60 Minutes: The Pentagon's Ray Gun
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Download | play (h/t Heather and Mark H.)
What if we had a weapon that could control, subdue and or disperse crowds without causing death or permanent harm? Well, according to David Martin and 60 Minutes, the Pentagon would be wary about using it in a combat arena like Iraq in favor of traditional (and lethal) methods. But we have such a weapon, one that the Pentagon has no problem demonstrating its use on groups like peace protesters. Hmmm....what are we supposed to take away from that?
Pentagon officials call it a major breakthrough which could change the rules of war and save huge numbers of lives in Iraq. But it's still not there. That because in the middle of a war, the military just can't bring itself to trust a weapon that doesn't kill.
Phasers! set to stun.. err kill... err... heat
THAT REPORT WAS PURE BS.
THE MILITARY HAS BEEN USING THIS WEAPON ON IRAQIS FOR AT LEAST 2 YEARS. DOCTORS WERE SEEING PEOPLE BROUGHT IN WITH BURNS TO THEIR SKIN BUT NOT TO THEIR CLOTHES.....ENTIRE FAMILIES WERE COOKED INSIDE THEIR CARS.
THIS IS A PORTABLE DIRECTIONAL MICROWAVE OVEN.
OH AND WHAT HAPPENS IF THEY GET A LARGE ONE LIKE THIS ON A SATELLITE? THE MILITARY COULD WIPE OUT AN ENTIRE TOWN/CITY
Fascist police state, that's what I think.
I heard of these things. Be interesting if we can miniturize them into portable ray guns, but until then, we're stuck with the NRA.
The question is, "To kill or not to kill?"
the Pentagon has no problem demonstrating its use on groups like peace protesters
Those are soldiers dressed up like peace protesters. I think the "Bush/Cheney 08" signs were being used elsewhere on the base... (iow, I don't think this weapon has actually been used in real life yet.)
I saw this on Sunday and was appalled.
Why are the mock targets anti-war protesters??
pretty pathetic, used to be they would at least vilify people other than fellow countrymen , for mock battles.
So they just showed us how they can use this in the National Guard in say, Seattle, but they claim its for use in combat situation.
cant wait til Jan 09'
Joe Marasmus @ 3:
How many times have you used a gun to defend yourself?
Just curious.
So when we have 2 groups of demonstators facing off against each other, which group will be zapped? The side that agrees with the current administration or the side that opposes it? This looks like a potentially serious threat to free speech.
So the military is basically afraid of it's own people is the moral of this story. The weapon won't be used in REAL battles, but when it comes to protesters/crowd control it's ok. So when does the US military officially take over complete control of the US in the form of a advertised coup?
A weapon like this is a clear infringement of our Constitutional rights to peacefully assemble for a redress of our grievances. It is unconstitutional. Period.
But you won't see any member of Congress saying so. Whether Democrats or Republicans. Because they are ALL treasonous, traitorous snakes.
I would also believe a weapon like that would be barred from use internationally. There MUST be some international treaty we are still a signatory to that would deal with a weapon like this...the Geneva Conventions perhaps? Or did Bush remove us from it too?
God help us.
Land of the free. At least until you become a nuisance to the crooks at the top.
The military just announced that peaceful protest is actionable by the military - but is this new? Remember kent state? Its not new. How better to fill their new role - now that posse comitatus is gone?
There are groups that will be safe from this - terrorists, chinese divisions, russian special forces etc. It will never be used on them.
Not even democrats are going to complain about this.
What would happen if Bush suspended elections? How would he keep people OUT of the streets?
Welcome to the new state.
Obama Supporters Complain That Pentagon Ray Gun Can’t Stop Hillary
It's comin' down, folks. Just a matter of time... they'll be subdueing the citizens and incarcerating people at an ever faster rate. It's appalling to know that the prisons are filling up faster all the time... and for what? Even speaking against those in power... Pathetic!
Cat Atomic @ 11:
You said it! Thanks!!!
Nice subtle reinforcement that war protesters and peace advocates gathering in a peaceful manner are fair targets of a government gone mad. Why on earth would peace protesters need to be dispersed with any form of weapon?
Why peace protesters? Why is the fake crowd not made up of people carrying signs saying "Bomb Iran", or "Kill innocent people", or "Nuke poor brown people", "Tranfer public wealth to corporate shareholders for free" or "I support war for war's sake and the consequences be damned", or "terrorists hate freedom" or "Our foreign policy should be more agressive"?
What struck me was the fact that peace protesters represented the 'enemy' in the demonstration. The signs were written in English and the protesters spoke English. Combine that with the fact the soldiers were only too happy to portray these 'targets'. Are we to expect this device to be used on Americans exercising their right to peacefully protest? Is the military conditioning it's soldiers to look upon fellow Americans as the enemy?
Talkin' bout ur' ray gun baby!
War millionaires washing there hands.
I have my reflective shield. Get yours ready...LMAO!!!
hedge @ 16:
You're asking the questions we all want answers to... good job! Why peace protesters is right!
Like the Merkava, this too will become a coffin.
it means welcome to the police state.
dissent will not be tolerated.
In Dune they banned Lazguns because they could be used against the user, shouldn't our military know more than scifi writers of the 60-70 and 80's?
I had first heard of this "weapon" as a crowd control tool, last year. But the article had a warning that if aimed at someone with metal on them that the microwaves backfired. Nice weapon Baron Harkonnen Bush!
I heard about this awhile ago - they are calling it a ray gun but it really is just a controlled microwave beam - and it can be lethal if the target can't escape it - it would cook you from the inside out.
But for all you "Tin Foil" hatters out there - take the foil off your heads, flatten it out, glue it to a poster board and stand behind it - not only will it totally stop the waves from getting to you, if your foil is flat enough it will bounce the beam back to your attacker if you are close enough.
Great weapon, can be defeated by the cleaver use of shiny metal objects.
Also, there is no doubt that this weapon was developed as a crowd controller, there needs to be legislation to restrict use to foreigners in foreign countries and should never be used in USA on American people - NEVER.
Shields Up!
Remember how the Eloi were controlled in H.G. Wells' "The Time Machine"? I think I'd rather be shot.
Disperse domestic protesters and you control the message completely. GIs don't like using deadly force on fellow Americans. Good for martial law. This weapon should be easily disabled.
The cops had something that looked exactly like the picture set up during the 2004 RNC demonstrations on 8th Ave between 28th St and 23rd St. They didn't use them but there were there and pointed at the crowds.
Wouldn't a mirror deflect the offending beam away?
LOL oh man when is the Government going to wake up and realize all people want is a decent life!
60 minutes is a year late on this story. This demonstration is stupid. Note that no one is armed and they are completely exposed. One RPG from a building or a vehicle could take it out. But it is more useful for an unarmed demostration, especially one with a controlled, predetermined route.
This device has cost ummm... $20 million if I remember correctly to deveop, but last year the talk was of deployment in 2010.
I don;t know what the unit cost of the system itself is but I'd guess it's in the 100's of thousands.
And I may be wrong but that didn't look like 1/2 mile to me though its hard to tell.
The branding.. Wait for it! the Ronald Raygun..
They call this a non-lethal weapon but they have said that about many so called non-lethal weapons in the past. I can see many instances where death or serious injury could occur. One example could be if a protester had a medical condition that when hit with that beam caused a cardiac arrest. Another thought, what exactly happens if that beam doesn't just hit the skin and hits the eyes instead? My speculation is that protester who was hit by the beam in the eyes is now permanently blinded.
On another track, I can already see people countering this new weapon system down the road. Especially if they know before hand that it will be in use. A light or heat reflecting shield or type of attire might be worn to deflect the beam back to its source or reflect it onto advancing police or military units.
I'm looking forward to feeling the effects of this weapon when the Republicans come to St. Paul this summer. Today is the first day when protest groups are allowed to register to protest in the tiny parade route, hidden behind the dumpsters out back of the CostCo.
Is it truly freedom if you have to register, and can only protest in a meaningless location where nobody can see you?
Keep your hands off of our pie
Zap!
Golly gee, I wonder why our nice government is beginning to make weapons to be used against us? What are they afraid of/planning for?
Oh, the signs say it all. "Love For All"
Yes, that's a sign I've seen at many a protest. And if someone does believe in "Love For All" then by all means, let's cook them with microwaves.
When Free Speech is repealed, we'll be seeing a lot of these gizmos on our streets
The intentions for this weapon are foreign AND DOMESTIC!!!!
Why do those in power feel the need to supress all forms of dissent? Is it because they know what they're doing is sure to cause it?
And the thing is, the 60 Minutes people thought that the weapon was the greatest thing since sliced bread. Not one word of doubt about it. They just wondered why it wasn't being used already.
hedge @ 16:
I think that using peace demonstrators as adversaries is appalling. Nevertheless, I recall that they weren't so peaceful. They were throwing rocks, etc., and were an unruly crowd. Besides, I'd rather be zapped with a heat gun than rubber bullets, real bullets, or a firehose.
$13.1 million for this thing is "chump change"? Give me half that and I'll wire together a bunch of RadaRanges to zap them dirty effin' hippies.
hardrain77 @ 35:
see
opressionidential order 51 and the FEMA charter for your answer. Also the PNAC manifesto is a great reference.The article says that this is being delayed in deploying to Iraq.
Does that have anything to do with the fact that THEY ARE ATTACKING PEACE PROTESTERS AS A TEST?
Make no mistake. This has no use against a vehicle at a check point. Look for yourself and you will see that the mechanism can't move fast enough to target anything that isn't a pedestrian. THERE ARE NO LARGE AMOUNT OF PEDESTRIANS ATTACKING US IN IRAQ.
This is for use against YOUR MOTHER. YOUR DAUGHTER.
Or didn't you hear the point in the report where they say that anyone who resists this ray can be assumed to be "intending" to do them harm, (and therefore will be shot).
They even make the claim that this allows them to see into the hearts of people and know their intentions. (like Bush did with Putin?)
CoIntelPro @ 37:
Agreed. That is the intention. I was also thinking that this new weapon may pose a serious draw back which will be more than the merely obvious. With this new weapon in use a peaceful protest could very well turn into a full scale, violent riot pretty quick and it will be this weapon that caused it.
Rob @ 38:
Well, the average earnings of the du Ponts for the period 1910 to 1914 were $6,000,000 a year. It wasn't much, but the du Ponts managed to get along on it. Now let's look at their average yearly profit during the war years, 1914 to 1918. Fifty-eight million dollars a year profit we find! Nearly ten times that of normal times, and the profits of normal times were pretty good. An increase in profits of more than 950 per cent.
Now we need to invent some kind of Large Portable Mirror that can reflect this beam back at the sender.
The reason this is designed for crowd control is exactly the weakness that has been pointed out. It is easily thwarted by a determined attacker wearing a tinfoil suit. Or a metal assault vehicle. It's not an alternative combat weapon nor was it designed to be.
But logic says that if you're on guard duty in a hostile environment and a group of people are converging on the gate to your forward operating base, the microwave blast disperses the crowd. The guy that doesn't disperse because he's shielded is the one that is an actual threat. That's the guy that gets to be on the receiving end of the reality of the phrase "Deadly Force is Authorized."
Properly employed, this will save the lives of servicemembers and innocent protesters alike, reducing the probability that a problem of targets in a crowd of innocents is solved by the wide dispersal of bullets or that a suicide bomber reaches the gates because a young guard was unwilling to fire into a crowd.
I'd rather be microwaved than shot, personally.
Rusty Shackleford you can't even repair your own Zippo.
Stop frontin'
LORIS JAKES @ 24:
Fine! Then I suggest that Penguin missiles only be used on ships with American crew members/ passengers. How do you like them apples?
So what makes one think that this will not be used against our own citizens who protest a criminal government?
ConcernedCanuck @ 9:
The message is clear, the military is threatened by Peace. Peace and Love is our enemy.
Yeah, this thing has "mission creep" written all over it. That's the problem with non-lethal weapons. They're actually more prone to abuse than lethal weapons. Look at the recent wave of Tazer abuse. This thing is just a ginormous Tazer.
Yeah, I commented on this one in the other 60 Minutes thread. It was a real propaganda piece, or at least, naive. It seems the reporter (Pelley?) consistently believes whatever he's told by authority figures. Despite the way the test "crowd" was outfitted, he never once asked if it would be used on protesters in the States, or what controls would be in place to prevent that. Nor was the effect of the ray on contact lens wearers - potentially fusing the lens to the cornea - ever discussed that I recall. Meanwhile, the idea that that would "solved" Fallujah is questionable. A crowd control weapon's usefulness against IEDs, rockets, and in searching houses door to door ain't exactly clear. As for funding, the military has more than enough cash to use to develop this if they wanted to.
Its meant for us.
Nothing like a boot on your neck to make you feel safe.
DON'T TREAD ON ME
Albatross @ 33:
Ah yes, the Orwellian "Free Speech Zones."
"What rights have you lost?" they say.
PHread01 just gave up his rights as an American.
Anyone else want to disappoint the Founding Fathers?
anyone?
the man @ 49:
*lowers head in shame*
Yeah, this is totally going to be abused by those in power. But there is no way to stop technology, if it can be done, it'll be done. So done waste energy bemoaning how to stop it. Better to figure out how to use it to our advantage or figure out out to nullify it.
I mean, if it causes no damage, seems to me some protesters could cause a lot of havoc if they got their hands on one of these.
I remember hearing about a crowd-control device the government had supposedly been working on the
60s. This device could allegedly generate a low-frequency sound 'beam' at, of course, peaceful demonstrators,
the frequency supposedly being the resonant frequency of one's anal sphincter, and if it worked, it
would cause the said peaceful demonstrators to shit themselves, and thus break up the otherwise peaceful
demonstration.
I think they must've tried it on Cheney, Rummy, Condi and the preznit, because they are always shoveling out loads
of some kind of manure all the time.
I know a better way to subdue war protesters: End the war. But then, if they did this, I'd be stunned.
If we left Iraq we would have to worry about it.
Their concern is there will be a whole continent full of bankrupt, re-poed, and idle former WalMart shoppers, many of them with half of their skin tattooed and many of that bunch all revved up to "roll heavy and gun up" against the folks who screwed them.
Arm Ray Guns!
Ready!
Aim!
FIRE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Dale @ 61:
That is one way. Another is to arrest the criminal Bush regime and hold it accountable. Well, maybe not. The people then would turn into a lynch mob with pitch forks and torches.
Just cross your fingers the Bush Administration never invents a ray gun that turns people into crude oil.
Ed in Socal @ 40:
That was a pack of lies spewed by the media. The police have been initiating violence as a policy since 1968 Dem Convention. Citizen footage as caught police plants hidden among the demonstrators initiating incidents which were then blamed on demonstrators. Routinely in the USA, demonstrating organization work with police to plan logistics of demonstrations. There reward for trying to be peaceful was to have the media demonize the demonstrators or trivialize the cause for the demonstration and even to underestimate the numbers. And any violence is ALWAYS blamed on the demonstrators and is permanently linked to the reasons why there were demonstraqtions in the first place.
At the last repug convention in NYC, after people accepted being herded into 'protest zones' the police still instigated violence against citizens and arrested close to 3,000 and held some for as long as two weeks.
Don't start that "everyone has a part in this" garbage. you live in a police state. Denial and ignorance can cost you your life. The evidence is right in front of you.
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"... as long as it's used properly..."
... On antiwar protesters?
.
It's scary indeed, but when you have soldiers coming back from Iraq feeling completely disenfranchised and helpless, not even they can still buy into the bullshit. They're losing and they know it, and now they're going to have to pay the price, but they'll go out trying to stoke the fire as much as possible. Totalitarian rule isn't so easy when you can no longer control the disinformation, that's why Internet neutrality is so important.
Make your signs big enough to crouch behind and cover the backs with foil, and your good. Model them after those Spartan shields.
Joe O. @ 45:
The crowd of people writhing on the ground in pain will be assumed to be resisting a justified, "authorized", proscribed police procedure. then they can be shot.
I think they are planning to deploy the weapon on election day.
.
This was intended as a slick propaganda piece.
War is good, antiwar protesters are bad.
Ray guns don't kill... if used properly and Antiwar protesters throwing rocks are a danger to armed troops.
.
Max-1 @ 67:
on ANY group of people
Personal Ray Guns with MP-3 Player. 3 Designer Colors.
This weapon will not be available for deployment in Iraq until the Whitehouse RayGun Perimeter Fence is completed. And of course they need a few hundred for the Fortress of Cheney.
Bangkok Bob @ 47:
Or take the mirror sunglasses off the cops and use them against themselves!
The military also has an acoustic weapon, that blasts crowds with sound waves. I guess weapons trump dialog and diplomacy, eh? I mean all protesters want to do is stage violent coups, right? They're not trying to bring injustices to light to be discussed, they want anarchy to reign, right?!
The video says it best: (paraphrasing) "It's a catch-22. You can't get it fully funded until it's field-tested, and you can't field test it until it's fully funded".
Well, I can see it coming. It will be field-tested, right here at home, in crowd-control environments, i.e. on protestors. The excuse will be that the crowd seemed to be getting a little unruly, and so, you know, we just had to use it for their own good, dontcha see?
Freekin' Jeebus, this is scary. But it's the government that's getting out of hand, not the protestors. And I can see another thing coming -- sooner or later somebody will take one of those ADS trucks out by using an RPG (or something similar), and then what've you got left to defend the troops? Why, BULLETS, of course! For your own good, of course.
I've only got a few years left until retirement age. I'm seriously considering leaving this country at that time.
Metal-meshed cloths = Faraday cage = blocked EM energy = obsolete ray weapon.
It took about 3 seconds to figure out a counter to this weapon. Next!
.
We wouldn't have bombed Fallujah with phosphorus... had we had this ADS?
REALLY?
.
Are large crowd of protesters the biggest problem we have in Iraq?
In the meantime bring your microwave popcorn to your next protest as a handy snack. It will also serve as a canary.
kulshan @ 8:
5 years 2 months and a day.... does that count as an answer???
.
WHAT...?
No mention of it's "OTHER" effects when not used properly?
If used on a large crowd and people fall and get trampled, or are wounded and can not move fast enough, what happens to them...
... NOTHING?
.
I think musharraf would have loved to have a weapon like this.
Israel could cook those pesky Palestinians from across the wall.
China can make 'protester' eggrolls.
Putin would not need poison.
ETC............
60 minutes was talking about using it on insurgents, but it showed peace activists?
redratio1 @ 76:
Perfume!
redratio1 @ 76:
patent it!
I'm ordering 10 now for my family.
E_I @ 82:
peace activists = domestic insurgents
"Besides, I’d rather be zapped with a heat gun than rubber bullets, real bullets, or a firehose."
You're missing he point. The TASER was developed to replace shooting people with bullets. I'd rather be tased, bro, than shot. But notice what happened - instead of merely replacing guns when possible and thereby saving lives as it was first advertised, the TASER is now used when a gun would NOT have been used. Because it's "safe."
End result is it ESCALATED the amount of violence instead of reducing it. People are now being tased that would not even have been hit with a billy club in the past.
This thing will end up being used when rubber bullets would NOT have been used. When it would look too bad on the news to see peaceful protesters being shot with rubber bullets or hosed down, it will look nice and clean.
No fuss, no muss... it just looks like the protesters "changed their minds" and turned and left. And its safe! You couldnt even see anything! Gosh, it should be used against those nasty evil Critical Mass cyclists to "safely" make them change their minds and go home so I can get to Starbucks faster!
This was clearly a staged warning. When The Thugs cancel elections and protests erupt,You have Been Warned.
good counter with the farady cage.
I'm concerned about the Time, Dose, Fractionation equations, and Radiobiological aspects at the cellular level (how many rads, roentgens,or watts=tissuedamage or mutation)
anyway, for all you citizens really curious about the ADS and other programs, go to
https://www.jnlwp.com/public_affairs/fact_sheets.asp .
Aack, Aaack-aack!
While this version isn't portable (yet), the movie Mars Attacks! provides some examples of what this weapon is capable of.
In the 60 Minutes segment, do you recall that they repeatedly mentioned "half a mile" for every demonstration? Well, electromagnetic energy diminishes exponentially by distance from its source.
At close range, this weapon will cook you!
If the military has this weapon, it's a pretty safe bet Blackwater does too. Think about that for a minute.
You’re missing he point. The TASER was developed to replace shooting people with bullets. I’d rather be tased, bro, than shot.
I tased a man in Reno, just to watch him fry.
this was about economics...you could probably make 20 of these gizmos for the price of an Abrams M1 tank (not including the enormous amount of gas or shells that a tank requires)...where is the profit for the military industrial complex in that???
I found it peculiar that as their victims they chose anti-war placards instead of something like: pro-war placards, or pro-lifers(like the ones that murder and bomb health care workers and buildings). Just like the tazers there are cases of death or injury. But it sure would be nice to have a war where people are not killed but forcibly persuaded to go home and not fight. Have a war and nobody shows up-what a concept!!
Just what bush needs to stay in power. If anybody thinks that a general election is going to take place better think again. Cheny won't give up his power and neither will the oil companies, period.
It ain't gonna be pretty folks.
Live free or Die!!!!
Impeach cheney and bush @ 93:
Yes I thought fair and balanced was the new mantra.
Rob @ 18:
In answer to your last question...yes, apparently so.
So much for free speech. How long before they deploy this in the US? Surprised Dubya doesn't have a few with him wherever he goes...
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The United Nations has already declared tasers, weapons of torture.
10 to 1 they'll include the ADS soon too.
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Yea, Fallujah wouldn't have happened if we had had this weapon. Well couldn't we have just microwaved the whole country until the WMD's popped or Sadam left?
I think our guys wanted to see some blood. Passive denial or whatever is no good to them cause the enemy is still there the next morning.
Oh yea, if they had let the guards at abu gahrib use this, they wouldn't have had to rape them and cover them in feces.
the ASA used to fry folks in the border highlands all the time, zap crackle pop.
anyway, the employment would be a zone coverage, with the zone being covered having concertina and the like as a the demarcation line. "You get to the wire, yer fair game."
you can call dogs back from an attack too, but lots of police departments don't have a lot of dogs,even thought they are considered non lethal...
rubber bullets though do have the propensity to kill, ask the british..
but beanbags and paint balls??? nothing recorded yet..
Woohoo! War and suppression without consequence. Now we can make protesters look like the bad people because we don't have to shoot them. And wow, what fun it is to throw virtual scalding water on someone half a mile away! No way this would ever be misused!
Doesn't this just up the ante for protesters who know they have to take this installation if they are going to be heard?
Also, isn't it supposed to be spelled "reagan?"
The anti-war protesters in the story are soldiers dressing the part of the type of situation the weapon might be used in -- one in which the military DOES NOT want to hurt anyone, but can't tell geniune peaceful (but angry) protestors from potential attackers, such as occurs in demonstrations in Iraq. If you watch the 60 Minutes segment, you'll see that part of the benefit of using this non-lethal weapon is that it can be used to distinguish the two by deterring innocent protesters who would probably quickly back off when zapped once or twice. I know this sounds Orwellian, but it seems preferable to killing innocent demonstrators because our soldiers can't tell the difference. The sad part is that the military does not trust anything that does not kill, and therefore makes it unlikely that this kind of thing will continue to be developed or deployed.
Technology that makes peaceful protest impossible will make bloody revolution inevitable. But the goobers just have to play with their toys, regardless of the outcome...
And, as it has been mentioned plenty of times, it's no accident the target subjects are wearing civilian clothes and purporting to be 'demonstrators'. Hardly a coincidence...
Weapons portrayed as denying Americans their freedom to discent or protest does not quite sit well with me.
That was a poor choice of its use. Would they have used it on the protest not long ago of the illegal immigrants that marched the streets of America?
Just to keep legal Americans from seeing the streets covered with illegals that our Gov't neglects to address.
It will be a great new weapon in the GOP arsonal in voter suppression on election day. They can have these in every densely populated Democratic voting place.
what we really need is another weapon...
the current stockpile of lazers and phazers and tazers and otherzers ain't quite got that magical musical quality of a good ray-gun.... hey ray-gun.... wasnt that the president all of the republicans bow down to?
ronald ray-gun.... no wonder they bow down... it could only have been better if his name was george nuke'm
riddle me this.... what was different about ronald ray-gun from other presidents ?
answer............ he was the only one capable of hiding his own easter eggs
They've CLEARLY shown who they intend to use this weapon against. I have no reason to believe that the full capability of this weapon was shown in this demonstration, and I take it for granted that this weapon can, in fact, kill. And I suspect that we will see this weapon deployed on the streets of America within the next twelve months.
The thing that struck me as I watched the piece was how well this fits with the "not-torture-enhanced-interrogation-technique." It seems to have all of the hallmarks that the Bush DOJ would use to justify using it on so-called enemy combatants. No organ failure, no "lasting effects" (physically, at least), etc. Is this another one of the enhanced techniques that the president refuses to divulge?
The ACLU website has a video about dissent in America. In that video they show police using large wooden bullets against a group of protesters. The bullet casings were left on the street and they clearly said, "do not fire at people" or something like that. This weapon is clearly intended to be used on American Citizens. Bush has expanded executive powers and can declare anyone an enemy combatant. They could easily use this weapon to protect the regime from the people.
I also heard that this gun will burn people if they have metal on them, like keys and change. It arcs just like foil in your microwave oven. It could also kill someone with a pacemaker.
In our last elections Bush made a comment about what a good thing it was that we were taking time to hold an election during a time of war. How hard would it be to escalate the war on terror (or Iran) enough for the executive to call off or postpone elections?
I realize I am all over the place on this comment, and it may seem like I am paranoid, but the signs of fascism are everywhere these days.
[Deleted. Off topic-Sitemonitor]
Nice torture device too!
The only way to save lives in Iraq is to remove all the people America sent over there to kill Iraqi's.
Support our Troops = Support murder & genocide.
When did American's feel O.K. with invading and occupying another country to steal it's resources?
Oh yeah, with the "Indians"...
redratio1 @ 76:
A .308 round into the microwave signal emitter (the small box at the end of the arm opposite the reflector) would be an immediate and permanent solution, right?
Zapping peace protesters and killing puppies, the American way! Makes you proud, right?
Microwave exposure is dangerous.... Deadly if exposed long enough but even a little bit could/can be harmful... Just because it doesn't kill you outright today doesn't necessarily track that you will be OK in say 10 or 15 years after exposure to this 'crowd control' measure... And make no mistake, this tool has no relevance in a hot war where the other guy isn't interested in disarming you as he/she is in fulfilling Pattons suggestion to make the other sonofabitch die for his/her country... Ya gotta remember what it is that microwaves do.. Cooks from the inside out... Ya gotta remember what the point of war is... and what the point of domestic crowd control is all about... Especially in a political context.
Funny that the meme wants everyone to believe it will eliminate our enemies in war without killing them...Like anyone in a justifiable hot war gives a shit about that... (more like some kind of phony kinder gentler war mongering?) Which it won't do, but will damn well quell peaceful protest by
subjecting the targets to ill considered microwave exposure... And you can be sure there are no studies to indicate what happens to a body exposed in this way over time... And you can take it to the bank that anyone exposed to this device today, who turns up mysteriously ill in five years even if its traced back to microwave exposure will get nada from this government by way of compensation.. Uncle Scam will disavow any connection to it at that point.
Cloned food? Raygun crowd control, trampling the Constitution and Bill of Rights? Just all part of the brave new world.... The real questions are; 'Are we going to put up with it?' And; 'What the hell can be done about it short of violence, that won't outright finish the nation as a viable country? .... I'm not at all certain we can look to either party for solutions to these problems... Not even sure Obama can 'visions of hope' us past these issues.....JD
Kill 'em slowly......... with cancer
weldon @ 2:
I think that was white phosphorus used in Fallujah, (graphic pictures on google images:"white phosphorus", exactly like you describe)
I don't know why they would use it in Iraq, its mainly for war protesters / cameras at home.
weldon Says: THAT REPORT WAS PURE BS.
THE MILITARY HAS BEEN USING THIS WEAPON ON IRAQIS FOR AT LEAST 2 YEARS.
Link Please. Otherwise STFU. Large type too. So scary.
Me thinks ye doth protest to much.
Hey gary do you think the pentagon introduces new weapons on 60 minutes before they use them in the battlefield?
I'm sure there is a link somewhere. I heard about the weapon and saw pictures about three years ago.
CoIntelPro @ 84:
Build either a flat 4X6 or three-sided (to protect you from the front AND sides) wood frame. Go to Lowe's or Home Depot and get some VERY fine mesh metal (not fiberglass) insect screening to attach to the frame. Or...if you want to get nasty, use a 4X6 sheet of aluminum sheet, attach carrying handles, cut an eye slit for viewing and put the screen over the slit. You can then use the aluminum sheeting to reflect the microwave signal back to the senders or "peacekeepers" surrounding the vehicle. You will be totally shielded by the sheeting.
The reason you have the metal mesh in your microwave oven is to keep the radio waves INSIDE the oven so your eyes won't boil when you look in to see if the pizza is done.
Like to bet that it causes cancer along with other nasty side effects?
I know they said it was harmless but do you believe government liars?
Would you bet your life on what the government says now?
Here's the counter-measure, if you don't want to go to the trouble of destroying the antenna with a single bullet from a safe stand-off distance: Grounded, conductive outer garments, with hood , booties, gloves and conductive face shields:
Hood;/ face shield: http://www.magidglove.com/product.asp?pf_id=166&dept_id=234
You can make a rainsuit of of metal -coated mylar survival blankets, to include glove covers and booties:
http://www.amazon.com/EMERGENCY-SURVIVAL-BLANKET/dp/B000FNQ7A4
Connect it all together with copper strap or wire and make sure it has a good path to ground, and you're good to go.
This will make an excellent torture device, too. less bruises.
What ever happened to all those soldiers that had the duty of watching the A-Bombs explode back in the 40s and 50s? All the Generals were saying it was perfectly safe, to be out of range and to watch the white light explosion. "Not to worry, trust us." Yeah right! They created a Frankenstein then and they are creating one now. If the U.S. can figure out how to make a ray gun, don't you suppose other nations can too? F*cking fools! Aren't we ever going to learn from our mistakes?
I bet these people enjoy putting poodles into microwaves.
A problem with all non-lethal weapons is the tendency for over use, absolute power and all..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMaMYL_shxc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqdUhotL6Fw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7H5tNX4_4Z0
another video "agent provocateurs caught", just shows the length that cops will go to to use these weapons.
http://www.nowpublic.com/spp-agent-provocateur-cops-caught-red-handed-at...
I saw another video that is more related, but I can find it. Undercover cops walked around a calm protest spraying people in the face and then walked away. I think it was at a code pink anti-Iraq War protest.
LRon @ 9:
More like a threat to freedom itself. Amazing how America just goes about
it's little lives while our government keeps finding and creating more ways
to take our freedoms away. How much longer to we see this shit rolling
down Main Street America?
Also, they are fucking full of shit when they say they don't have this in
Iraq right now. There are reports from 2003 that says Iraqis claim to have
seen Humvees with this very weapon on them being used against vehicles
and people...to a fatal extent.
Our tax dollars at work...nice hah?
curtilingus and Jack Damage,
The fact that someone makes a blanket statement that "THIS THING HAS BEEN USED FOR 2 YEARS","I heard about the weapon" isn't exactly proof that makes it so. Show the link. It's not up to me to do your research. If you can't then don't make the blanket statement
The point of the segment was to show that the Pentagon has spent a paltry amount of money on a "weapon" that would "possibly" deter a conflict without killing a civilian in the process.
All these Smart bombs, triangulation of targets etc etc. all for the benefit of cutting down on Collateral Damage. Good for us.
Now this weapon is introduced that could be a deterrent w/o killing innocent people and all I see are posts cutting the thing down before it's had a chance to prove itself useful. All the posts, or at least the vast majority, stating exactly what the Pentagon said in the report. The thing doesn't kill therefore it won't work in war.
Weak argument and wreaks of war mongering. Sad!
On a happy note!
Obama 08
What would be an effective counter measure? I layer of skin like material? Metal mesh?
navyswan @ 113:
Puppy killing. Big brave marine. I hope they put his ass in jail.
Maj. Chris Perrine, a Marine spokesman, said a Lance Cpl. David Motari is with the 1st Battalion, 3rd Marine Regiment at Kane'ohe Bay.
I thought the Pentagon already had their own Ray Gun
His name was Ronald.
GarysDiscardedCaps @ 127:
This is part of a much larger program, involving numerous non-lethal weapons. It is important enough to the Pentagram that the Non-Lethal Weapons Task Force, which is it's own organization and command; it involves all the services, including the Coast Gaurd, and it reports directly to the Joint Chiefs of Staff. Law enforcement and Homeland Security are interested and involved parties. This particular weapon system has been ready to go for the last 5 years, and is ready to deploy to National Guard, the Northern Command and police forces across the country, to name a few. It, along with numerous other non-lethal weapons systems, is mostly only of best utility against unarmed crowds. It is ulikely that any of these will see much of any deployment against OPFOR's in combat situations, they are too easy to neutralize. It is something we are far more likely, probably inevitably, going to be seeing deployed against American citizens, as the rights of free association, free speech and petition are progressively crushed.
namned @ 110:
I'm sure Dallas area prostitutes will have it soon for their customers who'll pay for that sort thing.
Hmmmm... If it is a microwave emitter, then a sheet of perforated metal, like the one in the window of your microwave oven, or (I think) a sheet of woven metal "hardware cloth" would stop it, and you could see the people firing at you.
Ed in Socal @ 41:
I'd rather be zapped with a heat gun than rubber bullets, real bullets, or a firehose.
Are you nuts? You'd rather be cooked with microwaves then have actual solid objects hit you? That's disgusting and inhumane, even moreso than using ammunition. You're response, I can only imagine, is what the government anticipates the larger (or louder) part of our country to have. God save us.
(_(_) @ 129:
My issue isn't necessarily with the puppy, although that act alone is sick. But, more importantly, if someone is able to so easily dispose of the life of puppy in such a callous way, what or who else are they killing 'just for fun?'
“Tick, Tick
Fellow citizens, the truth is that our present can only be as stable as our future.
For too long we have hobbled from decade to decade, generation to generation, and millennium to millennium, myopically adhering to superfluous battles that can never be won. Never once as a species forwarding or embracing an all encompassing path towards a certainly better future.
Our excuses have been many, our reasoning mostly incoherent, and our lack of vision as a species, certainly fatal.
For in the meantime, as each tick of the ages has passed, the critical threats posed and ignored by our species discordance have increased exponentially.
Pandemic famine and disease, massively destructive weapons, fatal atmospheric and climate change, super volcanic eruptions, catastrophic space body impacts, Orwellian societies of unparalleled oppression, and many other global catastrophes too numerous to list here, waiting to befall us at any moment.
In fact, one of the most immediate and ominous threats facing America and much of the world today is the utilization of advanced technologies for the implementation of authoritarian control over societies.
My friends, the truth is that if we do not fight for and secure freedom today, the time will very soon come when it will be almost impossible to do so.
In retrospect, when one soberly considers the critical challenges that we must face together to survive as a species, our differences, at times, can become almost imperceptible.“
-anonymous”
'USA Suicide Hotline..Please Hold'
There are fully weaponized lethal versions of this system IN USE in Iraq today.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7351283246882337350&q=star+wars...
Nikola Tesla worked on this type of stuff. I hope we are wary of Martial Law in this country. When the military is turned against our own people. Peace protesters no less. My god. What is occurring.
If the pentagon is allowing news of this weapon to hit the corporate media, you can bet that they have several other ray-type weapons, much more insidious in nature, ready to roll.
Make no mistake about it, this weapon is designed to be used on American citizens, and there is a segment of the population that will applaud its use to control those un-American protesters in a "non-lethal" fashion. What they fail to realize is this ray could certainly be used to corral its targets and load them onto trains bound for the newly completed FEMA camps, where more "persuasive methods" could be used to deal with them away from the glare of publicity.
Instead of commenting on this blog, we all need to be writing a few letters, first to 60 Minutes, challenging their complicit reporting of this weapon, and secondly to our "representatives" in government, demanding that legislation be passed banning the use of these weapons on American soil.
Yes there may be some "leaps and assumptions" in this post, but as the adage goes, "Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean there aren't people out to get you".
Orangutan. @ 139:
Yes, Tesla was working "outside the box" his entire life, pioneering technologies like radar, remote control, energised beams and free energy as far back as the turn of the century.
And when he died in the 40's, the CIA stormed into his home and seized his papers, never to be seen again.
141 zonk
I always thought it an interesting coincidence that when the makers of Return of the Vampire (1944), couldn't get permission to use the name Dracula, they renamed the Lugosi character Tesla, and made him a Romanian scientist. But the character's first name was Armand.
Funny thing was as a Hungarian born near the Transylvanian border, Lugosi grew up hating Romanians.
ysbaddaden @ 142:
I didn't know that. What a great bit of trivia.
I LOVE the internet....just hope we can keep it.
GarysDiscardedCaps@127;
I don't really know what you're talking about as regards my post. I stated, microwaves can harm, microwaves can kill... All too true. I also stated this device would be useless in a war scenario, you concurred more or less thru your post. I also stated it would more likely to be implemented in a civilian crowd control type setting. You didn't address that exactly, but others have and concur with my basic statement. So what's your angle Gary? Are you actually defending this thing? You actually think it's better to cook someone from the inside out instead of useing any number of other non-lethal options?
IF it happens to be that your whole pro use position (if that's what it is) hinges on the fact that it's cheap to make, that ain't gonna cut it and still allow this nation to maintain that we are humane and compassionate.. Let alone a free democratic society... What if someone could make an atom bomb for 50 cents a pop.. Would you claim that's the weapon of choice to use in a war???... cost containment is your argument? IS that it?? Look, just because you might save a buck on the front end of something, say a weapons system doesn't mean you can't pay thru the nose on the backend mister.... The A bomb finished WWII... but the people exposed to the blast and lived payed for the rest of their lives... Just one example of how the backend can bite you, me and everyone in the ass....
The one controversial thing I did mention, (If it can be justifiably considered controversial, and I'm not sure it can), is that noone has published any studies confirming that this device won't cause health problems later, debilitating and probably fatal health problems later.. And that in that likely scenario, nooones going to step up and take responsibility even if the health problem is traced back to this 'weapon'... Certainly not the government foisting this onto society thru law enforcement and the military.. Now IF YOU got a study, a 'third party' non governmental study that can refute what I just posited, than cough up holmes.. Where's your link that would justify the claim that it is in fact 'non-lethal'.... Otherwise, like I said, I don't know exactly why you include me into what seems like a backhanded pro use post about other posters making broad statements about this things already being used in Iraq... But as far as that goes, can YOU prove it hasn't been????
Whatever, my basic premise is that it's pointless as a war weapon and dangerous as a civilian crowd control measure... You want to debate those points, I'm up for it..... JD
weldon @ 2:
There is a video on youtube about this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0X5KcZeZ6Q (part 2)
part 1 here - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-a255YReLY
part 3 here - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwWzxaLeKs8
Ah yes, I know of this weapon. Klingons call it an "agonizer." There are portable beam units used to drive howling crowds protesters into kill zones, and of course there is also the agonizer chamber for torturing prisoners (I'm certain your intelligence agencies have procured some of these). The self-inflicted hand unit is more akin to your "taser" in that its punishment is delivered with an electrical shock to discipline a disobedient soldier.
America now can clarify its philosophy of democracy with discipline.
President PNACcio @ 138:
Thanks for the links.
BobFlash @ 116:
Weldon you were right, it doesn't sound like white phosphorus.
zonk @ 143:
Bela was born Bela Ferenc Dezco Blasco in the Hungarian part of the Austrian Hungarian empire. He fought on their side of World War I in the Carpathian ski patrol. He got shot up real bad, and ended the war in a hospital where he got hooked on pain killers because of some inoperable bullets in him. I've read that there was one, possibly three.
He chose the name Lugosi as his professional name, because the name of the town he was born in is Lugoj. Unfortunately for Bela, the Romanian officer Mihail Horhy annexed his birthtown, and placed everyone who supported the previous regimes of Count Michael Karolyi and Bela Kuhn (sp?) on a death list. Any one on the list could be shot on sight This list included Bela Lugosi and Mihael Kortesh who had to escape to Germany and then America.
Lugosi jumped a freighter, and worked his way across, but nearly got thrown off the boat when other sailors realized he was a politically active socialist. The captain of the boat saved him. Later he was a fiercely patriotic American, and FDR supporter, who sent his son to an American military school. When a reporter questioned Bela's patriotism after he died, Peter Lorre went into tirade yelling F you and F thi , and F your questions etc. Lorre also came from Hungary, but I don't know if he was a refugee or not.
Bela of course became famous as Dracula, but had to turn down the part of the Frankenstein monster because the bullets in his leg wouldn't allow him to wear a 40 pound costume, and he helped found the SAG. Mihael Kortesh became the director Michael Curtis who directed Erroll Flynn's Robin Hood, and Casablanca. Interestingly, enough both features seemed to deal with an oppressed people.
And to get beck to Nikolai Tesla, he too was born in the Austrian empire.
2 weldon
Wasn't that the plot of the movie Diamonds Are Forever?
The book was better.
I don't know where it appears in the google video, but the weapon (Active Denial System) pictured at the top of the post (and how it works) is described at about 2:30 of part 3 of the youtube video I linked to (comment # 145)
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