Cheney denies we torture people because it was approved by the OLC, but won't commit to testifying under oath
By John Amato Monday May 11, 2009 8:00am
Will any media member ask Dick Cheney why HE never released any memos when he was in power? is that too much to ask. He's playing games right now and trying to suck the media and the American people in.
Dick Cheney was having a grand old time defending torture, saying that he wasn't in the torture business, but hey, we waterboarded a few people because his buddies at the OLC helped him out. He was spinning his web and telling us that the OLC and the Bush administration acted within the law when they starting waterboarding prisoners on Face the Nation. He denies that they ever used torture. Cheney also said George Bush knew and approved everything they did. I guess when he said we didn't use torture his was misleading America.
He also used the GOP talking point that we used the same techniques on our own troops in the SERE program so it ain't torture. His daughter (Liz Cheney) learned a lot from him because she used the same defense to Norah O'Donnell which didn't even pass her smell test.
He absolutely wouldn't change a thing and still wants more memos released. When will journalists ask Cheney why he didn't released these documents when he was in power? Bush was taking a tremendous amount of heat over the torture issue at the time.
Schieffer was asking him if he would allow himself to be questioned about these topics and go "under oath." Cheney dodged the question by saying he'd have to look into it legally and see what precedent he would set , but he's talking now. He WILL NEVER go under oath.
SCHIEFFER: Senator Leahy, the chairman of the Judiciary Committee, was on this broadcast recently. And I said, do you intend to ask the former vice president to come up? And he said if he will testify under oath. Would you be willing to testify under oath?
CHENEY: I'd have to see what the circumstances are and what kind of precedent we were setting. But certainly I wouldn't be out here today if I didn't feel comfortable talking about what we're doing publicly. I think it's very, very important that we have a clear understanding that what happened here was an honorable approach to defending the nation, that there was nothing devious or deceitful or dishonest or illegal about what was done.
He's just trying to justify torture and he's using TV to promote his views. Let's see if he'll go on with Lawrence O'Donnell and face some real questions. If Cheney will never appear with another guest or interviewer that uses facts to question him with, what makes you think he'll go in front of Leahy?
CBS has the full transcript and you can read more below the fold:
SCHIEFFER: What do you say to those, Mr. Vice President, who say that when we employ these kinds of tactics, which are after all the tactics that the other side uses, that when we adopt their methods, that we're weakening security, not enhancing security, because it sort of makes a mockery of what we tell the
rest of the world?CHENEY: Well, then you'd have to say that, in effect, we're prepared to sacrifice American lives rather than run an intelligent interrogation program that would provide us the information we need to protect America.
The fact of the matter is, these techniques that we're talking about are used on our own people. We -- in a program that in effect trains our people with respect to capture and evasion and so forth and escape, a lot of them go through these same exact procedures. Now...
SCHIEFFER: Do you -- is what you're saying here is that we should do anything if we could get information?
CHENEY: No. Remember what happened here, Bob. We had captured these people. We had pursued interrogation in a normal way. We decided that we needed some enhanced techniques. So we went to the Justice Department. And the controversy has arisen over the opinions written by the Justice Department.
The reason we went to the Justice Department wasn't because we felt we were going to take some kind of free hand assault on these people or that we were in the torture business. We weren't. And specifically, what we got from the Office of Legal Counsel were legal memos that laid out what is appropriate and
what's not appropriate, in light of our international commitments.CHENEY: If we had been about torture, we wouldn't have wasted our time going to the Justice
Department.
SCHIEFFER: How much did President Bush know specifically about the methods that were being used?
We know that you-- and you have said-- that you approved this...CHENEY: Right.
SCHIEFFER: ... somewhere down the line. Did President Bush know everything you knew?
CHENEY: I certainly, yes, have every reason to believe he knew -- he knew a great deal about the program. He basically authorized it. I mean, this was a presidential-level decision. And the decision went to the president. He signed off on it.
SCHIEFFER: You said -- you said just a moment ago as you were talking about this, that -- you said that we have to realize what was at stake and we have to realize the circumstances. Do you have any regrets whatsoever about any of the methods that were taken? Any of the things that were used back in those
days? Because there's no question the country -- it was a different time. The country's mood was different. We had just been -- something had happened here that had never happened before.
In retrospect, you -- years have passed. You're now out of office. Do you think we should have done some things differently back then, or do you have any regrets about any of it?CHENEY: No regrets. I think it was absolutely the right thing to do. I'm convinced, absolutely convinced,that we saved thousands, perhaps hundreds of thousands of lives.
In the aftermath of 9/11, we had all of these questions about who Al Qaida was, where they were operating and so forth. We didn't know nearly as much as we know today. We were faced with a very real possibility -- we had reporting that said Al Qaida is trying to acquire nuclear capabilities. We had the A.Q.
Khan network out there, a black-market operator selling nuclear weapons technology to Libya, North Korea and Iran. We had the anthrax attack within a matter of weeks after 9/11. We had the kind of situation that meant that we were absolutely convinced, the country was convinced, that there was a very
high likelihood of a follow-on attack, a mass casualty attack against the United States. No one then would have bet anything that you're going to go eight years and not have another attack. And we know, in fact, that they did try other attacks, and that we were able to stop them.Now, if you'd look at it from the perspective of a senior government official, somebody like myself, who stood up and took the oath of office on January 20th of '01 and raised their right hand and said we're going to protect and defend the United States against all enemies foreign and domestic, this was exactly, exactly what was needed to do it.
I think if you look at this intelligence program that when things are quieter, 20 or 30 years from now, you'll
be able to look back on this and say this is one of the great success stories of American intelligence. I think, in fact, what the men and women in the intelligence community and the lawyers in the Justice Department and the senior officials who approved this program did exactly the right thing. I think the charge that somehow there was something wrong done here or that this was torture in violation of U.S. statutes is just absolutely false.SCHIEFFER: You -- you are speaking out. You say you obviously feel passionately about this. How far are you willing to take this approach? Are you willing to go back to the Congress and talk to people in Congress about this? There are all kinds of people talking about various kinds of investigations. Would you go back and talk to the Congress?
CHENEY: Certainly. I've made it very clear that I feel very strongly that what we did here was exactly the right thing to do. And if I don't speak out, then where do we find ourselves, Bob? Then the critics have free run, and there isn't anybody there on the other side to tell the truth. So it's important -- it's important that we...
SCHIEFFER: Senator Leahy, the chairman of the Judiciary Committee, was on this broadcast recently. And I said, do you intend to ask the former vice president to come up? And he said if he will testify under oath. Would you be willing to testify under oath?
CHENEY: I'd have to see what the circumstances are and what kind of precedent we were setting. But certainly I wouldn't be out here today if I didn't feel comfortable talking about what we're doing publicly. I think it's very, very important that we have a clear understanding that what happened here was an honorable approach to defending the nation, that there was nothing devious or deceitful or dishonest or illegal about what was done.
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"I am above the law"
Since when do criminals get to "decide" if and when they will testify under oath? Why do they give this guy any platform to talk? This short quote can substitute for any thing that comes out of Cheney's mouth.
You are such a fuckin evil bastard, one day, you will get yours.
I hope soon you'll be on trial for war crimes, AND treason you traitorous scumbag.
The sooner you leave this plane of existance, the better off the world will be you fuckin fascist asshole!
You made me think of Dylan's perfect analysis of this sort of evil:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muQRIUVd6Aw
that there is a Karma that will address this vile...thing.
This man honestly deserves a slow, torturous end to his lying, thieving, murderous existence.
Let's hope his heart gives out real soon, and is excruciatingly painful. I'd like to be nearby, just to recite to him all the evil things he has done, so he knows what to expect in hell.
shouldn't be exemptions. N'est pas?
I hope it's instant Karma, not that in the next life kinda karma...I want him to pay NOW!
Karma (since I see people talking about it.) Our souls/energy are undying, even after our physical deaths. Karma for our actions and ideas does attach/taint your energy/soul. It always affects you, but you may not see "instant karma", but it is there, and eventually will manifest itself.
It doesn't give you that instant revenge you may wish for, but he indeed has penance coming.
For most people, with slight trangessions, it just drags you down and makes you a bot. That's why there are lots of "grey" people walking about, like zombies. Their hearts don't ever sing.
... is the point of having this WAR CRIMINAL on for a weekly excuse if you're not going to challenge that position?
Forget anything else you achieved in your career, Schieffer. The footnote to your life's work will be TORTURE APOLOGIST.
"Let's see if he'll go on with Lawrence O'Donnell and face some real questions."
Dream on. "The Dick" isn't stupid enough to have an honest debate.
See, this is what happens when your government doesn't go after criminals. They pretend that they're patriots, and they dare non-thug politicians to do something about their crimes. Which only makes the non-thugs look like total wimps. And allows serial liars to continue lying ad nauseum.
Don't make me laugh! Leahy is a joke. If he wasn't such a "good long time friend" of Donald Rumsfeld AND had a set of balls he'd be calling for criminal prosecutions since THAT is what US law DEMANDS!
While a 'truth commission' sounds nice, it's basically a committee to determine what excuse will become 'the truth' - and does not promise to objectively establish facts or punish the guilty.
as the most likely outcome. If they want to do it in CONJUNCTION with the trials that law demands fine. But they're full of crap saying they'll investigate and make reccomendations for prosecution as they see needed. It's very clear and with ample evidence that laws were broken by Bush, cheney and the WH Iraq Group as well as in the CIA and military. Those obvious cases must be prosecuted ASAP.
thinks about letting obvious war crimes felons go free they might want to remember this.
I don't know who he or she is, but he or she is surely out there, waiting for the time to step on stage.
I wish to fuck Obama would cut off that possibility.
Coward. He's not VP any more and he can't refuse to testify under oath if he's called.
Just sayin..
..head! Cheney = Coward,
If you are so sure "everything was legal", get up in a court of law and say it. Now, you've admitted to torturing folks in our custody, not POW's or criminals, just guys you rounded up and imprisoned without cause and then tortured, NOW, go on the stand you self-righteous, draft-dodging, evil POS and tell the world what you did so we can imprison you for the rest of your miserable life.
Watch him, this group has proved one thing, there are rules for us, the little people, we get tazed, cuffed, put on trial and receive 30 years for armed robbery. They invade countries, kill hundreds of thousands, steal billions, break whatever laws they want and say, no thanks we won't testify and we dare you to arrest us. seems this country has rule of law for little people, if you are big people you do whatever you want.
We've seen more of this ashole since he left office than the whole 8 years he was VP.
Go away Cheney. The only way to build a good legacy is to be a good leader. You already fucked up.
If this asshole and the rest of them aren't prosecuted for torture and war crimes by the time Obama is out of office, I won't feel safe enough to live in America any longer. Hell, it's a miracle I've managed to hold on here for so long...
I've been think the past few weeks that the fall of 2010 is as long as I can possibly hold out. I can't stand the thought of living in the worlds wealthiest third world country that denies it's citizens health care and condones torture. I'd rather live in a poor third world country that keeps it's citizens healthy and believes in freedom and justice for all and therefore prosecutes torturers and war criminals.
Get out now. You won't regret it. I plan to retire somewhere in SE Asia. Maybe even one of the communist countries. They're much nicer than North America.
But they say Vietnam is nice too.
Love LUV love SE Asia. Just go and pick the place you like best.
Where'd you come from?
Mississippi
And your parents?
Very wealthy.
Where are they now?
Six feet under.
But she was granted one more start
The convent of The Sacred Heart!
When'd you get here?
1920
How old were you?
Don't remember
Then what happened?
I met Amos
And he stole my heart away
Convinced me to elope one day
Who's Fred Casely?
My ex-boyfriend.
Why'd you shoot him?
I was leavin'.
Was he angry?
Like a madman
Still I said, "Fred, move along."
She knew that she was doing wrong.
Then describe it.
He came toward me.
With the pistol?
From my bureau.
Did you fight him?
Like a tiger.
He had strength and she had none.
And yet we both reached for the gun
Oh yes, oh yes, oh yes we both
Oh yes we both
Oh yes, we both reached for
The gun, the gun, the gun, the gun
Oh yes, we both reached for the gun
For the gun.
[REPORTERS]
Oh yes, oh yes, oh yes they both
Oh yes, they both
Oh yes, they both reached for
The gun, the gun, the gun, the gun,
Oh yes, they both reached for the gun
for the gun.
there are few things in life that we can count on with absolute certainty, and one of the few universal truths is that cheney is wargasmic lying SOB. so (and this is where schieffer's failure come in) it is up to the media to know what the fuck is going on before bumbling thru an interview with this asshole. Fuck that up and you just merely give the sheen of responsible journalism, when what it actually did was provide yet another outlet for cheney to spin his ass-web of misinfo and BS.
being a newsman i would expect schieffer to not be as doltish as he was, but, then again, schieffer is a compromised newsmodel, and no longer a reputable journalist.
not even one month ago we were provided first hand accounts of just how effective cheney's torture is in getting information, and how effective real intelligence gathering is in comparison--from the nytimes:
There was no actionable intelligence gained from using enhanced interrogation techniques on Abu Zubaydah that wasn’t, or couldn’t have been, gained from regular tactics. In addition, I saw that using these alternative methods on other terrorists backfired on more than a few occasions — all of which are still classified. The short sightedness behind the use of these techniques ignored the unreliability of the methods, the nature of the threat, the mentality and modus operandi of the terrorists, and due process. [Ali Soufan was an F.B.I. supervisory special agent from 1997 to 2005.]
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/23/opinion/23s...
then the news came out that the reason we were copying the tactics of the khmer rouge, and the north koreans was to get false confessions from the detainees to help further the lie that saddam was in cahoots with OBL.
schieffer pussied out, or didn't know, or didn't care... whichever it is was, schieffer failed big time. nice job bob.
Not much of a surprise there. He used to golf with George H.W. all the time.
I wonder what messes with your objectivity more: a few rounds of Golf or a drunken rap dance. Close tie.
The main reason for them to torture was to get the answers they wanted, Saddam was in cahoots with Al-qaeda. They then use this justification to invade Iraq and "finish the job" of removing Saddam from power.
Ummm...this defense has been used from the dictators throughout history. It is nothing new to get the local government to pass legislation legalizing what they have done.
That's contempt, isn't it?
"I'd have to see what the circumstances are..." What an equivocating little turd.
I could go much harsher, but I give. 25+ years of people like this in power, and all the sting has left my curse words. I wore them out.
I laqughed out loud when he responded. Under what circumstances do you not tell the truth under oath?
The rules, of course, don't apply to the privileged...
Read the following article at Slate for some insight on swearing in before Congress:
slate.com/id/2135698
Cheney is all ready putting out conditions on how he'll testify,if he does! "I'll have to see what the circumstances are and what type of precedent we were setting."
He has no plans to testify,whether under oath or not!
cheney is sticking to the script and he doesn't appear to have any stage fright. cheney is the go to guy as
if BUSH were doing these shows he would fumble/bumble and lose his cool much like jack nicholson did
as col. nathan jessep in the movie, A Few Good Men. they had this figured out from all angles before
the moved into 'enhanced interrogation'. their defense will be til the bitter end, it was for the protection
of the country. pursuing the guilty up the chain of command is going to have too many detours all by design. cheney is ballsy he goes on the offense. to him it's NOT illegal if you write the law.
implicated Bush, Georgie has got to be pissed off.
I sure as hell don't, not with Dick Cheney still breathing free air on this planet.
to start at the top here. No need to work up the chain of command when with these guys if you start at the top they'll be trying to pass the blame down as fast as they can. Only that won't fly with the evidence available already.
What a shame that this lunatic freak is still free , alive and well , he should be locked up and facing criminal charges , both domestic and international. Shows the sorry state of this country , is a disgrace .
Why aren’t Dick & George making it a duet? Could it be because George is scared shitless? Or has he fallen off the wagon so hard he looks like a Wino?
That when Cheney says "that there was nothing devious or deceitful or dishonest or illegal about what was done," he has said the same thing about the Nixon administration's involvement in Watergate and Bush the Elder's role in Iran-Contra. We should also remember that he sets the bar of morality much higher for Democrats and even moderate Republicans like Colin Powell - which is deceitful and dishonest by itself.
I'd call him scum but it would be an insult to the unicellular micro-organisms that inhabit cesspools and drainage ditches everywhere.
.
Q U E S T I O N:
So I can hire a lackey lawyer to write a memo describing how I can drive intoxicated so that if I hit and kill someone, it won't be called vehicular homicide and I won't be prosecuted for it?
.
If your name is Cheney or Bush you could.
I'd like every criminal in this country to stand up in front of a judge and claim equal protection, based on the failure of the justice dept to hold anyone in the Bush administration accountable. They can say, your honor, we submit that this crime happened in the past and as such is done, nothing we say or do here today changes it. I say we look forward instead of back.
here is an idea, someone kidnap (rendition) a fox reporter, then use waterboarding on him, then when the Gov brings charges for kidnapping and torture, we'll have precedent.
But I guarentee you that if I am I most definitly WILL BE USING THAT!
All atrocities have their defenders.
...who wants Americans to die just to say he told us so and hasn't produced anything of detail to buttress any of his bullshit complaints. Everyone needs to stay on this sick fuck's back until he goes away...literally
there will always be reasonable doubt when their defense is we did it for the protection of this country. the BUSH administration/olc have this covered. they knew this could/would come. i would like to see BUSH and cheney answer questions under oath but i still believe there will be reasonable doubt and anything close to prosecution will get watered down big time.
The LAW is that "national security" does NOT trump the LAW. And until Congress or the Supreme Court changes that then that IS how it is.
Tell me, Dick, if you're so passionate about protecting the country, why do you detest most of its citizens?
And what does it matter who knew and if your own troops go through it? Does that change its legality?
because he engaged in the unpopular and dirty business of protecting the United States from another Terrorist Attack get used to it. No one prosecuted Truman for unloading two of the most hideous weapons of mass destruction in world history on Hiroshima and Nagasaki either.
I still have trouble understanding why this troll is allowed on television so much now....he has been living under a rock for 7 years now all of a sudden he's f'n letterman!
Me thinks thou doth protesteth too mucheth Heil Cheney..
worried much?
justice department meet bus. get under it.
If it actually give specific examples of how these "tactics" saved an lives. If it were to say "we waterboarded Ali al Terrorist and he told us they they were going to do this and his buddies were hiding in this roach motel and we sent it FBI guys who busted down the door while they were assembling a nuclear device" they yeah I believe its argument, but all it does time and time again is try to scare the crap out of us to justify its cast conduct.
Yes I am referring to Cheney as "it" for this thing, doesn't deserve the respect and dignity owed to human being.
Who is stupid enough to think Bob Schieffer is going to go hard on his BFF, Dick Cheney? These guys have been best buddies since Cheney first came to Washington in his Nixon days.
I know, Americans are pretty dense when it comes to picking up on the MSM's tight conspiracy with Washington's moneyed corporate aristocracy. But still...Bob fucking Schieffer? Is it still all these clowns need to do, put on a suit and comb their hair, and most of America thinks they have integrity?
Sure explains a lot, doesn't it.
"
"
"
"
Crickets!
During this interview, Cheney said, "Now, if you'd look at it from the perspective of a senior government official, somebody like myself, who stood up and took the oath of office on January 20th of '01 and raised their right hand and said we're going to protect and defend the United States against all enemies foreign and domestic, this was exactly, exactly what was needed to do it."
The REAL Vice Presidential oath of office:
"I, (name), do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter. So help me God."
He swore an oath to defend THE CONSTITUTION. THE CONSTITUTION!!!
yeah his interpretation of the constitution maybe i should say addington/yoo's interpretation.
i knew before i scrolled down that some other knowledgable on-point guy or gal would have picked up on this nuance of what Cheney said...
the oath is to the Constitution, Dick!
big diff, at least from where i stand... we don't sacrifice all that we founded this country upon based on some political or strategic expediency
they jez'don'gettit!
way to go, Devilishlydo!
"national defense" NEVER trumps LAW!! EVER!!!
Mr Cheney at Nuremburg... Could be a whole movie...
Who would get to play Cheney in the made for TV movie?
Can we reincarnate Lionel Barrymore?
Apologies to his family.
and get it over with already.
When his diseased heart finally stops and he's worm fodder, will you shed a tear?
I sometimes wish the christians were right in that there is a heaven and Hell, because this nutsack would most certainly burn in the fires of Hell..
I, for one, will celebrate, and share my joy at his death with everyone I can.
All the justice department has to do is drop some supoenas on this evil man and maybe he'll STFU. He didn't talk this much the whole time he was president. I kinda thought we wouldn't have to hear from these clowns for a while.
(quotes from the full transcript)
"...the possibility of Al Qaida terrorists in the midst of one of our own cities with a nuclear weapon or a biological agent."
Holy Sh*t Batman! Mushroom Cloud!!!
"I find deeply disturbing, and I think to the extent that those policies were responsible for saving lives, that the administration is now trying to cancel those policies or end them, terminate them..."
Good Grief Charlie Brown! Torture keeps us safe!
And, there are only two ways:
"Well, then you'd have to say that, in effect, we're prepared to sacrifice American lives rather than run an intelligent interrogation program that would provide us the information we need to protect America."
If we don't torture, good Americans die. That simple. Appeals to the Jack Bauer crowd fer sher. And, discussing the legality of torture is treasonous. Bizzaro Cheney!
"discussing the legality of torture is treasonous and emboldenates our enemies who will come blow up dirty newcuelar bombs with deadly gasses in our homeland cities..."
"So they should release those classified documents that clear me..."
The "fact of the matter" is that there are brain damaged and dead captives to deal with now, and Cheney the barbarian is solely responsible.
Is a dirty rotten lying coward!
I would not believe him even under oath.
bush gave the go a head. did bush tell the American people ON TV,"We don't Torture" this asshole just snitched off bush.
Like others have said, Where is bush. the press is still sucking off these guys. Why don't you guys in the press and TV land get bush on your show? Ask him the questions. Putting dick head on give him just the chance for him to put out his bullshit. Only in America can an asshole like this get away with this shit.
As long as Obama lets this shit go without any kind of court action, we will have a black eye from the last 8 years of the dick-dick-tater-ship.
WTF. when clinton was getting grilled by repugs because bills library was getting money from people "they thought was (?). bush is getting 1 million dollars a day and not one word from them or the press.
how did you take down 3 buldings and not get cought. where is the film from all the vidios cams on the hotells. must be at least 20 or 30 of them and all you show us is 4 or 5 fraims.
something about anthrax. the 2 people that got this shit were Dems, the 2 that would not sign there patriot bill to have control over the people of America. After there letters, they signed.
That was sickening to watch. There was so much spin and so many lies flying around I couldn't keep track after the first minute: it was ONE LONG LIE.
He's bluffing. He think s he's a tough guy. Watch him cry once they get him under oath, and then tell him he'll have 50 years in prison.
I wish it would. I wish these jerks would get charged with war crimes. Give them there day in court. I would like to see just what spin they could come up with when other countrys waterboarded Americand and were put to death foe it.
Schieffer should ask him, why were there 92 deaths of people in our charge. You said, dick, we cought these people when lots of them were bought with the 9 billion dollars you sent over there, and cant account for any of the money. dick you make me sick just to look at and what you and others like you have done to my country.rott in hell.
What a lying sack of crap. He doesn't have the marbles to appear before Congress and lie to the committee's faces. He'll lie to Bob Schieffer, he'll lie to his own mother, he'll lie to me and to you, and I'm certain he lies to himself.
What a sad, sad, fuck of a man. On to Den Haag, and soon, please, before the sorry puke-stick dies of heart failure.
It has already been established that the U.S. did engage in torture as ordered by Bush/Cheney. This is no longer the question. The question is whether or not the DOJ upholds the law or abandons the ideals under which it was built?
there is not one....not one...actual attack that was stopped by the torture that was committed
We now know the 9/11 time bomb was ticking for quite some time in which Bush/Cheney received warnings not only from our own intelligence but from various other countries AND they ignored them.
He was a coward as a young man struggling to stay out of the army. He was a sniveling coward when he promoted the war in Iraq, pushed torture against others, when he outed a CIA agent, and now trying to keep his fat ass out of prison for crimes against humanity. Cowards and bullies need to be exposed. And I think Cheney will look fantastic in an orange jumpsuit.
I don't get it.
Why on earth would Cheney hesitate to lie under oath?
To him, one more lie would just be like Hitler forgetting to brush his teeth.
When you build an entire political career on false premises, what difference does it make whether you did so under oath or not?
Does Cheney seriously think that God will punish him more severely if he lies under oath than NOT under oath?
Would a God-fearing man commit treason so shamelessly in any case?
The list of questions seems endless, until you realize that the only thing Cheney fears is US.
God is not in the picture at all.
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