Obama announces the end of 'an era of profound irresponsibility'
By David Neiwert Thursday Jan 08, 2009 9:45am
President-elect Barack Obama laid out his case for an economic-stimulus package this morning, warning that the current recession could "linger for years" unless Congress acts to pump historic sums of federal cash into the economy. He added that the current economic crisis is “unlike any we have seen in our lifetime.”
We start 2009 in the midst of a crisis unlike any we have seen in our lifetime - a crisis that has only deepened over the last few weeks. Nearly two million jobs have now been lost, and on Friday we are likely to learn that we lost more jobs last year than at any time since World War II. Just in the past year, another 2.8 million Americans who want and need full-time work have had to settle for part-time jobs. Manufacturing has hit a twenty-eight year low. Many businesses cannot borrow or make payroll. Many families cannot pay their bills or their mortgage. Many workers are watching their life savings disappear. And many, many Americans are both anxious and uncertain of what the future will hold.
I don't believe it's too late to change course, but it will be if we don't take dramatic action as soon as possible. If nothing is done, this recession could linger for years. The unemployment rate could reach double digits. Our economy could fall $1 trillion short of its full capacity, which translates into more than $12,000 in lost income for a family of four. We could lose a generation of potential and promise, as more young Americans are forced to forgo dreams of college or the chance to train for the jobs of the future. And our nation could lose the competitive edge that has served as a foundation for our strength and standing in the world.
And he made clear he understands how we got here:
This crisis did not happen solely by some accident of history or normal turn of the business cycle, and we won't get out of it by simply waiting for a better day to come, or relying on the worn-out dogmas of the past. We arrived at this point due to an era of profound irresponsibility that stretched from corporate boardrooms to the halls of power in Washington, DC. For years, too many Wall Street executives made imprudent and dangerous decisions, seeking profits with too little regard for risk, too little regulatory scrutiny, and too little accountability. Banks made loans without concern for whether borrowers could repay them, and some borrowers took advantage of cheap credit to take on debt they couldn't afford. Politicians spent taxpayer money without wisdom or discipline, and too often focused on scoring political points instead of the problems they were sent here to solve. The result has been a devastating loss of trust and confidence in our economy, our financial markets, and our government.
Expect Republicans to squawk at talk like this. But the fact is that conservative governance got us into this mess. Obama (and the rest of us) are betting that progressive governance will get us out.
Susie Madrak:
Obviously, this isn't how I would handle it.
I'd say to the American people, "Look, I'm done pretending that these evil Republican bastards and their greedy, short-sighted economic policies haven't put us in this deep economic ditch. They want tax cuts to please their base, but they're not getting them BECAUSE WE ALREADY KNOW THEY WON'T WORK.
"What will work is what I've proposed, and it's up to you, the people, to call your congress critters and senators to tell them pointblank: they either support our massive stimulus package, or you and your neighbors will be storming their homes and offices with pitchforks and torches. I don't know about you, but I'm sick and tired of treating the ravings of these mendacious excuses for human beings as reality, and you should be, too.
"We didn't do our job, any of us. If we had, we wouldn't be in this mess. In the name of bipartisanship, we actually treated their destructive ideas as if they had value. Boy, were we wrong! Well, no more Mr. Nice Guy. Time to tell these Republican maroons to get the hell out of the way, or they can go back to the free market to find out what they're really worth.
"Thank you, and may God bless the countless victims of this Republican greed."
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Let me see if I understand this. The economy is in the toilet because of overspending and over borrowing, so the way to fix it is to overspend and over borrow? That isn't going to fix it.
The problem is, they are borrowing the money from China, in order to purchase Chinese goods, with money borrowed from China. Make any sense? No, it does not.
This isn't an American recession. This is global. No amount of multi-trillion dollar funny money will change it. Industry wanted this. Why? Don't know. Maybe somebody should ask the greedy bastards why.
The recession will end, when the world's corporations and rich say so. Not before, regardless what any government does. This was all planned by a group of people. There is no way that one day in the fall, all the investors and banks said, "times up...damn...take the money, fear, fear, fear" Just. Not. Plausible.
I'm not sure why Industry want the economy to collapse...but it sure seems like they engineered this collapse...
It was definitely engineered. By who is the question. Or is it whom? Even the great Depression was engineered, so, before any government can "fix" the problem, they have to figure out who did it and why. Unless they already know.
Wanna know why? Go read "Shock Doctrine" by Naomi Klein, and it will ALL become clear.
The fact is that we are being set up for the rise of a neofascist corporate state.
but it is a matter of degree in the facts on the ground.
I must get that book I am just so cash strapped.
Nowhere in The Shock Doctrine does it show that the methods for privatizing a country include pumping money into that nation's economy. This situation is not part of that neoliberal policy.
This is an actual screw up on the part of financial elements - bankers, stock market and investment houses - that created and sold mis-valued debts all around the world. This was not created by the same elements of Friedmanism that has gone after nations from Chile to Russia.
If pumping money into the economy was one of their methods, then FDR used Friedmanism long before Friedman even got through school.
This is KEYNESIAN economics - the very antithesis of Friedmanism: Government as the solution, not as the problem. And no single - or even multiple - actor here has anything close to the ability to solve this, except the government. Every government in Europe and Asia is doing the same thing - including the Russians and the Chinese. So you are suggesting that all of the governments in the world are in cahoots? It would certainly be the first time THAT ever happened.
.
The tax rebates or breaks for the middle class are a nice idea, but only if we save them or reduce our debt and do not consume, which would sabotage the recovery plan.
But what if our state cannot afford to pay its citizens their tax refunds this year?
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2009/01...
Do the two balance each other out or are the priorities mixed up?
Federal governments are all going to toss trillions into "infastructure" or basically sending the money to states to deal with. These states are virtually bankrupt. They aren't going to spend a nickel without helping their own coffers, so, then what?
In Canada, the rich provinces are supposed to pay more than the poor to the Fed, who returns the payments to the poorest provinces. Those provinces use it as their own cash, not to start new programs to jump start the economy.
We run big deficits until...what?
People get more credit cards to buy more shit made abroad?
Banks miraculously get good, clean balance sheets?
A strong, vibrant middle class rises from the ashes?
I know, I know. Spend first. Think real carefuilly later...after the economic crisis is safely behind us.
Makes absolutely no sense, does it? "tighten your belts, citizens" while we spend like drunken sailors on leave.
If shit don't start gettin better...an uprising is inevitable.
We'll be thrown in jail at best...shot in the head at worst...
If they want everyone but them to be poor, what good is that gonna do anyone?
Isn't that feudalism?
Well...Obama can't really say what we all would say...he's gotta at least attempt to be a bit diplomatic. Right?
It will take an enormous amount of political capital to get to the fundamental truth of the matter, to speak of it and do something about it.
Both 'Parties' are shills for the same Corporate Masters.
Notice how cozy Obama was yesterday to the ex-Presidents Bush 41, Clinton, and Bush 43?
Notice how far he was from Carter?
This frigging fraud will further us down the path of self-destruction.
This nation and economy will utterly implode carry trillions in deficits as he claims, borrowing debt to maintain this facade, and spending trillions on a war machine empire building project that will end up killing more millions.
So now "this frigging fraud" Obama loves the Bush's and hates Carter according to you and the voices that torment you all day?
This terrible Depression was absolutely caused by the last 8 years of Reslug GREED and LIES.
Try at least 28, since saint ronnie took us down his Reaganomics ride of fun and games.
I would repace the word Republican in your first sentence with the word Rich.
I made it Republicrat, but they are just shills for the Fat Cats.
You can't point fingers at EITHER party without the aid of each other. This isn't about JUST Republican years. This didn't happen just in the last 8 years. This is a long time coming.
"Our government does not have any wealth to create jobs"
Think about it. Our government does not really make anything, they take the money and give it to the private sector in the hopes the private sector will create jobs. It hasn't worked so far.
The government cannot directly create jobs except in the government services (redundant unproductive and costly positions like Micheal Chertoff).
Another one is this phallacy about the Prez/Prime Minister/King/Whatever having the final say, and making others do their bidding. It doesn't work that way in Washington or anywhere else. The Prez, or whomever, has advisors who basically decide what is going to happen. Heck even in an election campaign, none of those words are actually from the person running. It's someone else's.
But it was an article from Chrysler's parent company speculating that Chrysler may fail even now that they have received the money. A live example of what you are saying, throwing good money for bad and taking it from the basic programs, like un-employment funds, that might keep people from rioting for another month or two.
perhaps since the repigs couldnt destroy social security with thier wall street scam maby this money for the jobs works program will be the straw that breaks the social security system and medicare ,
talks a good talk but there is a fundamental fallacy.
He is a Fat Cat and he doesn't want government, which should be we the people, telling him anything.
The truth of the matter is unfortunately, that government is hijacked by the Fat Cats, it just isn't the Fat Cats that Schiff runs with. If they were he would change his tune.
I listen to Schiff only to point, but I am never on his bus.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-CEsJjWDhg
I think one thing that can be taken from his warnings are the need for greater self-sufficiency. Both of us are in agreement that the government is poorly managed and could really blow it. There is too much reliance on the system and an mis-under-estimation of how stupid (or criminal) the idiots can be.
...should appoint Schiff to head up the SEC.
Find someone who believes in Government as Public Service.
Schiff is of the Ron Paul type of crap that got us here.
and Dennis Kucinich were two of few congress memebers that voted against all versions of the bail out.
They cannot be all wrong. They would not have spent a dime on this crisis because they know we don't have any money.
The damage is done Alice. The economy is collapsing and it will transform into something else. No amount of money can stop it.
but for different reasons.
We are pouring an endless amount of money into the Fat Cat Crooks bottomless pit.
Ron Paul says no because he doesn't want ANY government.
Kucinich says no because he doesn't want government by and for the Fat Cats.
Just a constitutional one. Something we all should want.
there fixed it.
Constitution in theory.
...got us here?
congress has very few libertarians...Dems and Repubs got us here.
If anything, having more libertarians would have brought collapse faster than it did.
If only Rand and Strauss had stayed home, but noooo... they had to move over here, enjoy the fruits of the stable American society brought forth in part by American organized labor, so that they could sit down on their entitled asses coming out with their selfish pseudo-theories and bitch endlessly about how the poor people back in the ol' country took their richy rich families toys away.
Anti regulation which they all like.
The term 'libertarian' sounds good except what it means is no government.
They want the Fat Cats to be able to run amuck as they please.
In that sense there are more similarities than differences between the 'Libertarians' meaning of the Right and Republicrats.
Ron Paul gets off the bus when it comes to bailing the Fat Cats out.
I like him for that. I like him on civil liberties. But not much else.
I am leftist, I like Chomsky who describes himself as an anarchist libertarian socialist.
There is however, a big difference between the 'libertarian' on the left and the 'libertarian' on the right.
It comes down to how you view authority.
President-elect Obama's prescription is doomed from the start. He is nothing but a liar.
http://market-ticker.org/archives/717-Obamas-...
...the evil and retarded President who left us this gigantic pile of shit, not the new guy.
for Obama to break out the Bush approved signing statement to strip out the tax cuts for the rich in the bill. For once an excellent use of an unconstitutional act.
WHat is you solution?
massive military cutbacks? ...Obama? ...anyone?
the defense industries are one of the few manufacturing bases left in this country.
yeah, because continuing on the SAME path is going to help.
Everyone wants this ideal free world with democracy and rights but the reality is if you make good decisions you are successful. If you make bad, you aren't. That isn't happening because governments won't let it.
You borrowed too much to buy stuff. Borrowing massive amounts to buy more, will not solve it.
Now is the time for the world's leaders to actually come together and think a way out of this. Either write off all the debts, and let those sinking companies completely sink, or continue at the same rate which does nothing.
I can't pay my mortgage, I certainly can't get another loan to pay my mortgage. It's ludicrous.
bloated 'defense' budget in half, or less.
Bring all of the troops home.
Nationalize the military and end private outsourcing.
Nationalize the banking system in its entirety.
Nationalize the health care system.
Institute a mandatory 2 year National Service/peacetime draft.
End aggressive wars.
Re regulate Wall Street.
Let the failing companies fail and be replaced with someone else. Short term pain. It's unavoidable. If you suck at being a mechanic, you aren't going to be one very long. Same should go for these rich tycoons.
when you nationalize.
As in the case of the banks, private military outsourcing et al.
There is going to be plenty of pain.
The path that we are trying to maintain with the Obama program as it appears to me, is the same path that led us to where we are.
I think you were saying that.
Now I think some of things may happen but not overnight. One thing at a time for now. Letting more companies fail though would only make things worse CC.
Maybe in the short term it would, but long term? These failing companies will still be failing as their CEOs keep sucking the profits out of the system. That's the problem.
this wouldbe a start.
http://www.consortiumnews.com/2009/010709a.html
Long overdue.
here's another one...
Legalize/decriminalize hemp and marijuana...regulate it, tax the shit out of it.
Food can be made from the seeds, as can fuel, paper, clothing, particle board for construction.
It's an ideal plant...you can make all kinda useful stuff out of it, and it gets ya high.
Anyone with me?
in some ethic cleansing in washington D.C.
I want my planet back.
in Washington is what is needed.
although the Chinese may be game.
Ethnic cleansing?!?! WTF?
Surely you don't mean that.
Maybe you mean a mass cleanup project in DC to start, to rid the Capitol of all corruption maybe?
Because if you REALLY meant ethnic cleansing...then that's pretty FUBAR
ethnic.
My brain put a damn extra letter in that word...
ah geeez.
to err is human.
To repeat the error a billion times in one second you need a computer.
Ethic cleansing in Washington is very much needed.
I knew I'd get someone w/ that one...sorry libinmo!
wrong as hell...but funny, nonetheless.
Tip o' the hat to ye milquetoast.
...all in fun...
...serious about ethic cleansing though
No harm done I say..
I'd rather colonize the ocean floor first. There's lots of wealth down there, but would probably involve international treaties and coopertion along the lines of our current American/Russian space station, but even more multinational.
It would be practice for eventually colonizing planets.
And if there has to be a rescue you don't have to go as far.
Then onward to Mars!
mars!
;)
Screw all y'all...I'm Venus Bound!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7_YNTQmtGg
take plenty of Sunblock 5000
is to figure out what the recovered economy will look like.
It sure as hell isn't going to look like the economy 1946-2008.
My thoughts exactly!
This was intended to be a reply to Ron's question.
OK. We've arrived at the end of an "era of profound irresponsibility", but we're not going to hold those responsible to account so that it can just as easily happen all over again in the future. Trust me, we will see many of the same players in a future Republican administration unless, for example, they have a criminal record.
We on the left should drop "conservative" from our vocabularies. "Conservative" is an innocuous word. "Christian" is an innocuous word. Calling radical Republicans conservatives is the same as calling Bible fundamentalists Christians. And it's a huge rhetorical mistake. These criminals are not conservative. What are they conserving? They are greedy radical Republicans.
They're not even republicans...they're fascists.
calling them assholes for a while now
That works too!
It may've been a long time coming, but the Democrats haven't been in power in Congress since 1994, until 2006. Except for a few years here and there, since Truman most of the presidents have been Republican. Republicans are the ones that say less oversight, less regulations and trickle-down will fix the economy.
The government can't do anything but either borrow and spend or tax and spend. It's essentially the biggest non-profit organization around. But they give out lucrative contracts, especially to armament manufacturers.
They money they give out they receive much back in the form of income, payroll and corporate taxes, if the latter would only pay their fair share.
And local Democrats, when involved, are primarily defending their own major employer so as not to risk jobs, even if that employer is someone like Walmart.
Trickle down economics for the last 28 years since Reagan... before that, 7000 years of economics were ignored in favor of this "voodoo economics" to borrow a phrase from GHW Bush who correctly labeled it as such. But now we have a whole generation of people that think that the Republican "free - market" is the only way for capitalism...
Free markets never existed and never will. Governments create markets.
And Henry Ford ( and Theodore Roosevelt) had it right: that without a living Wage, people are not able to afford goods and services --- which at this point in time drives the American Economy.
Rebuilding our crumbling infrastructure would be a good start to put people to work and restore our economy.
So there is who is responsible. Where are the arrest warrants? Where is the "stop payment" on the bail outs? Where is the accountability that tax payers are always reminded of? When do the trials begin? Let's see some real honest-ta-goodness change instead of fancy speeches and selections of the same powerbase from Washington to run your cabinet. I wouldn't thank anyone for this man's job. Obviously, from his speeches, he is not going to be allowed to bring about any type of justice. THAT is what would restore confidence.
don't expect it to happen very fast.
And we forget...Obama's a poker player...you don't want to tip your hand early right?
Maybe...he's waiting for right time to drop the smack down on those responsible.
maybe.
if he doesn't, and damn I hope he does, nobody else on the globe will because everyone follows the US lead.
The US bailed out it's banks with taxpayer's dough, so did my country. The US bailed out the auto industry. So did my country. If the US continues to borrow and spend like there is no tomorrow, so will my country.
Transferring federal funds to state and local government is LONG overdue, BUT, these smaller government agencies are all basically bankrupt. They are not going to spend money on roads and infastructure. They don't have it. If given money, they will pay their debts.
Even paying off debt frees up existing revenue for the other projects. Cities and states are not going to hoard their revenues.
Does your state and local governments not have their own programs to run though, like welfare? That is how it works here, so if there is a shortfall, and money comes from the feds, they use it in their own existing programs first.
Not to mention reading about all their little pet projects their own wanker politicians are wanting from this federal money.
"stretched from corporate boardrooms to the halls of power in Washington"
and Obama's Treasury secretary, former Goldman Sachs CEO's.
A "whole new approach", "trading old habits".
Journalism as well. Our media has allowed us to go uninformed into this mess and disaster of affairs. We all need to work to be more responsible when it comes to journalism and information.
one man's 'era of profound irresponsibility' is another's 3-decade-long payday.
and the only reason the ruling class now deems this the 'era of profound irresponsibility' is out of fear that the people (us) are on to their devious schemes. in a wallersteinian understanding, today's troubles are a direct result of a slow evolution in the core/periphery/semiperiphery. global capital couldn't give 2 honking shits about america, nor americans. they simply only care about their capital. but, with the entire world economy teetering, and the engine of the economy--american consumer spending--drying up, they need to reassure the people (us) that everything is going to be alright.
don't be fooled. any proposal coming from the ruling class will just be a different play on the same theme where the uber-rich control everything and the people (us) are left to fight over the scraps.
i am heartened that obama is rightfully pointing to the 'era of profound irresponsibility', but i would be in the market for some florida swampland if i believed that we aren't going to switch one irresponsible system for another. And I am sure summers, geithner and rubin will make this a certainty.
Why is that so difficult for the power brokers to understand? But wait, they do understand it. They are stealing the earnings of ours, and our childrens, and our childrens children. We need to rise up alright, but not just at the R's, but the D's as well. Although they seem to be the opposite side of the same coin, a false left-right paradigm.
... did he not?
are you throwing jm keynes under the bus?
http://endtheecho.files.wordpress.com/2008/01...
There isn't a big industrial base here to take off. What kind of jobs can a service sector economy create? "Would you like fries with that?"
Paper or Plastic?
French or liberty?
boxers or briefs?
Panties.
Burlap sack or wooden barrel?
?
Beat ya to that one fastfeat!
Check upthread! };p>
see link, though
(that is, if u like)
They only hire illegals.
correct, our industrial base was sacrificed for ruling class profit. granted.
but, mass infrastructure projects and a possible green-economy could subsitute for it. and those would need to be jump-started thru a govt cash-hose.
(and we can save money by halving the pentagon's budget, tax the rich til they bleed, etc.)
In 1946, Keynes still declared eugenics "the most important, significant and, I would add, genuine branch of sociology which exists."
Also advacated one world bank and one world currency.
the eugenics quote--although embarrassing for keynes (now)--is completely beside the point.
i am not the biggest keynes fan, but it is hard to dispute that the era of keynsianism was far more egalitarian than the current ruling neoliberalism. and the crux of that was the idea that in times of recession/depression the only way to climb out of the whole was thru economic stimulus, and when banks/consumers/industry stop spending, it is up to the state to stimulate, thus spend.
[see moody's chart on effectiveness of spending]
[and, yes, i know i have provided a coloring book version of keynes' ideas)
Is he that naive to think our corrupt Congress and greedy Wall Street will voluntarily change?
Geez.
the next ticking time bomb is commercial real estate. i see it here in the metro i live in. some of these strip malls are losing medium size anchors hurting the symbiotic nature of the smaller businesses. the
surrounding residential real estate foreclosure rate(s) is hurting the neighborhood commercial property.
in this metro it's been recently reported that 50% of the residential mortgages are underwater/upside down. it was also said that one in seven homeowners have foreclosed or in the process. commercial property like the residential property mortgages were repackaged for the financial markets. now when a homeowner even a building owner wants to refinance it's virtually impossible. the mortgage owners are NOT a single entity. so negotiating is impossible. personally there is plenty of blame to go around but i blame the likes of wall street and the sec(bush administration). i believe this is another high end sophisticated financial scheme that has a lot of players from greenspan to AIG.
the porn industry is also asking for a bailout. They're next!
What's next? Liquor and beer companies asking for tax money?
Drug dealers?
Um...no...they can't have any!
the liquor and beer companies are already basically a monopoly assisted by the government daily......and the big Pharma too....oh, you mean the OTHER drug dealers. Sorry.
Might as well bail out Hustler. At least they give better images of screwing in comparison to what politicians do to taxpayers!
when a person caint even afford to cuff his carrot, lol
Truly...a sad state of affairs when one can't afford to..."flog the bishop"..
"Whenever I see a monk's ass I just grab it,"
Said a mildly amorous abbott
"It's vastly more fun to make it with a nun
But harder to get into the habit."
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f156/Helena...
The porn industry is doing it tongue in cheek
The just didn't specify which set of cheeks.
No one wants to shop in or move into half-vacant strip malls, office complexes, or condo complexes. At least not pay for them--vacancies for vagrants only.
So they can qualify for the bailout.
They don't even have to change their content.
The porn industry wants a part of the bailout too, sometimes... you just can't make this shit up:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28545081/
It is clear from the nature of the corrupt-to-the-core duopoly that controls the U.S. under the guise of democracy, that BO is deeply beholden to the fat-cat corporate criminals and the (mostly R-party, but a sizable number of D-party collaborators, including Pelosi, Feinstein, Reid) political crime family. Thus, his cabinet choices, and highly nuanced speeches are inherently compromised.
Indeed, BO (and the rest of the soulless, conscience-deprived bunch, except Carter) stood noticeably apart from JC in that ignoble gathering. I will not exonerate Bill Clinton from his many dubious associations and actions aimed at the poor, and engendering or propagating endless lawless actions worldwide. Only JC and (for the moment untested) BO may deserve a measure of respect from humanity. As for the mass-murdering simian in the bunch- there is no punishment one can think of that would be appropriate for his immeasurable crimes.
There is some amazing irony and justice in the fact that while America has gotten away with ghastly crimes against humanity from its inception, and its criminals and imbeciles have gone unpunished and continued their hideously pious pronouncements, a deeply interconnected world is eventually reaching the point where America's crimes are finally coming back to haunt it. Global warming, environmental destruction, runaway poverty, and (one hopes) collective banding together of oppressed and exploited nations against the ghastly, blessed behemoth- all these are beginning to make inroads inside America's comfortable mansion. In India, this has long been pronounced as the Karmic principle, and there is nothing mighty enough to overcome it.
Right now, for progressives and caring people, there is reason for special vigilance, because the right-wing reptiles are already out in droves trying to inject venom, lies and all manner of hatred on a mass scale. Coultergeist is on TV hawking her latest bile; I saw a picture/clip of the loathsome Tom Delay trying to resurrect Terry Schiavo; Loofah O-Reilly and Oxycontin-Man are screaming incoherently with murderous ferocity. These lunatics are all very much out there, and sadly, there is little hope of any redemption from the D-party.
Hence, short of a major upheaval, this country likely is doomed. On the bright side- the downfall of an evil enterprise usually holds the promise of something better. History tells us it is possible.
Difecit spending is a problem, but as a % of GDP we are far from record levels (ww2) and about equivalent to late 80s.
I have read differently, so I would be interested on seeing the data.
here is something that provides some context.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:US_Federal_Debt(gross).JPG
i aint saying were ok, but i think some of the doom and gloom is overstated.
to that chart.
Wiki is less to be believed than anyone.
See below.
very true
democracy in factual information doesn't work all that well...
is more like it.
http://zfacts.com/p/318.html
roughly the same numbers
interesting read.
bush to do anything.
I do agree with Matt E though...the economy's in the shitter...sure...but it ain't as bad as the media says it is.
I hope.
those on fixed incomes and those that have lost their jobs. Also those that have no health insurance and I could go on and on.
point made...
Guess I'm just not quite seeing the effects as much, down here in tourist land...we're pretty busy...so far.
i think it is worse, personally
the media still needs us to be good consumers
We're all gonna know soon enough.
that's it. i believe it is worse than people believe and/or want to believe. this is an ongoing deal. many more variables can come into play. they want us to spend to bring us out. it's not going to happen anytime soon. residential and commercial property foreclosures......and gasoline could rebound within a year look out.
so many books that you can hardly believe anything you read.
Both different eras though Matt. In the late 80's we were just getting into the tech boom. In WW2, there was a manufacturing boom. Both have been taken away from North America. We are left with a service economy. Without some kind of manufacturing, there won't be a recovery, and manufacturing seems to be leaving faster than it's being imported. Is it just wages? I don't know. Shouldn't be a factor. Wages have been stagnant for quite a few years now, barely keeping up with inflation. Maybe it has something to do with foreign nations having so much money loaned to governments that they aren't interested in investing in manufacturing jobs here.
and whats up with the new snuff phorn movie they say is going under because of running out of funds! the films called chokeing the chicken ,
Tarzan got arrested the other day by Child Protective Services for spanking his monkey.
sometimes i wonder if this really is due to our relationship with china/japan. our financial arrangement that knits our economy with economies of china/japan. asian countries run huge export surpluses with the u.s. this allows the u.s. to run a huge budget defecit without having to raise taxes or interest rates and to run a huge trade deficits without depreciating currency.
is going to change dramatically.
They will stop lending us money because it will be clear that we are not, that we cannot pay them back.
There will be a run on the dollar, its value will plummet.
We will be able to buy their goods, but the cost, to us, will go way up.
At that point the apparent wages between a Chinese and an American worker will begin to equalize.
It will be very painful for us.
'We arrived at this point due to an era of profound irresponsibility that stretched from corporate boardrooms to the halls of power in Washington, DC.'
In that one sentence he not only summed up the Bush Administration, but also kicked them squarely in their teeth.
I stood up, heehawed, and said, "Preach it baby!!". Everybody looked and some even rolled their eyes, but I didn't care. It is so nice to hear a REAL President of The United States speak. I had gotten so used to hearing everything glossed over and prettied up by Bush and his cronies, it was DAMN refreshing to hear the truth and that President Obama recognized it before the American People. As bad as the shape our country, on every level, is in right now and will get much worse...I actually feel hopeful. Oh yes, the Republicans certainly will have something to say about it...cuz THEY GOT SERVED.
God's speed and protection President Obama.
unstated yet inferred is that the statement also included clinton, bush 1, and reagan...
bush is not alone in bringing us here, just sayin'
Ok....but Bush the lesser gets most of the blame.
the bill og goods to repeal Glass-Steagal...
Summers and Rubin, helpin out their buddy Phil Gramm, led/push the Clenis into signing it...
to actually rebuke the Pukes for their sins--usually 'bad faith,' a common GOPuke failing--the Pukes got their underoos all in a bunch and then ass-raped the next big deal to come along, just because they could...
Of course, the Pukes are gonna obstruuct any Obama/Dim agenda because the only they re-gain power in '10 or '12 is if Obama and th Dims fail to successfully address the reeking piles of political shit left behind in the bed by the Busheviks.
Being critical of them only gives 'em cover...
I mean, we've established some very crude, basic facts about what has already happened, but there really isn't much conversation about the details of what needs to be done. We can accept Obama's plan at face value, certainly, but what of the alternatives? Is government stimulus to be distributed via subsidies? Which industries should get the help, and which should get the axe because they are considered wasteful? Some form of regulation must be instituted, but what sort of regulation? Would nationalizing the financial industry prevent a similar recession or cause another one? Universal health-care is good, but how is it going to be implemented, if it is? Should we try to primarily minimize unemployment, or maximize GDP?
Our policies must also be structured carefully to minimize incentives and capabilities of business and political leaders to squander funds, conceal corruption, and escape responsibility. Currently, the collective agreement is more primitive: that our massively-dysfunctional government must spend lots of money. Implicit is the ability to make good decisions with that money and avoid corrupting Washington further with the ability to choose the economy's winners and losers.
With the state of our politics as it is (Democrats being practically unable to pass a bill without Republican consent, along with Democratic culpability in Republican crimes), it's very risky to trust our government with more power. The reaction to the economic crisis is, more or less, the economic version of the PATRIOT ACT. Even if Obama's administration uses it's new power responsibly, it's power is reserved by all future administrations, unless specifically relinquished.
I fully expect to hear (and hope I do not) echoes of the War in Iraq. Perhaps we'll call the current crisis the War on Greed--War on Poverty already being taken (and we're not winning that one either, as of late).
was the last time Bush spoke like this? Oh yeah, NEVER.
I wish Barack and all of us all the luck in the world.
If this mess has been really engineered by the "powers that be" it is the grandest, most complex, goofy Rube Goldberg contraption ever that is missing something. Reality maybe? Even the builders can't seem to exactly figure it out. No one knows what ball will drop exactly where or how far and then down go's GM and up pops Bernnie Madoff. Intelligence and wisdom are not requirements for those who ascend to power and wealth. But various combination's of greed, stupidity, delusion, entitlement, ego, ambition, and criminality are common attributes. More than likely the whole problem is due to simple money grubbing and foolishness rather than some intricate design. An engineered plan would require extreme competence and cohesion over long periods of time by all parties involved. Now just take a look around at our own government and big business leaders over the past 10 years or so. Now look at the assorted leadership in the rest of the world. This is largely "Good Job Brownie" kind of management on a global scale. That and various incredible criminal adventures. It's not a plan by "new world order" doing all the damage it's the new world cluster f###.
Susie Madrak that was great and is exactly what needs to be said and done . Bravo !
Id suggest taking a look at the guy who saw this coming: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9h2x7R8pxUs
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