Suddenly Saxby wins and the Village rejoices
By John Amato Thursday Dec 04, 2008 11:50amPlease raise your hands. How many people thought Saxby Chambliss would win the runoff election?
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[crickets chirp noisily]
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That's what I thought. It was almost a miracle that Jim Martin even had a shot at the Georgia seat.
And before the election, everyone was saying Democrats would be lucky to win seven Senate seats. I did a quick Google search and came up with this. The right wing Human Events wrote this in June:
Dean told a Monitor breakfast on Wednesday, June 11, that he expected “we’ll pick up from 5-to-7 seats” in the Senate. At a Monitor lunch the next day, Nevada Sen. Ensign told reporters that for his party to lose no more than three seats this fall “would be a terrific night for us. I don’t want to slip below the four-seat loss.”
Political analysts widely predict major gains for the Democrats in the Senate and House of Representatives today.
But few think the Democrats will win the nine extra Senate positions they need to have a filibuster-proof "supermajority" in that branch of Congress.
I would have loved to get to the magic number of 60, but if Franken prevails that will give the the Democratic Party 59.
And this:
In election forecast model developed by a political scientist 99 days before the 2008 elections and before the recent Wall Street crisis predicts significant Democratic gains in the 2008 congressional elections--including 11 seats in the U.S. House of Representatives and 3 seats in the U.S. Senate...read on
So where does David Gergen get off on spreading this nonsense (via Todd Beeton)?
On AC360 earlier David Gergen declared:
I think this actually puts a lot more pressure on Barack Obama to govern much more from the center and not from the left. He is going to need Republicans now, he is going to need a bipartisan approach...
Right! A 41-vote Senate minority should by all means have Barack Obama shaking in his boots. I wonder if Gergen said something similar about Republicans on Nov. 4th, perhaps something like...
I think the fact that Barack Obama won 53% of the vote tonight and that Democrats will have won at least 7 more seats in the Senate and 20 more seats in the House puts a lot more pressure on Republicans to govern much more from the center and not from the right.
Oh, he didn't? Ya don't say...
Gergen's refusal to put the burden on the Republicans to be cooperative and "centrist" rather than the Democrats is really a symptom of the persistent Beltway "center-right nation" conventional wisdom, which always puts the burden on Democrats to be the centrist ones since the Republican Party, so goes the logic, is where the people already are. Was there any greater evidence that the Democratic Party is where the people are than the results on November 4th?
You can never trust the Beltway weenies. Sure, they can come with some good stuff occasionally and add some honest analysis, but when push comes to shove they will almost always side with Conservatives. It's up to all of us to correct the record, even if Obama persists with his bipartisan narrative.
This is why people like me are chafing at all the bipartisan chatter, which does nothing to change that perception. Indeed, it feeds into it.
And until that default rightist mentality is changed, nothing changes over the long term. Sure, the country will hire Democrats to come in and clean up conservative messes from time to time, but they won't ever realize that the party that is identified as the center-left is actually the majority unless someone claims it. The result will be that when the smoke has cleared the country will reflexively want to go back to "normal" by electing Republicans, the true representatives of our naturally center-right country.








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Harry Reid's first item of business when the next Senate is sworn in is to pull in the Republican leadership into his office and tell them in clear terms that if they even talk about attempting to block even ONE of Obama's judicial nominees, he will bring out the nuclear option. We cannot allow these Republican thugs to stop progress. Chambliss is even already on record as stating he will filibuster Obama's nominees and that is simply unacceptable.
After watching that bizarre Thanksgiving video that he made wherein he rubes that little girl's chest, I have become a firm believer in the power of prayer. }:-} LOL! Good fucking grief, Republicanism is at least amusing at times.
To quote Tifa from FFVII: That man are sick.
That's what they're saying. It's a "model" of how to win elections by sticking with those good ol' conservative values. This cracks me up -- so by using "conservative values", and running an election in one of the reddest red states out there, you can win? And somehow this is surprising to someone? Anyone? Oy.
The main model for a republican win is to run in a state where daughters and sisters need to be able to out run the men in the family
They are to stupid to see the country changing and the narrow minded seem to never give up...but then WE never give up eather. It's SO over for thoes 'dyed in the wool' repubs.
is that very few people are taking the words of those like Gergen & the Villagers at face value anymore. Everyone knows that the fourth estate has been co-opted and we've decided to do some redevelopment on our own.
They are ignoring the trickle up socialism of bailouts.
Add that to your argument.
Chamblis "won" the November 4th election by 3 points; the Libertarian candidate had 3.4% of that same vote. He just didn't get over 50% of the entire vote.
So if everyone in Georgia who voted on November 4th also voted yesterday, except this time he Libertarian wasn't in the running, that would mean that Martin would have had to get all of that Libertarian's original vote. Not likely.
And the other stupid thing about Chambliss is that he credits Sarah Palin for giving him the boost to win the election yesterday. I am so sick of that woman and of people giving her credit. She brought out the base; I am quite sure she didn't sway many if any independents or Democrats.
Idiots; all of the Republigicans.
Isn't Georgia one of those original United and Confederate states?
Isn't its most memorable moment in American history the episode when Lincoln sent in the mean little General to burn the entire place to the ground? Isn't it the state whose best known white contributor to the body politic was Jimmy Carter and whose best known black contributor would have been denied entrance to the restaurant owned by a future Governor at the point of an axe handle? This is a place from which we should take guidance. Saxby, axme, and a tail of Newt to you Mr. Gergen.
What wimpy Harry Reed needs t do is actually make the repube stand up and speak. do not take the threat of a filibuster as a simple procedural matter. make the senators that want to block and blame stand before the country and go on record as opposing/blocking progress. no need for drama harry, no bringing in the roll away beds and all that just to have them removed and look like the tool you are. make the repube work for it a bit and once they are seen for the road block they have been, the press and american people will know. to quote the senator from arizona, "make them famous, you will know their names."
seems simple enough and take a minimum amount of balls harry.
[Deleted. Off topic, sorry, but...and yes he can. Wait for a thread on the topic or gather round on the open thread-Sitemonitor]
Yeah, a white conservative Repubican wins a run-off in Georgia (when he also had gotten the most votes in the general), and suddenly the tide has changed? Or, better yet, he's now claiming to be one of the "new voices" of the Republican Senate? Just shows how stupid, delusional and desperate that party has become. And Chambliss sure went out of his way to downplay whatever contributions McCain, Giuliani, etc made, while praising Palin to the heavens. This guy must think he's on to something. Till Mitch McConnell bitch slaps him, that is.
The key to Obama's success in the Senate may well depend on his ability to communicate with the public.
He's shown that in certain circumstances he can be extremely effective at this. He can practically guarantee network prime time coverage a couple of times a year. He's the one who can put the pressure on Senators. He needs to make sure that from Day One he's not walling himself up inside the Oval Office a la George Bush.
seems to be scurrying as fast as possible toward the Right, innit?
When Fred Barnes approves of a (even an ostensibly) Democratic Pres.Elect's choices for vital economic and international positions, it's time to worry, friends...
Barnes has NO sense of humor. He's not kidding. He LIKES Obama's choices. And he's not changing HIS stripes; he figures on the evidence (which is damn hard to ignore) that Mr.O ran a gae on the 'left,' and has already left 'em/us a'weeping and a'pining...
Some conservatives may actually like Obama and the way he's doing things after what they have witnessed these past eight years and others like Barnes may just want to jump on the Obama bandwagon because they see the wheels have just about fallen off their own party's bandwagon.
So, is there a point? I don't know of many people who thought Obama was going to govern from a far left position. Only those people, perhaps yourself, who bought into the crap that Obama was "the most liberal Senator" in the Senate. And in case you're not following the news, the Bush Conservatives are handing Obama and Company a hell of a set of problems. So, most of us, I suspect, will be sitting back and waiting before letting an idiot like Fred Barnes be of any importance to us. Say, isn't he on Fox News? Enough said....
nah the folks would eat a mile of bullshit as long as it was done with style!
This is a prime example of the conservative media misrepresenting the realities of the day. America is center-left, not center-right. Only once the country is free from the grip of the fearmongering industrial death-complex can we truly be represented as we really are.
60 is a magic number, but 58 or 59 means that you only have to convince 1 or 2 Republicans to vote with the Democrats.
It might not be that hard for Democrats to convince a couple of Republicans to cross party lines on the big issues like healthcare. Those up for re-election in 2010 may not want to be viewed as blocking the Democrats on these big issues. There are 18 Republican senators up for re-election in 2010, including ones from FL, MO, NH, NC, OH, and PA, states that voted for Obama.
Also, the Democrats may have to give up much less to get legislation past, if they only need to convince a few Repulicans. It will be pretty hard for Republicans to block a lot of important legislation.
got to admit someones getting a nice xmass preasant!
Was because those a-hole voters in Georgia haven't seen more of their own friends and family members looking like Cleland after fighting in Iraq. When Obama ends the war, they'll realize just how dumb they were all this time.
Just bring Olympia Snow or Maine's other senator into the fold, and while they'll keep the "R" by their name, they'll do the right thing.
And I agree to the idea of having Reid threaten the nuclear option (we should co-opt the GOP's old term for it: "the Constitutional Option"). Anyone who knows history knows the filibuster isn't constitutional, and while it began a limited existence in 1841, didn't become a formal part of senate rules until 1917.
The best case for ending Rule 22 in the Senate is this: Historically, every major cause the filibuster has been used to stymie has been a progressive effort needed to advance the country and our society such as Fair Employment Practices and Civil Rights.
You mean "How many people thought Saxby Chambliss would LOSE the runoff election," yes?
In the L.A. Times, Neal Gabler has an article that analyzes exactly what "conservative" Republicans have been doing, tracing their strategy back to Senator McCarthy, not to Senator Goldwater, who in 1964 lost in one of the biggest landslides in American electoral history and wrested the party from its Eastern establishment wing.
What Gabler believes is that, because of this tradition, the Republican Party will continue to move rightward. Fear and blame; rabble-rousing; the Rush Limbaughs and Sean Hannitys and Bill O'Reillys; and now Palin. This is the direction the Party will take. Probably because it cannot be believed as the party of small government or fiscal responsibility or moral integrity; all credibility lost in the harsh reality of events; at least not until people forget and these actualities become memories and fade. It is a dangerous approach because it incites people to do violent things, especially as times become more stringent.
According to Gabler, the myth made it possible for Nixon to hide behind and co-opte conservatism, talking like a conservative while governing like a moderate, disenchanting true believers. Ronald Reagan, next, embraced it wholeheartedly, becoming the patron saint of conservatism and making it the dominant ideology in the country, even though he didn't practice it in terms of fiscal responsibility or size of government. George W. Bush picked up Reagan's fallen standard and "conservatized" government even more thoroughly than Reagan had, cheering conservatives until his presidency came crashing down around him. That's how Gabler believes the mythology tells it.
Gabler's thesis is that the real connection is from Sen. Joe McCarthy, to Nixon to Bush and possibly now to Sarah Palin. McCarthy attacked alleged communists and the Democrats whom he accused of shielding them, as well as the centrist American establishment, Eastern intellectuals and the power class, many of whom were Republicans, including moderate ones. McCarthyism became a means to play on the anxieties of Americans, convincing them of danger and conspiracy even when they didn't exist, which he used to build power and support. George H.W. Bush used it to get himself elected, terrifying voters with Willie Horton (and denigrating Dukakis as a commander-in-chief). His son used fear of 9/11 and convincing voters that John Kerry was a coward and a liar and would hand the nation over to terrorists, tried and true McCarthy tactics used very aggressively, and W. then used fear and stealth in pushing through totalitarian unconstitutional measures. The thread continued through McCain and then Palin, probably through Rove (who also coached W.), and I quote from Gabler, "That's why John McCain kept describing Barack Obama as some sort of alien and why Palin, taking a page right out of the McCarthy playbook, kept pushing Obama's relationship with onetime radical William Ayers."
It is, I believe a shame, because some of the original precepts of fiscal responsibility and keeping government out of peoples' lives and moral integrity are well worth preserving. The Republican Party which stood for those princples was a Grand Old Party. But, I hate to say it, those are all too easily trumped by fear-mongering and, I might add, difficult to achieve. I would nominate the Republican Party today as the Party of Fear, as opposed to the Party of Solutions. And, if that's the direction it's going in, yes, it's a shame.
The consistent thing about guys like Jeb Bush, in line with the old Republican philosophy, is to be against something, not for it; to be in a position to scare people, not to advocate good positive things. Putting people and ideas down is the tack they have taken; witness McCain's whole campaign; witness Sarah's natural proclivities. So Jeb Bush starts off by surfacing and proposing that the Republicans start a "shadow government" to watch, and criticize, and follow what Obama's Administration does closely.
What bothers me about this, deeply, I might add, is the fact that it is not being supportive in any way. No one is saying, if we want to survive, we have to work together, guys. No, the implication is that "they" (Democrats) are the enemy. And in this terrible time, when the country is literally falling apart, and everybody is unsettled, these isolated Republicans are settling in to be critical. As if they aren't losing their savings, too; as if they are exempt; as if, should the country really fail, they wouldn't be affected. Quite a blind spot. isn't it. They aren't even pretending to help, to support, to work with their counterparts to make things better for everybody, themselves included. How antedeluvian, how "old school", how traditional, how like McCarthy and all of the Republican demogogues, to stand back and continue criticizing the Democrats who are working very hard, very earnestly, to fix what went wrong with this country.
So Jeb Bush is nothing more than another toxic Republican, joining in the long line of negative right-wing naysayers and destroyers, no better than Limbaugh and Hannity and O'Reilly. Pretty disgusting, I'd say. Stand on the sidelines and criticize while the Titanic goes down; criticize everything the crew and captain does. Disgusting, guys, absolutely disgusting. For more, see: www.ocpatriot-runningcomments.blogspot.com.
Neocons will be glad to tell you what they are against, but not what they are for. They are egotistic obstructionists who fear being marginalized and having the same sordid tactics they used against others in the past used against them.
They abandoned the genuine "conservative" credo long ago and substituted authoritarian fearmongering as a method of control, as OC Patriot rightly says. And these Neocon chumps are so hidebound and arrogant that they refuse to recognize that something desperately needs to change, instead preferring to rebrand their turd of a party into a different colored turd. Instead of lifting our country up with redemptive and workable ideas, they tear things down with their criticism and blame and try to salvage their sorry ass by parroting their manipulative propaganda such as "center right" like a broken record.
The voters sent these dolts a message a month ago that their ideas and philosophy were bankrupt and ultimately not in the long term interest of America. Their answer was basically to pretend the election never existed and use their MSM dupes and syncophants to promote a palatable image of Palin as their "new" image while conveniently ignoring and softpedaling her considerable weaknesses. New my ass---this latest imbecile is WORSE--if you can imagine it. It's like saying that you can cure pneumonia with tuberculosis.
Neocons need to get over their denial and do an extreme makeover of their party. I'd bet a lot of money that won't happen any day soon, which will be a big lift for the Democrats. Let the arrogant Neocon asses take themselves down with their incompetence and foolishness. Good riddance to bad rubbish.
I simply do not understand how the American media (whatever part of it has any credibility, especially post-2000) can even give the slightest credence to pathetically and patently overhyped gasbags such as Bill Kristol, George Will, Tom Friedman, or (in a slightly lesser league of gasbaggery) David Gergen.
I still recall, years ago, watching Friedman for the first time on Charlie Rose or some such program, and being told up-front that this was a "Pulitzer Winner" journalist. I still remember being so clearly underwhelmed by the puny intellectual impact this star journalist had upon me from the get-go.
Over the years, I have only come to realize that American media and American discourse are both populated by mediocre minds, and bloviating gasbags. Money plays the game, and the citizenry are fed a diet of pure garbage. Rupert Murdoch and allies deliberately propagate and ensure this- and, sadly, such extreme intellectual lightweights often get much mileage even at well-regarded academic institutions such as Yale and Harvard.
Any place in the world where brainless hatemongers capable of nothing but vicious lies and propaganda, such as Limbaugh, Coulter and O'Reilly, can have such huge audiences, and muster such attention in the nation's affairs- well, it only confirms that the American body-politic's opium-administration program has been enormously successful.
A nation so opiated, perhaps rightly deserves the intended responses from mindless hate-propaganda such as Willy Horton, "Harold, wink, wink, call me," "Max Cleland, the terrorist enabler," and the like. This is as far from enlightenment as one can imagine.
Little wonder, then, that the world is in such a sorry state, even after centuries of scientific progress, brought on by the tireless efforts of bright and wise men and women in human history.
Amen to that! Those words are burned in the heart of the entire blogosphere of citizen journalists. May the internet be their (the village people's) downfall!
Like many bloggers have said, the fact that there was a runoff in a solidly Republican state like Georgia was unbelieveable in itself. It's deeply insulting to anyone with intelligence that somehow Chambliss's victory is the real mandate, not Mr. Obama's. Now that the GOP has 41 Senate seats (with one undecided), they are in charge, and the Dems should be more like them.
Dems won 7 seats in the Senate, 25 in the House, and the White House. The GOP wins a seat that they were expected to win, even though it was tough for them. So, of course, this is great news for the Republicans.
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