The Daily Show: Ben Wattenberg Thinks More People Would Consider Themselves NeoCons If You Labeled It "Chocolate"
By Nicole Belle Wednesday Jul 30, 2008 5:40pm
If that isn't a perfect microcosm of the muddied thinking of a neo-conservative, I don't know what is. It's the conservatives that suffer from bad p.r., that's all. It has nothing to do with the fact that their policies have been proven to either not work or just be monumentally bad for most of the country...they're so secure that their belief system is right that the only problem is they just don't have a good branding. Call it "chocolate" and immediately 65-70% of the people would want to be them.
PBS host of Think Tank Ben Wattenberg makes the very serious misjudgment of appearing on The Daily Show to push his book, Fighting Words, with his vague talking points that just don't hold up to Jon Stewart's logic, and the only thing he can say to Stewart is "be serious now." Dude, you're on Comedy Central and it's clear who the only clown on that stage was.
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thanks for posting this- it was astounding...lucky for us we have Jon to set him straight....
What a douchebag. Couldn't believe he would actually spew forth that drivel to Jon Stewart. Guess he thought that all Jews think the same.
yes... stewart shredded this old fascist douche without him even knowing what happened...
love the daily show...
That guy was a joke.
Why is it that the modern conservative movement thinks that if they just package everything right, they can sell it to anyone?
I guess if we called horseshit "chocolate" as well, more people would buy it right?
His repeated use of the phrase "be serious" as a deflection to Stewart's arguments illustrates a very clear, very disturbing element in the underlying reality of the neo-con brain: facts are jokes to these people.
Absolutely ANYTHING which doesn't line up with their ideas and agendas MUST be in jest. After all, the right is always right, right?
I saw this last night! "Dude, you're on Comedy Central" would have been the perfect line in response to the request to be serious! I noticed that Wattenberg was very careful to say "the way *I* read the polls [blah, blah, most people would be neoconservatives]." Of course that's total nonsense and Wattenberg must know it or he'd just say that the polls SHOW that most people actually support neoconservative positions. He was pretty much admitting that there's funny logic/math/reading skills involved in how he is interpreting the polls. The way *I* read the polls, indeed.
What a crazy nut-job!
Jon was not letting him get to first base with this bs. Kudos, JS!
I think Jon should have as many neocons as he can book on his show. They always underestimate him and he never fails to eviscerate every single one of them.
Don't watch TV.
My take: Jon Stewart is in the entertainment business.
He's like Fox, just the other end of the political spectrum.
"Chocolate was never the basis for an invasion of Iraq".
Apparently Wattenburg was never taught that bringing a butter knife to a gun fight isn't a very bright idea.
I think it would hurt the sales of chocolate if everyone thought that eating it would make you go insane, say bizarre things, and attack your neighbors without provocation.
VietVet8666 @ 10:
Ah yes, but unlike Fox, he never claims to be a journalist or "fair and balanced."
My, the trolls are out today! Is McCain doubling his points for infiltrating the "lefties?" I hear that Official McCain Campaign Cheese Serving Tray is quite the prize!
Love the show and the work that he has done, but this clip kind of kills me. Why can't Jon be like this with other more prominent guests? The guy deserved what he got, but where does this Jon go when not infront of a whacked out old guy? Better yet, why can't he be like this with the other whacked out old guy, you know, the one running for President?
yeah i saw that. that old dude was crazy "seriously"
This has no excuse. You can't polish a turd, and the invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan both were turds. Repackaging the turd as "Chocolate mousse," convinces nobody but the propaganda people.
Neo conservative's got a bum rap? are you kidding?
anybody else notice how when Jon Stewart brings up a good point - this asshole says "I'm being serious" -
you are a certainly serious about they bullshit you spew Wattenberg!
My girlfriend and I were literally cheering the screen last night! I love it when Jon Stewart gets all aggro! He's logical, rational, and no neo can ever best him! Why is it that our best liberal pundit (aside possibly from Rachel Maddow) is on a comedy show, when the unfunny guys who talk us into wars and bad fiscal policy can't even debate well?
I almost felt bad for Mr. Wattenberg, though. It's hard to see an old man get called on his shit. But damn, does his shit stink.
How the hell did Wattenberg write a book using talking points from 2002? And what show did he think he was going on, Carrot Top's?
I wanna be a chocolate, I wanna be a chocolate!!!!
Progressive Libertarian @ 6:
Jon did say something to that effect when he reminded him he was the one who brought a laser beam hat to the show.
This was great....It was classic Jon Stewart just doing his deal and Wattenberg never knew what hit him..Wasn't quite as bad as Jon destroying Chris Tweety-Bird Mathews but close...
I've never heard this guy before, but seeing all the pictures on the PBS site and his appearance in the clip, something struck me: does this guy EVER properly wear his fucking glasses?! Seriously. Is he trying to make himself look more intelligent by using them as a fashion accessory? I bet he wears contacts too.
And people with two brain cells to rub together watch that guy and buy what he is selling? oh my gawd....no way anyone buys into his bullshittery..no way.
Long live Jon Stewart!!!
Life is like a box of chocolates; you never know what you are going to get.
Well, I get it. Forest Gump is sitting in the White House. No wonder shit is so fucked up.
Is Jon Stewart really liberal? I never felt that he was. I always saw him as a bullshit-radar, and it should be no surprise that it bleeps louder around Republicans.
It was almost painful to watch Stewart deconstruct those pathetic arguments. You could see an element of anger in Stewart's demeanor and he clearly had to bite his tongue precisely because he was in danger of becoming serious.
I Like Pie @ 25:
"Life is like a box of chocolates: after two or three of them, you get sick." -- if Forest Gump was a Buddhist
I think the guy meant 'fudge', as in packing it.
i saw this last night and now we know why we
have the 29%'ers. this guy is f#cking nuts.
he needs to be locked away AND give a lobotomy.
Oh, lest they forget how Stewart DESTROYED Tucker Carlson on Crossfire!!! It is a sad, sad, SAD state of affairs that we get sharper political discourse on Comedy Central than CNN.
BTW, this guy's "let's call it chocolate" premise reminds me of a Lincoln quote:
Lincoln: "If you called a sheep's tail a leg, how many legs would it then have?"
Guest: "Five?"
Lincoln: "No, four. Calling a tail a leg doesn't make it a leg!"
One thing most people ignore is that this man is one of the founders of the neocon movement.
Neocon = Fascist Zionist.
There is little debate on this point. These people aren't using America's power for our own best interest. They are using it for theirs. And if you think the phrase fascist Zionist is contradictory, then look up the definition of a fascist. These people are very dangerous, don't ever underestimate the things they will do to accomplish their goals.
Katie at 13
appreciate your view
the troll comment is puzzling, however
assume it applies to someone other than me (although if someone wants to call me a troll, so be it)
have always, since childhood, thought the term "troll" applied to a creature who lives under a bridge
i live in a pretty good house in CT
like bridges, but never have lived beneath them
like good government
tend to dismiss labels
find party labels create pavlov reactions
Why does this bumbling clown keep telling Jon Stewart, "Now now, be serious."
Take your laser hat and go home, old fool!
After watching this "PBS" guy you can see why the network was so easily infiltrated with cranks. This guy would make chocolate in his pants if he had to go through a pittance of what the poor Iraqis had to endure while in liberation mode - which is still happening. They should first bomb, then raze, then partition his neighborhood with his ilk being the odd scum out. His lastdays spent in a refugee camp in a foreign land would be too good for him.
I Like Pie @ 25:
don't insult forest gump. chimpy in the whitehouse has
an IQ close to partially dried jackass crap.
Jon: " I read the book. I enjoyed it. I actually enjoyed it."
Always throwing away a perfectly good deconstruction of a neocon argument by giving them an inch towards the end. Why the hell would any rational person say that they enjoyed reading that tripe?
Stewart cut through this old fart's nutjob blather like a surgeon's scalpel!
Soon to be marketed by Ron Popel, The Stewart Slicer-Dicer, it cuts, it peels, it'll even core your apples!
VietVet8666 @ 33:
Look, if you're going to equate Jon Stewart with the Fox Network, I'm not going to buy this "tend to dismiss labels" crap. Their functions are completely different: JS to bring his brand of logic to current issues without claiming an objective viewpoint vs. Fox News who gets their "opinions" directly from the White House. As an entertainer, Stewart does infinitely better journalism than Fox "News." Dismissing THAT points to troll-dom. Sorry, just call 'em like I see 'em.
Jon Stewart's almost always a devastating interviewer. He actually seems to understand what he reads pretty well...asks good questions...gets under people's skins a little...dick cavett was the last guy to do that, well.
I usually switch off the celeb guests. Go catch the near-by L&O franchise episodes of which are still usually fresh after 18-19 minutes.
Colbert's material usually cant sustain a whole show. though i gotta admit sometimes he's sooo right-on. E.g., on torture.
navyswan @ 37:
Maybe he did enjoy it in a quasi-faceatious way. After all, the guest himself called it a tale, a "yarn"... you know, FICTION.
Another fuck wit.
The biggest thing that came across to me was how restrained Jon was being with this clown. I really thought he'd blow it a few times, but ever the professional, he maintained his affability despite the fucking mind-buggeringly ludicrious things this ill informed goose was sprouting.
in his professional persona, i would say jon stewart was a-partisan, not caring particularly what exaggerated oxen he's goring, as it were...if obama gets in, and if as i am utterly certain he will be, he is unable to get past GOP intransigence in Congress and the residues of Bush loyalism remaining behind like cum-stains in the carpets of the whole, politicized Federal bureaucracy, stewart will launch barbs in obama's direction too, i imagine,. be really surprised if he didn't...
Interesting that he would say substitute chocolate for neocon. He probably knows deep down that there's no way a half melted vanilla will be elected so he needs to make a connection now.
Spoiled Old Men who are fucking it up for the rest of us.
Hopefully, Obama won't give him the fodder. Stuart will set his sights on media and congressional right-wing douchebags.
Jon and Stephen do such a better job than ANYONE interviewing in the MSM and cable news and they are quick, armed with facts, and often humerous at the expense of the fools that duel with them (of course as Colbert is playing a REPUG/CONS that doesn't always make me happy)...Elizabeth Edwards was the BEST against him...course she's another of those smart, articulate women..you know the kind AMERICA LOVES!!!
Progressive Libertarian @ 6:
No, that would have been the wrong line to use. It would have been an admission that Jon *wasn't* being serious (ie, "No, I won't be serious, because this is a comedy show"), when he clearly was. The light-up cap line was a perfect retort: taking Wattenberg down a peg, and highlighting the fact that Jon wasn't joking around.
Game, set and match. Thanks Jon.
Mmmmmm.....chocolate!
Man, I haven't seen that old coot since Barney Miller!
3 words:
1. Old
2. Folks
3. Home
I Like Pie @ 25:
Exactly.
If it's left to comedians and parodists to take on the incoherent ramblings of a senile, muddled arch-conservative, where does that leave the Fourth Estate and the Congress?
chocolate? i thought everyone wanted to be an oscar mayer wiener?
either way, a "feel-good" political ideology if ever there was one. look who's a hippy now!
its about time you people stop lumping everyone whos old into the enemy, guess you feel your not going to get old someday , not everyone who reaches old age is senile or setting around in a nurseing home in a wheelchair slobbering , and as far as euthenation goes this aint germany 1939 or is that whats next for your adgenda?
"PBS host of Think Tank Ben Wattenberg"
I wondered who that crazy old bastard was.
VietVet8666 @ 10:
Exactly! The end with the facts.
how come the video doesnt work? I tried it in firefox and iexplore
Man, it's infuriating to think that idiots like this have been allowed to shape such important policies which have disastrously impacted so much of the world.
Couldn't of been fun for Stewart- he seems more like 2 pd test bluebottle fly catch 'n release type- if ol' Ben was a fish he'd have to have to contact the game warden about possible wierd stuff in the water.
Mind- if ol' Ben was a hound most anyone would know what to do. I couldn't watch it all. Friend of mine asked me if it was the worst Daily Show ever- I declined on account of I missed about half the first decade so that's a third or so- but even those odds don't look good for Ben: Stewart wouldn't of made to 10 with klinkers like last night. Still- all of us have an old Ben or two in our lives or down at the barbershop or hangin around the courthouse or in our back upstairs attic - so I kinda hope theres a decent rest home for worn out authoritarians- or maybe once the American Heritage folks move all that equipment out of the sub-basement...
Tell you what tho- I'm not up there with Ben yet but I'm getting close & what ticks me off most about him is when TV started across the bridge in Windsor the Canadian TV station- all one of them- had this show called Fighting Words & the host there was a Jewish fella too but not a crazy coot like Ben- Nathan Cohen was his name- I always thought old Bill Buckley stole the format for his show from Cohen but just changed the name- & of the politics of course: Bill figured there was big money in winger intellectual fakery- but Cohen was a real intellectual & no winger- so he must of been cancelled.
On second thought Ben stole the name from Cohen's show. Now I'm pissed- wheres my fishbat?
SheepRock @ 60:
You can also go to: http://www.thedailyshow.com/ and watch it there.
"Aye, and if my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a wagon." - Montgomery Scott
VietVet8666 @ 10:
So if you don't watch VT then how can you talk about FOX and the Daily Show...
Could also tell that Stewart was pulling his punches. Probably didn't want to give the guy a heart attack.
Ben is the epitome of McGrampa's base.
Using his perverse logic, the reich-wing can label anything and anyone they don't like a terrorist or terrorism.
finally those scum squats got the bum's rush, way to go Jon!
Coundnt resist this, slightly off topic but an indicator of how Police and Sheriff departments hire their staff.
This explain why so many apparent morons end up as law enforcement officers, and then we have the subsequent taser and other forces brutality.
They want to hire Mongos
Combine criminality, lack of morals and low intelligence.
If its good enough for Iraq then its good enough for Main Street USA
I'm certain that I'm not the first person to say this, but...
We need no clearer sign that our nation is in deep peril than when comedians are our voices of reason while politicians speak utter nonsense.
What the hell does it take to be a "neo-conservative" or "conservative" "intellectual"?????! Seriously, I have yet to hear a single thing from any of these people that would show that they have a high level of intelligence, I have yet to hear a point that would make me think twice about a damn thing, and I do have an open mind.
This guy brings up elections in Iraq. Does he bring up the fact that the US BLOCKED the elections in Iraq and tried to install puppets into government? That the US was forced to allow Iraqis to have elections after massive civil disobedience and only after the CPA put in economic policies (in opposition to international law, including the handling of Iraq's debt) that not only destroyed Iraq's economy but was done in the most un-democratic way possible, to the point that the Iraqi chamber of commerce was even outraged? Did he talk about the effects of those horrific policies? How about the fact that the Bremer orders are, according to the US, binding on all future Iraqi governments? Is THAT a "democracy" to this “intellectual”? The over a million Iraqi deaths, millions of displaced people, the ethnic cleansing, the regression of rights for women since the invasion, the thousands of tons of depleted uranium we've dropped on them, the hospitals that we bombed, the huge number of journalists killed by US troops?
How about the massive fraud? The billions of dollars of tax payer money missing? The fact that Bremer's CPA can't even account for much of any of the money they were given. Honestly, I am sick to my stomach that goons like this are the "brains" behind the policies of this government, but not surprised. I hope he and people like him rot in hell for what they've done.
If anyone wants to see a neo-con intellectual get their ass handed to them, listen to this debate between Chomsky and Richard Perle, the neocon war profiteer. It’s from 1988 I believe, and is about Israel/Nicaragua, etc. The debate was laughably one sided, by the end Perle just mumbled to himself and the audience wound up laughing at him.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XxRrNkivydU&feature=related
Here’s a recent article by that same Perle where it talks about his profiting off of a Kurdish oil plan:
http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/07/29/10679/
VietVet8666 @ 10:
yet he is the only one who is asking the right questions
That was brilliant.
Does anyone have a link to the extended video of when Jon Stewart smashed Douglas Feith on the Daily Show?
navyswan @ 37:
I think you can see his tongue planted firmly in his cheek. And he got a parting shot when he replied to Ben's request for a blurb...
It always amazes me how Jon rips these guys to shreds and has them smiling and shaking his hand for it at the end. Truly a master.
ferrofluid @ 70:
The "too bored with police work" because they're smart is fucking asinine. Ummm... don't you think that those type of people would eventually end up as a detective or in forensics?
A shrivelled old man - with a shrivelled old brain.
There must be a parlor-game like "New Labels for Old Shit" played at republican gatherings.
Some winners: Peacemaker, Compassionate conservative, Uniter, Operation Iraqi Freedom...ad infinitum.
Perhaps "Fudgers" is better than "Chocolate"?
i guess richard perle and his ilk are still too smart to show up -- jon's left eating the low-hanging fruit.
After watching that I am in complete favor of the concept of Logan's Run. Where they exterminate people when they reach a certain age. Starting with this dumb bastard.
Imichael @ 80:
yes but lets start at say 17 yes that should be the cutoff age , hell yes lets kill em !
wha???..."saddam was spreading terror with wmds..."???...
holy crap ben that's so...years ago. get with the program, at least use some new wingnut talking points and neoprop for gawd's sake.
Geez, you all sound like the fans of Rush Limbaugh or Neil Boortz. You believe the comedian with the staff of comedy writers, not journalists, over a well educated scholar. You have all become Ditto Heads and are too silly to notice it. The tone and rhetoric here is exactly the same on their sites. Go see for yourself. Name calling, whining, judging, misogyny, vulgarity, following blindly, rage against all perceived as "the enemy". No wonder people are leaving the party in droves. Your Moral and Politcal Leader is a Comedy Writer people. Stewart rehearses all of his questions and responses and he is trained in improv comedy. It is all just entertainment, just like Rush. I stopped watching the Daily Show when I suddenly realized they no longer make fun of politics and Washington but make fun of everyone EXCEPT Obama. They never poke fun at him. Until the Democrats wake up and get serious we wont win the White House.
how about we just call the neo-con philosophy what it is. nonsense and BS
katie @ 13:
There's a drawing later this week for an autographed pair of "Airhead McCain" Ferragamo shoes. A $520 value. And, if you invade more than two sites, we'll double the offer. But hurry, we can't do this all day.
Wattenberg was pitiful. John Stewart held back so as not to embarrass his guest too much. He is too nice.
Pwned.
What a loser that guy is. He's an embarrassment to himself.
Twattenberg.
Oh yeah. Why do I feel like I am looking at mcAncient in about two years? The rambling, dumb ass logic are the same. The "I think I'm pretty damn cute" attitude is the same. Too much similarity. What a horse's ass. I'm sure this bozo is a propaganda network regular. Let him go push his book to the rest of the brain dead that like to stuff their heads full of shit.
Nice cut-up John. Respectful, but didn't bite the bait. This fish was way too slow.
If Neo-Cons were chocolate... I'd eat em! And I don't like eating a lot of chocolate, but it'd be for the greater good.
Maybe we could just send 'em to Florida and let 'em melt instead.
Next time I see Rove, I'll lick him and see what he tastes like... I'm thinking German chocolate (the only kind I don't like).
:D
"We'll see who's being arrogant."
What. An. Asshole.
Notice how he avoids any mention that all the 9/11 guys were from Saudi Arabia.
Ouch, that was painful. No wonder why he stuttered so much. You try stringing every hackneyed right wing talking point together to make the case in 2008 why we invaded Iraq because of 9/11, and see how well you do. Did he say that they had an election in Iraq and THEN they asked us in? Um, no, they had an election in Iraq, they elected the guys that we told them to elect, and then they asked us to get OUT. And then they even endorsed Obama's timetable for us to get out.
those of us on REEEEAALLLLY s-l-o-w dial up really like it when videos are down loadable....
oops... silly old PBS tool underestimated john.
That man is an old fool. Who would be stupid enough to buy his book?
Oh, thats right, right wing fucktards.
Nevermind.
swampfox @ 81:
More proof that swampthing is a complete and utter moron.
When the guy said he didn't know about Saudi Arabia, John should have said, "Get this clown off my set."
best Jimmy Stewart impersonation yet.
"Well, well, well, well,...."
that's Gold!
Did I hear this Old Fucking Tool say Iraq has a FREE PRESS, my GOD how dumb do you have to be?
Did anyone notice how he was attacking Jon? And his book is Fighting Words, he fights them, alright.
1.Ben: "...most people give you mugs, flashes "laser hat" at Jon (in the eyes) with no warning.
2.Jon about hat: "I'll just take Ben's" Ben: "You could, if you were looking for a fight!"
3."I'll flash this at you!" Ben's threat to Jon to "be serious."
4. Jon: "Who are you to say they wanted us in? They (Iraq) didn't send out the Bat-Signal--We bombed them! That is a very arrogant statement." Ben: "We'll see who's being arrogant, I'll get you again" (grabs hat, points at Jon)
It was painful watching the old guy. Really, really painful.
After one minute, I switched to CNN.... And I hate Dan Senor's wife. She still talks like she has a mouthful of braces with headgear.
'It has nothing to do with the fact that their policies have been proven to either not work or just be monumentally bad for most of the country…"
..
;;
;;
;;
I just love it when I see these words in print.
I can't help it.
It's the truth!
Please post these clips without linking directly to the Comedy Central site; those of us not living in the continental U.S. are restricted from seeing them. The earlier system of posting clips worked for all.
Cheers, and thank-you for all your efforts!
My walk away from this encounter is the realization that its no longer about solving problems in the country, but the marketing of a "brand Name" that gets things done in america..
The creation of slogans with corporate logos over nitelike army strong, and the flag lapel pin..
The whole industry is tied to the creation and marketing of a brand, yet the brand is for political vapor ware..
a rose by any other name still prcks, loud farts are all sound an fury amounting to naught.
I was very uncomfortable watching that old fart. To hear that old crap about why we are in Iraq turns my stomach. I am sick to death of these neo-cons and all the other toadies that follow them.
all I can say is ...OWNAGE
Never used profanity before, and I mean this in the only the sweetest way, fucking crazy old man...
Scoppertop @ 100:
Yeah, I noticed that too. He was being very confrontational with Stewart. I can only guess that he's trying so hard to prove to himself how smart and "serious" he is. This jackass reeks of insecurity. Occasionally on Saturday morning, after being sufficiently caffeinated, I would watch Wattenberg's show. He has a lot of neo-con jackoffs on like the extremely effeminate war monger Max Boot who continued to crank out the Iraq war bullshit talking points long after they were debunked.
Now be serious now.........as if..........neocons are like chocolate.
All of that revisionist history and not one mention of Willy Kristol?
Just how much does he have to pay PBS to be the host of Think Tank?
Are there not any minumum standards at PBS?
Strange how the most civilised and informative debates appear on a comedy show. John Stewart dismantled his opponent's arguments yet remained polite and respectfull. This show is really something else.
It seems that Wattenberg was asking for a moment of seriousness so he could make his point, but Jon had a series of quips which was causing the audience to laugh.
To pk @ #93 & Laribee @ #103 -
Comedy Central is EXTREMELY proprietary about clips from their shows. I don't think they want C&L (or anyone else), to post anything other than their approved embedded player or a link to their site. On the flip side, they're very generous about what they make available - they just insist that you get it from them.
OTOH, you could try a YouTube/Google Video search...
Who the Hell gave this guy Wattenberg a TV show anyways? What were they thinking? Who would even take this bozo seriously?
Jon Stewart was being charitable to the old guy.
sundog @ 114:
Tucker Carlson's daddy?
Soft target, guys. It's a bit indecorous to be going all OMGPWNEDLOL!! to a guy in his mid-70s.
To adam @ #116 -
What seems indecorous to me is a man who purports to be a great thinker, yet is clearly a muddle-headed, arrogant gas bag, writing a, "yarn," filled with ludicrous, thoroughly discredited neo-conservative claptrap, then touring to support said, "yarn." Add in the fact that the arrogant gasbag is so enamoured of his own b.s. that he was condescending to Stewart whilst painfully failing to recognize how fatally far out of his intellectual depth he was compared to Stewart.
Wattenberg (and you), can't have it both ways - either he's a serious intellectual on a book tour who should be expected to defend his neo-conservative ideas with some semblance of logic, knowledge & reasoning skills, or he's a doddering old man who can't be expected to defend his ideas anymore and should therefore not be on a book tour.
Or perhaps I missed the part where he mentioned that his book included his struggle with Alzheimers...
duncanidho @ 104:
Brilliant! That is the perfect term. It's all about the marketing -- never mind the product. All style but absolutely no substance.
And that's what pisses me off about "the news." They all talk of political strategy but never focus on the issues!
adam @ 116:
Respect is earned not granted, this basic concept is to concern trolls what bug spray is to roaches...
Doubting_Terrance @ 118:
It is just a reflection of a society at large. We no longer make shit in this country, we are an economy of "services." Thus it makes sense that marketing permeates all aspects of our society. What it is good for the economic goose must certainly be good enough for the political gender. Right? Right?
We are oh so very screwed...
adam @ 116:
So you're saying we shouldn't elect McCain?
The oblivious contempt of the neocons knows no bounds.
This man is a case study in how neocons young and old think. "If only that damn liberal media didn't exist, we'd be able to convince 95% of everybody, incarceate or kill the rest, and be able to enact any law we wanted because our genius would be self-evident!" The problem with neocons is, they think their philosophy, their theories, their proscribed issue positions and policies are utterly immune from becoming an evil like communism or fascism. They don't think they're capable of it. You can see this in how Mr. Wattenberg discusses his subject. They don't care what anyone else thinks, because they've found what they consider the magic socio-political formula that humanity has been killing itself to find for millenia.
They are of course wrong, and are the dictatorial troglodytes humanity has been trying to shed itself of for those same millenia. Nonetheless every few generations we get a new breed of them, a group that creates rule of the few under the guise that many will find liberty and voice. A group that says it will give you the independence to protect yourself by taking it from you. A group that misspends every tax dollar you give it while shifting your burden even higher because you're just not one of the big producers, ya know, like a CEO. And boy do they know how to throw around their weight whenever and wherever they want! They can pull them some triggers real good!
Just look at how they defend their positions: they keep making obvious pleas to emotion and force. But Saddam! But he killed! But the terrorists! (nevermind the ones harbored by oil friends). But but but! I'm so sick of being pleaded to death about how evil Saddam was. It's intellectually insulting to me, and revolting that people with such animus for power have so much of it. They are using banal, base, long-shattered ideas with high-minded multi-syllable words. They have already repackaged old garbage from History's dustbin, and ruined so much with it. My distrust for them grows every day.
These guys are getting to the point where they are as capable of leveling as much mass destruction on humanity as any other notorious political ethos has been. And they adamantly refuse to see their major flaws, long the mark of a bolshevite mentality, or a goose-stepping mentality, or a flock-of-sheep guided by wolves mentality. And they are exactly wrong. This country and the world will be better when neocons far and wide, home-grown or from other lands, are discredited with spirited abandon in public squares everywhere, with their crap ideas open for all to see.
PBS has an overated reputation as being a media source for unbiased reporting and commentary. My experience has been that PBS has a corporate agenda that, while not as blatant as the major corporate media companies, is still biased towards reporting that promotes the interests of corporations over the public good.
I mean, look at this Ben Wattenberg (I don't watch TV so this is the first time I've seen him). Sure, one could say that a truly unbiased media organization would have opinions from both sides of the political spectrum. But when a media commentator is insane or senial or both, and I'm supposed to be considerate and listen to this crap?
This guy is basically saying that fighting "generic terrorism" is a justification for invading sovereign nations, that these nations want us to invade them to bring law and order to their countries and the only reason that the whole world, and belatedly some of America, is against such criminal behavior is because its not marketed like yummy, feel-good chocolate. And we wonder why America has become the laughing stock of the world.
I'm going to be sick.
Chocolate! This guy spewed something that may resemble chocolate. I believe it is produced by The Uranus Corporation and is called Brown 25. Ben is so full of chocolate his eyes are brown!
this guy's an idiot
.
Yes, I'm sure that Ben Wattenberg thinks we were saving those Iraqis who have died since our invasion and occupation from the threat of death under Saddam...
.
Remember how easy it used to be for these fools?
So now they are Choco-fascists?
REALLY seems to give chocolate a bad name!
They behave like shit...
turn everything they touch to shit...
their justifications stink to high heaven like shit...
and they've always behaved like lying sacks o shit...
I'm sorry, they can label themselves any way they want...
they are still just plane old shit!!
Fantod @ 117:
I'm not trying to have it both ways. I don't really know anything about the guy, but he can't clearly complete his sentences or organise his thoughts, and it seems obviously to do with his age, not because 'hahaha-he's a dumb neocon!!' -- So yes, I probably agree with the second of your two options. But maybe he writes ok, and his publishers want him out on the road to hock his book. I think we can do without the self-satisfied snickering, is all I'm saying. It's cheap.
If I were a neo-conservative with any clout, I'd make sure that guy never speaks in public again.
I just gave myself a case of the heebie-jeebies.
Between 4:15 and 4:30 in the clip, that man says "I" at least 10 times.
adam @ 129:
It would be understandable if the guy in his dementia was talking about unicorns or neverland. He is however, quite clear and lucid in his support for the neocon agenda of evil bullshit... it takes a special kind of gall to diminish the terror and destruction spread by his ideological brethren as a simple case of failed marketing. And no, regardless of your concern trolling, that kind of gall is not brought forth by onset of dementia.
The thing that is cheap is your effort trying to turn the criticism of such an evil old man like Mr. Wattemberg into some kind of abuse of the elderly. It takes a special kind of demagogue to try to use the fact that the guy is clearly dumber than a light post to try to not only overshadow the evilness of the agenda this old crook is trying to push, but actually to try to cast his dumb ass as the real victim hear.
Enough is enough...
Tyler Durden @ 132:
No, I'd love to hear some criticism of him. Instead we're treated to 'he's an evil old man', etc, and yet apparently I'M the demagogue.
adam @ 133:
Yeah, if you'd love to hear criticism of Mr. Wattemberg then I'd be the queen of Sada. Concern trolls are funny, and yet oh so fucking annoying.
He is an evil old man, if you can't deal with that fact it is not my problem. He is not only supports the neocon movement, he is actually one of the first in the scene of the U of Chicago school of fun and games. The reason why this guy is a grade-A asshole is because Mr. Wattemberg has the gall to blame the bad rep on the neo-cons as just misplaced marketing priorities, thus completely ignoring the trail of destruction and sorrow left by his merry comrades.
It takes a special kind of creep to blatantly try to distort the historical record on the neocon movement. Which I guess is the reason why you feel such an special bond with the guy, eh?
Now please, let us all know how pointing out the obvious equates to bullying a poor defenseless retiree.
Well you're not really interested in what I have to say, so I won't bother. I'm a 'concern troll' because you and I have a different opinion. Pretty sure that tells me all I need to know.
One of the only right wingers I'd love to see more of. Have him on, as often as possible! It would do LOADS of good!
"Now, be serious...!" Hilarious.
Reminds me of Homer Simpson telling Ned Flanders there was absolutely nothing wrong with crabgrass except the name: "If it was called elfgrass, everybody would want it!"
I watched that interview. Wattenburg was completely full of horse manure. Talk about stretching the bounds of logic.
Neo-Cons are soulless. They created the Neo-Korporate war on terror to scare us into giving up all our freedoms and to enrich themselves in the process.
The world will not allow these Neo-Con war criminals to go unpunished!
A Neo-Con is still a Neo-Con no matter how they try to convince you otherwise.
You can wrap a dog turd in a nice package with a bow on it. It's still a dog turd!
Did Jon get the hat? Thats what I want to know!!!!
Way to go Stewart!
Neo-Cons (Chocolate):
We are the cowboys, the islamists are the indians. Moving into their country and bringing our form of government (religon) to them (and taking their land and resources) will justify anything else we do. In the long run, its good for them.
...and you all remember how things turned out for the indians ...right? (Chocolate will mention casinos as a descriptor of how well off they are).
Neoconservatism is reactionary and authoritarian. It started with FDR's policies and liberal and progressive ideas in the 30s.
Neo-classical secular humanist @ 55:
Excellent and brilliant observation. Precisely on point !!!!!!!!
So if we call Naziism strawberry, the KKK vanilla people will instantly embrace those, too, eh?
This guy is a deluded and clueless asshat, and PBS exposes itself as the neocon tool that it is by having any association at all with him.
Stan the Mahan @ 62:
Duuude!! Where's a coherent thought in your entire rant???
Neo-con dipped in tasty chocolate will just be chocolate covered shit. It might look good in the window but don't eat it. Ben is partly right, initially with the 24/7 promotion in the MSM of new and improved chocolate covered neo-con, their polls would rise. Anyone who pointed out that chocolate neo-con was the same old shit covered in chocolate would be denounced as anti-american terrist sympathizers. We talking good old murkin neo-cons covered in tasty murkin made chocolate.
The plan works well until people are forced to bite into it themselves, past the tasty chocolate covering to discover that it's the same shit as before. 100,000 + are killed or sickened permanently from eating it.
What of the 29%? They'll still be there same as before. The 29% don't need the chocolate coating, they enjoy Coprophagy and it's foul taste and after effects don't faze them because they enjoy watching the suffering of those who are forced to eat it.
VietVet8666 @ 33:
Apparently, you are not aware of all internet traditions. You need to get on that.
Wattenberg, what a flaming idiot. Ignorance surely must be bliss for the neocons.
After the term "psychopath" was in use for years, it took on a highly negative connotation to the general public. The term "sociopath" was substituted. Surprise, surprise: it also took on a negative association, because it was a different label for the same thing.
Changing the term "neocon" to something else might buy some time, but the same thing would happen.
Maybe neocons should try "sociopath"... it could be a step up for them.
adam @ 135:
That is the sound of the world's smallest violin bidding you farewell.
Sorry, I had to call you on your shitty attempt of trying to cast this evil old bastard as the actual victim. It takes a special kind of demagogue, which I guess now in the parlance of the times makes you a concern troll.
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