Disenfranchising Indianan Nuns Gives Oklahoma GOP Ideas
By Nicole Belle Wednesday May 07, 2008 12:00pmIsn't that just like the GOP? Others hear about not letting 80 and 90 year old nuns vote and they shake their heads and say, "that's awful." But the GOP--in this case the Oklahoma State Senate GOP majority--see it as opportunity.
All through history, the political left has agitated to expand the franchise. The left worked and fought yo abolish the rules that only allowed white Christian male property holders the right to vote. The political right fought to prevent poor people from voting, to prevent Jews, Blacks, women, young people... And a few weeks ago the rightist Supreme Court gave the thumbs up to a Republican scheme to limit voting in Indiana. We saw the first results of that ruling today.
About 12 Indiana nuns were turned away Tuesday from a polling place by a fellow bride of Christ because they didn't have state or federal identification bearing a photograph.[..]
Tonight I got a notice from Andrew Rice alerting me that the Oklahoma Senate had prevented the Republicans from doing the same thing in his state. All of the GOP senators voted to restrict voting rights and all the Democrats voted to prevent them from shrinking the franchise.
The vote was 24-23 for the bill, but it takes 25 votes to pass a bill in the 48-member Senate. All 24 Republicans supported the plan, while 23 Democrats voted against it.Democrats said the proposal was meant to help Republicans and would deter the elderly and other citizens from voting because they may not have identification readily available.
Ford said the bill is needed to guard against voter fraud.
Voter fraud is something the GOP gets hysterical about, like welfare fraud. And like welfare fraud the GOP turns reality on its head. They will wreck hundreds of thousands of families' lives because a few dozens people or even a few hundred people may have committed fraud to the tune of some thousands of dollars-- while corporate welfare goes out to the tune of hundreds of billions of dollars. I can't say that there has never been any voter fraud. But I can say the kind of voter fraud the Republicans talk about it nearly nonexistent or, at worst, extremely rare. Republican voter fraud, electronic voter fraud, voter suppression... now we're talking about hundreds of thousands of voters. Read on...
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Curious how it's only the GOP that wants to prevent people from voting. It's almost like... they don't think they could win a fair fight.
Naaah. Couldn't be that.
WTF are you talking about, turned away? They were NOT turned away. They were given the option to vote, and they refused to do so, because they said they couldn't get to the DMV in the 10 following days to obtain a valid ID... One that's given free, by the way!
There are plenty of real disenfranchisements and bad voter laws, but this is NOT one of those situations. To claim it as such just makes anyone who does so look like a lying idiot!
we need to clean some house
can you imagine if obama wins and then gets shot
it will spark a revolution
the people who want to disenfranchise us also want to kill us as well...they are killing some of us right now
Voter fraud? What, like the 2000 elections?
I wonder how many nuns will be voting for the candidate who kowtows to a preacher who calls their church "the great whore."
wtf @ 2:
if before the law they could vote without an ID
and then by passing the law they couldn't
they have by definition been told they can't vote!!
we don't have to have an ID to breath or buy food or go to a ballgame
marko @ 6:
Don't be giving them any more ideas now.
I think we're going to have another web site crash here soon. Again.
[We're working on it LA. Site Monitor]
Voter ID Law in Indiana Prevents Jesus From Voting
Here is Kansas the Republican GOP majority passed bills to disenfranchise voters. Thankfully we have a Democratic governor who is going to veto it. There probably won't be enough votes in the House to override the veto. But as with the coal votes in Kansas the Republicans will keep on pushing it to absurdity.
marko @ 2:
I'm afraid I must agree, that violence should be expected. Those people who've been calling the shots for 8 years won't want to give up their unbridled power. We've seen they can't really win in a fair fight, so like all bullies, they'll resort to the fist.
I hope I'm wrong.
L.A. Confidential @ 7:
Oh, good. I thought it was just my computer. Not that I'm happy your website is having trouble ;)
it takes a fraud to know a fraud...
Rusty Shackleford @ 4:
Yeah, good question. LOL.
L.A. Confidential @ 7:
Good. I hope you find the bastards.
randy @ 3:
You forgot 2004 and 2006 and probably 2008.
Randy,
GOP voter fraud doesn't count though.
marko @ 5:
stop. right there. nobody told them they couldn't vote.
judging by the awful decisions most people make at the polls (including whether or not to even show up), i don't think the problem is that it's just too hard to vote in america.
Fanon @ 11:
Nope someone out there in cyber land is trying to nuke this site. Thats totally obvious.
JonKeer @ 17:
Same argument would apply to poll taxes and literacy tests. Nobody told those poor and illiterate people they couldn't vote.
Who in the hell is Ford? I have reread the article and can not find a first name. Is this an automobile talking? I could do a google search but Ford id a common name. I know that I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer, but I am stumped.
GOP: Grand Ole Ploy
They've been relieved of their habits
to vote.
Crazy8 @ 20:
That's why you should handle it blade outwards.
Voter fraud is something the GOP gets hysterical about, like welfare fraud.
It would sure be nice if they were to be as incensed about warfare fraud. But I guess causing the deaths of hundreds of thousands of innocent people, like the character of Lex Luthor in the first Christopher Reeve "Superman" movie, is how they get their kicks.
JonKeer @ 17:
Rusty Shackleford @ 1:
They can't ... look how they got their boy george in office, fixed votes in Florida and then SCOTUS steps in and goes against the popular vote.
ysbaddaden @ 25:
Oopsie
I like to vote hard
They have those touch-screen voting machines in Dallas now.
They're trying to push voter ID in Wisconsin too. And to those of you who think it's trivial: when's the last time you tried to get an ID at the DMV, hmm? Last time I went it cost me two hours and $20. And they don't have waiting room seating any more. You tell me you're fine with your 90-year old grandmother on fixed income standing around in a DMV lobby for a couple of hours and then we'll see how "compassionate" conservativism really is.
And don't think it'll end with this. The next step is to make ID harder to get and more expensive to have.
C&L must be having server problems, or maybe my anonymous server has the hiccups.
[Deleted, posting in all caps. Please stop. Site Monitor]
randy @ 3:
That's not voter fraud... that's election fraud.
So-called "voter fraud" is so microscopically rare, as to be statistically irrelevant. It simply doesn't happen (unless you're Ann Coulter). Voting on an individual basis is such a giant pain in the ass generally, that no individual is going to do such a thing, unless they're some myopic Limbaugh dittohead.
ELECTION Fraud on the other hand is rampant.
That is large-scale illegal manipulation of the voting process by one party or it's agents through caging lists that target individuals for their race, age, or economic status, phone jamming, intentional disinformation campaigns to deter or prevent voters from going to the polls, tearing up Democratic registrations, tossing out provisional ballots by the millions rather than counting them, and of course, outright hacking the vote with viruses and code designed to flip electronic votes in the middle of the night.
That the Republicans do regularly.
L.A. Confidential @ 18:
Perhaps someone didn't much care for the telecom legislation post?
Wahlen verbotten!!
So, does this mean we will seat Michigan and Florida?
Here in Missouri we are fighting the same thing, but it has a chance of passing. A constitutional amendment to enact new voter-id rules should pass the house today and go on to the senate. We may not be able to stop it there with Republican majorities in both chambers. Gov. Blunt is sure to sign it and then probably authorize a special election so voters can approve it and have the law in place for the November election. With one week to go in the session, the state Republicans are working HARD to disenfranchise Missourians. A coalition has quickly formed to fight it and appears to have the support of Sec. of state Robin Carnahan. Let's hope we can stop it.
Oh PS. those relying on absentee ballots might want to pay a much closer eye on that process in their respective states.
Most people assume that when they put their ballot in the mail, that it goes directly to the elections office. not necessarily.
In many states, it first goes to a private "sorting center" that is a subsidiary of.... wait for it..... Diebold Inc.
many of those Democratic ballots may just uh, fall off a truck, so to speak, or worse, get "counted" by their "Vote Remote" system, which has been certified by exactly no one.
More here:
http://www.bbvforums.org/cgi-bin/forums/board-auth.cgi?file=/1954/8542.html
Best of all the security firewall for that little system is made by SAIC, the defense contractor, who of course, would have absolutely no interest in say, seeing a war-mongering Republican get elected so that they could continue their war profiteering, right?
Of course not...... [smirk]
Il presidente Bush ed il vice presidente Cheney dovrebbero essere messi in prigione per i crimini di guerra.
Are you people blind!? Voter fraud is RAMPANT!
Woman registers her dog to vote; prosecutors growl
By Keith Ervin
Seattle Times staff reporter
Jane Balogh had a pretty good idea who was calling when the phone rang and the caller asked for Duncan M. MacDonald.
Duncan is the dog Balogh registered as a voter seven months before the November 2006 election.
Duncan's absentee-ballot envelope was signed with a picture of a paw print.
"You can't sign with a paw print," the election worker told Balogh on Nov. 9.
"I said, 'he can if he's a dog,' " answered Balogh, a 66-year-old grandmother and Army veteran who lives in Federal Way.
The election worker told her a supervisor would call, but she never heard from anyone.
After making her point — how easy it is for a voter to register illegally — Balogh will be arraigned in King County Superior Court on Tuesday on a misdemeanor charge of making a false statement to a public official.
If she declines to plead guilty, prosecutors told her in a letter this week, they will file a felony charge of providing false information on a voter-registration application. She doesn't plan to contest the misdemeanor: "I'm not going to claim to be innocent when I know I'm guilty."
Balogh's crime was signing Duncan's name on a registration card under a declaration that he meets all the requirements to vote. She submitted ballots in his name in the September and November 2006 and May 2007 elections. She wrote "VOID" on the ballots, and didn't cast any votes.
Balogh, who lives with Duncan, an Australian shepherd-terrier mix, and four other dogs and four cats, registered her dog as a protest of a 2005 state voter-registration statute that she says makes it too easy for noncitizens to vote. She put her phone bill in Duncan's name, then used the phone bill as identification to register him as a voter.
Well pretty much all of Europe demands you to have an ID with your picture on it to be able to vote (as well as your voter card)
So it does seem to be a reasonable addition to the law, as you can't really say Europe leans the Republican way.
But we also use paper ballots rather then 100% electronics machine. Thats I think is a much bigger problem in the United States.
By now we should all see that the Republicans have only scorn for Democracy.
Freedom to them has NOTHING to do with voting, or democracy-its all about capitalism- the FREEDOM to make money.
My prediction? Obama will win the election, but Mccain will be installed....
The Democrats in the House and Senate will once again fall to their knees and do whatever the Republicans want.
The moment this country arrogantly insisted it had the right to torture, it lost all credibility...
I am concerned that the Republicans will try and steal this election...
givemeabreak @ 39:
is it?
is that your evidence that it is "RAMPANT"?
on a tangent: i find it quite amusing (in a non-humorous way) the way the GOP frames this issue of voter fraud, yet smiles and farts as rush 'mmmmmmm oxy' limbaugh uses the public airwaves to distort the primaries.
as usual, the GOP is as hypocritical as they are corrupt
marko @ 5:
... or to cast an absentee ballot.
givemeabreak @ 39:
WOW !!!
That's like planting a gay male prostitute posing as a fake reporter in the White House Press CORPSE to throw soft ball (no pun intended) questions at the President !!!
Just go look up EFTC (represented by Greenburg-Traurig), Suntron Corp (manufacturer of Hart intercivic, military contractor) and a few more that are tied to a medium size investment group (Thayer-Blum funding III) that has an address of 14xx Pennsylvania Ave. that took the whole works private on 12/07
I don't think any of this is on the up and up.
Rusty Shackleford @ 1:
YES IT COULD.
The only voting fraud that appears to have been actually demonstrated is the vote stealing and election rigging at the hands of the GOP.
This is all you need to know (pdf) about the partisan aspect of voter fraud and voter ID.
From Project Vote, one of the organizations that was at the center of the whole US Attorneys scandal.
They weren't disenfranchised. They chose not to have ID.
Palooka @ 49:
chose... hmmm
just like they chose to be elderly and have a hard time getting around?
The nuns, all in their 80s or 90s, didn't get one but came to the precinct anyway.
"One came down this morning, and she was 98, and she said, 'I don't want to go do that,'" Sister McGuire said. Some showed up with outdated passports. None of them drives.
They weren't given provisional ballots because it would be impossible to get them to a motor vehicle branch and back in the 10-day time frame allotted by the law, Sister McGuire said. "You have to remember that some of these ladies don't walk well. They're in wheelchairs or on walkers or electric carts."
Nonetheless, she said, the convent will make a "very concerted effort" to get proper identification for the nuns in time for the general election. "We're going to take from now until November to get them out and get this done. You can't do this like school kids on a bus," she said. "I wish we could."
It's HOOSIERS not Indianans (?) Only someone who is not from Indiana nor ever been there refers to the residents of that state as Indianans....
Samson- @ 50:
The ravages of time take their toll on everyone.
Hopefully I'll live to be the same age.
One thing's for sure. I'll have my ID.
Palooka @ 49:
"They weren't disenfranchised. They chose to be illiterate."
That used to fly too, back in the early 20th century.
This was in the works before the ruling that allowed Indiana to go ahead with it's voter ID law. There are several states proposing this law. It is a concerted effort on the part of the Gross Obtuse Pig party to steal the election on a nationwide state-by-state basis.
Also, to those who say this isn't a big deal. The hell, you say! When you register to vote, it is necessary to show identification prior to your being issued a voters registration card. Your information has already been given to a government agency which authorizes your identity and address for that precinct. If they want photo ID, then that needs to be done at the time you register and provide proof of your existence. But, then again, so many have remained silent about the loss of habeus corpus, the shredding of the constitution, and the imperial presidency, and on and on that it is no wonder you are willing to bend over and take one for the team. The Repugnicant team.
Andrew Rice's offices are around the corner from where I live. I need to go over there and thank him personally for standing up to criminal republicisms.
What does one call Republicans switching party affiliation in order to determine the outcome of a particular Democratic primary?
Rusty Shackleford @ 53:
And I ate a cheese sandwich for lunch last Tuesday.
Do you need identification when you register to vote? If so why?
Palooka @ 56:
I see the point went over your head. I'd dumb it down for you but I doubt it would matter.
Rusty Shackleford arrogance does not become you.
So, to these people disfranchising 1% of the population isn't enough. These clowns ain't Nazis! They're Rightist versions of Ol' Stalin's loonie tunes!
Good God in the foothills, we couldn't even get a decent dictator!!!!
(Sarcasm on part II, people.
Some may ask "Doesn't 24+23=47?" They'd be right. The GOP doesn't have a majority in the Senate. Not technically. What happened was the DEM Senate Pro Tem abstained from voting. Why? Another "no" vote would have given the GOP Lt. Gov. the deciding vote. So sorry we denied her that fun. Isn't it kinda fun when we beat the GOP using their own tactics?
Hey Nicole! If you want to cover more Oklahoma GOP stupidity, check out our new abortion law. Women are now FORCED to have an ultra-sound before undergoing the abortion. Gov. Henry vetoed the law but enough blue dogs joined the goppers to override. Nice huh?
Rusty Shackleford @ 58:
Over my head?
Nah.
I just don't understand the comparison between racist laws from last century has anything to do with asking some one to prove who they are to participate in something that will drastically affect the entire country and millions of people.
Again, I exercise my right to have _as much of_ a fraud free election process as possible.
Palooka @ 63:
If you don't understand it, then it went over your head.
Literacy tests were not factually justified. They were pretexts to keep certain people from voting.
Likewise, photo I.D. requirements are not factually justified. They are pretexts to keep certain people from voting.
I literally cannot make it any simpler than that.
What certain people does requiring a voter ID harm?
Everyone can get a voter ID. In Indiana, you can even get them for free.
"I literally cannot make it any simpler than that."
You could drop the charade. That would make this whole mess pretty simple.
Palooka @ 65:
People without photo IDs.
Really? That simple, huh? You just walk in and say, "here's my voter ID card, please give me a photo ID so I can vote"?
Charade?
> People without photo IDs.
There shouldn't be anyone without them, and this is a far cry than the elitist and racist laws requiring literacy.
> Really? That simple, huh? You just walk in and say, “here’s my voter ID card, please give me a photo ID so I can vote”?
Dunno how it is there, but the last time I had to renew my ID, I walked in, took a seat, and fifteen minutes later I had my SSN written on a sheet of paper, my picture taken, and a fresh smelling slip of plastic in my wallet. Thirty minutes tops, and I'm generally an impatient and busy man.
> Charade?
Yes, charade. The idea that this is, in any way, a big deal or that it infringes on anyone's rights. The charade that you "care" about the voting rights of some people who can't keep with the responsibility of keeping identification, but brushing off the rights of those who want people to provide proof of who they are when they vote.
Charade. Fraud. Fake.
Save your energy for real matters.
Palooka @ 67:
Your mind is closed, so I don't know why I bother.
But it's not a charade.
I don't think asking for a more secure voting process is closed minded.
Maybe next time, huckster.
Who can't get a photo ID in 2008?
- Anyone who cannot prove both their identity and their place of residence cannot get a photo ID.
- Anyone who cannot travel to a state office during working hours to get identity supporting documents cannot get a photo ID.
- Anyone who cannot travel to a photo ID center, also open only during limited hours, cannot get a photo ID.
That would mean that anyone who is:
- homeless (unable to provide proof of residence)
- medically housebound (cannot travel)
- indigent (cannot pay fees for proof of identity documentation and/or ID in states where there is a cost)
- a resident of a care facility whose financial matters are handled by someone with another address (cannot prove residence)
is definitely unable to get an ID and is therefore disenfranchised.
It is fair to say that the disenfranchisement will also extend to those who are unable to get to state offices to get proof documents or to get the ID itself because their work schedules are incompatible with opening hours of the state offices, and for whom a day or even part day off of work is not financially tenable.
It should be noted, by the way, that proof of identity documents provide a double hurdle for any woman who has married and changed her name, as she will need not just a birth certificate, but also a marriage license to prove that she is who she is.
Born, reared and educated in that State, "Indianan" is an entirely foreign term to this "Hoosier." I'm curious about the source of the word, even though the etymology seems apparent.
Leslie [Hussein] @ 14:
As someone who canvassed extensively in a very Catholic midwestern city, it may all come down to, "I can't vote for someone who kills little babies" (i.e., pro-choice).
Anyway, why be concerned about what Hagee says, when your church is (of course) going to prevail because it's the True Church? McCain is anti-choice, and that's more important than whether some Hell-bound preacher elevates your Catholic holiness by insulting you.
'Member they spat on Jesus, too.
Here's a thunk.
Maybe these nuns are in convents where TV, radio, and newspapers ain't allowed.
So they don't know the requirements until too late to vote in the primary.
A lot of folk don't own or can afford TV's and radios
Soon they'll all be cable anyway we have to pay for, and not get free anymore.
Newspapers are becoming obsolete.
So you need to first pay for a computer and second to pay for internet hookups.
But then the nuns would be clustered around the cloister PC to watch monkey porn.
Palooka @ 70:
Have it your way, racist.
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