Real Time: Mike Gravel Gets Honest
By Nicole Belle Friday Aug 31, 2007 6:26pm
(h/t Heather for video)
On Real Time Overtime (shown after the program online), Bill Maher asks guest and Democratic presidential contender Mike Gravel about presidential politics and the role of the media in presenting the truth to citizens. John Mellencamp and Barbara Bodine chime in.
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Turn off the lights and close the door!
But we one industry! War!
*have
It is refreshing to see someone not speaking in soundbites.
Too bad John Mellencamp didn't get to speak more, because it seemed like he was trying to point out that the strength of the U.S. economy from the Civil War until Reagan was based on our manufacturing sector: steel, cotton (and other textiles), all kinds of technological goods (radios, TVs, household appliances) -- well, you get the idea. Since Reagan, it seems like the economy is more and more based on smoke and mirrors: there are the genuine "idea" company cultures (book publishing, movies, the arts in general) but most of what they're pushing seems intangible -- what does "service economy" really mean, anyway? Do we all have to serve as maids or fast food employees? And who can afford fast food when we are all making just above minimum wage? -- and therefore not a solid basis for an economy.
Count me among the bears when it comes to long-term fiscal outcomes.
why is john cougar mellonhead smoking? Does he think he looks cool?
Yep' the MeDiA. . and man this one is sure slipping under the radar.
Despite the best efforts of the Teamsters Union, the Courts have given the Bush administration the green light for Mexican trucks to roll into the US next Thursday, reports the Houston Chronicle.
This is a sideshow of the corporatist/globalist plan to merge the US with Mexico and Canada (and have its own money) without ever having to go to the CONgress and call it what it is - merger. Instead, the administration's weasel-wording is that this is all "administrative" in nature and therefore no "approval" is required. As a result, there's a whole second government push (the second government being the one that was never elected, just appointed and really pulls the strings) which is neatly laid out at www.spp.gov and elsewhere, explaining how this is all really good for you.
o/t kinda-
But wasn't Bill a little rough on Mellencamp...and he was really rough on Miss Teen whatever....calling her a moron.
[Deleted. Off topic]
totally ot but.....that was the first time since the 70s that i have watched anyone smoking on cam during a talk show
talk about a flashback
and lets face facts people....
gravel isnt marginalized because he speaks the truth...hes marginalized cuz hes boring
kucinich is marginalized cuz hes funny looking
yes, the front runners do temper their comments...but look at what happens when they dont
blame the internet, 24 hour media outlets and talk radio for that
the days of the plain speaker died with goldwater
abarts @ 8:
Miss Teen whatever is a moron, what is wrong with calling a spade a spade?
It was nice to see adults having a rational if partisan discussion that revolved around problems and problem solving instead of trying to find a way of helping themselves like republicans do. One question though: why is Mellencamp sucking on a smoldering dog turd?
John is smoking a fucking cigarettes you dips. Get over it. Jeez. The smoking police running around on comment threads. GAFL. He smokes because he is an addict just like you are an addict to oxygen. Why don't you try not breathing?
If he keeps telling the truth like that he will be turned into an unperson.
Oh, wait, he already is.
Doctor Who @ 11:
Yeah, but ain't she CUTE?
moktar @ 6:
I was thinking the same thing. He had a heart attack a few years ago. I've had a couple myself and had to give up smoking. Smoking causes them. He needs to quit.
wow...the nanny cigarette patrol on a thread about politics?
unbelievable.
If only some of you would take his advice and DO SOMETHING about it. I'm not talking about voting for the top Democrats or top republicans as the media would have you. You need to get out there and raise some noise. If the 70% or so that are really sick of everything got out there and protested things would change pretty fast.
Doctor Who @ 11:
Bill 'M' is nasty, mean, and intolerant. He is becoming the Bill 'O' of the left.
Gravel speaks with intelligent, I'm a normal person language, instead of political rhetoric ratcheted up. Nice to see and hear. AND, he's absolutely right. The media has decided who they want the American public to be informed about, and they are not the Mike Gravels running, but the soundbite phoney Hillarys and Obamas. This nation is bankrupt, both financially and with ideas it seems. The political elite do not seem to grasp that Americans are fed up with all of it, and are tired of working 2 or 3 jobs to make ends meet because the jobs do not keep pace with inflation caused by their policy screw ups. The Perfect Storm is brewing, but what kind of impact will it have on America?
One thing we can DO immediately is support independent media. Become a member of your local community radio station, send a contribution to Democracy Now!, buy documentaries by Robert Greenwald et al, support your favorite independent 'news and views' web site...you get the idea.
P.S. Thanks, C&L for sharing this video clip.
In response to uncle joe mccarthy at #10 -
You don't really believe those are the reasons they stay away from Gravel and Kucinich do you?
They have to make the impression that the top tier candidates in fact are top tier. If it appears that Kucinich or Gravel are getting popular, but their "polls" keep saying otherwise it'll look a little odd.
Kucinich clearly won the ABC poll after their debate but not one word of it was mentioned.
P.S. Sometimes I feel I should start smoking again because why would I want to live a long life if people are going to continue to get fooled time and time again.
Charles @ 19:
He is not a lefty. He is not becoming the Billo of the left.
seatech1 @ 16:
He will. It's called death. And if he has had a heart attack, death probably will be sooner than later than other people. I'm happy for you that you have quit. Have a good/ happy and healthy life.
miss_kitty @ 23:
Exactly. Just because he's moved a bit to the left since ten years ago does not make him a complete lefty. And Miss Teen whatever of South Carolina is still a fucking moron. Just watch the video clip that has been floating around YouTube for the past week.
#5 Youffraita -- both you and Maher are wrong about the economy.
Read a few more stats about our service economy:
Service industry - 70% of GDP
Production - 20%
Government - 10 %
"Yet the United States remains the world's top manufacturing country, its factories producing goods worth $1.49 trillion in 2005, 1.5 times the level in the next country, Japan. And the value of U.S. agricultural production trails that of only China and India."
http://usinfo.state.gov/products/pubs/economy-in-brief/page3.html
Some service companies: American Express, AT&T, Citigroup, Disney, McDonald's, JP Morgan, Sears, Wal-Mart.
Also companies like IBM have huge consulting (service) businesses.
#21-Grateful American
Very well said. I have to say, to emulate your moniker, that I am grateful that independent media such as Democracy Now! and Free Speech TV and Link TV are on the air and not controlled by the corporate media.
[...] More honesty from Mike Gravel on Real Time with Bill Maher (via Nicole Belle @ Crooks and Liars): [...]
Youffraita @ 5:
..#5 Youffraita -- both you and Maher are wrong about the economy.
Read a few more stats about our service economy:
Service industry - 70% of GDP
Production - 20%
Government - 10 %
"Yet the United States remains the world's top manufacturing country, its factories producing goods worth $1.49 trillion in 2005, 1.5 times the level in the next country, Japan. And the value of U.S. agricultural production trails that of only China and India."
http://usinfo.state.gov/products/pubs/economy-in-brief/page3.html
Some service companies: American Express, AT&T, Citigroup, Disney, McDonald's, JP Morgan, Sears, Wal-Mart.
Also companies like IBM have huge consulting (service) businesses.
yenehC hcaepmI @ 18:
70% of political leaders ignore public opinion 95% of the time. Also 93% of statistics are made up on the spot. Seriously, protesting will do little for these clowns. They've been ignoring protests and stealing elections for awhile now.
Master @ 28:
Government info websites sure do paint a pretty picture, don't they?
Mike Gavel delivered the most honest assessment of our truly pathetic situation on the world's stage. We are bankrupt, we don't produce anything other that bombs and guns and too few of the politicians from either of the parties have the balls to call it for what it is. How can we threaten China, when the hold the mortgage note on America? No one is telling it like it really is.
Come on CensoredFan -- It's one thing to disagree with the conclusion, but are you really trying to disagree with the facts?
See "Who Killed John O'Neil" and one doesn't get a very favorable view of Ms. Bodine. A Frontline production.
...
bill w @ 24:
Now you see C&L why Bushinator is the Preznitwit TWICE. A video with actual decent conversation about real issues and the only thing Amerkuns see/hear is John Mellencamp smoking. This is why this nation is on a downward spiral. Amerkuns don't seem to have the damn attention span of a three year old. Oh, look at da pretty pictures.
moktar @ 6:
People like you are part of the problem.
In a discussion about serious world issues and the US' inability to get things done, you have some petty health and safety concern about SOMEONE ELSE smoking a cigarette on a show that used to be called politically incorrect.
Focus on the sh*t that's really important in life and stop contributing to the police state atmosphere.
Right on cesoredfan.
And by the way, as has been already expressed above, until and unless we somehow manage to pry loose the strangle hold that the corporate media behemoths have on the country, we will surely be reduced to little more than mindless animatrons, so purposely dumbed-down that we will be convinced and eventually may actually believe that Wednesday is now the new Monday. In other words, the corporate media whores will gladly manipulate and lead us along like puppets on a string. Media re-regulation has to be top on the list of issues that the democrats have to take up as soon as the last ballot is counted in '08.
Master @ 33:
Get them to take out the manufacturing of weapons and military completely from the equation and see just what is manufactured here. The big three automakers don't even make squat here anymore. Mexico and Canada. Cheaper. Levi's? Moved to Asia. I find it very hard to see that 20% being production, unless they count production for the food services industry that seems to be the only thing thriving and producing those wonderfull McJobs.
Censored Fan-#38
Your mentioning of the manufacturing of weapons and the military is reminiscent of the two excellent documentaries Fahrenheit 9/11 and Why We Fight which emphasized how so many, if not every, states are dependent upon the military for providing jobs for their citizens and thus behave in an obsequious manner toward the military in the hope that they will continue to keep their installations and their bombers in their state.
Erroll @ 40:
Both good movies and it's true. Take the military out of the scenario and we have very little production jobs now. Hell, take the military out of the budget, and the government spends very little tax money on anything.
bill mahers become a bore and is so full of shit its pathetic , hes about as funny as a cup of puss, your right bills no lefty hes a swell headed jerk, to bad he was only interested in rediculeing some poor ditz head gal instead of cutting bush and cheny a real new asshole , gravel got a few sound bites in ,they were the truth but thiers never enough truth being told, kucinich would skin the bush botts and thats who mahers sould have had on with him, as far as smokers go if you dont like em ,dont smoke em what ever happened to its none of your buisness!
I love Mellencamp smoking on tv too. LOL now that's not something you see everyday. I watched this episode and I don't know how I missed it. I love Gravel. He doesn't care about anything except the truth and providing answers to people's question's whether you agree or disagree with him.
Mellencamp may as well wear a big sign that says "I"M STUPID." IT IS STUPID TO SMOKE. STUPID STUPID STOOOOOPID. I'm watching my mother die from smoking right now. If you don't get cancer and "only" get emphysema is a very very slow death by suffocation.
Gravel's comment about the small number of companies who own the media was like a light bulb going on for me. I know it's kind of a "duh" kind of thing. But it is the reason TV news sucks. Here's a good simple link that explains the big 10.
http://www.thenation.com/special/bigten.html
moktar @ 6:
Gravel was Smokin'! Even Bill was a bit shaken by Mikes' comments. LOL!
Actually JCM was on the mark as well. What the hell are you smoking?
[...] Clark Real Time: Mike Gravel Gets Honest » This Summary is from an article posted at Crooks and Liars on Saturday, September 01, 2007 This [...]
Ali @ 44:
Smoking is dumb, but if someone wants to kill themselves legally, then at least we still have that much more in the way of personeal freedoms left after Bush tore aprat the US Consitution. According to him as quoted over at Capital Hill Blue, " It's Just A God Damn Piece Of Paper". It's a personal choice, but don't forget that the government collects a whole lot of your taxes through the sale of cigarettes. The same with booze, and plenty of people kill themselves while using that medium as well.
Gravel is an interesting character. Either he found God after leaving government, or he's the face of a new breed of politicians who have reinvented themselves. The media is bought an paid for and rather than provide an objective service in the public interest, we get NeoCon spin out of Faux News as well as politcal bias from all. On that point I think Gravel is correct. Too few mega corp's own all of the media outlets. It's just too easy to controll entier populations through the media, yet the sad part, is that most people actually believe what they are fed as real news. Has society really gotten that dumbed down? Sure. We're no longer taught critical thinking in schools anymore. In fact we're taught not to ask questions. Infotainment is more like it.
Where's Walter Cronkite when we really need him?
Really. A guy smoking on TV these days isn't making a statement? And those that question that action are ridiculed as nanny police state fascists or whatever? Get real. It's sad that his anti-corporate posture would include the inferred declaration that "I'm free to abuse my body and influence others to do the same in support of an industry that is a main contributor to rising health care costs and death in general." OK, I get it. He should be free to do whatever he wants, as long as it doesn't hurt anyone else; but isn't he, by his celebrity, influencing others to share his addiction?
Vman @ 47:
Does it really make a difference where the public might be exposed to something that will either kill them or place a large financial burden on the rest of society? One way or another we pay. So whether it's a public figure or an andvertisement, it will still find a way into ones conscience one way or the other.
The costs of treating OBESITY will pass that spent on smoking...and soon.
Vman @ 47:
Excellent point. Perhaps people are too young to either remember or to know how incredibly ubiquitous cigarette smoking was in America before 1980. It was considered hip to smoke a cigarette, both in the street and on the big and little screen. The maverick journalist George Seldes wrote about the pernicious effects of nicotine in his newsletter In Fact way back in 1940 but almost no one paid any attention to what he and reputable scientists were saying about the noxious weed. Movie stars like Bette Davis and Humphrey Bogart and musicians like Nat King Cole would light without hesitation. Cole would smoke a cigarette before making a recording in order to make his voice sound deeper. The latter two ended up dying because of their habit.
Now Mellencamp, who seems on the surface to be intelligent, also seems intent on bringing back the image of how cool a celebrity looks by smoking on that cancer-causing product. People complain about how smokers' rights are being infringed without recalling how smokers were held in such high esteem in the not so distant past. Another example, it would appear, how this country seems to be going backwards instead of forward.
as far as heart attacks go if your a smoker it only hastens one, its the crap you eat all your life that really kills you, plack builds up in your arterys and nicotiene pulls down on the arterys ,skinny fat smoker or not you eat enough big macs your asking for it, so unless your into eating lettuce and spinace youll get one if something else dont kill you!
miss_kitty
i didnt say i was staying away from either because of their shortcomings...only that is the reason why the media doesnt embrace them....and why, if he chose to get into the race (which he wont) al gore would win in a landslide
gore speaks the truth...and looks good while doing it....
gotta deal with reality
as for the smoking issue....
im a smoker....i dont think its cool to be smoking on camera in a small studio with other people
and mellencamp did have a heartattack just a few years back....
why do so many celebs have death wishes?
miss_kitty @ 23:
Huh? all I said was Bill Maher wasn't a lefty. I didn't post anything else on this thread, so I haven't got the slightest idea as to what you are on about.
These two go together. I got confused.
uncle joe mccarthy @ 53:
miss_kitty @ 54:
abarts @ 17:
Thank you! I thought I was losing my mind when I read the first anti-smoking comment on this thread, and I don't even smoke. I think smoking is actually pretty stupid if not unhealthy as hell but my god people. Oh and Bill Maher still rocks. Yes he is a smartass and way too smug but he is nothing at all like Bill O. I tried to watch Bill O today, made it a whole 30 secconds before I wanted to kill myself. All I can think is that there are people out there who truly believe his BULLSHIT. Oh but I forgot Mellencamp was smoking...jesus!
Oh and to all you who are sitting there typing into your computer how we should protest and stand up for something...GO FUCK YOURSELVES! You are completely full of shit. All Americans are spoiled to the point that I don't think we will never stand up for anything ever again. I honestly think we deserve what we get. Fuck me, fuck you, I'm out. But if I live long enough I'm sure I'll get to hear "Iran/Syria/WHATEVER is NOTHING LIKE IRAQ!" from some government idiot. Just like we were saying about Vietnam, and before that and before that. Nobody is going to do shit, they're just going to tell others that "we" should do something...I just pray that planet Earth will recover when we are gone (soon) and leave no trace that we were ever here.
Did I mention I love you? lol
I mean "ever" ...jeez
In response to CensoredFan At #29:
Sure they ignore a protest if there are only a couple hundred or a couple thousand. What would happen if the 70% who are sick of everything protested at the SAME TIME. Strike911.org has been trying to organize a Nation Wide General Strike but the majority of the 70% that want change are too dang lazy to make change happen.
"In the beginning of a change, the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." - Mark Twain
People like Gravel and Kucinich...and yes dare I say it here...Ron Paul are the patriots trying to change things and the majority are the timid. When are people going to join them and help get their message out?
P.S. The ones that don't want to do anything...Maybe they can take up smoking.
I'd like to see John Mellencamp interviewed more on political subjects
BM is an Independant....i enjoy the show...but lately it seems to have lost something..on a scale from 1 to 10 I'd say .........drum roll please...........4.5......can be alot better.
Just one thing. Mike Gravel said we should stop buying this stuff.
Its just that when boycotts began after NAFTA and started to have their effect. The corporations had the best Congressmen and Senators money can buy. And they changed the law that would allow them to put made in America and/or not put anything at all. They sometimes did minor assemley of some merchandise that allowed them to place "made in America" on it.
I tel you that after the china dog food killing our pets and the chinese toothpaste making people ill. Our product protection agency doesn't even ensure its safety. The money for them is great under the table. But mark my words. If we stop buying these chinese products, our Government will change the labeling law for them to dupe us.
Mellencamp was not smoking on the televised show, although Bill suggested he may. John declined, and apparently waited until this bit, which was not seen in Alaska anyway...
Emily @ 43:
The C & L blogger posted this clip, identifying it as a portion of the post-show OVERTIME segment of Maher's Friday night show.
I have to admit I had no idea there was more to =see= after the traditional show. I thought OVERTIME was like an online instant message forum where viewers are able to post thoughts and questions.
How long does he air the OVERTIME segment and is there a link on the HBO website/Maher page to this part of the show?
Thanks.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1dKSKFYhzQ
smoke free website
[deleted - due to bad spelling, poor grammar]
Vote with your mind and your heart for the upcoming primaries, and only vote for either Gravel and Kucinich since they seem to be the only two who are telling the truth and are not beholden to the multitudes of special interests/corporations (military, pharmaceutical, insurance, banking, etc.) that want to keep the American media dumbed down so they can stay IN CONTROL OF US ALL for their own selfish profit margins for the top 2% of the population (The Bush Crime Families best buddies and friends).
moktar @ 6:
I was surprised when I saw that.
Gravel is correct in his opposition to the occupation of Iraq, but not on what's called "free trade" given his comment on Smoot-Hawley, which did NOT cause the Great Depression. The lack of "balanced trade" is leading inevitably to a Great, Great Depression. His support of the "Fair Tax" is also misguided. Unfortunate. Edwards and Kucinich have good positions on "trade". Clinton is a DLC free-trader and "trade" isn't even an issue on Obama's site.
abarts @ 8:
Bill Maher (whom I generally admire) was in fact gratuitously cruel to the girl. Her "crime" was giving an incoherent answer to a pointless question in a silly beauty contest. She was not auditioning for the Nobel Prize. She was not pretending to be Madame Curie. She is in fact beautiful and, sometimes, that's enough. She's not a symbol of anything. Bill's remarks were mean-spirited and smacked of schoolyard bullying. They said nothing about the girl but said a lot about Bill Maher. and what they said was not flattering. Not flattering at all.
don't care about the smoking.....JCM can smoke on or off the air for all I care. I don't smoke, but I don't give a rat's arse about this and why is it such a big, bloody issue?
As for the brain-dead Miss teen USA, she is the only one making herself look stupid. Also, agreeing to go on daytime TV to go into Damage Control has pretty much sealed her fate.
Abarts, she is a representative and responsible to the teens that she represents. That actually counts for a lot. When you take up the mantle of responsibility, it should mean something. If you fuck up in the majestic way that she did, it says "I'm the best that teenagers have to offer, so get used to it". I think that teens need to be better represented in this case, don't you? Just because she's pretty is no excuse for idiocy.
When you hear someone talking straight - like a normal person - it's really hard to go back to
the bs laid out by the other candidates.
SMOKING???!!!? On TV??!!
Sounds to me like Matlin is running the campaign for Fred Thompson. She uses the subject "we" when she discusses his campaign.
He sure is a sour old stupid man isn't he? I quit watching that TV show when he came on.
It ruined it for me. He is awful to look at.
Can you imagine HIM at the oval office camera talking to the nation?
really! ! ! ! ! ! !
Mike Gravel has my vote.
Damn straight, I'm voting for Mike Gravel too.
You are not going to find anyone of substance when comparing the so-called “top-tier” candidates. This is intentional. The media (controlled by the 5 major corporations) sets up straw men on each side, so everyone has someone to hate.
The trick is, none of the candidates ever truly reflect your values. Giuliani wants to start asking everyone for “papers please” to identify illegal aliens. Clinton says she wants out of Iraq, but that it will “take a while”. Millions of hardworking middle-class Americans support George Bush, and he just authorized Mexican Truckers to come into the US and take American jobs.
And why do they do this? So you are always forced to vote for the lesser of two evils, and each time you do, another freedom gets shaved away, and a few more dollars get siphoned to the uber-rich. Saddam has WMDs? Billions for Halliburton. Hillary proposed universal Healthcare? Billions for the pharmaceutical industry. See how it works?
If you want to change things, register Democrat (if only temporarily) and vote for Mike Gravel in the primaries.
I really, really, really like Mike Gravel now.
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