Gingrich raises the specter of another government shutdown
By Steve Benen Friday Aug 08, 2008 8:00am
In the 1990s, then-Speaker Newt Gingrich helped orchestrate a government shutdown, which helped make him something of a national villain. Soon after, Gingrich forced a second shutdown, and was blamed for that, too.
A few years later, Gingrich was forced from his post and resigned, but he continues to linger in DC, and has managed to convince his former colleagues that his advice has merit.
And as of this week, the former Speaker is talking openly about yet another government shutdown. (thanks to R.S. for the tip)
Former Speaker Newt Gingrich (R-Ga.) predicted Wednesday during the fourth day of Republican protests at the Capitol that Democrats would lose a potential government shutdown fight over offshore oil drilling.
The offshore drilling ban expires Sept. 30, and some conservatives have urged President Bush to threaten to veto any bill that extends it, including a routine stopgap spending bill keeping the government open.
“Are they really prepared to close the government in order to stop drilling?” Gingrich asked of Democrats. “I think the public would think they’re insane…. I don’t see how the Democrats could possibly sustain a suicidal strategy like that.”
And I really don’t see how the Republicans could listen to such a nut.
Former Senate Majority Leader Tom Daschle (D-S.D.) said a shutdown would backfire on Republicans.
“The Republicans haven’t had much luck with shutdowns in recent years, and I can’t imagine that this would be any different,” he said. “The American people want to see progress, they want to see comity, they want to see bipartisanship. They want to see some action, not shutdowns. I can’t imagine they would fare any better this time.”
Let me get this straight. Newt Gingrich, who was ousted because he was so ineffective in shaping the congressional Republicans’ strategy 10 years ago, wants to see congressional Republicans shut down the government a few months before an election, because Speaker Pelosi knows that expanded coastal drilling wouldn’t help consumers or improve our nation’s energy policy, and is prepared to wait until there’s a new president before negotiating a new national policy.
I’ll tell you what, House Republicans, take Newt’s advice. I dare you.
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Damn....as if the results of the last time didn't make that clear enough. I wonder what Dubya's gonna say about that? Oh, and Go Team USA in Beijing!
When the GOP seek the advice from disgraced, run-out-of-town-in-shame losers like Gingrich, they are in more dire straights than thought possible. Has anyone asked Gingrich to weigh in about the Edwards affair? He's a bit of an expert on those matters.
what the dem leadership "if you can call it that" should come out with a statement saying its not gonne let exxon mobile ,texico shell .or conoco push us around they may have bought off the republicans but they havent bought us
cwazycajun @ 3:
Perhaps, but Standard Oil is still quite powerful. Damn Rockefeller and all his generation created.
When the Repugs were in power, they had ALL the power. When the Dems are in power, the Repugs have ALL the power. What's wrong with this picture? We need to get rid of the polite old ladies Pelosi and Reid and get some dedicated Democrats with backbone.
Extend the offshore drilling ban stating the oil companies already have leases they are not even using; then put the ball back in the Repugs court and let see if Bush will veto the bill.
Kilgore Trout @ 6:
Honestly...I don't think he gives a shit.
cwazycajun @ 3:
Maybe they have bought the Dems as well.
And on the fifth day Newt created hemarrhoids.
And he said let my people suffer these in remembrance of me.
Gingrich is the best they have, pathetic as he is. No one is stopping the oil companies from drilling. They have leases on tens of thousands of acres of land that they could be drilling on. Let them knock themselves out to "save us". They just want the leases on the real estate. That is all they are after.
They can already "drill here, drill now"? They just won't!!!!
The democrats should turn this shit back on these crooks. But then I make myself laugh.
Doesn't Gingrinch remind you of a troll?
cwazycajun @ 3:
Unfortunately, though, they have, and I expect the Dims to cave...
Democrats, or Moveon.com should come up with an ad campaign that turns the republicans own words against them. They could do a fly by of all the land that the oil companies own the leases on and then put the words Drill here, drill now over the pictures.
The Dims, dumber than dog-shit though they clearly are, should write introduce legislation which rescinds the Off-Shore and ANWR bans, when and only when ALL the lease holdings not yet explored and drilled have been exhausted, and then only on the proviso that the resources extracted be refied by and sold to USer end users.
The Pukes would filibuster, the Chimp would veto (and so would St.B), but it would make the point that the audience for these plans is not the US consumer, but BIG OIL...
foolme1ns @ 13:
What should be, unfortunately, is not what is, or in all likelihood, will be.
The MoneyMedia will cover Newt's fat ass and that of the Greedy Old Plutocrats come hell or high water.
MoneyMedia already treats Newt as an elder statesman and is hard at work undercutting all things not Repugnican.
And for the near future, Newt could bugger a baby on the Whitehouse lawn and get away with it. MoneyMedia will be bringing you the sordid details of Jon Edwards' affair.
I'm just guessing; actually we no longer get teevee.
This is beyond words. I am laughing so hard, my coffee is messing up my keyboard.
The fact that these Repubs are so committed to this makes me think that 1) they're getting big money for their effort and 2) they realize that this may be the last chance to do what their keepers want prior to getting swept out. Of course those who are out will become lobbyists if they can pull this off.
Congressional Democrats are forever "taking a stand" until the Republicans snipe sit down and shut up, which they dutifully do.
Down here in Tennessee, a Republican incumbent was defeated in the primary by an opponent who tied him into being a puppet for Big Oil. The ad the opponent ran wasn't even that good or clever - we're talking about a Republican, after all - but the opponent defeated the incumbent. If this is the result of the Rethug off-shore drilling strategy, then quote their hero, "Bring it on!!!"
ConcernedCanuck @ 17:
Stupidity is the greatest elixir on Earth, it even beats ignorance. Go Team USA!
Woody @ #14- I like that idea. But it's too simple, there must a way to obfuscate the point and rape the public a bit. Otherwise, what's in it for the politicians?
Just askin'...
This coming from the guy who did shut down the govt, and it cost him his job. That and having a woman on the side.
Off Topic, This from Fact Check.:
.
A TV spot claims Obama once voted for a tax increase "on people making just $42,000 a year." That's true for a single taxpayer, who would have seen a tax increase of $15 for the year – if the measure had been enacted. But the ad shows a woman with two children, and as a single mother, she would not have been affected unless she made more than $62,150. The increase that Obama once supported as part of a Democratic budget bill is not part of his current tax plan anyway.
A Spanish-language radio ad claims the measure Obama supported would have raised taxes on "families" making $42,000, which is simply false. Even a single mother with one child would have been able to make $58,650 without being affected. A family of four with income up to $90,000 would not have been affected.
The TV ad claims in a graphic that Obama would "raise taxes on middle class." In fact, Obama's plan promises cuts for middle-income taxpayers and would increase rates only for persons with family incomes above $250,000 or with individual incomes above $200,000.
The radio ad claims Obama would increase taxes "on the sale of your home." In fact, home-sale profits of up to $500,000 per couple would continue to be exempt from capital gains taxes. Very few sales would see an increase under Obama's proposal to raise the capital gains rate.
A second radio ad, in English, says, "Obama has a history of raising taxes" on middle-class Americans. But that's false. It refers to a vote that did not actually result in a tax increase and could not have done so.
These ads continue what's become a pattern of misrepresentation by the McCain campaign about his opponent's tax proposals.
I have a better idea than drilling in new places. Let's stop giving government money to oil companies to buy up battery technology and electic car technology, expecting the oil companies to develop them and only find years later that they aren't even trying. It's like giving government money to tobacco companies and expecting them to develop nicotine gum and patches. Philip Morris would never make nicotine gum and Cheveron will never make electiic car technology.
Am I mistaken but wasn't it during the shut down that Monica gave Bill the hummer? Maybe we should let them shut it down, then Jeff Gannon/Guckert can give GW a hummer and we can FINALLY impeach him for something the country can understand!
Newt Gingrich has nothing to say. He is no longer an elected official.
Republicans, nothing but reruns and repeats. No new ideas come from these wingnuts. They live in the past.
With oil and gasoline prices dropping, all the Republicans are doing is giving up their paid Summer vacation for naught while Boehner plays gulf in Ohio. They really are fools.
Remember when all the oil exec's were in front of Congress? Saying , Wha? Who Me?
.
Well , yeah. You!
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/15/AR200511...
On a side note, Cindy Sheehan is on the Ballot in San Francisco.
I have to agree. A government shut-down will back fire on the Republicans. While the Democrats are out meeting with their constituents and fund raising, the Republicans are stuck in Washington DC. Yeah, please do follow Newt's advice.
BobD @ 25:
That's a good point.
There are so many levels of retardation here: Gingrich, congress, portion of the public that think drilling is intelligent, it's difficult to fathom. Sometimes there probably is no difference between a government shutdown and what practically gets done every day.
The Dems will cave. Vegas odds are 4-1.
What a lot of bullshit (if you'll forgive the expression) The Government HAS been shut down for 7.6 friggin years and has been run only by the insane cadre that sits in the Offal Orifice and in Cheneys pit of decadence.
Cindy Sheehan on ballot in SF.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/08/08/MNC2127RCJ.D...
mudshark @ 33:
evening mudshark, good on ya.
♥♦♣♠☻..Bangkok Bob..☻♥♦♣♠ @ 34:
Good morning to you too Bob.
Even if Sheehan lose's, she's going to make Pelosi answer for her deeds.
I really can't see her winning, But she can force Pelosi to answer some questions. Which could make things interesting.
Boy let em do do do it....and wait til October right before election......assuring a democratic win.
These guys...it's all absolute with them. Iraq is about "staying in Iraq"...and nothing more. Drilling is about drilling..and nothing more. My guess is Newt will steer these guys right over a cliff. They identify him not with disgrace but the "miracle" of '94. Offshore drilling? It will do nothing for the American people but possibly pollute their beaches and the GOP'ers were dumb enough to attach unrealistic predictions to this pipe dream..oil in 2 to 4 years. So shut down the Gov, drill and in 4 years we will talk about it.
Is it possible to build a fence around Marrietta, Georgia to keep this windbag from escaping?
Map of Oil Rigs destroyed by Katrina.
http://www.cccarto.com/katrina/index.html
Map of Oil Rigs destroyed by Rita.
http://www.cccarto.com/rita/index.html
It's like my kid holding his breath until he gets what he wants.
May-be someone ought to tell this scum bag just to shut the fuck up . America is made up of more than the septic scum that floats on the top of the septic tank i.e republician government officials past and present. I want to leave the fucking oil for my daughters grand child not wasted on gas bag flying around the country crying "If we can't rape the earth for our self aggrandizement then we won't do anything for the good of the country".
Isn't it great that the Republicans finally decide to act on high gas prices!!!! Too bad they're doing it after the prices have gone down.....
The real culprit was the market manipulation, once investigations into the Enron loophole and over speculation, the price of gas went down by $.40/gallon. Boneheads, a day late, and a dollar short.
"continues to linger in DC"
That made me smile, Mr. Benen.
that phrase went well with my morning coffee.
Thanks
Ruthless People @ 38:
I propose to build a 15 ft wall around the entire state. They won't be missed.
Maybe if they way down on the wug and hold their bweath until they turn bwue and cwy big cwocodile tears they will....uh...maybe expire and go away. puhweeease!
But really - give it a go idiots!
Is this guy employed, or just a welfare queen for the corporate thugs? "He continues to LINGER in D.C.," says it all............what a douche bag loser.
His trash ass attempt to pretend he was Mr.Greenjeans failed so badly, he's got to pay his bills by foaming at the mouth. Who's supporting him while he fusses around town trying to get in teh papers???
What a fantastic bunyon-head.
Richard @ 37:
Only problem with that is Americans have no memory.
In 4 years they will have forgotten that the reason they voted McCain in was that drilling was going to get them "relief at the pump" and it didn't work.
And it will be some other stupid thing the repubs have dreamed up that will win them the election again.
So a political failure recommends a course of action that is known to be a failure. And you wonder why the Repubs are in the tank? They're like little children that threaten to hold their breath until they turn blue to get their way. Time to put these dopes in the political time out chair.
An Average Joe @ 11:
Yes, because he is a troll!
Why is this asshole still lingering?
When Dick Morris, Ann Coulter or Oliver North isn't on the Hannity show it's NEWT GINGRICH.
Will this asshole PLEASE go away.
Timmy_D11 @ 50:
I wish that Oliver North would have been dropped like a hot potato, the guy sold weapons to Iran, and with the push for an Iran war the logical inconsistences threaten the fabric of reality...
Newt Gingrich is a social dominator and authoritarian who has no conscience at all.
Gingrich is brilliant. Responsible for largest Conservative gain in history and it created Surpluses, Welfare Reform and other improvements to our society.
I wish he would of ran for Pres, He would of lost probably but the debates between him and the other Repubs and the debates between him and Obama would of been memorable and interesting.
He did resign for the loss off representatives that year because he's honorable vs what Clinton did.
Oil is the new gold.
All the lands and seas with real oil under them need to opened up for responsible clean drilling. Let the market back to work plus Oil future speculators should be banned from the market, People who never had the oil selling to people who will never get the oil should not be allowed, all they do is jack the price up for their profits.
I remember well when Gingrich shut down the government in 1995. I was working as a Naval Reservist at the time and didn't receive a paycheck for my Oct, Nov, Dec, and January work until February of 2006. Thank you for that, Newt. I had to put my rent on my credit card. You and all of your buddies are idiots.
Remember how well that worked for you last time asshole? How stupid are you?
Forget I asked - go right ahead . . . .
*
Dr. Britney Hussein Matt @ 44:
I would miss Georgia's Vidalia onions and peanuts.
obetwo @ 53:
Wow. I mean, WOW! How big do you think the rock this guy was hiding under was?
*
BrokenArrow @ 46:
Newt goes to DC when Congress is away because there are more hookers available then.
They probably won't listent to Newt.
but who knows,
It will be interesting to see if Pelosi will allow a vote on off shore drilling, She knows she lose the vote if its brought to the floor.
This issue is a loser for the liberals, will just take time to see how big a loser it is.
Speaking of men who cheat on their wives...
Doesn't Newt have a hooker that he needs to pay?
Oil companies are in a circle jerk with their shareholders, paying big dividends instead of investing in infrastructure.
the lies peddled by the GOP, some dems (see, gang of 10 democratic members), Big Oil (shocker, there) and the msm are breath taking---which is what i would be saying if i wasn't so used to the standard pattern.
the argument that off shore drilling will lead to american energy independence is so flawed as to be ridiculous. and it takes either will full ignorance or just plain laziness to buy into ANOTHER deception funded by Big Oil.
What's that enviroterrorist organization? I'll be the first one to contemplate joining them if they sneakily and underhandedly give a green light to drilling in ANWR.
Any law allowing MORE access to public lands for oil drilling needs to come with:
1) a preset GUARANTEED low price for oil and gas, AND
2) a GUARANTEE that it will ONLY be sold to Americans.
IF they refuse to give these 2 guarantees it proves, beyond a shadow of a doubt, they want to do this for the oil companies and NOT FOR the American people.
The above comments seem to ignore the very real problem we are facing. At present there is no economically practical replacement for petroleum / oil for our cars, planes, and industry. Tires, plastics, paving, and many other items use oil. We must move forward with all economically practical ways to reduce our dependence on foreign oil and to increase our domestic oil supply--drill now in ANWAR, off our coasts, start oil shale conversion to oil processes--this is the short term solution. Start building more nuclear power plants. Try to make the other energy sources more economical--wind power, solar, geothermal if they can stand on their own without government (read taxpayer) subsidies to compete against oil sources--this is the long term part of the solution.
Failure to take rational steps to resolve this crisis will result in severe economic damage to our country. This is the U.S.A.--we went to the moon in ten years--we can do the short term fixes in two years, and the long term fixes in ten years also.
Rocketman41
Gingrich is brilliant. Responsible for largest Conservative gain in history and it created Surpluses, Welfare Reform and other improvements to our society.
------------------
The surpluses came from an economic boom engeneered by Alan Greenspan's repeat of the roaring 1920's FED policy.
John Bibb @ 65:
If you want rational solutions, they you won't mind if we ignore your foolish suggestions for drilling in ANWR, oil shale conversion (one of the dirtiest and most environmentally unfriendly solutions) and proliferation of nuclear power. All of the preceding are promoted by those who just want to prolong our current bankrupt energy paradigm and who are too lazy and self absorbed to make any genuine sacrifices.
The real answer is conserving and living within our means. We have the technology to do so but not the will. Adopting an earth friendly paradigm is gaining traction but for the most part is considered what hippies and radicals do. Instead, we'll just send an IOU to our kids and let them do the heavy lifting while we profit at their expense.
And taxpayer subsidies and government leadership are absolutely essential to success because the Federal government is the only entity with enough capital to fund the Apollo Alliance like big picture program that we really need. Your pseudo conservative pipe dream is unrealistic and relying solely on voluntary cooperation will not be anywhere near enough to change anything.
And you will remember that the Apollo program in the 1960's was financed 100% with taxpayer dollars, not voluntary cooperation.
so if you dont do EVERYTHING i say, i'll shut down the government...and that'll be YOUR fault....
thats a bully's logic
Rocketman John, that's all good and well but people DON'T TRUST oil companies - it looks as though there will be a struggle between oil companies and people that oppose them as long as there is a SLIVER of dishonesty on their part.
I still haven't gotten a clear answer over why they aren't exploring the tens of millions of acres they already lease. WWHHYY do they need access to more if they havcen't explored what they got?
I live in Newts hood Cobb County/Marietta, Georgia and hardly ever see anymore Bush Bush/Cheney bumber stickers or decals at all! Every now and then you'll one stuck on a SUV with the driver yawking away on their cell, bouncing back and forth from one side of their lane to the other!
Now we know why this became an issue in the first place!
If its effects wouldn't be felt for anywhere between 2 and 10 years (depending on if you watch FOX or CNN), then the only reason Republicans have made this an issue is because they knew the ban expired on Sept. 30th. This is a major opportunity for a McCain campaign victory as they see it. They've strategically been hyping up the issue all summer so they can try to make Democrats look weak and anti-American-sentiment at the end of September, just before the election. They feel this is a hot button issue that they can win on. This whole argument is part of a summer-long campaign strategy knowing that this type of stand off is timed perfectly for them.
Campaigns might never be about actual details again. People form their opinions based on 8 words in a headline and everyone knows it. If you can make a headline that says "Democrats stand down on off-shore drilling", that's all people will register, forget the content of the article. The GOP know this and that's what they're going for.
MCCAIN IS TOO OLD. That's my headline. Let's keep repeating it.
What will it take to make that fathead go away?
foolme1ns @ 10:
All those acres are worth shit even at $140 a barrel oil dumbass. Ever heard of economics? Lets open up the continental shelf and let us drill our own oil u bunch of duffuses, then the money stays here and everyone benefits! Or is simple economics beyond you dem's comprehension? Pelosi is a dumb beyotch - can't wait to see them dems pay at the polls for not allowing drilling and lack of actions as a ruling party in congress! McCain 08 - not that commie bastard with the glib mouth!
John Bibb @ 65:
i don't think you understand the most basic fact around what you propose: any off shore, or ANWR, drilling will not be 'american' oil.
further, how do you figure that ANWR and off shore is a 'short term' solution? it is neither 'short term' nor a 'solution'
I agree with ya John Bibb,
Screw conserving, This is the USA not some 3rd world country, Conserving is not real answer, and it's not the American way. American's overcome problems with ingenuity, greed and the power of free capitalistic market solutions.
The free market ( the invisible hand) can easily this problem if Government will get out of the way.
The USA can have Energy Independence if the market is allowed to work. Real Market Competition for energy profits is the answer.
We need clean drilling , build more refineries, Build 100 new market based Nuclear or clean coal power plants, We need to create more wind farms, and market based ethanol or sugar cane based ethanol,etc ...
John Bibb @ 65:
It will require a rational population lead by rational leaders. In other words, hahahahahahahahaha!
drogum @ 73:
nothing is more pathetic than someone who excoriates others for their ignorance, yet all the while has little understanding of what they are saying.
"the money stays here and everyone benefits", might be one of the most dimwitted assessments i read today. you don't believe that do you? surely you aren't that confused....
obetwo @ 75:
of course you do. the same market fundamentalist talking points regurgitated on cue.
obetwo @ 75:
Funny how you guys don't trust regulation, which demands accountability, yet have the upmost confidence on an "invisible hand."
obetwo @ 75:
Screw conserving. You are really a small minded and selfish person. I have every intention of delivering a world to my children that is better than the one we inherited, not sending them an IOU for our selfish indulgence. Your "solution" is actually the problem and moreover, you have absolutely no clue what the cost or long term effect of your actions would be. No problems with wind farms or more ethanol, at least temporarily, but the rest is Neocon pipe dream rubbish.
The American way is not to be an indulgent, selfish nation with a consumptionist mentality but to be a better example for the world through redemptive actions that secure, not compromise our future. Part of that includes living within our means. If you don't have the sense to adopt that, get the hell out of the way and let competent people solve our problems.
Saint Augustine @ 56:
I'd shed more tears if we lost Georgia than if California slid into the Pacific with all the lib nut job tree huggers!
of course you do. the same market fundamentalist talking points regurgitated on cue
Yah but it's so true, kinda undeniable because there's proof everywhere of the power of the invisible hand of the market.
It's the reason why America leads the world.
It brings incredible efficencies, lowers the cost, ups quality. determines how much product needs to be where and when and all with out government help.
If we lose the freedom of the market because of the government and let the governments top down command and control decide what products and our efficiencies of production will fall and the Quality of our lifestyle will fall. See Soviet Union example or most Socialistic governments.
drogum @ 81:
Yeah, those Californians, those people who actually have the audacity to put their money where their mouth is and do something good for the world. People like you will never be remembered for anything except being craven, selfish consumptionists who stood in the way of progress.
Go take your redneck comments over to redstate where you'll get some genuine sympathy.
obetwo @ 82:
You confuse your opinion with fact, a common problem with Neocons. Bur thanks for the laugh about your Voodoo economics anyway.
obetwo @ 82:
"undeniable"? this shows a lack of comprehension, a failure to understand current affairs and history.
you are so unbelievably wrong and misguided it is shocking, and i wouldn't even know where to begin. stunningly sad.
God yes! shut it down at least until January!!!!!!!!!! I don't know how much more of THIS government I can stand!
bmw H. 528 Says:You are really a small minded and selfish person. If you don’t have the sense to adopt that, get the hell out of the way and let competent people solve our problems
I have kids too and love and want the best for them, and telling them they need to expect less of out of life by conserving is wrong in my humble opionion. I want them to help solve these problems with ingenuity, technology and the free market. It's the American way and it can be done.
Plus bnw H. 528 when we people start calling me names instead of arguing the difference of opinions normally means they can't win the argument and need to attack the messenger.
Fuck you, Newt.
Posters here do not mention that there are large number of lawsuits by environmentalists allied with Dem party suing oil companies preventing them from drilling for oil. Alaska is all tied up with many lawsuits stopping drilling all over the state. Dems will pay for this treason one way or another.
drogum @ 81:
Ooooh. Very insightful. Now...Pass John McCain and collect $200.
“undeniable”? this shows a lack of comprehension, a failure to understand current affairs and history
It is undeniabl and using it to solve the energy issue is the cheapest and most efficientway to get out of this problem. If governement regs and laws were removed we wouldn't even have this issue today.
Are you saying the free market doesn't work and isn't the best way to deliver goods and services?
What's the better way bnw H. 528?
obetwo @ 87:
If you want what's best for your kids, try making the sacrifice to be a leader by example instead of deferring the heavy lifting to your kids. They'll get less out of life because people like you won't make any personal sacrifices for a better world. Lip service and good intentions are not action plans. Good luck explaining that to the next generation, that you were too weak to take a cut. That definitely isn't the American way.
As for your alleged name calling you attribute to me, if you can't take the heat, find another blog. Political discussions aren't for the thin skinned.
mascmen7 @ 89:
treason? *spits coffee*
so, let me see if i understand you here: you think that american citizens have no say in issues that have dire consequences, and that any attempt to challenge corporate action is, to you, a crime worthy of death?
you throw around the charge 'treason' like you know what it means, which you obviously don't.
obetwo @ 91:
Try this, for a start to energy independence:
www.apolloalliance.org
Your libertarian free market premise is a hoax and unrealistic. Stop being such a dupe.
Beautiful political theater. They really know how to do that...we haven't since LBJ. Pity.
obetwo @ 91:
i am saying that you haven't the slightest idea about the subject you pose as an expert on
what you propose will:
1) not be a short term solution
2) not be any solution whatsoever
3) have no real effect on price
4) have ZERO effect on our 'foreign oil' usage
5) be a huge gift to multinational oil firms
drogum @ 81:
I'd love to see a study comparing the IQ's of the Georgia redneck and the California tree-hugger.
I think it would be a blow out.
mascmen7 @ 89:
The people at Prince William Sound really paid for your corporate indulgence by having their livelihood permanently compromised by the Exxon Valdez and receiving a paltry and insulting $16,000 each in punitive damages. And your toadies at the oil companies had the balls to complain that it reduced their EPS that quarter. I guess 11 billion in earnings last quarter isn't enough. Treason my ass. Stop being such a suck up to greedy oil companies.
obetwo @ 82:
* See lead paint tainted toys from China as example
obetwo @ 82:
News flash, the EU is now the largest economy.
What were you saying?
ConcernedCanuck @ 8:
Maybe??? Most people who identify with a political party and have the $$ to buy politicians usually call themselves republican.
mascmen7 @ 89:
Hum, so "cheap oil" is an undeniable right... yet lying to start an illegal war, subduing the constitution, implementing torture, and basically scrapping the bill of right are just "peccadillos" to you.
Wow, the mind of a right winger troll sure is convoluted!
Pelosi is a loser. With a majority in congress she (and Reid) still bows to Bush. Maybe she got wiretapped?
Look around your room to see the power of the free market.
The computer your on is a great example of the invisible hand of the free market, look at it, how did it come to be and for such a cheap price?
It's a miracle sitting on your desk and it blows the mind thinking about all the resources and labor it took to make.
Who mined the products for it? Who made the mining equipment?
Who transported the materials? Who made the transportation equipment?
Who are all the many different manufacturers of all the components in it.
The engineering, assembly of it,testing and selling and delivery to you?
A million invisible hands in the making of the computer your typing on and all based on greed and profit.
This invisible hand can work for Oil and energy too if we could drill, create more refineries and apply it to the rest of the energy market.
As for your alleged name calling you attribute to me, if you can’t take the heat, find another blog. Political discussions aren’t for the thin skinned.
and I'm not insulted or hurt by your name calling bnw H. 528, I could care less about your opinion of me, my only point there, is people resort to name calling when they have lost the argument.
* See lead paint tainted toys from China as example
We get millions of different items from China just because a few toys have lead paint doesn't mean anything. The transparant market (if not the government) will stop the lead paint in toys. I wouldn't buy toys (nor you probably) with lead paint, this self correcting aspect of the market is what is so powerful about it.
News flash, the EU is now the largest economy.
I didn't say we were the largest economy just that we were a leader in the world.
How many disparate countries are in EU? 20
Plus I've read the EU and Euro money pricing is starting to tear the fabric of the agreement of some of the countries, Like Greece
Someone should ask Newt this question....
"Congressman, can you explain this John Edwards thing for me? Why is it, that if a man has an affair, then divorces his wife and marries someone else, this is perfectly OK in American politics. He can be thought highly of and elected over and over?
But when a man has an affair, and stays with his wife, he's considered not electable?
As you know, I'm referring to John McCain and yourself as examples of the former situation, and I'm referring to John Edwards and President Clinton as examples of the later. You yourself sir, even had some harsh things to say about Clinton.
This just doesn't seem logical to me. Can you explain this?"
obetwo @ 104:
Why don't you stop bleating out your Ayn Rand free market nonsense? Our problems are solved if we just have unfettered drilling and build more refineries? A naive and simplistic premise that disregards the destructive impact our consumptionist oil based paradigm has on our world. Believing in the "invisible hand" is about as credible as witchcraft or voodoo.
The reality is that our problems are complex, defy simplistic solution, and there is going to be some sacrifice needed to keep from destroying our planet. You don't seem to be inclined to do that because of your naive belief that libertarian free marketism will just fix everything.
Lost the argument you say? Come back when you get one that is worth the time to consider.
obetwo @ 105:
Read this book and think again about American supremacy in the world, which has been compromised and exaggerated:
www.amazon.com/gp/product/0143036084
obetwo @ 105:
If you have to put qualifiers then you are not a leader.
To be the leading economy in the world, implies that our NGP has to be the largest, which is not.
Furthermore, if the depth of your knowledge of economic realities come from "I heard..." it means that you have a superficial knowldege at best.
In other words, you have no clue what you are talking about. I always get a kick about free market libertarians talking about the mightiness of the American Economy... while at the same time they are most likely posting from their parent's basement or their mobile home.
obetwo @ 104:
Because people like me, who decided to get a PhD in Electrical Engineering and actually contribute something.
... but it is not. A bright person once said: "any advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic to the common idiot." So, congratulations.
Hey Newt, I hear your wife has a headcold. Have you called your lawyer yet..you know...do kinda have things in order in case it becomes terminal.
obetwo @ 104:
This lead paint issue was brought to light by a whistleblower and when it was publically disclosed industry advocacy groups immedately tried to stop any meaningful additional regulation or accountability of their industry by stating such absurdities as "there won't be any toys for Xmas" if you adopt any changes.
So much for the benevolent nature of your market system. Self correcting my ass. Self indulgent and self serving, absolutely.
The elephant in the room is "Mark To Market" accounting. Developed by the geniuses at Enron, a corporation gets to book the "expected" profits from an investment at time of initial contract... so all of the oil giants get to book the expected profits from new leases now, weather they actually come to fruition is TBD sometime in the future.
Why doesn't anyone in the press explain and or investigate, why don't pols argue against it?!!!!! This practice is ruining our economy and burying an already deceased middle class.
MoDMaN @ 113:
Actually there is a bill to make the speculation process more accountable and transparent, however it was blocked by Republicans.
www.tpzoo.wordpress.com/2008/07/25/senate-republicans-block-oil-speculat...
Surprised?
obetwo @ 53:
Obetwo you should go get a job shining shoes. They're much easier to polish than turds.
I made a professional pushback video against Newt's "Drill Now" campaign.
It can be found here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YQvgN9w7zw
Shut it down!! It completely sucks anyway!!
Our government is totally bought off by Korporate interests. The Democratic complicity in the criminal behavior is proof of that.
Shut it down ................ Please!
Plisko @ 116:
Nice job. It's also worth mentioning that the US only has 3% of known oil reserves (Saudi Arabia 66%), even if the oil toadies drilled on their remaining land little long lastinggood would come from it anyway---except to Halliburton, whoi makes the oil exploration equipment.
The bann expires in less than 60 days, so what the fuck. daddy Bushes bann on of shore drilling expires in less than 60 days.
That means in less than 60 days there will be no bann on off shore drilling. So what the hell are they talking about? As usual bullshit. A totally pointless argument, a total stunt by the rethuglicans on the floor during recess, absolutle bull. Republicans put the bann on and when it's about to expire they go off with crap that it needs a vote on the floor to lift a bann that expires in less than 60 days!
Now if they won't bring a vote for impeachment hearings why in the hell would they bring a vote on this?
How bout we just stop exporting the Alaskan oil, vote on that ass holes.
Totally willing to hold the country hostage to their infantile antics. Control going to those who care LEAST.
OK . . . let me see if I understand you Gingritch-ites and pro pro pro-business [at any costs] folks. We're all doomed if Americans become less selfish and do the right thing.
Do I understand you correctly?
Well I think I have enlightened and enjoyed this blog on the benefits of free market solutions.
All I've heard is whining about how crappy the Free Market, USA, Repubs, and Newt are.
You have offered no solutions and no debate other then if I'm an idiot , under rock dweller, a turd , or just plain stupid. LOL
It is what I expected and why it's so tough to debate liberals, they have nothing but hate and emotions in them.
But I tried and will try again.
and finally,
Why don’t you stop bleating out your Ayn Rand free market nonsense? Our problems are solved if we just have unfettered drilling and build more refineries? A naive and simplistic premise that disregards the destructive impact our consumptionist oil based paradigm has on our world. Believing in the “invisible hand” is about as credible as witchcraft or voodoo.
The reality is that our problems are complex, defy simplistic solution, and there is going to be some sacrifice needed to keep from destroying our planet. You don’t seem to be inclined to do that because of your naive belief that libertarian free marketism will just fix everything.
Gobblety Gook crap like this by you bnw H. 528 is astounding? "invisible hand" as credible as voodoo? amazingly ignorant comment totally divorced from reality. 99% of the finished goods in your house is created by the invisible hand of supply and demand for greed and profit of the market. Hardly voodoo (gawd it's tough not to call you an idiot).
and Tyler I was going to do a point by point rebuttal but I deemed it a waste of time. Those arguments has such little merit and value to the real debate ( just emotional crap) that It would be like singing to a pig. It would waste my breath and annoy the pig.
obetwo @ 53:
Are you kidding me. Yeah you must be. Your honorable Newt was married to a older woman and when she got cancer he cheated on her and the brave sole went to the hospital to tell her he wanted a divorce. Married the 2nd time that moved right on up to capitol hill. He wasn't satisfied so he was cheating on his 2nd wife and there he was on the capitol hill steps yelling to impeach Clinton. It turns out he was playing patty cake with one of his employees in his office. Than divorced the 2nd wife and married Ms patty cake. So you are so wrong. Newt is the artist of what has gone wrong in congress. You can drink the cool aid but the rest of us know what happen. Not that Clinton was right. He went down for lying the president should go to jail for lying and getting our soldiers killed.
Oil is the new gold.
All the lands and seas with real oil under them need to opened up for responsible clean drilling. Let the market back to work plus Oil future speculators should be banned from the market, People who never had the oil selling to people who will never get the oil should not be allowed, all they do is jack the price up for their profits.
Gingrich's strategy wont work because it relies on the democrats being utterly spineless and incapable of escaping the GOP framing of each and every issue..... oh, wait a minute. Maybe it WILL work....
LET US NOT FORGET... that Newt Gingrich once wrote one of those vapid little political books... and took A FOUR MILLION DOLLAR ADVANCE from Rupert Murdoch while the House was considering new legislation for Federal licensing of OUR airwaves.
LET US NOT FORGET... that Newt has also sold his soul to the pharmaceutical and medical industries in order to promote bigger profits for them, and LESS ACCESS to health care for us.
LET US NOT FORGET... that "drill here, drill now" is not a new energy policy. It's a SLOGAN that merely promotes larger profits for BIG OIL... while concealing the REAL ISSUES of renewable clean and green energy sources.
LET US NOT FORGET... that the Republicans want to solve America's energy problems by OCCUPYING MIDDLE EASTERN COUNTRIES... AND STEALING THEIR OIL FIELDS.
LET US NOT FORGET... that OIL is not THE NEW GOLD... but OIL is simply EXPENSIVE BULLSHIT. Bullshit might make good fertilizer... but one should not mortgage one's future for it.
Also... let me just add: I met Newt Gingrich once, many years ago in South Dakota. He's a self-involved DICK, and a snake-oil salesman.
Jellosi Pelosi thinks its fine.
why is this man even speaking?? and why does anyone even care??
obetwo has now won a free big mac from the MACcain website for prizes in talking points.
Good job; now move along
Are you kidding me? A government shutdown is for when the legislative branch and executive branch suffer from irreconcilable budget differences. This is a joke, shutting the government down over offshore drilling. There are a million things for our country to figure out and if we are willing to shut down the federal government over offshore drilling then by the time we get to oh, I don't know healthcare, we aren't going to have a government left. What I'm really saying is that Newt should stop being such a drama queen and get over the fact that offshore drilling is small beans no matter how it polls not to mention the fact that shutdowns don't work. Didn't Einstein define insanity as repeatedly trying something and expecting a different result.
obetwo @ 122:
How dare credible people like me and Tyler challenge your almighty all encompassing knowledge. How amusing (not) that you have appointed yourself an expert in economic theory. Of course you don't have a comeback. You never had a credible premise in the first place.
Spare us your arrogance and condescension and take your deranged view of economics somewhere else. I don't have the patience to suffer egotistic fools like you gladly.
Let's see, years ago when Bush the elder vetoed a bill and thus threatened to shut down the government, it was his fault. Later, when Clinton was President (and Gingrich was Speaker), he did veto legislation that actually did shut the government down (he said the legislation was "unacceptable" to him), but this time it was not the President's fault, but the GOP Congress'. Flash forward to today and we are told that if Bush the younger did the same thing as Clinton, it would be his fault if the government shut down. So whose fault is it? President? Congress? President? Oh, I see! If the government shuts down it is always the fault of the branch controlled by the Republicans!
Hypocrites!
...a lovely example republicans are setting for the young people, seeing as how much they love being in charge: if the ballgame ain't goin' your way, just QUIT!
there are governments with a lot less than this country's government and are teetering, and are probably not threatening to pack it in.
the manipulation of the American people is breathtaking.
The level of sophistry of liberals in this thread simply amazes.
A. Oil companies do not receive any subsidies from the government to "buy up battery technology" or anything else. Oil companies receive manufacturing tax credits just like every other manufacturing company in the US AND NO MORE. So not only is Obama lying about government "giveaways" to the oil companies, he doesn't even know the difference between a tax credit and a subsidy.
B. Newt was blamed for the previous shut-downs by the Dems and the media but middle America wanted them in order to stop runaway government spending (that continues to this day). Republicans used to stand for a balanced budget and Newt and the GOP paid the price for this eminently reasonable public policy. Now, ALL congressional Dems and enough Republicans to help them in their runaway government spending sprees, are getting their way and yet, the Republicans still are blamed by the MSM. People who think that the Republicans are at fault for budget deficits are simply not paying attention. Republicans have never held 60 votes in the Senate while holding a majority in the House and had the white house, so they have never held "total power" over the budget process.
C. For all you blithering idiots who think that oil companies are not drilling on some leased lands for some nefarious reasons are children. First of all, do a little research on the subject before you make yourself sound more moronic than you already do. Oil companies make money by drilling. This is why they want ANWR opened up. Are you people saying that as soon as ANWR was opened to drilling that the oil companies would not drill there either?!? Oil companies don't drill in some areas because there is either no oil on those lands or, if they do find oil, litigation prevents them from putting that area into production. Second, I guarantee you that if restrictions on drilling on leased lands was lifted, the oil companies would drill.
And don't you "they won't even drill on currently leased land" people realize how stupid your argument is? If they aren't drilling on current leases then why do you care if the drilling moratorium is lifted on coastal areas and ANWR? According to your logic, they're not going to drill there either right???? So what do you care?
Final word. Newt was hounded out of office for a book deal that, in subsequent years, people like Hillary Clinton have also done, only more so.
Democrats and liberals. Thy name is hypocrisy.
Liberal Drivel Slayer @ 133:
"Over 10 years, the production tax credit saves oil companies $5 billion and the refinery measure and exploration credit a total of about $1.4 billion, according to Congressional Budget Office estimates."
nope, no giveaway there. phhppt.... and of course the poor, poor, poor oil giants need tax credits. phhpt, again.
you excoriate people for their "ignorance" and then, like a bushian, push through your own limited understanding of the argument. then, to top it off, you call people here hypocrites.... wow, the irony is delicious.
you set up a strawman argument and then destroy it with gusto. again, very bushian of you.
if the oil companies won't drill on the land they have they need to give it back to the people of america. it is our land, not your oil companies' land, anyway. and drilling in ANWR, and off shore drilling is a distracting and misleading discussion. neither will have ANY short term effect, and minimal--if any--long term effect on prices. not to mention the 500lb gorilla in the room: it will do NOTHING to ween us from foreign oil. unless you are proposing that we nationalize oil. is that what you propose? you leave so many holes in your reasoning, so many things you gloss over--and fits the stereotype.
there is one thing i agreed with bush on: our addiction to oil. (as a side note check out friedman's column this morning. i am NO friedman fan, he appeals more to the likes of people like you, but check it out). and you and other big oil shills are simply trying to find america a new dealer for our addiction. i guess that makes you a mule.
as far as newt goes, who the fuck cares? newt schmewt, big deal, a has been that will never be a player again. oh, wait a second... newt? is that you?
Republicans.
Bought and paid for by Big Oil.
Spare us your arrogance and condescension and take your deranged view of economics somewhere
bnw H. 528 your comment of the free market providing solutions being a "deranged view of economics" I think says it all about you.
It's really hard to come up with a response after such a amazingly stupefying (the xfiles) ignorant "of the real world" comment like that.
If the free market isn't the solution? then I take it Government is? and People like YOU figuring what's best for all of us.
Get Government out of the way and let the Greed and efficiency of the market fix this energy shortage problem (ya gotta know this true).
Millions of invisible hands with their own self interest will solve this for us not dictates from above ( see corn ethanol )
obetwo @ 136:
i think, again, you are referred back to the basic: you have no idea what you are talking about.
you spew a friedman-esque ideology that has not held up over time, and its failures have left millions upon millions upon millions of people much worse off. while the divide between rich and poor has skyrocketed.
if this were 1982, then maybe you could get some simpletons to accept your 3-card monty scheme. but, alas, its not.
your market fundamentalist ideas and ideals are not only deranged, they are detrimental.
what is boils down to is that you don't trust democracy, you trust the market. and that, bubs, is a call for plutocracy.
obetwo @ 136:
You seem to have the intellectual capacity of a ten year old as you keep bleating out your simplistic psychobabble economic theory like a broken record. And to top it off, you have the egotistic arrogance to believe that whatever you say is absolutely right and others absolutely wrong. Instead of addressing my concerns you ignore them, preferring to condemn and judge those who dare to disagree with you.
I would welcome a reasoned discussion with you anytime, but I have no time for your simplistic nonsense and haughty superiority.
I would welcome a reasoned discussion with you anytime, but I have no time for your simplistic nonsense and haughty superiority.
The previous market based proven solution is hardly simplistic nonsense but I'll bite
A reasoned discussion hmm -- no name calling when someone disagrees?
I reread your posts and couldn't find an answer from you for any of my questions other then a link to apolloalliance
Sure
What in your opinion is the solution to our energy problem besides conservation ( which is non starter for me - I consider it a total failure of a policy)?
I assume your into Boone picken windfarms, Solar, and corn ethanol, and filling up our tires with air, and better mileage vehicles, and government run thermostats on our houses, and carbon taxes but what else?
and your against opening up more land and sea for drilling for oil, and building more nuclear and coal powerplants and building more refineries but what else?
I may have read you wrong,
I'm for all of the above and more (market based of course) except for thermostat control, carbon taxes and corn ethanol, I think other and better and cleaner conversions will be found.
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