Forget the spin, forget the pundits. Let's just talk about the winning moment of the debate, shall we?

It was right at the end, when the moderator (finally!!!) got around to domestic issues which are of far greater concern with Vice Presidential candidates than foreign policy.

The moderator asked them to discuss their religious views, which left the door wide open for Mike Pence to go on and on about his forced-birth views.

Then Tim Kaine stepped up. "The very last thing goverment that government should do is have laws that would punish women who make reproductive choices," Kaine began. "And that is the fundamental difference between a Clinton-Kaine ticket and a Trump-Pence ticket."

"Why can't you trust women to make their own decisions," he asked.

That right there is the winning message, especially with women who don't appreciate Big Government being in their business.

Pence also had the nerve to say he and Trump would never, ever punish women for having an abortion. Of course, Trump has said exactly that, and Indiana has prosecuted a woman in Indiana for having an abortion on Mike Pence's watch.

Kaine nailed the entire debate with that one answer. Never mind that Pence lied about everything, couldn't defend his running-mate, and spent the entire debate serving himself instead of his ticket.

Pence's supercilious and fatuous answer regarding abortion and "sanctity of life" caused this retort from the daughter of a Sandy Hook victim.

Kaine nailed the answer, and whatever the spin may be, he probably nailed the whole debate too.