David Letterman Returns, Still Supporting the WGA: Leno in possible trouble
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David Letterman made a welcome return to The Late Show on Wednesday night. As stated on Wednesday, Letterman's production company, Worldwide Pants, negotiated with the WGA to return with his writers. And throughout the broadcast, Letterman made sure to know just where his sympathies lay.
At one point in the broadcast, Letterman took questions about the strike from the audience, leading to his head writer interrupting:
Thousands of writers still walk the picket line every day until their legs cramp and their backs ache, only to return to a home they can now barely afford because of the producers' greed. So, to the arrogant media moguls who've gotten so fat off our sweat-soaked toil that they can no longer fit behind their oversized mahogany desks, I say to you: Stop spending all your money on cufflinks, cocktails and whores. Stick a crowbar in your wallet and start bargaining in good faith with the writers.
UPDATE: Jay Leno could face disciplinary action from WGA decision to write 'Tonight Show' monologue violated union's strike rule.
I'm so sick of hearing these union types whining, its not the execs fault you bought a house you could not afford, if you don't like it get another job, cry babies, if you rated more money they would pay your more money! if you rated more money then SOMEONE else would pay you more money, get back to work!
Yeah, he's back, and his constant WGA sympathy play has been milked to the point that it's getting irritating.
Good for Lettermen. I did always like the man.
*
Too bad the fat moguls don't let straight talk, like that from Letterman's head writer, get through to the viewing public more often.
If they did, there would be a lot more viewing public.
Great to know that the first commenters on this article are anti-union corporatists. All hail the Fathers of the Nation, the Capitalist Gods, right?
Go back to whacking off to Ayn Rand.
It's kind of like baseball strikes. Being a long time union man from a union state I sympathize. But for the most part it isn't a little guy striking, it's some of the guys making big dollars.
How about support for striking groceries store workers for heath insurance? Not glamorous enough?
That said good on David for being a stand up guy.
Jay Leno could face disciplinary action from WGA
Decision to write 'Tonight Show' monologue violated union's strike rules
Chris take your Ron Paulista stuff to his site-talk about a whiner Pot, meet the kettle...
And no amount of support for striking workers from a management type could become irritating. If it is, you can't be very progressive. He's using his power in a good way. Turn it off Lollimom, if you're irritated. It's only been 2 days...
Damian @ 5:
You are such a liar for saying this. If you read any of my other posts on this blog, you'd know I'm more anti-corporation than any of you.
Screw you for suggesting that opposing views to Letterman's milking of this issue have no place here.
chris @ 1:
lol... no... it's the execs' fault for stiffing people on profits earned from the sweat of their labor... apparently, you forget the basic tenet of your own capitalist screed... negotiation... the strike is simply a negotiation... deal with it... and stop being embarrassed by the fact that the execs have been bargaining disingenuously and out of greed... for the record, your post amounts to nothing more than a baby's cry...
That was f*ckin' great. Good for Letterman. When was the last time a major media person stood up for unions like that? Bravo.
Chris at the top of this thread, you're an idiot.
Mike Mid City @ 6:
Baseball strikes have produced a lot of good for the pro who doesn't become a superstar. Pensions for marginal players (who, after all, would be chosen first in any sandlot pickup team, I was the manager of) and many other benefits. Yeah, the superstars make too much money, but in terms of buying power, 10 million today is about the same as a million was back in 72, before the Flood and Messersmith cases. And DAMN RIGHT I support striking grocery store workers.
Letterman rocks! And it is amazing that there are still plenty of people like Chris above, who somehow believe that there is a level playing field. "It's not about right...not about wrong...it's about power!" And good for Letterman for helping the writers here. I guess posters like Chris above somehow prefer a system, in which a handful of elite earn much of the wealth, while the rest of us labor to serve our masters. Bugger that!
[OK kids. Let's not make threats we have no hope following up on, OK? Sitemonitor]
Lollimom @ 2:
Helping fellow workers in need, including those who have helped make Letterman the powerhouse he is today, irritates you? Letterman is showing character and class, and for this we should keep applauding him. Go Dave!
First 2 comments = epic fail!
I love hearing the corporatists (who are never actually rich, they're just dittoheads) piss and moan about "all's fair" and "go somewhere else." Those arguements disappear when the little(er) guys get together and level the playing field a little bit. It's not fun to play when there's a chance you might lose, is it?
chris @ 1:
You're either an idiot or a fan of reality TV, although those typically go hand in hand.
d-man @ 12:
chris is a Paulbot. It's all "Me first, Me second and if there's any left over, Me third!!11!1!" with Paul's kids. So don't be surprised at all. They're selfish, self-involved babies. And I mean that in the kindest way possible.
This strike is proving one thing loud and clear:
Everything that comes out of the movie studios and TV production companies (even so-called reality TV, which is totally fiction) is the product of a writer's imagination.
No writer, no story. No writer, no movie. No writer, no sitcom. No writer, no joke.
Why should the writers sell their work for a token one-time payment? Residuals are capitalism at its best: the creator of the story gets paid exactly according to how well the movie/series does in the marketplace. It's the only way to pay for creative content. Internet residuals are legitimate, necessary and reasonable.
Dave's a good guy, but with his dang beard he looks too much like my ex husband.
Shave, Dave! MHO
I have been really stunned by the lack of sympathy for these workers and their rights. They have already been stiffed on one agreement, and considering the gigantic changes that have been/are taking place in the industry, a true capitalist would not deny their right to renegotiate. Anything else would be corporate totalitarianism. I don't care what percentage of them are starving, or what percentage have a big house, or what. They are being screwed, and are taking the only reasonable course left to them. When an entire industry has thousands of workers by the cajones, they don't just all "go get another job."
I very much look forward to hearing about other strikes on C&L, like the United Auto Workers' strike they blogged about last year, and I'm sure we will.
I think its great that Letterman is supporting the WGA. I went over to the WGA website and they have some very good arguements. Besides, there is a principle here. If the offers made by the execs were never reasonable and the WGA accepted anyway then that would send a clear message to the execs that they can get away with anything in the future.
I also think that Letterman has his own reasons for supporting the WGA. In his line of work he needs those writers. Without them, either he has no show or it goes down in ratings fast. This strike is hitting people like him hard as well.
I think writers ARE the Superstars of the entertainment business. When they write original characters and stories that make 100's of millions of $$$ for the producers - they deserve millions for their script.
However, staff writers (aka 'work for hire') writers are not in the same category. They, like musicians and cinematographers and other crew members are paid for an honest day's work. And, they make very good money. And, if they wish, can ask for lots more.
Staff workers that ask to be rewarded for a producers investment/risk is, to me, quite a stretch. They wish to gain from any future return on that producer's investment even though they have already been well paid. They do not give any of the money back if the show flops or never has future earnings.
[Again, they deserve to be paid ALOT.]
But, combine that thinking with their net ads when they try to compare their struggles with that of mine workers, farm workers, factory workers you lose my sympathies/support completely.
When you say such things as (and, I am assuming believe): "media moguls who’ve gotten so fat off our sweat-soaked toil that they can no longer fit behind their oversized mahogany desks" I have to step off your crazy bus at the next stop.
I hope you are all writing your spec scripts while you recoup from all those heavy lifting/cancer curing/important jobs you are striking.
I wish you all well, BUT GET REAL!
E
d-man @ 14:
Yes.
And I note that he hasn't done the same for other just as worthy groups, like people whose jobs are exported overseas, like striking grocery workers, like nurses who protested CIGNA for denying an operation to girl. No comment from Dave on these or all the other worthy or worthier people in need out here.
It's too bad so many here don't like to hear contrary opinions. Instead, they label people like me "corporatists", the equivalent of hit-and-run cowards.
chris @ 1:
Where do I begin with this pile of witless dung? Did Bill O feed you that line last night in his Talking Points Memo segment? If you had any reading comprehension skills, you would have realized that he meant they could not afford their homes because they have been on strike for so long and not working. Man, I bet you blame every person who has lost their home in the last year. I will go so far as to bet that you don't own a home and you live with friends or a relative (parents most likely)
chris @ 1:
Chris, I understand your opinion. They rate the money. They are trying to collectively bargain a better deal. They have been contributing to a revenue stream from which they haven't been offered a share. They got together to bargain for a share of the profits from the internet and DVD sales. They are just like, say, A-rod, only they got together as a group and got an agent-- the leadership and lawyers from WGA. Good comment, keep up the solidarity, brother.
enor @ 23:
If your point of view were to prevail, than all writers would rapidly become salaried 'staff writers'.
I've been a member of 3 unions in my life. I'm still a dues-paying member of 2, both of them as a freelance creative professional. I don't risk my life in a mine every day, but my right to be compensated fairly for my work is no less legitimate than a miner's.
Every cent of the billions of dollars of shareholder value of the big movie and TV companies, and all the ongoing profits, came out of scripts created by writers. They fought like hell to get fair residuals, and they should continue to get them as distribution moves to the internet.
Lollimom @ 24:
So because he doesn't stand up for everyone, he must stand up for no one, or his standing up for one group in particular is irritating? That's an interesting POV. We just don't happen to share it.
chris @ 1:
Ah, it appears C&L has producers visiting, and ones with shitty writing skills to boot.
enor, maybe we should let the two sides hash out the details, even if it's fun to discuss on C&L. Your points are valid, but missing another half a dozen points of detail. What is clear, though, is that the corporations are not negotiating in good faith. Well, it's to be expected, isn't it? Fine. That's why industrial action and raising public awareness is necessary to reign them in.
where his sympathies lie!!! ughhhhh
klunk @ 9:
Bah, bargaining is the for wise rich guys. The worker knows that if you don't swallow, you don't get rewarded for your labors. If you want a raise, get under your bosses desk and earn it.
Oh, and keep yourself clean shaven.
Weaseldog @ 32:
BTW, there's a corporate meeting in the 2nd floor men's room at two.
chris @ 1:
They won't get paid, so they should get back to work? Sorry, it doesn't work that way. When someone doesn't get paid for a job, they refuse to do it. Kind of like what is happening right now. Shocking!
If greedheads have the legal right to assemble and pool their power and influence and money in something called a "corporation", which is far more politically powerful than any individual could be, then why don't (in this case) writers have the legal right to assemble and pool their power and influence and money in something called a "union"?
Whiny babies who want too much money? That's funny, I thought that when a corporate CEO gets a $400 million severance package, all the right-wingers leap up to defend him and say "Hey, this isn't communist Russia! CEOs can make as much money as they want! This is America!"
Okay, assholes, so how come, when it's writers combining forces in a union to try to get as much money as THEY want, suddenly, they're whiners and losers who should be replaced by scabs?
I get it know. It's simple: if the person in question is already rich and powerful, then he's a right-wing idol and hero and can do no wrong. If the person is not yet rich and powerful, yet asserts power in any way, then he's a leftie loser and is somehow hurting the system.
Makes sense to me!
Jay Leno sucks.
Jay Leno steals his material from both David Letterman and Howard Stern. Jay Leno is a phony and not that funny.
Leno constantly runs pro-corporate themes and has loads of racist undertones on his show as well. Leno sucks.
a person @ 34:
I'm pretty sure that you're supposed to work, and if you get paid, be thankful for the windfall.
When I was growing up, we had to get up at two, three hours before we went to bed, and pay the miller for the privilege of working there. And kids think they have it hard today. - Apologies to Monty Python...
Weaseldog @ 37:
I love these back in my day nuts, so you worked all day then paid the guy to let you work there?? I can't stop laughing, what an idiot......
Way to go Dave!! Dave has always been the best! Gutless Leno owes his whole career to Dave. Stole "The Tonight Show" from Dave. Became a rich prick Republican and isn't funny anymore. Hopefully he will be sued by the WGA.
Most important issue of our time.
Forget about global warming, Iraq, Afghanistan, Darfur, stolen elections, the end of our rights under the Constitution, the military industrial complex, the end of privacy, rapant corporate greed and corporate control over everyone else's lives. We need to support this cause, because this is about Hollywood writers trying to make ends meet.
I'm not against this cause, but really, where are the effin' priorities? When are people going to get this organised about a real issue?
Me want'em Daily Show back! <>
Ricky Bones @ 25:
Cupcake, it is the home owners fault, NO ONE forced him/her to sign the loan, their should be no bail out, then the leander won't give out loans like this and idiots won't get loans they can not afford, thank you!!
PS. I have my own place, don't blame your insecurities on me...
Anyone else think that 2nd grade teacher in the clip was extraordinarily delicious?
chris @ 38:
It's true, we're in the presence of sheer idiocy, but not Weaseldog's.
As to the writers losing their homes: last time I checked, they were foreclosed on by a company owned by John Edwards. [/Loopa-loo mode]
Dr. Matt @ 43:
Yes, but I haven't been through the unfreezing process, so I still have an inner monologue.
Oh, crumb....
Damian @ 5:
Nicely said! LOL!
Timb @ 40:
When the people who represent the other concerns you mentioned stand up for their rights the way the writers have.
chris @ 42:
Idiocy. Homeownership is not the issue, not even peripherally.
Chris, I can't help but notice you respond, but answer none of the points raised in support of the writers' position.
Not that this is an official debate, but if you don't want to answer, or even bother educating yourself about why thousands of writers, the majority of whom badly need the income, have decided to withhold their work from the marketplace, then get out of the sandbox.
Or find another sandbox where you can whack off to Ayn Rand, as someone above usefully suggested.
enor @ 23:
this is where your argument breaks down... if a show flops, costs are still recouped... including the salaries you mentioned... there's literally no outstanding monies to be "owed back" as you imply... that, is where i get off of your crazy bus and tell you to get real...
and as far as the producer risk/reward ratio is concerned... this is where your perspective falls totally out of whack... the producer would not have engaged in his capitalistic enterprise if money would not be made from it in the first place... and the amount of profit being asked to share fairly and in good faith literally amounts to zero impact on that risk.. and only a closer to fair share of the reward... pennies for the execs and livelihoods for those that toil on their behalf...
so, please stop pretending you have any understanding of what's at stake... 'cause you very clearly don't...
Timb @ 40:
this is a "real issue" and it obviously represents far more than you care to understand... the middle class has been squeezed dry for decades and this is simply the representational tipping point for movement back toward a humanitarian view of business and society... where people get paid a fair dollar for a fair day's work and not be squeezed dry of every ounce of productivity and then tossed out like used kleenex...
After listening to the garbage that was spewed from that writer, if I was one of the people in charge, I would have fired them all. They're biting the hands that feed them. I'm so tired of "oh, we have things and homes that we can't afford. Boo Hoo..." Well then genius, either get a new job or don't buy those things which you cannot afford. Hell, move into an apartment for god's sake. By the way, smart move striking during the holidays. That means your kids got candy bars for Christmas.
These writers need to stop crying and start earning their pay. Put on something creative and thoughtful. Thanks to them, TV is overrun by Horrible reality programming. The good news is the sales of books and DVDs have went up. So if you babies want to ruin TV, be my guest. I'll be happy with my books.
Oh, and once more, Fire the striking writers.
Good day.
I'm never watching Jay again. Jay has made hundreds of millions by now. NBC wouldn't release him from his contract for not showing up
Annoyed Canuck @ 49:
I did in my earlier post, if they rated more money they would have got it, they can also go find other work!!! If they were so important the big bag man at the top would not think for a second to give these people more money because he needs them..
But I do love the way you accuse me of been dumb then attack me with "whack off."
I know Ayn Rand scares you libs to death, heaven forbid no government subsidies and each person got what they earned or far worse, kept what they earned because the income was not redistributed out!!
Funny though, corporations in America suckle the government's fatty tit more then any other group. I say cut off the tit or let somebody else have a turn.
chris @ 1:
Chris is just pissed off because the managers of Piggly Wiggly won't let him join a union.
gene214 @ 56:
Wow that was clever. Let me know when you finish the 4th grade.
chris @ 54:
Yes, indeed... I am scared that I may be forced to read anything from that lady again, the fountainhead was bad, but I simply could not finish Atlas Shrugged it was simply trite bullshit packaged in page after page of incoherent narrative. She is a paper back philosopher, with a chip on her shoulder because those uppity proletarians kicked her bourgeois derriere out of Russia.
Ironically, this country managed to welcome through the last century a lot of either the Russian upper crust, the Austrian school rejects, and the scum of the earth German Jewish Fascist lover boys like Strauss and his roving band of neo-cons. All of them selfish assholes 'til the end, and all of them at some point were heavily depended on the charity and humanity of a nation that welcomed when they collective asses were to be smoked out in the old country. Ironically, they were the first ones to deny the same charity to anyone else in need, it takes a special kind of asshole with no humanity left. And that is why neo-cons and the Austrian school rejects should have left to rot when we had the chance. Alas, scum and parasites always find a way to survive... jumping from host to host once the going gets rough. Because when the shit hits the fan, you will see all these Ayn Rand sycophants to be the first ones to jump the ship and leach off somebody else's kindness.
I find it ironic that most Libertarians want to keep their money, but they are pretty quiet about returning all the tax dollars that were used to educate them (although most libertarians I know, sys admins go figure, are either drop outs or have joke diplomas/majors but that is neither here nor there), or to build the roads that they use every day, or heck... even return the tax dollars that were put into producing their favourite invention: the internet.
Humans are social animals with an evolved sense of care and compassion, and a lot of Libertarians seem to not have got the memo.
chris @ 54:
". . . if they rated more money they would have got it." That's the dumbest thing you've said so far. What do you think they're on strike for? It's called negotiation. You only demonstrate here that you don't know what that means. The "big man at the top" doesn't just hand over a fair wage because he is politely asked for it. Sometimes you have to withdraw your services to make the big man deal with you on a mutually beneficial basis. Businessmen, large and small, do this to each other all the time. Funny how when they do it, it's called capitalism - but when workers get together and do it collectively, it's somehow offensive to the whole idea of capitalism.
And, yes, the writers certainly can go find other work. No doubt a lot of them are doing just that, or have other jobs anyway. What of it?
As for Ayn Rand, she doesn't scare me. She was a capitalist, like you and me everybody else these days. She was a professional writer of trite potboilers who made a living from her publishing residuals. Would Ms. Rand have sold her books to a for nominal amounts to publishers who refused to pay residuals? Would she have sold the movie rights to her work to a producer for nothing? Of course not. Nor will the members of the WGA.
gene214 @ 56:
Because the manager know if they let me join I will overtake him then educate the works on how they should stop wasting there hard earned money on a union that backs a phony who gives them empty promises......
Annoyed Canuck @ 59:
If they had any balls they would quit, besides are you going to lay any blame on the writers for the hair & prop guys who are not getting paid? They did not go on strike!! oh no, let me guess all the big bad corporations fault!! they only give you the toys you enjoy today!
since Ayn Rand keeps getting mentioned in this topic... i feel compelled to point out that her work's simply been perverted to mean something other than what she intended... she was a champion for receiving due rewards for one's efforts and would no doubt in my mind support the writers in this cause while heaping great amounts of disdain on the parasitic nincompoops whom not only benefit from, but would not be able to accomplish their own fiscal goals, without their (the writers') work...
it seems, many interpret Ayn Rand's writings to imply an extreme form of capitalism which promotes greed as a creed above all else... i would suggest to those whom hold this misappropriated perspective to reread at least both Atlas Shrugged and The Fountainhead...
it was the Artist after all whom she supported by writing that he had the right to destroy his creation if it became perverted by smaller minds...
chris @ 54:
you're mistaken... both in your interpretation of her work and in your interpretation of what she would say about this issue...
That was great commentating Dr. Who. I won't rehash my rant on how evil objectivism really is and how it is against everything a society is supposed to be. The delarious dream of a sycophantic, selfish c*nt with a superiority complex... Again, great musings on how this idealogy simply cannot work is found in the game Bioshock. People who only see others as tools for their benefit, numbers to be crunched....
BDM @ 48:
Amen. Also to Alex @ 55.
Sorry writers. You have every right to go after what is rightfully yours. But, if you have been getting paid anything the last few years, you are overpaid. Television sucks and has for a damn long time. It doesn't take geniuses to write reality television garbage, or reruns of the same shows over and over and over. I know it isn't your fault, but man. Television should go the way of the dinosaur. It's just constant recycling. I really sympathize, but......not really missing ANY of the programmes.
ConcernedCanuck @ 65:
As a Canadian myslef, I find your post quite embarassing.
Producers have allot of clout on crappy content. Writers are forced to work on crap the Producers want.
Even if writer salaries are avarage, their work load is large.
anyway, Conan O'Brian take over coming sooner than expected
It's not about getting what your worth Chris, it's about the people in power taking more then they're worth, or should really need. Obviously Hollywood producing is big money, and that it takes quite a bit of risk to make a movie or a pilot (even know the industry has gotten incredibly good at weighing risk and how much to spend on a production), but the writers, just because they get less face and name recognition, are supposed to not be entitled to just a tiny, decent slice of the residuals. Obviously your not a creative person, judging by the lack of creativity in your rebuttals, but its a very finicky thing. If a writer's work becomes a hit and sells well, why shouldn't they get enough from that to live just a decent, comfortable life in the super inflated regions of the country that they have to live in so they can get back to work on their next piece of work? It's not like they're even asking for much, just a decent, fair share of the money so they don't have to live in constant fear. Then again, that's what people with the money and power want us to live like eh?
I think the new motto for Republicans like Chris and Jay Leno should be "Republican: How to justify why you take more then your share and screw the people under you for personal gain!"
Me go no tv wrong wrong time.
You should too.
69!
Fil @ 66:
Well, if you're Canadian too, you should be embarassed. Our television shows suck even worse than the US. So blame the producers. Who cares? It's still crap. They all work on it, and not just one group in production are solely responsible. Even the supposed "producer extraordinaires" produce crap.
curtilingus @ 69:
Dang! U beat me to the 69!!
chris @ 1:
No writer in the world could make Leno funny. BTW, chris
your hatred of unions puts you in the ass hat category, where
you belong.
For those of you idiots (chris and JohnnyBravo) that can't see that this statement in itself includes comedic writing skills I say you have no sense of humor to begin with.
And for the 'biting the hand that feeds you' crowd I must wonder how far do you spread your ass cheeks for your employer? Collective bargaining of labor is the only way to address many issues that these robber barons (corporations) want to deny; fair compensation, healthcare, overtime, safety etc.
Where's Teddy Roosevelt when you need him?
Those "evil" producers risked their OWN money to start shows... they DESERVE a windfall of profits, if they are successful, and hire the right writers, etc. The WRITERS are simply employees... if they don't like the money the producers are offering, they are free to quit and try to find a better paying job. It's SUPPLY AND DEMAND... apparently, there are lots of writers out there.
I hope the greedy strikers lose their homes, and the wonderful producers, that PRODUCE things, who have risked LARGE amounts of their OWN money, hire cheaper writers.
Trust me, idiot Americans will still watch the crap they put on t.v., even with worse writers.
Letterman should keep the beard. Leno should go to prison.
King of Mean @ 75:
Nice to see you side with GE, Disney and News Corp on this but they don't need your help.
King of Mean @ 75:
puh-leeze... they "risked" other people's money... just like any business venture... and no, that doesn't grant them license to exploit... and if all you can see on tv is the crap that short-sighted, greed driven producers justify putting on with the same logic you employ... then good luck getting viewers to pay for your crap... otherwise, there's plenty of intelligent tv besides gameshows, talkshows and pseudo-reality shows...
anyone who views employees as simply commodity-like machines whom mindlessly produce what their puppet-masters direct inevitably find themselves regretting their own losses while blaming them on someone else... and so, i hope you find yourself losing your self-worth due to being exploited by those who undervalue your efforts, your value and your potential... you not only deserve it... you're asking for it.
I blogged on the Great Return of Dave...and I have a Beard Contest/poll over on my blog...come on over...
http://watergatesummer.blogspot.com/
chris @ 54:
I know Ayn Rand scares you libs to death, heaven forbid no government subsidies and each person got what they earned or far worse, kept what they earned because the income was not redistributed out!!
I don't know about you, but I have actually read all of Atlas Shrugged. As "literature" goes, the book my seem profound if you are sixteen or something. For an adult, the book was pretty bad. Ayn Rand is probably the most overrated writer of the 20th century.
So this is the kind of unfunny crap the writers want more money to come up with? Not a very persuasive argument. Come on, raise your hand if you laughed out loud at anything in that clip. It's the exact opposite of comedy. Awful, awful writing folks.
chris @ 1:
congrats chris...its early in the year, but this is no doubt the winner of dumbass post of the year
why dont you do some research into the industry before you start typing on your keyboard and leave comments in perpetuity that will make your mom embarressed for your existance
King of Mean @ 75:
uh, the producers and studios dont risk shit
you sound exactly like a friend of mine, who no longer has to work thanks to his parents being smart in investing in los angeles real estate.....and you both are dorks
the studios never really risk anything....if a project fails, its a writeoff....if a project succeeds, they use extremely creative accounting to prove that they made no money
its basically how they bamboozled the union into accepting shit in regards to video sales
the writer's comments from letterman werent really meant to be funny...they were meant to be angry, at the blessing of letterman and worldwide pants
and jay leno is an evil sob
JohnnyBravo @ 82:
hey genius...why dont you look into what the writers demands are before you start comparing your job at carl's jr to them
they do not want a raise, they want a percentage of both dvd and online sales
you may disagree with residuals, but that is how the industry works
are you gonna say the same shit when sag goes out on strike in june, when their contract is up?
oh, and the last time the industry tried using scab writers, it didnt go so well
ok, you can go back to flippin burgers
people, just turn on a book ....
el matador, the fighting pollo @ 87:
you are aware that since globalization, our number one export is entertainment....right???
stop being an elitist boob
chris @ 42:
Cupcakes? Wow! Insecurities? Funny, that just smacks of an insecure woman pissed because she got called out :-)
War against organized labor in an industrial society is war against the rights of people to collectively bargain for the value of their labor as factored in the operation of free market economics. Without those rights, the majority of the people have no organizational structure to represent their interests, as we have sadly seen over the last three decades.
I'm all for the writers getting a larger cut of the cash from DVD and internet sales, but I have to side with the execs on the other (more political) issues. Namely the writers demands that animation and reality shows be WGA only, and the demand to have their no-strike clause waived. I generally have a big problem with a large group of people being drafted into unions without having voted to do so. And on the other issue, there just isn't a sane employer anywhere that's going to tell an important part of the workforce that it's ok for them to not come into work if an entirely different group of employees walks out.
I could be wrong but the last thing I read implied that the studio execs were willing to bend on the monetary issues but not on the other two. And frankly if that's the case then I think you have to blame the writers themselves for their continued hardship.
Ricky Bones @ 89:
What is funny here is that the banks are getting a taxpayer funded bailout and they get to keep the real estate. They knew all along that they could incur massive losses and the Gov would rescue them. So for each home, they get the profits and they get the home. It is a sweet no risk deal for them.
Now the taxpayer won't see a tax raise. The Gov will just borrow the money and flood the market with hundreds of billions of new dollars.
So gasoline, milk and rent will double over the next few years.
Oh, and Congress is working on a new oil subsidy package to reward the oil industry for seeing record profits.
I bet Ricky approves of the government giving away hundreds of billions of dollars to corporations, just because they ask for it.
When the wealthy make bad business decisions, its the government's job to make sure they still see massive profits. And our job to pay for it.
i know though that Ricky believes that the
Ben @ 91:
In negotiations, both sides come to the table with more demands than they know they can get. Then each side gives a bit until they find common ground. You don't demand just the things you want, because you'll have to give some of them up.
Weaseldog @ 93:
True, but to me if the execs are willing to give more money and the writers are holding out demanding for the extra provisions then it makes it seem like the extras are what they're really focused on. And like I said, I just can't imagine any employer caving on the no strike clause. I mean if you were in negotiations, and as you said asking for things you knew you probably wouldn't get wouldn't you at least make them somewhere inside the realm of possibility?
JohnnyBravo @ 82:
Aw, what a little trooper.
"Chris 'n' JohnnyBravo/Sittin' in a tree..."
hear hear y'all.
If you want to cement yourselves as complete assholes, writers, then sure, punish leno for *gasp* writing.
Until then continue being obnoxious greedy jerks.
Leno seriously should give them the middle finger and leave the damn guild.
@ 86 uncle joe mccarthy - I never flipped a burger in my life, but I have plenty of respect for people who do. They're doing Real work for honest money. And if the SAG ever goes on strike, I'd couldn't be happier. That's another reason to give up TV and buy a lot of good books. Let the rich people b***h and moan, then suffer when no one is watching their crappy programming. You sir, need an education and probably a shower.
@ 95 CartoonCoyote - I disagree with the greedy writers, so I must be gay. Excellent logic. [Deleted. Please keep it civil. Site Monitor]
Jay Leno is a hero in my book. He didn't let his show come to a complete stand-still. The WGA has the mentality of "if I'm unhappy, we all have to be unhappy." Thw WGA and the SAG are a bunch of thugs. If I was an actor/writer, I wouldn't want to join either one. Way to go Jay.
None of these birdbrains can think on their feet.
Anybody remember Steve Allen?
I appreciate Letterman's sympathy for the writers. I just wish...if only his show was, you know...funny.
Putting the Jay Leno thing in perspective a bit here, why are the writers more important than everyone else on his staff? I have a couple of cousins that do lighting and sound for Ugly Betty, and they're really struggling right now and are definitely worried about being laid off. The fact is that Leno going back on the air with or without the writers is probably going to save many people their jobs. Granted that probably wasn't his main consideration, but still.
And really the whole "disciplining" him thing is a joke, the guy's got more money than he knows what to do with. The union can't touch him. The thing that could hurt him is public opinion, but I doubt most people are going to care.
The hell with the jut-jawed Republican giggle-boy and his omnipresent lapel flag.
Hey, 99.9% of television is junk anyway...so no more writer's being able to write the junk on TV that is rotting the brains of America's youth might ultimately be a good thing...less tv, more reading books!...
driven989 @ 103:
While I'll agree that there's a lot of crap on tv, I'd say that your estimation of 99.9% is a bit hyperbolic.
I've learned a lot from tv over the years. As a kid I'd catch Phineas J. Whoopee on Underdog, or Peabody and Sherman on Bullwinkle- segments that dealt with scientific and historical topics- and end up in the library to read up on those topics.
TV is a tool, the same way that books are tools. American Idol may not contribute to the advancement of thought, but neither does a Danielle Steele novel. Babies and bathwater, I guess.
Whoops, forgot to close a tag. I blame my radio for the distraction! :D
The state of network television for the most part is garbage. The networks let the advertisers and the corporations play the tune that the writers must write the lyrics for. The work is mostly middle of the road, offensive, unfunny and boring. that is why everyone was so interested when reality television came out because it gave the impression of risk and spontaneity but that too have been revealed to be worked out by executives who want conflict and emotion even if it if prearranged and false. They award destructive behavior and want to see pain. The only television worthy of reality is nature shows. The rest has be manufactured as crappy and cheap as possible. Who wants to pay writers,directors and actors tons of money to entertain you when they can tell some trailer tramp to pull her sister-in-laws hair for a couple of bucks or nothing...hmm what would a greedy businessman do? This is the end of Americas love for television, the future will be the internet and the Network executives want to control that as well. The deals have to be worked out now or anyone who works in the entertainment business (aside from the owners) will be screwed.
Weaseldog @ 33:
lol... you've got a spot reserved under someone's desk eh?
JohnnyBravo @ 98:
That's YOUR inference, not mine. [Deleted. Please keep it civil. Site Monitor]
I'm not a regular here, but a friend who is a regular sent me the URL. I'm one of the writers in question -- a writer/co-executive producer of a television show, as well as a novelist and short story writer.
King of Mean wrote:
I must correct you. The AMPTP, who are on the opposite side in this strike, are giant media corporations, not producers in the sense you seem to mean. They certainly deserve profit, but they are not producers in the sense of being a show's producer. I certainly agree that it's the people who make things who should be rewarded, and in the case of television, it's the writer who makes things. Here's how it works: The writer comes up with the idea, and sells it to a studio. If the pilot is picked up, the writer becomes the executive producer on the project. He hires everyone, essentially, including the staff writers who work on the show going forward and bring their own ideas to it. (Without new ideas, a show will stagnate.)
The writers risk everything -- and I mean real risk, that affects them personally. If a show is canceled -- and I've been there when this happens -- it's canceled that day, and all money stops at once. This will almost certainly happen at a point in the television season when it's difficult to find another writing position, as they'll all be filled, so good luck with that mortgage. Hollywood writers are pretty much the definition of capitalists -- we live with risk every day, and there's no safety net.
If, however, you are the president of Disney, and your work is considered unsatisfactory, you will be "canceled" with a $140 million severance package.
Writers assume further risk in the form of residuals. If a show isn't popular enough to be rerun, then there are no residuals. This strike is simply about moving the concept of residuals to the Internet. I won't get into all the arguments for intellectual property in modern society, residuals and royalties, copyrights and patents. I'll simply observe that even if writers suggested to the media corporations that they pay us more upfront instead of deferring our payments in the form of residuals that may never come -- well, trust me, this would hardly be met with enthusiasm.
For example, the current network residuals for the first re-run of an hour-long episode is in the neighborhood of $20,000. This sort of deferred payment comes in damned handy when you're unemployed, doing spec writing, working on your novel, and waiting for the television season to begin again -- but if there's no re-run, that money obviously never goes to the writer. That's as it should be. The studios are not going to want to move even a little of that money up as a "work for hire" payment, even in exchange for keeping all the residuals till the end of time.
You may be aware that the current Internet residual offer from the studios is $250 for unlimited use of your episode for one year. With media moving to the Internet, that's... less than satisfactory as a replacement. And that's what the strike is about: new media, and the future of how writers will work.
And in regard to Ayn Rand -- I will point out that her books earned royalties. No one said, "Here -- seven thousand bucks. If you want more, find another job! Hey, I'm PRODUCING the book! I'm laying it out, editing it, distributing it! You know how much that costs? I'm taking all the risk! If the book's a hit, I deserve all the reward!"
(Though unlike publishers, it's the writer/producer who "lays out" a television episode, and oversees the production and editing.)
A couple of commenters have suggested that if writers aren't paid enough, they should "get another job." First, all television jobs are according to the same scale, worked out in past union negotiations. You can't go somewhere else with different residual rules. Second -- I'm getting paid enough. (Don't tell my agent.) I'm in a privileged position; there are lots of writers barely making do, but I'm not one of them. And I'm middle-aged, to boot, which means that even if the WGA gets everything they're asking for, I will never make enough from new media to compensate for the money lost in this strike.
This isn't about me; it's about the future of writers.
I could say more, but I'll simply add that, for what it's worth, I've written about the strike here:
http://tightropegirl.livejournal.com/16033.html
[Flamebait-Sitemonitor]
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