Bernard Goldberg was on The O'Reilly Factor last night touting his hot new scoop in the long-running controversy over George W. Bush's military service in the Texas Air National Guard:
Until now, the controversy over the Rather/Mapes story has centered almost entirely on one issue: the legitimacy of the documents – a very important issue, indeed. But it turns out that there was another very important issue, one that goes to the very heart of what the story was about – and one that has gone virtually unnoticed. This is it: Mary Mapes knew before she put the story on the air that George W. Bush, the alleged slacker, had in fact volunteered to go to Vietnam.
Who says? The outside panel CBS brought into to get to the bottom of the so-called “Rathergate” mess says. I recently re-examined the panel’s report after a source, Deep Throat style, told me to “Go to page 130.” When I did, here’s the startling piece of information I found:
Mapes had information prior to the airing of the September 8 [2004] Segment that President Bush, while in the TexANG [Texas Air National Guard] did volunteer for service in Vietnam but was turned down in favor of more experienced pilots. For example, a flight instructor who served in the TexANG with Lieutenant Bush advised Mapes in 1999 that Lieutenant Bush “did want to go to Vietnam but others went first.” Similarly, several others advised Mapes in 1999, and again in 2004 before September 8, that Lieutenant Bush had volunteered to go to Vietnam but did not have enough flight hours to qualify.
This information, despite the fact that it has been available since the CBS report came out four years ago, has remained a secret to almost everybody both in and out of the media — one lonely fact in a 234- page report loaded with thousands of facts, and overshadowed by the controversy surrounding the documents.
There's only one problem with this: These claims were nothing new. In fact, it had been reported by the Washington Post back in 1999 -- in a story that Goldberg in fact cites in his piece. Here are the relevant grafs:
Four months before enlisting, Bush reported at Westover Air Force Base in Massachusetts to take the Air Force Officers Qualification Test. While scoring 25 percent for pilot aptitude – "about as low as you could get and be accepted," according to Martin – and 50 percent for navigator aptitude in his initial testing, he scored 95 percent on questions designed to reflect "officer quality," compared with a current-day average of 88 percent.
Among the questions Bush had to answer on his application forms was whether he wanted to go overseas. Bush checked the box that said: "do not volunteer."
Bush said in an interview that he did not recall checking the box. Two weeks later, his office provided a statement from a former, state-level Air Guard personnel officer, asserting that since Bush "was applying for a specific position with the 147th Fighter Group, it would have been inappropriate for him to have volunteered for an overseas assignment and he probably was so advised by the military personnel clerk assisting him in completing the form."
During a second interview, Bush himself raised the issue.
"Had my unit been called up, I'd have gone . . . to Vietnam," Bush said. "I was prepared to go."
But there was no chance Bush's unit would be ordered overseas. Bush says that toward the end of his training in 1970, he tried to volunteer for overseas duty, asking a commander to put his name on the list for a "Palace Alert" program, which dispatched qualified F-102 pilots in the Guard to the Europe and the Far East, occasionally to Vietnam, on three- to six-month assignments.
He was turned down on the spot. "I did [ask] – and I was told, 'You're not going,' " Bush said.
Only pilots with extensive flying time – at the outset, 1,000 hours were required – were sent overseas under the voluntary program. The Air Force, moreover, was retiring the aging F-102s and had ordered all overseas F-102 units closed down as of June 30, 1970.
In other words, if Bush actually did volunteer for Vietnam duty, he did so secure in the knowledge there was no chance he'd actually be called upon. That is, he was talking big talk, once again, knowing full well he'd never have to back it up.
This is especially so considering what followed -- namely, that Bush wound up failing to fulfill his obligations to the Texas Air National Guard, precisely because he failed to maintain even the most basic, fundamental components if his TANG pilot's status beginning in the summer of 1972.
Indeed, there is a set of facts about Bush's service that is irrefutable: Lt. Bush did refuse an order to take a required physical, and he was suspended for "failing to perform up to standards". Moreover, the sequence of events that failure set in motion eventually ensured that Bush did not fulfill the entirety of his military obligation.
(You can see the documentation of Bush's suspension from flying status in Sept. 1972 here.)
In the military-flying world, failure to take your flight exam is a big honking deal. As the Boston Globe reported at the time:
Two retired National Guard generals, in interviews yesterday, said they were surprised that Bush -- or any military pilot -- would forgo a required annual flight physical and take no apparent steps to rectify the problem and return to flying. "There is no excuse for that. Aviators just don't miss their flight physicals," said Major General Paul A. Weaver Jr., who retired in 2002 as the Pentagon's director of the Air National Guard, in an interview.
Brigadier General David L. McGinnis, a former top aide to the assistant secretary of Defense for Reserve Affairs, said in an interview that Bush's failure to remain on flying status amounts to a violation of the signed pledge by Bush that he would fly for at least five years after he completed flight school in November 1969.
"Failure to take your flight physical is like a failure to show up for duty. It is an obligation you can't blow off," McGinnis said.
What's more, Goldberg's big "scoop" was actually one of the Bush team's talking points when trying to deal with the TANG questions. On NPR's Morning Edition Feb. 23, 2004, Bush campaign chairman Marc Racicot said:
"John Kerry served his country very honorably, and we salute his service. We would never, for a moment, diminish his service to the country. At the same point in time, the President served his country very honorably too. He signed up for dangerous duty, he volunteered to go to Vietnam, uh, he wasn't selected to go, but nonetheless, served his country very well."
It was a bogus claim then, and it remains a bogus claim now. Bush may have had a hankering to go to Vietnam in 1970, as he and those lieutenants who talked to Mary Mapes may have claimed.
But by 1972-73 -- which is the time frame that's relevant here -- he couldn't even be bothered to maintain his flying status or keep up with his TANG training time requirements. That is hardly indicative of someone intent on serving in combat missions. And it completely nullifies Goldberg's claim that Bush really wanted to serve in Vietnam.



The Cheerleading Chimp used daddy's contacts to avoid combat then went AWOL. That's old news.
I guess Jr. never needs toilet paper what with Bernie's ol' willing tongue at the ready to lick Jr. clean.
n/t
Don't you know the Fox "news" motto yet?
"Don't let the facts get in the way of a good piece of propaganda."
Just like St. Ronnie. With careful shaping, and twisting and turning,
by the time the Righty-tighties are done George Bush will sound like a man who shat gold bars for breakfast
but also greasing the skids for Jebby to run later. oh goody!
another clue that this is PR for Jeb is Cheney telling us how wonderfully conciliatory dubya was, what a softie, a great guy! *spit*
to send thoughts on w's legacy to back last year sometime. I sent that his legacy would be akin to Benedict Arnolds. Then after thinking about it for a week or so I wrote to him that NO, Benedict Arnold only tried to sell one fort not the whole damn country, the Constitution, and everything it stands for.
If he couldn't fly a plane any better than he can ride a bike, he should never be in a cockpit again. The bastard couldn't even eat pretzels and watch tv at the same time. I had uncles who were pilots and these guys were smart and didicated to flying. That was their life. I wish they had been alive to see bush and give their take on him.
Say what you mean. Mean what you say. But don't say it mean.
Shrub probably learned everything he knows about flying from John McCain.
oh...wait.
I did some work for John Kerry during his run at the White House, and in talking to people, I always stressed the pilots are dedicated to flying. They love to fly. They LIVE to fly. Whether or not W was AWOL or not, it was obvious that he had no intention to go to Vietnam, because he didn't log the hours necessary to put himself in a position to fly to Dallas for a beer run, let alone fly combat or ferry missions to Europe.
It is obvious that the Bush Family had ambitions for the little prince, and set him up to be able to have plausible deniability about whether or not he was "brave" enough to go to fight a war where potential voters were serving and dying. Any other explanation just does not hold water.
you can see all the hung people you want on the Internet for free.
;)
Why, and what a mouth granny...
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
That is all Bunnypants and his crew of "never served" warmongers are.
These bastards have no clue about the real horrors of war and occupation.
"I know that there are people who do not love their fellow
man, and I hate people like that! " ~ Tom Lehrer (1928 - )
So are Bernie and Jonah related? I mean they are obviously "kindred spirits", but do they come from the same family tree?
Edit to add: OT-Dominck Dunne died. Sad. I really liked him.
I pledge allegiance to the Constitution of the United States of America, and to the republic which it established, one nation from many peoples, promising liberty and justice for all
Maybe both?
They're both A'holes, so they certainly are related.
Volunteered, schmolunteered.
..signed up to soar with Eagles. Nested with the chickens!
Mickey: "It was an epiphany. Do you know what an epipany is?"
Keoni: "NOT NOW MICKEY!"
had turkeys in his administration!
The only thing George W Bush ever volunteered for was making a cocaine and beer run.
Bushy was drunk as a hoot owl at the Olympics in Bejing. He was so drunk he had to be helped up and out of his seat by two of his SS men. Dig around and you will find the pics.
this is breaking news that is only 5 years old or what? What the F**k is your point? He still didn't fulfill his obligation.
If he wanted to go to Vietnam, he would have joined the real Air Force. It's not like there was a big frickin' mystery back then about how to get to Vietnam - join the real military.
And correct, the real story behind the story was what those memos said - that Bush disobeyed a direct order to take his flight exam. Three separate witnesses backed that up - Marian Knox, Bobby Hodges and Richard Via.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/09/15/60I...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles...
http://www.usatoday.com/news/politicselection...
He couldn't pass the required physical exam, which starting in June of 1971 included a drug test.
Thom Hartmann: Must see! The TRUE story of the Boston Tea Party
And if he'd been screwing Victor Ashe, he couldn't have passed a rectal exam without being discharged for homosexuality.
Hey Bernie, you can stop trying to shove your head up Bushes ass. He's not president anymore.
And He Can't Come Out!~
Bernie's just rehearsing for Jeb in '12...
The truth is CBS hung Rather up for target practice, they filled that panel full of Rather's enemies and Bush's allies.
From LA Times
"The material that has emerged so far shows that CBS executives worked frantically to defuse critics on the political right after the Bush story was challenged. News executives vetted potential panel appointees with Viacom's Washington lobbyists, drawing up a list that included conservatives such as Ann Coulter, Rush Limbaugh and Roger Ailes, according to internal documents."
http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/la-...
Propaganda is hard to manufacture, folks!!! Of course the 'propagandamedia' is 'protected' because we sure don't want people actually thinking............thinking about how appropriate it might be for a chickenhawk to even be pResident of the WH.
high-flying, mostly unarmed, Soviet strategic bombers.
They and their pilots were obsolete by '68.
Dang things could climb like mutherfockers. Near straight up! And FAST!
But useless in the Nam...
The biggest Bush/service story nobody EVER followed was why he declined to take a flight physical, got grounded, but never got followed up.
I believe there's a document with the question: 'Are you prepared to serve overseas' and the Chimp has ticked the 'No' box.
I do hereby volunteer for the first manned space mission to the sun---whenever it happens.
You people are my witnesses.
*updates resume*
teh stoopid... it burnz
Reason 1: So what?
Reason 2: So what?
Bush is history and the damage is already done. Talk about beating a dead horse.
...first, geedubya wanted to avoid the draft so he got his daddy to move him ahead of others on the waiting list for the TANG. When he did get a TANG assignment, he also had to go through some sort of Commissioning process...don't know if it was AF-OTS (Air Force Officer Training School) or what but when you first sign up you're asked to fill out what is affectionately known as a 'Dream Sheet'. This is where you indicate where in the US or the world you'd like to serve. If he did what I did and thought, gee, Europe would be nice, and put it down, guess what? He was, at that time, in effect volunteering for Vietnam. The reason was that in order to serve anywhere overseas you had to 'volunteer' for a world-wide assignment, and volunteering for a world-wide assignment meant that the Department of The Air Force could send you anywhere in the world that you were needed - not much call for F-102 fighter pilots in Europe, not many more in Southeast Asia, since it was a plane pretty-much exclusively used for Air Defense here in the US.
I guarantee you that if anybody had ever asked him, say in a personnel records review if he knew he had a 'volunteer statement' on file for Vietnam, the chicken-shit would have had it pulled on the spot. Fact is, my guess is that he never even bothered to have a records review because he was blowing the TANG off for his daddy's gettin' him out early so he could go do something else.
I hope the hell O'Reilly calls Rather on this cause I'll bet dollars to doughnuts that this is the source of the confusion. He never wanted to risk his boozing, cocaine-using ass in anything near where there was shooting.
What I want to know is, if Bush REALLY wanted to go to Vietnam, then why couldn't Pappy pull strings to get him there?
If he didn't have enough flight hours to get him to Vietnam, once again, why couldn't Pappy pull strings to get him more flight hours? That should not have been hard at all.
If Bush really wanted to and actually did intend to go to Vietnam his father could have pulled some heavy strings to get him there qualified or not just as easily as he did to keep him out.
If all else, Bush's father could have had little Goerge stationed in Saigon as a General Officer's aid something. Bush would have been safe and sound in a cushy armchair job and he would have obtained all of the Vietnam attendance medals just for being there. Heck he probably could have gotten a bronze star since they were handing those out like candy to.
Notice how its never mentioned that Bush "volunteered" to go around his father? No, Bush went through the chain of command knowing full well that he wasn't even remotely qualified for anything at all and that is what the military goes by. He knew full well he would never go and could shout that he "volunteered" around military personnel all day knowing that no one had any interest in him because of it.
But the Admiral maybe had more pull then h.w. at that time?
By the way, when I saw this segment last night, I went to Goldberg's site. It was sickening the way people in the comment section were thanking Goldberg, some almost praising him as if he were God.
No matter how they spin this bush looks bad. Even if you remove his father from the picture Bush's flying abilities were apparently so substandard that he couldn't even make the grade as a reserve pilot hauling cargo out Saigon. My guess is that the military knew that Bush was more of a hazard than an asset in any capacity so they left him alone and Bush knew it to.
Furthermore, even if Bush did say off hand that he volunteered for Vietnam does not equate to actually trying to do it. For example, I've mentioned to military people that I served with at the time while having some beers that I volunteered to be a Navy SEAL. Did I go and do the exam and actually try to become one? No, because that was the beer talking at the time. Bush's saying he "volunteered" for Vietnam was probably mentioned in a similar way.
And by going AWOL all the time, failure to report or reporting late, he saw to it he'd never qualify.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
will never be regarded as a hero, or buried as one. He is nothing but a drunk coke head that followed president cheney's orders to kill as many innocent people as possible. Bush's brain is deader than Kennedy.
with which I was previously unfamiliar and it explains a lot. Assuming Bush's 50% score on the navigation test correlates with his ability to find his way that would imply his entire administration was a random walk. Eight years of flipped coin backed decision making. Wow!
Hasa Diga Eebowai
Just learning what everyone else knew 10 years ago IS "breaking news" in that family.
Bush recently spoke to the football team at SMU, where his library is being built, despite a good deal of opposition to it, and he gave a pep talk where he mentioned he had been a CHEERLEADER. I am sure that they were impressed by that.
Then, he went on to say, "Go out and win this one for Yom Kippur." The man is an idiot.
For his autographed lonely copy of 'My Pet Goat'
..............his private torture library.
Yom Kippur is what I always say when I smell my breakfast kippers and pickled onions sautéing.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
3100+ words on GWB and Jimmy and Linda Allison and GWB's missing ANG year in Alabama (while working for JA).
The FR people for the most part do not read the article, they parrot the earlier posters who might have read part of it, and even those who make an attempt fail miserably at comprehending the sense of the article.
gwb had no intentions of going to vietnam. he may have had other issues to keep him from getting flight hours like maybe substance abuse.
Sigh. More ridiculousness from either children, or brain-dead old coots. I remember the Viet Nam war well. Yes, when I was in high school and early college, young men were desperate to find a way not to go to Viet Nam. When one knew they were likely to be DRAFTED (or if their daddy was a politician and they knew they couldn't be seen as a draft dodger), they joined. That way, they knew they wouldn't be drafted.
And in Bush's case, he couldn't even manage the incredible gift of enlisting and serving in a cushy stateside job. He went AWOL on that. THAT is the real scandal.
If Dubya wanted to go, there was nothing that could have stopped him. My brother volunteered for the infantry in '67 and it wasn't long before he was right in the middle of the Tet offensive, being awarded a Bronze Star and Purple Heart. Fortunate son Georgie never had to worry about being sent into the meat grinder of bodies in Southeast Asia.
That's why Ben Barnes pulled strings to get him into a Guard unit full of Congressmen's children and Dallas Cowboys.
http://www.liquiddaddy.blogspot.com/
just looking at the picture of those two scumbags turns my stomach.
Jeffy there isn't a bank I will not steal from bush. Another attempt to put a face to a COWARD with the Right Wing Hate Machine distorting Facts again. one thing I do know when the lead comes from faux Noise you know it is Twisted and Misinterpreted
I still cannot believe that this stupid son of a bitch got into the whitehouse much less into an F102.
I remember back then, the only guy's getting into the Guard were children of people with some kind of clout, because nobody wanted to be sent to 'Nam and one sure way was to join the National Guard or reserves of somekind. Therefore it was a difficult prposition to gain entrance. So it ain't much of a stretch for anyone to see whether he wanted to or not Barbara and GHWB's little boy was able to stay back in the world.
Bush and his colleagues in the Texas Air National Guard were well aware that the planes they were flying were considered obsolete by the Air Force. That is exactly why they did all their flying in obsolete planes, so that whatever hours they accumulated could plausibly be declared useless by the Air Force, thus precluding the lot of them from being sent to Vietnam.
Flying obsolete jets was key to the scam that allowed chickenhawks like George Bush to avoid serving in Vietnam, the same war he so heartily endorsed with his hollow words. The Texas Air National Guard was a carefully arranged safe-haven for cowardly right wingers like Bush.
Bring it on, Bernie.
These goofballs -- Bernie and the rest -- seem hell bent on rehabilitating the rep of the ex-President Bush. I've been mulling it all over and have decided that history will not regard the man as one of the worst leaders we've had. George W. Bush was THE worst we ever had. The only way he could be farther down the list would be if Sarah Palin were elected, in which case he would probably be second worst (or, as Keith would say, worser). And that is about as possible as a polar bear surviving in the Sahara.
"Respect for the rights of others is peace." --Benito Juarez
Everybody knows that Dumbya was constantly AWOL, snorting his cocaine and getting drunk all the time.
Check out Dumbya's huge unibrow. Hilariously ugly.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/ID/4179618/
Transcript for Feb. 8th
Guest: President George W. Bush
NBC News
updated 12:16 p.m. ET, Fri., Feb. 13, 2004
Russert: Were you favor of the war in Vietnam?
President Bush: I supported my government. I did. And would have gone had my unit been called up, by the way.
Russert: But you didn't volunteer or enlist to go.
President Bush: No, I didn't. You're right. I served. I flew fighters and enjoyed it, and provided a service to our country. In those days we had what was called "air defense command," and it was a part of the air defense command system.
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