'Punishing' Obama for not wanting to 'punish' his daughters
By Steve Benen Wednesday Apr 02, 2008 8:30amBarack Obama hosted a town-hall meeting in Johnstown, Pa., over the weekend, and was asked how his administration would address HIV/AIDS and sexually transmitted diseases among young girls. Obama emphasized education and prevention, including comprehensive sex ed and access to contraception.
“I’ve got two daughters; 9 years old and 6 years old,” Obama said. “I am going to teach them first of all about values and morals. But if they make a mistake, I don’t want them punished with a baby. I don’t want them punished with an STD at the age of 16. You know, so it doesn’t make sense to not give them information.”
For reasons that elude me, some conservatives — including Sean Hannity, a correspondent for Pat Robertson’s TV show, Hugh Hewitt, and some right-wing blogs — pounced on the “punished with a baby” line, suggesting that Obama somehow equates parenthood with punishment.
Word about this is apparently making the rounds in conservative circles, because the complaints are getting louder. In his Washington Post column, former Bush speechwriter Michael Gerson insisted that “Obama’s record on abortion is extreme,” and cited the weekend’s comment, among other things, as evidence.
And now Obama has oddly claimed that he would not want his daughters to be “punished with a baby” because of a crisis pregnancy — hardly a welcoming attitude toward new life.
And now the religious right is seizing on what it sees as a wedge opportunity.
The conservative Washington Times reported that “pro-life activists” are outraged.
Pro-life groups have long criticized the record of Mr. Obama, Illinois Democrat, who has voted against legal protection for babies who survive botched abortions and against prohibitions on taking a minor across state lines for an abortion.
His “punished with a baby” comment Saturday at a town hall in Johnstown, Pa., reignited the outrage. [...]
Concerned Women for America (CAW) called on Mr. Obama to recant his comment, saying it stigmatizes babies conceived by teenagers and “provides an excuse for aborting them.”
If the right wants to complain about Obama being pro-choice, that makes sense. It may not be an effective electoral strategy in a country that tends to support abortion rights, but at least I understand where they’re coming from.
But this outrage over Obama’s comments from the weekend seems wildly excessive.
The campaign told reporters on Monday, “What Sen. Obama said and what he believes is clear — children are ‘miracles,’ but we have a problem when so many children are having children. As Sen. Obama said on Saturday — and on many other occasions — parents have a responsibility to teach their children about values and morals to help make sure they are not treating sex casually. And while he understands the passions on both sides of this difficult issue, Sen. Obama believes we can all agree that we should be taking steps to reduce the number of teen pregnancies and abortions in this country.”
Obama believes teenagers should be given as much accurate information as possible so they can make the right choices. If a teenage girl makes a mistake, and gets pregnant, Obama believes she should have a choice. Conservatives believe that girl can’t have comprehensive education on sexual health, can’t have access to contraception, can’t have access to the morning-after pill, and has to deliver a baby whether she wants to or not.
It’s hardly a stretch to call this “punishing” the teenage girl for her mistake. Contra Gerson, I don’t think this is an “extreme” position to take; I believe the opposite is.
Login or Register to post comments.
These right wing gangsters would be hilarious if they weren't so deadly.
Anti Abortion
Anti Contraception
Anti Pre Natal Care
Anti Health Insurance for Kids
Anti Aid to Dependent Kids
Anti, anti, anti....
At least they are consistent in that regard.
Not to lead us off topic, but once, when I was drunk, a friend of mine thought it would be funny to hold a baby by its heels and kind of bludgeon me with it. So I was punished by a baby, and let me tell you, it's not pleasant.
So I can stand by Barack on this one.
Meanwhile, I'd smack Hannity with a baby if given the chance. Oh, and just so no one freaks out, it was an American Girl "baby," so that means I'm a patriot.
-DT
Taken out of context, Obama's comment could be seen as anti-baby, but in the context of STDs and other consequences of unsafe sex, his comment is clearly NOT equating "baby" with "punishment." Only idiots (thus, the religious right) would try to twist this around. As usual, the anti-choice folks care more about some possible future fetuses than for real, living people who are already here.
I don't rush to defend Obama--I'm still pissed at his racist "typical white person" comment (I guess I'm just a typical white person...)--but this is yet another non-issue being conflated by the morons of the religious right. Don't they have anything REAL to worry about?
For a teen aged girl caring for a baby and trying to continue her education would most likely feel like a kind of punishment. It would have been for me if I had become pregnant at that age and could not have gotten an abortion. My family was poor as hell and there would have been no way they could have helped me if that had happened.
The right wing tries to make mountains out of mole hills but they seldom succeed. At least they are listening to Obama's speeches, maybe they will learn something of value.
Like when Strom Thermond was punished with a little black baby.
Won't fly. The only people who will act like they are taking this seriously weren't going to vote for him anyway.
this means clinton will soon follow her rethuglican friends on this bandwagon......
that'll be good for a laugh....
so now clintons strongest arguments against obama will be that his pastor hates whites, and obama himself hates children.
FGFM @ 6:
when clinton starts parroting this attack, what will that say about her.....and her devoted sycophants.
Will we ever get to the point where pundits and media types can assess political comments IN CONTEXT?
I doubt it.
I understand what Obama meant, but he probably should have chosen his words a bit more carefully. It is impossible not to give teh mouth breathers ammunition - bowling, really? - but the dog whistle issues surrounding sexuality are automatic vocabulary checkers in my opinion.
"Punished with a baby" could be said "faced with responsibilities beyond their ability to meet".
Paul B. @ 3:
Yep, their biggest worry is ...... Everybody Else's Business.
Most religious people seem so worried if others don't believe what they believe,
maybe it's because they are worried that if the others are right that means they
are wasting their lives preparing for something that will not come. They can't seem
to see that life is the Journey, not a destination.
Anybody with a perfectly normal attitude gets short shrift with these nutcases. Of course it's a punishment to be forced to do something you don't want or are not ready to do. It's not the child's fault, but it's still punishment--I think Obama went right to the heart of the matter, in fact; that's exactly the attitude the religious right has towards unwanted pregnancy. They don't want contraception rights or abortion rights because they want girls to "suffer the consequences" of sinful sexual activity as much as possible (never mind the boys). I'd like to drop some of these unwanted babies on their doorstep and say, "Here you go, have fun raising them--what? You don't have a 'welcoming attitude' towards this new life? Shameful!"
FGFM @ 6:
I agree. They are trying to stir up something to justify their own ignorance.
14All @ 12:
Good point.
They've got nothing. The average person understands that an out-of-wedlock birth to a teenager is often a major hardship for all involved, and nobody wants that scenario to befall their own daughter. Let these lunatics rant. It just makes them look stupider and more extreme, if that's even possible.
Maybe the same people who are so outraged would like to see Jamie Lynne Spears as our next Surgeon General.
pissed off patricia @ 13:
i hope you feel the same when we hear Clinton make this same attack......give her another day or two to jump in...
kablooie @ 16:
But..but...she's gotten engaged, so she doesn't count!!!
the morons will hear what they want to hear, as usual.
Wow...to me this signifies that the right is in panic mode...grasping at straws.
And yet the right has no qualms about punishing babies - after they're born.
ohio progressive (typical non-typical white person) @ 17:
I would feel the same way no matter who tries to make the same attack. Clinton would be insane to jump on this bandwagon. But hell, who knows what she'll do.
Aren't these the same fuckwits who are always complaining about teenage, unwed mothers (especially "minorities") being the pox on God's (i.e. Rethugliconn) vision of a perfect white Christian Amerika? You know, the ones who are always sucking on the welfare teat, etc. You'd think they'd be happy with a few less little heathens running around...
Oh, I forgot. It's an election year. Bash the parents with the Bible then...
See post #46 from last nights open thread.
Again I say: What arrogance!
momly @ 10:
BULLSHIT! He said it EXACTLY how he meant it and was 100% right.
This is another RETARDED non-story from the same-old same-old.
I can't WAIT to see McCain TRY to debate Obama on EVERY issue.
No one can deny Obama will mop the floor with him especially on national security because McCain will be exposed just like Hillary with her 35 years experience bullsh*t.
She kept saying check my record....so we did.Now McCain is pretending he is somehow this war guru???Since WHEN?
You're next McCain!
fastfeat @ 23:
Yes, but they're not saying the girls shouldn't be having babies, just that they should be getting married at age 15. That makes everything okay with God.
liberalHUSSEINmoderation @ 20:
these guys have been in panic mode since bush was shitting his pants in the classroom on 911.....
they ignored all the warnings, took too many vacations, dismissed the threat of al qaeda......
it's been one big panic coverup ever since....
Radically Moderate @ 24:
I never got a chance to thank the SITE MONITORS for their quickly trapping the troll (Sanity) and putting him in a box. Thanks for your work guys.
FGFM, I don't think the mouth-breathers in the GOP really think this is their knock-out punch. At the risk of using a term that usually isn't racist but might sound racist in this instance, they want the tap dance. Like in the Old West (or Goodfellas) when bad guys shot at people's feet to male 'em "dance" the GOP & their minions will hurl all sorts of crap at Obama's feet to catch him off-guard & make him dance around his words: "th-th-that's now what I...wh-wh-what I meant to say was...I-I-I-I...LOOK, I'm a good person! Stop picking on me!" Attack attack attack, keep him on the defensive...if he doesn't crack his rep is still tarnished to anyone stupid enough to not pay close attention. And if cracks in public, on camera, that's a bonus! And they can shrug with a What-ME-worry?- grin and say "If he couldn't stand the heat..."
Obama and his campaign, to his/their credit, respond with a combination of class to the onlookers, and barely-concealed scorn to those who try to make every other sentence he utters a wedge issue. Not calling them morons, but making it clear that THEY know why the question's being asked, and it's not out of genuine concern about the controversy.
14All @ 12:
And have you noticed that the people who want the girls to suffer the consequences are the same ones who want to avoid the consequences of their own sinful sexual activity? They want 16-year-old girls to face the consequences of sex, but they blame their own perversions on alcohol, an abusive childhood, or media distortions.
They're also the people who support abstinence-only education, which has been shown (repeatedly!) to be ineffective. And too often they use "God" and the Bible as their excuse. It all reminds me of the classic poolside warning: "Don't pee in my pool, I won't swim in your toilet." Or in this case, "Keep your god out of my bedroom and I won't screw in your church."
ohio progressive (typical non-typical white person) @ 27:
True of course...but now it seems the tempo of their panic has picked up somewhat.
i guess all their daughters get knocked up out of wedlock during their early teenage years.
Alice Hussein @ 1:
Yet, they are Pro-War/Death for anyone who doesn't believe what they themselves believe...or are told to believe, or else!
What do they truly believe, anyway?
The story isn't really about the Right attacking Obama with a nonsense issue. The real story is that, while the Obama campaign continues to answer adroitly, the Democrats and the progressive movement as a whole continue to act as if the Right's propaganda is a surprise, and the concepts of public relations and marketing are wholly new and will take a while to understand.
The first crime is that the media is a wholly-owned right-wing propaganda tool. The second crime is that the Left, with some notable Internet-based exceptions, continues to respond feebly.
Hannity looks cro-magnon but he knows better. It's their job to keep their base misinformed and misguided.
This is OT, but a very interesting thought.
GHW Bush was a high ranking CIA official when Kennedy was shot.
He was Vice President to Reagan when an attempt was made on Reagan's life (trying to usurp power)
When finally elected President himself, he select a complete nincompoop (Dan Quaile) a his Vice President to (knowing how people can be shot out of office)
The further back you go into this family the nastier the seem.
Anyway, ............ I'm just sayin' ......................
Some 14 year-olds with empty lives see a baby as a miracle, someone to love them. It isn't a "mistake" or "punishment" when these girls become pregnant -- it's intentional. Others may not particularly want to become pregnant but make the "mistake" and end up pregnant and dead-ended, poverty-stricken, and uneducated for the rest of their lives.
Those girls who grow up in supportive families who want them to become educated, self-supporting, fulfilled, married or not, would far more likely to see that making a mistake and getting pregnant because of lack of information and guidance as a "punishment" visited on them by the rigidly moral ding-dongs of the world. Responsible parents and caretakers of daughters certainly see it this way, and they should be able to give their daughters the very best sex education, guidance, and information available if they want them to make important choices about the direction and substance of their lives. It's as sensible as teaching a child street-crossing safety.
zugzug @ 32:
I knew a girl once whom I was very fond of, but could not date because I wasn't 'born again'as she and her family were.. She was sent to a Baptist University with stringent rules/regulations...she got knocked up by a boy there whom her parents approved of...if not for such tragedy, I would have thought the irony to be delicious.
The truly delicious irony, was that this girl's Mother was the village bicycle in her youth before she "Found God" and became a nutbag "Christ-Crispie".
yeah, it would be sinful if their $5000 adulterous trysts with teenage prostitutes in any way obstructed or sought to occlude the miracle of reproduction.....to do so, would make those virgin isle viagra-popping excursions something less than the divine and devout pilgrimages they are....
As a mom of three, I must point out that babies are not a punishment. But toddlers and teenagers sure the hell are!
Seriously, for a snapshot of what teenage pregnancy can do to weigh down an entire community, one has only to look at the statistics in my old hometown of Memphis, Tennessee. It does shape up to collective punishment, when immature minds are dealt something they simply cannot handle -- raising children with no support, no educational opportunities, and no future in local job markets. Unless you count dead-end minimum wage jobs.
Obama is correct in his assessment.
The way the 'religious' right treats single mothers is the punishment Obama was talking about, not the baby as punishment. The way the right gives not one crap about life after birth - death penalty, no health care for kids (much less anyone else), cutting education, cutting job programs, borrowing against future generations, dead and wounded soldiers get an SOL from these bastards, dead and displaced Iraqis ----- the list of judgments against their fellow human beings is long. I want to remind Sean Hannity of his bromance with Hal the Nazi. Pat Robertson, he who hates those that aren't sheeple, he called for the assassination of someone. The hypocrisy goes on and on and on...
♣Bangkok Bob♠ @ 36:
If I had a "Way back machine" I would give GHW a vasectomy so he couldn't contaminate the rest of the world. Maybe even a castration, just to make sure!
"Daddy, your grandchild!"
Barack: "Punishment!"
"But Dad, your own flesh and blood.
Barack: "Punishment!"
"Dad, he looks just like you though."
Barack: "Punishment!"
Words matter, Barack. Yes they do.
Hmm this isn't exactly the same direction a wingnut was using on youtube. He focused more on trying to say that Obama was comparing having a baby to contracting an STD. The logic was mind boggling. He was saying that obama was saying that having a baby is just as bad or worse than getting an STD. These guys are flipping morons.
While I agree with Obama on this one, and he's usually brilliant, he needs to be more careful with his choice of words. If you just read his quote, without the rest of the story, you know immediately what phrase is going to stir up the wack-jobs.
i am not opposed to another civil war.
Bottom line, Obama and Michelle are good parents and their girls are fortunate to have their parent's wisdom as they grow up.
Sadly a lot of kids are not so fortunate and their parents refuse to give them the sexual education that they need. Those kids need to have someplace they can go to discover the facts before they become sexually active.
as i was driving thru missouri yesterday i saw a W sticker on a van. i had to ask myself, "how dubya are these people?"
dennis @ 43:
yeah, you must be a limbaugh guy....what about those words he gave his first 5 wives....
you guys are nuts
words matter, while you piss on everybody, telling them how much you love them....words matter
dennis @ 43:
Weak man...REEEALLY weak...is that the best BS you can come up with?
words don't matter that much. if they did, we would have a person who could actually use words in a sentence as president.
♣Bangkok Bob♠ @ 28:
He was a precocious little spud reaching out from his mothers basement.
tootles @ 51:
yeah, or bin laden, dead or alive (after 7 years)
When that asshole Sean Hannity equated "punishment with parenthood" he was speaking of his poor mother.
In reality life punishes teen mothers in so many ways. They face an awful lot of hardships from the day the baby is born. Financial problems, education problems, all sorts of problems that a girl in her teens is not prepared to face.
The world would have been much better off if Hannity's, Billo's, Rush's and the rest, mothers would have aborted them.
♣Bangkok Bob♠ @ 36:
Can we load Brushcutter-in-Chief into one of those circus cannons and shoot him out a WH window then?
Punishment is exactly what the religious right wants for our children. That's why they are against teaching our kids about sex, birth control, disease prevention, cervicle cancer immunization, and responsible sexual behavior. A baby proves to the community that a girl hasn't been chaste. Birth control allows then to conceal their behavior. Punishment was exactly the right word. Young girls don't need to be having babies when they are sexually active, but keep them ignorant and that's exactly what happens. Obama did not mean that babies are punishment if they are wanted and planned for. Somewhere I read that we have more abortions in the US than in the "immoral" Scandinavian countries (who also have very pro-family laws). That's because they are open about sex education and birth control and a single woman who has a baby doesn't bear the stigma she would here with our religious watchdogs.
dennis @ 43:
Give me a break, It would help, if maybe you would read what Obama said in full, but I forgot, trolls can't read.
Well in the case of Babs Bush we've all been punished by her babies.
Verdillac @ 42:
Should have begun that process before Prescott Bush at least. Cut down the Bush family tree when it was in the cotyledon stage, and spray it with Roundup just to be sure.
skeezix @ 19:
Yeah, BFD; let 'em wallow in their own vomit
Wow, the right is getting very desperate if this is what they seek to make a "wedge issue." Anyone with half a brain cell will see through this pretty easily. Anyone who doesn't see through it, well, their mind was made up already.....or they just don't have one.
"hardly a welcoming attitude toward new life."
what kind of attitude should a parent have towards their 16yo CHILD's unmarried unwanted pregnancy asshole?
On the other hand for 'conservatives' there is a good chance that the girl's father is also the baby's father so maybe they'd have a different view.
Barry made a mistake, chose the wrong word, he needs to apologize and clarify. It happens, he's not perfect, but for his blind, ill-informed cult of supporters to not admit it when he does these things, just does him and them a disservice. Sorry, but Barry O' off teleprompter is not a pretty thing. "Punish" was the wrong word, consequence was what he should have used. Yet another in an incredibly long list of f-ups from Lieberman's BFF.
diamondmc @ 59:
I read it, and I watched the video. And for the most part I agree with him. Still, a poor choice of words. And the reaction from the Hannity's and whoever else is talking about it pales in comparison to what the Left would be cackling about if McCain had made the same mistake, you can be sure of that.
Obama can't win, diamondmc. Hannity is doing you guys a favor, you just don't know it. What he says now is a 2 compared to the 10's that will be thrown at him this fall.
And when you look back and realize it, you'll still say the election was stolen.
fastfeat @ 61:
This entire mess we've been in for the last 7.5 years could've been avoided had Barbara Bush just enjoyed swallowing. GHWB should've eaten lots of parsley.
Jeez... when is it not silly season!?
These people need to go back to yelling at traffic, and let the adults run the country.
What would be Hannity's response if his own teenage daughter got pregnant?
Probably not "Oh, good"
CafeenMan @ 21:
So by their logic it is extreme to be pro choice.
IMO it is extreme to be pro life...
extremely hypocritical
Jim @ 65:
Where did this name "Barry" come from? I notice folks like you use it a lot.
dennis @ 66:
With the economy in the dumper, The war still raging in Irag, jobless rate climbing, I don't think come Nov, any of this stupid shit will sway any voters. The faux news trolls can bring this shit up all they want, but people this time around aren't listening. I hope repugs think that the old worn out shit will work again, because people won't buy it again.
YourMom @ 69:
"Can't be mine, I had a vasectomy. You know, DNA is just a bunch of that left-wing science stuff."
That's because the right-nut pundits don't lack the capicity to understand the message themselves. When your an unprepared teenager say 16 for example: You are punishing yourself with a child and tossing away what life you had and many of the choices you would have otherwise had. DUH!
fastfeat @ 73:
LOL!
He'd hustle her off to have an abortion pronto.
diamondmc @ 72:
I agree. Why in the world would anyone listen to a shit head like Hannity or FOX news? McBush is an old fart with old ideas.
I watched Jon Steward last night. It was really funny about McGrampa's campaign traveling around the country talking about his history. I hope Crook and Liars shows it today.
dennis @ 66:
Actually, I believe that either dem candidate will whup the tar out of McBain...and would we libs be off base by claiming the election was stolen if McFlipFlop wins, seeing as how the last two were stolen?
greg @ 71:
It was Barack's nickname growing up.
anneyhussein @ 75:
Maybe Hannity could ask his white racist nazi friend what to do?
Jim @ 65:
OMG I just flashed to the famous 16 words about african yellowcake in the '03 SOTU speech.
Wrong words? My how conveniently selective our memories can be. Yes, definitely Obama should lose the nomination for using the word punishment instead of consequence.
Maybe it's too early for me to be reading trash like that.
liberalHUSSEINmoderation @ 77:
Three words, LHM. Tuzla, and Jeremiah Dice-Clay.
Che's Lounge @ 80:
Umm, I saw him LIVE and off teleprompter, and he was amazing. Its funny how people try to take one of his strongest traits, speaking, and say he's no good at it.
In other news, why is everyone so interested in Michael Jordan's average dunking ability and Tiger Woods mediocre stroke?
One of the best bumper sticker ideas I've heard:
"Abortion is wrong
unless your daughter needs one"
dennis @ 81:
What is LHM and Tuzla?
By the way, it seems that the pastor has fallen out of the news. it would've been a much better card to play in late october, but to play it this early? It only keeps people who weren't gonna vote for him anyway away from the polls.
Deezus,
Umm, I saw him LIVE and off teleprompter, and he was amazing. Its funny how people try to take one of his strongest traits, speaking, and say he’s no good at it.
This is a classic Rovian tactic. Turn the opposition's strengths against them.
I think the religious right needs the extra babies to volunteer for more wars. They need to save a life so they can use that life to kill others who don't share their religious beliefs.
The 'Circle of Life' if you will.
dennis @ 81:
Wow! What a intelligence response. Your parents most be proud at your great wit and intelligence. Faux news would be proud that you are a champion of all the crap they throw out, that doesn't mean shit. What a waste of time.
Kids are punishment!
LOL
Of course Hannity would step in and prove yet again how retarded he is.
Children are not miracles. By the mere fact of overpopulation it is easy to see it is no miracle for most humans beings to have sex and conceive.
Every species reproduces.....hardly a "miracle"...
deezus @ 82:
They are just jealous. The Republicans wish to hell they had someone as exciting as Obama. But they don't so they have to pick at EVERY little word so morons like Hannity has anything to spin. Look, they trashed McGrampa during his primary run. Now they love him. Bullshit. We are pitting a young energetic, super intelligent candidate against an old, half dead, cancer ridden fart. No contest. The campaign will be his age. This guy wants to be President before he dies. Thats it.
Religious Idiots Logic:
Abortion = wrong
Raising an unwanted child in a hellhole of abuse for 18 years = no problem
And they wonder why no one can stand the sight of them anymore
Wow... talking about grasping at straws. These guys are really desperate.
The day a man gives birth to a baby is the day he can, in my opinion, have a say in his woman's (and only his woman's) reproductive rights.
The day every pro-life wingnut has adopted a child is the day they can, in my opinion, have a say in womens' reproductive rights.
OBAMA FOR PRESIDENT!!!
In just the last three days, two 14-year old girls in Houston have delivered babies in a fashion deemed worthy of media attention - one miscarried on a flight back to Houston from a school field trip to New York and left the fetus in the plane's toilet, the other was also delivered in a toilet and died when the frightened young mother attempted to flush the child.
Both girls were terrified, ashamed and, obviously, felt they had nowhere to turn.
Houston's public school sex ed program is abstinence-based and offers NO instruction on contraceptive use. Is it coincidental that Texas ranks first in the nation in teenage birth rates?
Yes, teen pregnancy is a form of punishment. Religious and civic leaders do not celebrate teen pregnancy, they use it as a wedge issue and the primary victim of their refusal to deal with the problem as adults are the very children bearing children.
And they wonder why Obama refuses to go on the Fake News channel.
Any kid having a baby is a tragedy for everyone. As one of the posters noted earlier, the same people who virulently oppose abortion also oppose sex education and contraceptives and then once a child has a baby, then wants to cut off aid for health care, welfare, day care, etc. The general argument--you made the bed, lay in it. If that is not right-wingers punishing kids having kids then what is?
If we as a community do not support comprehensive sex education, if we do not make a clear case to children why sex and pregnancy before adulthood is detrimental, if we do not provide education and access to contraceptives, and if we do not in some way support babies born to teenagers with health care, day care, etc.--YES, we are absolutely punishing children with babies.
jo @ 94:
Makes you wonder why Denise, I mean Dennis, wouldn't want to have her, I mean his, own rights.
As a childfree woman, I'm not sure I could think of a worse punishment than a baby. Snerk. I think I'd take a session of waterboarding first. At least that will be over with, kids are forever.
Seriously though, I like the underlying point here -- sex shouldn't be something that ruins anyone's life, especially a young teenager. This "abstinence-only education" business is so ancient in its philosophies. Sex isn't something to be terrified of, but it is something people should be educated about.
WrongIsRight @ 90:
Paraphrasing the late, great Bill Hicks, "...no more a miracle than eating a meal and a turd coming out..."
[Deleted. Off topic. Bandwidth is expensive. The comment space is reserved for comments that relate to the topic of the post . You may not reprint lengthy text from your own works or those of others, including news articles. You may link to them-Sitemonitor]
Reich-wingers are outraged over a hypothetical situation, but have no problem sending US troops to die for the GOPigs "war".
Captain Kangaroo @ 96:
He did go on there, Cap'n. When he needed to to stave off the bleeding from the Jeremiah Wright flap. Strive for accuracy in everything you say and do. It's not that hard these days, really.
Princess @ 43:
Another reich-wing living in a fake reality. Princess...hears.....voices.....
diamondmc @ 79:
He only has one?
"Fair AND Balanced" would suggest at least two.
Sarasvati @ 97:
Well said. And what about stem cells. They want to save stem cells too. I often asked my pro lifers -
(1`)would you go into a burning building if you knew stem cells were in there and save them. If not, why.
(2) Also, if your 15 year old daughter was raped and got pregnant, would you have and keep the baby?
(3) Finally, would you arranged for the adoption of all unwanted babies?
All you pro lifers, answer this. If the answer is no, shut the hell up.
dennis @ 103:
There is no bleeding. The only "people" that care about Wright are an extreme radical minority.
Obama's words were spoken in the context of the debate on "abstinence education," not in the context of the debate on abortion. The attempt to recast those words as a commentary on abortion is demonstrably mendacious.
deezus @ 84:
The only "people" that keep this non-story alive is FAux. That speaks volumes. Words matter, princess.
I wouldn't call this a wedge issue but I'm sure the right wing will do its very best to make it appear so. I do think that Obama should clarify his comment a bit by adding a few words to it. He could say that having a baby at anytime is a great thing. No one would argue with that. The punishment comes from the massive amounts of responsibility that always accompanies the new child. It is that responsibility that is most burdensome to the new parent(s) and it is the word "responsibility" that the right wing least understands. The right wing never takes responsibility for anything as we all well know. To them, there are no consequences for their actions. Therefore it is always someone elses fault.
Princess, how quickly you forget, Mr. Obama did appear on Faux to discuss the Wright "situation".....two weeks ago, you twit. Yet, the reich-wing channel continues to smear and lie about Mr. Obama and they continue to prove they are indeed the reich-wing propaganda machine.
Next....
dennis @ 103:
Wow! You of all people should talk.
Che's Lounge @ 85:
Man, will this ever end? Just because I think Barry O is a fraud, I'm "Rovian"?! That's hilarious. I'm about as left wing as they come, but that doesn't matter. What matters is that I can't see things differently than you and have a valid opinion. I saw Obama live in San Antonio WITHOUT a teleprompter and he SUCKED! So there. I also don't believe anything about this guy. I also think he's a total fraud in regards to his support of nuke power companies and his voting record on the Patriot Act and funding the invasion of Iraq. However, if he's our candidate, I'll vote for him.
-Your Rovian lover
princess @ 103:
Oops, princess fails again..... Strive for accuracy in everything you say and do. It's not that hard these days, really.
http://polijamblog.polijam.com/?p=932
hardly a welcoming attitude toward new life.
But war, torture, hate crimes.... people dying for lack of health care..... that's all good. Life only matters when it's "new" life. Once you're on this earth, anything goes!
greg @ 71:
Well, until a few years ago he was BARRY O'Bama. He was also white and in love with Joe Lieberman. Somewhere things changed. Maybe his teleprompter told him to change.
Okay, so Obama is acting like a concerned parent. He might not support abortion, per se, but he is saying he supports a woman's right to choose to have an abortion or not.
I'm a Christian and I support a woman's right to make the choices regarding her own body. I don't support abortion as an option for myself, but I don't have the right to deny that option to a woman who may need it. One of my aunts died before I was born - an abortion would have saved her life, and the doctors recommended it because her child would have been severely retarded and disabled, and was already brain-dead in her womb. The Dominionists (of which her own husband was one) bereated her in keeping the child, even though she was told by the doctors it would be born brain dead and wouldn't live long after birth.
She was advised not to get pregnant, anyway. But her husband wanted a child, despite the doctor's advice.
My mother brought me up as a Christian; however, she supported a woman's right to choose to have a child or have an abortion (safe, legal and rare), because if women had had the right to choose 50 years ago, my aunt would be in her late seventies or early 80s, having lived a long life. Instead, she was dead before her 30th birthday.
So, I say piss on Sean Hannity and O'Reilly and any other wingnut esposing this schtick, because if they're so concerned about the "sanctity of life" that concern should extend to the child when it's born, and to the mother who may be risking her life. The End.
dennis @ 103:
Yeah. He want on all the stations. FOX treated him like he was on trial. He handled it better than I. I would have told the lynch man to go to hell. But has not gone on the talk shows. They even have a calendar on one of those Sunday talk shows counting the number of days he has refuses to appear on FOX. First of all, FOX news is not a news station. It is a REPUBLICAN , neo con propaganda broadcast station. I don't blame him for not going on any of their shows.
gws @ 118:
Facts and reality are not princess' strong suit.
Come on. He was talking about his girls who aren't even close to adults yet and clearly talking about teenage pregnancy.
What should he say? That he can't wait for his girls to start menstruating so they can get knocked up and maybe HIV or syphilis to boot?
I'd call pregnancy a punishment - an awful tragedy of one to happen to a young girl.
For a guy who's campaign is based solely on words, he sure says some stupid things.
dennis @ 81:
What in the hell are you taking about? Your reply makes absolutely ZERO sense. Instead of just spouting nonsense, how about trying something new, like, oh I dunno...maybe ELABORATE on what you just said? As it stands, your comment is equivalent to a big steaming pile of elephant droppings.
Jim @ 116:
I doubt there are many 15 year old girls who refer to their babies as "miracles".
You want fewer unwanted pregnancies? You educate kids.
You want fewer abortions? You prevent unwanted pregnancies.
The fundies can dream big dreams, but then they need to put on their overalls and get to work.
Jim,
I’m about as left wing as they come, but that doesn’t matter.
Nevertheless, attacking the oppositions strong points as weaknesses is a well established tactic of KKKarl Rove.
Just lettin' ya know.
Yet with all this nitpicking by both of us, we still agree on one thing. We will vote against McCain even if we have serious conflicts with the Dem nominee. So let the battle play out. We should all still be there in droves in Nov.
The radical right jumped the shark a year or two ago in my mind. Certainly a conservative viewpoint is valuable and loyal opposition is necessary in a democratic society...but, these people are not..well lets just say that they fabricate outrage and come up with the most outrageous bumper sticker lies that I can't take anything they say seriously anymore. They are a joke, a cult of reactionary, knee jerk personality.
Can someone start parseing McCains speeches and words to the degree that Hillary and Obama do? This is getting ridiculous, the media is a complete joke in this country, if this type of coverage continues we are going to have to start reading and viewing foreign media to get any semblance of objectivity and value, I know issues are dry and boring on TV but maybe they could put a bluescreen up behind the anchors that shows wildest police chases with no sound while smart intelligent people discuss issues in depth.
ChrisM70 @ 9:
If they did, we wouldn't need
Crooks and Liars or Huffington Postto set the record straight.It's not our fault FOX News is run by Fucktards.
Yeah yeah, children are a blessing. BULLSHIT! Let's see if you feel that way after your child shoots up the mall, shoots up drugs, tosses another kid down the stairs, wrecks the car on the interstate, wrecks your car 1 block from the house, or is implicated in an Internet suicide cult. No blessing, probably not a curse, most likely somewhere in between.
Che's Lounge @ 125:
Now THAT'S what I'm talkin about! Though we may differ in our choice for dem nominee, we MUST all vote as one in Nov.
[Deleted. Off topic. Bandwidth is expensive. The comment space is reserved for comments that relate to the topic of the post . You may not reprint lengthy text from your own works or those of others, including news articles. You may link to them-Sitemonitor]
"Pro-life activists are outraged"? That's not news. They live every moment of their lives in outrage.
They're outraged that John "100 Years in Iraq!" McCain is wishy-washy on the whole abortion thing. Like most issues, he doesn't seem to have any convictions about it.
They're outraged that after 30 years of electing Republic candidates who put Republic judges on the bench, women still have control over their own bodies - and they always will.
Jim @ 113:
Glad you will vote for him anyway. All politicians are frauds. Name me one who isn't. You are wise enough to see the big picture which is more than just who is the President. Its the administration.
thisisthetruth @ 130:
What an absolute load of bullshit!! Aaahahahahahahahahaha!!!
These anti-abortion folks are all for protecting the unborn fetus. If they were really "pro-life" wouldn't they do everything they could to make sure children born into the world had adequate health care, clean air to breathe, and not have their "grandparents" lie their country into unneccesary wars?
thisisthetruth @ 130:
THIS IS TOO IGNORANT TO EVEN ANSWER.
This whole thing is a little ridiculous. Anybody who heard Obama say what he said knows exactly what he meant. Anybody listening to the Obama/Democrat/liberal haters knows that they are full of shit. The only people who take the right wing haters of reality seriously on this would never vote for Obama. These are the same idiots who rerun the Wright videos over and over and repeat the nonsense over and over. The same people who say NOTHING about McCan’t and his stalking and pandering for the endorsement of Hagee and Parsley and Robertson and the Falwellistas.
[Refers to a deleted post-Sitemonitor]
pjcarter @ 134:
They're "Pro-Life" only for the unborn.
greg @ 135:
thisisthetruth @ 130:
Trollin', with too much time to type on his hands...
[And troll feeders. Please everyone. QUIT FEEDING THE TROLLS. Thanks in advance-Sitemonitor]
greg @ 135:
thisisthetruth@130 You must be the only person on earth that believes Hillary's polarizing ass brings "all races and people together". That is so fucking crazy.
Captain Kangaroo @ 136:
Can anyone remember what Hagee, Parsley, Robertson or Farwell said. No. I wonder why? Its all about Wright. Look. Those who were not going to vote for Obama because of race is going to use Wright as a reason not to vote for Obama (reverse racism)
The reich wing wants you to have that baby so they can send it to die in a war for big oil and Halliburton.
Ruthless People @ 144:
And it will take a lot of babies, and THEIR babies, and THEIR babies, to occupy Iraq for as long as McCain wants to.
thisisthetruth @ 130:
[Refers to a deleted post-Sitemonitor]
[Deleted. Off topic. Bandwidth is expensive. The comment space is reserved for comments that relate to the topic of the post . You may not reprint lengthy text from your own works or those of others, including news articles. You may link to them-Sitemonitor]
greg @ 143:
Can anyone remember what Hagee, Parsley, Robertson or Farwell said. No. I wonder why? Its all about Wright. Look. Those who were not going to vote for Obama because of race is going to use Wright as a reason not to vote for Obama (reverse racism)
Ooh! Ooh! I Know!
Could it be because they don't play their comments on a continuous loop like Reverend Wright. At lease with Pastor Wright, some of the things he says make sense in context. The things they say do not.
For a man who thinks "words matter", both he and his wife sure have to explain a lot of the words they use. This is maybe just another example of not being ready for prime-time. We all know that the right-wingers will always make a mountain out of a mole-hill so the trick is to not leave a lot of mole-hills in your wake. Fortunately for Obama, he has CNN, MSNBC, CBS, NBC and ABC out there deflecting and making excuses and pooh-poohing any and all criticism.
greg @ 143:
Login or Register to post comments.