Why Does Bill O'Reilly Hate America?
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Oh, the fax machines at Grover Norquist's office are whirring again. And leave it to Bill O'Reilly to spin their talking points in his (surprise! surprise!) Talking Points Memo segment.
Naturally, the only people who have problems with waterboardings are the far left, the media (aren't they one and the same?) and some Republicans. I don't know about you, but that sounds like a majority of Americans to me. And the whole Jack Bauer scenario kind of falls apart when you realize that the great information the CIA got from Zubaydeh came a day later than the actual waterboarding...ticking time bomb indeed. Do they actually mean to say that there were no other ways--ones that conformed to basic human rights and the Geneva Conventions--to obtain that information? If so, then that makes the CIA look pretty ineffectual, doesn't it?
So tell me, why is Falafel Man so eager to endorse an act that the majority of Americans are against and that is illegal by both domestic and international standards? Does he hate America that much?
yes
answering the "Does he hate America that much?" question
I am against torture because I don't want the government to torture me. Not so hard to figure out. The weapons they use on others now are the weapons they will use on dissenters at home. As it has ever been, so will it ever be.
He's a fool. He luvs GWB better than he does the USA.
I don't know what to say. He's just a major league ass hole.
I wish it were a crime to be "bad for the species."
Cons think people will think they're gay if they don't support every war and torture
Kind of a dumb move Bill'o. The statement next to his mug clearly admits a link between torture and Bush. If you don't like torture you don't like Bush. I think it's the first I ever agreed with this egomaniacle, sexual harassing, draft dodging wimp.
Good LORD. If I didn't know O'Reilly was for torture before, what he just did to poor Logic would have sealed the deal. I think the chump discovered he had a surplus of logical fallacies, and decided he had to use 'em all up before the end of 2007 lest he get fewer in next year's budget.
These guys represent corporate interests. They don't care if America turns into a police state with a martial law mentality. They buy into the frame that Americans are nothing more than consumers. We need people in the Press who are loyal to the American people not the corporations/defense contractors who own the media. How to achieve that.. I'm not sure.
www.StopBigMedia.com
The subject should be whether we should be doing any kind of torture. They tortured some the detainees with other methods they are not even talking about.
“Funston's example has bred many imitators, and many ghastly additions to our history: the torturing of Filipinos by the awful `water-cure,' for instance, to make them confess – what? Truth? Or lies? How can one know which it is they are telling? For under unendurable pain a man confesses anything that is required of him, true or false, and his evidence is worthless. Yet upon such evidence American officers have actually – but you know about those atrocities which the War Office has been hiding a year or two....” Mark Twain
Imperialism Isn't Fun When The Enemy Can Shoot Back
"Does he hate America that much?"
I'm willing to wager that Bill O'Reilly hates everybody, including himself.
LiberalTarian @ 3:
Good point. I suspect that when this happens, if it is not already happening, then one will see people like O'Reilly and the rest of the demagogues engaging in a game of blame the victim, that it is all their fault, and that they deserve every bit of violence that is inflicted upon them. As noted writer Michael Parenti has observed in one of his books, people like O'Reilly deserve the appellation of Superpatriots, though when it came time for O'Reilly to display his patriotism, he mysteriously came nowhere near a field of combat while wearing a military uniform. A case of do as I say, not as I do?
Which America you referring to? I don't see America anymore. When a people within a country start viciously fighting each other. It's pretty much over.
Is "Talking Points" a person? Talking points says "......blah...." I don't get it. Can anyone explain?
"Why Does Bill O’Reilly Hate America?"
Because it's not a Christian Theocracy.
Lex Talionis @ 16:
Well, at least not officially. Yet.
can we please have a thread about the debate? Thompson was just awesome telling off the weirdo host they had.
Yes he does. But he does love him some fascism.
Misguided indignation?
This from the guy who invented the annual War on Christmas?!
Lex Talionis @ 16:
As long as people have
* the plentitude of cheap diversion
* and the lack of a clearly defined threat (most people do no look up until the jackboot is on the doorstep)
* and a lack of understanding of modern oppressive forces (they still think it wears jackboots and cannot believe that they carry around legal proof of their gulag residency in the form of plastic credit cards)
we'll delude ourselves into thinking everything is basically fine.
It has not been established or proven in any way that any 'useful intelligence' of any type has been obtained by waterboarding or shocked genitalia or child rape or any of the other 'creatively enhanced' interrogation techniques.
FWIW, I was just over at CNN.com and their nonscientific poll question "Is waterboarding acceptable?" had 55% of respondents saying yes. FWIW.
This is RIDICULOUS. The idea that you would do it to save your own children.
HELLO?! We don't allow people to shoot people who killed their children for revenge. We don't allow them to go out and kill someone who is terrorizing the neighbourhood. We call that illegal. We call that immoral.
This isn't VIGILANTE justice Bill. This isn't the wild west where you take care of your own.
This is America. And if it has to stand for something. It needs to be a beacon of hope for every nation on the Earth.
You MORON.
Is he imitating dickless chainey making a kissy-face?
Bill(shit) O'Reilly hates America because he's such a loser as a human being. He was probably beaten up on a regular basis while at school, picked last for any team sport, and was taunted because his parents dressed him funny... and he's never gotten over it. For some weird reason that even he can't explain, he's got a big empty hole inside of him he keeps trying to fill up.
Then again, maybe he's just a wholesale loser with a chip on his shoulder, a big mouth, and no original thoughts whatsoever.
ysbaddaden @ 25:
You wish...!
SKINNER @ 23:
It would be advisable for CNN to ask the question if Americans believe it would be acceptable for other countries to waterboard American prisoners. Bit it is doubtful if CNN would do this because that would require their viewers to think outside the box.
Question: "Does he hate America that much? "
Answer: Yes.
Next question!
I can't stand to listen to him anymore, just like I can't stand to listen to Ann Coulter. I'll just read the text from now on.
SKINNER @ 23:
It's a question of framing. If the poll question had been "Would it be acceptable for another country's government to waterboard Americans?" you can bet that the results would be different. As long as it's us doing the torturing, most folks are fine with it. Just like the American Mainstream is largely okay with Christianity's overt influence on politics and policy, but if a congressman asks to be sworn in on a Quran, it's a scandal.
Jack @ 24:
Not right now it isn't. One more Republican administration and the experiment is OVER.
"Bush hatred"?
Uh, I plead guilty, Falafel Man.
Of all the idiotic reich-wingers on TV, this blustering punk bully is the one I find the most disgusting. I'd love to see somebody just pop him one. Just shut him the f--k up.
What a detestable, despicable excuse for a human being. I refuse to watch him.
Dear Bill O'Reilly,
Would you fly a plane into a building in another country if it would save YOUR spouse or YOUR child or YOUR family member? I didn't think so. You can't have it both ways, buddy. There have to be limits for BOTH sides in your imaginary War on Terrorismists. I also liked how you showed a clip of Sen. McCain denouncing torture but didn't say anything about it. What's wrong? You're willing to make general statements about those evil people who don't want us to waterboard so that your viewers can make their own conclusions about McCain but you're not willing to attack a man who underwent torture himself? Wow. That's pretty sinister...Did Rupert Murdoch put you up to this?
So if they 'broke' the guy after "he resisted for quite some time" (30-35 seconds), and he didn't confess anything for "the next day or so" (a short time afterward)*, what happened to the guy in the meantime? Did they presume that the "interrogation" had not worked and let him get some rest? Did they "interrogate" him in more ways and more "harshly"?
*Interesting that "quite some time" means 30-35 seconds while "a short time" means a day or two later. Sounds kinda backwards to me.
Let's control the argument folks. Bill O'Reilly and the other supportive Neo-Cons are Pro-Torture. Plain and simple. Stop letting these assholes control the language. It's not and argument between people who are "for or against interrogations," it is and argument between those who are "for or against torture." Say it anytime you're in an argument with these fools and repeat as often as possible.
You know, not trying to make a lot of excuses for "24" in regards to the right's favorite Jack Bauer-tickign time bomb scenario, but I will say this about Bauer as a character: Whenever he's about to do something incredibly illegal because The Fate of The World Depends On It, you usually see Keifer Sutherland on his call doing that silent-scream thing, saying "I take full responsibility, I'll take the blame, I'll take the hit, but we gotta move, and we gotta move now." And of course, because we're following Bauer in pseudo-real-time, we know that there IS a ticking time bomb, and we DO have to move now. Whether that would work in a real-WORLD scenario, at least we see someone acting "heroic" - willing to sacrifice something, his life, his career, his reputation, to save the world.
Which is why I think the modern GOP is a bunch of Jennifer Pissybritches. NONE OF THEM, NOT ONE, wants to take responsibiity, the blame, the hit, for being wrong in the event that someone is tortured and no good comes of it. So, instead of NOT torturing, which seems to me to be the ethical, Christian, American thing to do, they just insist on making torture legal. This way, if they fail to extract any worthwhile info, at least they don't get in trouble, Heaven forfend. This way, it's one less pardon Bush has to write, and really, that poor sonofabitch has enough to do, doesn't he?
jimbow8 @ 35:
Hey... quit making sense... that completely blows Bill(shit)'s bloviating.
I'll tell what real torture is.Having to see his stupid face and read the bullshit he spews.Fuckoff o'liely.Fuck Fox security too.
i'm curious bill...how exactly DOES one learn to shit out of his mouth? teach me plz? kthx.
slappy magoo @ 37:
Exactly. At least JB is willing to take responsibility. Making torture LEGAL means that one CANNOT be tried and found guilty for it. KEEPING it illegal still means that one may be found NOT GUILTY of torture by a jury or court. In other words under the second scenario, if torture is the "right thing to do" a person can be exonerated. Under the first scenario, one can torture with impunity with no recourse or responsibility because there is no way he can be tried.
TimV @ 36:
I just thought this bore repeating. You are absolutely correct. Whoever frames the issue, wins the argument.
curious @ 40:
Stuff food up your ass. Didn't you see that episode of South Park? ;)
BillO would be the first to to scream barbarians if our enemy did this to our soldiers. One of the main reasons why we shouldn't do it. IF other countries or organizations see us do it then why can't they?
To be willing to further piss off the rest of the world and affect the nation's moral standing in the world is to HATE AMERICA
So tell me, why is Falafel Man so eager to endorse an act that the majority of Americans are against and that is illegal by both domestic and international standards?
We're at War remember? In order to protect us from the Enemy, who wants to slice our heads off you have to torture to get information that could be of use to our Military so they can intercept the bad guys before they slice our heads off. Or hit our cities with suitcase nukes or dirty bombs.
Isn't that what the Corp Media as been stressing since 911? Shop, don't worry, be happy and we'll take care of the nasty tasks?
Would this make y'all pro-torture?
http://kyushu.com/gleaner/gliss46/image24.gif
If you do it just for fun, does that put you in the amateur league?
Hearing O'Reilly pontificate is similar to watching the classic 1950s film A Face In the Crowd with Andy Griffith. In that film, the television audience is manipulated into giving credibility to a third rate country singer. In today's world, American audiences are supposed to believe that a former tabloid television reporter is capable of issuing pearls of wisdom that the unwashed masses are somehow longing to hear. Yet O'Reilly's audience, whose average age is about 71, eagerly tune in to hear what their idol has to say concerning events which he has no more intimate knowledge of than the average working person. Perhaps the lesson here is that people will believe what they wish to believe, relying more upon emotion than facts and intelligence.
ysbaddaden @ 47:
First off, who's "ya'll?" The S&M community? Is this an official "S&M Community" website?
Second, does having regular, missionary-position sex make you a rapist? Consensual behavior involving legal adults is not the same thing as kidnapping someone and torturing them against their will.
Erroll @ 48:
"American Idol" #1 (And #2) In 2007 Ratings
Some believe that in order to save lives, we should do whatever it takes. A short 'swim' on a board is no big deal. Just a little water, right? But where does that lead? What do people like O'Reilly, Scarborough, etc. think about John Yoo's comments concerning the abilities of a president in regards to torture? He says there is no law or treaty that would keep the president from "crushing the testicles" belonging to the child of a suspect. Just think about that....
Of course those who defend maniac Yoo would declare we'd never actually do that. To them I suggest they listen to the claims of Seymour Hersh who has actually viewed videos that make waterboarding look like nothing, and which would force the immediate resignation of the entire administration if made public. Too bad they are probably locked away in some underground vault.
At the rate the MSM is brainwashing this country I wonder if a nativity scene of the future will feature Brad and Angelina or Madonna and Guy figurines kneeling next to a cradle in a snowy pasture.
If hating Bush is wrong I don't want to be right
We really need to start working on differentiating ourselves from the regimes that we've historically seen as evil.
JudyLou @ 4:
actually billo loves a hand job better and wants larry craig to call him for a good time in minneapolis.
the way billo's lips are persed reminds me of a hospital bed pan that has been passed around too often.
I guess Bill 'O wants to be one of the "John Does" in the future war crimes trial of this administration.
Sweet
Its not about hating "America". Its manipulation to get the population to sign away everything to the group that took over the country. The regime hates the mass of people they want to dominate and drive before the cracking of the terrorist whip.
The Provokateur @ 57:
I was reading someone who mentioned the German People in the 30's were a hell of a lot smarter and aware of events then we are.
Now thats disturbing.
Lex Talionis @ 49:
Yes
I can't stand Orally as much as the next person here, but...
Has such a Faux News tone to it. That terminolgoy is Billo-ball in my book.
I think we can do better.
As you were...
Lawn Guyland isn't fit to be part of America.
Or maybe it was the religious epiphany that the CIA guy glosses over...
"We tortured him, then God talked to him, so obviously the torture worked...."
Bill O'Reilly is a heinous human being. He should have been marginalized but the leadership at Fox "News", who are themselves heinous, decided to give him a national audience. He BELONGS at Fox "News".
I would love to see a liberal ask one of these freaks one simple question:
If waterboarding isn't torture, does that mean it's ok for countries to do to our soldiers?
The thing about torture is where does one draw the line once one begins?
If waterboarding is OK, then is breaking a finger OK?
If breaking a finger is OK, then how about severing that finger?
If severing a finger is OK, then how many fingers can you sever? How about a hand? or a Foot? What about breaking a leg?
If one is allowed to break a leg, then get out the chainsaw for nick....of course not near an artery... Why not? It's not fatal.
How about blinding someone? Samson in the Bible got blinded, and he lived a little while longer for a little revenge on his tormentors, now, didn't he?
Let's see... one could remove someone's tongue if they won't talk... that won't kill them...
Where does it all stop?
I love that his source said that Waterboarding was torture and shouldn't be used in the same interview. lol Talk about taking things out of context.
Lex Talionis @ 49:
Who's "'y'all"? Who's "y'all"????!!!
All y'all's y'all boy! Sheeooot.
Bud @ 66:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLQ3i_XQXsw
It's sad just how much Fox News hates America. Perhaps it's really Murdoch (since he's not American) that hates America, and would like to see us destroyed. Obviously, Fox has nothing but contempt for all the good things we used to stand for. I think that makes O'Reilly and all of the other Fox Folks traitors.
Erroll @ 28:
Jesus Harold Christ...
Am I to assume from that poll that 45% of respondents believe that waterboarding ISN'T torture?
If that's the case, then the Administration has done its job. They've taken a question as dirt simple as "Is the sky blue?" and muddied the argument so much with their incessant spinning, that they've managed to convince half of the pollsters that waterboarding isn't so much "torture" as it is "enhanced".
Just when I was starting to have faith in my country again.....
What's the next CNN poll? "Are cigarettes bad for you?"
Golly you people know what...I think Bill O'Reilly hates everything and everybody except himself.
What Billo needs to cure is narrow-minidness is, to hear of one of our hostages returning homeafter being waterboarded, have that person on the show and for him to repeat it.
Turn out the lights.
I wonder how quickly Bill O' would have given up the facts of his sexual harassment case if the interrogators got to use "extreme" interrogation techniques? Where will it end. I guess that we can start allowing police to use water boarding to get confessions from suspected murderers, because keeping them off the street will save lives. Right? Screw the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, Habeas Corpus, the Geneva Convention, the US Constitution and every other sane rule of law ever used by civilized nations. Sorry Bill, we as American's have a the right & responsibility to disagree with what our elected, or in this case non-elected officials do under the guise of National Security. I can't even believe that Fox News has been allowed this topic to become a debate, since the overwhelming majority people continue to view water boarding as torture.
Opponents of waterboard can, and have, proven the practice amounts to torture. Bill has no proof to back up his spurious paranoid claims of thousands of American lives being 'saved' or still in danger. There is no argument here, because there is literally nothing to argue.
As for the 'would you waterboard to save your children' question, which we *have* to address if only to demonstrate a willingness to accept that the world isn't entirely black and white (unlike the wingnuts who dismiss hypotheticals all the time), the obvious answer is 'yes'. But that still doesn't make it *right*. If that's the only option the question makes an allowance for, then something has gone seriously wrong with the process leading up to it. Somebody would have to be putting a gun to the kids' heads and threatening to pull the trigger, or some insane shit like that.
He doesn't just hate America, he hates himself. Look at and listen to this weak sorry man and his "my way or you're stupid" rhetoric. Bill says we don't have a right or reason to hate Dubyah because HE SAYS SO. Bill, we get it; you and your bullshit makes grandma and grandpa feel safe from us. But they're dying off Bill, and soon it'll be just you and us. Time, in every way is on our side.
The Nazis claimed that they were saving lives by torturing their "enemies" too.
And for Billo,
I don't hate torture because I hate Bush, I hate Bush because I hate torture.
Orangutan. @ 9:
Find out what corps own the media and and refuse to buy their products.
SEXUAL PREDATOR!
Neo-cons like torture because it takes them back to their youths and the wonderful memories they have of pulling legs off of small creatures.
Besides, we all know it's not torture if it happens to a non-white person sillies.
One thing I am getting tired of with CNL is this. I don't watch FOX, but every time someone on that network says something, ANYTHING, it gets reported here. You bring this site up and the first thing you see is FOX bullshit. Can't we ignore these people now? I don't care about them. Couldn't give a damn what BillO says on any subject at all. Do CNL folks need to spend so much time telling all of us what we don't care to know? Wouldn't we watch if we thought it was important? Republican politicians are different, the 'govern' supposedly and need to be watched, but BillO?
If the waterboarding was successful, he would have told them everything at once instead of waiting for the next day. It was concern for his fellow prisoners that loosened his tongue. Threatening to punish others for your actions is a proven way to get someone to change his behavior. Moral anguish is more effective than physical anguish. Of course, you must believe that terrorists have morals, however twisted, in order to employ the technique.
bill...
following your logic -- if your neighbor was killed and you became a suspect -- perhaps innocent -- and you were waterboarded... would it be torture... why don't we start waterboarding our own citizens for any number of suspected crimes. how many americans do americans kill? let's get out the waterboard for EVERY interrogation...
Bill loves torture, Joe Scarborough loves torture. there is no more transparency in govt, but at least there is on these guys.
"If you hate torture, then you hate Bush."
The honest assessment of the year!
You can see the evil stamped on his face.
I know I'd like to stamp on his face.
perhaps the point of kiriakou's comments is to get the facts on the record.. that waterboarding is torture and that torture failed.
ysbaddaden @ 68:
Jeebus! There is a gigantic difference between fun and torture! Unless the players are crazy, BDSM involves consent.
You gotta ask to get hurt.
BDSM may invoke the specter of torture, but it differs fundamentally from a procedure involving a kidnapped adult who has not negotiated the events and does not have the ability to have the dom arrested if s/he steps over the preset line. I mean, there's idiots out there in every possible pastime, but that doesn't necessarily make the pastime bad. (Yes, I know there are pastimes you should not indulge in because they are inherently hurtful, but BDSM is not a matter of pulling the wings off flies or something like that. It's about cruelty, sometimes, but not being a monster.)
I realize BDSM can look like torture and feel like torture, but asking someone you like to hurt you (or vice versa) is different than being kidnapped and held without the chance to get legal redress or be monitored for health.
gg @ 12:
You nailed it.
Simply, if this is acceptable, then the next time there's a bombing or threat of bombing against an abortion clinic, the suspects can be waterboarded to discover if there's any other potential threats, what they know, etc. After all, that's terrorism.
Of course, I somehow doubt the wingnuts are going to tolerate that, are they.
Right now they think it's OK if my government can torture me. That destroys freedom and democracy because it OK's hideous, horrible, coercive treatment. Somehow they're not worried however . . .
mouthyb @ 87:
I'm sure Andrea Dworkin would argue the point with you.
billo misapplies logic when he states that the use of torture produced the effect of no attacks since 9/11. he could just as easily have stated that the lack of attacks since 9/11 has been due to the vacuum in bush's skull.
Better that than a submissive moral capitulator bowing to the fear mongering of an incompetent fool.
They point to Abu Zubaydah as a case where waterboarding produced results.
1. How many cases did not produce results?
2. What answer are they looking for? If the answer is wrong, how do they know?
3. If they think they know the answer then torture someone to hear it from him, what was the reason for torture?
4. How do they know who may or may not know something?
Just like in the wmd Intelligence they tell you whatever was a reason to go to war, never telling you all the Intel that pointed away from war.
The hate starts for billo in the morning. He looks in a mirror and sees the flabby, liver-spotted face of a drunk misogynist. His stubby fingers and flacid appendage fill him with rage. The small weak man goes to work seething, looking for a target. Sometimes its a hapless employee, more often its America. Billo needs professional help. Lets hope the little man gets it.
right on! @ 26:
I think that the chip on his shoulder is just a splinter off of his block head.
I think the main reason Billo is so pro-torture is because he is doing exactly what he accuses the left of doing: opposing the other side JUST to oppose the other side. I doubt he has really given much thought to it at all.
Not that he COULD give it much thought.
If you condone the torture of anyone, you will condone the torture or threat of torture for everyone by those with the power to do it. At that point the game's over. Everyone gets to be very and legitimately afraid all the time, and the Billos of the world can then workout their libidinous domination fantasies on the rest of us for the sheer pleasure and profit of it.
If Waterboarding a known terrorist like KSM provided information that saved 1 soldeirs life it is worth it. Simulated drowing seems to be very effective and causes no physical harm (so says the CIA..but who knows)
People are acting like this is being done by the police when you get pulled over for speeding.
Watch the Pearl video when KSM cut his freaking head off....so what if this guy got simulated drowing...Apparently he gave up tons of information that helped save lives. CIA says this has been done to 3 people since 9-11.
In the interview on ABC the CIA agent said clearly, these people hate us more then they love there onw lives, without waterboarding they never would have talked.
Seems pretty clear we need to do more than ask nicely.
I repeat...Waterboarding causes no physical harm...how is that torture
ysbaddaden @ 90:
Mz Dworkin, as well as Mz McKinnon, have the considerable comfort of theorizing from an ivory tower and not having to implement and therefore think about their theories (and sexism). They also have a typically moralistic take on sex which ignores the possibility that women can consent without giving up dignity (as can men) and takes for granted that women are victims, which is just about the shittiest way to empower anyone I can think of, and I say this as a feminist.
Bill'O and most far-righties hate everything America is supposed to be.
Thats what makes their "The left just hates America!" thing so laughable. They want America to resemble Nazi Germany for crying out loud! Thats about as America-hating as anyone can get...
What a bunch of morons.
The disgusting torture apologists are coming out of the wood work. I guess the CIA can call this "mission accomplished".
JJohnson....Resort to name calling when you can not make a compelling argument.
To actually say, or believe that the right wants the county to be like Nazi Germany is as ridiculous as saying the left was the country to be like the USSR or Cuba.
When O'Reilly was just a wee, small, babbling boob, his MaMa told him
'Willy, when someone hates you, you just hate them right back'.
ysbaddaden @ 90:
Well, she's dead (good riddance), so you'll have to take up the banner of the Ignorant Hypocrite camp and carry on her work.
jimbow8 @ 43:
Now THIS is the kind of tautological, intellectual excahnge that I read all the way down these comments to find! Thank you for your refreshing outlook!
Does he hate America that much?
Yes he does. His words and actions prove that he does but he'll never admit it because he wants us to believe that he's the ultimate patriot. Now cue the national anthem for uber-patriot BillO (who claims not only does he put his hand over his heart while he says the pledge of alligiance but he keeps it over his heart whenever the national anthem is played).
And BillO only endorses the majority's opinion when it fits his culture warrior agenda.
O'Reilly is mentally ill, just like his idol GWB. Look back through history of the past couple of centuries and you'll discover that most of the people who rose to power (one way or another) we very sick folks. I don't really know too much about Billo's upbringing/past, but he "presents" in the same way as narciscistic sociopaths - just like his bud, GWB.
Preacher Boob@103 No. When O'Reilly was a baby one night he kept crying because his mother ran out of breast milk so his father said "bring that boy over to me!" The rest is history.
Erroll @ 28:
Good point. To put a finer point on it, how about this question:
Consider this hypothetical situation: It is suspected that the United States Air Force is planning a strike against an unknown building in a busy Iraqi town. Many nearby civilians are in danger of being killed or maimed. A captured US pilot is thought to know details of which house will be struck and when. With potentially many innocent lives on the line, should the Iraqi militia holding the US Pilot torture him to extract the information needed to save many lives?
Of course its also the old white people / brown people double standard.
Us torturing brown people = ...Otay!
Brown people torturing US citizens = 24 hour Media coverage, demonstrations in the streets, campaigns to 'free the hostages', top level negotiations, threats of military action, trade sanctions....
The Truthiness Hurts@110 What the fuck are you trying to say?
The Truthiness Hurts @ 109:
Pow. You nailed it, right there. I don't really have anything to add except: Well Said.
So, USA does torture after all. What a shocker!
Why did Bush lie? He kept on saying over and over "USA DOES NOT TORTURE".
Is he a liar or an ignorant? In any case, it doesn't sound good.
i believe that if the waterboardee is lufa boy or el druggo than it is not torture
and if anyone thinks that someone can be broken after just a few seconds of waterboarding....ive got a bridge in florida to sell ya
oh...if one of our soldiers were captured by the enemy, and they used waterboarding against him/her, would our gov consider it torture???
and prove to me that they gave up real info on real attacks
what, like the brooklyn bridge being taken down with a blowtorch????
Dave @ 98:
there are many forms of torture outlawed by the geneva convention...many include psychological torture
but lets take a look at your assertion...that waterboarding causes no physical harm
and we know this how???
oh ya...the bushies have told us
note, they say these guys broke after only a few seconds of the procedure
please wait while i first laff, and then ask you this
lets say a guy refuses to break....dont you think that extended periods of this torture could cause physical damage....not that it matters.....but dont you?
and i dont care what that cia agent is saying....torture has never been proven to be an effective way to gain intel....never....just ask the guys from ww2
also note that he said the individual who was tortured said that if he were freed, he would kill as many americans and israelis as he could....really think he was giving reliable information?
What I want to know is what they had to do to that guy to get him to say that torture works?
It should be called "Walking-talking rectum segment."
BCHICAGO @ 15:
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/
case closed ,
( wrong button ) ,
all right ,
New aproach ,
Billo ,
U R a joke ,
Ur money will not protect you from life or reason . Talking jokes , U , r the joke , what a punk .
If there's anyone who's lost in a fog of self-indignation... pot kettle black.
He's just a well paid off mouthpiece for the Bush regime.
And any good FBI agent knows that Moslems don't believe "Allah" would ever visit them in a dream. Go ask any Moslem scholar. WTF? How does Fox get away with telling lies to us like this?
Are Americans swallowing this bull shit?
Also, if you notice in the video, Bill asks the viewer a question and then tells the viewer what answer to accept. He uses your own kids against you!
He does not support America. Bill O'Reilly hates America.
i presume this will be exhibit a when fuck face war criminal enabler o'reilly faces the music at his own war crimes trial. he can be seated right next to all the other torture enabling right wing mouthpiece pundits who are subborning criminal activity by publicly encouraging this medieval practice. and they say this is a "war" to preserve our "civilization". looks like the bad guys have already won.
So sorry Bill O.
You can pop up anyone to say water boarding this individual led to saving "all" these imaginary lives. Unless you disclose this information to us.
If you Bill are entrusted to talk with all these CIA type and they give you all this classified info with you Bill not having a clearance.
This makes the basis of your intolorance and fear mongering the great lie.
Selling something unseen and unproven. Are all republicans snake oil salesmen?
Because O'Reilly is an unpatriotic draft-dodger who hid out in England rather than serve in the military. If he had served in the military, he would have attended mandatory classes about the Geneva Conventions and POW treatment. It's the Fox chicken hawks who are the loudest about torturing prisoners, while someone like John McCain knows that torture is wrong and tries to tell them so.
And who said only religious fundies will argue a particulari of an ignoratio elenchy until the cows come home and fry up some burgers, just to prove their devotion to a cause?
Q: Why Does Bill O’Reilly Hate America?
A: Because he's a NAZI.
Does his mamma knows he makes faces like that?
Big Mouth Billy Bass, is always gonna sing on his wall over at fox. That is his job. That is what he is paid to to. As long as he can find one or two people to agree with him he can feel morally high and mighty. It does not matter if 99% of Americans disagree. It doesn't matter even if your a republican. You would have to waterboard Mr. O'Reilly to get him to back down.
PS: Can we rename this "waterboarding" to something like "simulated drowning" It sounds to much like a water sport. "Hey, guys I'm going to the lake. Anyone wanna go waterboarding?"
Bill...why not interview Jeremy Glick?
And....what about lives that are not 'American'? Do you care about them?
It's all about language. This way they can say hey all they got was a waterboarding. What sounds bad about that? If you used the term simulated drowning then it might sound like we actually hurt someone. But no us. Only the Axis of Evil does that. We don't wage wars on our own population. We love people and spread peace with flowers and candy.
I enjoyed this entirely objective debate.
Does anyone right of center frequent this site?
Every administration has been aware of these techniques and condoned them.
Democrats and Republicans alike supported the techniques until it became a "talking point" and the media expressed its uninformed outrage.
Fortunately you are able to express YOUR indignation and air your uninformed grievances so that this administration and future democratic administrations (Hillary included) can continue the policies which have supported this nation for the last 200 years.
Neither foreign policy nor national security is meant to be administered by public opinion, neither is it hostage to international standards which are developed by nations which do not share our interests as a nation or as a culture.
Thankfully, the Pentagon, State Department, Department of Energy, Homeland Security and other critical aspects of our government do not follow the advice of the frustrated masses whose inept musings litter this site.
Why are so many of us against torture? What the hell? If somebody may have information that we need and he/she won't give it to us torture is the logical conclusion. What else do you want us to do? Just keep asking them until they give up? Threaten them with non violence? Torture shows that we mean business. Maybe if everybody in our country approved of torture and our government tortured the crap out of some people, there wouldn't be much need for torture in the future. Everybody would know that we mean business and the smart ones would just give up the information right away, because they know what will happen if they don't. Like other countries don't torture us if we are captured. Anybody against torture needs to wake up to the real world, unfortunately there is just no way around it.
I would have to agree with D (133) on this one.
Polls can go ether way depending on how you ask the question. Tell some one their mother, father, sister, brother or friends will die unless you water board a known terrorist and see how many people say yeah go and let them die. Oh I am not saying you will not have some takers but most will want to save a life.
Anyhow this is such a non issue why not get upset about some thing meaningful like: darfur, world hunger, homeless children, rampant pollution?
Why are so many of us against torture?
Ethics and morality, civil rights, etc.
What the hell? If somebody may have information that we need and he/she won’t give it to us torture is the logical conclusion.
There isn't a piece of logic in that statement.
What else do you want us to do? Just keep asking them until they give up? Threaten them with non violence?
Follow the guidelines of the Geneva Convention and use non-violent tactics, yes.
Torture shows that we mean business.
It shows that we fail to respect human rights, if that's what you mean.
Maybe if everybody in our country approved of torture and our government tortured the crap out of some people, there wouldn’t be much need for torture in the future.
Maybe if we gave everybody in the country a gun, there wouldn't be a need for guns in the future...
Everybody would know that we mean business and the smart ones would just give up the information right away, because they know what will happen if they don’t.
So we use torture to give strength to the threat of torture, huh? That's quite the cyclical justification.
Like other countries don’t torture us if we are captured.
Those following the Geneva convention treaties don't.
Anybody against torture needs to wake up to the real world, unfortunately there is just no way around it.
That's right, nonviolence never worked for anyone...cough...Ghandi...cough....
While I don't care much O'Rielly I care even less for most of y'alls mindless comments. Even dignifying O'Rielly with a comment, however course and righteous you may feel, you have only succeeded in soiling yourselves. The uniformed, naive and ignorance of the ways of the world expressed here really depress me. Your comments belie your lack of experience and maturity. I'm glad I am an old bastard because I won't have to live in the world you are creating for yourself. I doubt I will ever hear that loud popping sound of your collective heads coming out of your ass before my time on this earth passes. By the way, I feel just as bad about my own progeny. Y'all are pitiful, petty and doomed. Your comments will become your epitaphs.
If hes so bad then how come his show is the number one cable news show in the nation for as long as i can remember?
There's many problems with Bill O'Reilly's argument. Firstly, he uses what's known as the confirmation bias, where only information that confirms the idea is used, omitting any information that disproves the idea. Basically, he's only working from one side of the aisle to suit his agenda. Also, psychological research has shown that a single first-hand account (as used on this clip), regardless of its accuracy, is much more memorable and convincing than a bevy of scientifically-balanced factual research studies.
Secondly, O'Reilly omits the fact that some of these "terrorist suspects" could very well be innocent people who were just in the wrong place at the wrong time. He shows a total disregard for anybody who has been wrongfully imprisoned. What's worse is that Guantanamo prisoners do not have the right to habeas corpus, so they can't even present their case to a non-military body.
Thirdly, O'Reilly always rails on the "left-wing kooks" for putting the troops in danger. (Case in point: The Mark Cuban video showing Marines raping and murdering Middle Eastern girls) What O'Reilly doesn't seem to realize, or purposefully omits, is that if the United States uses waterboarding as an interrogation technique, then other countries will see nothing wrong with doing it. Waterboarding is serious psychological torture that leaves a indelible mark on one's psyche, and every time we use it for interrogation, one of our troops captured in the field is in much more danger of having that same technique used on them. Not only that, but military states will now have an excuse to use this torture method on their own citizens, then when the world comes to say "Hey, you can't do that. It's torture." They're going to say, "No, look over there at the US. If they can do it, why can't I?"
If Bill agrees to be waterboarded, we should THEN listen to his opinion. Otherwise, he's just more Faux noise/
how is this man on tv, no one likes him.
I agree, how is he on TV?
CCNA Exploration
Grumpy,
thank you!
agree 100%
Mmm. I never got the impression at all the Bill hates America. Odd title.
Also, the Geneva Conventions have not yet been ratified by the US so..... the Geneva Conventions is NA in this artical.
You're retarded, all of you. I'm all for the torture of those trying to KILL US. The moment you forget that they want to KILL US is the moment we try to relate to their needs. "Embrace your terrorist. Know your terrorist." Screw that. Waterboard his ass, get the information where his friends are hiding and go waterboard them. Lather, rinse, repeat. And no. I didn't post this so I could be a dissenting opinion. I firmly believe all you coffee-enema hybrid loving dipshits are seriously delusional.
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