Harry Reid puts public option in the bill with 'opt out' provision for states. Kicks Republicans to the curb
By John Amato Monday Oct 26, 2009 2:00pm
Harry Reid held a press conference earlier today and said he's including a "public option" in the Senate bill that will have a states "opt out" provision, which means that all the states will have to stay in the bill until 2014 and then have the opportunity to opt out of it.
Frankly I'm shocked that he stood up to the White House on the public option and said no to President Olympia Snowe. Remember when all the Chuck Todds of the pundit class said that the public option was dead and liberals supported it because conservatives didn't? Wrong again.
Obviously, Reid talked to the Democratic senators and feels like he has the votes, or I didn't think he would have said what he did.
Senate Majority Leader Reid confirmed this afternoon he would include a public option in the overhaul bill that allows states to opt out if they choose. Reid said he plans to send an overhaul proposal to CBO today.
He said he is not asking CBO to score a trigger alternative, one supported by Sen. Olympia Snowe, R-Maine, but added that the bill will include a version of a co-op.
Robert Gibbs from the White House applauds Reid via email:
"The President congratulates Senator Reid and Chairmen Baucus and Dodd for their hard work on health insurance reform. Thanks to their efforts, we’re closer than we’ve ever been to solving this decades-old problem. And while much work remains, the President is pleased that at the progress that Congress has made. He’s also pleased that the Senate has decided to include a public option for health coverage, in this case with an allowance for states to opt out. As he said to Congress and the nation in September, he supports the public option because it has the potential to play an essential role in holding insurance companies accountable through choice and competition."
I agree with mcjoan at Daily Kos when she says:
Everyone is on the same page moving forward, meaning that we're that much closer to having meaningful, comprehensive healthcare reform pass this year.
There is much to still discuss and learn about the merging bills, but I think it's a positive step.
Steve Benen has a nice roundup, and found a statement from Max Baucus:
Perhaps more interesting was the reaction from Senate Finance Committee Chairman Max Baucus (D-Mont.), who has been a public option detractor.
"It is time to make our system work better for patients and providers, for small business owners and for our economy. It is time for health care reform. For more than a year, we've been working to meet the goals of reducing the growth of health care costs, improving quality and efficiency and expanding coverage. There are a tremendous number of complicated issues that go into reform and the public option is certainly one of them. I included a public option in the health reform blueprint I released nearly one year ago, and continue to support any provision, including a public option, that will ensure choice and competition and get the 60 votes needed to pass the Senate. Success should be our threshold and I am going to fight hard for the 60 votes we need to meet that goal this year."
What's fascinating about this is that Baucus was reportedly fighting tooth and nail to keep the public option out of the merged bill. This statement suggests he's on board with Reid's bill, and almost seems to be trying to take some credit for it.
I know there are a lot of questions about the bill and we haven't seen it yet, but the fact the Reid put some form of the public option without a trigger is huge and I didn't expect it from him.
Americans United wrote this about Harry Reid:
Senator Reid's announcement that the Senate health care bill will include a public health insurance option, shows that he has refused to buckle in the face of withering pressure from the big insurance companies and sided instead with everyday health care consumers.
HCAN released their statement.
Today, you stood up and delivered the kind of leadership America needs in the health care fight. You put a public health insurance option in the Senate bill, something the vast majority of Americans support.1
For your leadership, you deserve our thanks.
The Republicans' response is pure comedy gold. They called Harry a "partisan bully." '
A primary reason Harry Reid is one of the most endangered incumbents facing re-election in either party next year is due to the fact that he is viewed by many of his constituents as a partisan bully," said Brian Walsh, NRSC Communications Director.
The idiot known as Michael Steele says he's "the cow on the tracks."
Josh Marshall has a good take on the news. So What Is the 'Opt-Out' Compromise?
Howard Fineman sounded like a blogger when he wrote this about President Obama's obsession with Mount Snowe:
But the pursuit of Snowe is pretty close to obsessive, which is not a good thing either for Democrats or for the prospects of health-care reform worthy of the name. First, Snowe's exaggerated prominence is both the result and symbol of Obama's quixotic and ultimately time-wasting pursuit of "bipartisanship." In case the White House hasn't noticed, Republicans in Congress are engaged in what amounts to a sitdown strike. They don't like anything about Obama or his policies; they have no interest in seeing him succeed. Despite the occasional protestation to the contrary, the GOP has no intention of helping him pass any legislation. Snowe may very well end up voting for whatever she and Democrats craft, but that won't make the outcome bipartisan any more than dancing shoes made Tom DeLay Fred Astaire.
--
Worse, the pursuit of Snowe isn't uniting Democrats; it is dividing them. Democrats who haven't been in the room with her as she bargains with the leadership bristle at her role, even as they personally like and admire her. She remains deeply skeptical of a publicly financed alternative to private insurance, in good part because of what she sees as the failure of Maine's version of the idea—and yet some form of a public option is favored not only by most Democrats in Congress but by most of the American people. If Obama and the Democrats really want such a plan, they may as well try to get tough. For inspiration, the president might consider a Longfellow aphorism. "In this world," the poet wrote, "a man must either be an anvil or a hammer."
More coming....
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Harry Reid did this? Man, they finally dropped!
writhing in self-induced pain and dying from self-inflicted wounds but I even doubt that at this point.
Wow, Reid isn't as big of a shill as I thought. Sometimes Washington CAN surprise.
I'll wait until after the vote to say. Regardless here we go with it and we don't have a way to pay for it.
The argument of ending the war would pay for healthcare is total BS, we were and still are deficit spending our way though the war. Recall Senator Stark's "how are you going to pay for it" speech to the GOP? What happened to that question?
Harry Reid has a long way to go to make amends for his many years of passive aggression. I think he simply pulled this shit because he's chasing the blowing wind and knows he is free falling in Nevada.
...but I'd be interested to see any State try to opt-out in 2014, if half their citizens are already on the program.
Most of the states that really need the public option are the very ones that would do the opt-out if they could get away with it. Just look at all of the legislation that is sitting in a bunch of red-state dockets to opt-out of anything to do with helping to pay for healthcare for people.
if this is like any of his other promises, we're fucked.
Study the bill carefully.
When I see it, I will decide for myself who got kicked.
They're enjoying their
Kool-aidchampagne!.
...and nobody saw that? I don't get it. It happened right at the 00:05 mark. I watched it several times and either he said it on purpose or it was "freudian slip", but he clearly said it. Did you see his face after he said it? The dude meant it.
Harry is a Majority Senate leader with gigantic cahones. (or at least he found his own small pair)
Regardless, this is not single payer, but for my money is way better than the trigger.
I want to thank them.
to answer your question.
I don't believe it.
You could do worse. You could have the Boner.
Ain't that the truth. And you're right, she has been strong on the Public Option. It's too bad she has been so weak on so much else. Not that I'd trade her as a Rep. I just wish the HOR would elect someone stronger to the position of Speaker.
... I assume congress is going to start putting some pressure on the senate critters.
...straight truth!!
I'm feeling optimistic...let's give those conservatives that slippery slope towards single-payer they all feared so deeply!!!
No problem, the whole thing is slanted to protect insurers.
LA Times: Insurers poised to reap benefits from healthcare overhaul
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-health-...
I am still very disappointed with the behavior of the Democratic Party here. Reid and his minions have shown spineless leadership. I am not convinced till it passes and the ink is literally dry as to what will actually be in this bill. Until then, I remain a skeptic as the Dems have shown little spine in speaking up on behalf of its liberal base with very much enthusiasm or forceful positioning.
There should be a much better bill here and it should not be taking so long. I am still not convinced a "good bill for all" will be the end result. Sorry but I am not confident with the pro-bankster, pro-Insurance Reform posing as "healthcare reform" Democratic Party led by Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi. As long as Rahm Emanuel is there, I don't trust anything the Dems do.
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/cartoons/gallery/7...
The only conceivable opt-out scenario I could,and not necessarily would, support is if the opt-out question would put to a vote of the electorate. I do not, repeat DO NOT, want this decided by politicians (especially in my case, where that would be Bobby Jindal).
My hope is that it works so well, the Southern Senators will have to give in to the will of the people.
Is it bad that while getting over a lung infection, I assumed I misread that Harry Reid had actually been useful?
Swine Flu Jab . .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1Ud5ccqEhA
on these is messed up???
Must just be my Mac.
(No Swine Flu jab for me...)
The link's audio is fine on my Mac…
---
I have avoided all of the previous vaccines. I have had the flu once, ten years ago and I was seriously out of commission.
Still I think I will avoid this one also.
When Pigs Fly!!!!
I got the swine flu vaccine in 1976 - made me sick as a dog (or, maybe a pig?) for about 2 weeks. I was lucky, as there were a number of deaths as well as many cases of guillan-barre syndrome, which causes some kind of paralysis, I believe.
The mass vaccination program then was ordered because of an 'epidemic' - I think 8 soldiers got sick at Ft. Dix, in NJ and the whole country had to line up.
due to allergic reactions to aspirin.
The way I see it, the anti-vaccine people are co-operating with evolution. So by all means...
It kicked my ass. Incredible headache, total weakness and I was in and out of sleep, nearly delirious for three days.
My heart goes out to the many sick people.
Now let's see the actual bill.
...the actual language entered into the bill could still get really crappy. But like I said earlier...feelin' optimistic.
so I can complain about it not being there two weeks later.
I gotta commend Senator Reid. States will be forced to have it then the Republicans will have to shout in their states that in 2014 they want to take your health insurance away. They've been wanting to take away Medicare for years and every state has the option to opt out of it but none of them do. The Republicans won't dare to take away something that is extremely popular unless they want to risk a voter backlash.
referred to the so-called public option as "the consumer option." Congresswoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz, a Florida Democrat, appeared by Pelosi's side and used the term "competitive option."
http://crooksandliars.com/comment/permalink/1...
Can't we "re-frame" it as a "competitive option"?
what happened to that attempt to re-frame it, from last week?
It will still be a giant bone thrown to corporate America straight out of the taxpayers' pockets.
I'll believe any positive health care "changes" when I SEE them.
!
kidding. i'm probably mistaken but i feel obama is being underestimated. the (d)/obama have been somewhat prolonging this issue health care insurance reform to let everything come out from both sides. in the meantime (d) and some (r) are learning they're also vulnerable with the health care insurance they have/had. in the world of "individualism"/Darwninian capitalists many don't give a shit about anyone else
until they have a crisis/problem. NOW many are learning about medical bill based bankruptcies, the actual increase in health care ins. cost now and the future. many including here have a knee jerk reaction to what they read and/or what they thought they read. some of these independents and moderate republicans constituents will learn from this prolonging(strategy) that the (r) lawmakers are about party first and are very concerned about the possible positive obama legacy.
I wish I could believe the Democratic leadership was crafty enough to concoct such a plan.
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/cartoons/gallery/7...
Can anyone explain the "mechanics" of opting out? Who decides for the state? Would it be a ballot referendum? Does the Governor decide? The State legislature? Who? How? Where is (or who are) are our next battle lines?
I've already made up mind to OPT OUT.
As in flipping the whole scam the middle finger.
Hey, kids, here's your chance to learn something:
Today's phrase is: "Pyrrhic victory"
The link will take you to a page which explains what it is. Then, you can use your newly gained knowledge by applying it to the health insurance debate.
"the last two weeks has been a great opportunity to work with the white whore .... the White House"
Those words will be recorded and repeated on a loop at FUX. Expect to hear them echoing in your dreams.
Harry Balls?
predatory wealth extraction system masquerading as national healthcare.
That's my guess
Senate Democratic officials say the bill Reid envisions would require most individuals to purchase insurance, with exemptions for those unable to find affordable coverage. Large businesses would not be required to provide insurance to their workers, but would face penalties of as much as $750 per employee if any qualified for federal subsidies to afford coverage on their own.
The bill will also include a tax on high-cost insurance policies, despite opposition from organized labor, officials said. In a gesture to critics of the plan, Reid decided to apply the new tax to family plans with total premiums of $23,000 a year.
predatory wealth extraction system.
Seriously. I have been doing something else since last Friday. That sounds like a joke. Is it?
not require them to get insurance.
I'm personally for single payer, but with realization that it will have to be paid for by somebody via taxes. I presume that most who are for this, the translation is "wealth extraction from somebody else, not me!"
But the only way to make a Public Option work (not my ideal) is to make it mandatory. Somebody explain how it works any other way? [I.e., Only the sick sign up for it ... they can't afford the rates that would need to be charged if that's the case ... taxes are needed to collect the shortfall.]
So by definition, universal (or broader) coverage will require some form of wealth extraction. So maybe the "cheer" is "Wealth extraction from the wrong people!" I'll buy that.
While I can see the argument that universal coverage might require mandating coverage (though I see the argument, I do not concede it), yet that doesn't seem apply at all to the notion of a public option requiring a mandate to be effective.
Additionally, we pay, per capita (insured or not), vastly more than nations with universal coverage. Taking away the obscene overhead (e.g. profit), we can easily spend less per capita and gain universal coverage. This cost savings requires only the elimination of the unnecessary and counter productive drain of "profit."
I agree with your point in 2nd paragraph... and that's why I'm for Single Payer option. I do believe it's the right answer.
But as for public option requiring mandate to be effective. By effective, I mean pays for itself via the premiums and is affordable enough to presumably allow much higher coverage percentages of those not currently insured. If not mandatory, I don't see how the math works that avoids some funding for it from elsewhere ... at which point, you're back to Single Payer to achieve broad coverage.
Take quick look at NJ, where nobody can be denied coverage, but it's not mandatory. It's not affordable ... the premiums collected vs. payout model just doesn't equate to make it realistic. [Note: I'm sure there are differences in NJimplementation .. the most obvious being that it's private insurers.] But insurance only pays for itself if it's insuring a mix of high, medium & low risk participants. Now maybe if it were limited to "catastrophic insurance", that might work. idk
Anyway ... I just haven't seen it presented where the actuarial math works in this case. [I'm not an expert and open to explanation of to the contrary, but just haven't seen it explained.
This has been one of AHIP's major fears.
That Congress would prevent them from ferreting out those with "pre-existing" conditions....
Well, let's say that you have a job and your employer is not MANDATED to give you health insurance. You go to one of the magic "Exchanges". The lowest quote you get is about $400/mo. with B.S. coverage.
Let's see. $400x12 is about $5 grand/year.
Why not throw the dice and BOYCOTT the f'ing for-profit insurance corporations, save all year for the $1000 "fine" and just pay the fine come April 15th!!! An extra 4 grand in your pocket!!! (But remember to eat healthy...get exercise....be careful...take your vitamins and...KNOCK ON WOOD!!!)
Then, when you "get sick".....sign up for insurance!!! Hey!!! They won't be able to exclude you for "pre-existing" conditions....right?? Right??!!
Pfffftttt!!!!!
... so the whole thing still falls apart.
Round 2 will need to be Single Payer.
Ha!
Interesting how Reid is always portrayed as soft and with no backbone, and now that he has stood up for the right thing for Americans, against the partisan Republican insanity, he is labeled a "partisan bully." Truly, that is comedy gold.
Today I am proud to be a Nevadan with the leadership demonstrated by Harry Reid. Hell, I may even become a Democrat.
I'll reserve my celebration for when the Democrats have real courage, stand up to health insurance and create a single-payer system that insures universal access to all. I am going to wait to see how this plays out, as I'm sure the Health Insurance lobby has some ammo left. I will say I am surprised Harry Reid went this far, and for that he should be thanked.
if people can't afford it?
meaning free (not literally since we pay via taxes, which should be much more progressive).
it's only good if more people can afford it. if done properly/timely this could stimulate our economy. most people want the option of having health care insurance.
yes, but in a single-payer, govt run system, like France or Canada, you don't have to worry about affordability, everyone is covered.
I think as evidence to the threads on this page, it is obvious the health care industry has succeeded in using many things, like the debate over public option as a red herring. So instead of having real reform which would cut overhead to say 3-4%, they'll sacrifice their profits to 15-20%. It's tiny changes to a bad, corrupt, taxing and immoral way to run health care.
Yes, get to steppin Queen Snowe! We've all been living for this day when she could take her crazy old hag routine on the road. Go back to your party of endless losers! The public doesn't give a damn about bipartisanship. If we wanted input from the people who screwed up this country in the first place, we would have voted for McCain and his ignorant, wingnut runningmate.
Joan Walsh just pointed out on the Ed Shultz show, what that idiot Republican Senator Lamar brough up on the floor today. Medicare is an opt out program yet, not one state in the union has opted out! Basically, no state's citizens are going to sit by while other states enjoy the option while they're denied. It's the perfect trap.
Actually, it was Senator Lamar Alexander. I'll just be he's on Medicare too!
that's my next question. Or any of this. We going to sell health care debt, derivatives, stocks, hospital mortgages or something to China or investors to finance all this?
it's time olympia snowe goes.
all her lips have dried up with
her brain.
i have no confidence whatsoever that any reform will reach me.
my auto-immune condition requires a mere 1-2 phototherapy sessions monthly but unless care is regular, when i start i need 2-3/week for a month, 1-2/week for another month or two if it has really flared, then tapering off to the once a month...
the Doc bills BlueCross 129 cuz they only pay 85, charges 79.95 a visit for cash customers and was giving me $50/pop until i couldn't pay anymore back three months ago. My condition has now flared dramatically, go figure, after 3 mo of no care
this therapy works. i'm sure they'd rather sell me $1000/mo Enbrel, whatever... oh, and thousands a dollars a year in useless ointments that don't address the auto-immune issue at all.
pathetic
... and Harry Reid can't be trusted.
Still, so far so good.
K-Street, big business, and this dysfunctional congress.
Anyone else?
do you get involved by volunteering when
these issues come up or do you just bitch
on line like a lot of people.
bitching is fine if you back it up with
constructive solutions. don't take this
personally, but many people hide behind
their computer screens and never get out
of their chairs to help.
I can't see you past my bold font of truth.
in my life then most people. What did I get?
Ripped off.
I just got ripped off too man.
how many states will try to opt out? 1 or 2 and then the electorate is going to make them opt back in. game over.
as usual
Just in the interest of literacy...I thought you might like to know what "the poet" was talking about when Fineman quoted him as saying a man has to be either an anvil or a hammer. FYI, it's not like when Kos says throw them an anvil.
It is this: sometimes you're a hammer and you have to strike; sometimes you're an anvil and you have to bear.
See, Longfellow knows what an anvil actually is, what it was for; you just think of it as something heavy. "Hammer and anvil" was once a proverbial pair like hammer and tongs. The blacksmith uses a hammer and an anvil to shape metal. The hammer hits the metal against the (iron) anvil.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhQ4dE_RGnQ
this is harry reid we're talking about.
thank you, harry. now be a LEADER and get it done.
I wasn't expecting that.
Please finish this up, Push hard like Animals, I would like retroactive tax reform also to repeal the Regan Taxxes on Unemployment Comp. Sneak that in there too, Harry. Date Retroactive like the telecom imunity.
This is good tho, i think.
You gotta just love this compromise, right?
We, the conservatives of both major parties despise and fear a government takeover so much that we will only allow a Public OPTION on the condition that state GOVERNMENTS get to decide for their individual citizens whether they will be allowed to opt in.
That makes perfect sense.
... you mean republicans, right?
I think hell just froze over.
I hope he kicked the republican's in the crotch, as he booted them to the curb.
I'm currently retired and living in Mexico. During my professional life, I never earned more than $100k per year, but always said I would be more than willing to pay more taxes to provide health insurance for every American. I have nothing but contempt for those fatherless SOBs who are so greedy that they are rich and refuse to provide security for their fellow countrymen.
I am not a follower of political personalities and know little or nothing about Harry Reid. However, because of his part in working toward providing affordable healthcare for everyone, if it passes, I will be contributing a generous amount of dollars for his next election campaign.
Harry, I wish there were more people like you. Thanks from the bottom of my heart. Allen Fannin, (not the one is South Dakota. He's my son, but a ReThuglican)
So true.
The middle class bartered away their existence for a couple of measley GOP taxcuts, that didn't amount to more than chump change, while the oligarchs got millions and billions in taxcuts.
Then for their grubby $300 taxcut, they end up paying thousands a year in fees for stuff that use to be free when I was growing up? Taxes and a robust public sector is what made the middle class what it was.
Sadly, 40% of the people in this country are such mean sociopath's, they can't figure out this obvious truth because they are too preoccupied with trying to screw their neighbor's. The teabagger morons come to mind.
petitions to Harry over the past 6 weeks or so, I'm hopeful that he'll actually stand up and get this done. While I agree with the many who express skepticism, here, I for one am emailing Reid's office to thank him for doing the right thing . . . and to remind him that we'll all be watching to make sure he stays the course (uh, can I say that?)
To paraphrase R. Crumb: keep on bitchin'!
Don't forget to "feed the kitty." Reward the politicans when they do what you like and they might just keep on doing it.
to single payer. some how, some way, everyone needs to be covered to make it work at it's best/most efficient. having said that cost needs to go down significantly for it to work. caps on increases may need to happen. currently the paying pool/TAX payers are absorbing the cost shifted to them from the uninsured/under insured.
This is why the insurance companies are afraid of any reform. Once the public option gets out of the bag America - finally realizing its collective voting strength - will mandate single payer to bring us to parity with the rest of the modern world. They're afraid of us; that despite their billions in campaign donations to Congress it doesn't actually buy OUR votes, and we can still kick them in the nuts if need be.
Excuse me if this is a little long winded:
Current Costs: $13,500 per year per familiy. May include employer assistance, does not include co-pay or any prescriptions not covered. This is the cost of typical corporate contributions to group coverage enrollees.
Change the following:
1) Amend Social Security to remove all caps on income. (Currently, about $100K per year.) This would include taxing for FICA all bonus and stock options as social security income. Employers must match 100% of all pay to any employee. (Currently, employers only match up to the maximum then neither employee or employer contribute to FICA.)
added bonus: Social security gets extension of life and rich fat-cats get hammered.
2) Provide 100% medical coverage to all SSN bearing citizens of the USA. No co-pay
3) Provide 100% coverage for all prescription drugs. No co-pay
4) SSN is proof of needed coverage.
5) Raise the FICA tax rate to cover the cost of health care. Whatever it is, it should be calculated and the tax rate adjusted accordingly, including employer matching contributions. If my taxes go up $10,000 a year, I just saved $3,500!!!
6) Utilize the Medicare system, fold in the VA functions and provide total Veteran service throughout the US.
7) Abolish malpractice as a legal concept. All doctors should be board regulated, with peer review for all infractions and complaints. Compensation for victims should be determined and processed expeditiously.
8)Enlarge and increase funding for medicare waste, fraud investigation and prosecution.
There are many more simple things to do to adjust this mess. The end result should be that anyone needing medical or dental assistance should be able to contact their doctor, arrange an appointment and visit without worrying about pre-existing conditions or cost. The focus should only be on medical care.
now do all these things you said, and take a pencil, scratch out the current Medicare verbage, and have it now read "Medicare... from birth."
change i can believe in, to errr, coin a phrase...
Why does the article say that Reid is standing up to the White House if the White House says they're in favor of the public option? There's no evidence that the President hasn't always supported a public option. In fact, he probably arranged all of this so that Reid could get a much needed popularity bump.
This opt out provision stinks , it's a victory for the Repugs and the Insurance companies .
You mean to tell me that NONE of you noticed that Reid called the President the "White Whore"? LOL!!! Either it was a clever insult or what you would call a "freudian slip".
It was hillarious, and it happened in the 1st 10 seconds of the clip.
*I watched it again several times, and Reid definatly said it ON PURPOSE. Man, something must really stink up there in 1400.
The ignorant people, in all the red states, can just opt out and have no insurance or prefer paying the insurance co's ridiculous escalating rates. This is what their uncaring Reslug leaders want and now their sheep can enjoy too while being screwed at the same time.
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