Yes, Congratulations to Ron Paul. $4million dollars, one day, 35,000 donors. Freedom. The Constitution. Liberty.

And we're mad as hell and we're not going to take it anymore!

I literally JUST finished watching this movie. It has and will become a yearly ritual for me :D

fromnorthoftheborder @ 6:

I literally JUST finished watching this movie. It has and will become a yearly ritual for me :D

I could not wait a full year to see it again . . . .
*

Good for Mr. Paul !

Constitutional support: check!

States Rights Support: Check!

OUT of IRAQ: CHECK!

I gave em a little loot today :)

You all should really read the Graphic Novel by Alan Moore, it's far better than the movie.

Yeah, mega dittoes on Ron Paul.

He had a VERY good Guy Fawkes Day for himself yesterday.

Be funny if he actually finishes high in the first set of primaries, that will probably make Michelle Malkin and the entire Freeper community's heads explode.

One thing that bothers me, that nobody is talking about, even more than this incredibly elongated 2+ year election cycle that we're in, is that well over a billion dollars is going to be spent on the primaries and General Election, (a year from today, whew), for the job of President of The United States.

The job of President, which pays, over 4 years, after taxes.....

Wait for it...

(cue: Doctor Evil):

One Million Dollars

I've heard a lot of arguments as to why that is, but to me, no matter how you slice it, do the math, there is something fundamentally wrong with that.

Our whole process is broken, through and through, and I don't have a clue as to how to go about fixing it.

~nwa

Our Long National Nightmare.....

Has another year left to run.

S/Election Day is now only 1 full year off, as of today!!!!

Wheeee!!!!

Roll Out The Barrel!!!!

Champagne on ice for everybody!!!!!

~nwa

PS: Wake me up when it's over, m'kay, thx bye!!!

Remember remember that elections should be publicly financed. Since Nixon, the party that raises the most money wins the presidency. Sometimes they have to falsify the votes and manipulate the results, but they still win the election.

The U.S. is lagging badly behind its European and Asian rivals when it comes to broadband, coming in 14th place in terms of speed and 21st in price, according to new statistics published Monday. Americans want change. Apparently, in Bush-Land, it's the Kurds who are the terrorists. Will Musharraf's fascism lead to another Khomeini? The LAUSD manages to top the poll tax with a playground tax.

I love this movie. It just goes to show that the Wachowski brothers can work wonders with other people's material.. but they suck at writing their own.

Someday I'm going to have to watch that movie from the beginning...

Love the meat quote from TFA link, though:

Order in Quarters issued by General George Washington, November 5, 1775:

As the Commander in Chief has been apprized of a design form’d for the observance of that ridiculous and childish custom of burning the Effigy of the pope–He cannot help expressing his surprise that there should be Officers and Soldiers in this army so void of common sense, as not to see the impropriety of such a step at this Juncture; at a Time when we are solliciting, and have really obtain’d, the friendship and alliance of the people of Canada, whom we ought to consider as Brethren embarked in the same Cause. The defence of the general Liberty of America: At such a juncture, and in such Circumstances, to be insulting their Religion, is so monstrous, as not to be suffered or excused; indeed instead of offering the most remote insult, it is our duty to address public thanks to these our Brethren, as to them we are so much indebted for every late happy Success over the common Enemy in Canada.

HA! Can you imagine Bush chiding the troops (actual or metaphorical) for spreading FUD or hate mongering about Islam or anyone with olive skin, pointing to the struggling democracy of our Turkish allies or the people of Iran that demand reform (not the government)? I really can't.

It is amazing in how many measures Bush fails, especially by those of his own heroes. I don't always agree with Washington, but at least here he show the common sense and common decency that ought be possessed by even the slowest child.

Just finished watching V again a little while ago! Great flick indeed!

Oh come on. Ron Paul wants to destroy the Department of Education.

Education.

Yes, I said "education". Does that reeeally seem like what this country needs right now? LESS education? Really? REALLY?! All education becoming home schooling from wingnuts (ya know, 'cuz woman's place is in the kitchen, it ain't at work) and fundamentalist church madrasas that only teach not to question, only to hate? We expect this from parents that apparently can't even tell their own kids where babies come from?

Please! And that is just a small, small sample of his wonderful "ideas". Please don't make me find the link to the ye olde Ron Paul crazy show again...

Don't even get me started on the "gold standard". Warren Buffet, one if not THE most brilliant investor of our time (and worlds 2nd wealthiest behind Gates, before he gave it all away) pointed out:

Buffett emphasized the non-productive aspect of gold in 1998 at Harvard: "It gets dug out of the ground in Africa, or someplace. Then we melt it down, dig another hole, bury it again and pay people to stand around guarding it. It has no utility. Anyone watching from Mars would be scratching their head."

But I'm WAY sure that Ron is SOO much smarter about the economy than Buffet. He raised $4 million dollars fundraising, right? (As opposed to Buffet EARNING well over $40 billion dollars fair and square).

But hey, I'm all for Ron running as an independent to split the Republican vote and give us a chance at victory of EVERY SINGLE STATE voting for... personally, I hope Edwards. But most of the Blue Team will do -- maybe.

I exaggerate only a little ;) But for all the crazy I think he possesses, seriously, I do thank Mr. Paul for raising the necessary and urgent call for stopping the state from crushing the individual. He is that lone voice amongst the Republicans. They should all be VERY ashamed of that. I hope he makes a very large impact over there... but the presidency should not be his.

Your requested linkage.

August 9th, 2007

Good evening, America. Allow me first to apologize for this interruption. I do, like many of you, appreciate the comforts of the everyday routine, the security of the familiar, the tranquility of repetition. I enjoy them as much as any bloke. But in the spirit of commemoration - whereby those important events of the past, usually associated with someone's death or the end of some awful bloody struggle, are celebrated with a nice holiday - I thought we could mark this Second Tuesday in November, a day that is sadly no longer remembered, by taking some time out of our daily lives to sit down and have a little chat.

There are, of course, those who do not want us to speak. I suspect even now orders are being shouted into telephones and men with guns will soon be on their way. Why? Because while the truncheon may be used in lieu of conversation, words will always retain their power. Words offer the means to meaning and for those who will listen, the enunciation of truth. And the truth is, there is something terribly wrong with this country, isn't there?

Cruelty and injustice...intolerance and oppression. And where once you had the freedom to object, to think and speak as you saw fit, you now have censors and systems of surveillance, coercing your conformity and soliciting your submission. How did this happen? Who's to blame? Well certainly there are those who are more responsible than others, and they will be held accountable. But again, truth be told...if you're looking for the guilty, you need only look into a mirror.

I know why you did it. I know you were afraid. Who wouldn't be? War. Terror. Disease. There were a myriad of problems which conspired to corrupt your reason and rob you of your common sense. Fear got the best of you and in your panic, you turned to the Conservative. He promised you order. He promised you peace. And all he demanded in return was your silent, obedient consent.

Last night, We sought to end that silence. Last night, We destroyed the Old Lieberman to remind this country of what it has forgotten. More than 250 years ago, great citizens wished to embed the Second Tuesday of November forever in our memory. Their hope was to remind the world that fairness, justice and freedom are more than words - they are perspectives. So if you've seen nothing, if the crimes of this government remain unknown to you, then I would suggest that you allow the Seventh of November to pass unmarked. But if you see what I see, if you feel as I feel, and if you would seek as I seek...then I ask you to stand beside me, three months from tonight at the Voting Stations. And together, we shall give them a Seventh of November that shall never, ever, be forgot!

swarmofkillermonkeys @ 29:

Richard Vader @ 27:

I've just finished watching some travesty of a documentary on the History Channel about Iran's nuclear ambitions and the United States' and Israel's possible plans for attack.

One of the people being interviewed on the show was a supposedly ex-Mossad officer, under the pseudonym "Michael Ross". This guy's face was blurred out in the program, further adding to the mystique of him being an ex-spy. So, I looked him up on teh Google and came up with two interesting videos and one article written by an Israeli journalist.

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/848764.html
http://www.cbc.ca/thehour/video.php?id=1557
http://www.cbc.ca/sunday/2007/05/051307_1.html

In these CBC videos his face is shown. Why the secrecy in that History Channel documentary I don't know. Anyway, after reading the article and watching the two videos it seems to me the guy is a phony.

So, not only do I feel like my watching that documentary was a waste of time, but now I know that many people are going to profit from a showdown with Iran.

PS: Michael Ross' book is on bookshelves now. :P

Michael Ross = "Knuckleball" ?

I see what you did there. lol :D

swarmofkillermonkeys: You obviously have no idea how the education system works in this country. Go research it, find out what the Department of Education actually does (don't forget it's ever so short history!), and then go back and read your post (28). Do you really think that by getting rid of the Dept. of Education that everyone will have to be homeschooled? If so, you are right then... you defininately need MORE education.

Spike @ 12:

You all should really read the Graphic Novel by Alan Moore, it's far better than the movie.

V's speech from Jordon Tower in the movie (seen in clip) was somewhat different than the novel:

I suppose you're wondering why I've called you here this evening.

Well, you see, I'm not entirely satisfied with you performance lately ... I'm afraid we've been thinking about letting you go.

...

And it's no good blaming the drop in work standards upon bad management, either... Though, to be sure, the management is very bad. We've had a string of embezzlers, frauds, liars and lunatics making a string of catastrophic decisions. This is plain fact.

But who elected them?

It was You! You who appointed these people! You who gave them the power to make your decisions for you! While I'll admit that anyone can make a mistake once, to go on making the same lethal errors century after century seems to me nothing short of deliberate.

You have encouraged these malicious incompetents, who have made your working life a shambles. You have accepted without question their senseless orders. You have allowed them to fill your workspace with dangerous and unproven machines.

You could have stopped them.

All you had to say was "NO." You have no spine. You have no pride. You are no longer an asset to the company. I will, however, be generous. You will be granted two years to show me some improvement in your work. If at the end of that time you are still unwilling to make a go of it...

You're fired.

Ron Paul thinks the market will take care of everything. Funny, I'm pretty sure the market created children's toys with lead in them. No, we need regulations.

For a guy who hates the welfare state, he sure doesn't mind getting handouts.

It's now the 6th, and it's election day.

So *VOTE*!!!!

Whilst you got the chance to vote.

that @ 38:

Ron Paul thinks the market will take care of everything. Funny, I'm pretty sure the market created children's toys with lead in them. No, we need regulations.

You could always try buying American made toys. They won't have lead and you'd be supporting American workers. What a concept!

That is a cool video but this one is even better. Check it out. [Deleted. Nice try, but rather clumsy. It's why your comments go into moderation first-Sitemonitor]

swarmofkillermonkeys @ 28:

Oh come on. Ron Paul wants to destroy the Department of Education.

Yes, what would we do without No Childrens Left Behind??? Do you even know what ED does?? You might want to call up and get a new Internet so you can read the Wikipedias.

(As opposed to Buffet EARNING well over $40 billion dollars fair and square).

So Paul there's something unfair or unsquare about the donations to the Paul campaign?

So you are admitting that you censor my posts. [Have we ever denied it? Don't make assumptions about the reasons, because so far, you are wrong. This site is privately owned, and it is up to the site owner to decide content. There are many sites on the internet would be happy with your traffic and commentary. This is not one of them-Sitemonitor]

ON Ron Paul, I think it's wonderful that he's doing so well with financial contributions. I think it would be great for America if the Repulican'ts actual best candidate could somehow break through (the mirror ("Go to the mirror, boy" - the Who)) and win the Republican't primaries.

Of course he's full of shit on the social issues, but at least he's got it correct on our occupation of Iraq, and he's somewhat got it correct on the Constitution (though he doesn't when it comes to the (faked) abortion issue.)

Chris @ 42:

You could always try buying American made toys. They won't have lead and you'd be supporting American workers. What a concept!

You know why American toys contain no lead?
Because the CPSC prohibits the use of lead in toys. Another independent agency that would be eliminated by Ron Paul because the CPSC is not in the Constitution.

swarmofkillermonkeys @ 48:

LibertyLust @ 35:

This is for everyone that wants to talk shit about Ron Paul:
Your own party backstabs you. Get of your pedestal or get kicked off by the politician you support.

What does that have to do with Ron Paul? He is running as a Republican, but doesn't believe in their party at all! They call that a lie where I come from. He is lying to get more press, rather than running as Independent already.

But it hardly matters. He's a politician and his lips are moving. Of course he's lying.

Hey Dems, you got the Congress and you got the House. You know what you got? More approval for spying, immunity for corporations while your rights are whittled away, more dollars for war.

Well, I'm not a Dem, but rather crucially the don't really have the Senate. One has some sort of brain cancer, and the other is a Leiberman. Besides is Ron Paul running for Senate, House, and President at the same time? Wow, he's busy.

The Democratic House and Senate have proven that they're laughing at you. What have they done for you? NOTHING. So quit bitching about Ron Paul.

Eh, no. I won't "quit bitching about Ron Paul" until people stop spamming his "pie in the sky" bullshit in front of my face. I've yet to see substance from any Paulanista that actually matters in real life, and I will point that out, thankyouverymuch.

What have the Democrats done for you lately? NOTHING. What will they do for you in the future? NOTHING. Donors for the top tier Democrats are the same dollars that go to Republicans!

Again, your argument boils down to, "vote Ron Paul... he might not suck, who knows?" That's probably not really going to win over any of the Dems you keep chastising that believe in: worker's rights, social justice, antitrust regulation, environmentalism (protected by the Federal Government), social compassion for the sick and elderly, fair and equal treatment for all regardless of race or sexual orientation.... These don't really show up on a platform consisting solely of "Kill the gov'ment! Kill the gov'ment! Kill the gov'ment!"

Your own party backstabs you. Your own party backstabs you. Your own party backstabs you. Why should we listen to you bitching about Ron Paul? Your own party backstabs you! They laugh at you.

Woah, see there you go again. I can only say, "Take your pills! Take your pills! Take your pills! Take your pills!"

Look, I personally think Ron is OK as a voice in the party. Just like Nader is for the Dems. Hey, that's great. Pull from the edges, it makes for healthy debate. But PRESIDENT? No f'ing way, my friend. I grew up in a blood red state surrounded by big L LIbertarians. I get it. There is some merit there.

But the rest is... just not well thought out. Crazy even; just not rational. In some ways my idealistic Libertarian friends are more "out there" than my bleeding-heart pacifist friends (though I agree with neither completely). Using force will always be neccessary, but "might makes right" is no way to run a country, and is the eventual outcome of libertarian anarchy.

swarmofkillermonkeys @ 48:

LibertyLust @ 35:

This is for everyone that wants to talk shit about Ron Paul:
Your own party backstabs you. Get of your pedestal or get kicked off by the politician you support.

What does that have to do with Ron Paul? He is running as a Republican, but doesn't believe in their party at all! They call that a lie where I come from. He is lying to get more press, rather than running as Independent already.

But it hardly matters. He's a politician and his lips are moving. Of course he's lying.

Hey Dems, you got the Congress and you got the House. You know what you got? More approval for spying, immunity for corporations while your rights are whittled away, more dollars for war.

Well, I'm not a Dem, but rather crucially the don't really have the Senate. One has some sort of brain cancer, and the other is a Leiberman. Besides is Ron Paul running for Senate, House, and President at the same time? Wow, he's busy.

The Democratic House and Senate have proven that they're laughing at you. What have they done for you? NOTHING. So quit bitching about Ron Paul.

Eh, no. I won't "quit bitching about Ron Paul" until people stop spamming his "pie in the sky" bullshit in front of my face. I've yet to see substance from any Paulanista that actually matters in real life, and I will point that out, thankyouverymuch.

What have the Democrats done for you lately? NOTHING. What will they do for you in the future? NOTHING. Donors for the top tier Democrats are the same dollars that go to Republicans!

Again, your argument boils down to, "vote Ron Paul... he might not suck, who knows?" That's probably not really going to win over any of the Dems you keep chastising that believe in: worker's rights, social justice, antitrust regulation, environmentalism (protected by the Federal Government), social compassion for the sick and elderly, fair and equal treatment for all regardless of race or sexual orientation.... These don't really show up on a platform consisting solely of "Kill the gov'ment! Kill the gov'ment! Kill the gov'ment!"

Your own party backstabs you. Your own party backstabs you. Your own party backstabs you. Why should we listen to you bitching about Ron Paul? Your own party backstabs you! They laugh at you.

Woah, see there you go again. I can only say, "Take your pills! Take your pills! Take your pills! Take your pills!"

Look, I personally think Ron is OK as a voice in the party. Just like Nader is for the Dems. Hey, that's great. Pull from the edges, it makes for healthy debate. But PRESIDENT? No f'ing way, my friend. I grew up in a blood red state surrounded by big L LIbertarians. I get it. There is some merit there.

But the rest is... just not well thought out. Crazy even; just not rational. In some ways my idealistic Libertarian friends are more "out there" than my bleeding-heart pacifist friends (though I agree with neither completely). Using force will always be neccessary, but "might makes right" is no way to run a country, and is the eventual outcome of libertarian anarchy.

Libertarian anarchy? Oh really? I didn't know...

I didn't know respecting the Constitution and abiding by it was an act of anarchy.

Democrats have helped Bush fund his war and have given him more spying power, but yeah, Ron Paul's the irrational one...

Tell me, what have the Democrats done for you? They going to vote in that new AG guy and he's shady on the torture. What are dems going to do? They're going to support him. That's must be the true color of rationality that Ron Paul lacks.

LibertyLust @ 35:

This is for everyone that wants to talk shit about Ron Paul:

Your own party backstabs you. Get of your pedestal or get kicked off by the politician you support.

Hey Dems, you got the Congress and you got the House. You know what you got? More approval for spying, immunity for corporations while your rights are whittled away, more dollars for war.

The Democratic House and Senate have proven that they're laughing at you. What have they done for you? NOTHING. So quit bitching about Ron Paul.

What have the Democrats done for you lately? NOTHING. What will they do for you in the future? NOTHING.

Donors for the top tier Democrats are the same dollars that go to Republicans!

Thank you!This needed to be said. It's why I left the Democratic party a long time ago and became an independent. Most of the Democrats don't care about you any more than most of the Republicans. It's the truth, and you need to learn to accept it. Look at the current congress. Mike Gravel has pointed out that if the Democrats really cared about ending the Iraq occupation, they could get it done. But almost none of them have big balls, like Gravel apparently does. They're more concerned about their political career. And I guess that would be the first concern of a career politician. They know that a new "credible" tare threat will come out at just the right time (by coincedence of course!) and they'll take a political hit.

Really, if you were to ask me which of the Democrats do I think actually cares about people, I'd probably say Dennis Kucinich, although I have a lot of respect for Gravel for ending nam and reading things into the congressional record to get them out there for the public to see. Just because someone's in the Democratic party doesn't mean they give a rat's ass about you; stop dreaming!

Yeah, yeah
Ron smells great
Yeah, yeah
Ron smells good

What if Ron was what he (or his chronies) said he is?

(parody of the parody of Joan Osborn's What If God Was One Of Us titled What If God Smoked Canibis, I think I'll title it 'What If Ron was Legitimate')

Stanley Rosenthal @ 57:

Yeah, yeah
Ron smells great
Yeah, yeah
Ron smells good

What if Ron was what he (or his chronies) said he is?

(parody of the parody of Joan Osborn's What If God Was One Of Us titled What If God Smoked Canibis, I think I'll title it 'What If Ron was Legitimate')

The messiah, apparently?

Dustin de Wynde @ 14:

Yeah, mega dittoes on Ron Paul.

~nwa

Wait a minute.

Did you just seriously use the phrase "mega dittoes" [sic]? As in some weird form of cult worship of Rush Limbaugh? Wow.

As if I didn't have enough evidence cross Ron Paul off the list already...

"VOTE OF FOR RON PAUL -- RUSH LIMBAUGH SAYS SO!"

Yeeeah. That should go over real well with the Democrats you all seem to be chasing. HA! Good for a laugh though, thanks! Night!

swar -
> The messiah, apparently?

Not so "apparent", but I will say that it is my opinion that just as Man created God (IMHO), so is it possible that rock stars can create their own (apparent) messieah. If so, that's me of course. :-)

> Loggins and messieah?

ROFLMAO!!!!

I think you misspelled it of course. It should be spelled "log in(s) ... " IMHO.

swarmofkillermonkeys @ 58:

LibertyLust @ 56:

Damian @ 54:

Oh, and you Ronbots want proof? Google his name. I'm not doing what you should have done already.

Tell me what Dems have succeeded in doing since winning the House and Senate thanks to your votes. I tried googling that info and found nothing. Please help me out. Here's what I did find:

- gave Bush more spying power

- gave Bush more dollars for war

can you add to this list of success' by the Democrats? I'd appreciate your help.

Just one small example, since you are avoiding the issues already raised and rebutted (and I'm running out of time to play):

So you've never heard of Waxman, then?

You are unaware of the fall of Alberto Gonzales?

Do you even READ Crooks and Liars?!

Hell, I'm pretty damn happy with just watching Waxman rip apart the dogs of war that have been ripping us off in Iraq. A think of beauty, and it sets the stage for criminal prosecution of the VP, at least. But lets not also forget also mention that it is one of the busiest congressional sessions in history so far. Hindered only by one of the most obstructing opposition parties (republicans, of course) in history.

Why are you just parroting republican talking points? Are you REALLY that bad at using Google? And worse, why are you making me defend the damn Dems?

Please, oh please, oh.... dear god please....

You mean to tell me you are going to credit the Democrats for the boot that went up Alberto Gonzales' ass?!

You make it seem like the man didn't commit career suicide with the shit he pulled. To add on that, if this guy gets approved as the new AG, what difference would it make?! You make some of the weakest arguments ever. I read the news, not just a fucking blog. Had you tried to pull your head out of the Democrat Glee Club Blogs and read some news along with it, you would have known that Alberto crossed the line and even the immoral Republican party couldn't turn a blind eye to such blatant activity. That's why it became a bi-partisan issue, but here you are claiming this was a Democratic Party victory. Alberto served his own head on a silver platter and you got the audacity to claim it to be a Democrat victory.

I also heard Waxman is scaring the shit out of Republicans by holding "hearings". Wow! Damn dude, maybe in 20 years we'll actually be able to end the war! Cross your fingers, the hearings will clean up the government... in like 30-40 years... ah the sweet taste of progress!

You vote 'em in, they do nothing for you, then you make excuse for them and hand them false victories... you sure you're not a neo-con?

Opposites attract. The two will combine to make a moderate. pres and VP don't need to agree on things. Congress and the supreme court do.

Paul in a recent interview, although he acknowledged he had a lot of differences with Kucinich, he did not rule out the possibility of the two of them becoming running mates.

The two of them are beginning to force a change in the BS rhetoric the conventional candidates continue to spew. I'm tired of the status quo. I'm willing to gamble for a big change because the only thing you will get with Bush Clinton Bush Clinton is consistency.

How much worse can things get? If we end the war and begin to repair the economy, its a helluva start.

swarmofkillermonkeys @ 58:

So you've never heard of Waxman, then?

You are unaware of the fall of Alberto Gonzales?

Why are you just parroting republican talking points? Are you REALLY that bad at using Google? And worse, why are you making me defend the damn Dems?

Are you using a special Google?

What exactly has been accomplished? A great friend of mine still might get called up to go to Iraq, where he could be shot and killed. "Ripping apart" defense contractors doesn't do anything about that.

And Gonzales?? Sure, he's an a**hole, but he's just a figurehead. There's still plenty more in the administration, and the new guy looked better at first, but now he's going to play ball and do what W wants. He won't say that waterboarding is torture, which it obviously is, but some Democrats are going to vote to confirm him anyway. So how does this improve things? Habaeus Corpus is still gone, the Iraq occupation is still going on, defense contractors are still ripping off taxpayers. Meanwhile, the dick is getting ready to go to war with Iran.

David Addington is still there. Ever hear of the signing statements -- you know, where w says he's above the law and will ignore it as he pleases? Well, addington is the brains behind that.

What has been accomplished? Well, I am encouraged by Conyers.

curt -
> Paul in a recent interview, although he acknowledged he had a lot of differences with Kucinich, he did not rule out the possibility of the two of them becoming running mates.

Paul can dream all he likes. Being a Republican't he can dream he can have sex with a guy, but the guy he's dreaming of having sex with has a wife that has a stud in her tongue. :-) And she's extremely fine looking. I don't think Paul's gonna be able to compete with her.

[Edited-Sitemonitor]

I absolutely loved this movie when it came out on DVD. I swear I watched it every night for a week. It is one of my favorites!

"God is in the rain..."

"Your comment is awaiting moderation"

I've seen that kind've thing on Wordpress blogs before. It almost makes me yearn for the days of HaloScam. :-) So I'll try posting this without the obvious knock on the Curt(ilingus) pseudo -

Paul can dream all he likes. Being a Republican’t he can dream he can have sex with a guy, but the guy he’s dreaming of having sex with has a wife that has a stud in her toungue. And she’s extremely fine looking. I don’t think Paul’s gonna be able to compete with her.

[It's a word within a word. You pretty much figured it out. Insulting name edited-Sitemonitor]

Paul can dream all he likes. Being a Republican’t he can dream he can have sex with a guy, but the guy he’s dreaming of having sex with has a wife that has a stud in her toungue. And she’s extremely fine looking. I don’t think Paul’s gonna be able to compete with her.

20 years ago I predicted that candidates of today would brag that they had done fewer hits of acid than the other candidates, and was more qualified based on that attribute.

Instead, the crux of the competition lies in whether his wife has a tongue piercing, and how many.

Who woulda thunk?

Damian @ 52:

I love how the Ronbots won't answer to the facts that RONPAUL IS A RACIST, ANTI-CHOICE, PARANOID SCUMBAG. They already know it's true, they've seen it, and they just ignore it.

When they find out that their Chosen One is worthless scum, they'll just stick right by him.

And they'll fail like every other scumbag like him.

Damien,

It's because everything you've stated here are ignorant rants and blatant lies. Get your facts straight. You need some education on real history. Try reading "Shadows of Power" - by James Perloff. Guess what you don't even need the Dept. Of Education to pick out the book for you but maybe you do...

Your incoherent rambling only shows your lack of education. Try looking past those blinders and expand your mind a bit. If you are any kind of patriot you will be angered at what you discover.

Good night and good luck!

i just watched "to die in jerusalem" on hbo

i seriously think every member of the chimp's administration and every pro war nutjob should be forced to watch that doc

we are fighting a people who cannot be defeated, for they see death as martyrs as greater than life

and we are creating a brand new generation of martyrs

V - Speech
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-F6xfMl8Go&watch_response

V- Story
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uS_i8n3b_TI&watch_response

Sound familiar to anyone? e.g. duhbya, chainy, et. al.

If Ron Paul had one nut to go around, he would file impeachment, like he says should be done. WHY DOESN'T HE?

The Conyers filing today is 858 pages. It documents the entire US Attorney scandal -- it is not just some wasted effort.

But if they deal is that you prefer to fantasize about your favorite Republican dream candidate, rather than talk about -- you know, actual politics -- then any facts will do.

No liberal will vote for Ron Paul if they are actually liberal. Does Ron Paul oppose torture? NO, HE DOES NOT. He opposes the Geneva Conventions themselves. He opposes all international law, and is trying to dismantle the International Criminal Court, his biggest accomplishment in the last five years, in amendments he shared with Senator Jesse Helms. Because no votes on passing bills is A DIME A DOZEN. It doesn't cost him anything.

He can possibly save the nation, by filing a Republican impeachment and staking his entire career on the one real vote for what he believes in. But he won't do it.

Chairman Conyers just put another REAL barrier in the way of this history-changing nightmare. He won't get Bolton or Miers to appear, and the US attorney -- on orders from his thug boss -- won't comply. But it's Chairman Conyers who's doing any of the real fighting here.

Maybe Kucinich needs a mask?

Wag @ 91 "Wow....the readers of that site are completely in for a schocker when they realize they have been influenced by Christian fundamentalists."

That kind of stuff gets washed. Wikipedia is surprisingly self-cleaning.

The wiki is one of the biggest discoveries of the last 500 years. Will absolutely transform the informational world in every language. It's an incredible sharing of information, the delivery of a birthright of access to empowering education. No education is foolproof.

"No, I think he promotes anarchy because he promotes anarchy. As in complete deregulation of EVERY market of EVERY service."

And de-nationalization of our standards for equal rights, including equal labor rights, and equal rights for all.

In other words, a return to pre-WWII and pre-FDR Republicanism.

Oh yeah, he's our hero. The Whigs (and the Know Nothings that follow them) are coming out of the woodwork.

steve Says: August 9th, 2007

Last night, We sought to end that silence. Last night, We destroyed the Old Lieberman to remind this country of what it has forgotten.

----

"Destroyed the Old Lieberman"

LOL

swarmofkillermonkeys @ 62:

Dustin de Wynde @ 14:

Yeah, mega dittoes on Ron Paul.

~nwa

Wait a minute.

Did you just seriously use the phrase "mega dittoes" [sic]? As in some weird form of cult worship of Rush Limbaugh? Wow.

As if I didn't have enough evidence cross Ron Paul off the list already...

"VOTE OF FOR RON PAUL -- RUSH LIMBAUGH SAYS SO!"

Yeeeah. That should go over real well with the Democrats you all seem to be chasing. HA! Good for a laugh though, thanks! Night!

Oh, Jiminy Cricket and Jesus H. Christ on a shingle, it's just a turn of phrase that, like it, or not, has entered the common vernacular.

Considering that the bulk of the body of that post of mine reflected the glaring problem with the s/Election process for President of the USA costing over $1 Billion Dollars, for a job that only pays $1 Million Dollars, (over 4 yrs, after taxes), I'd say that a) either I wasn't communicating properly, or b) you completely missed my point.

I just don't get the fiscal logic of spending $1,000, (or more), per every $1 dollar that will be received in compensation for the job done.

Makes zero sense to me.

And I've yet to hear a rational argument as to why this $1,000 to $1 dollar ratio is a good thing.

A libertarian like Ron Paul, or anybody else that wants to write the United States Annual Federal Budget, should be screaming about that, but he isn't, and not a one of any of the others are.

So how can any of them be trusted with The People's Money?

Instead we get these quarterly reports that practically fall over themselves with glee with how many millions of dollars the candidates are, or are not, raising.

As far as libertarians go, I find them to be delusional. They labor under the belief that everyone can be a millionaire if that pesky old government would just get out of the way.

For one, not everyone will be a millionaire, no matter how hard they work, and two, for many people that much money in their hands might not necessarily be the best thing for them.

The modern state of "Money" is just a game, and like any other game, some people are really good at it, and most aren't.

That's why it's the Forbes 400 and not the Forbes 40,000,000.

And, just to kick out another rung in libertarian "philosophy", we do need government for some things. The whole reason that we invented Social Security in the first effing place is that not everybody is capable of taking care of themselves, and we created that particular program as an insurance policy so that we would ensure that we wouldn't have a significant proportion of our elderly population starving in the streets, like they were before SS was invented.

As far as Ron Paul goes, speaking as a recovered Republican, even with the dearth and paucity of this Republican field, I wouldn't support him if my life depended on it, or on a bet.

His widely circulated racist comments beat Ronald Reagan's 'Welfare Queens driving around in Cadillacs' by a country mile.

At least Reagan had the good sense to speak in code.

~nwa

uncle joe mccarthy @ 86:

i just watched "to die in jerusalem" on hbo

i seriously think every member of the chimp's administration and every pro war nutjob should be forced to watch that doc

we are fighting a people who cannot be defeated, for they see death as martyrs as greater than life

and we are creating a brand new generation of martyrs

I've said it once and I'll say it again. Uncle Joe, you are unfamiliar with the Israeli Palestinian conflict and you do not understand the reality of the occupation. One documentary on HBO surely doesn't change that fact. Have you ever been to the Occupied Territories?

Death does not equal martydom because it's cool or because it's pop culture, the way you make it sound. Think about what drives a person to commit suicide, in the psychological sense, the desperation, the lack of hope, the alienation, etc.

People in the West Bank and Gaza live under constant siege. They can't move 500 feet without some authority demanding to see their papers or ordering them to go back wherever they came from or worse, pointing a gun at them or punching them in the stomach. Kids can't go to school because many schools have been shutdown.

Random house searches are all too common. Can you imagine being awakened in the middle of the night, by a bunch of soldiers who kicked in your door for no reason and are walking around your house with loaded weapons and barking K9 dogs asking you and your kids questions? Now, pretend it happens every single night, over and over.

People have described their miserable conditions under occupation as a feeling of being asphyxiated, they can't breath anymore, they can't do anything or go anywhere to change their sad existence.

Israel occupied Gaza and the West Bank in 1967. The Intifada (Arabic for Shake-off [of the occupiers]) didn't start until 1987.

That year, 1987, the Palestinians collectively said, enough is enough. We will not accept this humiliation, pain and suffering and will respond in kind. They have tried civil disobedience prior to 1987, but that not only got them nowhere, but it got them injured and shot. Then, in 1994, when the peace talks "failed", mainly because Israel refused to remove the illegal Jewish settlements, the Palestinians resorted to suicide bombings. Put a pressure cooker on a stove and seal it shut, then pretend like everything is OK and walk away. See what happens? That's what happens to people under occupation.

So, as you can see, the transformation was gradual and it was due to circumstance, not some genetic makeup that causes those "evil doers, the Muslims" to do bad things.

As for the "martyrdom" label. It's just a way for the grieving mothers and wives to convince themselves that the loss of their loved ones wasn't in vain. So they glorify it, like many Americans speak of their dead soldiers as "heroes". It's the same human need to say, "he didn't die in vain".

@uncle joe mccarthy

I almost forgot. Since you're so keen on painting the Muslim world and Arabs in particular as fanatical violent creatures you might consider the not so convenient truth about what started the entire conflict. I'm talking about the means by which Israel took over the land that is today Israel proper. Let's go back a few years to 1948.

Professor Ilan Pappe the historian (an Israeli Jew) of the University of Haifa, wrote in his research into the Israeli Palestinian conflict about the crimes against Palestinians.

He stated that between March 30 and May 5, 1948 (before any Arab government intervened) Israeli forces seized 200 villages and expelled 250,000 Palestinians.

The Israeli leadership stated that the primary objective was the destruction of Arab villages and the eviction of the residents. On April 9, Israeli forces massacred 93 people, including 30 babies, at Deir Yassin.

In Haifa, the Israeli commander ordered to kill any Arab they encountered.

That year (1948), Professor Pappe explains, Israel uprooted more than half of Palestine's population, 800,000 people, destroyed 531 villages and emptied eleven urban neighborhoods of their inhabitants.

I saw this movie "V for Vendetta", and promptly watched it about a dozen times. Simply the best movie put out in years! I'm going to buy it!

It's exactly what's going on right now in our country and in the world!

Ron Paul is a Must Miss!

I suggest everyone reads up on the history of Pakistan since 1986 to best understand what 'THAT" is all about. I have and it has America's grimy paw prints all over it. But most importantly, it shows you what knowledgable, seriously Democratic people do with a Government who tries to take away their freedom.

I look at Americans and the rest of the world like American, British and Aussie Rules football.

The only way Americans can play this "mans game" is coated in Kevlar....nice and safe, while in other countries, the football they play is the same as it's been for 100 years. Rough and with little protection. Don't need protection when the "opponents" show respect for the rules of the game and each other.
THAT'S DIPLOMACY.

Daily Reading pt 1...

Climate Wars Threaten Billions - http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2007/nov/04/climatechange.scienceo...
More than 100 countries face political chaos and mass migration in global warming catastrophe. A total of 46 nations and 2.7 billion people are now at high risk of being overwhelmed by armed conflict and war because of climate change. A further 56 countries face political destabilization, affecting another 1.2 billion individuals.
This unlike boogeyman 'terrorism' will impact all life on earth...no one will be safe...not even the Walton's and their underground city: http://www.walmartmovie.com/

Keith Olbermann Accuses Bush of Waterboarding Us, With Schumer and Feinstein Enabling Him: A Dazzling Commentary - http://www.thoughttheater.com/2007/11/keith_olbermann_special_comment_11...

Tuesday, November 6th: Catch Michael Moore on Countdown With Keith Olbermann - http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036677/
Tune in to MSNBC at 8:00 PM ET ... LIVE!

New York's former mayor Rudy Giuliani is living up to his reputation as someone who will do and say anything for power - http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/story/0,,2205320,00.html
"This is one dangerous man: it's George Bush with brains" Rudy = Bush, its that simple
Nov. '07 Evil GOP Bastard of the Month: Rudy Giuliani - http://www.evilgopbastards.com/

Texas Oil Fuels the White House - http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinion/337888_erbe04.html?source=rss
As oil nears $100 per barrel, as gas exceeds $3 per gallon nationally and as heating oil and natural gas spiral skyward in anticipation of winter, debate is brewing once again over who is at fault.A smidgen of history is necessary here. Crude was trading at about $25 per barrel the year that George W. Bush was inaugurated.....
In April last year, Rep. Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., was asked why gas prices were surging ever closer to $3 per gallon. She told CNN: "We have two oilmen in the White House ... . The logical follow-up from that is $3-a-gallon gasoline. It is no accident. It is a cause and effect."

It's Time to Impeach Cheney, by Dennis Kucinich - http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/?q=node/28427

This is the piece the MSM should have had right away on Gerald Ford's book: Book Gives Another Look at Ford's Mixed Feelings About Cheney - http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/11/04/AR200711...

BradBlog: TIME magazine: The 'Stampede Away from Touchscreen' - http://www.bradblog.com/?p=5245

brent @ 2:

Yes, Congratulations to Ron Paul. $4million dollars, one day, 35,000 donors. Freedom. The Constitution. Liberty.

$50.00 + $40.00 in Ron Paul gear from the Human family.
Lot's of people remembered! Later today I'll be taking my draft Al Gore link and putting Ron Paul in it's place. Right after I work the polls for a local candidate today. Ahhh to be an Independent and free of the false paradigm of Republican vs. Democrat.
Peace.

I really didn't intend to get into the whole Ron Paul debate that has been popping up here fairly frequently recently, but reading through the post today got me fairly worked up, so here's my two cents: Ron Paul and his supporters are right in that many government agencies seem to be failing at doing their intended jobs and are not currently worth spending money on. However, the intended services that these agencies provide are valid. As has already been stated, the CPSC should be keeping unsafe products from the market through regulation. I'd prefer this to waiting for a product to kill so many people that the company behind it is shamed into changing or losing business, especially given the ability of big businesses to hide their mistakes. The reason the agency isn't working well is because it is not being run competently. This doesn't mean the agency should be dismantled. It means it should be run better. The same goes for the Department of Education, to give another previously cited example. NCLB is lousy, but the basic idea of having increased, measurable standards for our students is a good idea. Just look at the countries that are doing a better job of educating their children (yes, I know there are many factors other than national standards at work). It just makes sense to me to work to make programs better and more effective than to dismantle them because the current form isn't perfect. Okay, that was more than two cents worth...probably a quarter.

114 thrillhouse

I have to completely disagree. The watchdog agencies are not being run well by design. The Republicans do not believe in the Departments of Labor, Education, the Food and Drug Administration, hell, they don't even want our top scientists in government speaking without first being "vetted."

No, it is not the program's fault they are failing, they are failing by design.

right wing hater @ 111:

Sorry...ANYONE...who still identifies as a REPUBLICAN...with the party completely in the hands of the religious right, Big Oil/Old Energy, and the Military Industrial Complex...DOES NOT DESERVE YOUR VOTE....and that includes 'libertarian' Ron Paul...

Excellent point.

Besides 'Libertariansim' is for teenagers not a functioning society.

Which, despite George W. Bush, ours still is.

Here are two questions that will shut the waterboarding argument down.

1.If waterboarding isn't torture, would it be okay if someone waterboared American troops when they're captured?

2. should children be waterboared to obtain information?

"Feinstein is familiar with being the lone Democrat to side with Republicans on the Judiciary Committee. She did so in August by joining all nine Republicans in voting for the nomination of Leslie Southwick for a lifetime seat on a New Orleans-based appeals court – over the strong objections of the other nine committee Democrats because of the nominee’s civil rights record. And now on Mukasey. " http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/schumer-feinstein-surprise-thwarts-e...

Feinstein: The new Joe Lieberman. Undermining the Democratic Party from within.

The hysterical attacks on Ron Paul on this site are really pathetic. They seem to boil down to a few certain types of criticism.

1. The "Our Team vs. Their Team" argument. Ron Paul is a Republican, all Republicans are evil, therefore Ron Paul is evil. Nevermind that he has a better voting record on civil liberties, antiwar issues, health freedom, etc. than most Democrats running.

2. The breathless name calling argument. Ron Paul is RACIST, HOMOPHOBE, MISOGYNIST, ANARCHIST. No examples, no documentation, just get your talking points out there. This would be more at home on FreeRepublic.

3. The damning with faint praise argument. Ron Paul is right on the war/torture/civil liberties BUT he is pro-life/pro-capitalism/anti Dept. of Ed. etc. Keep waiting for your mythical Democrat candidate that is right on everything, sorry but he/she does not exist.

If more liberal progressives would stop obsessing over social programs and abortion than maybe we could actually prevent our next war and preserve constitutional govt. in the USA. I'll tell you this, if Hillary/Obama/Edwards are elected we will be bombing Iran in the next 2 years. Then when oil is $200 a barrel and the economy collapses you probably will be more concerned about getting to work and feeding your family than worrying about abortion and gay marriage.

From Screech Carlson kast night:

"They are not just men, I mean they're Democrats, sensitive new-age men, I mean they're ????, Volvo driving, whole food shopping, they are the kind of guys that cry during Mac Ryan movies, I mean they are kind of in touch with their ???, they're not manly men,, they're wimpy men"

The insanity of that wimp to talk about manly men, as if he knew what that meant.

What's the deal with Ron Paul fans coming over to Crooks and Liars and trying to sell him to the rest of us? This is John's website and those of us that have been coming here for years all lean left. Kucinich or Edwards or Gore but never Ron Paul. We (the long term lefty C and L fans) are against the war but also against Ron Paul on social issues in the USA. For all that Ron Paul says about the Constitution what has he actually done to stop his warmongering party? Nothing. Kucinich on the other hand is attempting to impeach. Action speaks louder than words. Paul profess' to be a Republican and a christian but who is really doing god's work? (if there is a god). That person would be Dennis Kucinich.

Beanzie @ 126:

"...If more liberal progressives would stop obsessing over social programs and abortion..."

We wouldn't be liberal or progressive. And if we did YOUR bidding, we'd be sheep, and Libertarian, just like you.

Baa baa baa and ugh. No thank you.

"on Paul could not only win, he could easily do so."

And monkeys could fly out of his ass.

Beanzie @ 126 "The "Our Team vs. Their Team" argument. Ron Paul is a Republican, all Republicans are evil, therefore Ron Paul is evil. Nevermind that he has a better voting record on civil liberties, antiwar issues, health freedom, etc. than most Democrats running."

Voting Nay on bills which will pass anyhow is not an accomplishment.

"2. The breathless name calling argument. Ron Paul is RACIST, HOMOPHOBE, MISOGYNIST, ANARCHIST. No examples, no documentation, just get your talking points out there. This would be more at home on FreeRepublic."

The examples are well known. His misogyny, for instance, is demonstrated by his desire to dismantle a woman's right to choose, which btw has a devastating effect on the lives of women.

"3. The damning with faint praise argument. Ron Paul is right on the war/torture/civil liberties BUT he is pro-life/pro-capitalism/anti Dept. of Ed. etc. Keep waiting for your mythical Democrat candidate that is right on everything, sorry but he/she does not exist."

Being 'right' is not the same as accomplishing anything. It's very easy for RP to be 'right' on the war his party forced on us, eh? As for torture, RP supports torture. He would dismantle the entire internatiohal framework of law against torture. He doesn't believe anyone has a right to interfere with the sovereignty of torturers.

"If more liberal progressives would stop obsessing over social programs and abortion than maybe we could actually prevent our next war and preserve constitutional govt. in the USA."

Sure, he's our Saviour. He just wants to hand us back over to the parochial state gov'ts because he loves us. And let every looney in the bin out into the light of day, because if a state wants to enshrine a religion or put a burning swastika on their flag, who is to say they can't? The states have no duty to a federal standard.

He's such a fraud.

Another reasonable response from an objective and calm reader. Let me answer these point by point.

1. Voting Nay on bills which will pass anyhow is not an accomplishment.

So because he does not singlehandedly convince the entire congress to go along with him he is a failure? You could easily say the same thing about Dennis Kucinich, and would be wrong about him as well.

2. The examples are well known. His misogyny, for instance, is demonstrated by his desire to dismantle a woman’s right to choose, which btw has a devastating effect on the lives of women.

So even though he is an OB/GYN he is not allowed to have an opinion on abortion without being a misogynist? So you
apparently think it is impossible to honestly and respectfully disagree on this issue?

3. Being ‘right’ is not the same as accomplishing anything. It’s very easy for RP to be ‘right’ on the war his party forced on us, eh? As for torture, RP supports torture. He would dismantle the entire internatiohal framework of law against torture. He doesn’t believe anyone has a right to interfere with the sovereignty of torturers.

The war his party forced on us? So even though he forcefully and intelligently spoke out against the war, and VOTED AGAINST IT! He is more responsible than Clinton, Edwards, etc.? This is really the worst kind of guilt by association.

4. Sure, he’s our Saviour. He just wants to hand us back over to the parochial state gov’ts because he loves us. And let every looney in the bin out into the light of day, because if a state wants to enshrine a religion or put a burning swastika on their flag, who is to say they can’t? The states have no duty to a federal standard.

He’s such a fraud.

How is expressing my belief in someone being a good candidate calling him your "Saviour"? If you don't agree with his stance on limited Federal govt. that's fine, but calm down with the hyperbole. As for calling him a fraud, whatever you think of him he is completely upfront about all his policies, more than we can say for many other candidates.

I guess the way I would put it is this, what do you fear more? Endless war, a surveillance society, and an all powerful executive branch? Or someone theoretically not being able to get an abortion in certain states? It isn't a hard decision for me.

Griffin @ 130:

What's the deal with Ron Paul fans coming over to Crooks and Liars and trying to sell him to the rest of us? This is John's website and those of us that have been coming here for years all lean left. Kucinich or Edwards or Gore but never Ron Paul. We (the long term lefty C and L fans) are against the war but also against Ron Paul on social issues in the USA. For all that Ron Paul says about the Constitution what has he actually done to stop his warmongering party? Nothing. Kucinich on the other hand is attempting to impeach. Action speaks louder than words. Paul profess' to be a Republican and a christian but who is really doing god's work? (if there is a god). That person would be Dennis Kucinich.

I've been coming here a long time before discovering Ron Paul, and I have this to say to you: Ron Paul is bridging party lines by taking in left-leaning people as well as conservatives. Isn't this something we should all support? He never supported the Iraq War or interventionism, and he wants to save our rights as guaranteed by the constitution. What is wrong with that?

Griffin @ 130:

What's the deal with Ron Paul fans coming over to Crooks and Liars and trying to sell him to the rest of us? This is John's website and those of us that have been coming here for years all lean left. Kucinich or Edwards or Gore but never Ron Paul. We (the long term lefty C and L fans) are against the war but also against Ron Paul on social issues in the USA. For all that Ron Paul says about the Constitution what has he actually done to stop his warmongering party? Nothing. Kucinich on the other hand is attempting to impeach. Action speaks louder than words. Paul profess' to be a Republican and a christian but who is really doing god's work? (if there is a god). That person would be Dennis Kucinich.

Speak for yourself pal. You don't represent me. I've been reading/commenting at C&L for years. If you don't like the Pro Ron Paul comments just skip 'em. Just like I know you've skipped even listening to Ron Paul himself. Because, I'm sure, you know it all.

Hey everybody here is an excellent post sizing up Ron Paul for all he is and isn't.

http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2007/11/06/paul/index.html

It is generally positive and addresses many of the points both sides have been bringing up. Glen Greenwald makes one important comment a few other people on this thread need to internalize. Just because one writes a positive comment about a candidate does not mean 1)that they are voting for them 2) that they agree with everything they say.

curtilingus @ 144:

Hey everybody here is an excellent post sizing up Ron Paul for all he is and isn't.
http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2007/11/06/paul/index.html

It is generally positive and addresses many of the points both sides have been bringing up. Glen Greenwald makes one important comment a few other people on this thread need to internalize. Just because one writes a positive comment about a candidate does not mean 1)that they are voting for them 2) that they agree with everything they say.

Thanks for the link! Glen is pretty sharp, and usually an interesting read. As to 1 & 2... if you look the majority of Paulanista comments (here or elsewhere) are overwhelmingly of the "Yuo R stoopid! Dems suck vote Ron Pal!!!11one" variety. Not intelligent engagement on the size of government.

Griffin @ 130:

What's the deal with Ron Paul fans coming over to Crooks and Liars and trying to sell him to the rest of us? This is John's website and those of us that have been coming here for years all lean left. Kucinich or Edwards or Gore but never Ron Paul. We (the long term lefty C and L fans) are against the war but also against Ron Paul on social issues in the USA. For all that Ron Paul says about the Constitution what has he actually done to stop his warmongering party? Nothing. Kucinich on the other hand is attempting to impeach. Action speaks louder than words. Paul profess' to be a Republican and a christian but who is really doing god's work? (if there is a god). That person would be Dennis Kucinich.

A good point, but surely they would be welcome (as I feel I have been, though I've never been a Dem) if they were argue honestly instead of being contemptuous brats. I've seen a lot of ex-Republicans here that make a lot of sense.

Beanzie @ 126:

The hysterical attacks on Ron Paul on this site are really pathetic. They seem to boil down to a few certain types of criticism.

1. The "Our Team vs. Their Team" argument. Ron Paul is a Republican, all Republicans are evil, therefore Ron Paul is evil. Nevermind that he has a better voting record on civil liberties, antiwar issues, health freedom, etc. than most Democrats running.

Really? I never said Ron Paul was evil, but running as a Republican rather than a Libertarian or Independent makes him a liar at his very core. But hey, why be honest when you can make more money and seize more power by being dishonest, right? The fundamental flaw with Ron Paul... he sold out long ago, whatever he says. Look at his actions instead.

2. The breathless name calling argument. Ron Paul is RACIST, HOMOPHOBE, MISOGYNIST, ANARCHIST. No examples, no documentation, just get your talking points out there. This would be more at home on FreeRepublic.

3. The damning with faint praise argument. Ron Paul is right on the war/torture/civil liberties BUT he is pro-life/pro-capitalism/anti Dept. of Ed. etc. Keep waiting for your mythical Democrat candidate that is right on everything, sorry but he/she does not exist.

Actually I gave you very substantive positions above, rather than just "faint praise" or "namecalling". Incidentally, anarchists don't view that label as a negative at all. And there are quite a few around. It is more useful than "libertarian" because that label means many things politically (even the Libertarian party changes the planks in their platform dramatically every few years). Just like "authoritarian" may be more useful than "neocon".

The irony here is I agree with much of the rhetoric of Ron, just not his phony actions. Government IS too large right now, and it IS way too inefficient and corrupt. I would repair the house, however -- Ron claims he would burn it down to fix it. That is childish. I'm perfectly happy with my choice of Edwards, who is not "mythical" and seems pretty pissed off by electoral and government corruption lately.

If more liberal progressives would stop obsessing over social programs and abortion than maybe we could actually prevent our next war and preserve constitutional govt. in the USA.

I agree 100%. No doubt about it, the root problem of most abortion is social inequality, education, and public safety. All people of the U.S. should work towards a future where there ARE NO ABORTIONS, even though they may be perfectly safe and legal. But there we are stuck again. The Blue and Red teams have radically different ideas about fixing "social inequality and education". So I'm happy with abortion at the current status quo; I agree with you that we should set it aside and concentrate on the causes.

But then, that ISN'T what the Republican fear-mongering (which includes Ron Paul as long as he is registered Republican) is doing, is it? They shout, "the Dems want to kill your babies and make baby Jesus cry! Wlect me instead!" instead of proposing real honest solutions to the causes. Sorry, you get no points there.

I'll tell you this, if Hillary/Obama/Edwards are elected we will be bombing Iran in the next 2 years. Then when oil is $200 a barrel and the economy collapses you probably will be more concerned about getting to work and feeding your family than worrying about abortion and gay marriage.

What a lie. I've been following mostly Edwards campaign and ides, and I see NO EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER for "bombing Iran". What the hell are you talking about? As far as feeing your family, Edwards is the only candidate right or left that has made poverty, and a living wage a major focus of his campaign.

Ron Paul is the only hope America has left, if a neo-con or Hitlery wins, it's all over folks.

It will push enough of us over the edge to where we will be taking to the streets.

I take solace in the fact that even if he loses, he has lit the fire of liberty for an entire generation and more.

Great feedback swarmofkillermonkeys. I don't agree with all of it but this thread has been a better than average dialog of issues and I think people stayed pretty civil through it for the most part. I guess the last thing I have to say is listen to Kucinich and Paul and the way that they speak. I believe it is not in the political "code" of false optimism and symbolistic idealism, but rather in plain language. And although I have heard Edwards and Dodd occasionally break from this deceptive and empty political speak, we know they have been able to speak in code before. The code is basically political BS that does not accomplish anything. It is the only language that GB speaks and to many in both parties are too eager to emulate the same bullshit double speak.