Right-wing economics are a disaster on the state level too
By David Neiwert Monday Dec 29, 2008 2:00pm
Paul Krugman devotes a column to the localized levels of the economic meltdown:
But even as Washington tries to rescue the economy, the nation will be reeling from the actions of 50 Herbert Hoovers — state governors who are slashing spending in a time of recession, often at the expense both of their most vulnerable constituents and of the nation’s economic future.
These state-level cutbacks range from small acts of cruelty to giant acts of panic — from cuts in South Carolina’s juvenile justice program, which will force young offenders out of group homes and into prison, to the decision by a committee that manages California state spending to halt all construction outlays for six months.
Now, state governors aren’t stupid (not all of them, anyway). They’re cutting back because they have to — because they’re caught in a fiscal trap. But let’s step back for a moment and contemplate just how crazy it is, from a national point of view, to be cutting public services and public investment right now.
Krugman is right, but there is a dimension of this that goes unmentioned: Many of these states and their governors are in fact constrained by right-wing ideology and its effects as well.
All across America, anti-tax ideologues have, over the past generation or so, managed to pass -- often through state-level initiatives -- laws that not only require states to meet balanced budgets, but hamstrung their ability to gather revenues.
Here in Washington state, we've been plagued by the efforts of a character named Tim Eyman, who successfully championed measures that capped property taxes and motor-vehicle licensing fees, and unsuccessfully attempted a number of other measures. In Oregon, it's a similar character named Bill Sizemore. Indeed, ever since the days of California's Howard Jarvis, there have been anti-tax initiatives similarly hamstringing state governance all across the country.
The conservative ideologues running these campaigns loved to appeal to people's cheapness and the Reaganesque belief that government is the problem. And now, we're seeing the results of that short-sighted worldview.
As we start digging ourselves out of this economic mess, we're not only going to have to undo the toxic effects of conservative ideology on the federal level, but at the state level too. And the next time some demagogue starts promising that he can make things better by slashing taxes and revenues and government, we'll all know better than to listen.
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"And the next time some demagogue starts promising that he can make things better by slashing taxes and revenues and government, we'll all know better than to listen."
The blue staters will and do know better. The redstaters on the otherhand will run to the polls like scalded dogs to pull the lever against the prospect of 2 gay men getting married in Provincetown, Massachusetts that the GOP will serve up to them every 2 years to con and scare them into voting against their own best interests time and time again.
If red state ignorance only affected them I wouldn't give a shit but it drags us all down including the forward thinkers.
1. Social Security- Wheres the money?
2. FEMA- $80B for Katrina.. I live down here.. its pitifully spent.
3. Dept of Ed- Dumber kids need more funding? Works great!!
4. Dept of Energy- Regulation that pays special interests.
5. SEC- Madoff. $50B. Regulated?
----------
It amazes me people think government can solve anything. The left yells more government!!! Why? It fails you constantly. People arent smart enough or responsible enough. Big brother needs to hold everybody's hand... Laughable.
The right also yells for more government with war on drugs, peeking into our bedrooms, bigger and more expensive weapon systems, more prisons.
The left doesn't claim the government can fix anything, only balance it out so the nations economy isn't so tilted toward wealthy vested interest, giving everyone else a chance. After that, it's up to each of us.
The Republicans are big government in your bedroom.
The Democrats are big government in you wallet.
Hey, there is another alternative, eh?
You have it all wrong. Government doesn't fail us, Republican Government fails us.
when it is corrupted or otherwise ineffective...as has been the situation for many years.
Repubs largely suck, but they have no monopoly on sucktitude.
Did you think of that all by yourself?
Where has government not failed you?
Yea, you know, because the GOP has controlled all 3 branches of government for most of the past decade has worked out sooooo well. The departments you lament about have been stacked with incompetent Bush cronies for the past 8 years, any wonder it's failed? Cronies, btw, who's MO is to "get government down to the size it can be drowned in a bathtub" and you're surprised it's been a failure? Cronies who's justification for making sure government fails so they can use the failure as an excuse to cut government spending even more. Are you too wing nutty even for redstate? Is that why you're trying that shit over here? Put on a tin foil hat and have a nice pitcher of Kool-Aid ass wipe concern troll .
have complete control, I cant wait to see the mess they create.
'Power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.'
Gunsandbigots. Nice name. Fits your attitude well.
Republican's run on a "government is incompetent platform," and then prove it when elected! But for all their hate of government, they will do anything to control it.
It's only evil if it's working for the people and not the uber rich.
If you haven't yet figured this out, either your not very observant, or your a republican - which means your not very observant.
And democrats aren't claiming government should hold our hands; only tie the hands of the deregulating republican sociopath's. You know, the ones who created this mess and almost destroyed America. Man are you clueless!
Where??? WHERE??? Show me.
Where was congress on the bailout 80% of America didnt want?
Where was congress when the Patriot Act was passed?
Where was congress when we started an illegal war???
Its all the rights fault???
WHO HAS CONTROLLLED THE HOUSE FOR THE PAST TWO YEARS???
The Right in the US also cries "more government!" but in the form of prisons, police, military, and corporate welfare instead of health, education, and social welfare.
Only in the US is there a belief that "government can't solve anything" and that only dates back to about 1980. In much of the rest of the world, the absence of such a belief means that quality of life is often better, even in some third world countries.
not to mention the exception of keeping government out of our lives being in our bedrooms, our reproductive rights and forcing religion (superstitious ignorance) down our throats with faith based initiatives at tax payer expense. Rethugs are for big government if it means keeping us enslaved to ignorance, religion and blind nationalism which makes it all the easier for them to rape us blind.
Neo-cons do. Dont get it twisted. Bush's brand is not conservative.
Wrong bub.. 'Government cant solve anything' dates back to about 1776.
Conservatives enjoyed riding along too: everyone onto the party neo-con wagon: profits to be made. (In fairness, Dems too.)
all these problems you list above are the
result of the redstate/gop self-denial attitude
that someone else is always to blame.
the democrats save this nation everytime the
gop throws a lead weight to the moronic decisions
they make that are drowning this nation.
the gop stands for only self-interests, greed
and the worst criminal behavior the nation will
ever endure.
Really?
Who ended the Korean War? Who started it?
Who ended the Vietnam War? Who started it?
What party helped blacks get equal rights? What party was MLK a part of?
You guys crack me up. Someone is to blame. The GOVERNMENT. Both parties swill around in their own shit pointing the finger at the other party. Have you ever heard of 'Divide and Conquer'? Seriously.. It doesnt matter who is at the helm, they are going to try to quietly pad their pockets, (Jeffersons frozen 90K ring a bell) and give their buddies special titles and contracts.
You were doing so well up above. Don't ruin it by getting into the stupid left/right Dem/Repub blue/red false choice.
The guy on the left
What couch did he kill
To get that jacket?
I used to have that leisure suit.
I always though Casper was nekkid
And wanted to be more than just "friends."
http://www.noveltyradio.com/casp1.jpg
if you ask me, and his leg was always in that position ... hmmm ...
http://blogs.usatoday.com/.shared/image.html?...
What was Casper whining about, they put kethchup and mayonnaise on his burger instead of mustard?
That face is scary enough without imagining him nekkid ...
Eye-wash, please!
.
the cat sleeping on the couch and turned it into a hairpiece.
You guys are hilarious!
Actually I thought that was a leech on his head.
It reminds me of the KITH skit with Bruce McCulloch when he uses a dead squirrel as a hairpiece. (I tried to find a link but can't seem to locate one, unfortunately.)
I seemed to recall something similar but I've never heard of KITH.
Unless you count Rev. Montague Summer's, The Vampire: His Kith and Kin
Sounds like incestous living dead with a lisp.
... Kids in the Hall. One of my all-time fave shows.
I always thought Monty Hall seemed a little swishy. Look, he even wears the same kind of jacket.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jd1LU4yFqxg
In lieu of the squirrel skit, may I present Bruce's response to person who stole his bike wheel:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m68-oWBh9Ow
another classic:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFEUy8NzazE
{ Back on Topic Please. SiteMonitor}
checking out my linking skills ... :)
When are we going to RETROACTIVELY start taxing the shit out of the top 1% - and Grover Norquist?
If they now own 41% off all wealth in this country (they do), taxing them would jump start a whole bunch of state economies. Plus, these uber-rich sociopath's would still have more money than god, so what's the problem?
What are the dem's waiting for?
rescind the bush tax cuts on the wealthy. Looks like I'll be waiting awhile...
...the corrupt Congress critters will just spend the additional tax revenue to make more war toys and then be put in the pockets of the CEO's and pols....none of it will be used to help
actual people!! Think Halliburton....
What percentage of the taxes collected do the elite pay compared to the middle class? You might be a bit surprised by the answer.
If Cuba had responded to the demise of the Soviet Union and the tightening of the US blockade by reducing social services, they wouldn't have the world-renowned health care system or organic agriculture system that they do today; such things would have been destroyed by budget cuts. Despite their monetary crisis, however, Cuba committed itself to continued delivery of needed services, and both the Cuban people and those countries benefiting from Cuban doctors are the better for it.
If something like the fall of a major benefactor had happened to the post-Reagan US, the response would be to make the population suffer even more by reducing and eliminating social services while somehow increasing the money for prisons, police, and military, despite claims that there isn't money for social services. People would just accept the increased levels of homelessness and imprisonment, as they have in reality for almost thirty years, while still believing they're the envy of the world.
Priorities are royally screwed here in Reaganland and Americans think it's always been this way so they do nothing about it.
n/t
"And the next time some demagogue starts promising that he can make things better by slashing taxes and revenues and government, we'll all know better than to listen.".......
Ha! Ha! Don't bet your life savings on that, Davie.
We Canadians pay a lot more tax than you do, and we still manage to have the same standard of living you do (perhaps even better?), and the wealth is more evenly distributed.
This applies in much of Europe too.
America has the highest proportion of millionaires, anywhere.
It's an observation, not a criticism. There seems to be a winner take all mentality.
But is there something to be said for American creativity (e.g., assembly line manufacturing, weapon making, Apple computer, etc.)?
I know it's not all good.
But the U.S. sure has been a petri dish of activity.
We have our faults, but creativity is not one. We also donate more time, money and resources than any other country too.
People are just f*cking cheap and selfish. That's all there is too it.
I'd like to believe that I'm aligned with the party that asks each of us to think and act beyond our petty self-interest and not the party that caters to it. But I'm not sure the two parties are really that different.
like JFK, calls upon individual Americans to give to their country.
Good luck with that. I've no doubt that he'll do it. What I doubt is the response he'll get.
sacrifice has been, as done by JFK (and Carter during the "Energy Crisis")? Are we really so jaded that we as a country can't comprehend sacrifice as a nation versus the sacrifices done to us by the current administration?
Sacrifice is definitely called for, some of it harder, some not. And if Obama asks and people step up to the plate, then I'll be a happy camper. It'd be great to see this country act like the America I had thought I was growing up in all those years ago.
I hope we're up to it, but I'm not optimistic by nature. We shall see.
so many of us feel--that we are just individuals/families stuck in overpriced houses, on the verge of unemployment, with little hope for the future, with that POS TV telling us lies--but we think our neighbor has one up on us, so we don't really speak to each other.
How about acknowledging we are all in the same boat, and by working together, we can elevate ALL of us? Doesn't seem that hard to me, but what the f*ck do I know...
'United States of Amnesia' Gore Vidal
"Give to your country" sounds too much like "give to your government."
If he said "give to your neighbor" or "help your fellow man" then that would be nice, and I guess people need to be told to do this.
Always money for the P-O-l-i-c-e, but little else. War on everything (Czars even); budget unlimited.
As an educator, I have long told people, "If you want to understand the USA, put a pile of greenbacks on the table, and remember to always look at them." That answers 90% of it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fP_m7BoYDBY
... started here in California 30 years ago with old Howard Jarvis and the now infamous Proposition-13 that served as the model for similar voter initiatives and campaigns across the country.
California has been sliding steadily downhill for that entire period until today we find ourselves buries under a pile of crap that Superman couldn't dig us out of, let alone some pumped up "last action hero" cartoon character like the governor we have now.
They may make fun of California but most of them seem to want to emulate this state as far as fiscal matters are concerned and that's just scary.
I guess you know that, but they are damn proud of the way they have reduced government spending to that of a third world country. It means those with more get to pay less...and f*ck those with none or who are down and out and need assistance.
This is the mantra of the repug party...or what's left of it. Lower taxes...screw your neighbor. As long as I can keep more of "my own money" to buy my Hummer or 5000+ sq ft home for me and the wife, it's all good.
Granted..these sons of bitches ought to be strung up and hung to dry, but we'll have to hope there is a life after death for that one I guess.
My sister bought a San Diego house in 1994 for $60,000. A tiny place, enough for her, 3 cats, 3 dogs.
She'd just retired from teaching school in San Diego since 1960.
A died-in-the-wool Democrat. On a fixed retirement income.
Without Prop 13, as the Cali real estate market exploded, she would have paid property taxes on a $1 million property in 2005.
Do you think this is fair?
??
I find that a little difficult to swallow. The problem with jarvis and his like is they take the burder off one group, but they don't allow for any other sources of income to make up for it.
I'm not buying it, but maybe I didn't comprehend your comment well?
for $167K. My mom sold it a couple of years ago for $1.7M. If it had stayed in the family, I could have been paying taxes at that '79 rate.
Oh well. At least mom is now happy in AZ; my sis and I are struggling under the bushco economy with everyone else...
but what party has controlled the most powerful branch for the past two years?
Like 2 years is plenty of time to fix everything in the Bush/Cheney junta. The president that put signing statements on everything. (The Dems could be less spineless. That would help.)
Uh, he didn't say today -- he said 2005. The house would be much less than $1000k today (considering the real estate bubble has very much popped). I think it points out both the incredible size of the bubble, and the relative shortfalls of the CA state tax situation.
Because Americans never learn. This right-wing crap will be back, and sound just as yummy to the simpletons in this country as it did before. People in the U.S. aren't stupid by accident. They're proud of it. And you can't fix stupid, as they say.
Who invented money and where has it all gone? Money rules the ruled, until it is gone... Then What? The Worldwide central bank cartel is slowly imploding, blame who you'd like, if it makes ya feel better. As the dominos' fall they'll expose the true rulers. Enjoy today.
or drop dead, and we'd all be the better for it.
What a template for a regressive asshole this guy is.
Washington state has had a job freeze since August. I was sort of hoping to apply for a possible fishery job back in September, but no.
being a secure thing are indeed over. Certainly the case here in Florida.
There's no such thing as a free lunch (just asked the pig who donated the ham for that tasty ham and swiss on rye). The only people whose magical thinking permits them to believe in free lunches are children and thieves. Most children eventually come to know better. As for the thieves? They mostly become Republicans .
No free loaves and fishes?
I can unequivocally say that Howard Jarvis is in my Top Five List of Guys I'd Go Back In Time To Kill. That fucker RUINED California.
The most basic economic lesson is that there is no such thing as a free lunch. The right wing wants better roads, better airport services, bigger and better armed forces, less crime, fewer homeless in their neighborhood and no taxes. No taxes. What the hell are they thinking about. Oh yeah, the Laffer Curve. What fools.
I smell republican apologist. As long as we follow the Republican standard of budget cuts and filling positions of responsibility with amoral ideologues, government will fail. As long as we adhere to the Republican moral 'high ground' of letting Americans die at the hands of terrorists or through planned neglect because to act would mean less working people's money ending up in some rich donor's pocket, government will fail. As long as Government is based on republican lies and cynical deception that denies reality, government will fail. As long as we allow republicans and other conservative demagogues to destroy the foundations of our government and the basis of the American social contract embodied by the Constitution, government will fail.
Republican=Fail
you separate residential property taxes from commercial and corporate property taxes.
keep the residential rates held to Prop 13 rates and let the others float as they should.
there are corporations here in california paying 70s tax rates on -huge tracks of land and industrial properties. the same is true for commercial properties. these interests have effectively funded the propaganda campaign that if Prop 13 is tinkered with, you will lose your home to the tax man. that is why it is the third rail of politics in california. and that is one of the main reasons the state is on the brink of insolvency.
when will we realize that this conservative anti tax movement has ruined the country?
who have traditionally been ag interests but are now among the state's largest residential builders?
Republigoons want:
small government ----> like Somalia.
lower/no taxes ----> like Somalia.
private ownership of government ----> like Somalia
I can just say be careful for what you wish for!
Big Government-----> Like China
Higher Taxes-----> Like Europe
Socialism-----> Like most everywhere else.
Ill take a real conservative perspective, over a liberal or neo-con any day of the week.
Republicans have used their voodoo economics/anti tax mantra as a way to blatantly pander to the public. Unfortunately they conveniently neglected to tell you the problem with that dysfunctional model---if you cut or flatten your topline revenue without controlling your costs and expenditures you erode your net margins and thus your ability to provide the same level of services. The Retardlicans decided to peddle the snakeoil of tax cuts without telling the public of the full ramifications of what they were doing, which essentially was an IOU to the future.
There is no business model that can exist in this way on a long term basis and government is no different. It would be like saying that our business will forego price increases for ten years, we'll just suck up the annual cost of living and incresed expense and erode our net profit. Eventually, you go out of business because your profit goes to zero. If you ignore fundamental realities, then someday, they will come back to haunt you as a reminder to get your head out of your ass. Welcome to reality, you filthy GOP pigs.
Just like that, the 'people' let this happen by not being engaged or caring about their long term future. So fuck em, the 'people' deserve this coming to them.
I agree with trench2k. Sadly, I'm people too.
I like Krugman and he is right about much but lets be clear, his Nobel prize was awarded for Krugman's "analysis of trade patterns and location of economic activity" NOT economic downturns. It seems to me C&L wants to rest their economic position on one man because he got a noted prize.
Maybe a good way to answer this post is with a commentary by Peter Schiff who saw this coming years ahead of most economists.
A Nightmare Before Christmas - Peter Schiff
Like many pragmatic economists I have always warned that rapid expansions of government debt would result in inflation and higher interest rates. The explanation was always simple: rising supply of government debt inflates the money supply and weakens the government’s ability to service its debt through legitimate means.
But In recent months, government has flooded the market with hundreds of new Treasury obligations and telegraphed its intention to increase the deluge even more. In response, both bond prices and the dollar have risen. This benign reaction has led many to the happy conclusion that the doom and gloomers are wrong and that bailouts and economic “stimuli” can be financed with deficit spending without any adverse consequences on interest rates or consumer prices. Recent action in the foreign exchange markets suggests these hopes will prove illusory. The renewed strength in gold, together with the long overdue rupture of the correlation between the movements of foreign currencies and U.S. equities, is further evidence that recent market dynamics are changing.
When the financial crisis of 2008 kicked into high gear in September, the U.S. dollar began to rally furiously. While America’s economic ship was sinking from stem to stern, its currency was becoming the must have asset for public and private investors around the world. The dollar benefitted from the positive flows that result from massive global deleveraging. Treasuries got an added boost from a reflexive flight to “safety.” As a result, politicians were able to fill out their Christmas wish lists with complete confidence that Santa would deliver. However, as these dollar-positive forces appear to be giving way, the Grinch is about make an unwanted appearance.
Last weekend Barack Obama announced his intention to implement a New Deal-style stimulus and public works program. What he somehow forgot to mention is that the United States is wholly dependent on the willingness of foreign creditors to supply the funds. But a weakening dollar makes continued foreign purchase of U.S. Treasuries a much more difficult decision.
Once the dollar begins to collapse beneath the weight of all this new deficit spending, accumulation of contingency liabilities, and the socialization of our economy, commodity prices and interest rates will head skyward. In addition, once all the going out of business sales at U.S. retailers are over, and excess inventories have been reduced, watch for big price increases at the consumer level as well.
Once the government runs out of foreign and private sector bidders for new treasuries, the Federal Reserve will be the only buyer, and the hyper-inflation cat will be completely out of the bag. Sensing this, the Fed has recently indicated a desire to begin issuing its own bonds. However, since dollars are already recorded as liabilities on the Fed’s balance sheet (dollars are in actuality Federal Reserve Notes) the Fed already issues debt. The difference now is that they are proposing to issue interest bearing debt. Perhaps the Fed feels this will make holding its notes more appealing. However, since the interest will be paid in more of its own scrip, I do not believe this con will work.
In the end, rather than filling our stockings with Christmas goodies, our foreign creditors will likely substitute lumps of coal. Of course given how high coal prices will ultimately rise as a result of all this inflation, in Christmas Future perhaps our stockings will be stuffed with nothing but our own worthless currency. It might not burn as well as coal, but at least we will have plenty of it.
http://europac.net/externalframeset.asp?from=...
Peter Schiff is my friend on myspace. He has been spot on for years.
And this is not to say the democrats are the best thing going either, but let's face it for now they are the lessor of evils.
makes me feel principled.
Just a little clip about taxes: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zO9EgeJpA40
Last I look the thread was entitled "Right-wing economics are a disaster on the state level too." And since conservatives argue that social spending should be at a state and local level, and that most state governments have been headed by republican governors, this should give them pause, instead of neanderthalish, "Taxes...bad."
So they end up having to balance their budgets anyway. At least, since they don't have the infinite money generating power that the federal government has, they are constrained by their revenues and debt loads anyway.
So you can blame balanced budgets, but until each state has it's own federal reserve of sorts, of course the state budgets must be balanced.
How the hell is that supposed to save money? Keeping prisoners in prison is damned expensive.
Balanced budgets? Whoever heard of such nonsense? Hell, the more debt, the better!!
He sounds like a real loser!! I want to pay 50, no 100% property tax. But if I do, so does everyone else. If they can't afford to send their kids to college, it's because they didn't pay enough property tax into the state schools. Their cheapskates, just like Ronald Reagan. Burns me up.
Exactly, the state governments are smaller. Dammit. When will these idiots learn, that high taxes and big government make everyone's lives better? I mean, life in places like New York, New Jersey, Illinois, and Maryland is sweet. There are like, no poor people. The education systems are the best around. They have the best health care and the best public services. All because taxes are the highest in the nation.
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