Countdown: Jim Webb on Lieberman/Kyl, Rush Limbaugh and the Spanish Downing Street Revelations
By Nicole Belle Thursday Sep 27, 2007 9:08pm
Download | play 
Download | play (h/t Bill W)
It's dizzying to try to keep up with all the plates that the Right Wing are spinning. On Thursday's Countdown, Keith Olbermann and Sen. Jim Webb try to put it all in perspective.
(On the Spanish "Downing Street" memos) There's no real surprise there. If you look back at where the situation was in '02, I and General Tony Zinni and other people were saying that Iraq probably would have been sixth highest in terms of the threats to the United States. In fact, I wrote a piece in the Washington Post five years ago this month, basically saying "Do you really want to be in Iraq for the next 30 years?" and that these people have no exit strategy because they don't intend to leave.
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Shouldn't that be "los calle Downing nota?"
A really fine analysis here. I wish all Americans could hear and comprehend it. And then we could get rid of bush/cheney before they mess things up even further.
yeah and webbs not going to lead us out either, once a repuke allways a repuke!
Mark @ News Corpse @ 1:
¡El Presidente esta se chingando los Estados Unidos!
KO seemed to be under the mis-impression that we had to pay the $1 billion Sadaam wanted to take into exile.
tyree @ 3:
But at least with Webb our troops will be better rested for the fucking they are going to continue to get.
2 late
2 weak
4 me
Yeah, Webb was...shall we say...less than impressive? I suppose once a member of the MI Complex always unwilling to tell the truth about what that swamp of corruption and cronyism is up to....
Is anyone surprised at this, or that Saddam was willing to leave or that the Intel was fixed. All this shit is old news or no news at all. Blood is on the hand of every American cause of this man.
never in my lifetime have i felt this sad for my country, the whole country seems to be under some kind of depression, the depression started in 2000 got worse on 9/11, went manic during Katrina and with each day this man is in office a cloud of sadness will hang over this great country.
I do see a light at the end of the tunnel that light is the up coming election. Rudy said " Think God George Bush Was In Office during 9/11" I say Think God there's A Election coming up.
My real hope is that the Dem's take more house and senate sets so some real work can get done.
Blue Buddha @ 4:
SI! El Presidente es un grande borracho y un grande culo..............no?
Now, see, if that were a real United States Senator, he'd be telling Keith that he was helping to make sure the House would bring articles of impeachment, but instead he shrugs, "Eh, what can you do?"
while Webbs motives seem to be all and good.....but for some reason (I can't explain)...I don't trust him very much.....but for right now....he'll do.
Good 'ol Jimmy-boy F#cked us AGAIN TODAY! That's twice Jimmy-boy has rolled over for his republican, NO TIMELINE tummy-rub! What a lying fraud! He also sold us out and voted with his republican circle-jerk pals on the NSA illegal spying. Then Webb cowers with Lieberman to vote to denounce the ridiculous MoveOn ad resolution. Has Jimmy-boy actually taken a stand on ANYTHING that disagrees or challenges Bush? NOPE! ( Jimmy-boy's laughing his @ss off about how the voters actually BOUGHT that bongwater about his "ending the war!")
Guess those boots Jimmy-boy was waving around aren't designed to stand your ground.. Jimmy-boy, you're a disgrace!
KUCINICH/FEINGOLD '08 The only sane choice.
Robert @ 9:
this is great but how do you know whos the dem and whos the the repig dressed like a dem?
So Jim is trying to recover from the damage he has done? Sorry, Jim. Too late. You and the Dems have made your beds and ours. Whether by the FISA crap that you passed, or the Kyl crap that your colleagues passed. Not even including the batshit insane attack against MoveOn that you helped pass.
So just do us all a favor and STFU now. You guys are done.
"Nota del Calle Downing," verdad?
tyree @ 14:
It's getting easier to tell. Look at Gulianni and Clinton: both are corporatist republicans and both wear dresses.
Also, Jim Webb is a reasonable, well-spoken and thoughtful senator. Seems like a good man.
fiver @ 17:
yes but with clinton we get twofers hillry and bill , maby bill will get hillery to fuck us on an upgrade of nafta
theOtherJK @ 18:
yes hes a great repig!
Question: If someone doesn't agree with you 100% of the time, does that make him/her a dick?
Show me a politician you agree with all the time and I'll show you someone who is only looking to get re-elected!
theOtherJK @ 18:
Good one! Thought you were serious there for a minute! Here's DINO Webb's vote last night giving bush another %#@*! blank check...just like his first one....
http://senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm...
What a Bastard! At least Feingold had some huevos...appears he's the only one!
GonzoD @ 21:
the answer to your question is yes it makes him a dick!
without a doubt, there is respect for jim webb. i can only hope that he doesn't get advisors who smooth him over so much that his message loses meaning. when the top dems in the debate declare that the war will last years longer, webb doesn't step out and call it what it is. he's into making excuses for them as to why they said what they said. we need an immediate pullout and allow the dust to settle. no gradual pullout, no peace-keeping force, just head out the back, jack. leave. allow that country to settle on its own. we created the chaos, why do we have to keep it going. because king george and his dominions tell us the terrible things that will happen if we leave. and you all know we can believe everything they say we are the caretakers, the people. don't count on your elected officials, don't look to the media, look to yourselves.
No wonder we don't see anymore trolls on this site. No need! Plenty of people already here willing to bash Democrats!
Usually, it's Hillary. Welcome to the club, Senator Webb!
GonzoD @ 21:
No kidding Gonzo, after hearing all this democrat bashing on a liberal blog, I've decided to vote for Mitt Romney just to be a bitch.
these people have no exit strategy because they don’t intend to leave.
I just want to say how shocked I am that Senator Webb is accusing General Petraeus of lying to the American people. We can't win this war when our brave troops and their leaders are attacked by blah blah blah complain to John Cornyn!
tyree @ 23:
Then you must have a very narrow view of the country and the world.
GonzoD @ 28:
guess maby ive just seen a lot more of it then you have!
Strawberry @ 26:
now,now,now.......we know you better than that...but the scary thought is some people might not go out and vote....Ya Know....I wouldn't put it past them to try to do just that.............................................................................................................................................And I'd never say you were a beeeeeeotch
tyree @ 29:
Touche!
Hey, did Webb ever complain about Rush's "phony soldiers" remark, or does he just slam criticism from people who are against the war?
we're going to be in Iraq forever. "Vital American interests" while we still use 19th century internal combustion engines in our cars
Congressional Democrat bashing? It couldn't possibly hurt them anymore then they have hurt themselves; the Dems have brought their own rating down to the low teens. Nobody can help them out of this except themselves. And all I see is talk, no action, and musical chairs on who is the next Dem congresscritter to vote for or against a resolution - the names change but the number of stupid votes doesn't. In fact, the number of stupid votes seems to be going up, not down.
nsr @ 32:
He does; it's in the video.
Otay @ 34:
well put!!!!!!!!!!!
mudshark @ 30:
Leave it to us dems to fight amongst ourselves when we've got the repugs are on the ropes.
Bill Maher looks pretty good tonight.....it's been awhile.
these assholes can vote for shit that doesnt help the democratic party in the least bit but when it comes to getting the real job done thier just so many farts in the wind!kucinich 08
James Webb: "Eisenhower took the right kind of action, for the benefit of the American people & for the health of our relations around the world. We call on this president to take similar action, in both areas. If he does, we will join him. If he does not, we will be showing him the way."
Source: Democratic response to 2007 State of the Union address Jan 23, 2007
How's that Jimmy-boy? By grabbing your ankles & giving 'this president' so much money that he drowns in $1000.00 bills? By surrendering our privacy protections without blinking? By cowering with Lieberman to attack free (and accurate) speech? Webb is a bush-suck republican, through and through.
Strawberry @ 37:
Democrats have given Bush his fully funded war, warrantless search power, an excuse to bomb Iran, immunity from impeachment, probable immunity for past illegal spying... the list goes on. What more could a Republican Congress have given him?
We've got the Republicans on the ropes? Bush is laughing.
fiver @ 41:
Bingo! Well put.
I don't trust a single word out of Webb's mouth. He has sold us out too many times to be trusted any longer and I began to wonder after he voted to allow the government to spy on us whether or not he is a plant from the right.
Retired Navy @ 43:
like i allways say once a republican allways a republican!
I guess Webb sucks - bring back Allen!
GonzoD @ 45:
reagan democrats ever hear of them
Strawberry @ 37:
Condemning the progressive wing of your own party for a completely factual ad, and voting to blame Iran for what's gone wrong with Iraq, are not acceptable. And it's not bickering to say so. This is a fundamental disconnect between us and the people who purport to represent us.
And it's not just on Iraq. Nancy Pelosi is pushing through an expansion of NAFTA because it's what K Street wants, not the voters. They don't think enough of us are paying attention to cause them any trouble. This isn't how I expected a Democratic-controlled Congress to behave-- you can't even say it's because her majority is too slim, which is the excuse Reid's pulling. They're simply not standing up for us. And I'm done being quiet about it.
GonzoD @ 45:
Like the votes woulda been different???
nsr @ 47:
Thank YOU! Keep talking! Never forget the screwing these 'savior Dems' are giving us after breaking our necks to get 'em into office.
hanshiro @ 48:
tyree @ 46:
I give up! Vote for Gravel / Kucinich!
GonzoD @ 50:
bet your ass ,
tyree @ 51:
Might as well vote for Nader!
Here's a Jimmy-boy blast from the past (Jan. '07):
“I have a strong belief that in this country, one of our greatest strengths is we have a right to stand in front of the people in power and state our views,” Webb said on CBS’s “Face the Nation” on Sunday morning. ~Jimmy-boy Webb
Unless, of course, you do it in the New York Times! Then, we'll resolution yer @ss!
tyree @ 51:
KUCINICH/FEINGOLD '08 (Feingold, the LONE HOLDOUT voting against this latest Senatorial funding cave-in to bush. We need people like that in office for us!)
nsr @ 47:
And we'd better start talking loud and soon. Another two years of a neocon agenda (even if it is under the auspices of a Democratic Congress and under a Queen instead of a King) and we are f&*$ed! Primary season is around the corner and if we need to challenge these phonies we need to start soon.
this countrys gone if we vote for the same shit they push on us hillery clintons going to give us no better government then we have shes a golwater republican none of the rest are goung to change anything kucinich and gravel are the only ones speaking honestly about the shit that goes on here, want four or eight more yrs of the shit they been cramming in your face vote for anyone of thoes lame brained pricks!
I like Jim Webb. I also do not understand the level of vitriol and the kneejerk reactions in the comments on C&L now. There used to be just a few (who seem to still be here) but there was some interesting additions to the discussion to give you more of an overview. What did Webb say about his votes? Why did he vote the way he did? What about the very scary discussion about the Lieberman Kyl vote. That seems like the most important part of this discussion to me.....Did anyone comment on that?
Jill Bryant @ 57:
guess all the smart ones left
Jill Bryant @ 57:
Look at his votes. You don't justify voting with the republicans to give bush a blank check. That wasn't what he ran on nor is it what he was sent to Washington for. His reasons are bogus, claiming that to cut funding would 'endanger the troops.' This is a flat-out falsehood! Feingold has consistently voted NO to funding this war. He has bigger stones than 'former republican' Jimmy-boy (R-shhh) Webb. Plus, how do you justify giving bush illegal spying power? 'Cuz it's "short term???" Justifying peeing on Constitutional protections, which bush has already violated, isn't in ANYONE'S interests except to cover bush's @ss. Webb sold us out.
More Webb hot-air:
“We have an American public,” Webb said, “that has turned strongly against the lack of wisdom in the strategic effort in Iraq.”
“This is almost like a tipping point for a lot of people who are saying we cannot continue to give the administration a clean hand in the manipulation of troops numbers without a clear strategy,” he added.
So has he voted to challenge ANYTHING about bush's strategy? Has bush changed anything about his plans because of Webb's "bold decisive" leadersh*t? Not when Webb trips over his dick to give bush more no-strings funding! Gee, what shrewd legislaterin' is Jimmy-boy Webb...
Jill Bryant @ 57,
I think Jim Webb happens to be a lightening rod on this thread for many people's serious disappointment with this Congress. While disgust with his warrantless spying vote is a reason I view him with suspicion, I admit that inaction on Iraq, Lieberman/Kyl, MoveOn condemnation, and the proposal being pushed by Clinton Dems to immunize the telecoms has pushed me over the edge with the whole damn party. I'm angry, and more than a little frightened that my country may become irretrievable if something isn't done soon.
hanshiro @ 13:
KUCINICH? lol
keep dreaming.
CD @ 61:
Always. Doesn't surprise that CD doesn't recognize a better candidate. CD doesn't recognize much anyway.
dreams are what this country is built on.........................but I get your point...sadly
hanshiro @ 62:
Kusunich probably realizes he doesn't stand much of a chance.....but he goes out there and keeps on trying to spread the message........That my friends is a Patriot.
hanshiro @ 62:
Unlike some people I recognize that a congressman with a limited fan base won't get elected.
mudshark @ 65:
Perhaps if MoveOn gets behind the effort. I've already emailed them and encourage others to do the same. Hillary-Edwards-Obama are corporate owned and have screwed us on votes too many times to imagine they're anything but republican-lite. Kucinich and Feingold have been consistently against bush.
I am sorta shocked it took C&L until Friday evening to post this. Why the delay? You're really quick when it comes to Olbermann's Comments, why wait a day to post this?
CD @ 66:
Oh, terribly sorry CD, I owe you an apology! I somehow gave you the impression that I give a rat's @ss what you think! My bad...
I'll end on a humorous note:
Saturday, October 28, 2006
Webb: Democrats Will Provide Iraq Remedy
Webb: Democrats Will Provide Iraq Remedy By BOB LEWIS Associated Press Writer RICHMOND, Va. (AP) - The only remedy to a series of Iraq policy failures by President Bush is a Democratic takeover of Congress in the Nov. 7 election, Virginia Senate candidate Jim Webb said Saturday.
BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! F*ck you Jimmy-boy. Bend over, bush wants more fundin' and more a-spyin' and you're givin' away votes like a drunk 'publican!
to congress shut up and put up put your political ambition on the back burner an the troops lives up front
hanshiro @ 69:
What no essay about how I'm wrong and Dennis is going to win?
May you all have sweet dreams!
gna!
CD @ 72:
every body believes every word you say cd if you say he cant win well then thats that!right
hanshiro @ 67:
How is Edwards corporate owned?
tyree @ 74:
Well hanshiro says I should vote for Dennis and since it wouldn't make sense to vote for a candidate you think is going to loose hence Hanshiro thinks that Dennis can win and since he knows everything I'd like to hear him explain why and how Dennis is going to win.
CD @ 72:
It's not a question of being wrong, CD, you're a brainless douche. Being wrong would suggest that you possess working synapses that don't rely on a Fisher-Price 'See and Say' to write your posts; "lol" and all...
Jill Bryant @ 75:
Good point. Edwards made his money suing corporations and insurance companies. His message of two America's is pretty anti-corporatist, and the constant attacks on his haircut by the MSM may indicate he's the candidate the top 2% fear the most.
CD @ 76:
well give us the lowdown cd whos going to win
fiver @ 78:
Actually, two things:
One Edwards was on the intelligence committee leading up to the Iraq war. He saw the 'unvarnished NIE' including all the red flags and still voted to go to war. Now Edwards himself states that a real leader stands up for what he believes in, but Edwards didn't do that. Despite the evidence to the contrary, Edwards voted to authorize war. That calls his judgment into serious question. On the issue of being 'owned,' his Healthcare plan, like Hillary's and Obama's allows the insurance and big pharma to remain in power to simply apply a different version of the current healthcare screwing. That is not an improvement. Why? Why allow those rapacious entities to keep ripping us off?
Yes, follow this ruthless logic:
CD says: Well hanshiro says I should vote for Dennis and since it wouldn’t make sense to vote for a candidate you think is going to loose hence Hanshiro thinks that Dennis can win and since he knows everything I’d like to hear him explain why and how Dennis is going to win.
Since I know everything, and have declared CD a douche, it’s only fitting that he’s acting like…a douche. G’night douche.
hanshiro @ 81:
So where's you proof that Dennis is going to win?
As an outsider , its not looking good kids. Looks like they opened the door for Chimp and Cheney to have their third shooting clusterfuck in Iran. Dems wont even vote for basic human values. You have Congress actually condemning free speech ala MoveOn vote. Bill Clinton had to be the one to go on TV and point out the obvious but regular hypocrisy of the rightwingnuts.
What are the Dems afraid of ? Whatever it is ? It seems to be catching as most of the country appears to have laid down and let the Neo assholes have their way. I seriously doubt there will be an election next year anyways. The coup of the US Constitution seems almost complete now. Amazing that the land of the free and the brave has let these assclowns rip up 230 years of democratic and Constitutional government.Time for this Canadian to get a FAC certificate and buy myself a nice hunting rifle with a good scope in case the cancer spreads to our borders. Amazing and sad at same time.
CD @ 82:
Where's yours that he's going to lose?
hanshiro @ 84:
answer the question.
[Is this the open thread? Because this little tiff you boys are having would be off topic for any other thread on the board-Sitemonitor]
Col Kilgore...you've asked a very good question..."What are the Dems afraid of"...............hell if I know.
Col Kilgore @ 83:
Get a cache of clean water, a filter unit and stockpile some food. I may need to crash a night or two on my way into the Canadian Rockies. I'll bring th' beer. :-)
Tell you what CD....
You answer tyree's question: Who's going to win?
I'll give you a scenario where Kucinich wins.
[And I'll delete it. Off Topic-Sitemonitor]
[Off Topic-Sitemonitor]
hanshiro @ 87:
or you can head south of the border........it's warmer and theres unlimited amounts of BEEER!
mudshark @ 90:
Air's cleaner up north, more fresh water....More places to hide from which to 'monkeywrench' the neocon's 'Amerika.'
Sorry Sitemon...just joshin'.
[Ok. I just didn't want to walk in here tomorrow and find the furniture tossed about, the glassware broken, etc etc-flamewar debris-Sitemonitor]
ok lets talk about DKs electability.........1....he doesn't come off as Presidential...but he makes alot of sense.2 .he comes off as far left....which right now to me is a good thing...and he makes alot of sense. 3..He comes off as being so far left that even the moderate Dems have a hard time choosing him....but he still makes sense.4...the sheeple don't recognize common sense.
I guess it's Squabble Night at the C&L Corral. :(
hanshiro @ 92:
Don't misunderestimate your bretheren to the south.....besides..who needs water?
it seems obvious to me that he lacks exposure and funding.Maybe he is playing his cards right.And waiting for the right opportunity...he still has alot of time.As long as he keeps driving his message...he stands a chance
Jesus. Republicans are so hopelessly out of their depth.
Such indepth reporting from KO on the "phoney soldiers" statement by Rush. One was led to believe that Rush was downgrading those who are against the war. This statement came about (if they would have checked his radio transcripts) because of the anti-war poster boy Jesse MacBeth who claimed on YouTube to have committed atrocities along with other soldiers against the Iraqi people. Well, he admitted finally that he lied about the whole thing and unfortunately it went over the Internet in Arabic. This was the type of "phony soldiers" Rush was referring to.....I don't believe I have seen anything yet from the anti-war movement retracting his claims!....
Col Kilgore @ 83:
So true. Demf**ks and Republicans. Time to call this human waste called self-proclaimed Democrats what it is. Actually, if "Demf**k" would spread like the reincarnated term such as a nigga', these worthless pieces of garbage that ripped up the Constitution in as little as 6 f*****g years and presently are feeding off of decent American people and suck the corporate dicks to hold on to the power (power which has nothing to do with the Constitution and the governance of the people's nation anymore, but rather power in monetary, materialist, corporate terms), would, after a little soul searching, start respecting this country and its people again. Call them what they are, Demf**ks!!! Spread the word.
Had to log in and and say, screw you Webb! I gave you my hard earned cash so you would not vote 'yea' on bills like FISA
You are a disgrace in my eyes and I wasted my time with you!
Just to make this clear.
Every single frightened little shit that didn't think they provided the American people with enough blood from attacking Afghanistan and enabled this President and his guy that lurks in the shadows. To every news outlet that kept its mouth shut or raised their pom poms high, to every business that sought war profiteering and every republican hack and every stinkin Democrat that went along with this insane notion of bringing peace at the barrel of a gun to a deeply fanatical religious country. And evey single frightened American citizen that proclaimed they support Bush to make us safe, but are to scared to join in the sacrifice themselves. Standing back allowing others to have their young go and risk and fight.
They are so scared they do nt deserve to have their freedom. They won't fight for it.
They are silent when the Constitution is stripped of the Bill of Rights that they have enjoyed and no longer will. It is just a matter of time before another comes along and likes the dictator role. Bush could be that village idiot.
There are too many scared Americans that are too soft and could not and would not defend this country. You can tell by the sheepish attitudes of giving up freedoms to a predident and disregarding the constitution. Out of Fear in exchange for the false promise of being taken care of and safe.
People like Rush Limbaugh is a prime example of a cheer leading, Frightened, undesrving of freedom, unwilling to defend the constitution, too scared to fight himself, when he had a chance to serve and defend his Country he cowed backwards and let others do the defending, Then sits back and bloviates arrogantly and disrespects those that did not cower from the Duty as he did.
Hey Spain, thanks for not telling us sooner, when it might have done some good.
Blue Buddha @ 4:
Mark @ News Corpse @ 1:
Shouldn’t that be “los calle Downing nota?”
¡El Presidente esta se chingando los Estados Unidos!
SI! El Presidente es un grande borracho y un grande culo…………..no?
________________________________________________________
Lo que ustedes necesitan, es un buen instructor en el lenguaje espanol. Por favor, cesen de arruinar mi idioma!
No more Jim Webb for me. Not after his vote against the MoveOn ad. Many of his other votes since being elected have also been bad. I regret donating to his campaign. Pure DINO.
Even if the US had to pay Saddam (that's not what he meant) it would have been the bargain of the century and saved thousands of lives, and Cheney could have still stolen all the oil.
GonzoD @ 25:
Bash them? If the assclowns actually DID what they should be there would be no need to bash them. It isn't trolls, GonzoD. It is the fed up American electorate and I guarandamntee you one thing. IF there was an actually alternative to the one party with two branches, the alternative would be elected with a landslide in both houses and the white house. Lying corporate buttkissing political A-holes, the whole damn bunch of them.
Bush + Cheney = FUBAR. These guys should be tried for war crimes as far as I'm concerned. We were all duped. The Iraq invasion and occupation has been a disaster for us, for Iraq, and for the Middle East. Did anyone catch Bill Moyers last night? They were talking about the refugee situation. All of Iraq's intelligentsia has fled the country, and are now struggling in refugee camps trying to make their savings hold out. Some families have been forced to prostitute their daughters to make ends meet. These are middle and upper middle class people. They have no home, no jobs, and no income. Their children can't go to school. They're living 20 people to a room. It's tragic and we did this to them. They're feeling hopeless. In the beginning, they believed they might be able to return home in 6 months, now most think it will be years. How many future terrorists do you suppose are being bred in those refugee camps? The whole thing makes me so damn angry. Do you think we might be forgiven if we offered up Bush and Cheney as a sacrifice?
We have nobody to blame but ourselves. The entire world protested, told us, "hey, look, your government is lying" and did we listen? NOPE. For some strange unexplainable reason, our nation believes these liars, until it is too late. We all KNOW that every damn one of these politicians are liars, and yet we want to believe their crap. So badly, that we go so far as to blog to vote for "so and so" cuz they aren't like that other "so and so". We know it isn't true. We know they are all lying rich assclowns. But do we use our brains? Nope. We just keep voting them in. Go to the Senate website, or CONgress' website and look at how long some of these liars has been in politics. Their constituents know they are liars. But do they keep voting them in? YEP! Not only did the entire world know Shrub lied our American blood into Iraq, WE knew it, and just to make sure the rest of the globe hated us even more, the sonofab**** was selected TWICE to make us look even more idiotic.
Daisy Zimmerly (#104)
No offense, but please get over it. If you're looking for perfection, it's never going to happen. I'm not happy about those who voted to condemn MoveOn either, but I'm not going to write them off. It's not worth it. Besides which, you're falling right into the Republican trap. The reason the Repukes sponsored this resolution in the first place was to put the Dems in an un-winable situation. They knew the Dems would be damned if they voted for it and damned it they voted against it. Yes, it would have been nice if the Dems had stood their ground, named it and shamed it for what it was, another cheap political trick brought to you by the republicans. However, they probably felt it just wasn't worth it. It gets to the point where you have to pick your battles with these creeps. Let's face, their exhausting, but then maybe that's part of their stratedy too. Anyway, as for Jim Webb, I don't think you'll find a more decent and honorable man. He cares about regular people, and is a very staunch supporter of the military, but more importantly the soldiers on the ground. I think he did what he felt he had to under the circumstances. He is only a freshman senator who has already taken big risks by being so vocal. Unfortunately, sometimes you gotta play the game, and let some of them go. It's really sad you would write Jim Webb off over that one incident. It would be very unfortunate to lose someone with his integrity. Instead, why don't you write a letter to your local paper, and help expose the republican hypocrisy with regard to the MoveOn ad. Because truthfully, many people just don't seem to see it, unless you point it out. The bottom line is, We The People have to do our part. By condemning Jim Webb, you are falling right into Republican hands. I hope you're smarter than that, because if your views are representative of many Dems, we are indeed in huge trouble.
How ANYONE could vote to condemn FREE SPEECH is beyond me.
Lady Liberty is weeping.
If an external military force is required in Iraq, that is a job soley for the UN! A peace-keeping force comprised of non-"coalition of the willing" nations, to be paid for by the US and Britain. There is no other way to assure that Iraq's sovereignty is respected and protected. The argument that Edwards, Clinton and Obamma (and now it looks like Webb) are making is complete, unconscienable bullshit. We can be out of there in a month, if the will exists. These corporatist candidates are merely mouthing the will and intentions of their corporate/neocon masters whose only intent has ever been to seize Iraq's natiural resources and continue
plunderingtransferring the wealth and assets of the American People into their pockets in the for of war industry profits. Like Bush, corporatists are never to be trusted.Spicegal @ 108:
"Anyway, as for Jim Webb, I don't think you'll find a more decent and honorable man. He cares about regular people, and is a very staunch supporter of the military, but more importantly the soldiers on the ground. I think he did what he felt he had to under the circumstances. He is only a freshman senator who has already taken big risks by being so vocal. Unfortunately, sometimes you gotta play the game, and let some of them go."
Let SOME of them go??? Try ALL of them. Webb claimed he wanted to 'end the war,' yet voted TWICE, with no timelines whatsoever WITH THE REPUBLICANS to continue funding the war. Webb then votes to allow bush to spy on us without court oversight! THEN votes against free speech despite the fact that the MoveOn ad was accurate and MoveOn's base raised funds because of the PROMISES WEBB MADE TO END THE F#CKING WAR! Talk is cheap and every politician knows this, that's why-they-LIE. They can't be held accountable for promises, only by their lawfully recorded vote. You really think it matters that Webb spouts off against bush when he then turns around and votes WITH bush's policies???? Jimmy-boy is paying lip-service before slipping the shiv into his constituents' backs.
Name one piece of legislation, when the vote COUNTED AGAINST THIS CLUSTERF#CK WAR that Webb didn't vote with his republican buddies. Yes, he sponsored legislation for troop rest that was bound to fail, so he looks good to the suckers back home..'Gosh, Jimmy-boy, you TRIED!' (Feingold was the lone dissenter in this latest funding grab. At least Feingold recognizes what he was sent to congress for and is keeping his promise.)
Let me say bully for Webb and his service, but y'know, an 'honorable, heroic' former soldier is 'honorable and heroic' right up until they stop acting like it. Webb has not stood his(MY) ground nor do his votes reflect the phony promises he made to get elected. He can bang his gums all f'ing day, but if he VOTES with the torture party, he's a republican, and that sure as hell isn't what I voted for. Webb is a disgrace.
Webb said:
"If you look back at where the situation was in ‘02, I and General Tony Zinni and other people were saying that Iraq probably would have been sixth highest in terms of the threats to the United States. In fact, I wrote a piece in the Washington Post five years ago this month, basically saying “Do you really want to be in Iraq for the next 30 years?” and that these people have no exit strategy because they don’t intend to leave."
Mr. Webb may not vote according to our wishes, but he is correct in what he says here. Cheney/Bush and their PNAC buddies et al, have no intention of alowing US forces to leave Iraq EVER. They have/are constructing several huge military bases from which to launch their imperialist takeover of all the oil resources in the ME - a la PNAC strategy documents. Either the US or Israel will attack Iran sometime in the next 6 mos-1 yr, and/or there will be another "terrorist" attack inside the US to ensure the populace is sufficiently "re-frightened" so they won't complain too much when Cheney/Bush try to cancel the elections in Nov '08. And, if they don't succeed in cancelling them, they'll just fix them like the previous 2 pres. elections. Check out the stuff going on in Burma now - that's what you'll be seeing here next year.
U.S. is a Fascist country. Period. Not sometime in the future. We've been turned inside out.
Our economy is WAR.
All our dems have done is sit in their armchairs and watch it happen. Same rehashing of the same conversation for 7 1/2 years.
If you happen to have a good governor to resist funding pressures you're lucky. Maybe this is the beginning of the states reclaiming their power and resisting the Nazis. Our human economy has been systematically hollowed out since 11-99.
All we've done is point at the looting and done nothing to stop them while they've robbed us blind. They don't care if we live or die, in fact, a little culling of the population might be in order.
Pelosi would simply be replaced by Hoyer, a dedicated nose-picker.
So what are WE going to do about this starting TODAY.
Amitola Says: Mr. Webb may not vote according to our wishes, but he is correct in what he says here. Cheney/Bush and their PNAC buddies et al, have no intention of alowing US forces to leave Iraq EVER.
I knew this when bush pushed for invading Iraq, and I'm not even a US Senator! So why does Webb collapse faster than a lunchmeat accordian when it comes to financing bush's insanity? Why is Webb screwing us over ILLEGAL SPYING? How does THAT slow the AWOL fratboy down?
Answer: It DOESN'T! Webb is a fraud and a DINO and should be recalled. It's so bad that if Allen had won the seat, THE VOTES WOULD BE NO DIFFERENT! Still 2 blank check funding votes, still passing NSA illegal spying, still denouncing freedom of speech in the stupid MoveOn resolution. So what exactly is the revolutionary improvement over a bush-suck republican with a bush-suck democrat?
tyree @ 3:
Bada-Bing!
Action, not words, Mr. Webb!
99 @ 11:
Bush is not going to get impeached. What a silly idea. Not
going to happen, dopes. Christ with all the shit coming out
of Washington DC you ass-wipes talk about tossing out Bush.
Reality isn't part of your life, you crazy bastards. No wonder
Bush is the president. It's because of the dimwits like you. :-)
Keith Oberman wants to think of himself as a real talk show host with weight and an audience. His ratings have been going down because like all others like him he makes no sense. All he does is bash the President and hope by doing so he can actually increase viewers. Too bad you are so boring, actually what is worse is that dumm pseudo=lips Chriss Matthews who actually together think they are so smart because all they have is their Bush-bashing talks. Transparent so very transparent your idiocy......THANK GOD that both GWB and Giuliani were around 9/11 at least they took action and did not let politics get in their way. By the way Rush and Oreilly make sense and actually have an entertaining news hour....
mudshark @ 10:
Posiblemente El Presidente es un pendejo muy grande?
Congress has no authority to delegate its war making powers to the president through any act it may take short of amending the constitution.
Spicegal @ 108:
With all due respect Spicegirl, I do not expect perfection. However, I do not accept Democrats voting with Republicans simply because they think the GOP will say something nasty. That especially goes for freshmen Senators that haven't yet made their bones.. I would also point out that I did not write Webb off after just "one" vote that I didn't agree with. He wrote me off (a contributor to his campaign) by repeatedly voting against what he surely knew was the wishes of his supporters. That is not integrity.
And yes I do write my local newspapers and call my reps and all that stuff. I have had several letters that pointed out Republican criminality published in the local rag . I was foolish enough to use my real name and I still have the NeoCon hate mail I received in response.
We the People have a right to expect the Representatives that we elect to reflect the will of the people. We the People did our part by sending these freshmen Senators to help end this war. We did not elect them to vote in favor of unconstitutional bills or play into Republican nonsense for the sake of appearances.
While you and I might be on the same team Spicegirl, we certainly don't agree on how the game should be played or what qualifies as integrity from our Representatives. And I don't know how smart I am, but I can say with confidence that a lot of Democrats are starting to feel the same way about Webb that I do. You will not defeat these NeoCons by playing nice.
Best wishes
Daisy
Daisy Zimmerly @ 120:
save the hate mail....it'll come in handy.
garcia @ 103:
ok garcia...your right....but you don't have to be so mean......
Mudshark @ 121 said, save the hate mail….it’ll come in handy.
I did save them, in case I run out of toilet paper.
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