Blackwater Shooting Charges Dismissed By Federal Judge
Obviously, this is going to do wonders for our image in Iraq:
WASHINGTON — In a significant blow to the Justice Department, a federal judge on Thursday threw out the indictment of five former Blackwater security guards over a shooting in Baghdad in 2007 that left 17 Iraqis dead and about 20 wounded.
The judge cited misuse of statements made by the guards in his decision, which brought to a sudden halt one of the highest-profile prosecutions to arise from the Iraq war. The shooting at Nisour Square frayed relations between the Iraqi government and the Bush administration and put a spotlight on the United States’ growing reliance on private security contractors in war zones.
Investigators concluded that the guards had indiscriminately fired on unarmed civilians in an unprovoked and unjustified assault near the crowded traffic circle on Sept. 16, 2007. The guards contended that they had been ambushed by insurgents and fired in self-defense.
A trial on manslaughter and firearm offenses was planned for February, and the preliminary proceedings had been closely watched in the United States and Iraq.
But in a 90-page opinion, Judge Ricardo M. Urbina of Federal District Court in Washington wrote that the government’s mishandling of the case “requires dismissal of the indictment against all the defendants.”
In a “reckless violation of the defendants’ constitutional rights,” the judge wrote, investigators, prosecutors and government witnesses had inappropriately relied on statements that the guards had been compelled to make in debriefings by the State Department shortly after the shootings. The State Department had hired the guards to protect its officials.
Did they fire their guns in the courtroom to celebrate?
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
Bush's attorney general Mukasey said ..... ALL CRIMES ARE NOT CRIMES TO BE PROSECUTED...
By now if we do not know what is meant by that statement we are dumb as hell..
None
the bush people are still screwing up the justice dept.
there needs to be a purge. period.
Obama better start seeing the sabotage.
Some stuff you can't make up!
http://thinkprogress.org/2009/01/11/obama-spe...
I not sure what party Obama and Emanuel really belong to... They certainly do not believe in the policies of the democrats of OLD>> Personally I believe Obama was the wrong choice for a presidential candidate by the democrats... Dean is more of a democrats with their real values than Obama , Emanuel , Blue dogs and most of the republican centrists combined...
In other words We f...ed up..
Q: The most popular question on your own website is related to this. On change.gov it comes from Bob Fertik of New York City and he asks, ‘Will you appoint a special prosecutor ideally Patrick Fitzgerald to independently investigate the greatest crimes of the Bush administration, including torture and warrantless wiretapping.’
OBAMA:We’re still evaluating how we’re going to approach the whole issue of interrogations, detentions, and so forth. And obviously we’re going to be looking at past practices and I don’t believe that anybody is above the law. On the other hand, I also have a belief that we need to look forward as opposed to looking backwards. … My orientation is going to be moving forward.
Obama explained that he doesn’t want CIA employees to “suddenly feel like they’ve got to spend all their time looking over their shoulders and lawyering.” He did not specifically rule out a special prosecutor, saying, “That doesn’t mean that if somebody has blatantly broken the law, that they are above the law.” Watch it:
Dawn Johnsen, Obama’s choice to lead the Office of Legal Counsel, rejects Obama’s “look forward” approach. In March 2008, she told “the next president” to avoid “any temptation to simply move on”:
We must avoid any temptation simply to move on. We must instead be honest with ourselves and the world as we condemn our nation’s past transgressions and reject Bush’s corruption of our American ideals. Our constitutional democracy cannot survive with a government shrouded in secrecy, nor can our nation’s honor be restored without full disclosure.
None
Last I heard an appeal is being filed as soon as the courts open on Monday.
"I know that there are people who do not love their fellow
man, and I hate people like that! " ~ Tom Lehrer (1928 - )
Of,, By and For these giant corporations and the mercenary army which is being set in place to take over our nation for the giant corporations and elite...
What happen to the military where the people how decide to wage war are the ones which fight it..
When you are a standby like Cheney , Bush , Rove , Rumsfeld , Ashcroft and the rest of the war hawks were when it was their turn to serve in the military ,,you want a mercenary army which you paid with others money to report ONLY to you... When you break a law screw everyone you are not held accountable..
Don't we see just how far our democracy , freedom and economy has fallen over the past 9 years. And there is NO CHANGE and transparency coming it is all a bunch of BS>.
There will be only a change when we create it... Vote them out kick them out.. By election time it is too d... late... We need a real American candidate Of , For the American citizens and not a paid corporate employee like we now have..
Criminals like Bush , Cheney , Rove , Rumsfeld and others are still walking the streets and complaining to the top of their voices about others when the only thing we should be hearing about them is for a pardon when their time is up..
Why are we giving Obama , Emanuel and the democrats a free ticket not to investigate and prosecute the criminals of treason , torture , illegal war and being responsible for the outsourcing of our manufacturing plants over 7 million jobs and criminally and totally destruction our economy...
All we have received from Obama and the democrats have been speeches and some of those phases were even stolen from others speeches...
WE have become weak and totally committed to these corporate paid democrats for what reason , I do not see any difference between these two parties.. It is time to create or vote for another party candidates..
None
Every story I heard on the radio yesterday, including NPR and BBC stories called them Blackwater guards. They are not guards they are mercenaries hired gunman who are paid to kill. Is anyone surprised that they did what they were paid for.
Tell me again how Bush, Cheney , republicans and the democrats love our soldiers..
http://www.alternet.org/blogs/peek/65723/
The colonel was furious. "Can you believe it? They actually drew their weapons on U.S. soldiers." He was describing a 2006 car accident, in which an SUV full of Blackwater operatives had crashed into a U.S. Army Humvee on a street in Baghdad's Green Zone. The colonel, who was involved in a follow-up investigation and spoke on the condition he not be named, said the Blackwater guards disarmed the U.S. Army soldiers and made them lie on the ground at gunpoint until they could disentangle the SUV. His account was confirmed by the head of another private security company.
**
Are Contractors Above the Law?
http://washingtonindependent.com/310/are-cont...
Former Halliburton Subsidiary KBR Insists It Is Not Liable for GI's Death
In January of 2008, Staff Sgt. Ryan Maseth, 24, was electrocuted while showering in his Baghdad barracks. His death prompted last week’s congressional report concluding that defense contractor KBR, (until a year ago a subsidiary of the oil services giant Halliburton) was well aware that the electrical system in Maseth’s complex was faulty. An accident like this, the report found, was bound to happen. But this report also now raises a larger and thornier question about military defense contractors: can they be held legally liable for their actions – or inactions? Will anyone be held responsible for Maseth’s death?
None
Blackwater is the only thing enabling this IMPERIALIST NATION OF OURS to continue its world wide aggression for resources. We no longer exclusively use our soldiers to fight because there simply are not enough to take on the HUGE HELPING of war we have bit off. We are now a shell of a nation that stands on its own only by virtue of a contracted infrastructure. If Blackwater was brought down, this nation would have no choice but to withdraw from these STUPID WARS... and the TRUE LEADERSHIP of this nation (aka the military) will NOT have that. Of course Blackwater got off... did you expect less?
Does Cheney income in bonuses and salaries increase..
None
That name sounds familiar....
Isn't this the guy who wanted to turn some Uighurs loose in this country a while back (because if they sent them back to China they would be KILLED?)
Yep...that's the guy...it seems he used to care.
Well, he's learned HIS lesson, now, right?
I am curious to see what rationale led to their being tried in US court. They are terrorists, and yet they get their day in court in the US? They were accused of murder in Iraq, and no US judge has jurisdiction one to rule. Not unless you can compromise the court in some way? Funny that extradition wasn't ordered so they could stand trial at the venue that mattered?
Something is wrong, isn't it?
When the torture story first broke out and the woman soldier which was sent to prison for torturing said..
That the contractors hired into the CIA and other departments were in charge and they were only following orders..
Well our us soldiers went to prison for following orders from the war contractors put in charge ordered , yet they are still committing crimes and telling us to go to hell...
You have to remember that Halliburton and Backwater have mercenary soldiers and workers from just about any country they wish to get them from..
So we have foreign soldiers on our shores and in war zones commanding our citizens and soldiers on what the can or can not do..
Also did anyone see the show on cable which told about how we help supply Bin Laden in his war against Russia to destroy their nation's economy and country,,
Now we are doing it to ourselves.. We should stop this f...ing war and stop it now... This terrorist BS has gone too far.. Our leaders are destroying us at a far greater number and quicker than any terrorist ever could... This war and corporate control of our country is just that... The transferring of our wealth and power to these Global monopolies and the elitist...
None
Prince being a good Christian boy and all
He was appointed by Bill Clinton.
It is all based on limited immunity for statements made then used against the defendants.
Not a clear cut issue. An issue any judge would have to consider.
It might well stand up to appeal as the judge was very detailed in his decision (or so I've read)
"I know that there are people who do not love their fellow
man, and I hate people like that! " ~ Tom Lehrer (1928 - )
Quote from up top:
In a “reckless violation of the defendants’ constitutional rights,” the judge wrote, investigators, prosecutors and government witnesses had inappropriately relied on statements that the guards had been compelled to make in debriefings by the State Department shortly after the shootings.
Why would officials at the State Department involve themselves in "debriefings" and not handle them in a manner that was Constitutional, knowing full well that the case would be headed into a court?
The State Department tainted the case. Why???
"The US has an army of 90,000 soldiers in Afghanistan and is spending $100bn a year, but has still been unable to defeat 20,000-25,000 Taliban who receive no pay at all." - Patrick Cockburn
is that bushco?
they were indicted a year ago... this points to another bushco f-up...
not?
hoping someone will clear this up for me...
looks like it, ya
"Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob"
-= Franklin Delano Roosevelt =-
Clinton started the free trade bill and Bush took that to the limit of outsourcing over 7 million jobs..
SO does that made it any better..
None
“Blackwater Shooting Charges Dismissed By Feral Judge”
if true.
Did anyone expect justice?!
I thought it was the Spanish Inquisition that nobody ever expected? (MPFC)
:)
"I know that there are people who do not love their fellow
man, and I hate people like that! " ~ Tom Lehrer (1928 - )
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gldlyTjXk9A
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSe38dzJYkY
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
no one expects the spanish.....ahh bollocks...lol
No.
"If the US government enforced its banking laws like it did its park regulations, we wouldn't be
in this damn park in the first place." OCCUPY.!!
just made an honest mistake. 37 times.
Blackwater mercenary armies are starting to police our streets and country...
None
2005.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OuBKmPQlJ-M
Make no mistake America. Listen to this man. Coming to a town NEAR YOU
I'm Boycotting NewsCorp! Heres what not to buy: http://www.cjr.org/resources/index.php?c=news...
Most of the commenters there support Blackwater. Ugh!
"If the US government enforced its banking laws like it did its park regulations, we wouldn't be
in this damn park in the first place." OCCUPY.!!
Could this be a poorly handled case intentionally lost by some Bush holdover US Attorneys?
Hmmmmmm?
*now where is my tin foil hat?*
"I know that there are people who do not love their fellow
man, and I hate people like that! " ~ Tom Lehrer (1928 - )
... my thought too ..
SadTragic ..Democracy is too important to be entrusted to politicians.
Rise Up!
Protest!
that's what i've been trying to find out too...
......... but probably not a case of "holdovers". The investigation and the interviews in question took place while BushCo was still in power.
don't s'pose the MSM will point that out though...
like they didn't point out that guantanamo detainees were released under bushco...
jonathon turley! calling jonathon turley!
we need someone like that to explain this to us...
There was no reason to get anywhere near those statements and any prosecutor would have known the consequences. They threw this case just as they did with Ted Stevens.
But it's the Obama Justice Department now and it has been for almost a year. We'll see if these lawyers are in any way disciplined for their "errors."
Corruption favors the wealthy.
the prosecutors involved brought the charges while Bush was still president.
Let's see what Obama's DOJ does about it. "Looking forward and not back" is the same as ratifying the behavior.
They can also convene another grand jury and get a clean indictment. Let's see.
Corruption favors the wealthy.
It looks like they're not too happy about this.
What is your conceptual, continuity?
I suspect that the wingnuts who support the Blackwater goons getting off on a technicality are the same who oppose giving Gitmo detainees a "fair and legal" trial because they may get released over legal technicalities. Hooray for the system when it works for "our guys"; reject the system when it might work for others.
Even more ironic is that as we try to defend the constitution and the rule of law these prosecutors totally botched this case. The judge IMO had no choice. Is Kenneth Kohl (an ASSISTANT US attorney) a holdover from the Bush era? And why does Eric holder still have his job if this is the level of competence of the DOJ?
The people of privilege will always risk their complete destruction rather than surrender any material part of their advantage." J.K. Galbraith
Fri, 01/01/2010 - 10:00 — jackalope
_________________________________________
And under boosh's rules of war, he made it so that enemy combatants, which blackwater could be considered as by the Iraqis, were to be tried by military tribunal with no assumption of innocence, flimsier evidence than a civilian or court-martial trial would allow, the allowance of hearsay evidence, and the allowance of evidence obtained by coercion (torture), and not necessarily a jury hearing.
Your tu quoques do not work here.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
I love the principled dedication on this blog to the presumption of innocence. Any Gitmo detainee is presumed innocent; anyone who works for Blackwater or who is even remotely connected to Blackwater is apparently presumed guilty.
As already noted, Urbina was a Clinton appointee. I haven't seen any convincing evidence that he's been "compromised," and I certainly have more faith in any American judge and court than any Iraqi one. Also, for those who talked about Blackwater "getting off on a technicality," I submit that there are reasons those "technicalities" exist--namely, that improper handling of evidence and the ability to improperly use government authority to compel statements could easily lead to the conviction of the innocent.
Everyone is entitled to the presumption of innocence. Even Blackwater. Also, the fact that a given trial didn't end with a hanging doesn't mean that justice miscarried.
Not guilty is also not the same as innocent. FWIW
"I know that there are people who do not love their fellow
man, and I hate people like that! " ~ Tom Lehrer (1928 - )
where the justice is when they are tried in a U.S. court rather than a court where the alleged crimes were commited.
question before!
"CRICKETS."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChSxOazIPTY
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
why you believe justice would be adequately served in an Iraqi court? Do you seriously think that the trial would be less politicized there than here? Flatly, I don't trust them now much more than I would have under Saddam. They are a signatory to the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights, I know, but let's just say that their track record upholding the spirit of the treaty, which includes the obligations to accord all due process and a fair trial, has been less than compelling, IMHO.
opinion on this but I do have a question for clarification.
Were Blackwater employees immune from in-country prosecution as part of their agreement to provide services?
I remember hearing that an arrangement of the sort is not unusual.
Contracted to work for the State Department they probably had that as part of their contract.
"I know that there are people who do not love their fellow
man, and I hate people like that! " ~ Tom Lehrer (1928 - )
Iraq's government would have signed off on this with the State Dept.?
been invaded by a foreign occupier doesn't really have a choice in what they are forced to sign.
"installed" their new government prior to this contract?
If so, just for the sake of looking good, would the US portray an agreement as supported by both parties?
And/or did or would the Iraqis actually support such an agreement in order to receive the support of Blackwater mercen...oops...employees?
The original immunity clauses were written by the Coalition Provisional Authority, the installed government in Iraq after the fall of Baghdad.
The people of privilege will always risk their complete destruction rather than surrender any material part of their advantage." J.K. Galbraith
Thx. So no real agreement from Iraq. Just the US saying what the rules would be.
So no strong say from Iraq now if they would want to ask for a trial there.
What ever happened to the Blackwater/Triple Canopy mercenaries who raped the woman and held her in a shipping container?
As I recall she was still looking for her day in court?
It looks like Blackwater's getting away with murder and more.
"The US has an army of 90,000 soldiers in Afghanistan and is spending $100bn a year, but has still been unable to defeat 20,000-25,000 Taliban who receive no pay at all." - Patrick Cockburn
that "We celebrated" when they established it. Shouldn't we respect their constitution and their courts?
He's a former public defender. They tend to be sticklers for defendant rights.
A former award-winning journalist and lifelong class warrior, keeping a jaundiced eye on the Washington elite.
Preserving the immunity is valid position.
It might well sustain an appeal.
Although the verbiage used can be one of three kinds of immunity. (I think it is limited immunity, blanket immunity or transactional immunity)
Defendants often assume immunity means blanket immunity.
"I know that there are people who do not love their fellow
man, and I hate people like that! " ~ Tom Lehrer (1928 - )
an opinion on the acts of Blackwater with the facts that we know.
From those facts we can make an informed decision on how we believe justice is best carried out.
Dismissal of charges gives no answer to their actions especially given the judge's reasoning for the dismissal.
The system is supposed to work towards a just resolution. Many of us here do not believe that occurred and we wonder if maybe some of the folks in the State Department might have made mistakes with forethought.
It's certainly not out of the question considering the administration they were working for.
That is not even the issue here, Gramare. This is about the performance of the DOJ.
The people of privilege will always risk their complete destruction rather than surrender any material part of their advantage." J.K. Galbraith
If by that you mean that the DoJ should not have mishandled evidence, well, sure.
The opinion is here (hopefully that's a stable link). I'm giving it a look-over now. I can understand that there are definitely facts that that don't look good for Blackwater, but I'm still not seeing evidence that the judge must somehow have been compromised in ruling the way he did.
I do think the majority of judges are interested in upholding the law, and I don't often fault them. That's what they should do.
I do suspect the case, and the evidence gathered, might have been intentionally poorly put together so any judge would have to throw it out. To me, that is VERY plausable.
"If the US government enforced its banking laws like it did its park regulations, we wouldn't be
in this damn park in the first place." OCCUPY.!!
True, as far as it goes - but the judge threw these charges out because they were apparently based on the statements these guys made to State Department investigators under grant of "use immunity." In other words, their confessions of guilt are being thrown out due to a technicality. So, while there's always a presumption of innocence - the dismissal of the charges wasn't based on a lack of evidence of guilt but on a lack of admissible evidence of guilt. Kind of like when Ollie North confessed under oath to committing crimes - but because it was done under grant of immunity, Ollie's conviction was overturned on appeal and he couldn't be retried due to another technicality (double jeopardy).
Here, the judge dismissed the case before jeopardy attached - hopefully the Bush League prosecutors didn't so thoroughly botch the job that there's enough admissible evidence to refile the charges wihout using evidence excluded as the "tainted fruit of the poisoned tree."
Interestingly, this is one of the doctrines that the "military tribunals" aren't bound by. So, if we classified the Blackwater guys as "enemy combatants" (civilians in a war zone conducting military-style operations) - their statements would apparently be admissible and the prosecutions could proceed.
Alternatively, the idiot State Department investigators could have proceeded in much the same way that police departments handle such statements in police-related shootings. Had they kept those immunized statements separated from the investigators doing the criminal investigation, the problem would go away and the Blackwater contractors could have had their day in court.
I agree that there is an unmistakable tone of suspicion for Ze on this blog. (Although in fairness, a para-military corporation operating with the blessing of the federal government should inspire healthy skepticism.) However, saying that the comments posted here are equating Gitmo detainees getting a fair trial to a presumption of guilt for Blackwater employees is a cynical and extremist association. In both cases a trial is in accordance with the rule of law. A trial is neither a declaration of guilt nor innocence. Moreover, why would you seek to try one group because you believe them to innocent and seek to try another group because you believe them to be guilty? Constitutionally speaking, such a conflicting paradigm would be illogical. I would rather think of the justice system as the proctor of evidence and the purveyor of truth, while being indifferent to guilt or innocence during its proceedings... even if a review of the track record demonstrates abysmal failures with respect to race, color, and social status.
There is a good chance that Judge Urbina had no choice but to dismiss the case, if indeed coercion was used to obtain Ze employee statements (and it's important to note that the statements were obtained during the Bush administration). However, the dismissals do not conclude the Blackwater employees' innocence. Whether the Blackwater employees are guilty or innocent, if there is reasonable evidence to suggest guilt, justice can only be served by taking them to trial and weighing the facts in accordance with the rule of law. There may exist personal opinions here and elsewhere on the merits of this case, but only a court of law can make determinations of guilt or innocence. But justice is never served when potentially guilty parties to a crime are released on technicalities, whether they are Gitmo detainees or Ze employees
Double Jeopardy is not in effect. It is important to point out that the physical evidence, victim statements, eyewitness accounts, and statements made by the ex-Blackwater employee who plea-bargained in exchange for testimony are still available. Dismissal of the Ze cases is NOT a declaration of innocence. To all intents and purposes, it's as if a trial never took place. If the facts merit a trial, Ze employees may well find themselves, once again, before a grand jury. Why? Because as Americans we must support the rule of law independently of how we feel about the involved parties or their motivations.
The rule of law is the keystone of our society... the U.S. Constitution, the U.S. Bill of Rights, the Magna Carta... they are the pillars our western heritage. It is what we strive to live up to.
Long live America!
Long live Equal Justice under the Law!
With cases like this it's no wonder why they hate us.
Is it the 21st century yet?
Sure, it's all stacked.
In Korea, when GIs commit crimes, they never see a Korean court. SOFA.
"If the US government enforced its banking laws like it did its park regulations, we wouldn't be
in this damn park in the first place." OCCUPY.!!
I was sickened when I saw this report last night. Although I'm not shocked by it, I'm nonetheless very disappointed. We'll pay for this in one way or the other, and I hope Prince and his merry band of Christian thieves gets Iraqi revenge served cold!
Had this gone to trial, we'd have had the possibility of a Ted Stevens / Ollie North re-run in which the initial prosecution was tainted by statements made under use immunity (tainted fruit of the poisoned tree) - and the defendants can't be re-tried because of double jeopardy. One suspects that this was what the Bush Leaguers were trying to do.
Here, the judge craftily dismissed the charges before jeopardy attached, forcing an appeals court ruling BEFORE jeopardy attaches. This means these scumsuckers can be charged again if the Bush League prosecutors didn't so totally contaminate everything that there isn't enough evidence obtained independently of the immunized statements to prosecute.
This very issue has been discussed ever since the initial investigation was screwed up at the very beginning by Condi Rice's State Department's improper use of immunized statements:
Thanks for the link. I am uspset with the DOJ but that article seems to point out that the guards may have spilled everything to the State Dept. to protect themselves under an immunity umbrella provided by Rice.
The people of privilege will always risk their complete destruction rather than surrender any material part of their advantage." J.K. Galbraith
I hadn't considered the double jeopardy angle, but that position does make sense, and there are facts described in the opinion that were gathered independently of the immunized statements (namely, the regular military officers' investigation of the shooting scene, which did not discover evidence of an insurgent attack). There could easily be more non-State evidence, too.
another story about how the good guys follow the law, while the thugs don't have to.
"Trust no one, Mr. Mulder." - Well-Manicured Man
The "judge" finds a "reckless violation of the defendants constitutional rights"?
What about the reckless violation of the victims Human rights? Who will speak for them? I'm hoping the Iraqi people and their courts. These war profiteers need to be held accountable and if we the people of the United States aren't going to be responsible for their actions they should. Payoffs to the victims family is not justice and cover-up's and dismissals only provoke greater hatred of America.
that some Iraqi children will grow up....
and want to learn how to fly....
and the next 911 will see those....
who still won't stop and ask why?
Iraq will send an offical request for these men to face trial in Iraqi court. Obama being the Bush-lite person he is will of course deny such a request. On the bright side this action by Obama will prove to even more people who Obama really is.
If that is the bright side, you must be not so bright.
Obama may well be sending a message that he respects the rule of law.
I could understand that position.
Department does with these Blackwater goons. I'll believe he supports the so called "rule of law" only when he prosecutes the bastards who got us into this mess to begin with.
Otherwise, the law only applies to us ordinary citizens.
employees are not regular citizens?
I thought they were. They are certainly not part of the society elite.
And yet...they benefited from the rule of law in this case.
citizens if the government has hired them to fight a war
overseas where they can shoot innocent civilians with impunity.
But back to my statement. It's like prosecuting the hitman without indicting the mafia don who ordered the hit.
Let me know when Obama cares about going after the people who put us in this fiasco.
was not Obama's problem.
I understand what you're saying.
But they did benefit from the rule of law and they were worker bees at best in the pecking order.
But yeah...going after the lead chickenhawks would have much more impact.
Not going to happen.
I'm certainly not defending what Blackwater did. It's just the fact they were even there to begin with...
Thanks for sharing the paddles.
Does pecking order mean promotion by the size of one's pecker?
http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=rFDgSKbapzY
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
...the size of one's pecker?
I think it has more to do with things than we let on. (real or perceived)
"If the US government enforced its banking laws like it did its park regulations, we wouldn't be
in this damn park in the first place." OCCUPY.!!
If Obama respected the rule of law, please explain why a few key (alleged) war criminals still either hiding in Houston or flailing on Fox, without even a hint of danger of an investigation into their activities from 2001 through early 2009!
"Trust no one, Mr. Mulder." - Well-Manicured Man
he could well claim that he does.
Are you judged for the entirety of your life based on any single instance of anything?
But now there's an even longer list of protected (alleged) war criminals to hide, isn't there? Like King George I said (October 19, 1992), "When you're President of the United States, you cannot have this pattern of saying, 'Well, I'm for it, but I'm on the other side of it.'"
I'm willing to see how this plays out, but as I posted here yesterday, I'm losing faith rapidly and starting to wonder if anybody in this administration has any idea about what they're doing.
"Trust no one, Mr. Mulder." - Well-Manicured Man
The prosecution simply needs to proceed in this case without the questionable evidence...they still can convict these murderers even without the testimony of the Blackwater personnel.
the court may have made the correct decision. However, where's the accountability for the people who put Blackwater there to begin with?
is sometning 'cons' are trying desperately to 'rub off' on ANYBODY else.
Torture and Blackwater are YOUR babies!
The untold American lives SAVED by George Washington's 'anti-torture' policies THROUGHOUT our history and the 'dismissal'of murder charges by the Bush State Department's 'corruption' of the system that 'NEO-cons should wear as a 'scarlet letter'.
You remember the Bush State Department, the one that was WARNED 'Bin Laden Determined to Attack within the United States' and LET IT HAPPEN and then let him escape on Tore Bora.
Are you trying to figure out how to blame Obama for that too?
The party of hate, lies, and war criminals trying to blame Democrats is getting old and predictable but keep talking, we need to know where the lemmings are....
Don't be rediculous. Bush and Cheney and all of his cronies should hang for what they did. What I said was, Obama has done Nothing To Charge Those Responsible for this mess. Don't like it. Too bad. Let's get the little fuc*ers, they're easier to prosecute. I make no apologies for Bush or the republican party. Nor do I make excuses for those who wish to swipe it under the rug and just look forward.
to 'neotag'.
I agree with you.
But a missing piece of this puzzle is Obama's FIRST security briefing as President.
If his lack of action is strictly political then he IS as bad as Bush, however, is it POSSIBLE there was something exposed in that briefing that has him walking on 'egg shells'?
It would not surprise me.
why do they hate us...?"
http://www.britannica.com/bps/additionalconte...
I'm Boycotting NewsCorp! Heres what not to buy: http://www.cjr.org/resources/index.php?c=news...
What a kangaroo court!
How can American boast about being the land of liberty, when it allows the oppression of freedom..by it's own hands?
slaughter innocent civilians, get paid for it and walk away smirking ...
(reminds me of a certain former Frat-boy King)
http://www.democracynow.org/2008/11/19/steve_...
I'm Boycotting NewsCorp! Heres what not to buy: http://www.cjr.org/resources/index.php?c=news...
to kill who you will
If you have enough clout in the bout!
So the mercenaries get off with murder because of an alleged rights violation, but there are guys in Gitmo who are being LEGALLY held? WTF?
me-oww!
shouldn't the detainees be sent back to their countries to be tried by their courts? No military tribunals or trials in the courts of the U.S. of A.
For all I know that was the right legal call. It was stunning to hear that the first U.S. agents to interview the Blackwater guards offered them immunity: not only were they from the State Department, not the Justice Department, but they were from the division of State that oversees the contract Blackwater held. Whether they intended to sabotage a prosecution is unknown, but that’s exactly what they effectively did.
http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2010/01/01...
Ding, ding, ding.
We have a winner. Intentionally sabotaged by the handlers responsible for hiring them. Certain to be no conflicts of interest there, if anyone would ever bother to look.
The State Department did *not* (and, AFAIK, could not) offer the Blackwater operatives immunity from prosecution. What it could offer was the ability to shield the statements they were going to make on their incident reports from admission during a prosecution. There's a difference. As several commenters earlier in this thread noted, the latter means that the charges can be refiled if there is sufficient admissible evidence to prosecute.
These kinds of immunity grants are legal for the same reason that we have attorney-client privilege: it encourages people to be candid about what really happened.
working in front of a 7/11 in Boise, Idaho fired an automatic weapon into a taxi windshield killing everyone inside ...
simply because he 'wanted to kill somebody that day' ... he would probably end up being tried and imprisoned.
Not so in Iraq.
THAT is the difference.
Lets think again, really hard, about who the Terrorists are...?
I'm Boycotting NewsCorp! Heres what not to buy: http://www.cjr.org/resources/index.php?c=news...
Does this mean it goes back to a military court?/
What is your conceptual, continuity?
Right!
"Trust no one, Mr. Mulder." - Well-Manicured Man
They can't try them again for the same charges
But it's possible to charge them with different ones.
Blackwater still stands the chance of having a lawsuit filed against it by the Iraqi government.
But that would probably make it a Supreme Court case.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
Can we try them for being assholes? For offending the lowest common decency? Really bad haircuts (Prince)?
We know none of them are going to be locked up: they're doing what they were hired to do.
"If the US government enforced its banking laws like it did its park regulations, we wouldn't be
in this damn park in the first place." OCCUPY.!!
... Suprising, considering that his Daddy made $1.6 Billion on lighted car vanity mirrors ... seriously, does he not flip it down and check himself out, everytime Blackwater gives him a Hummer?
I'm Boycotting NewsCorp! Heres what not to buy: http://www.cjr.org/resources/index.php?c=news...
$1.6 billion for VANITY mirrors?
And we wonder what's wrong with people?
"If the US government enforced its banking laws like it did its park regulations, we wouldn't be
in this damn park in the first place." OCCUPY.!!
“We’re obviously disappointed by the decision,” Justice Department spokesman Dean Boyd said in a statement. “We’re still in the process of reviewing the opinion and considering our options.”
http://www.mainjustice.com/2010/01/01/judge-c...
see also U.S. ATTORNEYS CHART (Interactive) there
OK,
The US reserves the right to deny US Constitutional rights to enemy combatants. Why are we giving US Constitutional rights to mercenaries on foreign soil?
Can you say Hypocrisy?
Not while sober.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
Hhhhyypppaacck.
Hhhhyyyppaacckkkrraaaccccccaayyy.
Wwhehhhhh
Thaaat mmade mmme(hicup) tirsty.
Bartender!
What is your conceptual, continuity?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIvka3SSv9Y
I'm Boycotting NewsCorp! Heres what not to buy: http://www.cjr.org/resources/index.php?c=news...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYusPRre07k&fe...
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SuLWRAq-Kuk&fe...
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
from the country that illegally invaded, tortured and murdered its citizens.
I don't expect justice in this country.
Operation Iraqi Liberation.
It was for their own good.
Justice is only for the rich.
These 'murderers' have their own heavy artillery and aircraft? and their 'leader' calls himself a 'soldier for Christ'? AMAZING!
Getting away with murderering Iraquis TODAY evolves into what TOMORROW?
To these kinds of 'conservatives without' conscience EVERYBODY is the enemy...
The 'trillions' of $$$$ earmarked to DESTROY the world will be used to REBUILD the world.
We are held 'hostage' by a handful of 'radicals'!
Osama 'the tea baggin' REPUBLICANS!!
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/34660136/ns/world...
"Iraqis seeking justice for 17 people shot dead at a Baghdad intersection responded with bitterness and outrage Friday at a U.S. judge's decision to throw out a case against a Blackwater security team accused in the killings.
The Iraqi government vowed to pursue the case, which became a source of contention between the U.S. and the Iraqi government. Many Iraqis also held up the judge's decision as proof of what they'd long believed: U.S. security contractors were above the law."
Lets see if Obama does the right thing or the Bush thing.
... you are kidding, right?
I'm Boycotting NewsCorp! Heres what not to buy: http://www.cjr.org/resources/index.php?c=news...
First thing is...The investigators, prosecutors and government witnesses (aka Bush attorney general appointees and employees) need to be prosecuted for violating the balackwater suspects rights.
...and then Obama needs to appoint a new "non Bush team" of prosecutors and investigators who will do the job right.
Obama could fix this!...will he? ...I doubt it.
I can't believe (that I look like) I'm defending Blackwater) !$%@*&!
audit-prosecute-incarcerate
The investigation was bungled. The gov't ran a horrible case, and the unfortunate truth is that we have to apply the rule of law the same to people like these in order to protect people like us. However, remember what happened with OJ. There's still a civil suit out there against these bastards. They can still make it so these criminals' great great grandchildren are paying for thier crimes. We can also make sure Xe gets no more contracts from the gov't. We can call it the contractor Black(water) List.
will get off scott free for the same reasons...
audit-prosecute-incarcerate
things get WORSE.
NOBODY 2012
Iraq is now a colony. Get used to it. Colonial rules apply. White invaders always innocent.
"If the US government enforced its banking laws like it did its park regulations, we wouldn't be
in this damn park in the first place." OCCUPY.!!
the case. The question is: was the fuck up done on purpose? What I mean is, did the prosecutors messed their case in order to allow the mercenaries to not get imprisoned?
Some people had made a case that the dismissal was based on a violation of the suspect's fifth amendment. But after a cursory read, it seems the 5th does not apply in the fashion it was being described for these mercs, in the context that these filthy arseholes were being prosecuted by a jury already. So the accusations had already been made, and once one enters the trial phase... anything they say can and may be used against them. Right?
I don't think the people "managing" this so-called war on terror, understand that throwing fuel to a burning fire is not necessarily the best way of putting it out. This could ignite a very palpable anger among the Iraqis and unite them against the troops and mercs over there. Frankly, nothing good can come out of this: A massive failure by the American legal system, which may provide a catalyst to make things even more unstable over in Iraq.
Yes.
As I said above, they were doing exactly what they were hired to do.
"If the US government enforced its banking laws like it did its park regulations, we wouldn't be
in this damn park in the first place." OCCUPY.!!
in such case?
This seems like a very serious transgression, and honestly it makes the USA look like a rather corrupt place. Certainly it does take away whatever little wind it was left in the "moral higher ground" claims by the US regarding the validity of the occupation.
although Blackwater / Xe claims to be a 100% American company, and uses their sense of "Americanism" to object to being labeled "mercenary" .. 25% of Blackwater / Xe's employees are non-US-citizens.
http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/natsec/RL32419.pdf
Blackwater did not have authorization to be outside of the Green Zone that day. they were escorting a right wing Polish diplomat who wanted to look tough and strut around downtown like John McCain or something. they were unauthorized, their presence was not announced to diplomatic and political partners in the new Iraqi government, and neither their vehicles nor their uniforms bore any of the Coalition's military's insignias.
of the 34 people shot that day, 3 were police officers in uniform. Two of the officers who were shot, were shot while approaching the mercenaries with their guns still holstered, hands up, waving at the mercenaries to stop firing.
so it could be argued that Blackwater kills cops.
of the 34 people shot that day, 3 were in a minivan. One was a 32 year old father, driving his van away (Mohamed Abbas Mahmoud, deceased) - one was a 12 year old boy (Qasini Mohamed Abbas Mahmoud, deceased) - and one was a 29 year old mother (Yassameen Abdulkhudir Salih).
so it could be argued that Blackwater kills soccer moms, nascar dads, little kids, and is basically anti-family.
one of the vehicles fired on, was a public bus. several of the 34 people shot that day were riding in the bus. two of them were Affrah Sattar Ghafil (28, female) and her mother Ghaniyah Hassan Ali (63, female, deceased).
so it could be argued that Blackwater kills grandmas. and hates public transportation systems.
the court affidavits against the mercenaries are easy to find and quite brief. they're full of much better information than mainstream media news articles and even most blogs (no offense, Mr. Amato)
criminal suit brought against Blackwater by the US Justice Dept:
http://www.justice.gov/opa/documents/grandjur...
civil suit brought against by both US and Iraqi attorneys:
http://www.expose-the-war-profiteers.org/arch...
the more informed we are the better we can explain why this disgusting
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