GWB: Saddam killed Mandelas
By Nicole Belle Wednesday Sep 19, 2007 5:31pmThe danger of having "intellectually incurious" people in charge of foreign policy...
Download | play 
Download | play
When asked by a reporter how long he thought the American people would be willing to wait for Bush to force the Iraqi government to reach benchmark goals, Bush veered bizarrely into a claim that Saddam was responsible for the deaths of the "Mandelas".
Part of the reason why there is not this instant democracy in Iraq is because people are still recovering from Saddam Hussein's brutal rule. I thought an interesting comment was made when somebody said to me, I heard somebody say, where's Mandela? Well, Mandela is dead, because Saddam Hussein killed all the Mandelas. He was a brutal tyrant that divided people up and split families, and people are recovering from this. So there's a psychological recovery that is taking place. And it's hard work for them. And I understand it's hard work for them. Having said that, I'm not going the give them a pass when it comes to the central government's reconciliation efforts.
Um, WTF??? Not only is Nelson Mandela very much alive, but he's also been very vocally critical of the Bush Adminstration:
"What I am condemning is that one power, with a president who has no foresight, who cannot think properly, is now wanting to plunge the world into a holocaust."[..]
"If there is a country that has committed unspeakable atrocities in the world, it is the United States of America. They don't care."
Maybe it was a bit of strange projection on the part of Bush to want another critic gone...something others in this administration have some experience with as well.
UPDATE: Obviously not everyone understands mangled metaphors: After Bush remark, Mandela Foundation issues statement that former President is still alive.
Login or Register to post comments.
Man, he looks terribly confused and out of touch with reality. I would suggest a vacation, but he's been on more than any other President in history already.
Where the hell did THAT come from? Chimpy's brain seems to be short circuiting.
He's looking bad. Circles under the eyes, puffy. Yep, things are bad. In addition to the craziness of what he said.
I wonder if he meant manatees?
Saddam Hussein killed all the manatees in Iraq.
Breaking up manatee families, etc.
I cross between laughing my ass off or running to the backyard to finish my bomb shelter.
what a useless piece of ape excrement! er shit!
Not to excuse his toxic brain syndrome, but perhaps he meant that anyone who might serve as Iraq's version of Nelson Mandela is dead, because Hitler, er, I mean Saddam killed them all...
W.......T........F!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
He's bat shit crazy....
Eesh, C&L...Bush is just mangling another metaphor, as he often does. "Mandela" in this case merely refers to the forces of sane and courageous dissent against a corrupt and violent dictatorship. The actual Mandela is very much alive, but the forces of dissent under Saddam's reign were killed by Saddam.
Naturally, Bush is utterly unaware of the irony of himself, of all people, lauding the necessity and virtue of dissent against a corrupt and violent administration.
Did someone put a pencil in his ear while he was passed out on the floor, then kick it as hard as they could? Only explaination I can think of for this stuff.
He has become increasingly fuddled - maybe drugs (prescribed or otherwise) maybe dementia (years of alcohol abuse catching up with him) maybe stress from working so hard to ignore the obvious.
I actually think this may be the rare instance where what he said *isn't* as dumb as it sounds. Here's what I think he's trying to say:
"people are asking me 'where is the Nelson Mandela for Iraq? When will that kind of figure step forward?' The problem is that Saddam Hussein's government killed the very people that today might have take on the role that Mandela did in South Africa."
Maybe I'm giving him too much credit and I don;t particularly agree with the sentiment but look at it a minute. Doesn't that sound like an argument the administration might try? And if Bush tried it wouldn;t he have butchered it to sound like what he said today?
Uh folks, I think you're taking Bush too literally. I believe he was referring to an Iraqi version of Mandela, a leader that the people could rally around.
Bush is stupid, but even he's not THAT stupid!
Sheesh. He was obviously referring to Iraq's version of Nelson Mandela. The statement is dumb enough without you distorting it, thank you.
I don't get it. I really don't get it. For the love of God, how did our country get saddled with this idiot? It is almost impossible for me to believe, but every word, every statement that this moron ejaculates still flabbergasts me anew. You would think that I would be numb by now.
My God in heaven! Save us from this perpetual Hell we have been placed in!
Tlaloc @ 15:
Absolutely. And I have no doubt that Bush considers himself the "Mandela" of Iraq. L freakin' O L.
anonymous @ 12:
exactly
this post is embarrassing.
George W. Bush is a joke. All his big bad talk about wiping out terrorists, then he turns around and lets the man who is undoubtedly at the top of that list come strolling into the country to speak at the UN. I am speaking of course about that state sponsor of terrorism and supplier of arms against our troops Mahmoud Ahmadinejad.
The mask is now offically off. Bush is a terroist sympathizer.
I usually like this site because of the information you guys post here. However, in this case, I think he was just speaking figuratively. I don't think it does your cause much good to grasp at stuff like this and try to turn it into something it isn't. A better approach would be to maybe challenge his assertion that there's no Iraqi left that could perform the role of a Mandela for Iraq because "Saddam killed them all". I think that assertion is a cop out.
Where did that one come from? "Hussein killed the Mandellas" goes well beyond "brain fart" or "left field" I mean I can't even fathom what point he was trying to make. It's like that gibberish text that graphic designers use as placeholders in layouts or one of those spam poems.
Maybe that's his plan! Blurt out moronic non-sequiturs to confuse people. Cunning Bastard!
[Deleted-Sitemonitor]
You’re working hard to put food on your family.
Why does this man open his pie hole?
Ya, he is clearly talking about where is an Iraqi Mandela, there are not any Iraqi Mandelas because Saddam had all the people who might be the equivalent of a Mandela for Iraq killed.
Sorry the only braindeadness here is from people who couldn't understand what he is saying.
But I agree the guy can't speak well, lets move on, this is a non anything.
What the hell is this JOKER talking about now? Just when I thought he had completely gone over the edge, he redefines CRAZY. Scary scary man.
Got to ask, what the hell did he mean by instant democracy?
Man, whatever he's smoking I need to stay away from. "Saddam killed the Mandelas"? I mean what......
Nicole, friend, you just misunderstood. I hate Bush, but what he said makes perfect sense (Sadaam killed all those who would be a Mandela in Iraq). Delete this post.
This is the most bizarre excuse I've heard for what is going on in Iraq yet. Mandela fought the Apartheid government. He advocated violent struggle against them (rightfully). And that's why he was in jail. If Bush knew Jack Shit, he would have invoked Ghandi.
Tlaloc @ 15:
That makes sense. But the chimperor did not think that up himself. It's a GOP talking point that they tried to plant in his head...and it died there.i
T
Completely 'round the bend. Hey bush! Steer us into the sun you wild-eyed drooling retard!
I'm not even going to say it...
But didn't Cheney and friends think of Mandela as a TERRORIST???
Cheney "opposed the resolution to free Mandela, according to Cheney, because it was attached to recognition of the African National Congress.
"The ANC was then viewed as a terrorist organization," he said.
http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/45c/210.html
So if Saddam was killin terrerists! Wouldn't that make him our FRIEND???
Ok so that was a lil intellectually dishonest, but you get what I mean heh Round and Round we go!
No more Mandelas? those things are pretty.
What a jack ass! This idiot is a menace.
Can we impeach him for just being stupid? Please?
anonymous @ 12:
I think you're correct. Among the myriad bonehead theories the neo-cons dreamed up in their think tanks was that once Hussein was deposed, the Iraqi Thomas Jeffersons, James Madisons, Nelson Mandelas and Martin Luther Kings would automatically gravitate toward lives of public service, and create a whole new kind of republic for the Middle East. They were naive enough to believe it was just that simple, and were ready (prior to the war, and 9/11, even) to accuse anyone who disagreed of racism. ("What? You think the American experiment can't happen with brown people?")
It didn't happen. Why not? Well, the Oval Office Orangutan is trying to explain why not -- the way it was probably just explained to him a few minutes before this speech, though his brain didn't quite process it. It didn't happen because Hussein was so bad that the Jeffersons, Madisons, Mandelas and Kings were killed before we invaded.
Yeah. Clears it all up for me. That's clearly why there's no instant democracy in Iraq.
Fucking idiots. You know, even if that stupid neo-con theory were viewed in its best light, there was no instant democracy here either. In fact, we're still fighting for it, and the historic battle sees a saw-toothed trajectory of progress. I just hope our current backsteps don't doom us altogether.
Nicole Belle - Your attempt to make Bush look foolish (usually so easy to do) has actually backfired and made you look foolish. Them's the breaks.
I hate to say it, but "salt" has a point. Bush isn't a very complicated man, and not particularly prone to literary devises, but it's pretty clear to me that he's answering "someone's" rhetorical question of "where is the Nelson Mandela of Iraq" with the same figurative term. That isn't to say what he said isn't ridiculous. It is. It is precisely from such brutal authorities that Mandelas are made. If Bush had left Iraq alone, he (or she) might well have come to power through more natural processes. But instead he blew up Baghdad, led a divisive occupation, and basically sprayed Roundup (TM) all over everything, killing flowers and weeds alike (to mix metaphors shamelessly).
Yes, yes. He meant the Nelson Mandela of Iraq.
Sadly, he didn't provide the correct answer, which is that if there was one around ten years ago, the United States is overwhelmingly more likely than Sadaam to have killed him (or driven him into exile).
-fred
Bizarre. This is worse than Reagan with his killer trees.
Why didn't Bush meet with Saddam before the invasion and look into his soul?
I wish we were in a golden age where discussion could be without conceit. Of course Bush is using metaphor..when someone(??!) asks, "where's Mandela?" they are asking where's the equivalent person to lead the Iraqis as a populist hero.
But we are not in a golden age. Bush would never allow such an uprising. In fact the entire Iraq effort is to smash every bourgeoning potential liberation of the Iraqis, as did Bush Sr. at the end of the Gulf War 1. Does gaming the oil and arms markets with his longtime Saudi friends have a familiar ring?
Maybe he was talking about Iraq's Mandella- But why do we have to figure out what he's trying to say? Should not the President of the United States be smart enough to say what he means to say?
Saddam destroyed all the mandolins! There's not one to be found! Maybe Chimpy's just suffering from pretzel dysphagia again. (I wish!).
yoshikawa @ 31:
It can't make perfect sense if you had to add to it to clarify it. Generally, when people are trying to speak figuratively, they are able to explain what they mean. Bush did not.
anonymous @ 12:
Yeah i'd have to agree here. He tried tot use a metaphor but WOW did he botch it. And definitely the irony of it is WAY too funny. At the very least i hope the original post is edited to reflect this point; it would be much more relevant that way.
...Sorry, forgot to add that the rest of the "Resident's" (the spelling is correct for he ain't won nothing) comments were bizarre, false, insensitive to the Iraqi people, delusional, and more of the Neocon lie machine. They make the Hitlericans look like amateurs. You people have lost your minds.....
Bill @ 46:
In reality... yes. But we're all in Bushworld now.
Someone gave him a metaphor and he butchered it. Much like his treatment of the entire English language.
Tlaloc @ 15:
Why should bloggers be left to try to reconstruct what the President of the United States is "trying to say?" This man is just too stupid to be in public office. "It's hard work" Here we go again with his stupid simpilistic mantras.
It's pretty obvious that he was speaking figuratively. I'd like to second another commenter: with all of the truly ridiculous things going on, there's no reason to blow something like this out of proportion.
Yeah, he's a dumb-ass. But he probably meant the Mandeans. Though it's strange for a dumb-ass like Bush to give a crap about brown people who don't follow Jesus and don't have any oil.
I have to agree with those who are saying this blog post is way out of line. I detest Bush but I understood what he meant. There are no Nelson Mandelas to arise in Iraq because Saddam made a point of killing anyone who could take that position. It really isn't that hard to understand what he's saying and I think this post is a way over the top cheap shot when none is necessary.
Of course, it is important to point out that Saddam also killed all the radical fundamentalist mullahs and others who would have been the bin Laden's of Iraq, and bush pointedly failed to mention that fact, which I think is the real criticism of what he said. I don't know how anyone could think he actually meant Mandela himself.
"Bush is utterly unaware of the irony of himself, of all people, lauding the necessity and virtue of dissent against a corrupt and violent administration."
i really think conservatives are almost incapable of appreciating irony or real empathy. I think it goes with the black and white comprehension of their brains.
wow good one Mr President.. lets go snort another line!
In the 60's I used to have a Mandela on my wall.
Bush thinks that Winnie Mandela is a Bear of Very Little Brain who was killed by Saddam Hussein.
He may not be very coherent, but I agree with many others in this thread that Bush was speaking figuratively. That said, he's still a moron. Maybe we should ask him if the world is flat, ala The View?
yoshikawa @ 31:
I disagree. How are we supposed to sort out the "thought processes" of someone with a brain fried by drugs and alcohol? I'm not sure you're giving the right explanation, and it does not make perfect sense to me. "Mandela is dead"? What the hell is he talking about?
Wouldn't it be nice to have a president who could actually speak instead of one that apparently needs interpreters for what is supposedly his first language?
Anonmymous gets it right, in my view:
"Bush is just mangling another metaphor, as he often does. “Mandela” in this case merely refers to the forces of sane and courageous dissent against a corrupt and violent dictatorship".
Mandela was the ONLY world leader who spoke out courageously and forcefully in dissent, unequivocally calling upon the American people to protest and vote Bush out of office. Not one other leader even comes close to calling Bush arrogant, and saying--correctly--that the U.S. had committed "unspeakable atrocities", and that it "doesn't care".
Every word Mandela has ever spoken is like a gem, something to hang onto. A true and very great world leader,
and when such a force says anything the world listens. And what the world heard was Mandela speak the utter truth about Bush. The trouble was Americans didn't pay attention. They were too busy vilifying gays. And look where they are today. The dollar is heading for collapse and the Iraqi holocaust is in full swing.
I think the "mandelas" comment is really a hamfisted attempt to suggest that Saddam's brutality precluded a Mandela, as 31 stated. That said, it was made a standard Bushism, and was especially awful because Mandela certainly survived an incredibly brutal regime--it minimizes the Struggle.
MK Ultra @ 59:
I preferred a Girldella, not a Mandella.
and the Republician's still keep supporting this nut job???? I think he has been smoking the roses in the rose garden!
I think I get what he's trying to say, and perhaps he's even correct.
Still ...
Bush is an absolute moron but this is intentionally interpreting him wrong and does Crooks and Liars a disservice. "Where's Mandella?" should be "Where's their Mandella?" if you want to get technical about it but it was abundantly clear to me and a lot of other posters exactly what he meant. The way he phrases it is a bit awkward but to act like he just up and says Nelson Mandella is dead in the middle of an answer about Iraq is really dishonest.
Equating the South Africa situation with the Iraqi situation is stupid but that's not what Nicole's post does.
Stacewizer might be right as well. Who knows what Bush meant? I think it's relevant that he's confused, as if someone briefed him about Iraq and he retained only what he didn't hear while he was waiting to call the General briefing him "Timmy", "Petey" or whatever cutesy name he needed to say to form the fratboy loyalty bond he's revolved his life around.
I do know one thing:
Words. They mean things.
Most of us don't speak "nut job" though.. :) It might be even worth deciphering if he had something ever worthwhile to say except RNC/whitehouse talking points..
Interesting, bat shit crazy crap spews forth from the mouth of the exalted leader and people are trying to read deeper meaning into it.
It matters not that he was trying to say, the mere fact that he can't open his mouth without spouting misinformation, bullshit or batshit crazy noise is a major concern.
He deserves no pass n this or any other crazy disjointed noise he makes. He does not get that luxury, he is the President of the United States and carries the fucking nuke football with him when he travels. He MUST make sense and be intelligible. Period. No exceptions.
If he cannot string together simple words to express simple concepts then he is a danger to us and the world.
There are times that I think that our fearless "decider" is as smart as some of the people on the street that Jay Leno uses in his "Streetwalking" segment. This man is an embarrassment. Can we all agree on one thing? No more stupid Presidents? At least not any that only achieved a C average ?
Where are our Mandela’s? That's the question these neocons should be asking themselves. When they actually find the answer it will be all those that they ridicule and attempt to intimidate into silence- Sheehan, Yearwood, Ritter, Penn, Kucinich, Arredondo, VAW, VFP, Code Pink, Andrew Meyer, and Nelson Mandela himself... Problem is these bastards wouldn't know peaceful decent if it bit them on their traitorous asses...
anonymous @ 12:
Ever see that "Town Hall" meeting Koppel had with Mandela? Bush's reference to Mandela to is a lame attempt to white-wash history.
I'm still trying to figure out his "historical anologies' to past great presidents and situations. Apparently he believes he is this guy
at times..
For seven years people have excused the stupid statements that this dumb President has made. This is one that can't be excused and for those who want to spin/blame/lie to cover up how much of an idiot Bush is it's to late today. The foreign press is having the best laugh and World Leaders have proof that George W. Bush is not only a liar but he's as dumb as a door knob. I look forward the the interview of Nelson Mandela yes the man who Saddam killed as told by a true idiot.
video killed the radio star
Ivan @ 8:
to the 1000th power. Holy Batshit.....his handlers are losing control..."stand back, he's gonna' blow!!"
Jason @ 69:
Amen, if the progressive community starts to intentionally distort reality, isn't it just becoming the mirror image of Faux News? I love C&L, but this one is off-target.
OK. I like this website and, like the rest of you, think Bush is either insane or an idiot (or both). However, there is a little bit of context that you are missing here: Bush (or one of the other administration officials, I forget who) was asked previously where the Nelson Mandelas of Iraq are; that is, where are the real Iraqi leaders? Bush's response is that Saddam killed all of Iraq's Nelson Mandelas.
In fact, I would say this is probably the smartest thing Bush has said this year! You really ought to consider correcting this story - it's not good for your credibility! Don't worry, I for one will only think more of this site if you can give Bush a break once in a while. (Just not too often!) :)
You are officially no longer a superpower.
You may have the hardware, but you are lacking the software.
Okay.
Now I'm officially scared shitless.
Is he really that drunk/high or is he trying to make some kind of point that no one understands? Is he asking "Where are the Iraqi Mandelas to fight against Saddam, well they're dead because Saddam killed them..." or is it just the wishful thinking of a neocon war mongering scum bag?
Were they all sitting around with their feet up trying to decide who was going to get sacrificed next? And Cheney said, "-They- could go after Mandela. We'd get rid of him AND get a national martyr who's body we could ride all the way to Iran." followed by fifteen minutes of chuckling.
Shrub, being the drunken moron that he is, grasping at straws in public again reaches into the fuzzy memory he has of the moment and tries to translate it for the plebes. All the while he's thinking "It always sounds better when dick says it."
But shrubby... there's no bigger dick than you.
fool me once...shame on you! fool me twice...blame Saddam!
Swashbuckler @ 16:
True, except an Iraqi Mandela would come in the form of a Muqtada al-Sadr or someone like him who could unite all of the Iraqis and the rest of the world at large against the minority power in charge of the country, which would be the US, and Bush has been doing a good enough job of that all by himself.
Bush Co is looting the American Treasury. They are just sucking whatever they can thats left dry now.
Thats the bottom line. They change the subject and spin constantly to keep Americans minds off of that one fact.
WE ARE BROKE. REAL BROKE.
...High-larious...
Paul @ 80:
Thanks for pointing that out. You're absolutely correct and in the context it makes as much sense as anything the Idiot King says.
Of course its far more likely the "Mandelas" of Iraq are among the millions of refugees that have fled Iraq for their lives.
where's the nutella?
If anyone's still reading... why aren't there more "Iraki Mandelas" do ya ask? Uh, that would be for the same reason there aren't too many Iranian, Indonesian, Chilean etc Mandelas - because the brutal regimes which were in control in all those countries "disappeared" them. Oh, and who was arming, training and supporting the secret polices of the Shah, Suharto, Pinochet (and Saddam)? Why: the greatest friend of democracy the world has ever seen, natch.... [ps. Read William Blum, "Killing Hope" for the full story]
the Lou Dobbs email list says Bush "has his mojo back" despite acting like a lobotomy patient
Thing Fish @ 75:
The operative term being WHITE-wash.
Free Nelson Mandela with every purchase.
Michelle,
Will you never tire of deriding our fearless leader? He was not talking of Nelson Mandela. It was Herbie Mandela and his wife Vivian who owned a small shop in a Bizarre near Najaf in the Iraqian Alps.They sold him a fake Persian rug, so he killed them with a head butt.I`m surprised you have not heard,but then again,since it happened when he was still pals with Bush I and Rummy I can see how the press might have missed it.
I think that`s what happened, but don`t quote me on it.It was very bizarre to say the least.
I guess that since Bush reads 87 books a year plus newspapers,he has a lot of knowledge we don`t know about.Let`s give him the benefit of a doubt for the umteenth time- NOT.
The funny thing is, the fact that he had killed off all the "Mandelas" was the biggest reason I opposed the war. For him to trot it out now after ignoring it for so long makes my fucking blood boil.
Wasn't it batshit crazy white guys just like monkey boy that tried to kill Mandela?
Huh? This guy continues to outdo himself in terms of ignorance, outright stupidity, and living in his own little "bubble". I'm not sure he's even on the same planet as the rest of the world these days. No doubt his brain is fried from the dazzling array of pharmacopia during the decades of his youth and now it's apparent that he's developing profound psychiatric illness. For his own good, Congress needs to suggest that he has a complete psychiatric workup and soon before he implodes.
The mangled metaphorical Iraqi Mandela would unite all Iraqis against the US, if the metaphor was anything remotely similar to the real Mandela.
[Deleted-Sitemonitor]
Anyone else notice that since Bush has nothing credible to add to the accomplishment side of his ledger, that he's all over the map these days? He can't seem to answer even the simplest of questions without jumping tracks and going down a road which has nothing to do with the topic at hand. In sleazy salesmanship 101, it's called "bait and switch". He's a master at it. Unfortunately, he's become an american embarrassment.
because dingleberry bush is such a dipshit nobody knows wtf he meant. his words are always so garbled like he just picks some out of the air and throws them together. the fuckin moron doesn't even know his ass from his elbow
Just caught Laura Ingram on "NoBalls" with Tweety. His response to her outright lies, venom, and talking over him. "Your always welcome here Laura". He was such a meek and pathetic clown, even when correcting her. She was saying Greenspan never said the war had anything to do with the oil. They went back and fourth for several minutes debating the point, finally agreeing to read the book quote after the break. When they come back and he reads the quote, all of a sudden she doesn't care what Greenspan has to say because he isn't a foreign policy advisor. Classic douchebaggery.
I'd like to change a word meaning to make it more apropos.
Instead of TOOT meaning a noise a train makes or that stuff you put up your nose (bush knows about the nose), why don't we change the meaning to Bush=Toot ( Totally Out Of Touch. )
Hmmm, Mandela... Is he talking about the "commie" "terrorist"?
http://www.realnews247.com/spec_rpt_mandela_fest.htm
http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/politics/article1222259.ece
Do those guys in the White House actually research their shit? Seriously, are they completely unaware that there are things like history books?
And why the hell isn't a reporter pointing this out to him? When the fuck will they start DOING THEIR JOBS?
Ivan @ 7:
No kidding. For the longest time I accepted that Bush was incurious. This convinces me that he is truly stupid. Or brain damaged.
Spud @ 97:
First off, no you don't, or you wouldn't dare, and you, like the retarded chimperor, evidently have no historical knowledge of anything about Mandela, like supporting terrorism against the minority power in charge. Mandela was no Ghandi when it came to fighting back against a better armed power in control of his country.
If the Iraqi Mandela's are dead, it's because the US killed them.
I dunno... Seems like not that big a deal really...I saw that dog and pony show on T.V. this morning... And it really was annoying to wake up to that pricks voice droning... But, all in all, just another example of the moron and chief mucking up the language again... Not like this is the first time he butchered an attempt at analogy or metaphore... As far as scewups go... Not really up there with his biggies.... It ain't no 'shock and awe' war crap or actively screwing up the Supreme Court now.........JD
“If there is a country that has committed unspeakable atrocities in the world, it is the United States of America. They don’t care.”
Not true. Many such as the Nicole Belle and John Amato's of the world/continent DO care - painfully so.
Sadly, it makes little to no difference (yeah I know... "what are YOU doing?" "This is better than nothing" - editor's note - NO - it's not better than nothing, IT IS nothing where it counts most - human lives).
Vietnam was an atrocity but it took over a decade to end and milllions perished (does anybody TRULY get that number anymore? Remember Stalin's quote on statistics...) without the American public (on whole - not the ones who've hit a modicum level of compassion) lifting a bloody finger? Many sympathetic (i.e. people who normally would never tolerate neighbours with such a destructive view let alone a nation) erroneously think the "protests" started right away but in fact they were about a half-decade behind the fact and one could cynically argue that even THAT was only because of "The Draft" and the inclusion of everyone not rich-deep in deferment opportunities. That saddens me to the core of my being. Truly.
I am Canadian. I work in Canada and the U.S. (almost as often) and have had a love of the United States of America since Russian/American history became my major in University (or "college" for you folks). One brother is married to an American and my other brother has worked (legally) in Texas for the past decade.
I have served in our own miltary (I am reticent to use quotes over military but I have lost many a friend recently in Afghanistan and that's another argument altogether... as are the results from exercises we've performed in unison over the years when I served - trust me, Rieckhoff's opinion aside, the rest of the world DOES NOT regard American soldiers as "the best in the world". In fact, far from it... best equipped and technologically proficient sure... but best soldiers? That's a laugh Americans believe that the rest of the free-thinking world mocks in unison. And that's something I wish Americans would wake up to instead of the prevalent thought that "the U.S. would kick anyone's ass!". That may be true but please educate these folks about the realities of life would you? China, Russia - hell, even India could obliterate the United States. If not obliterate then "raze" it so badly that folks would be living in anti-radioactive cocoons for the rest of their lives. The American public just doesn't seem to grasp that concept but the time is nigh for clarity and resolution and if it doesn't come we have truly seen the end of the empire.
And would anyone outside of the continental U.S. Mourn? Sure. But it would also be a dose of "good goddamn riddance" to a scourge of our planet (perceived... trust me, until recently I have been a huge proponent of American largesse but the positives are now FAR outweighing the negatives).
People condemn Pol Pot, Stalin and the numerous tyrannical regimes of the histories but as Bruce Cockburn once opined:
"Everybody wants to see justice done... on somebody else."
That says it all.
All I can hope is that the utter, absolute despair and shame that this administration has heaped upon this country (and the world for believing in the truism of "America the Great") some sort of "Rising" (thanks "boss" - without the religious connotation anyway) which propels us and the world forward with some sort of enlightenment.
Sadly, the human animal is almost too good at adaptation to really discern the danger in real time. The world wants to be on your side. Think personally... are you not impressed by someone you know with power that could wield it destructively but chooses to wield it constructively?
But... I guess there's too many people with the attitude of "I don't care what other people think". Sadly, that can ONLY end with nuclear weapons being detonated in the United States. Until people realize it's not "Carte Blanche" out there because the might is right... this planet is going to be a disaster waiting to happen. And unlike a video game - there is no reset button.
I know people don't read this shit but thanks for the chance to vent. As you know john, I've the utmost respect for this site... I just wish it personified human compassion a little more in results.
Thanks for the screed.
Cheers
brando
Let me guess the WH press corp just stood there with a dumb look on their face?
Yes, I think Thickie meant Mandaeans.
Of course, as this sub-moronic dogturd on legs didn't even know the difference between Sunni and Shia before deciding to destroy a Muslim nation, I guess we shouldn't be surprised if he doesn't have a good handle on the various religious minorities in Iraq.
Anyway, the situation for all these minorities -- especially Christians -- is far, far worse than it EVER was under Saddam.
Maybe Bush secretly put Ms. Teen South Carolina on the cabinet, and she's writing nonsense speeches about South Africa...
Dammit... its screwups....Sometimes I spell as bad as Chimpy talks....JD
Hahahahaha, what a freak. hahahaha
Mandela or mandelas, ya know, those little artistic sand designs?
Stupid fuck. I'm telling ya, I don't know - really - how much more of this I can seriously take. Seriously.
Come on guys. Dont be rediculous.
I cant stand Bush. He is a complete idiot, but you know damn well what he was saying. If you dont then you are an idiot too.
He was saying "Where are the peacemakers like Mandela in Iraq. They are all dead."
That is what he meant and you know it.
The anti war movement is way too important to waste time on misleading criticism.
Dont be an ass. We need to get Bush out of office and there is plenty of truth that can do it. We dont need false arguments on our side. Leave that to his administration.
Having said that, Bush is a Fu@#ing liar and a fool. There is a special place in hell for him and Cheney.
Two things:
1. bush Sr allowed any Iraqi 'Mandellas' to be killed when he failed to follow through with his promise to help the uprising against saddam after the first gulf war.
2. Any remaining potential Iraqi 'Mandellas' were ignored and/or marginalized when the occupation of Iraq began. Read Imperial Life in the Emerald City to find out just how bad it was.
Jackie @ 73:
I have to agree. If more than half the people listening to Bush's ridiculous statements pause in shock; or think more than 5 seconds about what exactly he meant when he spoke the President has not done his job. The sheer number of verbal gaffes and missteps Bush has made staggers the rational mind- this one was particularly horrendous. In this PR-Media world, there is no extra time for a re-telling of what you "meant" to say or do.
Yeah - these things: http://www.barbkowalik.com/mandelas.htm
justabill @ 102:
Listen you-- Belle is saying that Bush doesn't know that Mandela is alive. That is not indicated in the transcript or the video. If we don't correct our misstatements and mistakes we are not much better than them.
And fuck you. I sat in a shanti town in red square in 1985 at the University of Washington and demanded the University divest from South Africa in support of the ANC.
Spud @ 96:
somebody please taze him.
The words "intellectually incurious" do not fit bush in this case. Try "aggressively and stupidly ignorant".
What a total embarrassment to our country to have this clown as the president/dictator.
Mandela's ANC, just like the IRA and the ETA, to name a few, all supported terrorism as a means to fight against a superior armed power in their succesful quests to gain political legitimacy before they became peaceful.
An Iraqi Mandela's followers would be attacking our troops oday.
Weed + Jack Danels = Bush's comments. And he is certainly the Embarrassment-in-chief.
Yep, the WarPig was speaking metaphorically. He's still a waste of human flesh, though.
... today.
I agree with Carleton (comment 110) - clearly, Bush (inarticulate as he is) was not suggesting Mandela is dead.
Having said that, the fact that Mandela himself has been a vocal critic of Bush, to say the least, speaks volumes. And if Bush's VP had had his way, Mandela would still be behind bars.
I like this site but jeez people, get a clue. It was a metaphor and an obvious one. I expect this kind of clueless reaction from the likes of the chemp but not from our side! Nicole, post an update to this, it's embarrassing.
GREAT MANDELA
So I told him that he'd better
Shut his mouth and do his job like a man
And he answered, Listen, Father, I will never kill another
He thinks he's better than his brother that died
What the hell does he think he's doing
To his father who brought him up right
Take your place on the great Mandela
As it moves through your brief moment of time
Win or lose now, you must choose now
And if you lose, you're only losing your life
Tell the jailer not to bother
With his meal of bread and water today
He is fasting till the killing's over
He thinks he's a prophet, but he's a coward
He's just playing a game, he can't do it, he can't change it
It's been going on for ten thousand years
Tell the people they are safe now: hunger stopped him
He lies still in his cell
Death had gagged his accusation
We are free now, we can kill now
We can hate now, we can end the world
We're not guilty: he was crazy
And it's been going on for ten thousand years
recorded by Peter, Paul and Mary
[Deleted-Sitemonitor]
anonymous @ 9:
I agree, but Bush is mangling the metaphor because he doesn't understand it. He should have had the guy who wrote it for him read it for him.
oh please. If you took the time to analyze the damn thing and figure our it was a metaphor....congrats! You think analyzing the speech of a monkey is worth your time.
For those of us who just figured he was saying Saddam killed the mandelas...hell, hes dumb enough to say it. Why waste my time figuring out if this is actually a metaphor or just another idiotic comment from the idiot in chief.
Either way, its damn funny.
I hate the guy as much as anybody, but he was speaking figuratively about Iraqi "Mandelas" in this case, and we should be smart enough to understand that.
He does indeed mean the Mandaeans, but he is lying when he says Saddam wiped them out. For a start, the Mandaeans survive (as a suppressed culture) in Iran. Mandaeans survived Saddam in Iraq, but then their situation got dramatically worse, as they are now the victims of violence if they don't convert to Islam.
Saddam was a first class b*****d, but relatively speaking he kept a lid on sectarianism (or unified groups in opposition to him) rather better than the US and UK have managed. That is rather precisely why we installed him in the first place.
As many moronic comments as Bush makes, we don't have to manufacture them by being obtuse and misconstruing what he says, it would be real great if this post was deleted as it is kind of embarrassing to have something this silly posted.
Maybe he is one of the US Americans who doesn't have maps.
For gawds sake already!
If you have to take the time to think about what he meant, or do a double take on how disjointed his wording was then he is a danger to us all.
Honestly people, don't excuse his wording! What ever he meant is moot to the issue. It was his actual syntax that should give pause.
He sounds like a slow 10 year old, and he runs the country. Do NOT give him a pass when he spews incoherently.
As I said above, he is the PRESIDENT of the United States and has the keys to the nukes, it is a BIG deal if he can not think or speak clearly.
A VERY big deal.
So enough of the shrugs and brushing it off, get scared and get mobilized and DO something to save yourselves and your loved ones before it is way too late already!
Hehe. Ive got to say, this is ridiculous. If you got it...its because you actually analyze what this monkey says. I think you're right, that is what he was trying to say, but still...you're analyzing the speech of a monkey and for some reason feeling superior about it. Not the best use of your time.
IF you just took him at his word, that hes dumb enough to say Saddam actually killed the Mandela's (as I did) its because...this guy is a freaking retard. Its something he ACTUALLY COULD SAY. Hes said stuff just as stupid in the past. I no longer analyze his statements. Waste of my time.
You sound like you can follow an argument. All I'm saying is that we need to be better and smarter than the ruling party and Nicole should be able to admit that she got the figure of speech wrong. It was a poorly made figure, true, but he did not mean that Nelson is dead, and all the chickens in our hen house shouldn't start clucking because she said so.
I guess I can see that point of view...but Id have to ask, WTF do I care if a wingnut thinks Im dumb? Any wingnut on this site is gona call you an idiot liberal REGARDLESS.
"He was a brutal tyrant that divided people up and split families"
WTF does this f**king idiot think we are doing? I hate these people. The republicans are teeheeing that this congress has lower ratings than they did so they refuse to pass anything except some stupid ass thing on Moveon. The dems don't speak up and say it like it is. Blah Blah I respect blah blah...Ugh.
Rudy supports King even after the too many Mosques remark.
McCain is horrified by the Betrayus ad. Will someone please ask him where is outrage was when bush and rove slandered his family? What was his response to the slander of him you ask? Bend over for bush ever since and daily blowjobs for rove.
The anger I feel about EVERYTHING this freakin government has done is so huge, I fully understand how someone could become a terrorist.
sorry im late here, but has cheney ever recanted his "Mandela is a Terrorist"claim?
It's kind of fun to measure the arc of difference between Nelson Mandela and Dick Cheney in terms of... well, everything.
Come on!
At risk of being told to
"GET MY OWN BLOG"
Lame as it was - you can surely recognize an analogy.
A desperate grasp to say the least, but Mr. Crooks and Liars come on...
approach this with a little more intelligence and less knee jerk.
The leader of the free world.
Nice.
Heck, guess then all the civilians killed were figuratively Iraqi "Ghandis"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandaeism
Is there any stupid thing the chimp won't say?
JW @ 133:
You sound like you can follow an argument. All I'm saying is that we need to be better and smarter than the ruling party and Nicole should be able to admit that she got the figure of speech wrong. It was a poorly made figure, true, but he did not mean that Nelson is dead, and all the chickens in our hen house shouldn't start clucking because she said so.
I guess I can see that point of view...but Id have to ask, WTF do I care if a wingnut thinks Im dumb? Any wingnut on this site is gona call you an idiot liberal REGARDLESS.
Ok my last word on the subject. We should not be lazy and ignorant because that is exactly what the editors of this site accuse the right of, and prove the right to be day in and day out. Nicole had a knee jerk reaction to Bush's comments and people agreed without looking critically. I'm for the group that is honest and not blindly parroting the opinions and conclusions of the "leaders" ok?
Look, I hate shrub more than most, but that comment about killing all of the Mandela's actually makes sense. Anyone who opposed Hussain was killed, and Nelson Mandela was not. But what the fool doesn't realize (or more cynically, does...) is that we are doing the same damn thing only worse.
What an idiot.
To be fair to C&L,unless you have a copy of "Bush Speak" handy to de-pretzel-ize his hapless attempts at coherent speech,you're pretty much wide open to this kind of confusion.
Anyway,how dare he bring up Mandela?
The Repugs are lousy with Sun City exploiters like Abramoff and Cheney who actually voted against Mandela being released from prison.What a blithering phony asshole.Just like Reagan.
I don't give a flying fig if he was speaking metaphoricaly or what. The moron in chief has killed MORE Iraqis than Saddam did. They had electricity under Saddam. They had drinking water under Saddam. They have neither now. In case you haven't been paying attention (I'm talking to the defenders of bush here) all the educated professionals that we haven't killed have left the country because of this bush fuck up.
it's nelson mandela. the same mandela that cheney voted to keep in prison during the anti-apartheid vote in the 80's.
He forgets to mention that HIS FATHER ARMED HUSSEIN so he could kill all those Kurd and Shia Mandelas, and blocked UN action against him.
He forgets to mention that HE has murdered a million Sunni and Shia, though his 'Shock and Awe' illegal genocidal war.
GW Bush IS the Korovet. He also employs them:
http://www.corpwatch.org/article.php?id=12061
Login or Register to post comments.