Sacramento, We Have A Problem
Folks, it's Super Tuesday and Californians are going to the polls, along with 22 other states. But if you're a registered independents in California, take note: Your vote might not be counted if you don't fill out one single bubble.
In addition to vote-tallying issues, some concerns had arisen about the voting process.Voter-outreach groups criticized the ballot in Los Angeles County, saying it could disenfranchise independent voters.
The Democratic and American Independent party ballots given to independent voters who request them include an extra bubble specifying that the ballot is for that party's primary. The bubble appears before the list of presidential candidates.
If voters fail to mark that spot, the county's scanning machines will not read the selection for president.
Lawyers for the Los Angeles-based Courage Campaign said that violates California election law. The group sent a letter to Los Angeles County officials threatening legal action if the issue isn't addressed before Tuesday's election.
"We did talk to the county, and they admit it's a problem," Courage Campaign chairman Rick Jacobs said. "They just don't seem to know what to do about it."
Other groups, including the California League of Women Voters, said they had fielded numerous calls from independent voters asking how they could get a party ballot.
"These voters are getting ballots that are blank, because they're not in a party, and it did not seem clear to most of the decline-to-state voters that they could request a party ballot," said spokeswoman Elizabeth Leslie.
Independents account for nearly 20 percent of California's registered voters. The GOP does not allow them to vote in the Republican primary, but Democrats and some other parties do.
1st
2x in one day
Go Obama
Oh shit......
Hillary knows the way !
Yup. Here we are, eight years down the road from 2000, and we still can't design a ballot that doesn't leave big ..................................... gaping .................................... holes for errors.
I guess this would matter if I hadn't discovered when I showed up to vote this morning that they have purged me and my husband from the rolls. In addition, my father has been in the hospital for a month. I mailed a duly executed request to Orange County so that he could vote by mail, and that request was ignored. They don't need votes if they can just keep the system corrupt enough.
Could we get a pic of the ballot in question?
Wow! Thanks for the tip.
Deborah Testa @ 7, that's horrible.
this is another fine example why the two party system needs
to be fucking chucked out the window. they don't want any
interference in their entrenched corporate power.
they want to dump on the average independent voter.
well, i say.......NO and GO FUCK YOURSELF.
Late breaking primary news!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NdAUnnU9Ac
dan @ 1:
You're the Lone Ranger's nephew!
Ho old are you now?
This wasn't some snap election called last Thursday or something was it?
I mean, could it be any more convoluted, complicated, begging to get screwed (up) ...
caging lists, chads, Diebold, I mean Jeez guys ...c'mon ...
dadams @ 10:
and, funny enuff (see, not funny), the two-party system is one of the few things both political machines agree about. that and corporate domination, neoliberalism and a military empire...
This is just SO frustrating. How on earth can this sort of obvious design flaw still get through the ballot process? Unless, of course, it's intentionally done to suppress votes.
Get Your FREE News Corpse Widget here!
>and, funny enuff (see, not funny), the two-party system is one of the few things both political machines agree about. that and corporate domination, neoliberalism and a military empire ...
Coke/Pepsi '08!!
And we are going to show Iraqis how to have fair elections?
Why doesn't Cal. just say the little bubble thingie won't have to be filled in and even ballots without it filled in will be counted?
Not to appear to be a troll, but why would independents be voting in a primary anyway? If you're an independent you shouldn't have a party to vote for.
So I guess no matter who gets the nod, it's tainted. Nice. And Bush thinks he is going to bring American style democracy to the world? Hahahahahaha.
pissed off patricia @ 17:
According to the article: "If voters fail to mark that spot, the county’s scanning machines will not read the selection for president." It's not a policy thing -- at least ostensibly -- it's a programming problem with the ballot-counting machines.
Or maybe that should be a programming "problem" (nudge nudge, wink wink).
'World's greatest democracy' strikes again!
C'mon America! For god's sake. Plenty of third-world elections are more coherently run.
What a dog's breakfast of a system.
See The Big Picture @ 20:
Well, take the ballots that are rejected and hand count them. There has to be a solution to this screw up.
In Fla. independents could only vote for state propositions. They could not vote for a candidate in the presidential primary.
[You're banned for spam blogwhoring-Sitemonitor]
• Heavy snowfall was inconveniencing some would-be voters in southern Colorado. Dian Campbell, a CNN I-Report contributor who lives near Antonito, said snow was up to her shoulders at her front door. She was making calls "to see if we can put together a snowmobile patrol to pick people up because the roads in most of the county are unpassable." If that doesn't pan out, she and her husband may consider riding horses, Campbell said.
• In Georgia, voters reported long lines and voting machine problems at some polling places in metro Atlanta, WSB-TV in Atlanta reported. At one polling station in downtown Atlanta, voters received paper ballots after voting machines malfunctioned, the station reported. At another polling spot, I-Reporter Judy McCabe Smith said she stood waiting for 75 minutes in a line that stretched around three walls of a basketball gymnasium. An Emory University professor told WSB that as many as 1.5 million people could cast ballots in the GOP and Democratic contests.
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/02/05/california.ballots/index.html
And the excuses start pouring in......but, but.....the system is just fine....nothing here....nope....shut yer eyes and take what we give you. Nice.
Seems the fancier we get with our voting systems, the worse it works for us in the end.
Maybe we could go back to voting with a pencil and paper and let human beings tally the votes. It wouldn't be perfect but I think it might be closer than what we are doing now.
> Dian Campbell, a CNN I-Report contributor who lives near Antonito, said snow was up to her shoulders at her front door.
Hmmm CNN reporter ... maybe she should just try standing up ...
I voted this morning in CA, and I wish I saw this post before doing so. I am a registered Democrat, so hopefully this won't affect my vote. It did throw my fiance and I for a loop when we saw it, and even though it opens with "If you are an independent, then..." it still caused us to think twice about it. The options for the bubble are Independent and Democratic, so if you don't read the wording correctly, you could accidentally mark it, even if you're a Democrat. I fear that this can screw up not only Independent votes, but also the votes of the elderly, new, and young voters.
This is America - we make voting as complicated and hard to do as we possibly can!
The people who hand out the ballots should explain this to each of the voters. That would have been the best way to avoid the confusion on an already flawed layout of the ballot.
Most independents are not informed voters, and it's good that their vote may not be counted. They are the ones who are most responsible for electing Bush. They swing like monkeys, and vote for candidates that appeal to their emotions. It's rare to find a thoughtful independent voter.
Don't forget to dip your thumb in purple ink to show everyone you tried to vote!
Prabhata @ 29:
Where as republican and democrat voters use the critical thinking method in selecting their candidate, never changing their minds or questioning their selection, there by always producing exceptional results.
Weak logic dude.
That problems doesn't exist in Pennsylvania. You have to be registered as either a Democrat or Republican to vote in the primaries. The two parties don't want "spies" infiltrating the system.
It's not a mistake!
It's a literacy test.
I'm working our local polling station here in So. Cal and I have been point out to Non-Partisian voters that if they take a Dem or A.I. ballet that they need to first select that they are voting for Dem or A.I. or their vote for a candidate will not be counted.
also just to note we have 1600ish people on our rouster and we already saw about 150 voters turn out before I went to lunch at 11am. it looks like it will be a good day, hopefuly people are turning out like this accross the country.
I say Sacrament-o has a problem; they're trying to take a religious concept, and turn it into a calypso song.
curtilingus @ 30:
no kidding...when did Barack change his last name to McCain?
curtilingus @ 30:
And don't forget to Vote for Little Jack Horner!
I know Kansas isn't all that important, but we have a Caucus today. We can't vote without registering for a party. I really think that's stupid on multiple counts. I grew up in WI where you can register to vote the day you vote, but I've lived in 6 other states: Arizona, Colorado, Oregon, Kansas, Illinois & California. In all of these states, other than California, you had to register to vote at least three months before the elections. In Colorado it was something like 6 months. It's really ridiculous, and in my opinion a way for wealthy republicans to bar the poor from voting. I can't say how Cali is because I didn't live there long enough to vote.
curtilingus @ 31:
i completely agree--that was weak argument and, might i add, embarrassing and ignorant.
Thanks so much for the heads up.
Deborah Testa @ 7:
My request to vote by mail was also ignored, despite the fact that it was made about a month before the deadline.
As for the independent bubble on the ballot, it isn't that big of a deal when you consider that it is literally the first thing on the ballot. If you skip all of the instructions and the extra bubble, and just jump down to the candidate names, you really have nobody to blame but yourself.
Prabhata @ 29:
I druther swing like a bonobo.
Here in AZ, they have a neat little trick.
The primaries are open: if you are registered as an Indy, you can vote in either party's primary. BUT...
...technically the primaries aren't until September! The vote we're having today is a "Presidential preference election". Which is closed.
Which means Indies can't vote in it.
Of course, Indies CAN vote in the primaries in September...long after the decision will already have been made about who the nominees will be.
Talk about screwed up...
I never understood why it mattered. Why a person should have to pick which party they were affiliated with. Why cant people just go fuxing vote for whoever they're going to vote for and not have to worry about not being counted because they said they were affiliated with this party or that party, or no party.
Makes me want to puke.
Kevin @ 45:
It's all about $$$$$$$$$ and of course Party Power. Look how many supporters we have.
Look, this is much ado about nothing. The party seems to have *saved money* by printing ballots for *two different parties* on the same page. That means that you had to select 1) which party you were voting for and 2) the presidential candidate in order for the computer to properly read your ballot. If you can't do that, you haven't properly filled out your ballot. Its no different from, and no more difficult than, any other set of instructions for filling in the bubble or writing in a name. This isn't rocket science and its not, in fact, too hard to do. Its not any different from specifying in advance which party you want a ballot for (which you have to do in our state). You are supposed to be able to read and follow instructions in order to fill out the ballot. If you are too stupid to do that, or too confused, you can ask for help.
aimai
This kind of thing came up in Washington State a few years back. There was a great deal of controversy about the fact that voters might accidentally not check the box indicating party affiliation and therefore their votes would not be counted. I expected to find a very confusing ballot when I went to vote but, to my surprise, the ballot was straight-forward and easy to understand, and clearly indicated that if you are voting in the Dem primary, you must check the "Dem" box or your vote would not be counted, and the same for the Repub. I haven't actually seen the CA ballot, but I can't help but wonder about whether these stories about voter suppression and confusing ballots are perhaps exagerated slightly. To what end, I can't speculate, but it seems curious.
Kevin @ 45:
Because, primaries are elections within a party to choose a nominee. Some states have closed primaries, meaning people from other parties do not have a say in choosing a particular party's nominee. I think that makes more sense so that the nominee is truly the choice of the party without interference from people outside the party.
aimai @ 47:
Agreed, following instructions should be a requirement for voting for continuity sake. But I think it is ridiculous to need to get a ballot for the party you are associated with. Why cant it just be:
1. You show your ID
2. You step your ass into a booth
3. You make a selection
4. You step out of the booth
5. You go home and take a nice long shi#
Meanwhile back in Gotham:
1. Bob the voting booth collection man, collects the voting booths results
2. Those results are sent via something to a central location for counting
3. Those results are calculated with the other results from other locations (ad finem until all the votes are counted)
4. The winner is declared
5. The end
Is THAT too complicated aimai?
It's obviously a conspiracy to deny Obama the support of independent voters in California!!!
This problem is just limited to Los Angeles. Keep in mind that is 776k registered Decline-to-State voters that could be effected.
An image of the ballot in question is available on this Calitics diary.
Julia Rosen @ 52:
Thanks for the link to the copy of the ballot. Seems pretty straight-forward to me. I think it could disenfranchise some voters with weak English language abilities if there was not a ballot available in their native language.
liberalista @ 53:
I speak English just fine, and I'm a registered Independent. I inked the dot for Obama and my choices for the California state measures, and I cast my vote. I even double-checked the numbers on the ballot to make sure I inked the correct ones.
I never noticed the extra dot, though, so I never inked it. I'm bummed that my presidential primary vote doesn't count, but I'll be more careful in future elections.
J
BobD @ 8:
Just looked at a Democratic ballot. Extra bubble? That's a total lie. Good try, joker.
Nicole Belle: Reading comprehension, it's a good thing. The key is the ballot sent to INDEPENDENT/DECLINE TO STATE voters who wish to vote in the Democratic primary, which they can do by California law. I'd be careful about those rocks you're throwing around your glass house, Mark.
Mark @ 56:
Uhm, is it the Democratic ballot given to independent voters in Los Angeles County?
Luckily, I'm a registered California Dem, but I was taken aback when I saw this on the ballot this morning. I knew it'd be an issue the second I started reading it.....
Andy K @ 57:
Good question. I live in LA, so that's the one I saw, and it would certainly be confusing to someone who wasn't paying full attention (as much of us in LALA land often do).
Ivan @ 59:
Trust me, that problem isn't LA-specific. It's not even inernet-comments-section-specific, although you see it a lot while online. Too many people fail to read and digest too often.
Ivan @ 58:
The old ladies working the tables in my precinct during our primaries(MI) were very helpful in pointing out all of the discrepancies on our ballots.
FWIW Didn't see it on my absentee ballot (Sac County) - did my vote count? Ah the mystery!
Won't be happy until all are paper ballots, counted by hand... If Canada can do it in 1 night... what, can we not compete at ANYTHING anymore? ;o)
Arnolds & Bushs GOP, always looking for an 'angle', caging voters to suit their partisan political agenda
Did Rudy and Karl and Dick have a hand in developing the california paper ballots? I wouldn't put it past the slimy scumsucking neocon fascists.
liberalista @ 48:
Yes, but this year in WA state it's different:
By marking the party box and signing the mail-in ballot you are swearing an oath of allegiance to that party. The wording is different for each...
(D):"I declare that I consider myself to be a DEMOCRAT..."
(R):"I declare that I am a member of the Republican Party..."
I am an Independent, and since "falsely signing this oath is a felony", I cannot vote in the primary.
HOORAY TWO-PARTY SYSTEM!
Zzyzysz @ 64:
Lighten up- it's a primary, not an official election. Primaries are just opinion polls by the parties (and if you read the entire bit up top, this was on the Democratic and American Independent party ballots given to independent voters. Is the American Independent Party the alternate name for either the GOP or Democratic Party? And is the Green Party holding a primary? Or the Socialist Workers' Party?
The title of this post would seem to blame Sacramento (Bowen) for this problem, which is completely incorrect.
Los Angeles had, since 2000, one of the worst Registrars of Voters in the country, Connie McCormack. She's gone, but nearly as bad is in place, because we don't elect the RoV, the RoV is selected by the County Supervisors--several of whom are corrupt, corrupt, corrupt.
pissed off patricia Says:
"Seems the fancier we get with our voting systems, the worse it works for us in the end.
Maybe we could go back to voting with a pencil and paper and let human beings tally the votes. It wouldn’t be perfect but I think it might be closer than what we are doing now."
And it would be a whole lot more fun for voters to participate in the counting of paper ballots at their precincts! We can actually act like citizens for one day instead of consumers.
But now that the private corporations have control of our voting we will be hard pressed to get it back.
Andy K @ 65:
They are elections, within the party. Of course they are official elections.
In CA, Dems allow anyone to vote in their primary (open primaries).
The box says:
To Vote for Democratic Candidates, Nonpartisan Voters Must First Select Party in the Box Below.
Nothing about an oath of allegiance in it, liberalista.
Abbybwood @ 67:
That's no longer legal. And if you want to know why, have a chat with the handicapped lobby.
In CA, the problem was solved by having one touchscreen device per polling station, and the output ballot from that has to be hand-counted.
The real issue with counting elections is AUDITING, and mandatory recounts (which of course requires an actual paper ballot. Within two years, just about every state in the country will be voting on paper ballots with optical scanner tabulation. That won't stop fraud, without the auditing and mandatory recounts).
Oh, good, my vote didn't count. In America. In the year 2008. I'd have more confidence voting in an Afghanistan election.
Well, I just voted in Rochester, New York, for Senator Clinton. I was the 80th person to vote in my district at 3:30 pm, which is a good turnout for a presidential primary. I'm usually the 50th or something, but the place was hardly being swarmed. The guy ahead of me-young and white-was obviously a firsttimer as he had to be shown how to work the voting machine, forgot the instructions behind the curtain, and had to be instructed again. He also kept trying to show his driver's license to the election inspectors, who weren't all that interested.
He got it, though, and came out of the booth looking very pleased.
I never realized until the 2000 Gore/Bush debacle in Florida-and I have been voting since 1972-that our clunky chunky New York voting machines arre NOT how.. the rest of you vote. What a friggin' shame! It takes about two minutes to get the hang of them (as I saw today) and they are very hard to tamper with. I have heard of a case in Long Island where one, locked and sealed, FELL OFF THE TRUCK while being driven to the Board of Elections, but, hey, that's way Downstate of me.
These are NOT the tricky Diebold machines, people, these are five hundred pounds of machined steel with levers and gears. The technology is about 80 years old, and it works just fine. When it doesn't, there is usually an 80 year old technician, or as we used to say, mechanic, around to fix it...
Actually the mechanics are dying out, but that's a problem that can be fixed. Job training anyone? New York's counties are famously dragging our Arctic-booted feet against switching to the "new technology' required under Federal Law.
Our old technology works FINE. Including the part where one declares one's party affiliation to the election inspectors, they hand you a slip of paper that says DEMOCRAT or REPUBLICAN, and the lady who does the mechanics LOCKS YOU OUT of voting for the weakest candidate in the party you want to see lose the general election.
That's the way I like it. This crap about being "Democrat" for a day sucks, and yes, I mean you, Obama, and your charming Michelle, and all your dogwhistle appeals to the young and dumb...
Hey, I got a couple of "biracial" kids myself, and they did not get to go to a prep school in Honolulu. They were raised in innercity Rochester, New York , where the Clintons'
tax cuts, the earned income credit, their abolishment of AFDC (aka "welfare reform") made a positive difference in my life as a single struggling mother...
This may be "old" to Obama and his minions, but it is real to me. I don't want idiot "independents" voting in my primary. If that's what they do in California, thank goodness they have a voting form that weeds out some of those morons....
Kevin @ 50:
You are NOT required to show ID.
wobbly @ 71:
Hope you enjoyed it. Lever machines are no longer legal, except as legacy in some locations. By the next Pres. election, you will vote on paper ballot with optical scanner, and your lever machines will be squashed flat.
Paul in LA @ 68:
Only official in that they must meet the rules laid down by the state parties, rather than by the state legislature. And the California GOP is a great case in point: registered Republicans only, because that's the way the party wants it. The state can't(or, more likely, won't) do anything to change that.
wobbly @ 71:
In CA we let independents vote in our primary. You don't have to declare yourself to be a Democrat (which would be absurd).
Paul in LA @ 72:
Maybe not in CA, Paul, but you must in many other states. I had to do so , for the first time since I started voting('83), in our primary last month.
Andy K @ 74:
Who is allowed to vote in the primary is set by the party, but the primary election is just as official as any other election, and DOES select the recipient of CA's delegates, so it is indeed an election with real consequences.
Andy K @ 76:
Yes, we have been fighting this for awhile. The whole point of having to identify yourself is part of the 'Real ID' rightwing movement to require everyone in the country to have the same ID system, in a surveillance state.
Fight back. Under your state Constitution is language that enfranchizes you without any statement of identification requirement. As a citizen, you are legally entitled to vote, and lack of ID is not a basis for withholding that right.
Mark @ 56:
Now... will mark have the integrity to post an apology?
I won't hold my breath.
I will second this concern - in Washington state, we've traditionally had a caucus, but a voter initiative *added* a primary, which only the state's Republican party has said they'd acknowledge. Dems receive a mail-in ballot for the primary (which does not count), but little information about the caucuses. Even if the primary ballot were to count, it is needlessly complex, requiring no less than four steps (including bizarre requirements, such as what type of pen is appropriate). I have four advanced degrees, and am still not convinced I interpreted all of the rules correctly.
I've had an easier time filing taxes.
I would think after Florida 2000, we'd begin paying more attention to the informational design of our voting systems.
this was indeed confusing. if i ask for a democratic ballot why do i have to mark that I am voting Democratic? I read the first question and was very confused. should I put independent because that is what I am registered? or democratic, because that is who i would like to vote for? i figured it out, but i can imagine many others won't. bleh.
Maybe it's time we called for international inspectors to monitor our elections in the USA? Hell, most 3rd world countries have figured out a way to have more fair elections than we can.
The ballot pamphlet I was given today had this 'bubble'. Almost missed it. We get to use something called 'Ink-A-Vote' here, people. You stab your ballot with a needlepointed Sharpie and hope it's got ink in it. The ballot was almost a foot long, too, topped with a 2-column write-in section, which I have never seen before on a ballot in California in the 32 years I've been voting. What really needs to change in California is the recognition of an actual Independent Voter category. Out here, you're "decline to state", not Independent. You are at the mercy of the recognized parties to provide you with a sample ballot and place at the bloody polls, too! This time, it was provided by the Democrats and the American Independent Party. God help those who mistakenly register as "American Independent Party" thinking it puts you in the Independent category, because AIP are so far to the right, they don't make the Republicans seem like Democrats or "Liberals" or "Commie Pinkos", they make the Republicans seem like dadaist Teletubbies.
I'm jealous. In Arizona Independents aren't even allowed to vote in primaries. We are persona non grata. Our Republican Secretary of State actually justified this by saying that voting in a primary is a "privilege of membership" in one of the two parties. How terribly, terribly clubby of her. And here I thought membership as a citizen of the United States automatically enrolled you in the "right to vote" club.
This situation is asinine! The non-partisan ballot has a bubble that indicates the party of the candidate you are voting for, when the selection of the candidate makes their party designation perfectly clear. Why is there this need for a superfluous bubble in the first place??
The solution to this debacle seems so simple. Can’t the state authorize the votes to be counted even without the party bubble punched? The fact that the vote was cast on a non-partisan ballot will distinguish the ballot from those of the Democratic party, which was the point of the inane bubble in the first place.
Sam @ 85:
No sir, there are no "Independent" or non-partisan ballots out here. Or ballots marked as such. You get provided one by a 'legitimized' political party because there is no "Independent" category in California. We're "decline-to-staters", I guess. Please see #83 for more details. C'est screw-ay-voo.
LAND of Fruits and NUTs
VOTED FOR ARNOLD
ha h ah ah ah ah ahah ha haha ha ha ha ha h aha
curtilingus @ 32:
Yes, Republicans vote their dumb beliefs, but at least they have some sort of compass. The Democrats may not use critical thinking, but they also have some sort of belief that guides them. Most Democrats are liberal, and tests have shown that liberals are not guided by their emotions as much, as their intellect. The independents just swing and mark the ballot based on the emotion the teevee ad triggered (fear, hope, change, whatever is fashionable). There are some informed independents who, like Chafee decides that his old party just doesn't work for him anymore and the Democrats hold views that don't fit him either. But for the most part, an informed independent is an oxymoron.
Julia Rosen @ 52:
Fortunately the San Diego County Ballot didn't have the problem.
Actually I am pleased with the ballot I used (Democratic ballot for Independent voters). With just one candidate and 7 propositions, this was the least complicated ballot I've ever seen in 17 years of voting. They got rid of the overly complex touch screen and the lame punch cards and made the ballot very clean and easy to follow. I just had to fill in the bubbles like they taught me in first grade.
Kudos to San Diego County.
Sam @ 85:
It is not a state problem. The problem is LOCAL.
People don't seem to understand that our elections are NOT run by the Congress, or by the States. They are run by the localities, and your local RoV is the main problem in your voting life. If they are corrupt -- and they frequently are -- then you are screwed.
The SecState only oversees the legality of the election. It is not their job to design ballots (that is done locally).
RJ @ 89:
You have a totally crooked RoV, and have had some of the most rigged elections in the US over the last several years.
Ask about the custody of voting equipment, or the transparency of the vote-counting, or the audits on irregularities, and you will find out that 'kudos to SD' is not the right emotion.
impeachbush @ 87:
The 2003 election was stolen. The 2006 election was not fully-legal.
The 'fruits and nuts' joke was lame back in the 60s.
Paul in LA @ 90:
Yes, fine, so can't the SecState authorize the votes to be counted despite the flawed ballots, when it is clear who the voter had selected?
Sam @ 93:
If there is a contest of the election, that's possible. Courts have long held that voter intent, if it can be ascertained, rules. But it is highly unlikely that someone will sue to have their independent vote counted in the Dem primary. Since R have a closed primary anyhow, it would be tough to show that independents were especially harmed.
That bubble is NOT on the sample ballot that all voters receive in the mail prior to the election. However there IS a page in the beginning of the booklet that gives non partisan voters 3 options for their ballot. I just don't understand why there should be a bubble indicating that the voter is voting for the democratic party candidates when they have specifically requested a democratic ballot.
KISS!!!
I'm a fan of open primaries, and am looking forward to voting in the Dem open primary here today in CA.
For Decline to State voters, only the primary vote wouldn't be counted if the bubble isn't checked, not the whole ballot. That's being challeged, too, especially because many poll workers didn't know about this at the start of the day. There's no reason not to count them all, regardless.
Che's Lounge @ 95:
Yes, it is. In LA County, it is.
Paul in LA @ 97:
Those who "decline to state" get sample ballots that don't have ANY presidential candidates whatsoever. That page is not included on the sample ballot! It begins with the propositions. So we Independents had no preview of such a thing. Who would have thought to ask about it beforehand or (on the side of those registered w/ parties) who would have thought to inform any "decline-to-stater" about it?
E B @ 98:
I see. Well, the RoV has apparently made it harder for the Dems to hold an open primary. Doesn't surprise me.
If you're an independent who wants to vote in the Dem primary, then you would have to know that you can and demand your rights.
Paul in LA @ 97:
It's not on the San Diego county sample ballot. Neither the Democratic or the American Independent sample ballots. There is only the option page (about p.5) in the front of the booklet. It's in bold type. But if the voter goes directly to the sample ballots themselves, there is NO bubble on either one. Again, if the voter asks for a Democratic ballot, why is there a separate ballot for AI's voting democratic? Even if they are tracking demographics, it still complicates the process for the voter and sets the voter up to screw up the ballot.
Che's Lounge @ 100:
I see. It's in my Dem sample ballot in LA, which I thought we were talking about. These ballots are generated by each county, not by the state. San Diego has such CRAP election officials that anything is possible. Your last RoV was a full-fledged CRIMINAL, as ours was. Now you have his deputy, while we have someone from the office -- they are as bad, but the times have changed, so they're laying low. Come November, and the shit will fly again, I'm sure.
Um, it's not that difficult to figure out, assuming you have reading comprehension skills at ~the 5th grade level... not to trash on 4th graders or anything.
PIL,
Yeah I forgot the sample pamphlets are county by county. And as you know, our registrar is a former Diebold sales rep. Thankfully we have a good Sec of State who sent the E voting machines into a warehouse. Good on her.
I guess I could chalk up the bubble omission to incompetence, but it is...difficult.
rubyinparadise @ 102:
No but some elderly folks are not as sharp as they used to be. Hell I even skim sometimes and miss things. And I'll pass that snide comment on to my college students, who sometimes don't read every fine print that says something to the effect of "round your answers to the nearest tenth". If I told told them they couldn't read like a 5th grader, I wouldn't be teaching for long. We all miss stuff. Except you, of course. The point is that voting should be easy and simple.
Che's Lounge @ 104:
That would, I think, require better candidates. :-)
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