Two competing Olympic strategies
By Steve Benen Thursday Aug 14, 2008 7:30amBoth presidential campaigns have invested pretty heavily in television ads for the Olympics, with Obama reportedly spending $5 million, and McCain $6 million. Given reports on high ratings for this year’s games, it’s probably money well spent — a lot of folks will see the commercials.
But it strikes me as interesting how the competing campaigns are going about communicating with this particular audience. Here’s the new Obama campaign spot, the second to run during the Olympics.
It’s a simple, straightforward, positive spot on the economy. There’s not much to dislike. Indeed, it’s reminiscent of the Obama campaign’s first Olympic ad, which was another positive commercial about energy policy and the economy.
The McCain campaign is trying something very different.
Here’s McCain’s spot for the Olympics: “Is the biggest celebrity in the world ready to help your family?” the voice-over asks. “The real Obama promises higher taxes, more government spending. So, fewer jobs.”
The attacks on Obama are patently false, and McCain’s claims about energy policy are equally deceptive, but there’s another question to be considered: who goes negative during the Olympics? MSNBC’s First Read reported:
[L]ike good NBC-Universal employees, we spent much of the weekend watching the Olympics. And during the commercial breaks, we saw plenty of those Obama-is-the-biggest-celebrity-in-world TV ads hitting the presumptive Democratic nominee. But almost every other TV ad we saw — whether it was from Audi, Coke, or the now foreign-owned Anheuser-Busch — was positive and upbeat. Just asking: Are McCain’s ads tonally off for the Olympics? They stuck out because they were darker than every other ad. The good news: The ads stuck out. The bad news: The ads stuck out. It’s a gamble. The message will get across, as all messages from constant negative TV ads do. But will McCain’s own favorable ratings pay a price as well?
People can and will debate the strategic merit behind misleading, negative attack ads in a presidential campaign. But I can’t help but wonder if there’s something unique about the Olympics, and the expectations of the viewing public.
Or, put another way, who goes negative during the Olympics?
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I don't like the part where it says, "end tax breaks for companies that ship jobs overseas" because it sounds like the announcer is saying "AND tax breaks for companies...." When I heard it, I had to read it because I was shocked at what I thought I heard.....
Is Barack Obama the anti-Christ?
I know this is going to seem like a joke, but unfortunately it's not. CNN just spent 10 minutes, with Campbell Brown hosting and three conservative guests, ruminating on the burning question, "Is Barack Obama the anti-Christ?"
Umm ... I'm not usually in the boycott business, but CNN is officially dead to me this election cycle. Not even Fox News has sunk to this level.
We need to lead a revolution against MSM!
Let's fight back!
many are already turned off.
tx @ 2:
Well the acronym MSM is appropriate but we're all confusing "media" with news rather than what it actually is, "entertainment." Should be calling it MSE. 'cause that's what it is. If a story will build ratings and make the corporate unit profits, then it's run and damn the consequences.
The only "revolution" that will make a difference is one that forces a license holder using the public domain to actually broadcast NEWS, just like they used to be required. Until we get the train back on that track I'm afraid there's not much incentive for any of these profit machines to provide their public service responsibly.
Wow, I thought our political process couldn't get any lower. Obama the anti-Christ? Have the religiuos right finally went off the deep end? I hope Obama wins. I want to see these folks freak! "A Black Muslim President! Rapture take me now!"
On "Never Provoke Republicans" (you can't even spell "Republican" without NPR), yesterday, they had a story reporting that 48% of people are 'getting tired' of all the attention being paid to St. Barry, the Changer.
tx @ 2:
Agreed about CNN. At 8:42 AM, I was hoping to see something substantive about Georgia. Instead, a five minute fluff piece about "The Ugly Side of Beauty". Where's good ol' Faux News when you need 'em?
Someone is selling a McCain doll that looks like it is blowing it's top. I think an improvement would be to have it repeatedly bitching and whining about Obama when you pull it's string. That would be perfect.
Even if Obama wins, and he might, our society is in deep trouble. Our ability to respond to challenges has ossified into a culture of proud ignorance where entertainment values prevail over learning what we need to get to the next century.
There's nothing positive about the GOP so naturally, they have nothing positive to offer. Their negative agenda is reflected in their policies, their campaigns and their ads.
What a miserable bunch of phonies they must be.
Their final demise cannot come soon enough.
lovable@9, Very true. Add the numbers of the Baby-boomers in the next couple of years, and our generation is pretty much screwed. The Boomers are the first who scream about taxes but they certainly wont give up their tax funded benefits. Even if they are wealthy.
I don't understand why McCain is allowed to run false ads. I mean, I know that politicians have a history of distorting the truth, but this goes way beyond distortions. When did the big three start allowing this kind of thing to air on their stations? Did I miss the memo that said "we're going to allow any ad to occupy our airtime so long as someone pays for it."?
Sad but true tx. I have been watching the slow death of CNN too. Just a bunch of bimbos spewing the corp line. How can these people praise MC Cain with a straight face anyways ?
Im all for revoking John Roberts Canadian citizenship too. You can keep him.
A worldwide audience of hopeful and happy people for demonstrably false accusations? Reminds me of a joyous wedding and a guest disses the groom. Or a bunch of Youth getting together and planning a party and one says "we can't do this because...". Or my boss calling me at dinner with my family from his vacation telling me I have to go into work on Saturday...
Please Mr Mc43, keep up th good work of reminding people why you are so wrong for the US.
P.D. @ 11:
Especially if they're wealthy.
Well, to be responsive to the question, "who goes negative at the Olympics," the answer is the guy who's behind, of course. That doesn't mean it won't work, however. Sadly, even though the ads are manifestly false -- many of the claims are, in fact, the precise opposite of reality, such as Obama raising taxes on people making $42k -- the majority of viewers will never see the fact check.
As for the anti-Christ shit, I wouldn't worry about it too much. Anybody who actually believes that is not going to vote for Obama in the first place. I have no idea why they would vote for McCain either, except that the con artists who tell them what to think will instruct them to do so, and they will march to the polls like zombies. Nothing anyone can do about that, our constitution gives the vote to demented fools.
It's simple: the rich folks in our extended family will most likely vote for McCain, while the not-rich families (ours included) will vote Obama.
My only hope is that there's more of us than them!
The object of all the athletes is to "win". They want a positive outcome from the games. Everyone around the world also wants a positive outcome for their athletes. For McCain to show nothing but negativity at a time like this, I believe is ill thought out.
This time of the Olympics is a time when people try to put some of their problems behind them and just enjoy the competition. I doubt anyone wants to hear McCain's campaign bitch and moan via a campaign ad.
Obama's ads are showing how he would make our future a little brighter. He, like the athletes and the games, is looking toward a positive outcome.
fastfeat @ 7:
And ten minutes later, another five-minute fluffer about how tough it is to be a reporter! I'm not kidding. Ted Turner probably drinks himself to sleep every night...
Negative is all the McAyn camp has got. Charlie Rose had on Obama economics rep who made a good bit of mileage on the tax cuts favoring sending jobs abroad, and the fact that the U.S. business community pays the least amount of any industrialized nation, because of tax breaks. Good points.
McCain has to go negative, it is all he has. He has no new ideas and all the old ideas he is offering are obvious, demonstrable failures. It is going to get a lot uglier as the election gets nearer and the McCain camp gets more desperate.
Don't the two of them have a debate scheduled for tomorrow night? I thought I heard that somewhere... if so, I hope McCain gets so enraged he has an apoplectic fit right on the telly.
Asking if Obama is the anti-Christ means to me that they have scraped through the bottom of the barrel and are now scraping the mud below it. Has that question ever been asked about another politician? I doubt it. CNN seems to believe those emails that everyone gets but that most of us just delete in disgust.
Is Barack Obama the anti-Christ?
IF McCain gets elected, Its not because people voted for him but to vote against Obama. It's because the MSM and it's blatant lack of integrity.
Dennis Kucinich or Some other Dem with some balls should come up with a legislation against MSM - I dont just mean the Fairness Doctrine debate (equal amounts of conservative and liberal political commentary)
but a legislation to a least fact check, use reasearch and knowing what's actually news not a puff piece.
McCain seems to be seeding his own defense. When people see negative ads, they get depressed. If they hear someone telling them something positive, they are going to gravitate toward that person.
I hope I'm right on this because if I am, Obama wins hands down.
Simon White-Thatch Potentloins @ 24:
Not "defense".... I meant "defeat". Idiot!
kablooie @ 21:
It's not really a debate. First Obama will have one hour of questions he will answer. Then McCain, who will not have heard anything Obama was asked or his answers, will have an hour to be asked the same exact questions Obama was asked. Then at the end, I think they will appear together.
The moderator will be Rev Rick Warren, who from what I can tell sounds like an okay guy for a minister.
You can read more about it here.
fastfeat @ 14:
I'm not sure this is entirely true. I think people now understand that things have to be paid for. They understand that 1/3 or more of the reason for high oil prices is because of the tremendous debt that the Republicans have run up over the last three Republican administrations leaving the Democrats holding the bag. They saw that Clinton left office with a huge surplus and then Bush talking it and giving it to his friends. The most stunning example of what i am saying about people understanding that thigs have to be paid for and tax cut are just feel good words is when McLiar wanted to do a gas tax holiday for the summer. People everywhere said "WTF? How the hell are we going to pay for the bridges that are falling down and roads that are falling apart as we drive to work. This gas tax holiday is nothing but a gimmick and we are not going for it."
PD @ 11 I call bullshit. When our people hit the street in protest in front of McCain's office here in Phoenix, it's mostly Boomers. The younger people are usually counterdemonstrating in a group called the Young Republicans.
Also, I've noticed that a lot of the commenters here at C&L are boomers or older.
Your politics are devisive.
Grow up.
The first people to scream about taxes are Republicans and some Libertarians. They cut across all age groups. They don't like paying their bills. They are proud deadbeats.
This is just slander against Osama
McCain lies, flips-flops, he's Arrogant, presumptuous, elitist, Keating 5 (Should disqualify him), cheater, uses races and accuse Obama of the race card,
Has no plans just his visions of the future, war monger, celebrity, gaffs on foreign affairs his supposed specialty and a hypocrite
But don't Question McCain he's a POW, he can do no wrong.
MSM treats McCain as if he’s a messiah
Thanks POP!
The hubbie and I are having a watch-party with all the essentials. I'm bringing the wine.
McCain's bringing the whine.
kablooie @ 31:
It was my pleasure. We saw McCain on the dairy aisle recently, maybe he'll bring some cheese too
By the time we get to the debates, McCain will be linking Obama to foreign agents, a potential alien invasion, asteroids impacting the earth and athlete's foot.
I heard reports of Cindy's hand being hurt by a well wisher who squeezed her hand too hard. Then this morning I saw her arm in a sling and her hand and wrist appeared to be wrapped or in a cast. Hm mm, all that from a firm handshake? Or did the trollop get her daddy angry?
Negative, scary ads work best well selling terrible products.
If you have nothing positive to say about the product your offering, then the only course of action you have is to attack other products.
Of course, this could backfire... but it does work. The only problem is, the person offering the product better be sure that someone doesn't come along and compare said products side by side so people can see which is the real value...
Like during a debate.
McCain will crash and burn during those debates. He has NOTHING.
The only thing he represents is scared, angry, old, greedy, bigoted white men.
He should just quit now. Retire.
I can just picture him now, standing in the yard of one of his 9 houses, waving a cane, while he screams at clouds.
Mccain's ad says: “Is the biggest celebrity in the world ready to help your family?” the voice-over asks. “The real Obama promises higher taxes, more government spending. So, fewer jobs.”
Holy Crap! I think McCombover is giving us codewords that John Mccain is the REAL Obama! He wishes.
Numinous @ 35:
He does have that weird grin he gives every time he says something stupid.
John j @ 23:
Right, that's the truth, Mcaint will not be voted FOR, Obama will be voted Against by the bigoted, the hateful, the homophobes, the people who want to stand between women and their rights to control their own bodies.
Mcaint is a pitiful old crank who as an elitist with 10 home, private jets, and a ton of money who makes fun of Obama for visiting his Grandma with his kids at Grandma house in Hawaii.
Hopefully US Americans can see through this crap, but then ............
There's a whole lot of stupid out there.
(and good morning POP) it is morning in FLA right?
What's with the "old people support McCain" meme?
Are you afraid that a day after the election Obama will be a loser, just like Kerry, another election, another f**k up, the media will report the story about President McCain EXACTLY THE SAME as if Obama won, but just like Kerry, he just didn't have what it takes, we'll be told, what a pity, but now we have a hero as POTUS, how cool is that, they'll spin, for us, the left, it will be a shock but the corporate media that as of this moment are dictating us who should be the VP will keep going as if nothing happened because for them nothing will happen, Obama will be a senator, Bush will be freed, what about America and Americans? It's going to be a weird feeling when we lose that day, the era of new drilling offshore, onshore and everywhere in between, the era of all of the above as long as 99% is derived from oil, the era of fear mongering, the last phase of the war on the middle-class and so on. Let it not happen people, as we all know, our election loses do happen and each time everyone seems to move along very well but the American people.
Just about the only thing positive people say when they talk about McCain is about something that happened to him about forty years ago. I don't hear them talk about his accomplishments since that time. So what's he got that's positive to talk about in his ads? He has no choice but to attack Obama. Oh sure, he crows that he knows how to win wars and that he knows how to capture Osama, but that sounds so freakin' weak when we have done neither for seven years during which his party was the majority most of the time.
Wow, anti-christ. Is that what passes for news? Wow. Just wow.
Back on topic: seems counter-intuitive (and not in a good way) to have negative ads during the Olympics. Kills the fun and flavor for 30 seconds. I guess when a McCain ad comes up, time to hit the bathroom, grab another snack, or, what I do, throw shit at the tv.
☻Bangkok Bob ☺ @ 38:
Good Morning to you! Yep, it's just about 10am here on a dreary Florida day. The sun must be feeling a bit shy today because it is hiding behind some thick clouds.
O'Really @ 42:
Is that what passes for news?
As long as they are reported by News CORPORATIONS, or if you will, Information MANUFACTURERS, or Fact FACTORIES, News Sweatshops or whatever it is that Corporations do, the answer is -- YES.
When we found out, to our sorrow, that Bush has won a second term, I didn't think I could keep my sanity for four more years. Now here it is, four years later, and I am four years older. I don't think that four years of hanging in there has prepared me to face four years of McCain. My sanity is even more fragile now than it was in 2004.
If Obama is the "Auntie Christ", shouldn't the fundies vote for him? Wouldn't that fulfill their prophecies? Let's see a thirty second spot of that.
fastfeat @ 18:
Probably, but he doesn't own CNN anymore per se. (Well, according to one article (May 2003) he owns less that 4 percent of AOL — but that's the largest single ownership by an individual shareholder).
"But will McCain’s own favorable ratings pay a price as well?"
Yes, most definitely. People are burned out from this election cycle. It's been going on too long.
IMO, People who were tuning into the Olympics were looking for some relief from politics.
Another miss step by McCain.
An urgent policy, what a concept.
Would someone please call Ted Turner and get a response on CNN doing the Obama/anti-Christ story?
this ad is just a recycling of the older ads. mccain campaign should think of something new
Video: Baracky Part 2
*WARNING ahead- Read this on another blog
a href="http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article4535173.ece">This is interesting.
It's really irritating when Russian propaganda is obviously propaganda and yet also possibly true. Remember how Rove used 9/11 specifically for the 2002 elections? If Cheney really believes keeping the White House is the most important thing to do to protect our national security, then why wouldn't he use this strategy if he thought it would be successful? Not saying this is what's going on, I don't think it is, just saying that it's really irritating that I can't dismiss crackpot theories like this out of hand anymore.
This is interesting.
fderk @ 51:
I truly enjoyed watching that video. Thanks for sharing it.
Red Headed StepChild @ 1:
Didn't john mcCain work with dick armey to create the legislation that rewards corporations for shipping jobs out of America?
Red Headed StepChild @ 1:
That happened to me too. They should fix that.
ThunderMonkey @ 47:
That was my point. I'd think it's got to nauseate him to see what has been done with his brainchild that held so much promise when he developed it. Not saying alcohol would cure a father's dismay, but I know I can't watch much of the CNN "family"--Wolfboy, Nancy (Dis)grace, Glenn Dreck--without drinking myself...
cobsjo @ 53:
Link doesn't work.
NOTHING would surprise me from this administration, however.
P.D. @ 11:
If i were an irascible person, I might suggest you take your IPOD, your Blackberry, and your Prius and shove 'em someplace stinky. To the extent that you still enjoy ANY human rights, civil liberties, or personal freedom, it is NOT beacuse of anything YOU did, cully. Some of us 'whiny' Boomers got gassed, beaten, trampled by horses, and otherwise got our asses kicked for our efforts in behalf of the country and the constitution.
(Dear Mods: I am i being 'abusive,' or is the original post "flame-bait" to which I rose like a prize trout?)
fastfeat @ 57:
Gotcha. Didn't Nancy's contract expire with CNN without renewal?
I heard that Glenn may not get renewed as well.
Chicken Hussein Little - NOT!! @ 4:
Her?:
"Personal life:
On April 2, 2006, Brown married her second husband Daniel Samuel Senor (born 1971), a Republican consultant who regularly appears on Fox News.[6][7] ... "
No conflict there ...
Captain Bitter Whiner Hussein Kangaroo @ 37:
He also has his buddies ginning up WW3 so a War Hero President is the only one who can save us all.
I just DVR the Olympics, then skip the commercials, political or not. I just wish November would come so I can go into the ballot box, hold my nose, vote for Obama, and then sit back and watch him bend over like 99% of the Democrats.
**Sorry here is the link!
This is interesting.
Russians were told over breakfast yesterday what really happened in Georgia: the conflict in South Ossetia was part of a plot by Dick Cheney, the Vice-President, to stop Barak Obama being elected president of the United States.
{ Back on topic Please. We have an open thread . SiteMonitor}
BigSky @ 63:
CBC.ca has about 8 live feeds for different events. Cool to watch excellent camera coverage with crowd noise but NO commentary or commercials ... USA/Canada womens soccer this a.m. was great.
Chicken Hussein Little - NOT!! @ 4:
I agree!!!
I was thinking about this last night because of a related discussion on slashdot where folks were debating the merits or problems of imposing "balance" on the blogosphere (most agreed that freedom of speech trumps any concerns about balance when it comes to the blogosphere, just like if you were standing on the street corner on a soap box).
Anyway, it got me thinking ... why are these wild speculative opinion pieces even allowed on "news" programs? This stuff is not news. They're not giving us facts. They're encouraging wildly destructive speculation, and making a profit from it. I don't think anyone is better informed by garbage like that.
My opinion in the end is that when it comes to news agencies or others who would call themselves journalists, opinions should be left out as much as possible. The news media should be used to inform, not to convince.
The Television commercials are trying to train people to believe what?
woody @ 59 Right on, bro! Not to mention the fact that many boomers answered their country's call in good faith, found out about the lie called Vietnam through bitter and deadly experience, and came back to join the hundreds of thousands of people already protesting in the streets.
These veterans testified in Congress (Winter Soldiers) and founded groups such as Veterans for Peace.
Is Doughy Pantload a Boomer? Sawnoff Hannity? Tucker Carlson?
For most of my life time anything coming out of Moscow was dismissed as obvious bullshit from an authoritarian regime incapable of telling the truth about anything.
Now it is our own government that has lost all credibility and has morphed into an authoritarian regime incapable of telling the truth about anything.
So when Russia says that the Georgian attack is about Cheney trying to get McCain elected by reviving "old cold war fears"... it is within the realm of possibilities and needs to be considered.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article4535173.ece
Anti-Christ (Obama)? No, not Obama...How about this theory? What if "Catholicism and Democracy", as a whole, was the Anti-Christ? Think about it!
Since the early 1900's, our country and our allies, have been on this great mission to make every other nation in the world a Democracy. And we set up Catholic and Christian churchs to sway the people of those nations. How do we usually do this? We bomb them! (Death and Destruction) Sounds evil to me.
Why do "We" think we are so Righteous? What gives us the right?
I don't think the Mccain ad does well. Forget all the negative stuff, it is just poorly written. When she says "renewable energy? energy independence?" it sounds like she is mocking those concepts.
I dunno; back when we had the teevee we used to mute all of the ads.
I would have to say that the 20th century Olympics were originally launched in the spirit of hope and peaceful competition. Obama's ad is consistant with this noble sentiment. McKeating's ad is creepy.
pd@11
There is no valid reason for you to make such generalizations about anybody's generation. Being a Boomer myself, I recognize that the don't raise taxes issue is largely a manipulative tool invented by Republicans to pander to voters. In reality, it is a sign of their incompetence and lack of fiscal integrity. I am very concerned about the current debt our government has run up thanks to the free spending Neocons---and the reality is that eventually becomes an IOU to everyone--but especially younger people whose lives undoubtedly will be compromised by it.
I wanted you to know that there are other centered people in my generation that are concerned about the legacy we will leave yours. The worst possible outcome is that we knew what to do and chose to do nothing. To what extent I can change it, I will not permit this to happen. Having the cooperation and help of your generation will be an essential element in changing America for the better. I trust that you will do what you can.
McCainFries' cash cow Ralph Reed has a five inch taint.
The purpose of the McCain attack ads are obvious AND they are working. The idea is to divert attention away fron the old senile ignorant gaff-pron idiot with nothing to say and everything to hide, beginning with his corruption in the Keating mess, the wrong positions on the war and ecomony and the fact that he missed more Senate votes than any senator in the USA. He is simply pathetic, but the ads are brilliant and are doing their intended purpose.
I wanted you to know that there are other centered people in my generation that are concerned about the legacy we will leave yours. The worst possible outcome is that we knew what to do and chose to do nothing. To what extent I can change it, I will not permit this to happen.
YES--All us Dems are concerned, but not the Repub$. Don't forget their motto:
"I got mine, phuc everybody else"
ThunderMonkey @ 60:
Not sure. I think I heard something about that with Dreck. I've got a feeling they'll have to have an armed escort present to get Disgrace out of the studio. She's so in love with the camera, I bet she'd work for free.
justgrubit @ 70:
Democracy was never seen as a "revolutionary doctrine" until the Neocons attempted to make it so. Cold war opposition to the Soviet Union was seen as a defensive stance taken against the revolutionary doctrine of Communism.
Up until Bush and Cheney, we had the doctrine that we would never be the one to do the "first strike" and Bush, Cheney, Wolfowitz, and the rest of the Neocons turned that upside down.
First strikes were seen as war crimes and war waged for plunder of another nation's assets (oil) were also seen as war crimes... and they are.
No nation has the right to arbitrarily invade another whether is Georgia or Iraq.
What ever "moral high ground" the United States had was wiped out with the Bush/Cheney administration... now our government does all the things that totalitarian regimes have been criticized for since the rise of Nazi Germany... lack of due process, protection of civil liberties, torture, destruction of privacy rights and spying on our citizens.
Well, two things:
1. I don't know many conservatives that aren't "elite" (read: rich) that watch the Olympics anyway. Nascar or UFC sure, but seeing a bunch of "mamby-pamby prisses" parading around on mats and in pools doesn't seem "masculine" enough for the average so-called republican "Average Joe". So chances are they aren't seeing McCain's attack ad anyway, which is bad for McCain because...
2. Negative works work the "Average Joe". He or she doesn't have time to research candidates, and knowing their penchant for Jerry Springer level discourse, these ads are right up their alley. Positive is wasted on these folks as they have nothing really positive in their lives anyway... Low pay, high gas prices, too many bills. About the only thing they look forward to is that beer at the end of the day to drink their cares away.
So yeah, McCain wasted $6 Million, but not because he went negative, but rather because he didn't know his audience. This is the same problem Obama has when he throws out positive ads to the "Average Joe" who doesn't respond to positive. The "Average Joes" have been conditioned over the last several decades to gradually realize that everything is hopeless. Maybe 150 years ago we had hope for the future, maybe even 50 years ago we still had a little hope amid the fear that nuclear holocaust was right around the corner. But since that "golden age" we have had Viet Nam imposed on us, racial violence, war on drugs, war on terror, and countless government regulations meant to demoralize and domesticate the average American. We now can only respond to negative since the world has been made so negative. Positive is seen as a lie, an impossible dream, in this climate.
So I fear that Obama will lose ultimately if he doesn't go negative, even to defend himself. It is not the veracity that is important, but rather the tone. So he can defend himself from McCain's lies, so long as he does it in a negative way. That's all that matters. So call McCain out for being the liar and the crook that he is, and MOST importantly, call out his trump card: POW. Do extensive research and poke as many holes in that as you possibly can. Without his "war hero" trump, he has no leg to stand on. He can't use the "You can't attack me, I was a POW" meme he has turned to so often. So long as Obama is afraid to attack that, he has no hope of winning whatsoever.
By the way, being a POW sucks, no doubt, but I fail to see how that makes you a "war hero". For me, a war hero is someone who sacrifices himself for the benefit of his fellow troops. As soon as you start using that for personal gain, however, you lose that status. But getting shot down and imprisoned for 5 years doesn't automatically make you a war hero, in my opinion.
If i recall correctly...
McCain top advisor Charlie Black that another terrorist attack within the United States would provide a political benefit to McCain.
"We Are All Georgians". NO and there are many countries that also need help. US is make it personal for pipelines and now maybe to use against Obama
Neocons are creating another cold war.
Neocons? Wrong frame. Neo Nazis.
john j @ 80:
Men who are willing to do anything to extend and consolidate their power as we have seen with Bush and Cheney will do anything to keep it... they won't arbitrarily give it away to the opposition party.
Given every thing that has come to light about their criminal activities and utter contempt for the law that Bush and Cheney have shown... anything is possible.
http://current.com/items/89163220_sy_hersh_cheney_neocons_considered_kil...
Do I believe that Cheney was behind Georgia's initial attack on S. Ossetia to revive cold war fears to get McCain elected? I don't necessarily give credence to Russian claims... but after everything that Cheney has done... it is most certainly within the realm of possibilities!
James in Colorado @ 79:
I think you're exactly correct.
That's exactly correct too, and when Gen. Clark dared even to broach the topic, suggesting something that should be even less controversial -- that POW experience is not itself sufficient experience for the presidency -- the right wing machine demonstrated another of its tactics. It had its media-heads yammer angrily, endlessly and at high volume in order to legitimate a position that was utterly without merit.
I'm not entirely sure it was a waste. Any negative ads get people talking, and they'll be replayed for free by talking heads on "news" casts.
I hear what you're saying, though I don't think positive ads, even aimed at the average Joe, are necessarily wasteful. They do respond to positive somewhat. The mistake is thinking that they reward you for taking the high road. Positive ads can be effective. Not responding to negative ads with other negative ads under the belief that positive is enough is suicide.
I would say more that the average Joe has been conditioned to fear that no matter how bad things get, they will always get worse by risking a vote for someone who promises to make things better. Better, they think, to stick with what they know -- someone who's at least "one of them," who'll at least let them keep their culture and rituals when that's all they have -- than to vote for someone who promises something new and better. They want what the Democrats have to offer. They don't think it's impossible. But they do believe what the Republicans have scared them into believing. That the Democrats hate them and everything they live for, even if they promise better policies.
Yes. Obama should go negative, and in a blatant way. Give the chattering/hobnobbing class something to sink their teeth into. And ad like:
John McCain says that Barack Obama will raise your taxes. John McCain is an effing LIAR! John McCain says that Barack Obama is inexperienced. John McCain is an effing LIAR! He lied to his first wife about his affair; he lied about his stances on immigration and campaign finance reform. Why would you believe he isn't lying to you now? John McCain is an effing LIAR. He knows it. So do you.
No matter how McCain's campaign and media surrogates respond, that kind of negative ad opens up the door for repeating as often as possible all the things about which McCain lies, and simultaneously touting Obama's actual policies.
I would imagine this is actually one of the reasons Gen. Clark is still in the running for the VeeP slot. They can resurrect this conversation, and be ready for it. They'll win it if they play it right.
I think that obama is actually going to put a change in the world. When Mcain is only trying to be a president for the fun of it. it is like mcain is only trying to use us. When obama is president nobody will regret it, for he is going to be the best president ever in history. mcain will not make a change in the world. In his add you can see that he is only trying to make people vote for him. With obamas add he is telling you that he can make a change in the world with the help of you. I hope obama hears this message.
I'm Hate Face Christ Rifle and I approve this message.
Regarding all of the incisive comments about MSM (more correctly referred to as Corporate Media/CM), has anyone ever thought about what would happen if all intelligent people stopped watching their b.s? Maybe if these ridiculous "news" shows started losing great numbers of viewers the CM might decide to present some actual news just to get viewers back.
I propose a boycott of all corporate news shows (except for Keith Olberman's), and let them know you are boycotting.
Gail @ 87:
It's a good proposal, but the 90% don't realize it's BS. So since they don't know any better, we 10% would be the only ones boycotting the MSM/CM (I already do anyway, I just watch clips of what I want off of YouTube or here).
I approve of that ad. I think this shipping jobs overseas/outsourcing is an abomination. And then these corporate guys don't want social programs to support the people who lost their jobs and can't get jobs because of oursourcing!
tx @ 2:
You must have missed one important point last night during that segment. At the end, they showed a clip of Tim LeHaye, one of the authors of the "Left Behind" series. He even said that he had to come forward to address all the Obama is Antichrist talk and he said very clearly that when the Antichrist comes, no one will know it is him. So, that blows that theory out of the water! But, I also read online that he has stated the Antichrist will not come from America, which is true. Revelations states that he will come from the East; we're in the West.
But, I'm totally with you about boycotting the MSM in general! They are doing a terrible job of covering these two campaigns. While there are a few journalists and pundits that are starting to come around to the fairer position, for the most part they are enabling a McCain Presidency.
They nitpick every little thing about Obama, but the ignore all the important gaffes that McCain has made, especially on Foreign Policy, which is supposedly his "specialty"! As Josh Marshall just posted on TPM, John McCain said: "My friends, we have reached a crisis, the first probably serious crisis internationally since the end of the Cold War. This is an act of aggression." He just said that today! Hmmmm. Oh yeah, Afghanistan, IRAQ, Kosovo, etc WEREN"T Crises, huh?
I'm beginning to think the MSM wants McCain to win so that THEY won't be under the microscope when ALL the truth comes out about the failed Bush "Imperial Presidency", as Andrew J. Bacevich, (the retired Army Colonel and International Relations expert) calls it. And the American public will THEN start to ask them why they didn't do their job for 8 years!
BTW, Andrew will be on PBS's Bill Moyers show tonight, 9 pm/ Looks like a must watch!
mrspeel @ 90:
I boycotted MSM a few years back. It was to a point where I could not trust anything they were saying. Then there were important stories, I knew were out there, but they were totally ignored. I guess this peaked between 2002-2005. Even media outlets I had trusted for years (WaPo, NYT, CNN) became unreliable. Critical stories/articles, exposés, etc. were relegated to page 18 and beyond. I credit Bill Moyers documentary, Buying the War (April 2007), for giving the media a cold slap in the face. Since 2006, I have seen a steady, although tentative improvement in reporting. But, I mainly get that from threads on C&L and similar. The McClatchy Washington Bureau is the one source I have a great deal of respect for. They were the only ones who bucked the system and actually got the Iraq story correct. This shows the truth was out there for anyone willing to be professional journalists.
As far as this AntiChrist BS goes, why would anyone bother reporting on something most people do not even believe in, except for the religious types? I am sick of everything in this Country having to pass the neocon evangelic 'sniff test'. It is well past time for these people to be reigned in. That will not happen as long as the MSM keeps making them significant.
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