Jesse Ventura Schools Pat Buchanan on Gay Marriage
By SilentPatriot Thursday May 22, 2008 8:44pm
On "Verdict" last night, former Minnesota Governor Jesse Ventura made the perfect case as to why same-sex marriage is a civil rights issue and that the federal government has no right to tell you "who you can fall in love with." I was just waiting for Buchanan's head to explode.
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VENTURA: "Well, first of all, I made a statement when I was governor and stand by it today. Love is bigger than government. Who the hell are we as a government to tell people who you can fall in love with? I think it‘s absurd that fact it‘s even being debated. "
I couldn't have put it better myself, Governor.
Full transcript below the fold:
ABRAMS: Pat Buchanan does this become an issue in 2008?
BUCHANAN: Yes, I think it will because of the California Supreme Court decision which was a foolish decision, frankly, from the standpoint of the Democrats. The Massachusetts Supreme Court decision in 2003-2004 put the thing on the ballot in 13 states and homosexual marriage lost by 58 percent to 85 percent in Mississippi in all 13 and it killed Kerry. It won‘t be as big but it‘s an issue Barack Obama will say, “Marriage should be between a man and woman.” He will run away from it.
ABRAMS: Jesse, you‘re shaking your head.
VENTURA: Well, first of all, I made a statement when I was governor and stand by it today. Love is bigger than government. Who the hell are we as a government to tell people who you can fall in love with? I think it‘s absurd that fact it‘s even being debated.
We can solve the problem simply. Government only acknowledges civil unions then you don‘t have to put your sex down. Let the churches acknowledge marriage. They are the private sectors. If they don‘t want to acknowledge it, they have every right to do so. How on earth can we even entertain the fact that government should have the ability to tell you as an individual who you can fall in love with? Ridiculous.
ABRAMS: Jonathan, real quick. Is this going to be an issue?
ALTER: Let me disagree with Jesse.
ABRAMS: I want to - Let me say, get Jonathan, because I want to move on. I mean in 2008, this is going to become an issue.
ALTER: I think it‘s not going to be like 2004 because it‘s not going to be on the ballot in nearly as many states and in California where obviously it‘s going to get very hot.
ABRAMS: Because there‘s an economy to worry about and -
ALTER: There are a lot of more important things. But I did think it was interesting that, you know, John McCain looked here like he had taken a trip to Ellen the orthodontist - very, very uncomfortable. Even though his position is the same as Obama and Clinton‘s, but they are just more fluent in discussing it in ways that sort of bridge the gaps on this.
ABRAMS: Pat, final thought?
BUCHANAN: Well, (UNINTELLIGIBLE) marriage is a cinderblock of society. Historically, it‘s between a man and a woman. It ought to be set aside for a man and a woman. If government wants to set up civil unions and benefits for people like that, it ought to be done by elected legislators and not by un-anointed judges who are behaving more like tyrants imposing their values on us.
VENTURA: Let me throw something out. You can‘t take a civil rights issue and put it up to a vote. If you did that, we might still have slavery if it was allowed to be voted on.
BUCHANAN: Jesse what about -
(CROSS TALK)
VENTURA: (UNINTELLIGIBLE) civil rights and let people vote on it.
BUCHANAN: Well, Jesse, what are you talking about? The Civil Rights Act 1964 was voted on. The Voting Rights Act of 1965 voted on by congress.
The Open Housing Act of 1968 was done by LBJ, first went to demonstrations
by Martin Luther King. These were done by representatives -
VENTURA: Exactly.
BUCHANAN: Not by these un-elected judges.
VENTURA: Well, and not by populace itself, Pat. If the elected officials stand up for what‘s right and do what‘s right for civil rights like they did back then, I fully agree with you. But you can‘t put a civil rights issue on the general ballot in a state and let people vote on it because if do you that, in the southern states before you can bet, they would have voted to continue slavery.
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Pat Buchanan fell in love with Dick Nixon and orange hair dye.
Love vs Gov
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0GSKdC05hpA
Paul/Ventura 08
Gee Pat, are you not "behaving like a tyrant and imposing your values" on... us?
Pot, meet kettle.
Let's get the government out of the marriage business, period.
Pat still thinks gays are about nothing more than blow-jobs. He never got that they love each other.
[Deleted. Off topic-Sitemonitor]
"Who the hell are we as a government to tell people who you can fall in love with?"
Who the hell is Pat Buchanan to discuss anything. He is a feckless twit!
The government couldn't care less about the real issue. They just want it to be in play every time there's an election so they can avoid real issues and draw the simple-minded together on a lightning rod issue.
Would somebody please remind Buchanan that the US Supreme Court held up slavery and Jim Crow, too, before it finally came around and did the moral thing.
warsaw @ 7:
He needs a B.J.
Victorian Squid @ 10:
How else can they keep screwing us. Distraction!~
Marriage is an archaic practice of property transfer. The Repubs are only against gay marriage because it leaves less men for them to cruise in restrooms.
Underground Pirate @ 13:
I can see the plotters now: "If gay marriage won't do the job, American Idol will".
[Deleted. Off topic-Sitemonitor]
I apologise to Governor Ventura for judging him harshly. That's a very humanist way to think. well done.
HELL YEAH! Ventura got it right!
I wish they'd let Ventura finish his thoughts on Martin Luther King, Jr. Because I think what he meant to say was that MLK protested the Vietnam war, and the government smeared him and said it was un-American. But they cut him off before he could finish the thought. If that was what he was saying, it's something I've thought for a long time - most of these hawkish conservatives would have HATED one of the greatest civil rights leaders back in the day because he dared to stand up against their war!
If our federal government (regardless of party) has the effect of stealing our jobs, our money and our children for their wars, why does it exist?
Can we not just go to 50 independent self regulating states?
Why do we trade with the rest of the world anyway? Simply to create economic pressure on employees to keep labor cost minimized.
somebody needs to tell Pat that the judges in California ARE elected.
Gay marriage is ruining the USA. It is not the Bush administration that destroyed our way of life, it is gay marriage.
buchanan doesn't know love all
he knows is there's a hand up his butt
telling him what to think and say.....bastard pundit.
Attila the Appeaser @ 21:
no, it's miscreants like you that are destroying America.
Excellent job by the very eloquent former Governor of Minny-SO-TA. Good leadership on this subject by the current Governor of KGALEE-fornia. They're wrong on a lot of things. They're incapable of properly pronouncing the names of their own states. But at least they're secure enough in their sexuality to do the right thing on gay marriage.
I like how Buchanan tries to paint the decision of a Republican court as somehow something done by Democrats.
The one time a Republican does something right, they are painted as Democrats.
what happened to VERDICT tonight? anyone know?
they ran david gregory's show again, instead...
Attila the Appeaser @ 21:
Gay Marriage -- took my job.
Gay Marriage drives down the value of the dollar.
Gay Marriage causes mortgage rates to spiral out of control.
Gay Marriage is keeping us in Iraq.
Gay Marriage brought Katrina to New Orleans (actually, that's not snark -- they said that shit).
Gay Marriage is listening to your phone conversations. Without a warrant (or a Gay Marriage license, I might add)!
Gay Marriage made Mark Foley . . . hit on Congressional pages.
Terri Schiavo would have recovered completely if it hadn't been for Gay Marriage.
Gay Marriage causes abortions.
Gay Marriage is responsible for stem cell research.
Gay Marriage made Iran start its nuclear programs.
Gay Marriage detonated a nuclear bomb underground in North Korea.
Gay Marriage is charging $4 for a gallon of gas.
Gay Marriage outsourced your high-tech jobs to India.
Gay Marriage is why they had to close factories in Detroit.
These have been Gay Marriage facts.
so when the courts vote to allow greater rights to individuals...that is when they behave like tyrants
when the courts vote to remove rights from individuals (ie, upholding voter id laws) then they are doing what is right
and come on pat, you cant use examples of congress voting to provide rights to people on the same footing as states taking away rights from others
ventura is truly a liberatarian...i just wish he would shut up when it comes to 9/11
Attila the Appeaser @ 21:
The US must be uniquely vulnerable to the ruinous effects of gay marriage. Canada, Spain, The Netherlands, Belgium and South Africa all have it and many other countries accept some equivalent of civil union. The skies over those countries appear not to have fallen. It would have been nice to see the U.S. lead the world for once on a matter of civil rights in this century. Perhaps in the next one?
This politically liberal, theologically conservative evangelical is in total agreement with Ventura. Christians don't need the government to enforce belief. Pat's assumption that we do is insulting, frankly.
I thought these people were about shrinking government? And didn't Prohibition teach these numbnuts anything????!!!!
I will never understand how granting someone the same civil right that I enjoy somehow diminishes my right. It's not a zero sum game.
I didn't always agree with the Guv here in MN (I rolled my eyes many times), but he makes sense in this case.
whenever i get to the comment page of the hillary thread, my browser freezes up...
anyone else?
would really like to read the reactions to her major "gaffe" today...
and, no one knows why VERDICT didn't air tonight?
katy @ 34:
Comments on that thread are mercifully closed.
Jesse the body........
where's mean gene okerlin?
i'm sorry that jonathan alter suffers from only a slightly less distasteful form of the disease that afflicts buchanan and his pals.
jesse ventura got it absolutely right. it has long been my feeling that the real solution to the question of "marriage" is to let the religionists have that but only civil licenses recognized as legally binding. of course there is the question of "common law marriage" in many states. that could (and i suppose, should) be left to states to decide, as is the case currently. not to decide that one pairing is eligible or ineligible but to decide whether common law marriage should be recognized at all. what's good for the goose is good for the gander, as they say.
Peter G @ 35:
can't even READ them? and where's the NOTICE or WARNING?
i mean it freezes up... i have to quit firefox and start over... very weird!
gop wedge issue to feed the hatred of the radical right.
Charlotte @ 18:
dear charlotte: many of these hawkish conservatives in fact DID hate mlk in the day. borrow rick perlstein's "nixonland" from your local library. knowledge is the most powerful tool we have.
slippy hussein toad @ 27:
Yes, this is all true according to the President, the Vice-President and FOX NEWS....
Jesse ,
Go man Go , right again ! .
Ron / Jesse , ah truth speakers , to few understand till its to late .
slippy hussein toad @ 27:
ROFLMAO!!!
You're a funny sumbitch!
Yes, teh ghey has ruined EVERYTHING!
*contemplates never wearing purple, pink, or any off-shade of red again*
The more I see of Ventura the more I like him.
You may have a problem with your browser Katy. I can read the comments just fine. You aren't missing much though. I think the site monitors got tired of tensely hovering over the delete button and closed the thread down. The open thread will doubtless make fascinating reading tonight.
Pat Buchanan looks like every woman's ex-husband.
I don't think gay marriage will be a huge issue this year. We have these on our minds: wars, gas prices, food prices, jobs, foreclosures, paying for college tuition, incredible national debt, the falling dollar, stock market, commodity prices, home equity crashing, bridges falling apart (kudos by the way to the contractor for the state of MN for being ahead of schedule on opening the new 35W bridge this coming early Fall, just put our minds to it and people can do it)
My arguement for years. Marriage is a religious institution. Government has no place in it. To do so is to step on everyone's civil rights. One of the best ways of promoting unwanted behavior is to ban it, eg. prohibiton and the "war on drugs".
Best arguement I've heard from a pro-polygamy person was that if you let us alone these cases of abuse would be fewer.
No Keith Special Comment today. First time ever.
David N @ 42:
Obama/ Ventura. heheheheheh. Sounds good to me.
Jessie "the Body" smoked Pat right in the face!
numfar @ 43:
this must include gays are responsible for the demise of
religion in America and the creation of ALL evangelists.
The GOP has run America into the ground on every front so of course the party of division will try to scare and divert America's attention away from all the damage they have done. The 28 percenters will be conned again, I doubt thinking America will be conned again though.
Former Govenor Ventura to Nixon appointee Buchanon:
"So tell me Patsy, how many elections have you won in your political career?
[This is not John, and this thread is not about Clinton. Deleted, Off Topic. Site Monitor]
Sadly when Jesse became Gov , alot of ppl both parties painted the state as the state of fake, waste, etc.
It didint turn out like that did it? And Iam glad that Former Gov jesse speaks out and will take the nomintaion from Al franklin.
Franklin has kept his snoot shut to long and only say a year ago jumped on the band wagon. It takes balls and true grit and a beliefe of what you believe in to keep on going and never wavier from your cause on a election. Iam sad to see that Barack Obama , has swayed to match his base camp and the same for others running as well.
Put Not Your Trust In Politicians
You're sure to be disappointed
We all know John McCain is a warmonger, even if it's impolite to say so. But what about his Democratic rivals?
One day Hillary is threatening to "obliterate" Iran – a nation of some 70 million people – and the next day she's posing as the candidate who will get us out of Iraq. Well, if Iran is reduced to a radioactive crater, that will be a good reason to get our troops out of the area.
And what's up with Obama? One day he's saying that we just might have to bomb Iran, and the next thing you know he's denouncing Hillary for "saber-rattling" on the very same issue. Huh?
You just can't take candidates' promises at face value. Remember when George W. Bush was calling for "a more humble foreign policy"?
Put not your faith in politicians!
We must maintain and expand the institutions that make up the backbone of the peace movement. Politicians will disappoint you, even betray you, but there's one thing you can count on, and that's Antiwar.com.
We have been fighting the War Party for over a decade, bringing you the real news and the best commentary. Left, right, center, whatever: every day, Antiwar.com unites a wide variety of people and viewpoints in fighting to restore our Republic. We're nonpartisan, and what's more, we're nonprofit, which means your donation is tax-deductible. You can take from the War Machine and give to the Peace Machine – and doesn't that settle the question of whether to contribute?
Put your faith not in politicians, but in yourself – and in the power of the self-organizing, Internet-driven antiwar movement to effect real and lasting change.
PROVE IT WRONG FOLKS !!!
oh, but i would like to know this...
what will pat say when the constitutional amendment does not pass in cali
Apparently Mr. Buchanon doesn't remember Brown v. Board of Education. It was a fairly prominent Supreme Court (i.e. a group of unelected judges) case back in 1954 (i.e. 11 years before the Civil Rights Act). He must also think that that was a tyrannical holding by the Supreme Court.
I didn't hear Pat mention the biggest activist judicial decision ever. The trumping of American democracy with the installation of Chimpy McFlightsuit as America's dictator by 5 Republican appointed activist judges.
dadams @ 52:
Addendum to Gay Marriage Facts:
Gay Marriage took Creationism out of our schools.
Gay Marriage stops children from praying.
This has been an addendum to Gay Marriage Facts. Citizens, go about your business.
Maybe there's hope for the WWE vote afterall. Nascar next?
Ruthless People @ 59:
I predict a movement, in the near, near future, to term-limit Supreme Court Judges to 15 years or less.
It's got to be done. We cannot have 30 more years of Scalia and Alito and Roberts pissing in our judicial pool.
[Deleted. No need to copy a long post to bash the poster, who is European, over misspelling a name. It's off topic, if not rude. Please grow up-Sitemonitor]
Isn't Pat Buchanan supposed to be anti-big goverment -- and every other Repulican? Why do they want the government dictating who you can and cannot marry?
Und,, guten Nacht alles, danke for C and L ! Take care folks and danke again for a kick ass blog that allows ppl to comment without the bitch fest back log either.
Have a good morning and a even better tomorow folks.
Best regards,,,
:)
Ventura's facial expressions were priceless during that segment. I really hope he runs for Senator. I greatly prefer Ventura to Franken or Coleman.
As governor one thing Ventura did that I wish more elected officals would do is veto funding for stadiums. None have the cojones to veto funding after being subjected to the blackmail from sports teams threatening to leave if they don't get a taxpayer funded stadium.
Pat Buchanan is a racist dinosaur.
Judges don't make decisions based on whether or not it makes a political party look good or bad. (If they do they should be removed.)
They make it based on the Constitution and precident. Sometimes they overturn precident when they find reason to and sometimes when public mood shifts. (For an example of that look at how the courts have shifted over the past three decades over drunk driving.)
Pat Robertson would love to make this election about gay marriage, but he can stand on his head and whistle Dixie. This election is about Bush.
slippy hussein toad @ 61:
I saw a bumper sticker the other day "Anarchy is Democracy without the politicians".
jesse ventura doesn't believe our gov't's account of 9/11. clearly the old coot took too many hits in the rasslin' ring. why else would anyone be so uber-unpatrioc?
harley @ 66:
I like Buchanan on foreign policy but on social issues he is off the wall.
*uber-unpatriotic
[Deleted post-Sitemonitor]
EAT IT either way moron. Its from THE EU! sue us as you sue me for not being able to contain laughter , every time some bitch from the back woods here and there speak crap.
Now record the words in PERFECT GERMAN,, etc.
see ya cant so stop with the fuck factor little things wont swell alot in your life !
DANKE :)
As an expat living abroad in Europe (Belgium & the Netherland) ... It's just terrible here with all these gays getting legally married. Something should be done about it. After 14 years of this law being passed these gays have all become "normal". They settle down, buy homes and keep steady jobs thereby adding to the strong economy of Europe. Not to mention that they just blend into our neighbourhoods and live among us pretending to be one of us.
They have had the nerve to actually be driving the divorce rate "down" and establishing a whole new outlook and set of rules for the "old" institution of marriage. Some have even gone as far as legally adopting children ... can you imagine these children being exposed to warm, loving family environments? After 12 years of these children being exposed under a warm-loving gay-marriage behaviour ... results from a study has discovered that on average, children being raised in this destructive environment seem to averaging better scholastically in school as compared to children raised under the "same" two-parent heterosexual conditions. Not to mention the odd fact that these "homosexual environmental raised" children seem to excel far above average in scores measuring personalities and a full rounded well adjusted "human". But I'm sure that must be some type of flook!
Yes Uncle Pat ... Keep talking out of your arse, because we all know these gays are going to destroy the institution of marriage in America as fast as they're doing it here in Europe.
Jesse's not wearing a SUIT with NOOSE (tie)
Love It
pat buchanan's like james baker; an essentially decent republican? why does he keep getting hoodwinked by the hagee/likud lunatics?
slippy hussein toad @ 62:
Why is an unelected president even allowed to sully our courts with conservative activist judges in the first place? When Chimpy leaves office Alito and Roberts should be forced off the court.
Brian @ 71:
Isolationism?
That will not work to well when your manufactoring base is in Asia.
*republican.
(sorry, long week @ work!)
Where's Pat's flag lapel pin?
There were so many things wrong with what Pat Buchanan said, but I'll limit my comment to the most obvious.
Let me first disclose that I am a native Mississippian. I was born and raised in the state. ALL of my family still lives there.
Still, I wouldn't want ANYONE to look to my home state for pointers in how to advance or restrict civil rights, as Buchanan seemed to be suggesting by pointing out the state's 86% vote for an anti gay marriage amendment.
They have a perfect record. Their record is 100%!
100% WRONG!
Mississippi, in it's entire history, has NEVER been on the right side of a civil rights issue! Never!
Judicial activism has a very slippery definition. Any given decision by the Supreme Court is tainted by judicial activism when it offends the views of the commenting pundit. Buchanan is still somewhat upset by the thirteenth and nineteenth amendments.
What gets me is that the fact that alot of EX PATS come here and ad comments, and some pissed off sorry sour bitch has to play spell nazi.
Well live in another country for over 10 years, serve your MILITARY in another country for 15 years, and travel outside the USA for the past 4 years.
SUE ME BITCH for not spelling right, abber at least i know how to behave in another goverment. See that is what is sinking the USA! they think they are the worlds crop cream of life, but,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,its not anymore.
and as soon as you see this the more you will understand the SA trade and various other source of trades.
Now iam done,, and tired,, take care folks and once again,,,, danke C&L for a kick ass blog too!
Best regards
Friar :)
Zeke @ 82:
Mississippi produced you. It can't be all bad. :)
Ruthless People @ 78:
Unfortunately one of the mechanisms to prevent hacks and useless clods (and don't forget the incredibly unqualified Clarence Thomas who has hardly spoken a word in the Court since his installation almost 20 years ago) was supposed to be the advice and consent of the Senate. This was bullied into meaninglessness by a GOP that cried "Victim!" whenver it was convenient, and allowed to get that way by a spineless DLC whose driving philosophy of "governing from the center" actually meant "governing through caving," or as I call it, Spelunkocracy.
Jesse Ventura shows Buchanan to be a self-righteous prick.
What happened to Repubs wanting government to stay out of people's private lives? Would Buchanan like it if California held a referendum stating that Protestants could not marry? No, of course not. Then it would be government interference, and he would be happy for the courts to step in and defend civil rights.
EuroRant @ 74:
-------------------------------------------
YOUR QUITE THE SCUMBAG NAZI arent you?
I am going to dinner now. When i return i hope all the Candidates are still very much alive.
xoites defends Constitution @ 49:
i just listened to it, the 2nd time...
another excellent commentary, but i'm afraid for keith now... ... watch out, man...
Peter G @ 84:
The contortions of Scalia alone regarding his refusal to recuse himself (is tha a recusal refusal?) from hearing a case of interest to Richard B. Cheney following his participation in a duck hunt with the same Richard B. Cheney is enough, in my opinion, to build an impeachment case from. His other interpretations of the Constitution have been equally bizarre and peculiarly self-serving. Not to mention the non-precedent-forming move of the SCOTUS reaching down into the state of Florida to stop an election. The contortions in which they've engaged have been astonishing.
And don't forget, requiring a photo ID (that costs money to purchase) is NOT a poll tax, according to the Supreme Court.
Everything they've decided since 2000 needs a huge asterisk next to it, AFAIK.
Obama Ventura '08
^ gold.
slippy hussein toad @ 93:
I meant, of course, to use the acronym AFAIC. Recuse me, er, excuse me.
To quote Stephen Colbert: "I'm so sick of gays trying to destroy my happy marriage by wanting a happy marriage of their own."
Please x@76 Not on every thread. You'll have your chance on the open thread tonight brother. Hopefully they won't have to close that thread early but I'm not sanguine about it.
L.A. Confidential @ 83:
Attila the Appeaser @ 21:
No, that's a lie right there.
The Bush administration, and the people they work for (Cheney and the rest of big business) are ruining America.
The lies and hate... the destruction of the media... the attempted destruction of education... and the support of a theocracy (more like theoCRAZY)... the absolute GREED of the 1%...
... They are trying to destroy freedom and the security of people in this country. They want a police state, and for people to live in fear.
I'm sure that many people here know that the government is compiling a list that now tops over 8 MILLION United States citizens that are to be monitored, questioned, or even detained in PRISONS should this country enter martial law.
The lists include educators, writers, activists, entertainers, or just people who expressed displeasure with our current state of government.
Say... didn't they do the same thing in NAZI GERMANY?
A list of over 8 MILLION people?
Tell me that isn't scary.
I should also point out that there no way that many people could actually be detained. Use your imagination and think about how the bulk of them would be dealt with.
You all better vote carefully. None of you should forget that this is actually happening.
Buchanan another "expert" that got 3 medical exemptions from being drafted.
How all these scum bags float to the top is beyond me.
Brian @ 66:
What do they call them " sports bars " what a fucking joke , ppl sitting on stools ( love that one ) drinking and watching ppl chase balls . What a stupid way to waste your life ( oh most ppl dont have one ) and paid millions per , you envy these ppl ? , no wonder the world is in big trouble .
slippy hussein toad @ 95:
Peter G @ 45:
thanks... i can't figure it out... but i am using firefox more these days, after having so many troubles with safari quitting... probably NSA... ha...
but not being able to get to other tabs, or go back, or ANYthing, freezing, is weird - and only
when i get to the comments page, no scrolling, nuttin'...
it needs a "COMMENTS CLOSED" sign on it...
slippy hussein toad @ 92:
No problem. I very much agree on these issues. The inelegant sophistry used by the latest incarnation of SCOTUS to construct their assault on basic human rights is something future courts will have to revisit. Dred Scott was overturned and the latest nonsense will be too. Poor voters are still enfranchised Americans despite Scalia's best efforts.
slippy hussein toad @ 93:
I think an Impeachment would be a waste of time and money. The easiest solution would be for Congress to just raise the number of Supreme Court Justices to 25. Scalia could spend the rest of his days on the Supreme Court pouting in the corner.
Also...teh ghey marriage made Chuck Norris old and feeble
Attila the Appeaser @ 21:
And the fact the 50 percent of marriages end up in divorce and the devastation that does to the children of marriage is very good for the country? I hope you are just being sarcastic and not exposing your idiocy.
Ruthless People @ 59:
One of my favorite Patsy Buchanan moments was during the Kitzmiller v Dover trial of Creationism disguised as "Intelligent Design", using the Dover School Board to replace Evolution with religious dogma.
Patsy wrote an editorial on how Judge John Jones (Bush appointee) should stand up for religion against the evils of science. His editorial came out on the same day that Judge Jones ripped the Intelligent Design proponents a new one with a terse 200 page spanking.
One thing that you can say about Pat Buchanan is that he is consistently on the wrong side of history. Just like his buddy Willy Kristol.
chicano2nd @ 103:
By the way, divorce is up to 66 percent, 2 out of every 3 end up in divorce.
Brian @ 66 ,
" You envy these ppl " was not aimed @ you , rather the stool sitters , cool .
harley @ 97:
They say cream rises to the top. But so does hot-air filled excrement.
chicano2nd @ 106:
Marriage either ends in divorce or death. It is one of the few things in life that always has an unhappy ending. Best to avoid the thing all together. You can always lie and tell your stupid christian neighbors that you are married.
Would someone please let Buchanan know it isn't 1953.
Radically Moderate @ 105:
For some reason, I didn't place Buchanan as that far gone. Guess I was wrong.
Otay @ 111:
Pat Buchanan is far enough gone that all he needs to complete his image is a little square moustache and a brown shirt. He REALLY IS a fucking Nazi.
slippy hussein toad @ 60:
i thought you were being facetious, but now i believe you are an asshole.
Jesse is right on the money here. The fact that this civil rights issue is being debated is outrageous. Reduces them to second class citizens. Sometimes, Jesse sounds so refreshing and we here in MN remember why we elected him in the first place. Then he opens his mouth again and we are reminded that Ventura is a giant douche.
dadams @ 113:
Attention Citizens: Gay Marriage also deprives people of their sense of humor.
slippy hussein toad @ 95:
slippy hussein toad @ 115:
you are just here to bate everyone on and now you are boring and
i am done with you.
Let's not get carried away with the libertarian crap. Ron Paul and Jesse Ventura are right on VERY few subjects. Libertarian concepts are pretty much every man for himself. Large concepts require cooperation and sometimes agreements need to be enforced. Rights of minorities need to be protected, etc. Gay marriage and the drug war are probably the biggest rights violations not being addressed, plus the war, and Ron and Jesse are indeed right on those issues, but free market pixie dust isn't going to stop the coming depression. A nation, to be a nation, must be "we", not "I". We need to realize the value of the commons to US ourselves, and maintain it ourselves. But gay marriage is causing my hair to fall out and my back to hurt.
slippy hussein toad @ 112:
Who can forget his play on the Reform Party in 2000.
In '92 & '96, Ross Perot siphoned Libertarian and Independant votes away from GHW Bush and Bob Dole helping Clinton take the Presidency.
In 2000 Buchanan publishes a book praising Hitler, then with the help of supporters moved in and captured the Reform Party nomination. Nationwide the Reform Party was a non factor with the Exception of 1 county in Florida where he outpoled Gore 2-1.
The Reform movement died with the 2000 election, and we know what came next...........
I Like Pie @ 102:
FDR tried that and got kicked in the junk for it. We could make a case that there are a lot more Americans now and that we need more proportional representation, but then we'd have to face the ugly spectre of having to design new chambers for the House and Senate for anywhere between 807 and 10,000 members, depending on how you want to do your math.
Says: Says: Says: @ 63:
Here , Here ,
To all grammer police , attack the logic , why point out the obvious ! .
bob @ 118:
Try a different position or use a safe word.
dadams @ 117:
Oh, I'm the master bater, pal!
Where's my snare hits? Oh, dear, I'm here all week. Try the veal, folks!
Damned it Ventura didn't point to the finish line on this one.
Let all marriages be recognized as civil unions by the state, then let churches have the right to recognize them or not. Brilliant.
Brian @ 71:
racism and xenophobia. sure a great combination! That really works for you?
Make that "damned IF"
harley @ 122:
harley, you just made my night....LITERALLY Laugh out loud
CoIntelPro against Repug DoucheBaggery @ 125:
Myself, I like Pat Buchanan behind bars with an armed guard. He was one of Nixon's close advisers. Enough said.
White House advisor Buchanan urged President Nixon in an April 1969 memo not to visit "the Widow King" on the first anniversary of Martin Luther King's assassination, warning that a visit would "outrage many, many people who believe Dr. King was a fraud and a demagogue and perhaps worse.... Others consider him the Devil incarnate. Dr. King is one of the most divisive men in contemporary history." (New York Daily News, 10/1/90)
In a column sympathetic to ex-Klansman David Duke, Buchanan chided the Republican Party for overreacting to Duke and his Nazi "costume": "Take a hard look at Duke's portfolio of winning issues and expropriate those not in conflict with GOP principles, [such as] reverse discrimination against white folks." (syndicated column, 2/25/89)
On race relations in the late 1940s and early 1950s: "There were no politics to polarize us then, to magnify every slight. The 'negroes' of Washington had their public schools, restaurants, bars, movie houses, playgrounds and churches; and we had ours." (Right from the Beginning, Buchanan's 1988 autobiography, p. 131)
"There is nothing wrong with us sitting down and arguing that issue that we are a European country." (Newsday, 11/15/92)
Buchanan on affirmative action: "How, then, can the feds justify favoring sons of Hispanics over sons of white Americans who fought in World War II or Vietnam?" (syndicated column, 1/23/95)
In a September 1993 speech to the Christian Coalition, Buchanan described multiculturalism as "an across-the-board assault on our Anglo-American heritage."
"Rail as they will about 'discrimination,' women are simply not endowed by nature with the same measures of single-minded ambition and the will to succeed in the fiercely competitive world of Western capitalism." (syndicated column, 11/22/83)
Atta boy Jessie, He says what he means and means what he says, and I dare any of those limp dick spin artist to get in his face. If Jessie starts rocking back and forth in his chair, stand by.--CEO
The problem that i see here in US and Canada is that "the church" is allowed to issue legal documents. why in the world are they allowed to do that? In europe, you marry in front of the state (its representative) that issues the legal document and in front of your god (whoever that may be). There is no relation whatsoever between the two. And, obviously you are not required to do the church ceremony if you dont want to. Its completely and totally stupid to allow the church to be involved in legal business. Let the state handle that. The church is about gods and religions and crap,none of which have any room in a judge office.
Right on, Jesse. One person's discomfort doesn't trump another person's civil rights.
I'm consistently appalled by the paternalistic, insulting selfishness of the religious right.
I bet Pat Buchanon doesn't REALLY think that gay marriage will be a roadblock for the Dems. But I bet he wishes it were. it won't be. By the end of the summer, the evangelicals will rather hold gay wedding services than see a Republican in the White House.
I applaud Jesse 'the Mind' Ventura for cutting to the heart of the meat of the bone on this particular issue. He says it in a way that simply can't be fucked with. Who is the government to dictate who one can and can't fall in love with? What the FUCK is 'the pursuit of happiness', if it isn't to get busy with / married to, the person you fall in love with?
I should say, those evangelicals who don't live in mansions and go to church in a hummer driven by a bodyguard.
Does anyone else see Gargamel instead Pat Buchanan? LOL, he's become a caricature of himself!
This is such an obvious truth, it's stunning that people still don't get it. Government, in terms of how people personally interact, is ONLY interested in two things: Disposition of Property and Enforcement of Contracts. Period. Marriage is one of those medieval holdouts, an atavistic remnant. Marriage refers to metaphysical concepts of love and devotion and Stuff Like That. Stuff that Government is NOT equipped to measure or legislate. Hence: the government should not recognise ANY marriages. It would work like that - it's a CONTRACT (something government is good at enforcing), so: two people enter a DOMESTIC CONTRACT, and they get (x) set of rights as a "couple", most of them having to do with property and other contracts. That's It. So if a couple of guys (or a couple of girls) want to get married, they can fill out their DOMESTIC CONTRACTS, file them with the state, and then go to the Holy Rolling Gay Lesbian Transgendered and everything inbetween Holiness Church of the Presumptuous Assumption of the Blinding Light, and GET MARRIED. And I say, good for them. And the neoNazi white knuckled hetero couple can fill out their DOMESTIC CONTRACTS, file them with the state, and then go to the Holiness Right Wing Zealots for Jesus Church and GET MARRIED. And I say - good for them, too. Everyone needs to be loved, and if the way a couple does it is with butt f*cking happy happy joy joy, or rug munching yumminess, or Missionary Baby Batter Insertion Methods - whatever floats their boat is fine by me, because that's what FREEDOM is all about - you know - that consenting adult thing...
The Body is dead-on (as usual).
However, I was afraid that Pat was going to go for that disgusting GOP slippery slope by invoking pedophilia, incest, or beastiality.
But Pat, as usual, is a pompous and clueless horses ass. He thinks the only reason people commit crimes is because their parents got divorced.
As to why MSNBC would CONTINUE to put this guy on ALMOST EVERY SINGLE FUCKING SHOW is simply beyond me. He's boring and his Leave It To Beaver worldview is representative of a non-existant time in American history.
I've said it before. MSNBC tries hard, but they deserve all the ratings ass-kickings they get--as long as they continue with this motley crue of fuckwits (Scar, Tweety, Patsy, etc., etc.)
You should also put up the video of Ventura schooling Michael Reagan about the Iraq war. "That's great Michael, you visited the Hospital, now why don't you and the rest of the chickenhawks go and fight the war?"
Everyone is forgetting that the California Supreme Court judges ARE elected by popular vote. Therefore, his argument is at the very least uninformed and at best wrong.
did pat say that the ratio was 85% to 58%?
that's 143%
pat is dumber than a sack of doorknobs.
Pericles @ 139:
where is it?
Progressive?
Ventura is absolutely on the money here...yet still...a vast majority of the "progressvies" here do nothign but smear him.
Why is it that the right-wing is hated so much? Oh thats right, becaue the farleft is identical to it in ideology and hypocrisy.
Forget facts, forget whats right or wrong, just focus on whether there is a [D] or an [R] next to a persons name, and base all decisions on that.
America deserves everything it has coming.
FreedomofSpeech
Do you know what progressive means? You'd do a lot better if you didn't get your definitions from Bill O'Really...
FreedomofSpeech? @ 143:
Er, I'm looking back through what's been written here, and I"m not seeing too many people "smearing" Ventura. Actually, the majority of comments here seem to be acknowledging how correct he is on this. There's plenty of slamming Buchanan, but then, he's totally wrong on this one. Your complaint sure doesn't seem to be backed up by the evidence here.
In fact, people seem to be focusing on the words each man has spoken, rather than dismissing anyone offhand. I don't know how that can be perceived as ideological or hypocritical.
Would you like to try that one again?
FreedomOfSpeech
just in case you were wondering, the definition is:
Man those fringe radicals, what an evil philosophy...
Charlotte @ 18:
Jesse was a Navy SEAL in the Vietnam war. He would have been involved with the very toughest missions of any group there. It has given him a very humanistic view of the world.
Ventura for President!
Good on you Jesse!
I didn't realize that buchanan was such an intolerant religious nut - or is he just being the asshole that he usually is in his role as pundit?
Funny how the repukes and their sycophants (e.g., buchanan) want government out of people's lives, but only until it comes to something like gay rights, or racial equality. Then they want to control, control, control. What are these bigoted people afraid of?
it is no wonder to me that people voted for Jesse.
Every so often he comes out with something, like this, that is so crystal clear.
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