A question for John McCain about honoring the troops
By John Amato Tuesday May 27, 2008 1:30pm 
You keep saying that you'll bring the troops home with honor. When have they not been honored? Can you please give examples? C&L and many other sites fight everyday for the rights of our troops, their health care, benefits and the conditions of Walter Reed. And the best way I know how to fight for them is to never send them to war without a true cause and bring them home now so their families can see them alive and healthy. You are against Sen Webb's GI Bill not because it doesn't give them adequate compensation for their service, but as you say, it will lead to many more troops leaving the armed forces sooner:
They are very hard to replace. Encouraging people to choose to not become noncommissioned officers would hurt the military and our country very badly." McCain argues his bill would have a smaller impact on retention rates than the legislation that the Senate passed.
Is that an honorable argument?
Login or Register to post comments.
Only in the alternate republican universe....
Honorable argument? No.
Predictable? Yes.
the only thing you need to know is, mccain say he will never surrender iraq!
"Is that an honorable argument?"
Can any Republican these days claim honorability? Certainly not Mr. McSame. Political convenience trumps honor in elephant territory.
honor is a term created by aristocrats so they could legally kill each other.
honor is term used to soften the reality of killing innocent women and children.
honor makes poor and middle class kids fight and die for the benefit of people that hate them.
tyree @ 3:
And we all remember how he single-handedly took Baghdad and captured Saddam in the process............
You know, those troops will eventually leave anyway especially when word gets to them about McCain's consistent opposition to the increases in benefits they are suppose to receive after they get out. Family members and others will let them know. Its only a matter of time. McCain’s arguments never have and never will make any sense.
When is someone gonna' ask McLobbyistsBestFriend where the "honor" is in an illegal invasion and occupation that he still stupidly supports ?
I think that dead soldiers coming home in the cargo hold with no television coverage is dishonoring them. Maybe John McC will allow the news to show them coming home their last time.
McCain Blooger Alert!!!
We really need to start referring to this as what it is....."Bush's War"....that way when he's gone we can stop all of this "retreat" talk and "cut and run" BS and work to end this disaster. END BUSH'S WAR!!!! He made this mess now let's stop this idiocy and clean up what HE screwed up.
BobD @ 10:
And showing caskets that could have easily been avoided in an illegal invasion and occupation is honorable how ?
McCain shorter: Keep 'em stupid and enslaved.
Republicans, ppphhhh!!!!
And, another thing, isn't that the same crap that Nixon was shoveling and why he kept soldiers dying in Vietnam for YEARS after he KNEW the war was unwinnable? How many people will have to die for McCain to figure out how to leave with "honor"? Leaving in a box ain't all that honorable.
Republicans, pppphhhhh!!!
McBush got a free education, but doesn't want anyone else to. What a scumbag. He's not a hero.
It's a disgusting argument that boils down to wanting to limit opportunities so that there will always be a steady supply of "volunteers" who have few options between joining the military or working at Wal-Mart.
A question for John McCain about honoring the troops
He has his flag on half-mast
On his britches.
MCMetal @ 17:
Because the soldier inside that box is an American that served his/her country and should not be ignored and slipped in the back door. By ignoring them and their service the message is that they failed their country. How is that be honorable to them?
tyree @ 3:
bush started the war, we did not go in to fight an enemy,
he went in to steal their oil.
BobD @ 45:
Our troops are not in Iraq because of America's or our population's benefit ; they are there for oil and to enrich the already wealthy in charge of the military industrial complex and those given no-bid contracts , regardless of the (in)abilities and(in)competence...............There is simply nothing honorable about that.
and to answer the question," when were the troops not honored?"
bush dishonors the troops everytime one of the brave troops
returns home in a coffin and bush refuses to allow the press
or anyone see the coffins as bush has them snuk into the country.
Regardless of the benefits they receive (or don't receive), our soldiers still fight because they want to help keep our nation safe against enemies foreign and domestic. Our soldiers still fight because they want to serve their nation. Our soldiers still fight because they are patriots.
I borrowed this from Senate Guru for those who did not get to read it. I thought it addresses this issue pretty well.
What might actually hurt retention is sending our troops into battle without proper body armor. What might actually hurt retention is forcing our troops to bathe in unsanitary water so that Bush-Cheney's corporate cronies can make a few bucks. What might actually hurt retention is VA medical services that don't adequately serve our veterans.
I see nothing honorable about sending the troops to that hell we have created in Iraq over and over again. There are kids who have grown up and started school while their moms or dads have been sent to fight this god awful war time and time again.
Any soldier who wants the hell out of this mess will hear no criticism from me.
McCain says he knows all about being a vet and all that stuff. If he were sincere about his concern for vets he would treat them with respect and get their asses out of Iraq as safely and quickly as possible. He would also give them whatever they needed to get their lives back to some sort of normalcy after they return, whatever that might be.
McCains argument has no honor but why should it... McCain, the man has no honor.... Whatever honor he may or may not have had he pissed away years ago trying to get ahead in politics...JD
MCMetal @ 51:
I agree the war is wrong, actually heinous. Our country may never be seen the same again by the rest of the world, or by ourselves. But the grunts, the soldiers are there on orders. The ones to blame are the ones making the orders. If a soldier dies on the field they should come home to full military honors, not be ignored, as they are currently.
The soldiers didn't start the war, the greedy SOB in the WH did. Dishonor his sorry ass, Impeach him, but salute and recognize the soldier.
Support the troops
Send them back to Iraq so the terraists have another shot at them.
Would someone please step up and tell everyone to stop feeding GABA the troll...?
BobD @ 64:
The way to honor our soldiers is to bring them home ; end of story.
My spiritual mentors:
http://www.blazesoftball.com/images/statler_waldorf_02_01.jpg
Precious cannon fodder; hard to replace. The American people aren't completely dumb, Senator.
Joel @ 70:
I completely agree.
my father is a korean war vet who went to college on the gi bill....he thinks that both mcshame and bush are pigs...that is what he said...pigs
and my dad never talks like that
if any gi or vet votes republican in the upcoming election, then you know they have been giving mind altering drugs to our men and women in uniform
Does john mccain polish his helmet?
What does this have to do with john mccain honoring the troops?
Especially on my way to and from the bar .........
ysbaddaden @ 108:
Not a goddamn thing
I used to have a t-shirt that I had lettered on the back, I'm a Born-Again Heathen.
marko @ 5:
You know the difference between honor with patriotism. Patriotism is dying for your country and having your name misspelled in your local home town newspaper. Honor is being gullible enough to buy into patriotism.
Is there a list somewhere of McSame's voting record on funding, etc. for the military? I probably shouldn't ask because I assume that it's a 100% pro-support record. (I don't mean war funding etc. I mean salary, benefits, safety, etc. for Service men and women)
Of course it isn't honorable, and McCain (alas) is not an honorable man. The campaign is going to get vile and very dirty -- from McCain's side. And when he loses the election -- deservedly -- he will also have lost the shadow of the last tattered shred of the honor he won through his suffering in Vietnam.
It's a real shame, but it's his choice. The pursuit of Honor ennobles. The pursuit of Power corrupts. And so it goes.
votingvet @ 144:
excellent post. right on, the 'last shred' comment is correct. considering how he has sold his soul in order to be elected president he isnt even recognizable as the McCain we saw in 2000. he is nothing.
There are those who learn to keep their position by gaming the system, raising false questions and objections, and it's a fair charge to make at someone like mccain, who's running as a maveric and a war hero, when the issue involves our American soldiery.
Wow, I missed the fun. I ask a question about McCain and suddenly I've twisted his words. haha...Listen, stop the flame war or deletions and banning will take place...
John Amato @ 149:
Ok sir
Just say nay:
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y226/the_maryhunter/Horses_ass_1.jpg
Dr. Acula @ 137:
Only John Belushi in Animal House was on a mission from God.
Actually, the line is from The Blues Brothers, and Dan Ackroyd usually said the line.
I like that nun from hell.
Dr. Acula @ 137:
That was The Blues Brothers, wasn't it?
thanks for the correction, Ysb -- Blues Bros it was.
L8r.
The only honor mccain would bring the troops home with is honor guards
That's who accompanies the corpses.
While the new and improved GI Bill may cause some folks to get out at the earliest time possible (as opposed to the fiasco that is the Iraq War and the war on terrorism in general, which I guess McCain assumes is causing people to stay in forever) people still need to join the military in the first place in order to benefit from the new GI Bill.
:(
[You and McMetal have earned a little time out in moderation. Because of the 190 or so comments in this thread, over 140 of them belong or refer to the two of you. I need to go through and decide which are off topic, insulting and/or abusive.
And the rest of you, QUIT QUOTING THEM-Sitemonitor]
Interesting how my post about religion has been stricken from this thread, even though it was very civil and rational.
[Sorry, there are two site monitors here, and we seem to be stepping on each other's toes. I've got some good news and some bad news. The good news is that we've got this off topic flamewar under control now. The bad news is that, in trying to suppress the flames, this Site Monitor deleted the last 19 comments with any reference to the commenter who drove this thread to a screeching halt. Yours may have been one of the deleted. Sincerest apologies, Site Monitor]
[ps- a reminder to all: the topic is McCain and how he honors the troops. Discuss. :D Site Monitor]
It seems McCain hates America. No FLAG PIN
Site Monitor:
Thanks for the explanation. Much appreciated!
Sorry, I should have looked a little sooner rekroc. I don't mind people calling me out, but dumb flame wars aren't allowed..:-)
If mccain honored the troops as much as he does money, we would be far better off--CEO
GI Bill to GI Joe
"Why can't I quit you?"
LOL
Don't feel too bad, rekroc. Even though GABA and I never reeeally got into and ended on a pretty civil note, I got wiped, too. Har. Way it goes.
Say SM,
I was wondering:
When a submitted comment goes into "moderation" does that mean the whole thread is being monitored or has one's name been flagged, temporarily or otherwise? Thanks!
[Flagging a name- not yours- that caused a lot of trouble today. Just want to make sure no one drives another thread off of a cliff. Site Monitor.]
Bonkers @ 59:
Ah! Thank you. Yes, my name was in the mix with the other two for a bit, though not at the same level; just quoting posts.
I don't pretend to be an angel 100% of the time, but I try to keep it somewhere near civil and failing that often just pull the ripcord on myself.
Thanks for the clarification. Good to know the rules and processes.
McSame does not want to see the war critic's names on the Bill. he wants his own Bill. This guy is a FRAUD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This is so frustrating. I am in the military. Have been for 7 years. I enlisted to see the world and I have. The condescension implicit in his argument is that us poor folk, forced by our station in life, are just biding our time, risking our lives for mere lack of civilian opportunity. Are you kidding me?
The frustrating part is why this is not a stronger talking point.
Someone (Obama and every Dem), must point out that McCain is imploring that opportunities should be limited in order to keep the lowly enlisted ranks appropriately stuck where they belong.
If his overriding concern is retention, shouldn't a policy of smart warfare, as in avoiding dumb wars take precedence over how we reward our vets?
Why does no one pick up on this?
Full disclosure: I do plan on getting out, especially if this bill becomes law. I'll go to school without financially burdening my family, then I'll probably rejoin as an officer because the military needs educated people as a way of improving the ranks.
When I was in the U.S. Army in the 60's, many volunteers enlisted (for 3 years) because the GI Bill was the only way they could affrd to get a university degree. They did
their 3 years, and then came home and entered the university. The GI Bill enticed more men and women to enlist in the armed forces than the services could have recruited without offering this inducement.
The end result was more volunteer recruits, a better quality of volunteers (more intelligent, more success motivated), and more university graduates to make positive contributions to our society--a stronger military and a stronger, better educated nation overall.
What do we have today? An undermanned all-volunteer miltary that the Republicans consistentily spit on and, due to a shortage of volunteers, a lowering of standards for new recruits. A low IQ and a criminal record are now as permittable for recruits as they are for their current Commander in Chief. And the Republican pig presidential candidate who was imprisoned as a war criminal for dropping bombs on innocent civilians from 30,000 wants to continue to weaken our military.
When I was in the U.S. Army in the 60's, many volunteers enlisted (for 3 years) because the GI Bill was the only way they could affrd to get a university degree. They did
their 3 years, and then came home and entered the university. The GI Bill enticed more men and women to enlist in the armed forces than the services could have recruited without offering this inducement.
The end result was more volunteer recruits, a better quality of volunteers (more intelligent, more success motivated), and more university graduates to make positive contributions to our society--a stronger military and a stronger, better educated nation overall.
What do we have today? An undermanned all-volunteer miltary that the Republicans consistentily spit on and, due to a shortage of volunteers, a lowering of standards for new recruits. A low IQ and a criminal record are now as permittable for recruits as they are for their current Commander in Chief. And the Republican pig presidential candidate who was imprisoned as a war criminal for dropping bombs on innocent civilians from 30,000 feet wants to continue to weaken our military.
No Flag Pin!
[ edited, Please, no yelling.Site Monitor]
.
How McHonorable of him... NO?
.
To paraphrase Country Joe & The Fish's "Fixin to Die' rag ,
"Be the first one on your block to have your boy come home in a box
That one, two, three, what are we fighting for, I don't give a damn, next stop will be...Iran
There ain't no time to wonder why, whoopie, we're all gonna die"
There seems to be an almost Soviet Union style approach to the military amongst American wingnuts, in the glorification of military power, an eagerness to use it, yet a total disregard to the value of the life of the individual soldier...
Login or Register to post comments.