Utah Mine Collapse: Memo Shows Roof Problems Revealed Last March
By Logan Murphy Sunday Aug 12, 2007 12:45pm
Operators at the Crandall Canyon mine experienced serious structural problems in the mine in March and entirely abandoned work in an area about 900 feet from where six miners remained trapped Saturday.
A memo obtained by The Salt Lake Tribune shows that mine owners were trying to work around "poor roof conditions" before halting mining of the northern tunnels in early March after a "large bump occurred . . . resulting in heavy damage" in those tunnels.
A bump or bounce occurs when the intense pressure on the coal pillars supporting the mine causes the pillars to burst, "sending coal and rock flying with explosive force," according to that National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health.
The memo indicates that mine operators knew the tremendous pressures of a mountain bearing down on the mine were creating problems with the roof, and they were searching for a way to safely keep the mine from falling in as they cut away the coal pillars supporting the structure.
"It's dangerous. Damn dangerous I would say," Robert Ferriter, now director of the mine safety program at the Colorado School of Mines and a 27-year veteran of the Mine Safety and Health Administration. "What is MSHA doing in all this? They're the ones who are supposed to catch this sort of thing." Read more...
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I'm still upset that we won't have a
President Tommy.I'm not trying to start rumors, but wasn't there some talk that some of the miners were "undocumented" illegal immigrants?
Is this true? Does anyone know?
Mad Money Kramer exposed Bush on this whole mine safety issue.
Why aren't the blogs on that?
I worked for Federal Highway Administration (Civil Rights Division) for three years, and I can tell you that every state has these types of reports. They use them to get the Feds to pony up more monies in their states, pledging to pay for infrastructure. Because within the FHWA, we weren't allowed to audit bastards like the guy who owns that mine in Utah, or who was responsible for the collaspe of the bridge on I-35 in Minnesota, because the DLC type Dems ran our office and pretty much restricted us from doing our jobs.
The money they get from the Feds goes elsewhere (because they know about the lack of accountability) and then shit like collapsing bridges happens. This also happened out in Oakland, California with the collapse of Highway 880 Nimitz Freeway and the Bay Bridge during the 1989 Loma Prieta Earthquake.
An eighteen year old report advised to reinforce those structures to withstand earthquakes with magnitudes of 7 or more (published in 1971 - found in 1989).
Nothing happens unless you pile civil suits on the respective state transporation departments - and even then, they'll roll it over to the Feds.
No justice.
I just don't trust a word that comes from Bob Murray's mouth. That guy is up to something. All day Sat. he said he had some "definitive" news. He had everyone waiting and waiting and then in the afternoon when he and others finally spoke, they had nothing new. The guy is playing some sort of ass covering game. He still insists the cave-in was a result of an earthquake even though all scientists say otherwise. He's either crazy or something is up.
In Bushland, "ordinary" workers who are sent down into the mines figure low on the scale of concerns. It's cheap to put up a front with frantic post-collapse digging and wailing at memorial services. It's much more expensive to put safety first. Hence decisions to do the job right are subject to risk analysis: how much will it cost us versus any payout of death claims.
Criticism last January that the maladministration was gutting MSHA regulations and oversight, putting slimeball mine owners like Murray before the lives of actual human beings, went unheard in Congress. No oversight. No reversal of all the gutting. Our new congress is as useful in protecting us from the maladministration as it is in stopping the war.
It really should be a crime.
The sad story of yet another Katrina is here and elsewhere:
http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=06/01/05/1455200
This Murray guy strikes me as a bit of a huckster. He kind of seems a bit of the mining equivalent of Ken Lay.
We all know about the problems with the mines. What I want to know is WHEN are they going to INDICT this scum bag on manslaughter charges. It is a matter of record He put PRofit OVER Human life. No less then 25 to life to run concerrently and a fine of NO less then $100,000,000 dollars after the pay out of NO LESS then $10,000,000 to the miners families. The point is to make it so costly for these FREAKS that if they even think about cutting money for safety it would be a automatice 25 years inn jail with the above fine. This SCUM only understands one thing MONEY so lets talk their language.
Another strange thing he's doing is keeping the families at the school. One report said they are sleeping and eating there. Murray doesn't want the immediate families talking to the press. Who made him the sheriff of their lives and what doesn't he want the families to tell the press? The guy reminds me of the guys who used to hire the migrant workers and keep them under guard and in debt to him all their working lives.
Something tells me that Mr. Mine Owner is about to get into a heap of trouble. After all, what do you call it when you kill people?
pissed off patricia @ 5:
POP, i submit that he is crazy AND something is up...
tangentially, i am STILL waiting for the MSM to investigate thoroughly the connection between bob murray, mitch mcconell and his wife/labor secretary, elaine chao. he donates mad amounts of cash and is protected by GOP.
"Murray backs his political beliefs with his pocketbook. He contributed more than $213,000 to Republican candidates over the last decade. Three political action committees tied to Murray's businesses have given $724,500 to Republican candidates and causes, including $4,000 to Rep. Chris Cannon.
He made use of his political ties to Kentucky Sen. Mitch McConnell, who is married to Labor Secretary Elaine Chao and oversees MSHA, to get back at a safety regulator who had crossed him, according to the Lexington Herald-Journal. In the meeting, Murray shouted that "Mitch McConnell calls me one of the five finest men in America, and last I checked, he was sleeping with your boss."
http://origin.sltrib.com/ci_6570325
(i brought this up last week, and i hesitate bringing it up again, but--despite the sweeping coverage of the trapped miners--i have not seen the MSM cover the murray-GOP-corruption angle. thus, i bring it up again. consider this a freebee MSM.)
Maybe they'll give him the medal of freedumb . . . or maybe more people have to die first?
Biggus Diggus @ 8:
so true.
corrupt, scheming, tied to the GOP, etc.
if i were a miner working in one of crazy-bob's mines i would fear for my life everytime i went down--murray simply does not care about those who work for him nor their families. if he could get away with it i'm sure he'd try to use child labor in his mines.
Perhaps Murray should have spent money reinforcing his mines instead of giving it to Repubs.
http://www.campaignmoney.com/political/committees/murray_energy_politica...
I don't trust him either Patricia and Biggus Diggus.
Murray is just another greedy Republican. He gives money to the Republican party and he thinks global warming and climate change is a myth. He claims it was an earthquake that caused the collapse but like many stupid Republicans he doesn't believe the scientists (specifically siesemologists) who say it wasn't an earthquake that caused the collapse. For some reason republicans have a hard time believing science. It runs counter to their objectives.
Besides all that, he "literally" cuts corners in those mines. They do that technique where they start cutting the coal out of the pillars that holds up the ceilings to get more coal. They also cut the pillars and "retreat back" on purpose in some parts of the tunnels to collaspse the ceilings to mine more of the coal after the collaspe. It's a very dangerous practice and can weaken adjacent parts of the mine.
I bet this jerk has cut lots of corners in that mine. It's been cited for several violations. Murray will ultimately be responsible for this disaster. Don't trust him. He has that "run roughshod over anything that gets in his way" mentality. A pretty common personality among arrogant Republicans.
If warnings that that the structural integrity of the mine was reported and the owners/managers did not respond with appropriate fixes, then the responsibility for these miner's lives fall on their shoulders. It is as simple as that!
hundreds of violations, and people are allowed to work? this is pretty much a non human thing. why is this mine owner walking around? it should be in jail or all ready have committed suicide out of respect for those it killed
ysbaddaden @ 7:
That's ignorant, demeaning and disrespectful to hard workning miners, not to mention to the people of Utah in general. Do you think these miners take those jobs because they are well educated and love high risk, filthy work? Do you think they depend on the likes of this Murray character to look out for them?
If you want cheap laighs, go do stand up at the improv.
scientists are perplexed at the amount of imaginary seismic activity in that utah region. apparently murray has this uncanny psychic ability. my spidey senses are tingling that there's something fishy going on.
I have family there. In small towns such as this, everyone pretty much knows everyone. What is being said by the locals (some who escaped during the collapse) is totally different than what is being reported or what Murray is saying.
This bloated corporate pig would use humans for backfill if it increased his net worth.
-GSD
I smell a big negligence suit... someone call Gerald Stern!
Janet @ 21:
You can bet that access to the MSM is being carefully controlled, but the truth is bound to start leaking out and making a mess again.
This Murray guy is one creepy motherfscker. The other day when he was blathering on about how bad he felt for the families and kept invoking this "Lord" person, I came close to vomiting on my veggie burger. One thing you can be certain of, is that the American coal mining industry is up to their ears in backroom political bullshit.
Bush and Rep. Tiahrt are among those who cut the staff and budget of MSHA and OSHA as well as put more limitations on their ability to cite violators of safety violations. Naturally the media has been completely silent in pointing the finger at those who allowed this to happen just as they were when Bush ignored warnings about 9/11 and Katrina.
Murray does seem to be playing CYA. I hope for his sake he was not responsible but if he was he needs to pay the price.
Well, they would if it weren't for the fact that you and one other guy (maybe an exaggeration... maybe not) are now the MSHA, as the Dept. of Labor was gutted in the latest round of tax cuts for the rich.
I hope to hell there is an investigation into this and it just doesn't become yesterday's news. Sadly, there probably won't be a real one. I'm afraid the miners are dead and once thier bodies are found and talked about for a few days, it'll be over until the next one happens.
This is one of those "why am I not surprised" things.
None of this surprises me as we are talking about the State of Utah.
Samson- @ 12:
Jacques @ 25:
Veggie burgers make me vomit too
Doggiebobo @ 32:
Opps, My comments somehow got inserted as 2nd para in your comment section.
ChrisM70 @ 2:
Some were Mexican nationals - not necessarily illegals.
I think this is just one more case of profits trumping either consumer or worker safety. As much as I'd like to think it, this brand of greed is not peculiar to the Usurper in Chief's administration. It's just more blatant.
If they do a movie of this - Danny DeVito will play Murray. LOL
And the beat goes on...
Anyone see the replay of Murray's Congressional testimony? He was all offended and went into a tirade that he provides the safest mine in the country in which miners work and bitterly condemned the dems for suggesting otherwise. The man is a monkey-boy supporter and, as of now, pure scum.
Welcome to another episode of "Murder by Republicans."
Ol Heckuva Job Murray can't cover his ass too much longer now. The blood of those miners is on his hands, a fact that will forever blacken his name. Do you suppose HE ever walked into that mine? of course not. He wouldn't risk his life, but it was OHHHKAAYYY to risk others' lives so he can keep billions to himself.
Sick. Sick. Sick. And, of course, the commentary on this from the reich-wing?
Crickets.
Where is the Utah National Guard? Oh, that's right....they are probably in Iraq. Oh well, I feel bad but if those miners in heavily Republican Utah are themselves Republican they may be getting exactly what they voted for. Just think if a portion of the trillions dollars pouring into Iraq so Halliburton could get no bid government contract were put into extra rescue equipment and salaries for rescue workers...just a though...
leftminded @ 37:
True, and as best I recall when checking "violations within his mine", he was cited
335 times since 2004, of which 116 were categorized by the MSHA as "significant
and substantial" VIOLATIONS...
The media seemed to be giving Murray a pass as far as background and all. But after he kept them waiting and waiting Saturday and then after all those hours he had no news for them, I think that's when he ticked them off. Today they have guns blazing when they talk about the mine's condition and him along with his history.
MSHA FEMA OSHA FDA FRS VA DEA USDA GAO NTSB NASA…
If it’s a government agency known by it’s acronym, it responds to accidents, emergencies and crisis after the fact, not prevent the problems before they happen. That requires planning and logic and people who give a shit.This government has been looted of it’s assets, and the lunatics are now running the asylum.
pissed off patricia @ 41:
Well Murray did, as the record will reflect, raise considerable monies for McConnell
and since the MSM is sooooooo "liberal", they have only reported what they have
been told to report..
Murray looks like he's changing from a human into a pig. No offense to pigs, of course. There's just a facial resemblance
This pretty much describes Bob Murray
http://www.comics.com/comics/pearls/archive/pearls-20070809.html
That's why I prefer Bill.
And now our shuttle, held together with spit and duct tape, has more problems with tiles that fell off. What do we have here in the US that is in actual good repair?
Doggiebobo @ 40:
it is stunning just how easily the MSM is cowed into subservience.
after all his past crimes and violations, after his repeated lies about 'seismic activity', after his shocking congressional testimony, after his CRAZY comments about al gore, and his whack-a-doodle opinions on science, the MSM just kind of giggles when they see him.
the MSM: "oh bob, you old coot, god love ya, hee hee."
MSM coverage = cowardly, insulting and pathetic
Doggiebobo @ 43:
:-)
wunderbar
You have to know this Murray guy is hoping the trapped miners are in fact dead so they can't tell anyone that they were retreat mining.
OK, well I guess this is another industry we're just going to have to outsource to some third world country or maybe to our China overseers possibly...Someplace where they just don't give a damn if a few people get crushed to death now and then in pursuit of profit...
It is becoming painfully obvious that we can't do this dangerous type work here in the U.S. safely 'and' economically.. Apparently it can only be one or the other... And given our economic and cultural model along with the current state of this countries financial heath? The powers that be have opted for profit instead of safety.. And with a neutered oversite process... The enevitable happens.....
Thanks to George Bush's vision of America, we can all rest assured that wherever we work, whatever we do, it's just a little more dangerous than it used to be... And we can no longer count on any kind of systemic oversight to watch out for us lowly peons at the bottom of the economic/employment chain....
Gotta just love how all the futurists visions for the 21st century are turning out....yea... right... lovely fucking future ain't it...PFFFT!!!
Yep, we got it so good in America now... I could just puke!!!!
My heart and best wishes goes out to those miners and their families........God have mercy on you peoples situation....JD
pissed off patricia @ 41:
are they? well, golly gee wilikers, consider me sh-sh-shocked that the MSM is actually acting like a *gasp* news service.
one thing is for certain, it won't take but a commercial break to get them back to their old pathetic ways.
(i was not born cynical, i was made cynical)
pissed off patricia @ 46:
I’m sure if Air Force One was constantly shedding pieces of it’s aluminum skin, the Chimp would have second thoughts about hopping aboard to start his Crawford vacation.
Samson- @ 48:
Wunderbar sounds like a jockstrap made by the Wonder Bra people.
Samson- @ 51:
I, along w/many, many others, am a member of your club and as each day passes,
our membership is increasing.
Maybe the Murray the Mine Owner's tax cuts are like the lord's love which is now trickling down the shaft.
Mike @ 3:
I'm sorry, I missed this one. When was this and can someone point me to his comments?
And bravo to CrooksandLiars for highlighting this story. This is a big deal. MSHA should not be investigating itself as to why this roof control and pillar plan was approved.
Doggiebobo @ 40:
I think part of it was on Olberman either last Thursday or Friday. He ranted and raved at Barbara Boxer about listening to the unions on mining safety.
ysbaddaden @ 53:
you peeked!!!
Eeeeeeee! titter, titter~
Doggiebobo @ 54:
Back in 1988 I was getting polled by various election groups. One asked me if the election were held tommorrow would I vote for bush or Dukakis, and I answered Pee Wee Herman. Another asked me if I was a Democrat or a Republican, and I answered a Cynic. Another asked me if I was a conservative or a liberal, and I answered conservative, I believe in the Divine Rights of Kings...
...but then I didn't see boosh coming (come to think of it Pickles probably hasn't either.)
when issues of labor arise in political discourse, i think crazy-bob will be an excellent poster-boy (or, should i say, poster-crook) for those aligned against unions.
bob murray's ethos: up with personal riches, down with any safety/security/money issue facing those making him rich (and fat, and dumb, and crooked). his employees serve at his pleasure. i'm sure written in his blood-soaked will he has a stipulation that when he dies a dozen or so live mine workers will have to buried with him.
Doggiebobo @ 54:
the dog philosophers, inc.
Samson- @ 62:
Close buy no cigar...Actually it's the Doggie Poo Poo Clinical Club...Our motto..."We
like to shit on Repigs and the MSM"
Murray has long been a villain around the Ohio Valley. I know some railroad workers who shuttled his coal and they unanimously hate him. He has no consideration for anything but his bottom line.
FYI - Murray's a heavy-duty GOP contributor:
" . . . This is not Murray's first time in the spotlight.
Murray is active as a leader in the mining industry, and in 2001, he testified before a House Ways and Means subcommittee, on behalf of the National Mining Association, in support of several proposed tax cuts.
Murray Energy Corp.'s political action committee has been an active contributor to GOP candidates.
The Murray Energy Corp. Political Action Committee has given more than $155,000 to Republican candidates, including $30,000 to the National Republican Senatorial Committee, since 2005, according to Federal Election Commission records.
The committee donated to Republican Senate candidates such as George Allen in Virginia, now presidential candidate Sam Brownback of Kansas and Katherine Harris of Florida. It also gave to Ohio Republican Reps. Deborah Pryce and Patrick Tiberi, and Ohio Republican Sen. George Voinovich. The committee did not give to any Democrats during the same period, FEC records show.
In 2004, Murray gave $15,000 of his own money to the NRSC, and he gave $10,000 in 2006. Among other donations in the last election cycle, he gave $2,000 to Ohio Republican Sen. Mike DeWine's unsuccessful re-election campaign. "
From CBS News:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/08/08/business/main3144730.shtml
Doggiebobo @ 63:
LOL!!!
i didn't even think about the connection doggiebobo!! sorry!
what it is from:
Cynicism was an ancient Greek philosophy, primarily concerned with virtue, whose followers were known as "The Dog Philosophers."
http://personal.ecu.edu/mccartyr/ancient/athens/Cynicism.htm
and the doggie poo poo club, well, consider me curious~
Annoyed Canuck @ 65:
eggsellent
also, if you didn't see the link already, scroll up to #12. another story/link about crazy-bob.
Bob Murray looks like the stereotypical corporate conglomerate pig
Samson- @ 66:
Yellow or Blue?
ysbaddaden @ 69:
ah, my favorite color? yes, it is yellow. no, blue. AHHHHHH!
Kind of like Stan and Wendy trying to describe the color of his puke.
Thank you for setting this ignorant person straight. The majority of Utahns' don't practice polygamy and more than half of the citizens here are not even Mormon, including myself. As far as the ethnicity of the miners mentioned earlier, it does appear that three of the miners are Mexican nationals but it isn't know if they had work permits or not. Regardless, all of them were working hard, trying to support their families. I wish Murray would put a sock in it -- his diarrhea of the mouth has been noticied by everyone, and it isn't winning him any new friends. I have a sick feeling that it may be too late for these miners and as someone else said, there will be hell to pay. Even though Murray has denied it, the miners were practicing retreat mining, where they pull the roof down behind them as they move on. He calls is something else, but I think he is trying to cover up his immoral, if not illegal mining practises with a lot of bluster. ALl the rest of us can just wait and pray that the miners aren't suffering and if they're still alive, that they are found quickly.An Average Joe @ 19:
Ruthless People @ 38:
The Carbon County miners are heavily Democrat. They, along with the hippies (yes, hippies) in Grand County and the urbanites in eastern Salt Lake County, are what keeps Jim Matheson (Lone D-UT) in office. Granted, Matheson's practically a Republican himself, but the Carb Co voters did not vote for this shit. Of course, this is Red Utah, there couldn't possibly be any of us here who actually vote in our own best interests, no Sirree Bob.
More on Robber Baron Murray: http://www.sltrib.com/ci_6570325, http://www.sltrib.com/News/ci_6564581. The man's a coal exec from Ohio with a long history of cutting corners, safety violations, GW Denying, and supporting Republican election campaigns (including Chris Cannon, but the DLCC couldn't be bothered to ever dump enough money on a Democratic contender to make a difference).
This old fart continues to blame the earth and it's quakes (if there even was one) for the fate of the miners. Let's divert attention from the mine's cited safety issues, and the fact that some of the miners are, indeed, illegal immigrants, not to mention that they are unable to locate a live voice deep within the bowels of this mine. I believe these miners are gone, and I thnk this moron is doing nothing more than trying to cover his own ass.
But hey, force majeur: blame it on the earth,
Motherbear @ 71:
Actually, I'm a former Mormon, decendent of Welsh and Scottish miners.
I prefer cheap sex to cheap laughs.
The guy reminds me of 'Baghdad Bob' who appeared on our TV's saying how Saddams' army was winning the war and everything was fine, while bombs were exploding and buildings' collapsing, in the background.
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