Strong Economy? Maybe For Some, But Not The Middle Class
By Nicole Belle Tuesday Nov 27, 2007 6:02pmJohn's talked about watching the stock shows, and I have to admit that I do occasionally catch them myself, but far less frequently than he does, mostly because I find them bizarrely contradictory and less than useful. The same set of conditions can be characterized as being the precipice of a recession, the warning of a deep depression or positive signs of growth, depending on which talking head is looking at it.
What I know of the economy is both informed by friends in the financial industry and just common sense of looking at the circumstances of people all around me. And what it's telling me is that things just aren't looking good for most Americans.
I just came across a study that confirms that gut feeling and then some. Demos and IASP/Brandeis have released a study that shows that the middle class is hanging by a thread. Some of their findings ( full .pdf here):
Overall Economic Security
* Only 31 percent of middle-income families match our profile for being securely middle class. That is, despite falling into the broad range that defines middle-class "income," fewer than one in three families has the necessary combination of other factors to ensure middle-class security.
* Our Index results vary by race. Thirty-four percent of white middle-income families are securely in the middle class, as compared to 26 percent of African-American middle-income families and only 18 percent of Latino middle-income families.
* One in four middle-class families matches our profile for being at high risk of slipping out of the middle class altogether.
* One in five (21 percent) white families is at high risk for slipping out of the middle class, as compared to one in three (33 percent) African-American headed households and an alarming two in five (41 percent) Latino families.Lack of Assets
* More than half of middle-class families have no net financial assets whatsoever-that is, no financial assets or debt levels that exceed their assets.
* Only 13 percent of middle-class families have sufficient assets to meet three-quarters of their essential living expenses for nine months, should their source of income disappear.
* About four out of five middle-class families do not have sufficient assets to cover three quarters of essential living expenses for even three months should their source of income disappear. We defined essential living expenses as food, housing, clothing, transportation, health care, personal care, education, personal insurance and pensions.
* Middle-class families have a median debt of $3,500 and median net assets of $0.Insufficient Income to Meet Living Expenses, Cover Housing Costs, and Buy Healthcare
* Twenty-one percent of middle-class families have less than $100 per week ($5,000 per year) remaining after meeting essential living expenses. These families are living from paycheck to paycheck with very little margin of security.
* In nearly one out of four middle-class families (23 percent), at least one family member lacks health insurance of any kind.
* Twenty-eight percent of middle-class families spend 30 percent or more of their income on housing expenses, putting them above federal guidelines for housing affordability.
For me personally, THESE are the real issues that the presidential candidates need to address, not diamonds or pearls or whether the top 1% should have their tax cuts made permanent. This kind of disparity and insecurity for the vast majority of Americans should be considered an abomination in the last remaining superpower.
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The middle class must be destroyed to have a banana republic. This is what corporate Amerikka wants.
If you create a good environment for investors what does that entail? At the most basic level the interest rate on investment must be above the expansion of the monetary base. This means that for there to be a good investment climate a country has to essentially go into debt. In the developing world this has lead to mass privatizations. When those countries go into debt the only thing they have as collateral is their state enterprises and their natural resources.
If people want this to change they have to radically change the way economics works, especially how the monetary system works (how money is created and the Fed) as well as the financial markets. A superficial change won't do an ounce of difference in the long run. If you want things to change you don't work with the investor class you challenge them directly and work to create new and better ideas in economics. If anyone is interested in some good books on the subject I could pass them along.
oh kewl the economy is doing great awsome that is great for us right? I mean even though my income is 20 percent going to federal goverment and my sales tax is high and i have to have do my tag every year for crappy roads meanwhile praying i never get sick cause my bills which have gone all up along with food couldnt take a hit on my 7.30 dollars an hour before taxes job that amazingly to avoid having to give me and others full time status has been reduced to part time cause it is cheaper for the stores to employ more people at part time than keep and groom the ones there for full time, and lord help me if i miss a day because even with a doctors not after three days i can be fired, and I am glad that ever one is happy while i try and firgure out how to by gas, and eat, and pay my bills on less than 1.350.00 a month before taxes it is so easy and to be honest the funniest part i am considered middle class by the standards my friends are going through. yea great news excuse me i have to go donate plasma so i can eat food for dinner.
let's see....ship all jobs to overseas, big business makes more money,stocks go up, yeah things are fine.
it's the middle class that fuels most of these "banana republic" style stores, not the rich or the poor. kill your middle class and you lose the largest market and support in America.
quote from my gal-pal , , , " let's not spend alot on everybody & everything this year. "
Larry Kudlow may be the nastiest neo-nut on TV. Just watch his show one night on CNBC and see if I'm not correct. For some reason he escapes the ire of angry progressives. Why? No one on TV has pushed harder for deregulated, corporate-orgy capitalism than this man.
Yet another reason the Republicans will not let the "war" end. This is during a wartime economy even.
Imagine what will happen when the troops come back. It won't happen until after Bush is gone, that way the collapse of the economy will be blamed on the Dems.
The markets rose today because the fed IS going to lower the rate again.
Key word here is is.
Insiders (and I'm not one) already know what's in store. Do you? Are you privy to this information, too?
Didja know a few days ago, when the markets went down? Didja know when to swoop in there and buy, knowing that there was going to be a "rally" in a few days?
This market is so fixed it ain't funny.
Don't EVER buy stocks based on the recommendations you hear on CNBC! Remember, Jim Cramer is for entertainment purposes only.
Lollimom @ 9:
economics 101 everyone knows market down buy. did you miss this course?
We're treading on seriously dangerous thin ice. Look at Citi Group. The largest bank in the U.S. A 125 Billion loss just on sub prime bad debt paper. So bad the Saudis had to step in and inject a 7 Billion cash infusion.
Thats just the tip of the iceberg.
It's going to take a miracle to get out of the mess Bush got us into.
Expect some very tough times ahead. Learn to find happiness and joy in things other then "stuff and buying toys and gadgets".
Think about the future. Plan.
don't hate me @ 10:
The stock market is nothing but a monster right now devouring anyone who steps in and doesn't know what they are doing.
You'll get eaten alive.
I don't know about you folks,but I'm feelin it.and who said kill our middle class.What kind of fuckin bullshit is that dadams?
No it has nothing to with oil at all.
Wednesday, November 28, 2007;
Kurdish Ministers Woo U.S. Oil Firms
Regional Bid Angers Iraqi Government
On Monday night, Omer Fattah Hussain was the toast of a dinner held at the 10,000-square-foot McLean mansion of Ed Rogers, a Reagan White House political director and current chairman of the lobbying firm Barbour Griffith & Rogers. In an opulent living room just off an art-filled entryway with a curved double stairway, the deputy prime minister of the Iraqi Kurds' autonomous region mingled with such luminaries as former assistant secretary of defense Richard Perle, former White House aide I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby and former White House press secretary Tony Snow.
Today, Hussain travels to Houston with Ashti Abdullah Hawrami, the Kurdish regional oil minister, to woo an even more important audience: U.S. oil companies.
During the last Democratic debate, Richardson chided Edwards about making his campaign about class war. The income gap should be a major issue in the campaign. Of course, I don't know if it can be called a "war" because I think only one side is armed and, unfortunately, it's not the side I'm on.
We are in a recession right now. The idiots who talk for a living are largely unaffected, and it's against their interests to say how bad it is, and how bad things are trending.
The thing that's scaring them is the possibility of another depression. That's the hole we are staring into.
It goes beyond that even. Everything is relative to inflation. My salary has increased by 12% since George Bush stole (I mean won) the 2000 election. ( I had to change jobs three times to get it). Now, if inflation did not go up, that is a fair raise. However, if inflation rose by 2% per year, I lost money. Who sets the standards of whether inflation rises or falls? Our government of course. Now, how do they do that? They use indexes. For example, if a man's long sleeve shirt sold for $2.00 in 1950, $4.00 in 1970, that's a 100% increase over 20 years. If last year it sold for $10.00 and today it sells for $11.00 that's a 10% increase or a 1.1 on the index. Never mind that the shirt is now made of cheaper material in China, will tear and only be able to be worn one tenth as long, therefore considerably less value. The Inflation index is still 1.1 Now what about fuel costs? That would make inflation look bad right? Not exactly, the government decided that was too volatile to include in the index. What about rent, interest rates, heating bills, shipping charges? Nope, all too volatile. They decide what to use and how to pick the items so as to minimize the appearance of inflation so they do not half to increase wages and can claim that their economic policies are working. It is easy to have a successful economy if you get to decide how being successful is going to be measured. Kind of like winning a war isn't it.
There is not ONE SINGLE CANDIDATE talking about this wreck of an economy.
They are afraid to. They avoid it like the plague.
Even Bill Clinton has decided to NOT TALK ABOUT IT.
Not one single question is presented to these people. . . "what are you going to do to get our country out of bankruptcy?"
L.A. Confidential @ 19:
Unfortunately, Bill Clinton decided to not weigh in on much of anything since w took office. What a waste.
20 years from now.
Not too much different from today. Same issues.
The U.S. depends on China, which is poisoning the planet. The U.S. depends on the Mid-East oil.
A candidate comes forth. A person somewhat like Kucinich. Has faults but ideas.
But he's out of the mainstream. He isn't like us. He's weird.
So the U.S. elects a safe candidate. Someone who will make sure nothing changes too much.
And makes sure each proposition is poll-tested.
The US inflation index has always been a joke. Basically, if you have to eat, pay a mortgage, and have to drive to work the inflation index does no reflect your reality. However, if you are homeless, attend soup kitchens and live under the bridge, then maybe this index will be closer to your reality.
The point is that no one has evern wondered why the US inflation index has always been so disconected with reality...
Buckeye Nut Schell @ 18:
in the last 6+ years I've thought"as soon as boosh leaves office.....we'll find out how fubar this economy really is".Then they'll blame it on the dems......I can see Chainey laughing already.
Buckeye Nut Schell @ 18:
You got it. Think about the U.S. debt they are keeping off record. It's like the mob. They keep two sets of books.
"Richardson chided Edwards about making his campaign about class war."
Which is why he hasn't a clue and shouldn't be elected. In capitalism there is always a class war, whether or not it's a one sided slaughter or not depends on the kings we elect to govern our lives and obviously Richardson is fine with the setup.
hope @ 20:
Yes, I noticed that also. And I hear Mom and Pop Bush now call Bill "son".
I'm really disappointed in Bill. And I voted for him twice. He's really let us down. I can't even say I trust him anymore.
hope @ 20:
Yeah, but the Cheney family is doing GREAT!
That's the point of the Republic party's entire Economic Schema?
Concentrate ALL The wealth at the top, so when the economy collapses, THEY will be protected.
I say, storm the Bastille...Er, Martha's Vinyard?
We'll lose a few to the Backwater Militia guarding Dick's compound, but they're all so crazed on steroids they can't shoot straight anyway?
Madame LeFarge and Le Guillotine for Ol' Darth Cheney, circa 2011?
mudshark @ 14:
if you understood english, then you would understand that is a statement of opinion and not an action against a group. do you know where you are on the map? i think not !
WashStateBlue @ 28:
his defibulator is giving him trouble...........I suspect he's going to croak soon.eh!
dadams @ 29:
I was waiting for your reply.....took you that long huh?and that's all you could come up with?don't bother.
mudshark @ 30:
Don't be too sure. I had a physician friend who told me years ago that Cheney wasn't anything to worry about because he probably wouldn't live out the year. Yeah, right.
Prices are going up every time you turn around as well. I work at a grocery store
and when I came in today my department managers were doing price changes as
they do every Wednesday. The only thing different about today's price changes
was they were all increases and not one item is on 'sale'. For example our Deli sells
a slab of baby back ribs that went from $9.99 to $14.99. All of our Deli meats and
cheeses went up anywhere from $1.50-$ 2.50 each...oven roasted turkey went from
$6.99 lb to $8.49 lb. Our customers are going to be fucking pissed! I'm pissed! I shop
at my store as well. Your wages stay the same but the cost of living is going through
the roof!
mingled with such luminaries as former assistant secretary of defense Richard Perle, former White House aide I. Lewis “Scooter” Libby and former White House press secretary Tony Snow.
AH, the Neocons cash in?
What a mountain of integrity and ethics those guys are?
I'd call them Money Grubbing Whores, but Whores actually DO something for thier money.....
mudshark @ 30:
Times like this I wish I wasn't an atheist, it would be neat to have Cheney having to answer for his actions to a higher power in the afterlife. Alas, it seems all them crazy bastards tend to live long and prosper in this life time, the Cheneys and Bushs will never have to answer and own to what they have created.
hope @ 32:
I think this is the second time this year he's had to take a jolt.To get it workin properly...but he has done it as an outpatient.aleast that's what they say....no I think he's running out of time.
Dana @ 33:
So, I keep wondering, exactly who is buying all of this high-priced stuff. The reports said Cyber Monday set records this year.
Maybe it's a matter of spend what you don't have 'cause things are only gonna get worse. Party down!
WashStateBlue @ 34:
Let's rewrite the article.
"mingled with such money grubbing whores as former assistant secretary of defense Richard Perle, former White House aide I. Lewis “Scooter” Libby and former White House press secretary Tony Snow.
Thats more appropriate. Being they are empty shells of human beings they won't even mind anyway. They sold out a long time ago. Seceded from humanity. You look them in the eye and it's just black dots.
I love being Canadian. We're not perfect, but pretty damm close. Your system is fucked and so are many on this blog unless you start to do something drastic, and I mean really soon...
Lakeguy @ 39:
Haven't you heard? The "Amero" is comin' your way too!
The squeeze is on. Pay stays the same, health insurance goes up, energy bills go way up, food prices go up. The first effect is curtailing of non-essential goods. That new car is out, the old one will do for another year or so, and then it gets replaced with a used one, not a new one. Too bad for Ford and GM; things are not going to get any better for them for a long time. Watch the sales of iPods, video games, silly expensive appliances, etc. gradually fall through the floor. The problem is that the sales of all the spiffy consumer junk is what's driving the economy, when it goes away we are left with what basically amounts to third-world conditions: we ship out raw materials to countries that still have manufacturing capacity. Until the dollar recovers on the world market we won't be able to afford the goods made from our raw materials. Foreigners will pump in capital to restore manufacturing capacity to take advantage of our distressed currency, but then they will own us. This is what happens when the leadership drives the economy with the gas pedal depressed completely to the floor with low interest rates and active disincentives to saving.
L.A. Confidential @ 19:
I'm sure the Republicans tonight will be asked searing questions about their economic policies. And they'll answer in excruciating detail the minutea of their proposals. Either that or they'll be asked about God, Gays and Guns.
Dana @ 33:
But the most recent report on inflation said it's well contained (when you exclude fuel, food and everything else you might conceivably buy).
You Canadians have hitched your economy onto ours and you're gonna go down too.
hope @ 40:
I sure as hell hope not...
L.A. Confidential @ 13:
Wait until the market crashes, then buy EVERYTHING. Contrarianism is the only sure way to trade successfully. (Buy when everybody else is selling, sell when everyone else is buying).
Fran Taylor @ 44:
We're nowhere near as dependant as we were 20 yrs ago. We had 12 yrs of very good liberal govt, I just hope our current Conservative govt doesn't fuck things up...
Wait until the market crashes, then buy EVERYTHING.
With what? Dollars? Hah! Everyone with something to sell will already have bushel baskets full of worthless dollars and won't want any more.
We’re nowhere near as dependant as we were 20 yrs ago.
Oh really? What about this: http://www.census.gov/foreign-trade/balance/c1220.html
Check out the crazy-ass jump between 1998 and 2000.
Harley-Davidson idles 5400 workers
BusinessWeek - Nov 26, 2007
By EMILY FREDRIX Some 5400 Harley-Davidson Inc. workers are out of work this week as the motorcycle maker cuts production because of falling sales.
I got curious, so I crunched some numbers:
1986: Canadian exports to US were 11.3% of its GDP
2006: Canadian exports to US were 27.7% of its GDP
Yep, that wagon is hitched up good and tight. See you at the bottom.
My business is related directly to newer homes in a trendy suburban area. My experience for the last several years is that purchases were made largely with personal equity loans. They aren't spending money any more. Between the SUVs and loss of equity in their homes, the parties over. Non-essential spending is going away.
dadams @ 11:
Did you? Who's talking about buying? Wasn't I talking about insider knowledge? Did you take reading 101?
Fran Taylor @ 51:
Take away oil, gas and hydro electricity and check the numbers...
Forget absurdly idiotic sex-ed classes. We need mandatory financial education in high school. All graduates should have a basic understanding of how to invest wisely as well as a DEEP understanding of the evil that is using credit to buy things you don't need and cannot afford. Compound interest is a miracle especially if you start saving at 18. Honestly, its not hard to invest successfully if you have a basic understanding of how it works and a lengthy time horizon. And with a war on... all kinds of issues to buy if you can morally accept it.
I was at Costco over the weekend and they couldnt keep the LCD screens on the shelf. People were buying all sorts of stuff and the lines were looooooooong. And this is the most middle class of middle class joints. So where the hell are these people, supposedly teetering on the brink of disaster, getting the scratch to buy a 47" screen? Chances are, its credit. And there are no politicians on either side of the aisle who can be blamed for an individual's personal stupidity.
And it aint just rich people buying $5 coffee at Starbucks. Peeps need discipline.
Lakeguy @ 54:
What else do you guys have to offer? Maple syrup and smoked salmon?
Is it generally agreed that the middle class should have tax cuts like the Republicans have campaigned for?
I hate to say this, but if the US economy crashes, it won't be just the Canadiens effected, the whole world will. If you think how much China, Japan, and other Far East countries export here, as well as Europe, we are looking at a global meltdown. Those guys in the WTO have to be literally fllipping out right now as they see the US stumbling.
And me, I am worried as hell right now, my job is being outsourced to another part of the country, my wife and I just had a baby, and I recently bought a house. At least my company will give we a decent separation package that should get me through the rest of next year.
Okay then Mandatory Financial Education in one easy lesson.
An "American dream" was invented which enriched bankers who collect interest on our expenditures for cars, homes, credit card purchases and late payments for the above when we spend more than we make or can afford to repay without incurring interest.
Sell Short @ 56:
Don't forget Celine Dion
RasslinGod @ 57:
It's agreed that the wealthy should have theirs rescinded.
Sell Short @ 56:
Blackberrys, hondas, toyotas. You have no idea what we have, so typical. No wonder you guys are in so much trouble.
dothehop @ 58:
Yep... that's exactly what will happen. When (it's no longer a matter of if) the USD hits hyperinflation, it's going to fuck the global economy six ways 'til Sunday. A *lot* of assets floating out there are denominated and tied up in USD... it's not like the US is a 2nd world country with few ties to other countries, such as those who had to revalue their currency due to hyperinflation (ie: MXN, TRY, PLN) in the 20 years.
And Bernake is a fucking idiot for continuously cutting rates. All he cares about is keeping the stock market up. Well, if the USD is worth shit, the Dow could skyrocket to the moon, and it won't mean a damned thing, as it's denominated in USD.
dothehop @ 58:
Your not alone brother.
I understand, you'll be able to sell that energy to China instead of us, so our problems won't affect your energy business.
Okay, energy exports from Canada to US in 2006 (I can't find data for 1986) were approx. 20% of the total, crunching some more says that:
2006: Canadian non-energy exports to US were 19.8% of its GDP
Again, see you at the bottom.
Blackberrys, hondas, toyotas.
Electronic junk and new cars are the first things we're gonna stop buying. Your maple syrup business will take off as global warming pushes the native habitat of the sugar maple further north.
pepper @ 25:
I'm not entirely sure why Richardson even thinks he's a Democrat.
I have to love all of these talking heads babbling about "inciting" a class war. HA! You're in the damn middle of one! Wake the hell up! What did you miss Enron? Exxon posting RECORD profits every single quarter, yet getting subsidized by the government for all their exploration and infrastructure? Shifting more of the tax burden off of the rich onto the middle and lower class? The dollar buys less now than since the depression, and that was before it slid against every other currency! Just look at the price of food (which, believe it or not, poor people need too).
And tax breaks? What the... hello?! It's all GONE. No money. Empty banko accounto. Nada. No one gets any tax breaks, hell we'll ALL have to pay more (assuming anyone is actually interested in saving the country). All classes must have higher taxes, with fewer loopholes.
If ever there was a time for Robin Hood in the U.S., it is now. The problem is that with globalization, these jerk-offs will just leave the country, and transfer their accounts of stolen loot in the Caymans to wherever they land the private jet. Not that this is my favorite, but clearly there's only one thing to do:
Fran Taylor @ 66:
10% of the worlds easily potable fresh water and a population of 35 million...
Lakeguy @ 62:
Uh, Canadian stuff... The robot space arm?... and... hockey brawls with children? Aaand- oh and comedians (half of which sadly disappear into obscurity after great promise)! You guys used to have a few beer companies before everone decided to let there only be one: "InBev SAB Miller Molson Coors".
But I guess most think all you guys had up there were lumberjacks and cars! And, of course, that word... (though I love how the guy playing the American is SOO Canadian! ;) )
Blue Buddha @ 60:
Try Shania Twain...
L.A. Confidential @ 50:
Last time I was in Prague I met a Czech cabbie who REALLY wanted a Harley. In that the Czech Koruna is now 17.8 or so to the dollar (used to be around 40-44, he just might get to realize his dream.
When I get motivated, I'm going to go antagonize the wingnuts about how the US is going to get bought up ON SALE by mostly the Chinese........interestingly they like to ramble on about "financial Darwinism". Here's the thing....they gave us shiny baubles (cheap consumer crap) and in return, they are going to be able to buy up REAL assets at a steep discount to our devalued currency....in effect, we are going to be OWNED by the CHINESE. Basically, our "mighty capitalist engine" is going to get eaten by a bunch of shortish communists....making us the modern day equivalent buying off indigenous people with a couple gadgets for vast acres of land and natural resources.
V V
Buzzflash has a link to a very good article on "The Agonist" website. Pertinent to this thread and more than a bit frightening.
http://www.buzzflash.net/story.php?id=32470
10% of the worlds easily potable fresh water
As frozen ice! How you gonna cut it up? Friggin' sharks with friggin' lasers attached to their heads?
People sitting outside of Kohl's and Best Buy at 4 AM the Friday after Thanksgiving. My wife and I looked at eachother when we saw the commercials and thought "Who are these idiots sitting outside waiting for a store to open at 4 AM?" Spend, spend, spend. I heard some crazy stat the other day that 70 percent of the U.S. economy is based on us spending money. If we stop spending money so goes the economy. And we wonder why the Middle Class is feeling the pinch? How about those morons (and the greedy ass enablers) not having any financial sense and getting ARMs (or interest only loans) to get houses that they could not otherwise afford? Interest rate goes up and these people have to scrape every penny to come up with the payment. Not to mention that even if they wanted to sell their houses they would have a tough time right now. Adding insult to injury the value of their home is dropping (and so is mine by the way so I am sort of screwed as well). Add a terrible education system that teaches nothing but how to take a test so people do not have the skills to get better paying jobs.
The middle class will soon be destroyed and America will become a third world country. Negative national savings rate. $9 trillion debt (of which $3.6+ trillion is under Bush's watch alone). No energy policy to get us out of the Middle East. And add to that unfunded trillions in Medicare and social security liabilities. AND NO ONE CARES. WHY? Does Bush want to destroy the United States?
"I would argue that the most serious threat to the United States is not someone hiding in a cave in Afghanistan or Pakistan but our own fiscal irresponsibility." David Walker, Government Accountability Office.
Cheney's electro box does not shock atrial fibrillation. It only shocks ventricular fibrillation. He had to go in for that last cardioversion. But it does give one pause if he is having breakthrough arrythmias despite being the most closely monitored cardiac patient in the world. I wonder if he's on a transplant list? That's about the only option left. He may be too old to qualify, but they would bend the rules - for him.
KCThinker @ 74:
Agreed but maybe we shouldn't get totally distracted by the bright, shiney subprime issue. One of the things that came first was that wage increases came to a virtual standstill. Would all of this subprime b.s. have happened if that had never occurred?
And I totally agree about the education "system". Teaching to the test bites.
hope @ 72:
Thanks Hope.
KCThinker @ 77:
Of course. I thought the article and the comments were informative and/or intriguing. I was never the best student when it came to Economics so am glad when I find a discussion that holds my interest (even if it is rather depressing).
f the top 1 percenters the Kudlowites pander to
hope @ 76:
Agreed but maybe we shouldn't get totally distracted by the bright, shiney subprime issue. One of the things that came first was that wage increases came to a virtual standstill. Would all of this subprime b.s. have happened if that had never occurred?
And I totally agree about the education "system". Teaching to the test bites.
I do think the subprime debacle would have occurred regardless because even modest wage increases would probably not have offset the effect of rising interest rates and people just spending too much on crap like new HD TVs. I also think there is a trend to believe the bank when it comes to what you can afford and not decide for yourself what you can afford. I think most of the foreclosures are occurring because the folks are mortgaged to the hilt and any changes in the payment would be greater than any increase in pay they might get.
For me, the sub-prime meltdown is important because it is one of the first signs that things are not going well. It sheds light on a system that is out of whack and unsustainable. Kind of like the canary in the coal mine.
I have less than $200 for the gifts AND food for the holidays. War on Christmas? Bullshit. This is war on the working families of America. Gas prices make everything more expensive, and my pay hasn't kept up with bills. Good thing I taught my kid that there is more to life than money. And there is more to Christmas than gifts and greed.
pepper @ 2:
I would be interested in those books, Pepper.
Thanks in advance.
They just axed 25,000 workers in the midwest, and the stock went through the roof!
It's a great republican economy!
Just because its not my job has nothing to do with it.
A disappearing middle class equals a disappearing democracy. Watch it vanish before your very eyes.
KCThinker @ 80:
Well, I'm on very shaky ground when I attempt to argue economics, but my vote is that the first effects of Reaganomics was the canary in the coal mine and the subprime fiasco is more like one of the final nails in the coffin.
And why can't the lenders get it together and renegotiate a lot of these loans? Nobody wins in this situation--not the lenders, not the (stupid? naive?) homeowners who went for these loans and are about to be foreclosed on, and not the rest of us who would likely benefit from the market picking up again.
and yet, there are people on this board, and other progressive blogs who are arguing that we need to be more liberal in regards to illegal aliens
outsourcing and insourcing are killing the middle class
the goal of the corporatists is to turn the US into the worlds largest 3rd world economy
and its happening slowly....so we as sheep will sit idly by as we get fucked
Even my richest friends are having major cash flow problems right now...... the economy is for the elite only
The lead article in this week's Economist business section is titled, "At the Gates of Hell". As a newspaper, its pretty conservative. On economic matters it is very conservative.
We've been treated to nearly a generation of thinking that the US is somehow removed from the business cycle, even removed from that Newtonian axiom of what goes up must come down. When things have turned down, the "free" markets have been manipulated with cheap money, er debt instruments. Each time we fiddle with the cycle to keep it looking healthy, it only makes the inevitable downswing more violent. All that cheap credit, including at a national level will have to be paid back. The sagging dollar means nobody wants Treasury bills...or favored method for paying the debt without actually paying it. I remember all those foreign debt payments that third world countries were saddled with in the 90's and think of us.
And the boomer generation has been sold lock, stock, and barrel on the idea of investment...forgetting that the stock market does not generate wealth, it transfers it. What should be the middle class is now le petit bourgeois (also the Democratic base) who think they are a lot wealthier than they really are. These are the folks who have their retirement sunk into the markets and these are the people who are going to lose everything if/when the market really tanks. They probably won't be so complacent then, but it will be too late. Meanwhile, the truly rich will buy up the stocks for a song and never be affected anyhow.
I certainly agree that the Administration sees it coming, i figure that's why so many Republican Congressmen are getting out now. Whoever gets the presidency is going to face serious shit hitting the fan.
Also, we are not a wartime economy because of Iraq...we've been a wartime economy since WWII without even the smallest of breaks.
I say FIRE THEM ALL!!! If they've been in office more than 6 years, FIRE THEM! Vote for the new person. Hell, could it be any worse?
What 'Middle Class?'
Is that the fifty-or-so folks who earn between $2M/year and $25/hour?
Sell Short @ 56:
I sure hope you were fooling around because that is a completely ignorant question.
hope @ 85:
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Japan had a stock and housing bubble in the 1980's. We have now had the same. Japan slipped into deflation in 1995. People are not paying attention to the big picture.
Once the stock bubble peaked, nothing could stop its reversion to the mean. the same is true with the housing bubble. Why would banks want to lend when the collateral is dropping in value?
The K-wave bottoms in 2014. The FED in all its money pumping, is fighting deflation. It is the natural completion of the inflation/deflation cycle. Note how many things are being mentioned as the worst since the Great DEpression. The reason is that we are at that phase of the long term cycle.
don't hate me @ 7:
I just recently had the displeasure of seeing 5 minutes of this guy; damn he is HORRIBLE. let me sum it up with one of his quotes recently:
"Wow, a strong President Bush, a strong stock market...it doesn't get much better than that."
yes, the guy is a damn N U T.
The funny thing about Wall Street is it always goes up on the announcement of lay-offs which is good for the company, but bad for the workers.
They also rebound favorably whenever the Fed cuts rates, although the Fed is loath to do so for fear of inflation.
KCThinker @ 74:
Considering wage growth has been stagnate over the big picture, average middle class Americans cannot afford to buy a home; they took these loans because it has LONG been a part of the American dream..and idea, that if you WORK HARD, you'll be rewarded...with a place of your own.
I do not fault all of these people who took ARMS; I fault the system in place that 1)allows them, 2)makes huge profits, and doesn't care what happens afterwards, 3)our leaders who are not protecting the "American Dream"
...oh yea, working hard isn't getting you diddly squat.
Bud @ 91:
What, no legal reefereno?
One of my favorite movies, and appropos to this thread:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SiOQ5RV07xA
Josh @ 96:
I'd druther squat, then diddly, otherwise I'd have a nasty carpet stain to scrub out.
Yes. We know the truth. Corporate America and the elite are destroying the middle class. The problem is that we still play their games. For example, I am sure that this year, the middle class, is going to spend or extend their credit cards, in toys that are not only not manufactiure here, but that are also contaminated. Until we seriuosly change the rules and play by our rules, they will not care. So, don't buy toys this year, unless it says Made In America. If you don't find them, then don't buy. The kids are not going to die.
The economy is great if you are at the top looking down.
"Our Blessed St. Ronnie" and the rest of the Market Fundamentalists just don't understand what Henry Ford -- an avowed fascist -- did; that you have to pay the workers enough to buy the product. David Stockman had it right. "Voodoo Economics" indeed. With the money they have stolen from the middle class, they have initiated a successful leveraged buyout of the US Government. Unless we do something right away we are so screwed. LBO's, junk bonds, bailouts, asset bubbles, hedge funds, collapsed CDO's; who always winds up picking up the tab for these pirates?
Like Don Henley sang, "The man with a briefcase can steal more money than any man with a gun."
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