Does CIA Still Deserve a Medal for Destroying 100 Interrogation Tapes?
By Jon Perr Monday Mar 02, 2009 6:00pm
Back in December 2007, Americans learned that then-head of the CIA's clandestine service Jose Rodriguez two years earlier ordered the destruction of at least two videotapes of detainee interrogations. Today, government lawyers revealed the number of tapes destroyed was much higher, totaling almost 100.
That shocking revelation prompts two questions. First is the issue of whether the videos might have revealed enhanced interrogation techniques constituting torture, actions which might have both jeopardized detainee prosecutions and led to legal action against CIA and Bush administration officials themselves. A second, less serious question goes out to conservative propagandists and Bush apologists: do you still believe Jose Rodriguez deserves a medal?
As ThinkProgress relayed this morning, the AP is now reporting that the effort to conceal the interrogations of Zacarias Moussaoui and another suspected Al Qaeda operative was far broader than originally thought. That news came in a March 2 letter to Judge Alvin Hellerstein as part of a lawsuit brought by the ACLU:
"The CIA can now identify the number of videotapes that were destroyed," said the letter by Acting U.S. Attorney Lev Dassin. "Ninety two videotapes were destroyed."
The letter also reports that "the CIA is now gathering more details for the lawsuit, including a list of the destroyed records, any secondary accounts that describe the destroyed contents, and the identities of those who may have viewed or possessed the recordings before they were destroyed."
Which is the last thing that likes of conservative commentator and failed Bush Labor nominee Linda Chavez wants to see happen.
In her Decemeber 21, 2007 column titled "Destroying CIA Tapes Deserves a Thank You," Chavez argued that the 2005 decision by Rodriguez should be lauded. Chavez expressed her gratitude that Rodriguez destroyed evidence of "enhanced interrogation techniques" such as waterboarding, acts which may have violated U.S. law and American treaty commitments:
In the next few months, his name will likely be dragged through the mud, and he will be vilified as a rogue official engaged in a massive cover-up. I think he deserves a medal...
Even though he is likely to become a scapegoat, what he did was right. He protected not just his men but all of us. I, for one, thank him.
Of course, Chavez is far from alone in wanting to reward those concealing the criminality of the Bush administration.
Former Fox News host and right-wing radio mouthpiece John Gibson similarly wanted to bestow honors on those who exact revenge on Bush's opponents. In November 2007, Gibson cheered the White House operation to out covert CIA operative Valerie Plame as retribution for her husband Joe Wilson's July 2003 op-ed debunking President Bush's bogus claims about Iraq seeking uranium in Niger. Ending the classified career of CIA agent deeply involved in critical nuclear proliferation work and compromising her global network was essential, Gibson argued, because "this was about an anti-Bush cabal at the CIA" that needed to be "rooted out." Again, this right-wing water carrier declared, there ought to be a medal:
"I'm the guy who said a long, long time ago that whoever outed Valerie Plame should get a medal. And if it was Karl Rove, I'd pin it on him myself."
And so it goes. For the Republicans' amen corner, Jose Rodriguez, Scooter Libby, Karl Rove and others behind Bush administration wrongdoing are national heroes. Conversely, the whistleblowers and journalists who exposed Bush's illegal domestic surveillance, the CIA network of secret black prisons, and torture techniques like waterboarding deserve prosecution.
For his part, then CIA director Michael Hayden claimed tapes' destruction was "done in line with the law." Beyond that, Hayden said little else about the revelations in December 2007, except to worry that "we may see misinterpretations of the facts in the days ahead."
For preventing that, Republicans believe, Jose Rodriguez deserved a medal.
(This piece also appears at Perrspectives.)
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Prosecute those involved and disband the CIA.
The CIA has been the cause of so much grief, hatred and criminality since it was founded. Disband it and publish its files. Help to clean this nation's soul
My shit doesn't stink either. We have a teeming pile here that should be processed.
Gotta prosecute to get all the americo-talibani zombies out of the CIA.
Someone Gave the Order:
"The large number of videotapes destroyed confirms that the agency engaged in a systematic attempt
to hide evidence of its illegal interrogations ..."
– Amrit Singh, lawyer for plaintiff ACLU
FLASHBACK:
18 Minute Gap Times 1000
Far smaller 1973 destruction of tapes brought down Nixon presidency
"The large number of videotapes destroyed confirms that the agency engaged in a systematic attempt to hide evidence of its illegal interrogations"
Who actually destroyed the evidence? Because the CIA never destroys intellegence, they always file it...
There is never a reason for the CIA to destroy intellegence data. Something is now very wrong.
Obstruction of justice and a slap on the wrist is preferable to life in prison for tortures and murders.
Plus theres the little matter of the child rapes they did at Abu Gharib on video.
This was admitted and documented at one of the Abu Gharib court cases against the low level NG MPs.
And assorted medical personal assisted the 'interrogators', that is going to look dandy on somebodys resume when they go to a hospital looking for a job.
The "My Country, Right or Wrong" crowd clearly are supportive of destroying any incriminating evidence. The scary part is how widespread these feelings are. Percentage wise I havent a good guess. Then add in the indifferent crowd, the "torture, who got tortured?" lobby, also widespread, and how many of us are left to be outraged? Over a third of the population.
And how does this third get our government to follow the letter of the law in prosecuting those who clearly have broken the law, and have destroyed evidence to avoid prosecution?
People have to be prosecuted. There is still evidence out there. Turning a blind eye is the worst option at this stage, meaning this will surely be repeated in a decade (or whenever the next so-called terrorist attack happens).
It is amazing how the population breaks down over certain issues.
"...it does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds.." - Samuel Adams
...IG Farben concentration camps management worked fast to destroy incriminating documents.
I put final touches on a comment concerning WWII war criminal Fritz Ter Meer over here.
I was in the U.S. Army Security Agency for almost three years. In the Security Agency we worked direcly for the national Security Agency(NSA) and took orders from them. My outfit reported directly to the Director of the National Security Agency.
If you stayed in the military after your first go round, you were eventually rewarded with some lucrative positions within the CIA or NSA. Some people I was stationed with in Ethiopia went to work with the CIA or the NSA and are now on lucrative retirement programs. I could have gone with the CIA and was offered a job by them but I turned it down.
I guess my point is that these people that continued their employment with these organizations were so enamored with them that they would do anything asked of them.
Anything.
After meeting with a former soldier stationed with me that had joined the CIA, I learned just what their attitude was. The man was an absolute fascist and it was his determination that he was right about the path that he chose and I was just stupid for believing in freedom and independence.
There has been a long held belief that these people in the CIA could do whatever they wanted if it was in the "interests of the United States". Today's revelations proved exactly the opposite.
The American people and the Congressional leaders of this country must wake up to the fact that there are factions within the United States that are set to destroy our country and they will stop at nothing to do so. Many of the leaders of this faction, I believe, are holding political office and have immense power amongst law makers.
Am I ranting or do I have a point?
You have a very sharp point. You'd better be careful. Patriot Act and all, donchaknow. Not to mention the FISA bill. They monitor these places.
Mossad probably does too.
Screw them and the elephant they rode in on.
'Dusty' Foggo is convicted of a crime and going to prison, strike one.
I wish you were ranting, but I fear you have a point.
Your observations are absolutely correct.
This is a secret government that must be dismantled.
I keep repeating that.
"There exists a shadowy government with its own Air Force, its own Navy, its own fundraising mechanism, and the ability to pursue its own ideas of national interest, free from all checks and balances, and free from the law itself."
— Senator Daniel K. Inouye at the Iran Contra Hearings (1987)
shadow government.
I came across this paperback in Bangkok when I was traveling there in the 70s.. it was one of the books traded by fellow world travelers.. it described the troubling reality to which you allude and made the Viet Nam War more intelligible.. I wondered why more people weren't talking about it since it was so relevant and Col. Prouty seemed very credible..came across it again on Amazon awhile back and the description said that the original and most copies had disappeared and was now released again. Of course it's not so shocking now, 30some years later.
The Team is on steroids now.. it even seems to have it's own television network.
the name of the book?
few days ago in which a former CIA man, the guy who'd led the CIA's field operations at Tora Bora, stated that he thought the Gitmo prisoners should have been executed after they had outlived their intelligence value. Psychological screening should remove people like that from positions of any power whatsoever.
And wouldn't you thing that if you'd been the field commander at one of the greatest military debacles of the "War on Terror," you wouldn't publicize that?
Reports of POWs packed into shipping containers and then machine gunned, plus that massacre at that old fort, they shot them and then poured diesel into the cellars and burnt them alive.
It's whats for breakfast.
why destroy all 100 tapes? if your protecting the interrogators why destroy all the tapes. they weren't in every tape were they?
But they prefer the lesser 'Obstruction of Justice' to the pain of what would happen if those digital recordings got out to the public.
EDIT; Its possible that the '100' tapes show really illegal and disgusting actions by these monsters, they are afraid of prosecutions.
Also got to remember they interrogated many 10s of thousands of people in Iraq and other other places over the years, esp when they were after the playing card people in 03/04, detainees on navy ships which had
mass cages setup in them, in Iraq at Abu Gharib and Afghanistan etc.
They used digital recording devices to record the video and allow it to be internetted back to Washington, there must have been 1000s of 'tapes' in existence or maybe were.
While what the CIA did is certainly worthy of condemnation, it should also be pointed out, as this link from The New York Times notes, that the Obama administration is going to continue the Bush policy of granting no legal rights at all to detainees in overseas prisons. If anything, the prison at Bagram may be even worse than the one at Guantanamo Bay [which Obama will not close until a year from now].
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/22/washington/...
Agent of hope and change? Apparently not for those who believe in the rights that they should be afforded under international law and the U.S. Constitution.
anybody stepping foot onto one is automatically granted constitutional rights, inalienable etc.
This means whoever laid an unlawful hand on a detainee, grunt, TLA or contractor, broke US law.
They are desperately trying to cover their proverbials, avoid any indictments and possible civil actions.
... the patriotic 'kept us safe' argument.
How? Oh, of course, they obtained actionable intelligence that led to this or that or some other Major Victory in the War on Terror. But we can't actually tell you what we learned, or how we learned it, because that would Let The Enemy Know We Know. I'm well aware of the historical import of Churchill's decision about Coventry, but the horseshit being served up by Bush loyalists is patently ridiculous.
We grabbed a bunch of ideological thugs off the battlefield. It'd be like kidnapping people out of the crowd at a McCain/Palin rally and expecting they'll have details on the nation's nuclear plants.
And, I don't know about you, but if I had a secret organization and plans to attack America, if anyone significant in the chain got captured or dropped off the grid for more than a day, that entire chain would be burned. An operation scrapped, if necessary. Furthermore, the information that my people DO have is going to be compartmentalized. If I have three teams in play, Team 1 doesn't know about Team 2 or Team 3. They don't know about each others' targets or methodology.
Ticking time bomb? Jack Bauer saves the day? Hardly.
And if those tapes were truly useless, are the subjects of those interrogations free, or are they still in the bag at Guantanamo because They Don't Know Anything But They Might Be Dangerous?
Supposed to be about a third of whose left there, they are going to scream blue murder and start suing when they get out.
I gather the game plan was/is to break them in mind and body, insane people make bad witnesses in court.
... just destroy the tapes? Nothing they do ever gets prosecuted. Crooks subpoenaed to court just don't show up. (Rove, Myers, etc.) Nothing ever happens to them. And almost all the Dems say, "Let's move forward, not back!"
Yeah, that's the ticket. Don't prosecute crimes -- I am sure they will never happen again. Then why not say the same thing about SINGLE murders? "Let's look forward?"
This country is in bad shape.
"Why didn't you just burn the tapes?"
Nixon was a fine example of what should be done in order to escape justice.
"The truth is, there is no Islamic army or terrorist group called Al Qaida. And any informed intelligence officer knows this. But there is a propaganda campaign to make the public believe in the presence of an identified entity... the country behind this propaganda is the U.S."
-- Robin Cook - Former British Foreign Secretary
and enemies of the 51st state, plus odd jobs for the Saudis
The medal was BECAUSE they destroyed the evidence, wasn't it?
In other comments.
the full quote is:
"My country, right or wrong.
When right, to be kept right,
when wrong to be set right."
Now that I can agree with! Our country was been wrong since the crazy "conservatives" took over in 1980. We need to set the country right be restoring the policies that kept this country strong for 200 years - policies that Reagan was installed to abolish and directly led to this crisis.
They must be at least a little worried if they don't have the usual sense of humor to extol the sensitive humanity of the torturer that one often hears in these situations.
one of the perks of the job when working in war zones.
Lets not forget, one of those CIA tapes was a video recording of a TLA persons sodomizing a screaming Iraqi boy in front of his parents.
...the dignity of the raped teen boys.
Someone might hear their screams.
So did all the other nondescript Iraqis rounded up for interrogation at Abu Gharib, I gather they moved a lot of them to Camp Bucca, theres about 20,000 in that hell hole of a concentration camp still.
Knowing these suck ficks are at large.
The Bush-brat-sociopath wants to donate his private torture collection to the BushLibrary. He has his own private torture collection, you bet!!!! It graduated from just stuffing frogs with firecrackers.
Come on, guys. Do you really think Rodriguez came up with this plan on his own? Do you really think the CIA is the start and end of our problems in intelligence and clandestine operations?
The spy world has a name for that kind of approach... it's called "the limited hangout."
The "limited hangout" version of the story pins the blame on Rodriguez and the CIA operatives who (allegedly) conducted torture.
The "limited hangout" focuses the anxiety and fervor on the low levels of the cover up.
It ignores that White House officials were involved in making the decision on the tapes. It ignores that Rodriguez requested immunity to testify to Congress about what really happened. It ignores that Bush himself may have seen at least one of those tapes before the decision was made.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/u...
Back when all of this bullcrap was going on, career CIA and FBI officers were seeking clarity from legal advisors on exactly what the new "take" on interrogations meant. They feared that if they were involved in "enhanced" interrogation, even at arm's length, they would eventually be thrown to the wolves while the officials who conceived and implemented the policy walked away scot-free.
That's what's going to happen.... wake up and go after the people AT THE TOP, who STARTED THIS.
You're absolutely right, but it's a big tree with many branches, and goes way back to the first bush, once in the CIA.
"Does CIA Still Deserve a Medal for Destroying 100 Interrogation Tapes?"
Has the CIA ever deserved a medal? Probably not. These intelligence agencies are above any laws on the planet. Don't like it, "the storngest military force ever conceived" will wipe you out (American or foreign born).
How many times have I heard this ("the storngest military force ever conceived") to justify everything America does? [Far too many times.]
It goes like this, "Shut up you stupid Canncuk or else... the strongest military force ever conceived will wipe you out. Followed by a guffaw.
You guys are asking the wrong question. Tapes? Who uses tapes in 2009? Look for disks. Someone has probably copied everything several times, both for bureaucratic record-keeping and for torture-porn activities. The entire show is lurking out there on a server, I promise. These are humans, and you guys are way-overestimating their intelligence!
Like this is a shock. Hell I bet the bushies were working over time getting All the shit trashed. We will never know just how much they wanted to make themself DICK-TATERS AND JUST HOW CLOSE THEY "WERE"
..for being the Prom Queen at Levenworth!
Enough already! These people committed crimes; prosecute them!
Mr. President, end our collective nightmare and have these people arrested, tried and if found guilty, thrown in jail.
From what I have seen in the last 35 years most or all of these assholes just walk away. Look at that fat POS rove. he told congress to go fuck them self, I do not have to show up to talk to you people. As long as this fatass can get away with this and the dems just let him we have a system that will never work for All the people. If you are just a working person and you hit on hard times and you steal food from the store to feed your kids and you get cought, tuff shit, you get 2 years. Or you get cought with a JOINT, you get 2 to 3 years. But when guys like rove and scooter get away with what they have done its time for Americans to take a stand. this bullshit "war on terror" is just like the "war on drugs" there all bullshit way for the ones who want to continue there life long goal of taking over,everything.
...if Jose is related to Felix.
Why do these people hate freedom and democracy so much?
I can't believe my eyes. Commit gross war crimes and then "protect your men and all of us" by covering them up.
That pretty much opens the door to anything.
This woman and her ilk are as un-American as they come. They are nihilists. Their ideals are basically along the lines of: do anything. . then cover it up. . . then say you are the greatest country in the world.
The CIA and the NSA and all other military secret government organizatioons should ALL be shut down. Imagine the savings of dollars if we didn't have to support TWO GOVERNMENTS, one, the dog and pony show for the people that "looks like" American Democracy, and the other, the secret, fascist, underground government, named by the biggest Dick of them all, "The Dark Side".
It needs to END. and the Mercenary armies and training of them has got to be made unlawful. END ALL OF THEM. OUTLAW THEM.
They are all in the hands of conservatives and are being used to put them back in office, COUNT ON IT.
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