Hey, You Kids...Off My Lawn!!!
No, it's not the latest ranting of Grampa McSame, but a news item my local San Francisco news affiliate carried. The context was a new way to combat the problem of loitering in high crime areas. The answer is a technology that struck me: "The Mosquito." an ultrasonic device that emits a high-pitched noise that only teenagers can hear.
Marketed under the banner "Kids Be Gone," the device emits a high-frequency modulated tone that has been likened to fingernails on a blackboard or a mosquito buzzing in the ear. Because the ability to hear higher frequencies fades with age, the Mosquito affects only people younger than about age 25. Also, according to the makers and various media reports, the sound does not annoy young children or dogs, only people in the 13 to 25 age bracket.[..]
A website focused on the Mosquito — www.kidsbegone.com — says studies have shown the device is safe and does not damage teenagers' hearing. The effective range is about 50 feet, according to the website.
In a sneaky twist, the same technology is available as a cellphone ring tone, alerting teens to calls that teachers, parents and other adults can't hear. The Kids Be Gone website has a link to the high frequency ring tone. In a test at The Courant, a 22-year-old said he could clearly hear the tone, while several staffers over age 25 heard nothing.
The technology rests with little tiny hair perceptors in our ears that usually die off by the age of 25. Although the manufacturers say that no permanent damage is done from The Mosquito, I'm a little wary of such assurances. The technology has been used in the UK and is now the subject of a protest for its indiscriminate use. (YouTube)
Cool. I just found a way to keep teenage boys away from my daughter.
I can't hear any more, I'm gonna sue!
Unfortunately, for some kids my age, it's needed. Many of them are killing their own hearing with loud radios, and don't listen to other folk who want to still be hearing 15 years for now. So, this stuff is needed for a select group. Indiscriminantly Hell, No! This is a dangerous tool, and I wouldn't be surprised if results show it does damage hearing. If that is proven, then I retract everything I've said about it even being necessary for the assholes.
No-one deserves to have others damage their hearing. I know, because I was born hard of hearing. I don't want others to have to stumble through the joys of mishearing stuff and getting into trouble because of it.
I heard a story a few years ago that some stores were using classical music to the same effect.
The yutes will just fight back with that damn thumpa-thumpa music they're always blasting out of their jalopies.
Kids these days.
Ingenious!
Pair this with a cell phone blocker and I'd never have to see a teenager again.
Not every teen can hear it. Not ever adult cannot hear it. Don't believe the marketing crap from that company.
I heard about this a few years ago. The funny thing is, teenagers actually took the sound (or a pitch similar to it) and used it as their ringtone on their cell phones so that they can only hear it if someone calls them.
I just read a story on this where a landlord put one out in front of his building. They interviewed a twenty something who lived there who couldn't keep his windows open or stand in front of the building because of the noise. How is that right?
Anything that will repel teens is a good thing. Where can I buy one?
Can't we all just get along?
Blue Taliban Osama Buddha @ 9:
Actually, to clarify, they use it more for text messaging. This way they can send text messages, say under the desk, and know they got one without the teacher hearing it.
Well, we all hear things differently, Rush and Sean and especially Glenn Beck all sound like fingernails on the chalkboard to moi
Laura @ 12:
NO! It's impossible for adults and teenagers to co-exist. If they were just more like fish....then, maybe.
I am 35 and I can hear up to 20 khz. That includes dog whistles, calculator LCD's, dimmer switches for lights, the power supply for my computer, and the Mosquito/Teenbuzz. It is incredibly annoying, and I always ask businesses to disable it when I hear it.
When O'Racist and Drugbaugh tells their daily and endless lies, reich-wingers magically hear "the truth".
This is pretty disgusting. I can't imagine that anybody would accept a different group of people being indiscriminately targeted. Imagine if the fire alarm of a building was constantly on so you had to run through the lobby everytime you went in and out. How long do you think the adults would allow that to continue? But who cares about the innocent kids who have to deal with it as long as we get rid of the "punks".
8 Khz.
Am I going to die soon?
Won't be needed I think 99% of the young generations will be deaf by ipod by 30 anyway. 99% of the Boom Car people are already deaf.
Some people with autism are sensitive to the sound, causing distress or headaches. If one were used around my daughter, and it bugged her, I can't vouch for long term hearing damage, but I could guarantee someone's getting some musculoskeletal injury.
my ears exploded. thanks!
I wonder what frequency would repel republcants?
L.A. Confidential @ 20:
My name is StirFry Hussein, and I'm an iPod person.
What BS. Not only teenagers can hear it--I'm a 33 year old woman, and I was walking down a city street a few months ago and we walked past one. It literally made me scream in pain, hunch over, and start yelling in incoherent confusion while my friends who could not hear it had stopped because they thought I was having a heart attack or something.
One of the huge problems is that the people who install these things can't freaking hear it. So I suspect they've got the volume turned all the way up to an unbelievable decibel level. But because the noise right on the verge of what people can and can't hear, it doesn't act like a normal noise, that gradually builds as you get closer to it. You're walking down the street and it goes from being something you can't hear to something you're totally in the middle of. Like literally standing in front of a rock concert speaker that's off, and then suddenly having it turn on full blast, playing feedback.
I live in NYC, a street-facing apartment on a busy street that's also an ambulance route. Really, I can deal with loud noise. But I can tell you from experience this is isn't noise. It's something much worse than a fire truck blaring its sirens and honking as it passes you walking on the street. It comes out of nowhere, and it's a brain-piercing pain that just stops you in your tracks. Worse, it's incredibly confusing because you can barely hear it, so you're just in pain and can't figure out what's happening. It's sort of like someone sneaking up behind you and blowing an air siren in both your ears, but when you turn around you can't see them, so you're all confusedly like "no, there's no noise source, how can it be noise? What is happening?" but the whole time you're trying to put together a coherent thought, the air siren keeps blaring nonstop.
When it happened to me, all I could think was how much it would suck if a mom with a stroller went past there. There's no way this isn't dangerous, and I'm sure it's going to lead to tinnitis at least. They should be illegal.
Let me tell you more about sound. Sound is not just something you hear, it's a force.
Sound molecules can literally cause a shift in your genetic structure. It can cause cell damage, make you seriously ill, or even make you well.
Using it as a weapon is pretty low.
StirFry @ 24:
Well just educate yourself on sound and you'll be fine.
L.A. Confidential @ 26:
Sound molecules?
Great.... Let's not try to figure out why kids have nothing better to do than loiter. Let's just treat them like pests... wow...
Yellow Elephant Safari @ 28:
Well energy or whatever nomenclature you prefer. Stand next to a Boeing 747 doing an engine spool up and you'll get the drift.
#26 L.A.Confidential,
Isn't this like a microwave oven?
Melton @ 29:
Actually some of them are pretty inconsiderate and tacky. I'll assume that crowd is Republican trained.
Yellow Elephant Safari @ 23:
What ever frequency the truth is broadcast at.
Yellow Elephant Safari @ 23:
More better you worry about Republicans setting these up in front of crowded polling places to repel the youth vote.
L.A. Confidential @ 30:
I fronted a metal band in teh late 70's. I know what sound feels like. And yes, I have some major tinnitus now.
Damn....I didn't hear it until about 14khz.
I DID suspect I was going deaf...though I thought that maybe I was just tuning out all the assholes.
:)
Dr. Hussein Matt @ 33:
Good one.
Bonkers Hussein @ 36:
You're just an old bastard. :)
JoGoBamma(formerly Jo) @ 31:
Sound pushes air.
Microwaves cook.
Yellow Elephant Safari @ 23:
LOL hey every person has a frequency that can be exploited with the use of sound. It doesn't even need to a audible. I'm sure the Pentagon would love to get their hands on that but it's to expensive to try to break the "code" of every individual.
Yellow Elephant Safari @ 35:
Welcome to the club!
I am 38 and I can hear those ring tones. Annoying as hell, by the way. As with most statistics, there are majorities and minorities, but this technology is not 100% by any means.
JoGoBamma(formerly Jo) @ 31:
No. Sound waves are a different form of energy than electromagnetic waves, like microwaves, the light we see, gamma rays, and X rays. Sound waves are slower, and are based on vibration. Sound operates on different frequencies than the EM spectrum, which is based around emission of various frequencies that can span from gamma rays and X rays, to the size of the Known Universe. Microwave ovens, depending on the quality of these devices, can actually mess them up owing to the effect of microwaves on electronics.
In a sneaky twist, the same technology is available as a cellphone ring tone, alerting teens to calls that teachers, parents and other adults can’t hear.
My phone has a "sneaky twist" too, it's called "vibrate" mode.
L.A. Confidential @ 40:
For me it's my wife's voice when she's in one of her naggy moods.
Dr. Hussein Matt @ 38:
FUCK! Tell me about it! But the People's Front can hear it and we are the same age (even if he/she is a lowly splitter).
Man, this makes me all cranky and...
...*GASP*....
i'm 36 and i can hear or feel high frequencies like it most of the time, so the marketing hype could stand a bit more research.
Bonkers Hussein @ 46:
Don't worry, I didn't hear it until 14.1 kHz as well. :) Years of concerts, motorcycles, and jumping out of planes have finally taken a tole on my ears.
I heard about this.. I don't know if it will cause serious hearing problems down the road or not... I certainly wouldn't believe the company line on it.... and I would certainly hope someone is keeping track of who is making, marketing and promoting this device... You know, so the suits will know to go after later after little Johnny and Janie find out their hearing is shot to hell and can prove they lived near one of these and weren't crusin 24/7 as teens in a tricked out ride with an ear splitting stereo system blowing out the neighborhood...That right there is your future litigant pool... A garage musician such as myself? Probably won't make the cut.. but then I already know how I got my tinnitus...
Mostly I'm figuring that the first time some 13 to 25 year old is actually annoyed by this and can see where it's coming from???? That will be the last time that particular device annoys those particular teens.... Does the powers that be plan on taking bb/pellet guns and slingshots off the market? What about your basic 9mm glock which is almost standard accutrement for your garden variety gang-banger... I'm sure one well placed shot from one of those, and that will be the end of that toy.... Destruction of private property and vandalism??? possible repurcussions for destroying one of these devices?? Yea, sure...No doubt about it... Like that ever stopped teens from doing something adults didn't want to them to before...
And just how many times will Mr. Wilson buy one of these things only to have Dennis the Menace destroy it before he throws in the towel... For that matter, how many times will Dennis let Mr. Wilson buy one before little Denny comes over the fence to pistolwhip the shit out of old man Wilson. Yea, I suspect this toy will foment that kind of response too. Ain't like 13 and 14 year olds are still settling things with their fists like when I was that age and keeping their grevances within their own age group... But they do still overreact to goofy shit like 13 or 14 year olds always have... Besides, this feels like auditory fascism wrapped up nice and neat in a little bowtie of 'revenge of the old folks'.... Thing is, puberty is, and has always been, and always will be, the most potent enemy of all kinds of fascism... And I think that is how this is going to play out.. Oddly enough for a guy my age, I find that reasurring and funny as hell....But then I guess I've always been a headbanger...So shoot me....JD
Did they invent one that only Liberals can hear?
# 43 General_Rennenkampf
This is why I asked -- http://www.assassinationscience.com/EMP5.htm
are you kiddin? I've had both of my ears removed and my ear canals honed out(surfers ear) and sewn back on of course. I ain't goin there.
mudshark @ 52:
You had/have exostosis? How long before you needed surgery? I've had it for about 10 years, but haven't had any problems....yet.
L.A. Confidential @ 30:
I like "sound molecules."
It is really weird though even though I have some high frequency hearing loss and tinnitus (thanks marshall) I still have super hearing. I can hear the most subtle and slight sounds. A pin drop. I can't count all the times though I wish I had either a bazooka or rocket launcher when the boom car era was in full swing and these jerks used to drive down the street at 2:30AM.
I feel sorry for kids today. It's hard enough to be a teenager without having to deal with a bunch of dumbed-down adults.
I wonder what frequency would repel republcants?
Just play a recording of someone telling a story or reciting
a philosophy that involves any truth at all.
You could probably clear out a large crowd of republicans in
minutes... all running back to their tv's and the warm fuzzy
feeling that watching Fox News gives them.
It really stinks being a teenager. It was a long, long time ago, but I remember.
Nowhere to go, nothing to do if you weren't into playing sports or had no spending money, no place to hang out with your friends without bothering people - and it always felt that our mere *presence* bothered people - we didn't even have to be noisy. It always seems like it's ok to treat kids like second-class citizens. Kids have no rights to assembly in this society - and that's always been true.
If the kids are being obnoxious? I like the Classical Music idea. It's harmless, and they'll hate it. But, heck, if they actually *like* it, they might shut up to listen! And if, you know, Vivaldi doesn't work - try Wagner Opera.
Dr. Hussein Matt @ 53:
I needed surgery 15 years before I got it.(yeah I know)
I had 98% blockage in both ears. All is good now(6 years) except for this constant itch in my canals.
I had a lot of infections, I actually went def for 2 weeks once. That was scary.
and I do have a ringing every now and then.
I'm 36 and I can hear it.
I bet it's mostly genetic and not age-based as the company says. I've always had sensitive high-frequency hearing. I could hear when people's TVs were on 50 ft from their house. (I could hear the whine of the Flyback Transformer. I later learned this. People thought I was just nuts.)
And at that pitch, around 20kHz, it's more of a feeling inside your brain than a sound. It should be outlawed. Use classical music instead.
I Like Pie @ 56:
No way I want to be a teenager again. No way. Without a doubt it's the most fu*ked up period of life.
Peer pressures, identity crisis's, competition, adults trying to force you to become something you don't want to be and never can be, bullies and idiots claiming turf, and true friends are hard to find.
12 KHz. Damn. I need to listen to some more Led Zeppelin and take a Viagra.
mudshark @ 60:
Mines constant. It's not loud it's just pretty much constant.
L.A. Confidential @ 64:
Mine starts off very low, then grows. then it just goes away.Then it starts all over again. some days it doesn't even show up.then some days it's constant. their better than they were, oh well, such is life when you get over 40( that would be 10 years ago)
this is discrimination, pure and simple. Harassment of a certain group of people based simply on their age (or hearing ability). The unfortunate twist is that this product casts its attack on the group that is least likely and least able to sue.
Can this be adjusted to keep repuglikans away?
I wouldn't worry too much if you couldn't hear the high pitch frequencies in this clip. It's youtube for crying out loud. Not exactly the ideal audio medium for such a test. Even the higher quality youtube link is an aliased mess.
To really assess your hearing, try a 96KHz uncompressed format. And make sure your headphones/speakers are up to the job. And be careful.
Work at a high school. Kids DO use the tones for texting (the rule is no cell phones in class) and it's always fun when a younger teacher hears the tone - the usual reaction is, "You're not suppose to be able to hear that." That said, I LIKE teenagers - even the surly ones; with some kindness and humor most of them behave. And they keep me from turning into a cranky old fart.
mudshark @ 65:
I've learn to deal with it. In fact sometimes I like to kickback and listen to it. I've discovered some interesting musicality almost bordering on Symphonic under some circumstances if I'm really tuned in to it.
Loonie @ 68:
Nothing personal but youtube is the worst low fidelity experience on the planet. Worse, they go mono I mean come on going stereo can't put that much additional strain on the bottom line.
Wonder if it has any effect on babies in the womb? Maybe not because they're surrounded by amniotic fluid, but until somebody knows for sure, they should probably be illegal.
Why not install a gadget around the perimeter of your yard instead that would spray skunk juice into the air? Just push a button inside the house when troublemakers congregate, and anything in your yard will tear out of there lickety split. The smell would eventually dissipate into the air.
More'n one way to skin a cat...
Damn kids. Always fooling around riding skateboards, smoking cigarettes, looking for pot, booze and sex and playing loud, bad music are more than welcome to stop by my place.
JoGoBamma(formerly Jo) @ 51:
Sounds like a bad L. Ron Hubbard novel. If those things worked like they are said to, let's just say that the Russian Federation and its allies, as well as the PRC would have discovered "clean" ways to dispose rambunctious citizens. This psychic warfare crap really does sound like something Rodenberry would have dreamed up.
Those weapons, if invented, would be a godsend to whatever autocracies could afford them, assuming that the makers aren't quacks like those idiots who worked for Hitler that tried to replicate the feat of Archimedes...
I've read about this before. What I read stated that it WILL damage hearing if the decibel level is high enough, even if people cannot hear it. That means a lot of older people will suffer hearing damage from something they cannot hear, and are therefore unaware that the damage is happening.
Are the shop owners who are using this willing to damage their own hearing to keep teens away?
It's a bad idea.
I was in a mall today that played ornate waltzes and aria to keep the teenagers out. It seems to work.
Rusty Shackleford @ 54:
Oh the wonderful sounds Mr. Brown can do; He can do it, how about you?
The Energy of the Sound Molecules traveling through The Force causing cell damage.
Boom boom boom, Mr. Brown is a wonder. Boom, boom, boom, Mr. Brown makes thunder.
lactose intolerant @ 75:
Got sources? As someone already hard of hearing, I might try to get the Hearing Loss Association of America active against this.
52 and didn't hear anything until 12 khz. I clearly remember 40 years ago when I could hear some of the chirps of bats!! It's been a long time.
I play bagpipes...
L.A. Confidential @ 71: Nothing personal but youtube is the worst low fidelity experience on the planet. Worse, they go mono I mean come on going stereo can't put that much additional strain on the bottom line.
Exactly. What these videos demonstrate is the limitations of youtube's upper audio fidelity, not the limits of your hearing.
As for the subject, it's amazing how adults will go to such measures to make the world as miserable a place as possible for kids and teens. Then they scratch their heads over issues of juvenile delinquency. What a bunch of fucking Einsteins.
annoying, high pitched, repetitive, synthesizer-like sounds used as a repellant, huh?
kinda like - the samples on a rave record? well thats CERTAIN to annoy the troublemaking youngsters into leaving!
ya I'm sure the positive results will outweigh the negativities.
We should just draft the little thugs when they turn 15. All of 'em.
50 and heard the first at 20 khz
General_Rennenkampf @ 78:
I did a bit of digging.
Prolonged exposure to sound louder than 85 decibels will cause damage.
http://www.scienceray.com/Technology/Information/How-Loud-is-Loud-Extrao...
according to their own website, the Mosquito Device operates at a decibel level between 85 and 100, depending on the model.
http://www.kidsbegone.com/Mosquito-FAQ.php#Mosquito-SoundLevel
In spite of the company's claims, this level of sound IS NOT SAFE.
32 and heard the 12khz.
This would be pretty terrible even if it worked properly. I'm 25. I shouldn't be able to go where I want? It bothers me that people assume those of a certain age bracket automatically cause problems. And I wonder how many of them would just be scared something was wrong with their ears?
i'm 27 and heard it at 12khz as well, maybe my early years as a raver have pushed it a little lower than average but who knows, i just wish i could destroy my hearing all over again.
I'm 28 and I've damaged my hearing greatly though rock concerts and such but I STILL can hear that...
lactose intolerant @ 85:
Thankee, I'll start trying to get the HLAA to take notice. And I'm under 21 for anyone who'll start cracking "grandpa" jokes about someone with membership in the Hearing Loss Association of America.
I'll have to look into the HLAA, General. I have Meniere's Disease, which is an inner ear disorder that will slowly destroy my hearing if I am not careful to prevent attacks. I'm always looking for good information about it.
i would like to thank c&l for reminding me just how old i am, as i was only able to hear the final 2 tones
arggggggggggggggh
I'm 37 and i can hear it as well. Bloody annoying.
And I have seen places using Classical music. One of the shopping malls in Yellowknife, Northwest Territories, uses it in their entrances (often used by people to stand around and smoke during the winter) cranked right up. One store in Iqaluit, Nunavut, uses it to drive off loitering kids.
And it works.
what's good for the goose is good for the gander.
lactose intolerant @ 85:
I did a bit of digging.
Prolonged exposure to sound louder than 85 decibels will cause damage.
http://www.scienceray.com/Technology/Information/How-Loud-is-Loud-Extrao...
according to their own website, the Mosquito Device operates at a decibel level between 85 and 100, depending on the model.
http://www.kidsbegone.com/Mosquito-FAQ.php#Mosquito-SoundLevel
In spite of the company's claims, this level of sound IS NOT SAFE.
PROLONGED exposure.
85 decibels is about equal to your average household vacuum cleaner, a noisy restaurant (people talking, not loud ambient music),and other common everyday things. In fact, NIOSH rates 85 dB exposure as good for 8 hours before you run the average possibility of hearing damage. The "safe" time decreases with decibels, of course. NIOSH gives 15 minutes at 100 dB, while OSHA rates it safe for 2 hours (the difference is the disagreement between NIOSH and OSHA about what level of lifetime risk for hearing impairment is acceptable).
The brief exposure of a cell phone ring or an irritating noise to get you out of a place (as long as you don't insist on hanging around for hours, every single day) has a very, very, low chance of causing permanent hearing loss.
here in the netherlands they use classical music in train station, and it work
My tinnitus sounds almost exactly like the 14.1 frequency, constantly.
44 y/o and I heard it.
I'm a 39 years old recording engineer.
I not only can hear this but i am finding that it has shown up as an artifact in one of my recordings.
The cost to re-record was about $5000.
This reminds me a lot of that "Active Denial System" which basically blasted a soundwave so horrible it made anyone in its path instantly double over in pain.
And now these high-pitched whines are being emitted and heard by everyone from ages 0-25, with many exceptions.
Why must we accept this audial assault on children, toddlers, babies, teenagers, young adults, day in and day out? The damages wreaked are incalculable.
But it's an effective "safe" tool to blindly punish anyone suspected of wrongdoing, like the ADS. A fascist state's best friend.
Prior to the onset of my high frequency tinnitus, I was very irritated by the sound emitted by the 19khz transducers used in security systems, which merchants would often leave on during business hours. This was well into my 40's, and I recently tested and found that at 57, I could still hear this sound if it was adjusted above the masking of my tinnitus. I have always believed that my hearing sensitivity made me more susceptible to tinnitus.
The information below is from the FAQ section of the web site for the Mosquito. I presume that by db they mean dbm, and there is no distance spec'd here. It could be much higher for a victim if it's mounted where someone can stand directly in front of it.
A comparison of the noise emitted by the three Mosquito™ models with common everyday sounds is as follows:
Near total silence - 0 dB
A whisper - 15 dB
Normal conversation - 60 dB
Mosquito Mark II Standard (M-85) - 85 dB
A lawnmower - 90 dB
Mosquito Mark II Maximum Volume (M-100) - 100 dB
A car horn - 110 dB
A rock concert or a jet engine - 120 dB
Mosquito Mark II Law Enforcement (M-130) - 130 dB
A gunshot or firecracker - 140 dB
sometime back somebody talked about this. they played it and I could hear it. i was over 25 at that time. the lady said she couldn't hear it. many people were able to hear it.
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