Pointing out the obvious: Self Correcting Conservatives
I've been saying that this is the time America was finally ready to turn away from the phony notion that being a conservative is a good thing---go left and reject conservatism completely. I mean, it's been an utter failure and John McCain has been a big part of that failure. I've been calling on the Obama campaign to attack the ideals that conservatism apply. Not to be used like a wedge issue since he has been running on a platform of bipartisanship, (I disapprove of that also) but to point out the obvious. If a party hates government then they will prove how bad government is. And what we get are people left stranded in NOLA with no water for a week as an example of how dangerous it is.
Well, all summer we had a chance to point that out to America, but unfortunately that did not happen and now we're left watching John McCain try to remake the image of his party while he gets sucked into the conservative Borg organism in the process. And the media rejoices. He's a Maverick they say! What a guy. And if you believe the polls, the public is buying it to so far.
I've also thought that this would come down to the debates because Americans just don't know Obama all that well and when he's side by side with McSame, America will truly see the difference. It's tough to wait it out till then, but that's going to be the defining moments I think in this election unless some really bad news or crazy gaffes take place.
Digby has a great post up called: Self Correcting Conservatives. The Republicans do a great job of defining liberals and The Democratic Party lets them get away with this crap every time.
And I always felt that Democrats should have run hard against conservatism itself so that a majority of voters would reject the GOP brand no matter who was wearing it. Instead we saw airy campaigns rife with symbols of liberal progress and the promise of some new post partisan agreement that only one side had signed on to. Indeed, they have all spent way too much time for the last year extolling the other side, genuflecting to their icons and pretending that there was some national consensus that everyone wanted Democrats to stop their vicious partisanship --- when they hadn't lifted a finger. It's been maddening to watch.
So here we are. It doesn't mean Obama will lose, of course. He probably won't. Their side is even fundamentally weaker now than when the campaign began. But since both sides decided to run on personality and symbols we now have an empty campaign. McCain had no choice because his party is as decrepit as he is and their ideas are even more dessicated. But Democrats didn't have to help them hide it. If they had worked a little bit harder at discrediting conservatism itself, people wouldn't have felt so comfortable coming back to it, which is what Nate Silver thinks may have happened. There's much about the Obama campaign that I admire. But I have always believed it was a mistake to box themselves into a post-partisan trap...read on.
Face it
the democrats suck too
everyone is wanting something different, even many so called McCain supporters
(especially the ones recently sucked in by Palin)
The Dems need to grow a backbone and call out these republican F****UP'S. GROW A DAMN SPINE AND FIGHT!!!!!
I know that people have to work together, but I've always hated the Dems who would roll over and play dead whenever the Republicans bullied them. It has peeved me to no end. I'm also tired of the Dems who say that certain Republicans are their "friend". Don't they know that the Republicans do not do so in kind? They could care less who their friends are. Instead, they use such a relationship as a fact-finding mission, to find something new to weaken the Democrats.
It is like giving comfort to the enemy.
That's why this crap has to be put to bed. No more sycophants. it is time for a change in the Democratic party where there are people who will fight back when necessary and finally plant a foot in a Republican's ass if need be.
The day is over for compromise. The Republicans "comprised" us to the back of the bus and everyone knows it. :(
Term limits.
[Deleted. Spam. Site Monitor]
Republicans can't even run on their own party platform anymore.
It seems like the GOP brand of conservatism has been evolving way over to the extremist right....
Leaving the GOP moderates and Reagon types in the dust...
That's the people we should be courting right now....
....I ...ahhh.... (sigh)... ahh fuck it... whole situation speaks for itself... all or most republicans are criminals who would steal the nations treasury blind, stab anyone in the back to get ahead and kiss the victims baby while doing it, and dems to a large degree are evidently spineless cowards, simpletons and dupes that can easily be led by the nose by the opposition party apparachiks and/or immoral co-conspirators in all the shit that's come down the pike pretty much for the last 30 plus years since Reagan...No futher comment by me needed........JD
I can't begin to tell how disappointed I am in Obama. Heard him on Keith last night and he continues to push "I believe the American people are smart enough to see through the Republicans." Sorry Sen. Obama, the American people are NOT smart enough.
The Democrats continue to play nice, they will not fight back. When the American voters see how complacent the Democrats are don't you think they might just think the Democrats don't necessarily disagree with the Republicans. The msm will not tell the truth about Palin's lies and that McCain continues to support Bush's policies. All we see on TV defending the Democrats are people I have never seen or heard of; who are these people? Where are the Democrats that we know?
We know Palin and McCain are lying but apparently it is working. A lie is a lie, is a lie, is a lie. How do these people sleep at night?
TOTALLY AGREE!
Could you imagine how the right would handle the following?
Illegitimate Baby/Absent Parents
Book Banning
Taking earmarked money then not doing what the said they would do.
Redneck son in law
Over expensing person items to the tax payers (i.e snowmobiling)
Short skirts
Driving a small town into millions in debt.
C'mon guys this should be shooting fish in a barrel. Crap.. the Republicans mocked a bonafide Vietnam vet and got away with it.
kucinich 08 !
This time it's not about spinelessness, it's about cluelessness.
What the Republicans are good at is framing and marketing. Watch 'Mad Men.' Listen to Don Draper. He is the model of the modern Republican: everything is about creating an image in the mind of the viewer.
This is how Democrats lose elections: they believe that presenting the facts and outlining the obvious advantages of their proposals will convince voters to support them.
They're not wrong about that, as some cynics might think. It's just that it's preaching to the choir at this point.
If the two parties were of comparable strength on the issues and the solutions they offered were complex and varied, then campaigning on issues would be central to success.
But the reality-based vote is already firmly in the Democratic camp. As Bill Maher asked (supposedly undecided) Scott McClellan: "what are you going to hear in the next six weeks that will make up your mind?"
Exactly. Anyone who is persuadable based solely on charts and graphs is won over at this point. The undecideds are probably mostly giving Obama the edge on the charts and graphs, but they put a lot of weight on narrative, framing, values, relatability, etc.
They're not looking to hire a manager for the country. They're looking to fall in love. What do people fall in love with? Independent images of success that flatter.
Consider self-help gurus. Do they focus on sober, critical analysis of various life strategies and then present the messy but realistic landscape using visual aids and simple analogies? Or do they focus on telling you that YOU'RE GREAT! LOOK AT THIS WATCH! I USED TO BE NOT-GREAT, BUT NOW I AM GREAT AND I CAN HELP YOU BECOME EVEN MORE GREAT AND THEN YOU'LL BE ABLE TO AFFORD A NICE WATCH!
...taking it down...
...and folks sometimes ask me if a watch can really make you happy and I think, they just don't get it. You know what I'm talking about. I can see that. Some of you here get it. Some of you here are just getting it for the first time, but you're also feeling like you've known it all along. It's not the watch. It's the power and personal freedom that the watch represents.
And that's what we're gonna talk about today...
This isn't about making offers. This is about persuasion. Persuasion may not be able to break with rationality altogether. I doubt McCain/Palin could get very far telling us their energy plan was to pray for it to rain oil. But persuasion can bend rationality quite a ways.
You have to flatter the voters. You have to paint a picture of Obama's America(tm) that has a bright, shiny place for them.
That's why the Jesus stuff works so well for the Republicans. Christianity is the template. Wrap it in a flag and serve it on a bun and you're halfway home.
The extreme right, of which Palin and McCain are now a part of, want to ultimately destroy the union that is the United States of America. They want to bankrupt the country. Make it an utter failure and then propose to dissolve the union into North, South, Hawaii, and Alaska. 4 separate countries. That is the only way the extreme right can get their fundamentalist views into the mainstream and upheld by moral law. This is their goal. George Bush was the beginning of the end of the union.
MUST SEE!!!
Norm Coleman: The Running Man
goldenjoe @ 1:
Yeah, we Democrats suck too. But at least we are a greater representation of what this nation CLAIMS to be. And sure, some of us were reluctant followers into the Republican shithole we are presently in and yes.... blood is on our hands. But the Republicans bathe themselves in the blood of the helpless and innocent....and they love it.
The debates are the next setup.
The third debate will be moderated by Bob Schieffer, and it will be an open forum where the candidates will get to ask questions to each other.
Yeah, so we have to softball McCain, otherwise Obama is abusing an old man and war veteran...meanwhile McCain will basically ask Obama why he hates America.
ATTACK ATTACK ATTACK. We're going to get abused for abusing an old man anyway...ok...then attack him...DESTROY HIM...and let at least lose on PRINCIPLES.
2 things come to mind about this -- 1) the Democrats have a conscience, ie, they're concerned about coming off as accurate speakers whose sound-bites won't be taken out of context, distorted by the Right, and come back to *grinning* bite them later. The GOPers, however, are completely unencumbered by conscience at all, don't care about being accurate, honest, aren't troubled by petty crap like morals or, uh, truth -- and so they'll say and do anything to get elected. So the Republicans are free to lie through their corrupt teeth at every turn, beating at the Dems below the belt over and over again, and the Democrats seem weak by comparison, taking the so-called high road (to where? defeat?) and coming off looking like bumbling idiots.
(side note: when Barack had the chance, with Keith Olbermann last night, why oh why didn't he just call a lie a lie? and a liar a liar? dancing AROUND the topic instead of nailing the topic down to the floor, where it belongs? whaaaaaaaaaaaaa?)
But 2) this self-correcting conservatism (great phrase, however chilling), reminds me of the way infectious bacteria operate when given repeated doses of anti-biotics -- they just keep adapting & mutating, the wily creeps, until the antibiotic is ineffective.
I once defined conservatism as the intersection of racism, greed and religious prejudice. If you look at the bedrock of conservatism most of their principles are based on that. Of course a dose of militarism is thrown in.
I agree Dems should have always attacked conservatism as "the cancer of conservatism" because it amazingly gets people to vote against their own best interests.
I wish Obama ran an ad of Mc Cain's voting 90% of the time with Bush followed by him stealing Obama's message of Change and calling him "Me Too McCain." "A man can't lead if he keeps following".
And I always felt that Democrats should have run hard against conservatism itself
Like, duh. I've always wanted "conservative" to be a dirty word, seeing as how its ideology runs against the idea of America itself.
You are so right about bad repugnician government. It's easy for government agencies to be terrible when they are underfunded (deliberately ) and have repugnician incompetent cronies to head them. Fema was given rave reviews by both parties and state governments under Clinton but we all remember how Bush's Brownie did a great job ruining it. This is deliberate , they want people to complain when these incompetents foul up and they can claim that the democrats made it that way. Remember , everything is Bill Clinton's fault even eight years after the fact.
"I’ve been calling on the Obama campaign to attack the ideals that conservatism apply"
You're a riot there Johnny!
You've been calling, but they haven't listened to you? hmmm
Crackpotpress @ 10:
One crucial mistake of the Obama/Biden ticket is their apparent inability to switch gears regarding to what the situation is at hand....
That is a major concern to me....
Forget about being nice....you don't have to lie....just show clips of McCain/Palin just being themselves (Grampa Simpson/clueless VP pick) that's it....like I said before one picture worth a thousand words.....
I am not going to sit around and wish the next 4 to 8 years away like I did these last 8. If McCain is elected, I probably will move away, either back to Canada or to Ireland. Either way, it will be better than this nation of fools. I give up.
I hope to God Obama and Biden and others in their camp grow a spine in the next few weeks and start hitting them long and hard on these lies. THe time for playing nice has past. Fuck it. As someone said before, the reality based community is firmly in the democratic camp. The ones to convince are the mouthbreathers who get all their information from what they are told and those on the teevee. I fear that Obama might let this election slip through his fingers because he has chosen to take the high rode. In a fist fight, there is no 'fair fight'. The one who fights fair will end up getting his ass whipped. Politics is a fist fight. That is what will happen to Obama if he and his camp don't watch out.
The latest news is all of a sudden...the Obama campaign is broke and McCain received $47 million in donations this month.
The public has spoken.
What a joke.
edit "high road"
Doublespeak as Art Form
by Leonard Pitts Jr.
http://www.commondreams.org/view/2008/09/08-2
"We need change, all right. Change from a liberal Washington to a conservative Washington. We have a prescription for every American who wants change in Washington -- throw out the big-government liberals."- Mitt Romney, Sept. 3, 2008.
. . . If you're a regular here, you've heard me rant from time to time about intellectual dishonesty -- to argue that which you know to be untrue and to substitute ideology for intellect to the degree that you'll do violence to language and logic rather than cross the party line.
And no one does it like Republican conservatives. They are to intellectual dishonesty what Michael Jordan was to basketball: the avatar, the exemplar, the paradigm. They have elevated it beyond hypocrisy and political expedience. They have made it ... art.
Which returns us to the astonishing thing Mitt Romney said while addressing the party faithful in St. Paul, Minn. You want to walk around it the way you would Michelangelo's "David," admiring the elegance of the workmanship. You hesitate to touch it, much less pull it apart. To do so seems almost an act of desecration.
Unfortunately, some of us are too plodding and earthbound, too blind to the seductions of art, too stubbornly wedded to some vestigial notion that intellectual honesty matters, to walk past a steaming pile of bovine excreta without calling it a steaming pile of bovine excreta.
So excuse me, beg pardon, so sorry, but I have to ask: What liberal Washington is he talking about? The federal government has three branches. The legislative, i.e., Congress, was under conservative control from 1995 until 2007. The judicial, i.e., the Supreme Court, consists of nine justices, seven of whom were nominated by conservative presidents. The executive, i.e., the president, is George W. Bush. Enough said. . . .
I think you have it wrong when you say the 'debates will decide this'. In the last 10 days since the Rep convention, with almost no pushback from the Dems, the Rep's have savaged Obama and team. Even in the last 2 days or so, with reporters throwing out good, answerable questions to Obama that provide a platform to strike McCain, he won't push back. I have loyally watched him, hoping for the soundbite that will resonate, the restatement of 'enough' so profoundly spoken at the Dem convention, and it is not there. He is not fighting. He is, instead, 'talking' too much. (I wonder what's happened to that part of him that learned how to box in Indonesia with his step-dad...I know he learned how to deliver a punch). In the meanwhile, attitudes and decisions from undecideds have hardened, as reflected in the polls. Don't you see...the Reps want the thing decided BEFORE the debates, so that there will be nothing to debate. MCain will approach the debates the same way he approached Saddleback...2 word answers and snappy comebacks. Barack, please. I'm begging you. Get concise. Do it now. Please stop saying 'if John wants to have a debate about this, we're happy to do so.' It's already getting too late for this.
samdog @ 23:
You're not the only one.
It will be interesting to see what happens if they do win. It is very possible, I believe, that we may actually see a significant emigration away from this country.
CNN just blurted out that 57% of Americans believe Sarah Palin could handle the Presidency if called apon. Unreal!
Steve E @ 30:
Ignorance truly is bliss.
The bar is so low in this country...barn animals can run for President and win.
I can only hope that groups like Moveon.org will ignore Obama and take the fight to them.
It is obvious to anyone with half a brain cell, the republicans are nothing "but", lying, thieves and criminals.
It is obvious somebody is racking in record debt.
It is obvious somebody is racking in record profits.
It is obvious somebody is breaking all the rules.
It is obvious somebody who has the powers, the duties, the sworn oathes, is not enforcing the law.
Obviously, nothings been changed after all the true facts have been found.
Obviously, they will continue on to rule, in a system that's...."as is".
Steve E @ 30:
Wolf loves to blitz GOP anuses.
At some point the great majority of Americans are going to have to ask themselves if the Republican economic values are really working for them. Do they really enjoy being trickled on?
#12 Actually that is one hell of a show "Mad Men"---It does show similarities on how the Republican brand has probably been framed.
We have lost the fundies a long time ago and it really doesn't matter because they are not the majority...
We need to frame our response to people outside the traditional Democratic sphere without compromising our values...
That's where the GOP has us, because they don't have any values just tag lines conveniently added (like conservative) without it remotely reflecting the actual product their selling....
For all our sake, the Democrats have to keep pointing to our economy and the stock markets reaction to a Republican administration which will not change this status quo.
Everything the Reps have been saying is wrong-wrong-wrong, their drill-drill-drill means little as oil drops 40% and commodities with it. It is the economy and Dems must scream "The worst is yet to come!!" and it is- and it is the Republicans which have put us here. Keep reminding the voters again and again, IT IS THE REPUBLICANS WHO PUT US HERE! John McCain will keep us here, the man doesn't have a clue and for the sideshow Palin, is just that....a glamor puss sideshow.
MBrillson
In all life one should comfort the afflicted, but verily, also, one
should afflict the comfortable, and especially when they are
comfortably, contentedly, even happily wrong.
John Kenneth Galbraith
The problem with the Democratic Party is that they are NOT liberal.
Imperialist foreign policy? Same. Corporate enabling? Same. Economic free market capitalism? Same. Privacy rights? Same. Health care for insurance companies? Same. Government accountability? Same.
Last night Keith tried to let Obama know how the rest of us are thinking and feeling. Obama continues to play the same game. He will never say anything to stop the Republicans' lies; he will never say anything bad about McCain or Palin; he will never lower himself (in his eyes only) to get really upset and tell the Republicans enough is enough!
The people who are haters of black people, who are lovers of a woman who has lied consistently about her record as mayor/governor in Alaska, who are lovers of a fake hero who doesn't know s**t about the economy and only dreams of the power and glory he will receive as POTUS; these people will NEVER vote for a Democrat. So why not go ahead and blow apart the Republican platform of lying and hatred.
I guess it just isn't in Obama's or Biden's natures to fight dirty. I will be the first to admit I was wrong when the Democrats win the election; but til then I don't plan any celebrations in November.
It isn't in my nature to hate; but I do hate the Republicans who are trying to tear this country apart; who lie to get in power; who will do anything (steal elections) to win; who think I am stupid. The Republicans are not only tearing apart our country they are dividing the populace by hatred and lies.
Also, I honestly believe that if Pelosi and Reid had done their jobs, Karl Rove would be behind bars now. That would probably have slowed the Republicans down considerably.
(hope everyone's writing to the Obama/Biden campaign with these thoughts and comments. the message needs to be: FIGHT BACK NOW!)
Liberal AND Proud @ 34:
i can't believe that wow........that has been an argument that i thought made some sense no matter
what your party affiliation.
if mccain can't serve as early as March/09 palin would
step in.........i'm not convinced at all she is ready and/or would be ready. i still think the argument has
strength.
Liberal AND Proud @ 34:
She can't even handle the press. Where do they get these statistics, their arses?
Miss A. @ 41:
They needs to get really, really mean...
But let the surrogates handle that business...
Let Obama/Biden be above the fray....
i heard she'll be ready/prepared in a couple weeks.
i am curious to know if palin/mccain campaign will get
questions prior to palin interview or will she be in a
'cone of silence'???
John Amato's quote on Obama: "Not to be used like a wedge issue since he has been running on a platform of bipartisanship, (I disapprove of that also) but to point out the obvious."
LOL.
So, Mr. Amato, we cannot be lukewarm. We have to pick a party by faith. You disapprove both parties; so go independent.
I agree that Pelosi should not have taken impeachment off the table. We were lied to time and time again. Former Bush aides like Scott McClellan have written whole books on the subject. How is this a democracy when the Democrats won't hold the Republicans accountable?
you give the electorate too much credit.
a. the majority of american's don't vote, could care less
b. a large percentage of those that do vote don't bother with debates or fact checking
c. a good chunk of people vote entirely based on one or two issues that may or may not even be an issue. (abortion, guns, etc)
the % of well versed, well read, debate watching voters is very small, and of those, i'd gather
most of them have already picked who they are going to vote for. i heard someone say
that the polls aren't gonna move much from now til november simply because there
just aren't that many undecided voters.
the good news, unreported of course, is that obama is killing in the electorial count, which is really all that matters.
i'm not sure why they even bother with national polls, which as the last 2 elections have shown us, are completely meaningless.
The Democratic Party lets them get away with this crap every time.
That's because the Dims are NOT the "liberal" party. They're NOT the 'peoples' party. And the DIMS do NOT want anybody calling them "libruls." They hate it. Why else would they flee the label so compulsively...
They're the slightly less fascistic, slightly less authoritarian wing of the Party of Property charged with making it appear that the needs of the "people" can be met by an oligarchy interested only in capturing and exercising more power for its own agenda...
Uppity Blue Lensman @ 4:
Bullshit with your term limits. That's the lazy way. Hell, you wouldn't even need elections. Just line up the next person and dump them before they could get to know their job. Term limits, bah.
Hey, everyone.
Old Viet Nam vet here.
Shoot at me. Doesn't matter.
Dems suck. Repubs suck.
Americans need to stand up for themselves. Take back their country.
That means taking to the streets in a serious way. Not letting some bloated pussy police scare everyone with some noisy explosions.
Otherwise, after the November elections, it WILL be business as usual. Out.
Neo-con conservatism has created in Fannie-Mac a socialist institution sooo large it dwarfs Roosevelt's new deal programs by billions of dollars. Previously we had the bailout of Baird-Sterns with tax payer money. I'd say capitalists have all of a sudden become socialists because they need the welfare. De-regulation spawned under the Bu-shies permitted their liaise-faire attempt, which failed. Neo-cons are always crying about left wing desires as being socialist when out of control right wing institutions shear more money from Americans than a little bit.
constituent @ 45:
It would be more apt for a "dunce cap" these people are maroons....any "accepted" interview will be some stupid, incipit, and pointless exercise that will in no way enlighten the public as to who these people are.
Is the Coast Clear?--- @ 36:
The Dems need an angle on the culture war. Typically, they have two responses. One is to criticize the mischaracterizations made by the other side, the other is to try to change the subject back to the real issues.
Both strategies have a chance of success, but they fail again and again because they are missing the important third element, which is to provide an ALTERNATIVE NARRATIVE on the culture war.
Otherwise, no matter how hard they refute the lies or how assiduously they rise above the fray, they allow the Republicans to simply own the culture framing. The Dems' strategy is to try to make that ownership less relevant, instead of going straight into the lion's den and owning their own narrative.
This is what Bill Clinton was good at. This is why he enraged conservatives. Bill could tell a story. Bill could feel your pain. Bill loves ya, baby. Bill knows that good, hard-working people have to put up with snotnosed knowitalls down at the bank and he's here to tell you, he's on your side...but he needs your help.
Bill Clinton didn't beat the Republicans because America suddenly decided they loved the liberals. He beat the Republicans by gaining the high narrative ground.
You need something like this sentence to be forming in people's heads...on their own...no prompting:
"As a , I am concerned about , and it seems that Barack Obama understands me and shares my values about because he's lived the kind of life I have, at least with respect to Obama understands that people like us have been ignored and pushed aside and a victory for him means that we will finally get the recognition we deserve."
Like that.
Is the Coast Clear?--- @ 7:
Reagan types? Reagun was a radical. He was the daddy of all the religious wack jobs. And, if I'm going to be courting anyone it will be a Democrat.
Obama will lose, unfortunately. The GOP keeps their message simple and just keeps repeating it over and over. Americans want to hear simple answers to complex problems, and that is what the GOP provides.
America - It Seemed Like A Good Idea
Democracy - It Was Fun While It Lasted
the hardest fact i have had to face all my
years as a democrat-40yrs-is the democratic
voters have had more passion to succeed than
those who have been elected. we don't mind
stepping on toes, bonging someone on the
head or stomping hard on their fingers to
make ourselves heard.
so why do those who represent us, ALWAYS
allow the conservatives to burn them willingly
at the stake EVERYTIME?
it's time those we elect to represent us
have the same passion to WIN as we
want them to win.
C’mon guys this should be shooting fish in a barrel. Crap.. the Republicans mocked a bonafide Vietnam vet and got away with it.
Obama will NEVER go 'toe-to-toe' with Bombin' Johnny.
Too "uppity."
Nagahapun...
constituent @ 45:
Just how difficult will it be to be interviewed by
Katie Couric without the tanCharlie Gibson? It will be, both literally and figuratively, a Disney interview.Well, it is quite clear that people simply have not suffered enough.
Maybe economic depression will smarten them up.
John
great point, It's a mystery to me why Progressives won't directly take on the failure of conservative values. Just as progressives have not articulated their values well, they are not able to systematically and strategically attack conservativism and it's values. Progressives are getting better at expressing their values, but have not developed the ability to go after conservative values.
Here for example, the Campaign for America attacks conservative failures, but they do it in a 10 point policy list approach.
http://www.ourfuture.org/makingsense/alert/2008093708/conservative-failures
It seems to me an attack on conservativism should be at their values.
Here's a framework I'm working on to do it:
http://progressivespirit.com/Projects/FailedConservativeValues/
I've been posting on the topic Failed Conservatives Values for some time now.
- Failed Conservatives Values: Jim Hightower on Grasping Greed
- Daily Show Coverage: GOP RNC Conservatives Failed to Remember Small Town Values
- Sarah Palin and the same old Failed Conservative Values
- Failed Conservative Values: Gavin Newsom on Division & Schizophrenic Tasmanian Devils
- Presidential Candidate Bob Barr on the Failure of Conservative Values
- Fatally Flawed Conservative Value of Hypocrisy
- Failed Conservative Values: Congresswoman Maxine Waters on Blame, Hate & Lying
etc, etc, etc,
for more see;
http://progressivespirit.com/InterviewStories/ProgressiveValuesStories.htm
edwin rutsch
What are Progressive Values? Documentary Project
http://progressivespirit.com
Dems will never do it because they are too rational and care about other people - they have a soul.
And if the GOP didn't control the media like they do now they would get away with half the stuff they get away with.
One question: What does it say about ordinary Americans if they continually get sucked into what amorality and snake oil that the Republicans sell each election?
I mean if people are so enamored with Gov. Hockey Mom, obviously a lot isn't being done to expose the woman for what she really is.
I mean how many years with America in the toilet is going to convince people to shun the Republicans and their neo-con agenda?
VietVet8666 @ 50:
What you are proposing is suicide. The police are very well armed and will stop at nothing. They are not pussies. They are militant.
fiver @ 60:
He'll be tossing Whipple balls for sure.
I've also heard "the Americans are smart enough", or "the Americans are not stupid".
You can't rely on this at all. Same thing happened in 2004 - didn't work then either.
Also, I don't think the debates will help our cause. I'm convinced most people make up there
minds on first impressions, a sense of excitement and positiveness. If a debate is
not going the way a viewer expects, they just tune it out.
The first response, and picking on Sarah's family/lack of experience wont help either.
Obama took a massive gamble in not choosing Hillary. Look at poor old Biden, there's just no
excitement at all. People are not even talking about him. McCain is out there with Palin,
while Biden is hidden away.
FACE IT ...YOU'RE ALL FUCKED AND WELCOME TO THE FOURTH REICH!!! DON'T SAY YOU WEREN'T WARNED
The Very Bitter Ceci Hussein @ 63:
Americans take to Palin because she appears to be like them.
Americans know professional politicians are different -- beholden to powerful corporations.
From a pure political (cynical) standpoint, picking her for VP was brilliant.
I disagree.
I don't think it's conservatism that ruined the country lo these past 8 years. It's neoconservatism, which is very, very different.
I favor small government that stays out of everyone's lives, responsible capitalism, oppose military adventurism, etc. On the other hand, I favor regulations that govern fairness, freedom of choice, etc.
Just wait a generation from now when "neo-libs" start stealing elections and suppressing dissent.
Liberal AND Proud @ 61:
I think you may be right. We haven't hit rock bottom yet.
However, don't look for another Roosevelt to get us out of this one.
Jo @ 64:
Hey, Jo.
Some criticized the Founders as committing suicide by standing up to King George III.
#53
The Dem Convention did hit all the notes on Obama's compelling and sincere story....
It did resonate...
But it's lost in the GOP noise...
We need to refocus on our humanity to connect with potential voters...
Just like Bill Clinton...
Perhaps we need to take a page out of his game book and use it...
prairie @ 55:
Yup.
That, of course.
And the Dim's candidate's a skinny, smarmy, smart black dude with a furrin name, who just might turn on Whites the tables they've set for minorities these last 400 or so years...That's what just scares 'em outta their Depends...
Jo @ 69:
No one looked for Roosevelt. He was the product of history.
You can't "find" greatness. Greatness is created out of opportunity, intelligence and good fortune.
No one has ever heard me call Obama "great". No, my view is he is the right TYPE of person, with the right philosophy for the times that we are in.
Reagan, Bush, Gingrich, McCain and now Palin have all had the "greatness" word used to describe them. When words like that are thrown around recklessly and with no validation from history, then it is simply a smokescreen to hide mediocrity.
John, John, John ....
You keep thinking that the problem is that voters prefer McCain over Obama. Voters aren't stupid. They know McCain would be a disaster for America, but at least so far McCain has been consistent about how disasterous he would be. Obama, by contrast, has -- as is the practice of the Democratic Party -- completely betrayed his liberal base with things like his reversal on how long we should stay in Iraq, his voting for unconstitutional bills like the FISA provisions, his support for upping the number of troops in Afghanistan and his considering attacking both Iran and even, God forbid, Pakistan, not to mention his unqualified support for Israel -- as demonstrated at the AIPAC conference -- which is very much behind all the adventures we are getting into in the middle east. He has shown himself to be what the Democratic Party is in spades; opportunists who will say anything to get elected, and then quickly betray every promise they ever made once in power.
Given that McCain is likely at best a one term president if elected -- I highly doubt he survives his first term -- and the Democrats -- despite not doing near enough to roll back the police state in America and the wars overseas, in fact behind everything Bush has rolled out -- are likely to landslide into power in Congress, maybe a Republican President with a hostile Congress is where people's thinking is at. I'm not saying that's ideal either, and I am certainly not a Republican or McCain supporter, but people are sick of being lied to by both parties and maybe are not interested in giving either party a monopoly of power.
The real story is that the media and the political elites are not able to "sell" this illusion of choice like they have in the past, and both parties have very unhappy factions within their ranks who are going to be gunning for real change as opposed to the phoney change both parties are peddaling. And mark my words, Johnny boy, change will be coming, with a vengeance, and likely before the election. Take the economy, for example, which is likely to take a major tumble in early October. That will definitely put many of the events of the last ten years in very sharp relief, and both Democrats and Republicans will be rightly identified as the culprits behind the raping of America. (This is also why the political elites are working so hard to get the police state in place: they need these tools to crush the very reasonable outrage that will follow.)
It's best that pundits like you explore these issues in a little more depth before events show you for the shallow "major party" shills you have been.
Jo @ 69:
More like a Mussolini or a Hitler, if the bottom's deep enough...
Jo @ 54:
Reagan was not a religious wack job but he was a union buster...
My family suffered under that boot a long time ago...
There are GOP who are disinfranchised and we need to take a close look to see if they can be persuaded into our party...
I've know of GOP types who are interested in us...
Are you that willing to turn away potential votes....
In a fair contest between the principled and the un-principled, the principled will always lose.
liberAL @ 40:
woody, tokin librul @ 75:
Now you're talkin'!
America needs a dictator. It would like a little gentle reminder of how easy life has been here.
Filthy Harry @ 77:
That's cuz there can never BE a "fair" contest between 'principled' and 'un-principled' actors, by definition. The unprincipled actor will always already have cheated...
Sara Palin is a wedge issue. She reduces the level of political discourse to a soap opera level where everyone's opinion is equally valid. Think she's a hypocrite on sex education? So what? An equal number of people will defend her against attacks on her family. Think she's ridiculously unqualified? So what? An equal number of people will defend small town America.
Even mentioning her, regardless of the validity of the attack, is playing McCain's game because she divides the populace and distracts from serious issues on which the vast majority of this country agrees.
Conservatives have always been about gaining the most for the few, and wedge issues are their favorite weapon to divide the majority into impotent segments which can't fight back.
Why the heck am I not seeing Obama fighting. The most important election for you folks (and the rest of the world) and Obama is trying to be all nice and above the fray. McCain should be swift-boated, beat up, pummeled and all his lies exposed but thats not happening. I don't think there is a trick in the world that not too dirty to use against McCain. Christ its so important that the Dems win but it's like its a high school student council vote and 'we can always win again in grade 12'. It's sickening. Where is the fight. I'll be so dissapointed if I don't see some neo-con blood spilled. Do what it takes to win for crying out loud Obama. Please please be a big mean prick and fight.
Speaking of neo-cons don't forget that up in Canada we are having an election and our neo-con friend of Bush PM just may get re-elected. I think we must be getting some democrat advice because our centrist liberal party is about as lame as lame can get. So if your looking for a place to run and hide out the McSame years we may be neo-con up here. Yuk.
And speaking of sleazy skanks from Alaska (i hate the word skank but it is fitting here) it scares me that she's in the VP slot and that the majority of Alaskans driving by my cabin 1000 miles up the Alaska hwy have voted for the bimbo. Might have to start locking my doors. She's like so many small town mayors up north. In bed with every real estate developer and local contractor and govt. official. Almost all of them are crooks and milk the Feds for personal gain. And mean as mean can be. See it all the time. Remember that if your digging for Alaska dirt on her, its a very small community so everything govt. is so transparent. All will be revealed if one digs deep enough. Any C&L agents in Ak?
Oh yea you should be plastering the pics of teen mom Bristol with booze and penis-head boyfriend everywhere. Remember there is nothing too low or dirty if it means beating McSame and Palin.
#79
Okay, I'm glad I've got another plan...
Canadian citizenship here I come....
(Got family there guess I will have to learn to dress really warm being a Californian and all)....
For several months now I've been reading about the demise of the GOP.
And yet more and more I get the feeling that we're going to see a repeat of 2004.
I didn't think this country would be so stupid as to re-elect a corrupt buffoon like Bush.
And yet there he sits in the White House like Al Capone.
I thought the Dems would learn from John Kerry's and take the Kid gloves off.
And yet here they go again letting the GOP frame this election in favor of McSame and Failing Palin.
All I know is it's going to suck to hear fours years of "I told you so's" from the Clinton's.
fiver @ 81:
Wedge issues not only highlight the differences, but more importantly, they camouflage the synonymies, identities, and similarities between the two wings of the Party of Property...
Every fence-sitting Hillary supporter, democrat and independent should be made to watch this video before casting their vote.
Bush/McCain Warmongering
Welfare?
Welfare for the PEOPLE? Can't have that! It is non-sense! They FU,...let them suffer!
Welfare for the CORPORATION$? Mega-multi-Billions in mega-bailouts?
RIGHT F^%$#$ NOW? No questions asked?
Quick! Hand me my official "government logo" pen, before the sun comes up!
Now were talking bout some "reeeeaaaal" progre$$! The republican "getting things done" the right way.
The overburdening indebtedness to taxpayers is totally irrelavant, and will NOT be a question we will TOLORATE, ...in outragious conspiracy theories!
Welfare MUST be put in the proper place!
VietVet8666 @ 67:
Which group of Americans?
I hope you didn't mean it this way, but it seems you are saying that America is only filled with citizens who also white, racist, sexist, gun-toting and testifying to pray the gays away.
You seem to forget that there are a whole lot of us who don't look or act like Sarah Palin.
That only means that elections can be fixed by the powers that be. And unless we have real advocates, the people of the United States are powerless to stop them.
I still think to this day it was a desperation pick that blossomed once a (racist, sexist, conservative) MSM picked up on it. If the MSM truly reflected the way American looked and thought, Sarah Palin would be an afterthought.
Many here think the system of electing candidates to U.S. offices is correct.
The system guarantees the best elected official.
Yeah. Jimmy Carter. Reagan. Bush I. Clinton. Bush II. Great presidents all.
Liberal AND Proud @ 29:
Obama appears to be abandoning Georgia as a lost cause. I want to leave if my nasty racist Republican neighbors manage to make that black guy (not their words) throw in the towel. I am German, I could go there and let the German government lovingly care for my aging bones but it is damp and gray there and I like speaking English. I could go to Canada, but talk about aging bones and arctic cold! So, what to do?
I guess I will press on for the Democrats - keep the eyes on the prize - and hope for the best. We will lose the Senate race (Martin(D) vs Chambliss (R) and we will cross our fingers for the Obama / McCain race. Then we will hope that Diebold does not steal the election or at least get caught when they do and that the candidates do not encounter anything life threatening. Except Palin
"Why the heck am I not seeing Obama fighting."
cuz if he does, he feeds the embedded, tacit meme that he's "just another angry Niqqer."
The Dims would have short-circuited this whole thing if they'd nominated HRC for PRes, and she'd named BHO as Veep.
Cakewalk.
Obama/Biden? (Or HRC/anybody else)?
Toast.
Or "history," as in 'footnote.'
Howard Zinn: US 'In Need of Rebellion'
so in what way can we all begin to label conserve-atives so that word will resonate as tainted from here on. There is the notion that conserving is protecting the status quo and being afraid of the future. "How to talk to a conservative: if you think they can understand logic." Republic Party. Any way of tarring the name with backward thinking, pretzel logic, lieing. Any ideas?
VietVet8666 @ 89:
So you are willing sight unseen to candidly say without a doubt every past and future president is just fine and dandy to you because of the "system"...
You have a very simplistic way of thinking...
The world is a hell of a lot more complicated than that....
"I could go to Canada, but talk about aging bones and arctic cold! So, what to do?"
I hear Paraguay has a lot of former Germans; a recent president was named "Strossner"...but i'd prefer Costa Rica.
woody, tokin librul @ 80:
By fair I meant the contest itself is designed to be fair.
The Very Bitter Ceci Hussein @ 88:
White, angry Americans.
Attack conservatism? Gee, ya think?
Whenever I see some imbecile that still supports the GOP, I ask them to point out one, JUST ONE FUCKING THING conservatives have ever done for anyone other than themselves and their uber-rich pals! They can never ever come up with an answer - other than "cut taxes." Then I say no, they cut income taxes, which you and most people don't pay. But they raise payroll taxes, which transfers the tax burden from the wealthiest, to the least well off.
At this point their eyes have completely glazed over with the distant look of the wingnut idiot. Then I list about 15 things liberals have done to make their "working class" life more enjoyable (and get them to admit they like them). Of course, these are all of the things conservatives opposed, and are hell bent on destroying.
Why the hell don't democrats FIGHT like this? Why do the democrats ALWAYS bring cupcakes to a gunfight? Even the conservatives I know say "why don't the democrats ever talk about that? I didn't know that."
If you want people to change their voting patterns, you have to fight to garner their trust. Would it be easier to get people to vote for your policies, or to vote AGAINST the toxic policies that everyone hates? This is NOT rocket science for chrissakes. If Rove and Bush can figure it out, anyone should be able too.
I have made it my life's work too make "conservative" the most filthy word (which it actually is) in the American dialogue. Especially since you can forget about the dumb-asscrats ever doing it.
Oh, and Mr. Obama, good move silencing Move-On this summer. Otherwise, you might be 15-20% points ahead in the polls.
Dumbass!
woody, tokin librul @ 85:
Not that I disagree, woody. In fact, I think forcing the demise of the two party system is one of the most important fights we can wage. The problem is: that's probably not going to happen in the next 60 or so days. So I'm not sure what the validity of your point is right now. There actually are significant, non-wedge issue, differences between these two candidates, and these differences do matter.
Democrats struggle to call "BS" because they don't completely disagree with the conservative message and movement. Yes, they prefer more civil liberties. And, yes, they prefer a bit more of a safety net and wealth distribution. But they remain the second part of a unified political system that makes American Democracy and government run capitalism one and the same. Dems are Republican-lite. Wish they weren't, but they are. And it's why they cannot bring themselves to attack the fundamental failings -- they are their failings too. So, we're screwed.
It doesn't really matter who the "Preznit" is.
What matters is who gives the "Prezinit' his orders...
Is the Coast Clear?--- @ 94:
Was being sarcastic.
PorridgeGun @ 86:
the truth is now get what im saying! thier are no peace candidates running for president of these new nited states! thier all warmongers!
To hell with the republicans and bipartisanship. They will never be bipartisan and we should not even try. If it is left up to me I would take a stick and ram whatever I could down their stupid throats, and if they choke to death? That would be a great thing for the world.
You know what you call a million republicans on the bottom of the ocean? A good start.
republican = insanity!
VietVet8666 @ 97:
At least you made that specific. I was beginning to wonder if we were in two different Americas. O_o
"Fiver sez: There actually are significant, non-wedge issue, differences between these two candidates, and these differences do matter.",/i>
And he's correct, that there are (possibly non-trivial) differences between the candidates.
But there is laughably, risibly, diminishingly little difference between the two Wings of the Party on matters of long-term economic, social, international or military policy. So the differences, such as they are, between the candidates are, in fact, insignificant...
woody, tokin librul @ 101:
Good point. Who do you think owes less favors? The Republican with decades in Washington who is almost completely reliant on corporate lobbyists for cash and strategy; or the the 47 year old Democrat, relatively new to Washington, who is a fundraising force in his own right? I'm sure they both owe favors, but matters of degree can be important.
First time posting to this site.. I post and posts don't show up.. where do the posts disappear to?
During this election season, I desperately wish that everyone would read the book "Talking Right" by Geoff Nunberg and learn just how false that the narratives that conservatives and Republicans have been pushing are. Go read it.
No one here wants this:
maximum individual freedom
minimum government regulation of individuals
minimum government support of corporations
maximum individual control of government
maximum information about JFK, MLK, RFK, Watergate, Iran-Contra, 9-11
No one wants any of this.
ok,, let's try it is shorter bites.
John
great point, It's a mystery to me why Progressives won't directly take on the failure of conservative values. Just as progressives have not articulated their values well, they are not able to systematically and strategically attack conservativism and it's values. Progressives are getting better at expressing their values, but have not developed the ability to go after conservative values.
Here for example, the Campaign for America attacks conservative failures, but they do it in a 10 point policy list approach.
http://www.ourfuture.org/makingsense/alert/2008093708/conservative-failures
It seems to me an attack on conservativism should be at their values.
Here's a framework I'm working on to do it:
http://progressivespirit.com/Projects/FailedConservativeValues/
I've been posting on the topic Failed Conservatives Values for some time now.
- Failed Conservatives Values: Jim Hightower on Grasping Greed
- Daily Show Coverage: GOP RNC Conservatives Failed to Remember Small Town Values
- Sarah Palin and the same old Failed Conservative Values
- Failed Conservative Values: Gavin Newsom on Division & Schizophrenic Tasmanian Devils
- Presidential Candidate Bob Barr on the Failure of Conservative Values
- Fatally Flawed Conservative Value of Hypocrisy
- Failed Conservative Values: Congresswoman Maxine Waters on Blame, Hate & Lying
etc, etc, etc,
for more see;
http://progressivespirit.com/InterviewStories/ProgressiveValuesStories.htm
edwin rutsch
What are Progressive Values? Documentary Project
http://progressivespirit.com
#102
Point taken...
FDR Fala speech
They've never stopped
John W @ 84:
In 2006 I wrote somewhere that Senator Clinton and the people around her from '92 would send this country to hell in a hand basket to make her president in 2008. They failed. They are already working on 2012. There are meetings going on in New Jersey among Jewish donors, strong supporters of the Clintons from Yale and Georgetown to derail Obama. Democrats (Obama) are fighting the stupidity of American, the dual alligance of some Democrats, racial hatred and James Carville and Mary Matalin (they found uncounted votes in Ohio in 2004 and Cheney took charge.Good Bye Kerry!)Canada is looking better and better!
HEY EVERYONE. You may call yourself a DEMOCRAT but no one in the "Democratic Party" is listening! Someone turned the lights out in the Obama campaign in June. The game is over because the Democratic Party doesn't give a sh** about America. NO ONE IS LISTENING TO YOU. They don't really care if they win or lose: their pocketbooks win either way.
Every person making blanket statements about how American is tired of the Republicans and the last eight years needs to get out into the real America. Come to the barber shop in my town. Listen to conversations in line at the post offices of rural America. People out here LOVE the Republicans, they want to rewrite the Constitution with their religious doctrine, and they don't want a n***** to be President of the United States of America. The "liberals" and the "blacks" are the cause of all their problems and the Republicans are only trying to fix things.
I am at school in a modern Southern city and it is refreshing to hear the pro-Obama and otherwise liberal voices. But these people are as much in their fishbowl as the so-called "conservatives" from my home town. Small town Republicans run the small town schools that teach the small town kids. It is a self-reinforcing horror.
You want to know why McCain will win this election? McCain will win this election because a concentrated majority of Americans are uneducated, hyper-religious sheep. Obama will lose this election because his solid constituencies are not sheep. Many of them have lost much of their excitement for his campaign as he has dropped promise after promise and value after value.
Obama will join Gore and Kerry as Democratic Party losers because the Democratic Party stands for JACK S**T.
When people from home say, "How can we trust Obama and the Democrats to stand up to ter'rists if they can't even stand up for himself," I unfortunately have no answer.
Welcome to hell. I weep for my country.
Georgia Democrat @ 115:
Come to Canada! !
You'll just have to prove that you're not a Republican. That's a disease we cannot allow across the border (unless you're running for PM of course)
fiver @ 107:
Show me whose hand you eat from, and I'll show you whose song you sing.
Here's who's song Barack'll be singin':
The only thing is, I don't know the date of this report...
woody, tokin librul @ 106:
Again, agreed in part. I do, however, believe that issues like habeas corpus, torture, net neutrality, de-regulation, tax structure, global warming, etc. are substantially more than "insignificant."
conservatism is just a word used to cover up Racism,homo phobic.elitest, greedy and corrupt.
Is the Coast Clear?--- @ 44:
totally disagree. people need to see that Obama is a fighter as well as a bi-partisan get-it-done lover. we need to see him LEAD. the surrogates can be mean, you're right about that, but Obama and Biden both need to be stern and presidential, pointing out right and wrong, truth and lies.
we need to see our leaders LEAD -- otherwise it's more watered down progressive messages a la Pelosi and Reid.
ENOUGH already!
PorridgeGun @ 14:
That's a really good ad. Obama should do the same for McCain
maby were not looking at the big picture , when they fire up that super collider very soon seeking answers to the big bang it just may backfire on these sientists and if your lucky maby before your tush dissaperes in some black hole you can kiss everybodys ass goodby! shame and they said the earth would die with only a whimper , bang bang!
The new campaign talking point against the republicans: The Change Wannabes
Again, agreed in part. I do, however, believe that issues like habeas corpus, torture, net neutrality, de-regulation, tax structure, global warming, etc. are substantially more than “insignificant.”
I will be REALLY REALLY REALLY surprised if Obama, if 'elected', makes any inroads in any of those problems. I predict any changes will be overwhelmingly cosmetic, meant to paper over the Obama regime'sa appropriation of all the good shit the Busheviks stole...
i can't see obama losing in a fair election.
what are the odds of that happening?
but what i can see is that democrats still don't/won't fight back correctly. it's so inept it smacks of collusion w/ the republicans. always playing defense, never attacking, even while sitting on the biggest political aresenal ever assembled in modern history.
they need to get mean and go on the offensive. fuck this 'he's my friend' crap. that's loser talk. kick them squarely in the balls and don't keep kicking until December. yes, i know the election is in november.
Forget about Palin, just erase her from your memory storage, she doesnt matter. Go after McCain, kick him in the balls, spit in his face, defame him, call him a liar, and when he is in a ball on the ground crying for us to stop, KICK HIS FUCKING TEETH BACK THROUGH THE BACK OF HIS SKULL!!!!!
Attack McCain on everything that the repugs stand for:
Freedom of choice
Staying in Iraq, fuck who was right about the surge, get us the fuck out.
Economy, really are you better off, and lets not forget that the CEOs of Fannie and Freddie are getting a lot of money for failing, think they vote demorcrat.
Civil rights, why is it so hard to have rights and fight terror, if you cant do both get out of the way and let people who can, do the job.
Education, failed failed failed
We cant let the repugs dictate the debate, there is no debate, THE REPUGS SUCK, and we have to remind the American public of that every day, hour, minute, second. We need to do it loud, with no mercy, and above all without a single thought about Palin and her wonder womb.
PorridgeGun @88
This should be played by the Obama campaign on TV over and over and over. Says it all about McCain and what we should expect when he is elected.
Past peak oil @ 119:
Good to know, thanks!
Miss A. @ 123:
Georgia Democrat @ 132:
Lets not talk about Pelosi and Reid, we were so energized in 2006 and look what it got us - nothing.
Screw bi-partisan - we are not going to win anything that way. Obama once said about fights ' if you bring a knife, I'll bring a gun!' His gun appears to be a sqirt gun. He needs to get serious, he is pissing away a lot of money, time and good will by staying above it all and it is not working.
CMINCA @ 43:
You found their secret hiding place!!! It is right out of their asses that they get this crap!
Obummer @ 128:
I would vote for you!
Liberal AND Proud @ 25:
Got a link to that news?
Floridiot @ 116:
I have to add this quote from the speech...it floored me
I read this blog faithfully every day and I leave it frustrated and angry. Does Obama read your blog? Does anyone with influence in his campaign listen? or read? It's like they know what to do and then they do the opposite.
MR. Obama,
Do you have a compulsion to fail? It seems as if you are deliberately working to get your ass handed to you on a silver platter.
Barak, you are dealing with a collection of malignant personalities who are playing for keeps. They don't want to cooperate with you, dude. They are at war and consider you and everybody who is allied with you to be their enemy; they want you dead both politically and figuratively. They are in a fight to the death. If you don't wake up, they are going to eat your lunch 6 ways to Sunday.
Bipartisanship? Wake the fuck up, man! The only "Democrats" who have argued and acted for "bipartisanship" or "cross-aisle cooperation" have consistently been the ones to betray the people who elected them and betray their duties to the nation and to the Constitution: Lieberman, Pelosi, Reid, Hoyer, the Blue Dogs..ad nauseaum. They are complicit in the crimes of the GOP and the prostitution of the government to corporate America. They have been abettors of the forward march of totalitarianism. All in the name of cooperation and bipartisanship. From their mouths, those words are not ideals, they are cybical obscenities. Code words for betrayal. Don't let yourself become enrolled amongst their number.
It is as if you insist upon showing up to a gunfight unarmed in order to face opponents who consider cold-blooded murder of the defenseless to be a patriotic virtue.
It is not a betrayal of principles to show single-minded resolve to the sociopaths and the psychopaths, and that's who you are dealing with. It's time for some brutal, pitiless and merciless honesty against those who gleefully take courtesy, manners and common human decency as weaknesses to be exploited. You are so running out of time to get this part of your act together, man. Do not confuse delusion with holding the moral high ground.
If McCain wins, everybody - including the McCain supporters, lose.
VietVet8666 @ 92:
I'm a vietnam Marine and I have this to say about these presidents.
Jimmy Carter -probably the only true religious president we ever had and tried to govern that way in the corrupt environment of Washington and failed miserably.
Ron Reagan -perpetrated the biggest shaft job on the middle class by switching the tax burden onto the blue collar workers
Bush I -mister "read my lips" raise taxes numerous times thru the continuation of Reagan's unfunded mandates on the states
Clinton -all he did was create the longest peace time expansion of the economy in our history and created a monetary surplus. If he had kept his pants zipped ,he most likely would have been considered the best of our modern presidents
Bush II -good god do I really have to say what a sorry S O B is piece of crap is.
Don't put the good in with the bad .
Obama cannot win. There is too much 'spin' in the media, which translates to too much UNinformed support of McCain and too much attention on Miss PissyPants VP candidate, which in the end will translate to an artificially close race in which Diebold and Sequoia technologies will hand the victory to McCain and no one will really question it because, after all, it *WAS* a close race in the polls, wasn't it...?
This is so frustrating.
I consider myself a moderate Republican that has voted Democrat in presidential elections, since 1992. I’m so infuriated with the lack of fight to debunk the LIES – the very reason to get angry. Not opposing views, subjective beliefs, but LIES. Release the 527s. I don’t want Obama’s wish to be “nice” to sacrifice my rights and hopes by allowing the Republicans win with LIES. How does one lower themselves by fighting back with the TRUTH?!?! What about those that donated to the 527 groups? Were they aware the groups would be rendered useless because of Obama’s request for a gentle approach?
For the love God, fight back!
Just reveal the LIES with commercials, which is where most Americans get their info from, unfortunately. It would be so easy to do that the News Media would DEMAND McCain/Palin for answers. PLEASE!
I tell you, if Democrats lose this election, they are done – seriously.
~Melodic Hubris~
yeah @ 5:
Friend, I have contributed to Obama..I am 60 yrs old. I never gave to anyone before that's how much I believe in him. He reminds me when I was young and heard JFK. I live in a rural area. I don't know many people around here that are voting for Obama. The young voters are and I am proud of them. Am very upset with an aunt that should be voting for Obama because of her financial status but she isn't because of his race. I was so shocked by that answer that it still upsets me that makes me cry. I toll her she was nuts. I don't know if I even want to talk with her until after the election is over. I don't know what else to do. My health doesn't allow me to go door to door. Oh how I wish I were younger I'd be knocking at doors. But give me some other suggestions. I worry for the future of you young people and my granddaughter who is only 3. God bless Obama.
What’s up with McCain? I think he might be losing the plot. Not impossible at his age, but just look at it… His wife owns a beer company but he refuses to share. He thinks flip-flops is a policy strategy instead of shoes. He doesn’t know that a chick that smiles at you doesn’t mean she is hot or a running mate. He shows some man-love by hugging Dubya but then denies they are having an affair. He thinks del.icio.us is a vetting process and he scares little Republican kids. Shame, poor old man. I wrote him a letter to give him a few tips on how to deal with these and a few other problems at http://angryafrican.net/2008/09/09/a-letter-to-john/
I agree with John. Obama and his advisers should be taking to McCain hard.. punch his nose hard. The failures are conservatism are vast and wide.
I really just do not understand the modern Democratic Party. I am pretty darn sure that it isn't the Progressive arm of the party that lacks the will to win, but that does seem to be a fairly consistent theme of the DLC (Corporate-owned arm of the party.)
Gore lost the 2000 election because of (1) GOP kicking voters off the rolls in Florida, (2) failing to immediately demand a full Florida recount, and (3) no Dem senator rising to challenge Florida election results in the joint session of Congress in support of members of the House Black Caucus.
Mid-term losses to the GOP in 2002 were directly related to both (1) gerry-mandering in Texas, and (2) GOP malfeasance regarding voter caging. Again, the results were unchallenged.
Kerry lost the 2004 election because of (1) GOP voter caging and fraud in Ohio, and (2) similar unchallenged voter problems in Nevada, New Mexico, and Florida. Right, well Kerry wouldn't challenge the (minimum) 5% difference between votes counted and exit polls. Some Ohio counties recorded as much as a 40% spread between counted votes and exit polls -- something totally unheard of.
The 2006 mid-term election results were also heavily "program shifted" in the favor of the GOP (judging by votes VS exit polls), but they could not overcome a huge shift in Democratic voter turn-out which still put Democrats in the winning column.
I have a prediction to make: MSM and the bobble-headed political pundits will continue to report only a 1 or 2 point spread between McSame and Obama, right up until polls start closing on the East Coast. The exit polls will reveal that Obama has a 8 to 12 point lead over McSame, excepting some die-hard GOP precincts, and Obama ahead by 60-plus electoral votes. The MSM will report that, just like in 2004 and 2006, exit polls had yet again proven to be very wide of the mark, and McSame will be the (uncontested by the Dems again) official winner.
Whether you vote or not matters not at all, if your competition is in charge of COUNTING the votes. The ruckus over a McSame upset victory will make the 2000 swearing in of Bush look like a British high tea compared to Australian-rules rugby.
{Dream On Doc. SiteMonitor}
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