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Michael Moore was on Larry King Live last night with Wolf Blitzer, and there was a classic moment after Moore calls insurance companies "thieves and jackals" and says they'll take the fines rather than help people. "The question should never be, 'How much money are we going to make on this?'" Moore said.

BLITZER: Isn't that the basic nature of American capitalism?

MOORE: Yes, it is, Wolf. That's why this economic system we have is broke, it's bankrupt, it's corrupt, it's unfair, it's not just and We need a more democratic economic system where the people are having a say and the richest one percent don't control the whole thing.

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121 Comments
kittycollins's picture

the truth, albeit unconciously I'm sure, for once.

SadButTrue's picture

..how Wolf's CNN bosses will punish him for throwing out such a vulnerable rhetorical question? Especially since Michael Moore is the person least likely to pass on the opportunity.


"In theory theory and practice are alike. In practice they are very different."

ricky's picture

have the intelligence to understand what happened.


"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter

You may be right. The MSM still treats Colbert and Stewart as a joke (even though they're the most trusted name in news), so I doubt that Wolf or CNN have realised what happened.

sixandseveneights's picture

Don't let the erudite looking white beard and mustache fool you.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bd2ySV7AfgM&fe...

MikeD's picture

he's just another vacant corporate talking head

Medical Diagnosis by Video's picture

if I could afford one.

project's picture

I also agree with some of the other opinions.
There are 40 million of them that do not have the morals or the intelligence to understand what was said.

Geraldo's picture

Wolf Blitzer came THIS CLOSE to having a thought.

He's an AIPAC mouthpiece. He's incapable of thought - or conscience, for that matter.

A total Freudian slip by Wolf. After he said it, he has that "oh, shit" look on his face. It was totally unintentional on the part of Wolf to say what most of us have known for decades.

He's probably praying to his patront saint, the dollar sign right now (and begging the CNN bosses not to fire him).

Wolf: DOES NOT COMPUTE.

PYTHONCHARLY's picture

WOLF IS RIGHT, AND THAT IS WHY CAPITALISM IS IMMORAL AND SHOULD END

Jack Canuckski's picture

Economic predation? Certainly is.

Its good to have at least one voice on the MSM that will criticize Capitalism, which is America's true religion.

I'd like to see a lot more of Michael Moore on television. He might get a few more people thinking.

ikalbertus's picture

Capitalism has morphed into religion in this country. True believers have to keep the faith with constant reinforcement. If they lose faith they may fall from grace and have nothing, monetarily or spiritually, or so they believe. If you are not a true believer in capitalism you must be a . . . Socialist. Beck is like Oral Roberts except for the fake healing. In 2050 how will people look at capitalism.

A page is turning and they know it

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

Not since laissez-faire and caveat emptor.

If we were truly a capitalist society, anyone could start an insurance agency and not have to follow any regulations

Including paying claims.


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

Milquetoast's picture

...we had a judicial system that made insurance companies follow the contracts that they enter into? (and the regulations)

(then would it be capitalism?)

...(forget about The FED for a moment)


audit-prosecute-incarcerate

Jack Canuckski's picture

Insurance company contracts are written by insurance company lawyers to benefit insurance companies.

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

Businesses break contracts all the time.

And judges don't originate the laws, legislatures do, judges just interpret.

And in business law pain and suffering is not a consideration, merely putting people back into the positions they were before entering into the breached contract.

But right now only state legislatures regulate insurance due to McCarran Ferguson Act,

When what we need is more federal, and breaking up the monopolies set up by the Big 5 insurance agencies and their agreements not to compete in each other's area.


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

popworld7's picture

Which is why private for profit health insurance companies should have nothing to do with you and your health care. Your life or some company and their profit... I wonder what the company is going to do since it is the basic nature of capitalism? Do you get it now? Thanks for making the point!

Shadowgm's picture

... because the insurance companies are better served by the current, favorable legislation mandating the purchase of insurance from companies like them, as opposed to a public option, which (as some have pointed out in threads here) is the only constitutionally-valid means of requiring insurance.

So under no circumstances will the insurance companies allow the GOP to piss in their teacups - the suits will be used to whip up conservative nutjobbery, then quietly fade into the background. The GOP is chasing something that will knife their corporate buddies in the back and/or pave the way to a public option, which runs against their 'big government' scare tactic.

Milquetoast's picture

is most certainly not a constitutionally valid means of requiring insurance!

(as some have pointed out in threads here)


audit-prosecute-incarcerate

Shadowgm's picture

... Petey Wheatstraw. He's the one making the argument.

My only point is that the GOP, in suing to repeal the legislation, is really chasing something that will hurt them in the long run.

In regards to mandating purchase of insurance and the lawsuits from the states. I propose that we let whomever wants to opt out do so, BUT, they go into a CASH only database that all doctors & hospitals have access to. Then when they show up they will have to make arraignments to pay before they are treated

That's pretty much what we have now. People who don't buy insurance receive only emergency treatment.

How about we just remove money from medicine instead?

You know, socialized medicine. Everyone receives treatment.

It will cost MUCH less than we are paying now.

savannah43's picture

the argument is not that simple. Do some research.

Milquetoast's picture

I don't want it.

I don't need it.

If I had it...I wouldn't use it.

Here is a vid of reasonable people who are singing my song!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DWuX2s7h55A

and here is judge Andrew Napolitano on the mandate subject.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8e0vcgE_tAw


audit-prosecute-incarcerate

Shade Tail's picture

[I don't need it.

If I had it...I wouldn't use it.]

Keep telling yourself that, if it helps you sleep at night. I'm sure that denial really is just a river in Egypt.

Oh, and by the way. A youtube video from Faux "Business" Network doesn't count as research.

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

He's just making an asp of himself.


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

Peter G's picture

or get hit by an uninsured driver or get an infectious disease or have a heart attack or.. If any of the nonsense these people spew about food curing disease were true our ancestors would have outlived us. They didn't. Eating healthy is all very well but curing disease nonsense. Anti-vaccine idiocy doesn't help either.


Hasa Diga Eebowai

I believe it IS un-Constitutional to FORCE any American to purchase ANY "for-profit" service.

It WOULD BE Constitutional had they legislated "Improved Medicare for All" paid for out of our collective taxes.

Perhaps this will be the only way Obama/Pelosi/Reid/Rahm/Axelrod/Plouffe and the rest of the Democratic Party will finally understand that an "Improved Medicare for All" system that bypasses the "for-profit" insurance corporations will be the ONLY way to overhaul the dysfunctional non-system that currently exists.

And don't even try to say that because of my position on this that I support the Tea Baggers/Republican Party.

My position only proves that I support the rights of the American People.

I will NEVER pay a dime to any "for-profit" Wall Street backed insurance corporation. I'll pay the fine instead and go without insurance until my Medicare kicks in. And I'll only pay the fine to avoid going to JAIL.

How any of you can doubt the un-Constitutionality of what was just passed really does puzzle me.


"The US has an army of 90,000 soldiers in Afghanistan and is spending $100bn a year, but has still been unable to defeat 20,000-25,000 Taliban who receive no pay at all." - Patrick Cockburn

phalanx's picture

File a tax form and one admits guilt. Not filing is akin to pleading the fifth. Interresting.


The wickedness of pride has lost the light to understand how little grace is earned an how much given.

Patriot Actor's picture

isn't every American purchasing 'for profit' service with the outsourcing of the military?
Halliburton, Blackwater et al.....

Is the Government the people?

Carrot and Shtick's picture

says it all!!

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

Does the antelope on the savannah want medical attention from the jackals?

Oh Savannah...oh don't you cry for me Argentina....


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

ricky's picture

pampad in your ute.


"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter

exitstan's picture
[Comment Deleted By Administration For Violation Of Terms Of Service]
ricky's picture

There are no therapists available for what ails you.


"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter

savannah43's picture

Get thee to a psych unit.

exitstan's picture

Click your heels and repeat: "there are no terrorists in the USA"...

. . . then I'm sure the country is crawling with them.


Corruption favors the wealthy.

exitstan's picture
[Comment Deleted By Administration For Violation Of Terms Of Service]
savannah43's picture

believe in it stupid. Accusing all of us, except apparently you, of having it is paranoid. Did you get a hit of the bad acid?

fiver's picture

There's been a lot of stuff going around lately.


Corruption favors the wealthy.

Why should I respect you when you are so accommodating towards atrocities (and death threats) made by fellow Americans? I always wondered what I would do if I came face to face with what Hannah Arendt described (in the form of a certain Mr. Eichmann).

Now I know. I risked my financial and physical security. All of it. What did you risk?

I have little problem with those who do not have a US passport -- about 95% of the human race. I have a big problem with 5% of the human race. Now, I know that there are millions of decent people in the USA who are truly mortified by the actions and attitudes of your country's majority. I just don't know any of them (except one). The rest -- whom I once believed to be truly decent and intelligent -- turned out to be just banal when the sh*t hit the fan. While many "had to look out for their children" (not take risks), I sometimes wonder... how many of their children and grandchildren are going to look back at our American contemporaries -- their own parents -- and be mightily unimpressed.

I ask you to consider: what is the limit? What number do you have to reach before you realize you are in the "big leagues"? (I am referring to the societies which accommodated the big 20th century monsters -- Mao, Stalin, Hitler). You haven't arrived there yet, but the numbers are cumulative...

What is the limit? It may be over 10 million corpses now (since the Vietnam war). What is the limit? 15 million? 20 million? Does it have to reach 40 million before an electoral majority of Americans actually start feeling enough remorse to induce them to change their offensive, aggressive foreign policies? (Or will a severe spanking be the only antidote?)

Many Americans cried over 9/11. (It shocked me too, but I also knew that our offensive wars would come home some day.) And I remember the sympathy many Americans had for US soldiers coming home from Vietnam (and now, Iraq and Afghanistan). But when it comes to Vietnamese, Palestinian, and Iraqi victims... Nothing.

I'm blasting you for these reasons. If a Palestinian or an Iraqi says these things, it's far easier for you to brush it off. For most of you, they are barely human, but for me... their lives have become more valuable than yours. I am just holding up mirror to your face so you get a taste of what it's like to be de-humanized (something most Americans are expert at). Hearing this stuff from someone who knows you pretty well -- maybe even better than you do, because I have a good knowledge of history, and I've lived among the most liberal and most conservative people in your country -- is different, isn't it?

I can and have talked this way to heavily armed people who've threatened to kill me if I appear in this or that location ("if they see me, is the specific plan"). And I suppose you think that's "ok". And then you call me paranoid.

Why should I respect you?

I'm not done yet...

You can dismiss me as psycho, paranoid, and display your canned vocabulary and world view by characterizing what I say as a "rant" or "diatribe", but know this...

In my life since I left the US (living in London, Sao Paulo, possibly China this or next year) I find that it is not me who is being laughed at.

[Knock it off with the personal attacks and this off topic stuff-Sitemonitor]

corporate conspiracy. Corporations are running the country, so anything an actual human may try to do to correct the problem you complain about is futile. Spend some time pondering that concept.

exitstan's picture

That is why they have been voting -- since 1980 -- to liquidate their industrial base, while paying the commission fees to Goldman Sachs, AIG, Citibank, and the Offense Industry, etc...

It was always in the voter's hands.

People (yourself included) do realize how screwed they are, I just hope enough -- jobless Republicans too -- start to realize that they actually voted for this to happen.

In 1918 and 1945 the top marginal tax rates were in the 88% - 90% range, because Americans voted for politicians who decided this tax rate was in the best interest of the country.

When President Carter advocated substantial efforts towards retooling industry in ways that would inch the economy away from its dependence on imported oil, he was laughed out of office -- a majority of voters preferred that mediocrity who began the process of relocating the "land of opportunity" to other countries (via the democratic process).

Today, in the midst of the generational, global, bankrupting war on an abstract noun, the top marginal tax rate is less than half the WW I & WW II levels, because Americans (Democrats too) keep promoting politicians who seem to have an extremely narrow definition of what the public interest is -- 1% of the voters, who think their votes should count more, as the director of GS - Brazil spent hours trying to convince me.

If the US is truly a democracy, then voters can change it. I had hoped Obama's election would swing the pendulum leftwards, and the watery health care bill is a strong step forward, but he is still owned by Goldman Sachs, and continues offensive, risky foreign policies (escalating the Afghan War while refusing to impose the two state solution).

I bet we agree on a lot of things Savannah, but after watching the US go into the shit hole -- killing millions of civilians along the way, counting the bodies in East Asia, Latin America, and Southwest Asia -- precisely because of US voting habits, I find myself rather annoyed. I am sorry for dumping on you. But I hope you understand the point I am making: this is what the voters chose. (sarcasm: they must have wanted it)

savannah43's picture

I hear you. But so does YS. I was sticking up for him. He's a good guy, too.

exitstan's picture

Peace, reason, and reconciliation is what I want (where possible). Sometimes I hope, but I'm tired of waiting ;-)

All the best,
-s

curtilingus's picture
:p

Point taken existan. You can learn a lot from an ex-pat. While traveling I learned more about America than I did about the the countries I was visiting. The only way you can see how much conditioning is going on, is to get outside of the US.

Incidentally I didn't see any personal attacks in that rant.

fiver's picture

After reading only two lines of internet text . . . .

I'm thinking Bill Frist might be getting a bit jealous.


Corruption favors the wealthy.

ron's picture

the terrorists are the regressive republicans, the teabagers and the MSM.

Jack Canuckski's picture

of Texans. I'm a Willie Nelson fan.

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

Diabolus est Deus Inversus

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

Stephen Foster is how I remember the name of Amaterasu's brother.


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

Why does he hate our troops?


Corruption favors the wealthy.

is a win-win for the Insurance companies. Don't be fooled by their wailing and gnashing of teeth. They are wailing because they didn't get their way, and don't like the idea of a government which is not directly under their thumb 100% of the time.

They are not bemoaning any loss of earnings.

Once the mandatory purchase requirements kick in, they will make more money than ever before. I guarantee it.

Abbybwood's picture

My fine for non-compliance will be about $1000/year or so. I think what I'll do now is invest $1000 in United Health Plans stock so that way when the fine comes due I'll just cash out a little stock and pay the fine with that money.

Thanks!


"The US has an army of 90,000 soldiers in Afghanistan and is spending $100bn a year, but has still been unable to defeat 20,000-25,000 Taliban who receive no pay at all." - Patrick Cockburn

Different Anonymous's picture
.

OUTRAGEOUS! How dare MM claim that our belov-ed capitalism is anything but a shining beacon of all that is right, true, and christian! Dirty red, doesn't he know that the system that allows one tiny minority class to trickle onto the heads of the rest of us has been annointed by GOD?! Jebus Himself said that only the rich will get into heaven, the rest of us will have to ride a camel or some such thing.

Next thing you know he'll be calling for a reduction in the "defense" budget! Why, the very idea...

I don't really think you can fake outrage here. Is there any movement that looks favorably on the American economic system outside of the beltway?

Conservatives think the system is too screwed up by government deals with big business and union interests. Liberals think the system is too screwed up by a lack of government oversight of big business. Both sides generally think the system is irreparably screwed.

Only in the beltway are they trying to uphold the current system. Look at the bank regulation, bailout plans, and health care reform deals cut with corporate interests to see that.

Think about the health care reform in particular: one side pushed for single payer or at least a public option to lower costs, one side pushed for opening up competition to lower costs. What we got was a bill that doesn't lower costs, just guarantees business to insurance companies and raises taxes.

Like the expansion of entitlements or not, you cannot deny that it was accomplished without threat to the profit margins of health care industries.

is proof people watched bluegal's video and are still dancing to a different tune.


"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter

Pete C.'s picture

And that's why insurance companies shouldn't be responsible for health care.

fiver's picture

You know, like the Wall Streeters keep threatening to do. Except they haven't.


Corruption favors the wealthy.

SadButTrue's picture

..with a comment about how capitalism has also destroyed the media. Which is just as bad or even worse when you think about it, because the media directly impacts on the health of the nation.

That would however have been MM's last appearance on CNN or any cable or network TV.


"In theory theory and practice are alike. In practice they are very different."

Shadowgm's picture

... that profit USED to be a byproduct of newsgathering. You provided a service, a solid and reliable product, and so people watched.

Then, that profit became the raison d'etre for the news business. In order to make money, you had to have ratings. In order to have ratings, you had to have gimmicks (or at least spiffy new graphics and 'special' reports).

SadButTrue's picture

..if you look at the big picture connection between media and the much larger corporations that control them. The profitability of NBC pales in comparison to the benefits of using them as a propaganda voice promoting low taxes on parent GE. Most other news outlets have a similar motive. The same 1% that controls the economy have bought up the cable and networks -- and use them to control the population and preserve their privileges and dominance.

"Freedom of the press is guaranteed only to those who own one."

-- A.J. Liebling


"In theory theory and practice are alike. In practice they are very different."

Milquetoast's picture

The profitability of NBC pales in comparison to the benefits of using them as a propaganda voice promoting low taxes on parent GE.

even if NBC were to operate at a loss...

G.E would keep dumpin' money into it! (to keep it on the air)


audit-prosecute-incarcerate

ricky's picture

MM would not want to crap in his movie promoting messkit.

Face it, he is just a ball absent, spine challenged cottage cheese butt corporatist and this act of omission proves it.


"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter

SadButTrue's picture

At no point are the rat-wangers more successful than when they get people on the putative left to attack their own advocates. I should think that Moore's body of work is sufficient to shield him from accusations of being a corporatist. YMMV


"In theory theory and practice are alike. In practice they are very different."

Jack Canuckski's picture

The right wingers targeted Moore for his truth telling in Farenheit 911, and then the insurance companies went after him for Sick-o.
If Moore has made money, he has done it honestly, making films that had to be made.
He's a true American cultural hero, up there with Mark Twain and Will Rogers.

Alice X - Chomsky Nader's picture

There should be a communist conspiracy, and I want in on it.


statusquObama, change you can only pretend in

icepicks.


"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter

Alice X - Chomsky Nader's picture

Ricky, you were starting to make sense (for a moment), and then you relapsed. Go out and lie in the sun.


statusquObama, change you can only pretend in

project's picture
wow

I was wondering what happened to ricky there myself.
I didn't hear MM say anything corporatist. Hey there is nothing wrong with making money. There is a difference in making money providing a good or a service and riping people off.
We have been getting riped off for years now. The wallstreet crowd the insurance companies are all getting something our money for nothing. Things that are neccassary to life should not be left to the market place. Things like roads, bridges, public transportation, police, fire depts, hospitals, insurance, utilities, should be part of the shared sacrifice of all the people, not for private profit. It is just morally and intellectually wrong.

taller ghost walt's picture

half percenter.

Terrible's picture

is one of those uneducated idiots who believe that capitalism is somehow enshrined in or democratic system. In his stupidity he shows his support for Italian Fascism. Idiot!

Jack Canuckski's picture

is that he makes too much money and only feels empathy with those in his income bracket.

As I have said for long time, capitalism is inherently antithetical to democracy.

DrDick,

That is only true on particular levels. Yes, you cannot run an economy democratically (collectively) and capitalistically (individually), but you can manage capital democratically, manage shops democratically, and so on.

The real problem is the inevitable concentration of wealth, and with it power, in a small economic elite which comes to dominate the system and limit the options for the vast majority of the population. Look at the situation in our own country, with an inability to enact campaign finance reform, the ludicrous SCOTUS definition of corporations as persons, and the disproportionate power of the wealthy in our political system

More democracy, people power, less "grand" old elitists bossing everybody around. Great idea. I've been supporting real economic power for the masses for years now. Parecon is one idea that might work.


Politics is for the present, but an equation is for eternity. Albert Einstein

"Basic nature of American Capitalism?"

Can anyone show me how this isn't just the nature of people?

People, when not confronted with the effects of their actions first-hand, routinely look for methods to benefit themselves.

Just look at how quickly Wolf Blitzer and Michael Moore are both willing to stretch the truth and engage in poor journalism in order to create a stir and raise their image. Look at the pensioners bankrupting state governments by loading up vacation and overtime in their last year. Look at any politician in recent memory, and you will see a multitude of instances where the politician took a small benefit to himself, despite the detrimental effects it had on others.

The simple fact of the matter is that people are naturally moral, made that way by evolution. Our natural morality is not able to handle modern society, and whenever there happens to be a society as large and diverse as the US (or any other modern society), people will misbehave.

Taking it a step further, a recent study has shown that market activity has a beneficial effect on the shortcomings of human behavior.

American capitalism is a disaster, though.

Medical Diagnosis by Video's picture

that is why we have laws. Of course, the Rethugs want to de-regulate everything about THEIR behavior and regulate everyone else's. Because, they benefit.

I think acting like either side puts together their policies without first asking industry lobbyists what they want is fooling themselves.

Jack Canuckski's picture

Today, capitalism is justified by its defenders as corresponding to human nature. 500 years ago, feudalism was defended in the same way.
However, there have been counter-arguments made about human nature being social and co-operative, if you read people such as anarchist Petre Kropotkin or anthropologist Levi-Strauss.

Humans are certainly naturally social and co-operative. I also do not believe capitalism is justified by human nature.

I do believe a successful market is necessary to augment social human nature where it starts to break down over large numbers.

Medical Diagnosis by Video's picture

Michael commented on how we have to count the pages of a bill now, and Wolf replied, it's confusing.

Yes it is, IF YOU CAN'T READ!

Now that's a big problem for Tea Party ignoramuses and Sarah Palin (who reads any and/or all of them newspapers, you betcha).

Of course the bill is a mess. It could have been a few pages, starting with:

Single Payer,

Financed by raising the taxes of the rich to a equitable level,

Cutting the"Defense" budget by 90%

Ending the illegal wars of choice

End the bank and insurance company bailouts, with claw back of the ill gained funds, and prosecutions

Yes folks, it's that easy, if you have the courage, a spine. Most Dems don't have either.

I was going to reply because you singled out the Tea Party at first, but I noticed you called out the Dems as well. As far as I can tell Paul, Grayson, Sanders and Kucinich are the only major successful politicians with the courage of their convictions (or any convictions whatsoever).

LCforevah's picture

!

is the day before the military coup.

reluctant leader's picture

They've almost always "controlled the whole thing", going way back before the first white man set foot on North America.

They will keep their control and ownership, but the profits need to be shared more equitably, not only with employees but shareholders as well. Allowing managers to pay themselves 400+ times what an average employee makes harms the overall economy. Historical data shows our overall economy was in much better condition when CEO pay was much lower, when the middle class could actually raise a family with one wage earner.

Something like 40% of ALL Americans have ZERO net worth. Blitzer is correct. This is exactly what corrupt captitalism is designed to do.

PYTHONCHARLY's picture
[Comment Deleted By Administration For Violation Of Terms Of Service]
ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

Like your shift key?


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

Alice X - Chomsky Nader's picture

He doesn't have a shift key.


statusquObama, change you can only pretend in

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

He's shiftless?


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

derekthered's picture

yes, for once someone said it, i would urge readers to look deeper.
santa clara county vs. southern pacific railroad established corporate personhood, it is just plain bad law; citizens united has further exacerbated the situation, it too is just plain bad law.

the workings of capital can certainly be nefarious, but when our laws elevate artificial entities to the same status as human beings, things take a much darker turn. you have to pull weeds out by the root, otherwise they just grow back.

Zak44's picture

Whovever said "all Jews are smart" never met Wolf Blitzer. Or saw him on "Celebrity Jeopardy."

And for a very interesting piece on why thieves and jackals are ultimately destructive to not just societies, but economies as well, check this out:

http://www.democracyjournal.org/j_wes_ulm_soc...

Gloriapower's picture

This "reform" gives new meaning to insurance poor.

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

Diabolus est Deus Inversus

Disturbed Havok's picture

IF that's the nature of capitalism, then don't you think we can find something better? The "best" system's nature is to have thieves and jackals and that seems to be okay with everyone because... why?

I'm of the belief that a good idea is a good idea is a good idea. Also, to all my "let the free market be free" friends out there - if you believe pure, unhindered capitalism will work, then you also have to believe true Marxism will work because both theories work on the same premise - people will naturally work in the greater interest of all in order to better their own existence. It sounds nice on paper, probably a lot like the F-22 Raptor did at some point, but not so much in practice.

Abbybwood's picture

Would entail the American people turning off their fucking teevees and walking out their front doors and actually meeting those in their communities face to face for a little political chit-chat.

A NEW political party would have to actually be launched that would not include anything remotely resembling any D's or R's or C's (corporatists).

Good luck with that.

I need to run now. My soap's starting....


"The US has an army of 90,000 soldiers in Afghanistan and is spending $100bn a year, but has still been unable to defeat 20,000-25,000 Taliban who receive no pay at all." - Patrick Cockburn

SgtCedar's picture

I would bet most people in 1775, just before the publication of The Wealth of Nations, could never imagine that anything could ever replace mercantilism. Sooner or later some other economic system will replace capitalism. The challenge is to make sure the replacement is fairer than the current system. Totalitarianism in some form is always trying to replace capitalistic democracy.

And Adam Smith even acknowledged that the market fails to produce public goods.. health care is a public good and the market fails.. our corporate state is not capitalist because capitalism requires competition, free flow of information and freedom of entrance and exit from the market and a government which ensures those prerequisites..

SadButTrue's picture

Mass advertising also puts a spin on the free market that Adam Smith would never approved of. If say laundry detergent ads were limited to actually telling you about the intrinsic virtues of their products you would find that ALL powdered detergents are essentially sodium phosphate, an industrial chemical that is sold for about $150 for a 50 lb. bag. But instead they sell pictures of pretty young women, attractive children and cloudless skies. The process is not designed to inform your purchase decision, but to subvert your intelligent involvement in the transaction.

I won't even go into how disappointed I am that my use of various body washes and deodorant sprays has not resulted in me being chased by dozens of attractive women 30 years my junior.


"In theory theory and practice are alike. In practice they are very different."

When people talk about making money, there are two common phrases used:

Making a living.

Making a killing.

How un-ironic it is that making a living results in earning enough to live without harming people, while making a killing inevitably requires harming others, personally and financially.

Peter G's picture

Who did Bill Gates harm personally or financially? How about Steve Jobs? I understand the companies those men founded made quite a few people wealthy and generated jobs , good jobs, for many other people. Yet they made a killing. Seems contradictory to me.


Hasa Diga Eebowai

Obviously names like Digital Research, Novell and several other software firms are completely beyond your grasp. Or you only started using computers in 2007.

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

Diabolus est Deus Inversus

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

Michael Moore looks like he's losing weight, but getting a little long in tooth for the unkempt youth look.


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

virtue's picture
A

couple of points:
1. Blitzer said "American capitalism" not capitalism. There's a difference.
2. Did it occur to any of you that high prices are a result of monopolies? Could it be that the regulations of your beloved "government" could oppress business competition? Therefore creating monopoly situations. I think you could begin by looking at the AMA to see where your high health costs originate.

But Free Market Capitalism = freedom and democracy...right?


Government + the Federal Reserve = organized crime

ed1007's picture

the only thing Dick Cheney ever said that I agreed with was "Wolf nobody is on teevee more than you" Who the hell names their kid Wolf?? Man is he Dumb didnt know what town Jesus was born in?? I mean cmon wolf this is why he should not be an interviewer or political host so dumb he allows the interviewee to say lies & he doesnt know the difference so it just goes by and once the bell rung well you know you cant unring the bell. But really Wolf, you should resign maybe host a kiddees show. Let someone with a brain or even half a brain be the host. Actually a parrott could do his job

this interview and he actually let him speak a little. Amazing.

Paul's picture

had Moore on. It is comical watching Blitzer trying to spar with him.

When talking points collide with facts.

researcher's picture

michael moore is one of the few americans that understands the evils of capitalism.

it is in the process of creating a very selfish and immoral society.

look around we are imperialists, some even war mongers, many seeking violence, the list is long.

capitalism like communism must self destruct but not before we reach third world status.

it is so bad the supreme court now considers global corps persons.

materialism gone wild.

and to think the middle class lined up to vote for reagan and since then reagan economics. he gotcha good americans.

americans wanted and love their capitalism now they whine like babies when it puts them in third world status. it is called karma folks or what we sow we reap.

mega profits off the sick and needy says it all about the evils of capitalism. and the suffering we create around the world with our wars for profits for the few.

how few americans understand a social democracy over communism, socialism or capitalism.

michael moore we need a movie on a social democracy and its benefits to the american people.

oh really's picture

Best kept secret in America.

Way to go, Mike! You tell it like it is, man!!

I get tired of the media using the excuse that how the insurance companies operate is capitalism in action. Because it isn't.

Name any other major business sector that operates on the principle that saying "no" as often as possible is good for profits? Name any other sector where your alterative to bad actions, policies, etc is to just not have it anymore.

What if Toyota, Target, Wal-Mart, etc all operated on the prinicple of saying no? No you can't buy that? No there is not a sale? No, only certain people that meet certain requirements can make use of our products and services? No, we can't address your complaints? We would refuse to use them and go elsewhere because competition exists to provide that option. We choose to do business with them. In all other sectors, saying "yes" to the customer is good for business. Trying to create as many customers as possible is good for business. It is capitalism in action.

That is not the case for healthcare insurance. If you don't like their service, you usually don't have a resource. If you don't like the options, you can't go elsewhere. There is no "competing", there is no "I will take my business elsewhere". We are not choosing to do business with them, most of the time they are choosing if they want to do business with us. The motivation isn't to say yes, but to say no. The motivation isn't to create more customers, but a certain "quality" of customer that isn't really going to use their services. There is nothing that comes anywhere close to "capitalism" in how insurance companies work.

The press, the Democrats, everyone needs to quit letting that slide because it is not true. Everytime it brought up, the reporters need to be called fools for reiterating the talking point and set straight.

tiktokklok's picture

--------"That's why this economic system we have is broke, it's bankrupt, it's corrupt, it's unfair, it's not just and We need a more democratic economic system where the people are having a say and the richest one percent don't control the whole thing."------

And the ONLY way we're going to get that is via socialist REVOLUTION!

Americans: Wake up, wise up, rise up and throw off your chains!

The workers are the only people who actually create wealth; the capitalist steal it.

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