The Rachel Maddow Show: Steve Benen On Which Candidate Is Winning On The Economy
By Nicole Belle Monday Sep 22, 2008 9:15pm 
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Ah...we knew him before he became a Villager. Our buddy and former C&L contributor Steve Benen handicaps how the candidates and their respective economic messages are playing with the American people. Needless to say, Benen rightly points out that McCain's flailing has hurt him in the presidential race.
I heard George Will, who is not exactly a reflexive liberal, talk yesterday how this is something of a presidential test. And there's one candidate who's come across as steady, unflappable, calm, the kind of person you would want in a crisis and it's not John McCain, it's Barack Obama. I thnk to a certain extent we saw that with John McCain's constant changing of messages. It didn't necessarily convey a sense of confidence, or for that matter, a sense of competence.
Beyond being happy to see one of my colleagues on television, I think that Steve makes a point -- though I do wish he wasn't quite so charitable towards McCain -- with which I hope we can see the Obama campaign expound upon and moreover, really hammer home in the upcoming debates: this past week and McCain's response to the economic crisis has shown him to not only have a plan to lead the country out of its economic woes...it shows he doesn't even understand them in the first place. That's not "ready from Day 1", that's not ready at all.
And that's a meme that will resonate with voters.
Transcripts below the fold
MADDOW: Senator McCain has been struggling to find a coherent message in response to this overakk economic crisis. It made for a very bad week for him on the campaign trail. Last week, over the weekend and over the course of the day today on the campaign trail, did it seem to you like he was finding his footing? He was finding his voice?
BENEN: No, not yet. I think he's still trying. To use the Halloween metaphor that you were using earlier, I get the sense that the mask has come off and we've seen a candidate who really doesn't have much of an economic message at all. You know, looking back to Monday, we saw him talking...first thing...first message, right off the bat, was that "the fundamentals of the economy are strong." That was a disaster. The next day, we heard a little bit about a commission, which I also think was a disaster, because it made him seem as if John McCain didn't quite know what was going on and was hoping to have a committee tell him. From there, we heard him...he was against the AIG bailout, then he was for it. He's just been flailing around all over the place with an economic message and it's become something of a disaster for him and we're starting to see some of that reflected in the polls.
MADDOW: On the other side of it, Sen. Obama has certainly had an uptick in the polls of the course of this crisis. When you hear him on the stump talking about this, is he offering the kind of specific remedies that people can understand and relate to or is he scoring most of his political points right now off of attacking John McCain?
BENEN: I think it's probably a little bit of both. I think Robert Reich was right; neither candidate has necessarily presented a lot of details in terms of what they want to do. I think Chris Dodd's proposal today offers something of a path going forward. I think Barney Frank's proposal, he'll be working with Chris Dodd, also offers a bit of a way out. But Barack Obama has a very compelling message in as much as he gets to say ‘I'm not John McCain. I have a policy going forward. I have an economic message I think resonates with people,' and given that, I think he's probably going to try to ride this wave out a little bit further.
MADDOW: I wonder if this isn't in a certain way sort of a temperment test for these candidates, in that we voters and potential voters are seeing how these two men respond to a crisis. How they make politics out of bad news. Is this sort of a "3 am phone call" anticipated so much during the primaries?
BENEN: Absolutely. You know, I heard George Will, who is not exactly a reflexive liberal, talk yesterday how this is something of a presidential test. And there's one candidate who's come across as steady, unflappable, calm, the kind of person you would want in a crisis and it's not John McCain, it's Barack Obama. I thnk to a certain extent we saw that with John McCain's constant changing of messages. It didn't necessarily convey a sense of confidence, or for that matter, a sense of competence. And this week, I think we're hearing more of the same. Hopefully, for John McCain's sake, he gets some kind of message and gets back on track, because right now, he does not have a firm footing. What's more, he goes into this with something of a disadvantage. John McCain has always trailed with an economic message, he's conceded, acknowledged, publicly many times, that economics is not something he understands particularly well. Polls have shown consistently that Democrats are preferred against Republicans on economic messages and so given that dynamic, he has a high hurdle to clear and he hasn't quite gotten up to it yet.
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So apt and funny
from theseminal
Well This sure isn't going to help McCain any!
As the author points out here rule number 1 through number 4... Don't f**k with the NYT!
You'll enjoy the video links of McCain caught in the act.
NY Times Exposes McCain Lie: Davis Took $15k LAST MONTH from Freddie Mac (Under FBI Investigation)
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/9/23/212335/090/21/608147
he was probably only charitable with McCain because there were NBC execs in the background with stun guns
Wow! Just caught this clip of Rep. Marcy Kaptur from the House floor:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S27yitK32ds
I am proud to say she represents my home town in the great state of OHIO!!
Wah-hoo!!! Go Marcy!!!
Abbybwood @ 4:
A voice of reason
Abbybwood @ 4:
"Privatize gains to a few, socialize losses to the many"
where have we heard that before :)
Steve Benen ROCKS!! Whomever C&L's SilentPatriot is, that person reminds me so much of Steve. Their writing styles are so similar. C&L has some awesome talent and I miss Benen being here, but you still are one of the best sites online.
Congrats, Steve! I wrote Rachel and told her how much I enjoyed the civil discourse and how much I enjoy Steve.
Abbybwood @ 4:
everybody should listen to this representative.
i see it like she does...could i be wrong sure. but you
have wonder why now they have known about tis or months i understand the scenario/plot thickened with
the 'nationalization' of fannie/freddie. of course they
are shoving down our throats while we're standing on
the plank....this way they can anybody who opposes
and/or ask questions. this is bigger than subprime
loans not being paid and they know it.
the financial institutions have a sophisticated 'betting'
system...it's called the 'shadow financial systemm'
essentially it's palcing bets on whether or not the
loans will or not. NOT the loans themselves.
BUSH was involved in this deregulation. gramm
and others set up the necessary ground work.
look at what happened to eliot spitzer he was making
noise about this. BUSH help rid some of the protections
on the state and federal level. they don't want this to
come out....that's part of the rush in my opinion.
OT but a must watch. Gather some friends and relatives to watch also. A real inspiration
http://slackeruprising.com/download/
So... What precisely is Senator Obama's position on, and plan to redress, the present economic crisis?
Don't get me wrong, Senator Obama is hands down the man I would want in charge of the economy on January 20th. But lately on the progressive blogosphere I've been reading a lot of "here's why McCain's response to the crisis is a farce..." and not enough of "here's why Obama's response to the crisis is sound..."
I'm not that well-versed in economic matters, and I probably haven't been paying as much attention to the campaign as I should. So far, all I know about Senator Obama's position is that he supports oversight of any bailout proposal, which should be a given. If someone could give me a more precise "quick and dirty" on his position, that'd be much appreciated.
Thanks.
Remember eliot spitzer coming out about predatory
lending? he was pointing his finger at the BUSH
adminstration. this short video is interesting. explains
the possible BUSH role in this. apparently he made some
changes and used the office of the comptroller of
currency(OCC). he used the OCC as a tool to change the rules.
http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/291.html
All Obama has to say is . . . the plan Secretary Paulson proposes here seems like the cherry on top of the whipped cream for the finance industry. They get to unload their undesirable investments on the general public but save the lucrative investments for themselves. What’s fair about that?
When do we see Nicole on TV? She must be smokin' hot.
She is. Actually, every woman who has any connection whatsoever in any way, shape, or form, with Crooks and Liars, and yes, this includes commenters and lurkers, is smokin' hot. Thank you for your erudite contribution. - Smokin' Hot Sitemonitor, oh you betcha.
Abbybwood @ 4:
Rep. Marcy Kaptur is nothing short of inspirational and it is time to make your voices heard on this issue!
We can not sit by and let the criminals in this administration get away with this crap any more!
This can not be allowed to be treated as a financial “Reichstag Fire.”
We need to contact those committee members now!
Below are the links to contact forms and a sample letter that you can customize as you wish, but speak up now!
Senate Banking Committee Contact Form:
http://banking.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=Contact.Form
House Committee on Financial Services Contact Form:
http://financialservices.house.gov/contact.html
Sample Letter Below:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Regarding the proposed Bail out plan...
Committee Members,
I agree that we have to do something but Secretary Paulson's plan is not it!
I read the provisions of Section 8 under this plan and it is appropriately located there because you'd have to be crazy to agree to give this administration a blank check while granting them no review by the congress, the courts, and placing them above the laws of the land.
That is insanity! NO! NO! NO! To grant them this would be the unforgivable sin!
Lack of oversight and deregulation is what caused this mess and I want full oversight and accountability for any such bail out deal!
Secondly, there is no guarantee that this will work and I want it to be split into smaller tranches that allow for quarterly review to see if it is working before committing to astronomical sums in a carte blanch form like what Secretary Paulson is proposing.
Thirdly, by committing the country to this huge bail out it would limit the next President’s ability to handle any other crisis. It is imperative that either it be split into quarterly segments with full review, or the Congress must come up with its own counter plan immediately.
This can not be allowed to be treated as a financial “Reichstag Fire.”
1. I want an independent group to be formed to do this much like FDR did with the RTC. I like Warren Buffet's Suggestion of Bloomberg for head of this agency.
2. I want taxpayers to receive the title of ownership to the companies that we bail out and guarantees that the tax payers will receive the benefits of later sale of these properties.
3. Assets purchased by this group should not be inflated beyond their market value. Companies should not be rewarded for bad decision making...
4. Not one penny of our tax dollars should go to the CEO and upper level staff for "golden parachute" exit packages.
5. Liquidity to the banks should be supplied by Federal Loans, not by purchasing assets at vastly inflated prices.
6. As a condition for any bail out or loans, the Glass-Steagall Act of 1933 should be reinstated.
7. Mortgage holders should be induced to renegotiate terms to keep single home owners in their homes.
8. A special loan facility should be created specifically targeted at small business owners to provide them with operating lines of credit.
This last point is vital. I know many CEO’s of small companies who have hundreds of thousands of dollars of orders but they can’t fill them because they can’t get credit lines to purchase the parts. Small business owners provide over 65% of the jobs in this country and need to be given priority over the financial institutions.
Rasputin @ 2:
At this coming Friday night's debate Obama should hit that MF MKKKain right between the eyes with this one!
The White House, 2010…
Track returns from Iraq and gets Cindy “Pill Head” McCain hooked on meth. He makes a sex tape of himself giving Cindy some white trash lovin’ and it’s widely circulated on the net.
Bristol relapses and snags Cindy’s oxycontin supply during her new pregnancy resulting from late night meets with Trent Lott and proceeds to give birth to another Downs Syndrome baby…
It didn’t necessarily convey a sense of confidence, or for that matter, a sense of competence
Confidence? Competence? It didn't even convey a sense of comprehension.
Fil Hussein Oaks @ 15:
I wouldn't wait if I were them I'd put the video of McCain lying and the NYT headline in an ad so fast... rub their faces in the truth until their gonads hurt!
What Nobody's Saying: The Bailout Will Kill the Dollar
By Dave Lindorff
from afterdowningstreet.org
let the shafting begin, "hold-to-maturity" value, what a F***ing joke
from bbc news
BoA pays out other peoples money to inflate Merrill Lynch's profits, and the bonuses to the select few.
from wiki
ferrofluid (Obama + Biden = 2008) @ 20:
All kind of shit is starting to float to the top....
What can you say? It pays to have friends...
Any one care to bet that when Paulson leaves office after the elections that there is an announcement of him rejoining the old gang there???
http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Paulsons_former_firm_to_be_among_0923.html
ferrofluid (Obama + Biden = 2008) @ 5:
Loved it! Why isn't SHE on the ticket?
Abbybwood @ 4:
You are so fortunate to have her as a representative! I have watched her for years and always liked what I saw. Today was a masterpiece!
I wish someone would have listened to Ron Paul on the economy, he was right dead 100% smack in middle right on this and no one listened. I'm not sure who I'm voting for, definitely not McCain, probably not Obama, I don't we have any real choices right now because both candidates are clueless on the economy. They don't even understand the origins of the issue or the scope of the problem.
I'm glad to see Steve Benen on Rachael's show. I have been a reader of him since he had his own blog "The Carpetbagger Report".
VegasRage @ 25:
Gee, kinda makes one wonder why no one listened.
joker @ 13:
Sitemonitor change hands recently? This is far and away one of the best responses I've ever seen from SM.
VegasRage @ 25:
Then I suggest you default to the party that has not held the Presidency for the past 8 years and both houses for 6. At least the Democrats cannot do any worse.
Rasputin @ 14:
thanks!
how's this
ferrofluid (Obama + Biden = 2008) @ 20:
you saw that on monday - essentially, with our credit as bas as it gets, we told the world that we were going to print up or borrow nearly a trillion dollars. gold up $80, oil up $16, every commodity and resource going up.
why?
because currency by itself is not worth the paper it's printed on. US currency, in particular, is only worth the threat of losing it's historical value. On Monday, the world told us they have no use for a dollar if a trillion of them can be had so easily.
ferrofluid (Obama + Biden = 2008) @ 5:
awesome!
The Repubs should have gone Romney and I think they would have, if they knew back during the primaries what they know now. C'mon, McCain was getting his advice from Phil Gramm? They are two peas in a pod. Gramm: We're a nation of whiners (because the economy is sound). McCain: The fundamentals of the economy is sound (so stop whining, and did I mention that I was a prisoner of war for 5 years?).
Only reason Gramm is out is because he made a fool of himself in public, not because McCain and Gramm have a different point of view on the economy.
But, you do have to wonder how long Americans are going to buy the Republican logic that we can continue to spend and spend more than we take in, with never increasing deficits, and that we'll never have to pay the money back. (Probably through inflation once foreigners refuse to loan to us, and the printing presses are turned on to generate liquidity)
Give me a break, Dems pay so much attention is paid to conservatives who actually critique conservative candidates. News flash: George Will criticized McCain as a warning -- "get back in line with our policies (stop talking about things like regulation in the future) or we'll publicly criticize you".
This kind of coarse punishment-reward system is how they got McCain to become a Republican clone so quickly during this campaign.
Enough quoting conservatives to "prove" McCain is doing a bad job. Who cares what they're saying? We never care the rest of the time, why would we care just b/c they're trying to bully McCain instead of Dems for a day?! Stop quoting them as evidence, it's absurd.
What happened to our favorite troll... Dennis?
Rasputin @ 35:
Did he finally recognize the utter hopelessness of his indefensible positions?
Well, at least he could spell.
Steve Benen, I miss you at C&L. I've always liked your posts here and at Carpetbaggers (yes, I lurked there often, ha). It is so very nice to see you on Rachel Maddow's show. She's always fantastic. And so are you.
bmw 528 @ 32:
Chances of any of that TRUTH making it onto the evening news? Same as the chance of taxpayers not paying for this historic corporate failure.
bmw 528 @ 32:
Chances of this TRUTH making it onto the evening news? About the same as the chances of the American taxpayers not paying for this historic corporate failure.
doesnt matter what benen says
doenst matter what reality is anymore
not when you have wingnuts on radio 24/7 spewing lies
not when you have wingnuts on radio 24/7 singing the praises of palin
not when you hear that its more important to protest ahmadinijads appearance at the un, then it is to deal with the economy
and if you dont think these things are having an impact, speak to your friends who dont have the time to fact check anything
and watch as next week, mccain unveils his rev wright/ayers ad....and will alledge that obama is a radical in a suit, whose goal is to totally destroy the us economy so that we can be taken over by muslim terrorists
Bob Roberts @ 29:
LOL! Such options. Now that's campaign pitch.
Vote Democrat, at least we cannot do any worse.
HAHAHA The republicans can't say it's a lie.
huh. we have a three-prong front to confront: iraq, economy, and oil. and with our attention on the economy and iraq, we are now diverted from our oil problem, you know, off-shore drilling not going to help and we should stop it at all costs or else we might have a huge mess on our shores.
well, the democrats have capitulated. they are going to let the ban expire. and i must say that it is very reassuring to know that the democrats were fortified on this issue and are now taking on the wall street fat cats and their subprime extorsion racket. i mean, what are the odds that they are going to buckle under the pressure again? i mean, er, ah, oh-boy.
VegasRage @ 25:
i take it that you have never listened to thom hartman, bernie ward or kucinich...all of whom predicted this scenario over 4 years ago
and please, paul is a libertarian, he doesnt believe in oversight
ron paul is not an answer to anything
just like ralph nader is not an answer to anything
paul and nader are shit disturbers....end of story
who's winning? I'll give you one guess
House GOP rises up against Cheney
By DANIEL W. REILLY & PATRICK O'CONNOR | 9/23/08 1:51 PM EDT Text Size:
There was a time when Dick Cheney could turn back a Republican revolt on Capitol Hill. Not anymore.
Photo: AP
There was a time when Dick Cheney could turn back a Republican revolt on Capitol Hill.
That time is gone.
The vice president traveled to Capitol Hill on Tuesday to silence a chorus of GOP complaints about Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson’s $700 billion plan. But House Republicans who walked into a closed-door meeting with Cheney steaming over the plan walked out just as angry, and they described what happened in between as both “a bloodbath” and “an unmitigated disaster.”
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0908/13789.html
The only reason Obama is not further ahead in the polls is because racial bias runs deep in this country. How sad for us if the guy who actually has the smarts and talent to lead this country through some very difficult times doesn't get elected because he has brown skin. Seems kind of ironic. The morons who vote for McCain/Palin would get their just desert, but it's seems unfair to the rest of us who realize this country is going down the crapper fast, and McCain will only hasten our demise.
john mccain is much better for our economy and national security and eevrything else for that matter the obama. obama has nothing in goverment except fill a seat. he has never wriiten a bill and 130 times could not even vote yes or no on a bill. This is a amn who would crumble under the pressure of president. he rejects every idea that comes up for energy independence and lowering energy prices. he wants to tax the american family to death. he lies about his record on various things. can not answer questions any better then that is above my pay grade. that is weakness. we need john mccain a strong and proven leader
charlie @ 46:
Semi-literate people should not troll on behalf of candidates, it just doesn't work.
charlie @ 46:
You are sorely mistaken. Obama has co-sponsored several pieces of legislation that have passed into law. He also tried early on to pass a bill that addressed the financial industry but was dismissed as too new.
I see your grammar and spelling skills could use quite a bit of improvement. Why is it that people who demand that English be the only language don't seem to use the language well, or to appreciate a candidate whose skills at speaking and writing far surpass those of the opposition?
And thanks to the folks from Toledo for the heads-up on Rep. Marcy Kaptur. She was smart, articulate and funny with just the right amount of righteous anger. And yes, she would have been a great veep candidate to counteract the empty skirt of Palin.
ferrofluid (Obama + Biden = 2008) @ 20:
The other day on NPR, either "Wait, Wait, DTM" or that other one (my apologies but the comedy shows on NPR are really background noise for me) had Paula Poundstone on. She made one of the funniest suggestions I've heard yet which was that since the DOLLAR is now worthless, maybe we should change the photo of George Washington to George Bush!
That's funny right there!
charlie @ 46:
Please tell me exactly what Sen. McCain has led! He's never had a command in the military and maybe he's chaired a committee or two, but a leader? He may lead in voting with W, he may lead in championing deregulation, he may lead in giving tax breaks to big oil but unless you want to see America led deeper into the drain with McCain in charge, I don't understand how you can make that claim.
The fundamentals of our economy are strong.
I've also got 12 inches. :)
charlie @ 46:
Too many lies in your post to take them all on, but as for taxes, Obama will likely lower yours more than McCain would.
In all due respect, I've read Benen's blog contributions on C&L and rarely been impressed. Now seeing him live it makes sense. He's slow, boring, and seemingly a bit ill-informed. How in the world did this guy become a pundit? He has little to contribute and has a slow, monotonous delivery. Dude, have some caffeine before you go on live television!
charlie @ 46:
With all due respect, you really would be taken a lot more seriously if you were able to write a coherent sentence. As far as taxing the American family, you are sorely mistaken. Under Obama's tax plan 95% of Americans will get a tax cut. The wealthiest Americans, making over 250,000 dollars a year will see an increase. They will pay more, because frankly, they can afford to pay more. It's the patriotic thing to do. America has given them so much, wouldn't it be nice to give something back?
Now, I don't know where you're getting your information. Let's just assume it's from Rush Limbaugh. How much money do you think Rush makes in a year? I'm guessing it's a lot more than 250 grand. So, don't you think he might be looking out for his best interests?
Take some time and just Google "obama vs. mccain tax plan". Read about 3 or 4 of those articles. It'll probably take you 5 minutes. It's a really nice feeling to think for yourself instead of listening to other people's opinions.
Have a nice day. And good luck in thinking for yourself. It's the first step towards true enlightenment.
joker @ 13:
Oh yeah! I knew it. Did somebody say C&L swimsuit calendar?
What a cutie Benen is.
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