Special Comment: George Bush's Criminal Conspiracy of Torture
By SilentPatriot Sunday Nov 04, 2007 9:01pm
In his latest fire-breathing Special Comment Keith tears into President Bush for firing a true patriot that spoke out against torture, while cowardly and simultaneously ordering others to commit the very same heinous crime.
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Download | play (thanks to Logan for his help)
No matter how thorough you might try to brand disagreement as disloyalty, Mr Bush, there are still people like Daniel Levin who believe in the United States of America as true freedom, where we are better not because of schemes and wars, but because of dreams and morals. And ultimately, sir, these men, these patriots will defeat you and they will return this country to its righteous standards, and to its rightful owners: The People.
Transcript below the fold...
Finally tonight, as promised, a Special Comment on the meaning of the story of former U.S. Acting Assistant Attorney General Daniel Levin.
It is a fact startling in its cynical simplicity and it requires cynical and simple words to be properly expressed:
The presidency of George W. Bush has now devolved into a criminal conspiracy to cover the ass of George W. Bush.
All the petulancy, all the childish threats, all the blank-stare stupidity;
All the invocations of World War Three, all the sophistic questions about which terrorist attacks we wanted him not to stop, all the phony secrets; all the claims of executive privilege, all the stumbling tap-dancing of his nominees, all the verbal flatulence of his apologists…
All of it is now — after one revelation last week — transparently clear for what it is: the pathetic and desperate manipulation of the government, the re-focusing of our entire nation, towards keeping this mock president, and this unstable vice president, and this departed wildly self-over-rating Attorney General — and the others — from potential prosecution for having approved or ordered the illegal torture of prisoners being held in the name of this country.
“Waterboarding is torture,” Daniel Levin was to write.
Daniel Levin was no theorist and no protestor.
He was no troublemaking politician.
He was no table-pounding commentator.
Daniel Levin was an astonishingly patriotic American, and a brave man.
Brave not just with words or with stances — even in a dark time when that kind of bravery can usually be scared — or bought — off.
Charged — as you heard in the story from ABC News last Friday — with assessing the relative legality of the various nightmares in the Pandora’s box that is the Orwell-worthy euphemism “Enhanced Interrogation,” Mr. Levin decided that the simplest, and the most honest, way to evaluate them… was to have them enacted upon himself.
Daniel Levin took himself to a military base and let himself be water-boarded.
Mr. Bush — ever done anything that personally courageous?
Perhaps when you’ve gone to Walter Reed and teared up over the maimed servicemen? And then gone back to the White House and determined that there would be more maimed servicemen?
Has it been that kind of personal courage, Mr. Bush, when you’ve spoken of American victims and the triumph of freedom and the sacrifice of your own popularity for the sake of our safety? And then permitted others to fire or discredit or destroy anybody who disagreed with you — whether they were your own Generals, or… Max Cleland, or… Joe Wilson and Valerie Plame… or Daniel Levin?
Daniel Levin should have a statue in his honor in Washington right now.
Instead, he was forced out as Acting Assistant Attorney General, nearly three years ago, because he had the guts to do what George Bush couldn’t do in a million years: actually put himself at risk for the sake of his country, for the sake of what is right.
And they water-boarded him and he wrote that even though he knew those doing it meant him no harm, and he knew they would rescue him at the instant of the slightest distress, and he knew he would not die — still, with all that reassurance, he could not stop the terror screaming from inside of him, could not quell the horror, could not convince that which is at the core of each of us — the entity who exists behind all the embellishments we strap to ourselves, like purpose and name and family and love — he could not convince his being… that he wasn’t drowning.
Water-boarding, he said, is torture.
Legally, it is torture!
Practically, it is torture!
Ethically, it is torture!
And he wrote it down.
Wrote it down somewhere, where it could be contrasted with the words of this country’s 43rd President: “The United States of America does not torture.”
Made you into a liar, Mr. Bush.
Made you into, if anybody had the guts to pursue it, a criminal, Mr. Bush.
Water-boarding had already been used on Khalid Sheik Mohammed and a couple of other men none of us really care about — except, Sir, for the one detail you’d forgotten — that there are rules, and even if we just make up these rules, this country observes them anyway, because we’re Americans, sir, and we’re better than that.
We’re better than you.
And the man your Justice Department selected to decide whether or not water-boarding was torture, had decided, and not in some phony academic fashion, nor while wearing the Walter Mitty poseur attire of flight-suit and helmet.
He had put his money, Mr. Bush, where your mouth was.
So, your sleazy sycophantic henchman Mr. Gonzales had him append an asterisk suggesting his black-and-white answer wasn’t black-and-white, that there might have been a quasi-legal way of torturing people, maybe with an absolute time limit and a physician entitled to stop it, maybe, if your administration had ever bothered to set any rules or any guidelines…
And then when your people realized that even that was too dangerous, Daniel Levin was branded “too independent” and “someone who could (not) be counted on.”
In other words, Mr. Bush, somebody you couldn’t count on to lie for you.
So, Levin was fired.
Because if it ever got out what he’d concluded, and the lengths to which he went, to validate that conclusion, anybody who had sanctioned water-boarding, and who-knows-what-else… anybody — you yourself, sir — you would have been screwed.
And screwed you are.
It can’t be coincidence that the story of Daniel Levin should emerge from the black hole of this secret society of a presidency just at the conclusion of the unhappy saga of the newest Attorney General Nominee.
Another patriot somewhere, listened as Judge Mukasey mumbled like he’d never heard of water-boarding, and refuse to answer in words that which Daniel Levin answered on a water-board somewhere in Maryland or Virginia three years ago.
And this someone also heard George Bush say “The United States of America does not torture” and realized either he was lying or this wasn’t the United States of America any more, and either way, he needed to do something about it.
Not in the way Levin needed to do something about it, but in a brave way nonetheless.
We have United States Senators who need to do something about it, too.
Chairman Leahy of the Judiciary Committee has seen this for what it is and said “enough.”
Senator Schumer has seen it, reportedly, as some kind of puzzle piece in the New York political patronage system and he has failed.
What Senator Feinstein has seen, to justify joining Schumer in rubber-stamping Mukasey, I cannot guess.
It is obvious that both those Senators should look to the meaning of the story of Daniel Levin and recant their support for Mukasey’s confirmation.
And they should look into their own committee’s history and recall that in 1973, their predecessors were able to wring even from Richard Nixon, a guarantee of a Special Prosecutor (ultimately a Special Prosecutor of Richard Nixon!), in exchange for their approval of his new Attorney General, Elliott Richardson.
If they could get that out of Nixon, you — before you confirm the President’s latest human echo tomorrow — you better be able to get a “yes” or a “no” out of Michael Mukasey.
Ideally, you should lock this government down financially until a special prosecutor is appointed — or fifty of them — but I’m not holding my breath. The “yes” or the “no” on water-boarding will have to suffice.
Because, remember if you can’t get it, or you won’t with the time between tonight and the next presidential election likely to be the longest year of our lives, you are leaving this country, and all of us, to the water-boards — symbolic and otherwise — of George W. Bush.
Ultimately, Mr. Bush, the real question isn’t who approved the water-boarding of this fiend Khalid Sheik Mohammed and two others.
It is: why were they water-boarded?
Study after study for generation after generation, sir, has confirmed that torture gets people to talk, torture gets people to plead, torture gets people to break, but torture does not get them to tell the truth.
Of course, Mr. Bush, this isn’t a problem if you don’t care if the terrorist plots they tell you about, are the truth or just something to stop the tormentors from drowning them.
If, say, a President simply needed a constant supply of terrorist threats to keep a country scared…
If, say, he needed phony plots to play hero during, and to boast about interrupting, and to use to distract people from the threat he didn’t interrupt…
If, say, he realized that even terrorized people still need good ghost stories before they will let a President pillage the Constitution…
Well, heck, Mr. Bush, who better to dream them up for you… than an actual terrorist?
He’ll tell you every thing he ever fantasized doing, in his most horrific of daydreams — his equivalent of the day you “flew” onto the deck of the Lincoln to explain you’d won in Iraq.
Now if that’s what this is all about — you tortured not because you’re so stupid you think torture produces confession — but you tortured because you’re smart enough to know it produces really authentic-sounding fiction — well, then you’re going to need all the lawyers you can find because that crime wouldn’t just mean impeachment, would it, sir?
That crime would mean George W. Bush is going to prison.
Thus the master tumblers turn, and the lock yields, and the hidden explanations can all be perceived, in their exact proportions, in their exact progressions.
Daniel Levin’s eminently practical, eminently logical, eminently patriotic way of testing the legality of waterboarding has to vanish — and him, with it.
Thus Alberto Gonzales has to use that brain that sounds like an old car trying to start on a freezing morning, to undo eight centuries of the forward march of law and government.
Thus Dick Cheney, has to ridiculously assert that confirming we do or do not use any particular interrogation technique, would somehow help the terrorists.
Thus Michael Mukasey, on the eve of the vote that will make him the high priest of the law of this land, cannot and must not answer a question, nor even hint that he has thought about a question, which merely concerns the theoretical definition of water-boarding as torture.
Because, Mr. Bush, in the seven years of your nightmare presidency, this whole string of events has been transformed from its beginning as the most neglectful protection ever, of the lives and safety of the American people into the most efficient and cynical exploitation of tragedy for political gain in this country’s history.
And, then, to the giddying prospect that you could do what the military fanatics did in Japan in the 1930’s and re-make a nation into a fascist state so efficient and so self-sustaining, that the fascism would be nearly invisible.
But at last this frightful plan is ending with an unexpected crash, the shocking reality that no matter how thoroughly you might try to extinguish them, Mr. Bush, how thoroughly you tried to brand disagreement as disloyalty, Mr. Bush, there are still people like Daniel Levin who believe in the United States of America as true freedom, where we are better, not because of schemes and wars, but because of dreams and morals.
And ultimately, sir, these men, these patriots, will defeat you and they will return this country to its righteous standards, and to its rightful owners, the people.
Good night, and good luck.
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Thank You, Keith.
If they haul you away when we go "Pakistan" we will come and break you out!
IMPEACH!
Thank you, Keith
God Bless Keith. God Damn bush.
I apologize..... I didn't read it! Was it at the beginning or later in the show?
I'm at work and will get home in time to watch from like 10:15 or so! I want to see it LIVE!
Hey Keith if your reading this.....THANK YOU.And don't stop.Keep up the good work ,the country needs a voice now more than ever.
Oh yeah - thanks.
I could hear the Battle Hymn of the Republic in my head while he gave this one. Nuff said.
woohoo!
If George W. Bush is not behind bars sometime in the near future, with Cheney and Gonzales, then there is no justice.
That was Great ... Was that on American TV?
Thank you Keith, Cheney and Bush must be stopped now, or the worst is yet to come.
Once again, this lone MSM patriot doesn't suffer sellouts, fools, incompetents or evil gladly.
One KO is worth the whole gaggle of war and terror pimps and media whores our fragile republic is cursed with. KO's words, outrage, ridicule resonate..
That was intense, Keith!
Seriously I doubt there will ever be justice for the incredible number of war crimes this filth of a president has committed.
If only the Democrats in Congress could muster up a fraction of the integrity and fortitude of Daniel Levin. Oh well, a moose can dream...
May the powers of good watch over him. I'm sure he must be on a list by now.
Olberman hit the nail on the head with that piece. I hope Schumer and DiFi watched it too.
But most of all I hope the warcrimes prosecuters in The Hague will watch it too ;)
Even granting that torture (and I agree that waterboarding deserves that label) is inherently wrong, I am less concerned with torturing K.S. Mohammed (who is presumably guilty) than for any number of random, anonymous detainees who are likely guilty of little more than driving their cab. That's a stronger argument against the practice, and why it needs to be banned outright.
That [virtually] said, Olbermann's about the only mainstream talking head bringing it. More please.
Kyle @ 8:
curious.
I heard Something In The Air by Thunderclap Newman
Keith was absolutely on fire and made me proud to be an American. Although he was controlled in his delivery, the dry spittle on his lips was a giveaway of the passion he feels for the subject.
What amazes me at this juncture in time is the fact that with every passing day more and more of Bush's felonious behavior is exposed but lazy, fatass Americans sit idly by watching wrassling, NASCAR, and infotainment stories about Brittney, Jacko, Paris and OJ while our country's Constitution is dismantled, our economic stability is destroyed, and our nation's reputation that was built upon our father's blood, sweat and toil is eroded beyond recognition. What exactly does this moron and his band of co-conspirators have to do for the people of this country to take notice and react. For chrissake, our progenitors waged a war of independence over a 10% tax burden. With the interesting (cointelpro) plethora of nooses appearing around the country, you'd have thought Bush et alia would have ended up in one of them by now.
An Edwin R Murrow event folks.
I noticed he made a reference to billo in that speech.
Thank you Keith. You definitely speak for me. When you feel like no matter what a person does, nobody hears them, no matter what you do, nobody cares, YOU say EXACTLY what we are thinking and feeling. Thank you. You are the voice of MOST of America. Maybe someone will finally listen. (Hello Congress.. are you paying attention?)
I agree, KO speaks for me too.
Keith , if you're reading this, thank you for expressing what so many of us want to say but don't have a public platform. We have been so angry and frustrated that no one seems to be listening to us including the Democrats for whom some of worked to get elected. I'm thrilled you mentioned Schumer and Feinstein (Why not Lieberman?). There's got to be another dynamic that is going on which we aren't privy to because it is so apparent that Mukasey should not be nominated. They cannot be that stupid!
It takes courage to speak out against this administration and I applaud you for your courage.
Thank you, Keith!
Bob In Pai Thailand @ 11:
LOL. Believe it or not , yes it was .
He's one of the last bastions of the truth.
That crime would mean George W. Bush is going to prison.
And he said it, fuck yeah!
Speaking of Cowards, if Olbermann is the Edward R. Morrow of out time, why won't he ever participate in a situation where his comments can be challenged? Just wondering.
Awesome KO! The Senate should drop kick Mukasey and hold out for Daniel Levin as the new AJ, along with a new Special Prosecutor to lay the groundwork for BushCheney's indictment and criminal conviction. Impeachment's not enough. They need to be tried and, once convicted, sent to prison.
I want to BE THERE when they march him out in handcuffs.
Keith is a Brave Patriot. He has once again inspired me to do my best as a citizen to stop this nightmare. I mourn for the America I once knew. I will be taking part in the General Strike tommorrow. I will also call my congresspeople and tell them I do not want to live in a Facist country. I want to Thank Keith for his bravery and Love of America that he continues to fight for. If nothing else everyone try not to by anything on Tuesday 11-6-07 and Google General Strike for some other ideas.
It was his best yet...dead on the money...
I was referring to Bush, but I forgot Cheney and Gonzales as well. A three-fer.. That would be worth the price of a ticket.
Olby's Wig @ 28:
He's offered to debate with anyone anytime....but no takers....speaking of cowards....hey olby's wig...why did you dodge my question on the other thread.
I am so sick of the lack of action. What I want to know is what the hell can we do about congress and their not doing what we elected them to do.
Do we have the authority to recall any of the representatives. Can we do it by starting a petition. What what what can we do.
liberalNmoderation @ 357:
Apparently you slept through 9/11. oh wait...that was Bush too....silly silly liberals
Jeff @ 359:
No Jeffy, actually I was in that five sided building that got hit. Hard to sleep with all the fire and screaming.
Isn't it about your bed time now?
Marge @ 35:
All progressives can do is hold the current Dems accountable by electing them out of office next term cycle. Reid, Feinstein, Pelosi, etc. can be removed from office but it will take some effort. Unfortunately, most Americans don't care enough to even vote!
Doug @ 327:
Well, if you knew IN ADVANCE that a prisoner is, in fact a terrorist, and does have information that he can give you that would save lives, it might be an easier decision. HOWEVER, when the torturer is acting as judge, jury and executioner for a prisoner who has not been given due process, you cannot argue that there is an ethically defensible process at work. The end can never justify the means when a process allows potentially innocent people to be subjected to this kind of injustice in a fishing expedition for information.
Jeff @ 360:
No I was at work you troglodyte, you were in school bullying the smart kids, stupid stupid neo-con...
JustSickOfIt @ 355:
Thanks for the comment JustStickOfShit. That's the ol' "If you're not in the army you can't support winning the war" liberal line. Can't you come up with something new?
War sucks. It's too bad we live in a world where crazy ass Muslims want to kill Americans because America is free and they want American women to be second class citizens and want all husbands to be able to beat their wives and hang gays and stone women to death for "sex crimes".
But I don't want that to happen. So I want the US to defeat any movement that says "become a Muslim or die". But maybe you want to wait until they kill us first? :)
Jeff @ 353:
Jeff, Jeff, Jeff from what do you extrapolate that I'm a "follower of Al Gore"? I'm going with the feeling that (if you're old enough to drive) you're one of those gung-ho, gun-toting, Tahoe-driving mofos. Perhaps you've got one of those "Proud to be American" bumperstickers as well.
I'm arrogant? That's rich coming from such a condescending fellow such as yourself.
Doug -- same goes for you. Seems you & Jeffy are 2 peas in a pod.
If we outlawed all torture, would we still be allowed to play to prisoners John Ashcroft's singing, Let the Eagle Soar on an endless tape loop?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubjgisuitDw
I bet the Eagles were sore.
Doug @ 365:
No, not us, just you.
Doug @ 365:
You are a moron Doug. Plain and simple, straight up moron. You have bought into the jingoistic BS that I am so fucking sick of...I don't think I'm alone in this sentiment either.
It's too bad we live in a world where crazy ass CHRISTIAN SUPREMACISTS want to bring about the second coming of Jeeeeebus, and destroy the world in the process...oh and ain't that what most of these republican neo-cons want too? Oh wait, they want to "hang out" with the gays. Not hang them...alotta you boys just kickin down that closet door ain't ya? LMAO...PATHETIC!!!
Dr. Acula @ 345:
It’s a real pleasure having Doug & Jeff here today. Booyah! Torture is good! Murka - love it or leave it! How many yellow ribbons are on your SUVs? Bush/Cheney stickers?
Nah, the elections been over for quite a while now. But I do have
354 Doug Says:
Nuke the Whales
Warm the Earth - Drive an SUV
Celebrate Guantanamo
I speed up to run over hybrids
AND
Ted Kennedy’s car has killed more people than my gun
May you have a girlfriend with the same inebriation, depth perception, and hand-eye coordination of Laura Welch.
10 slippytoad Says: If George W. Bush is not behind bars sometime in the near future... then there is no justice.
___________________________________________________________
I heard he's been sprawled beneath a few.
Doug @ 365:
BTW, thanks for proving my assertion. You are a chicken-shit-hawk that loves war as long as it's not YOUR ass in the line of fire. Your "arguments" come from ignorance of facts and the Fux news talking points. Spend one day in some boots in 120F sand and THEN tell me you support the war, chicken shit.
liberalNmoderation @ 369:
Yeah, the Republicans are your real enemy. The Islamo Fascists will love you and respect you.
Am I knocking the closet door down? I don't care if it's open or closed. I don't give a damn. Do I care if Muslim fascists kill gays? Yeah, I do. Do I care if Muslim fascists stone women to death? Yes, I do.
Do you?
Do you see gays being hung in America?
Do you see women being stoned to death in America?
It's happening in the middle east and they want to bring it to you. Are you ready for it?
365 Doug Says:
But I don’t want that to happen. So I want the US to defeat any movement that says “become a Muslim or die”. But maybe you want to wait until they kill us first?
___________________________________________________________________
Actually Douggie, here is the threat we all should be watching for:
http://www.yuricareport.com/Dominionism/DirectoryRiseOfDominionismInAmer...
Dougie, there's no such thing as an "Islamofascist", okay? You ARE a good parrot, though. You've proven you've learned all the talking points by heart. Congrats!
Now wake up and realize that the majority of the scumbags who attacked us on 9/11 were SAUDIS -- not Iraqis or Iranians -- our "allies" the Saudis. They're not trying to bring their way of life over here (as opposed to what Busholini is trying to do in the ME). They (Muslims) want us to get the f*ck out of their countries, pure and simple.
Got it yet, Chickenhawk?
So, I hear that the Kucinich motion to impeach Cheney was tabled, under the direction of none other than Steney Hoyer. Spineless Democratic leadership, and they expect me to donate money to the Democratic Party?
Is it time for a National Strike yet? What provocation will it take for this idea to take hold? I am inclined to just keep asking this question again and again until it ripens. Isn't it time we went on strike? No more business as ususal until this government is reformed and responsive. Who is going to join me on this? The silence is deafening!
Here's Douggie's biggest hero:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OeLw-jWx3-0
Dr. Acula @ 375:
So in Iran and Saudi they hang gays, stone women and vow to kill Jews, but there's no Islamofascists.
I say actions speak louder than words.
Where is the gay hanging, woman stoning and Jew killing in America, guys? Show me the pictures. Show me the documents.
I give up on you.
This was Keith's best Special Comment yet.
A thought: if - as Bush & Cheney want us to believe - we don't use waterboarding, then how can the military who did it on Levine know precisely how to use it and so effectively? Hmmm. Practice makes perfect?
Doug @ 373:
Doug, ya poor dumb bastard...Islamofascism is an oxymoron created by the Neo-Conservatives to give you sheep yet ANTOHER imaginary thing to fear so they can finally create the fascist state they've had hard-ons for for 30 years.
All that shit you say the "islamofascists" are going to do...just WTF do you think THIS FASCIST govt.'s gonna do, throw a goddamn tea party?
You, and ALL WHO BELIEVE AS YOU ARE SHEEP!!!!
And for cryin out loud, stop listenin to limpballs, o'rly, and the rest of the fascist facilitators (sp?)
That little brain you have, they've washed it real good for ya...oh yeah.
Douggie, fascism is where the corporationists and nationalists merge together into one amalgamous and amorphous blob.
The Islamic folk to one degree or another want a THEOCRACY, much like our Dominionsts.
ysbaddaden @ 377:
That's funny as hell. I loved those cartoons. Tom Slick was good too.
Doug @ 378:
Doug...as your collaborator Jeffie, asked earlier..."do I even know what fascism is?" I suggest you find out the the meaning of fascism, and maybe you'll see wherein your error lies...ah who am I kiddin? You knuckle-draggin, troglodyte, phillistine, mouth breathers don't concern yourselves with meaningless facts. You watch Fox News, where they make up facts when it best suits their purpose. Choads! The whole stinkin lot!
ysbaddaden @ 381:
Thank you! Geeeeezus H.W. Schmidt on rubber crutches!!! Tryin to talk to these people is...well, like tryin to talk logic to a 3 year old...except you have to repeat yourself more often...
Sun Tzu in his Art of War insisted that one must indentify one's enemy correctly, so as to anticipate their movement, thereby setting plans to defeat that movement.
If the enemy is not so properly labeled than, "The best-laid plans o' mice an' men
Gang aft a-gley..."
Jeff @ 315:
have to say you make some good points (some I agree with, some I dont)..but please, could you tell me exactly when you served this country??
liberalNmoderation @ 383:
So when your mother and sister are being beaten for not wearing their burkas and there are calls to stop the Islamo fascists, you say "oh, no, they're not fascists. they're theocrats." I'm sure your mother and sister will feel better knowing you know the academic definition of fascist.
Now, since you've dodged my point by trying to prove to the world that you've learned the textbook definition of fascist, why don't you address the point of the Islamo-fascist movement to have you live by their creed.
384 liberalNmoderation
I'd probably need that three year old to explain Tivo and Bluetooth to me.
Doug @ 387:
That will never happen ya silly bastard, lol! I will likely be defending them and myself from the likes of you for not believin in Jeeeebus hard enough.
Ok, let me say THIS ONE MORE TIME!!!! Islamo...fascism...is....an...oxy....MORON!
A buzzword created by William Kristol most likely...And as for the last part of your...question...WTF? Doesn't make a whole lotta sense there Sonny-Jim, then again, NOTHING you've said all damn day has either.
Doug, just WTF are you SO afraid of? Remember "we're fighting them over there, so we don't have to fight them here!"
Bwahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!
387 Doug
You're still ignoring our more pressing threat of our Dominionists.
They actually advocate the death penalty for other Christians who don't believe in their way.
Funny thing, although they'd be seen by Roman Catholics as being in one of the 13 Great Heresies with their emphasis on sola scriptura, and sola fide, and they in turn would accuse followers of the See as being superstitious papists, they all pretty much agree with the Nicean, Athanasian and Apostle's Creed (even the Confessional Low churches), and the Definition of Chalcedon (with the exception of Anathemas of the Second Council of Constantinople (553 CE), and Article VI where Mary is called “ever virgin,” but the rest which establishes her theotokos status (iin opposition to a title of only Christotokos) that came from the Nestorian heresy, which was a response to the Monophysite heresy, which was a response to...
Anywho ya get the idea.
ysbaddaden @ 388:
Hehehe, no shit, lol same here...
ysbaddaden @ 391:
Awesome, but could ya dumb it down a little? For our....not quite as bright as a bag of shit, dumber'n a box o' stupid, friends? There little minds are like the warp reactor on the original star trek, they can't go very fast with out cracking.
torture does work, but not as it is commonly promoted.
torture is what terrorists like cheney and bush use to promote terrorism.
torture has nothing to do with 'intelligence'.
torture has everything to do with 'fear'.
sadly, many americans respond fearfully to torture's advocates.
happily, most do not.
mr olbermann speaks for me, my children and my grandchildren.
peas!
Ronnie Raygun started the dumbing-down of this country and Dumbya has perfected it because the sheeple just don't give a shit.
That was AMERICAN.
God Dammit the napalm of true indignation flared in those words. Yes, the first to truly suggest publicly how Hagueworthy their crimes are.
Maggie @ 26:
I am suprised anyone wants to serve under these idiots and risk their older years being lost behind bars or immunity in an uncomfortable setting.
Olby's Wig @ 28:
Why doesn't rush want to be challenged? Just wondering
A little reminder.. Kucinich will be invoking House privilege to force through H. Res. 333 - Impeaching Dick Cheney tomorrow. Call your reps and tell them to vote AGAINST tabling his resolutiong and vote YES to supporting his resolution.
What’s the point? We all already know that Olbermann doesn’t like Bush. And we all already know that we, and likely a hefty majority of Olbermann’s viewers don’t like Bush. And yet, he does these little comments as those they will change anything, as though people still on the edge of liking/hating Bush will happen to decide to tune in and then decide to finally stop ignoring everything that’s happened in the past 6 years and start to express their dislike as though even a whole country full of dislike and disapproval toward our president and his policies would finally push our elected representatives into actually doing anything about it.
They’re nice speeches to listen to, but when it comes to listening to nice things, I’d rather just put on a good tune. After all, a good tune is just as influential as one of Keith’s comments.
Don't get me wrong, I LOVE Keith, and everything he stands for, but really, what's the point in even bothering talking about this stuff when we KNOW that NO ONE in our government is willing to listen?
Way to go, Keith, kudos.
IMPEACH. IMPEACH. IMPEACH.
AND GOD DAMN BUSH.
F'ing awesome. Where are the Democratic (or Independent or patriotic Republican) leaders that can nail it like Keith? Have the lobbiests purchased ALL of them???
srvgrd @ 40:
Why do you like to copy and paste?
Great stuff. We need more folks to come out swinging like this.
srvgrd @ 40:
It really isn't about LIKING Bush or NOT liking Bush, it is about abhoring as an American what Bush and Cheney have done to our country and our Constitution (and, oh yeah, the rest of the planet). It is about recognizing what they have been doing in their manipulating the system and the American people. It is about calling them on all the lies. This isn't personal, it is about their actions. Actions have consequences - or at least they are supposed to. At least that is what I have tried to teach my children..
sammy Says: Olby’s Wig @ 28:
Speaking of Cowards, if Olbermann is the Edward R. Morrow of out time, why won’t he ever participate in a situation where his comments can be challenged? Just wondering.
Why doesn’t rush want to be challenged? Just wondering
Limbaugh should. But at least he is on a radio show that takes calls. Olbermann was on a daily radio show recently....... But the show didn't take calls. Why take the chance of being questioned. Olbermann never comes out from behind the skirt.
Olby's Wig @ 46:
why should he? the reich are idiots who have no standing to logic.
393 liberalNmoderation
I guess you can tell I wasn't having my period
Or that I'm channeling Archie, for Archie and Mehitabel.
Did Mehitabel ever come running up to him as he came home gushing, "Oooh, Orchie!"
395 Dr. Acula Says: Ronnie Raygun started the dumbing-down of this country and Dumbya has perfected it because the sheeple just don’t give a shit.
Ketchup's not a vegetable?
I can see the Heinz bottle even now retorting, "Look who's talking!"
Doug @ 373:
You could replace Muslim with Chri$tofacist and you would be all in favor. Ever hear of hate crimes? You love 'em. Ever wonder what happens to women who can't get proper medical care because their fetus has hydroencephalitis? Sorry big word. You won't understand that. Abortion clinic bombing, you're not too stupid to understand that, and you love 'em.
Point is, even if you're just a pimple faced fool home on a Tuesday night, you would rather lose the point of being an American (constitution, that thing in civics class) than face up to the guys that lied us into a war with a country that didn't do the things you accuse the non-existent Islamofacists of doing.
You want to get to the heart of Islam and the oppressive Islamic regimes, ask your commander in thief to invade Saudi. Go-head, see how long that conversation lasts. Because chimpy is owned, lock stock and smoking barrel by the Saudis. And neither of these wars are bout fascism you putz, they're about money and power.
If you ever get old enough to pay taxes, you'll understand what it's like to have two crooks steal a trillion dollars of your hard earned money. If you ever get old enough to join the military, try it out and see first hand how chimpy and darth support the troops.
Till then, shut the fuck up and go to bed.
Bush is worse of a criminal for his conspiracy to invade Iraq on false pretenses. He (nearly?) tops Hitler in sponsoring an unnecessary military aparatus, genocide AND lying a nation to war... Torture is just one more thing he copied from die Germans. Wake up already, this is 1940-45 all over again. So,... when are we gonna send in the Russians?
JustSickOfIt @ 398:
I see despotic Muslim regimes hanging people for not adhering to their faith and you're worried about Christians. When's the last time a non-Christian was hung in this country for not being a Christian?
You said I love hate crimes. You're probably wishing that were true because that way you could pidgeonhole me into your narrow view of people who disagree with you. It's not that simple, JustFullOfShit.
Abortion clinic bombings - I love em? Nope. Wrong again. You jumped to conclusions again because it's a shortcut to thinking. Try asking next time, rather than ASSuming.
You seem to be very prideful of some of the knowledge you've obtained. But don't be proud to jump to conclusions about things you don't know anything about.
Because some Christians go to extremes doesn't mean gays are hung by the US Government. Women are not denied driver's licenses here. Women can vote here. No one is stoned to death here because someone else caught them having an affair. These things ARE happening in the middle east and other Islmist countries. And they are agressively exporting it.
Muslim doctors blow themselves up in England. Couples with babies prepare to blow themselves up on airplanes to kill infidels. And men fly planes into buildings killing thousands. For what? Because we don't believe what they believe.
Christians are not blowing themselves up to kill innocent people - at least not any more. We've seen the horror of it and have put a stop to it. The Muslims have not.
Now, who's the real enemy again?
[Deleted. This thread has veered off topic-Sitemonitor]
God bless you Keith. I dare any f'n moron to say that any part of Keith's speech was a lie, fabrication or mistruth. God damned ReThug echo chamber. Do I have to say it? Scream it? Impeach. Impeach! IMPEACH!
Wow I looked through the earlier comments. The trolls are out in FORCE! Looks like KO touched a nerve again.
JohnnyBravo @ 402:
yeah....bless his heart....LOL
Doug @ 400:
Christian Supremacists and this Neocon Admin...that's who......and all the stupid people who voted for the Preznit..TWICE!
Ya know Doug all this talk about killing....explain Iraq for me would you.Over 1 million dead Iraqi's...for what?
ysbaddaden @ 391:
yep...
402, I did'nt get that far. When there is this many comments, ugh!
Anyway, K.O was brilliant !!
One thing he brings to all of this is that this administration (and other war hawks) just looks at ways to get around the laws. They find one fucking idiot that will give them an excuse to
bombspread democracy (based on lies) and give them a shit load of money for it. Then, all they have to do is say " Well, our intel was wrong !!! "Nothing will come of this, they have covered their asses. And to the DEMS who have enabled this, SHAME ON YOU!!!!
peoples Front of Judea @ 283:
now,now,now...don't pull a repug spin on us here....sorry bud..I ain'y buyin your BS.
damn.typos...AIN'T...buyin your BS.lol
Olbermann is bogus. He devotes entire segments of his nightly program to goofy videos of water skiing squirrels and puppy dogs on trampolines. For some mystifying reason he doesn't allocate any time on his show to confront an articulate person with an opposing viewpoint on any issue. Olbermann is gutless. He only invites guests who co-sign his opinions.
Well said! If we only had a few more news people like this, we'll drive the "no balls" Congress to impeach. But, I won't count on it. The democrats are spineless! Just ask Palosi.
mrogi @ 411:
Probably because it's the only place they can be truly heard on MSM media. And so what if he does light stuff? If you hate him so much, why watch? Why care what he covers? He doesn't claim to be fair and balanced, like the liars at Fox 'News.' So what's the beef?
ISP
Hi miss kitty...ya gotta luv KO....he just drives the loons nuts.LOL
mudshark @ 409:
No spin here. No answers for my questions? What BS?
peoples Front of Judea @ 416:
read the guys question again...he was simply asking for some info....and calling his question retarded was not cool..you could of helped him out by giving him some usefull info...that's what he was looking for.
Ofcourse torture is insane...that's what we have been saying for a long time now.I thought more of you than that comment.....
Somewhere . . .
In a far, far better place . . .
Edward R. Murrow is cheering!
God Bless You Keith!!!!!
Verbal flatulence... I love it!
sammy @ 177:
Sorry. As I've said before, Olbermann is the emily latila of cable commentary. And the previous poster raises a great question- why doesn't Olbermann ever have guests on with contrasting opinions? Because the majority of his positions are ridiculous, and easily proven so. But, of course, KO always knows more than everybody else. He's a windbag, just like O'Reilly and Limbaugh. No different. No better. Just on the other side.
peoples Front of Judea @ 323:
Jeff, please answer this question.
What if you are wrong and torture an innocent person? What if the person you think knows something really knows nothing?
That's a fairly respectable dodge there, "jeff." My point is that you have then tortured an innocent person for NOTHING! Oops we just had the wrong guy. You're free to go. Thanks for your time.
Perhaps we shouldn't have any law enforcement at all then? After all, the police do run the risk of catching the wrong guy(which obviously happens), so they had best just not go after criminals at all then, no?
maggie@26:
"I’m thrilled you mentioned Schumer and Feinstein (Why not Lieberman?)."
Probably because there was some small, dim, faint, forlorn hope for Schumer and Feinstein.
oswald @ 421:
That's a fairly respectable dodge there, "jeff." My point is that you have then tortured an innocent person for NOTHING! Oops we just had the wrong guy. You're free to go. Thanks for your time.
Perhaps we shouldn't have any law enforcement at all then? After all, the police do run the risk of catching the wrong guy(which obviously happens), so they had best just not go after criminals at all then, no?
In my little mind there is a huge difference between arresting the wrong suspect and arresting and then TORTURING the wrong suspect.
Perhaps if you had made the analogy of a person arrested, then tried, then sentenced to death and executed to make your point. Oops, but that would imply the use of due process and at least following SOME of the bill of right.
mudshark @ 417:
Then why would you defend a mindset that not only implicitly endorses torture, but also sees it as the first option?
Dayumn. K. O. Hit. It. Outta. The. Freaking. Park.
Outta the parking lot, in fact.
Thanks, KO. I hope it's not too late. I hope the last few sentences of your Comment are true.
Today's vote on Kucinich's impeachment resolution offers some slim hope (thanks, Repugs, for your arrogance in turning the vote; no thanks, Pelosi, Hoyer, and your ilk, for trying to sabotage it.)
Everyone must now call all the members of the House Judiciary Committee and tell them to move the impeachment resolution (HR799) forward.
Just Do It.
God bless you Keith. This was like a punch to the gut to see. Honest journalism on the media is refreshing and breathtaking to watch.
Doug @ 400:
Hmmm.. remind you of anyone you know. Give you a hint. It's the guy who keeps touching you at night. BINGO! It's you.
Ha ha ha.. "We've seen the horror". What fucking horror have you ever seen, simpleton? The horror of paying too much for gas? Sorry, you don't drive yet.
Remember those towers you are so apt to reference? And that 5 sided building I was in? Now imagine 200 of each of them. That's what your psychopathic Chri$tofacist leader has done to just one country in 4 years. That's one 9/11 strike per week on a country that did nothing to us. Chri$tofacists don't have to blow themselves up to kill innocent people, they have huge armies and trillions of dollars of weapons to do that for them. And they haven't even caught the guys who you are supposedly pissed at. I'd say that's one fucking huge failure.
This is really going to go past your tiny intellect, but.. One man's war is another man's terror. And one man's terrorist is usually a poor man's warrior.
Once again, you are.
JustSickOfIt @ 427:
This is adolescent blather, so I can now assume you're an adolescent. At least in intellectual maturity.
More childesh name calling rather than intellectual rigor.
And finally more shortcuts to thinking. Seeing moral equivalence between targetting legitamant military assets and innocent civilians.
.
I tried to have an adult discussion about this issue, but apparently I'm the only one willing to engage in adult conversation.
Ignorance is the enemy. Disinformation is the enemy. Making up reasons to attack an country that had NOTHING to do with 9/11, those are the actions of the enemy. Nobody here wants the United States to be attacked again. Eveveryone that posts on this site does so because they love America, and no longer recognize it.
I am fed up with sad sack, grown up little boys playing army with real soldiers lives. I am fed up with being lied to, with having my legitimate anger and fear after 9/11 being twisted into the deaths, not of the people that attacked us, but of innocent women and children. And I will no longer accept from a group of chicken shit typists the continuous accusations that I don't love America as much as they do.
Bullshit. I love America so much I actually served in the Military. I love America so much I cry when I think of all of the deaths that are directly attributable to our insane occupation of a country that NEVER attacked us. I love America so much I believe in all that stuff so many seem to want to throw away. Our honor, our reputaion, our standing in the World as a human rights leader.
Life isn't like 24. And Keifer Sutherland is a lovable drunk, not a Master Cell Phone CIA Badass. There will NEVER be a situation where torture is going to be the quickest route to extract information. Any information has to vetted, translated, vetted again, checked out...translated again... time consuming at best, a circle jerk most of the time.
The only reason to torture a person is to get them to say what you want them to say. It worked during the Inquisition, it worked during the Salem Witch trials, it worked for Pol Pot, and as Keith so brilliantly pointed out, it seems to be working for George Bush.
The people that say torture is okay have this belief in America's inate superiority. What makes us superior? Because before Iraq, I would have said that our treatment of every human being as such set us apart. Our standards, our honor... we don't have it anymore.
The men in Washington having young men and women beat on others, and then calling them monsters when they are caught, that are creating a generation of mentally tortured young men for no other reason than they thought Chuck Norris was KEWL ... Motherfuckers every one. Manufactured manhood, that is all they know.
Our Enemy is within, and it is destroying what America stands for. It makes me so freaking angry to read utter ignorance and tripe shuttled off as fact, and than be called naive or some other patronizing shit for having the goddam sense to know waterboarding is torture. I mean, sweet chocolate Jeebus on a stick, convincing someone they are going to drown if they don't tell you what you want to know is frakin' torture. How goddam confusing is that?
peoples Front of Judea @ 424:
there you go again..spin it around and around ....now it's you who is retarded
fishboots @ 429:
thank you....keep on keepin on.
sammy @ 43:
It's a hobby of mine that I picked up in grade school after a traumatizing incident.
No, actually, I figured I might get more replies in this topic. Seems like that'd be pretty clear, unless all you're really worried about is making a stupid sarcastic comment.
Chip @ 44:
Unfortunately you have a majority of america that thinks "This is too mad, this can't be happening in the USA, we're perfect, we're #1 ...... he must be a mad liberal ..... err or something like that, where is my McDonalds ...... lets what Oprea" .......
*sigh*
First impeach, then hang'em for treason as well as those that continue to say impeachment is off the table.
what = watch
It is so sad what bush and his administration have done to this country. I hope that if and when this is over, we can recover from this ugly and tragic situation.
KO - great writing - I just hope you have good bodyguards. I do not trust bush or anyone allied with him, and that includes the rabid repukes who still support him.
The entire administration are war criminals, either directly or as enablers, and deserve to be treated as such. In that category, I include also, those demoquacks who enable the policies and crimes of bush's government - they know who they are, but the latest to hit the news are feinstein and schumer (lieberman of course, holds a very special place, and should be tried simultaneously with bush, cheney, rice, etc.)
God that was great!
chlorocardium @ 1:
I'm in too. I'll steal my neighbors tools.
Don't worry, my neighbour is a jerk. He likes Bush
Olby's Wig @ 46:
Rush screens his calls and the callers with dissent are are phony. Also he cuts people off too, a cowardly tactic.
Olby's Wig @ 46:
Limpbaugh screen his calls......he won't let a dissenting voice be heard.
Homerun, Keith and shutout. Absolutely great.
HEY Sammy........great minds think alike......LOL
nwmuse @ 45:
Yes, and if you read the rest of my post, you'd realize that I meant that we all already know this stuff, and simply repeating it over and over wont change anything.
WE know this stuff. But WE don't have the power to do anything about it, and those that do have already demonstrated time and time again that they are not willing to do anything about it. It's really that simple. Realistically, the best we can do is hope that someone like Obama wins in 08.
But if you care more about what you WISH would happen as opposed to the reality of the situation, then sure, we can say that since Olbermann FINALLY brought this stuff to light to the public, GWB will be out of office tomorrow. YAY! GO US!
mudshark @ 58:
well...maybe not great minds(mine)....but you know what I mean......have at it.
The chief is watching this in his bed wearing pajamas and shedding tears. This makes the president sad...
Damn you Keith!
ajclowder @ 31:
Interesting. I haven't seen anything on a General Strike for tomorrow. Tried Googling it and didn't see anything. Must not be well publicized. I just saw something mentioned about a General Strike on 9-11.
Without a doubt, the most courageous thing I have witnessed on TV in modern political times. Here's to you Keith. You go. The "point" is, maybe someone that has not gotten it yet will hear KO say it and the light bulb will go on. These people are criminals and KO called it like it is. Keep up the good work Keith, you are a true patriot and journalist, a rarity these days.
and i have no time for euphemisms with the democRats either: they are complicitous in war crimes and crimes against humanity. and someday some of them are going to be arrested and held accountable (or maybe there will be The People's justice) along with all the members of the cheney administration who dare to travel overseas - or perhaps i could and should suggest that in 10-15 years times the governments of Europe etc begin their own program of rendition, kidnapping US ex-officials from the cheney years and taking them not to be tortured but off to The Hague to be tried...... for their multitudinous crimes against humanity, their torture, renditions, assasination of a nation called Iraq, their pre-emptive nuclear strike plans, their gross violations of the UN Charter and the Geneva Conventions, and so forth........someday.....
Thank you thank you thank you for continuing to post Olbermann's commentaries. No TV. They are the sweet sound of truth and water to my parched soul.
Joe for Unity08 @ 61:
No worries. Cheney will come in dressed as Mother Goose and tell Georgie Bush a bedtime story about how a chimp became president of the world. Georgie
srvgrd @ 59:
Didn't mean it as a criticism.. Sorry if it came across that way. I just HAVE to believe this can change, that momentum can build to turn this garbage around and SOMEONE will be made to account. I have to believe it can happen.
Kucinich-Olbermann 08~!!
Fort he sake of this country I want to see George Bush, Cheney, Gonzales and the rest of the clan brought up on criminal charges. They brought up the criminals from the Bosnian conflict on charges didn't they? What makes Bush any different? Why is he above the law? He walked into this presidency to make money. He doesn't even care if he looks good. It's all about the money. Keep the terror story going and Halliburton and Blackwater can make more money. Hand the oil fields over to the oil companies and make more money. Have a conflict so that the oil doesn't flow and make more money. Have to rebuild the country of Iraq and make more money. This group is so freaking inept and it works. They make more money.
michael72 @ 64:
DemocRATS??...why ...that's a popular term used by the Repugs.........you gave yourself away.........troll.
Joe for Unity08 @ 61:
Hey Joe, hate to break it to you.., a sociopath doesn't cry tear unless there is a camera on him and it is on cue..
Kudos to Fishboots!
I just needed to comment on these insane idiots Doug and others have to say. You are just bigoted scum, replace the word Islamofascist with a derogatory word for blacks and Jews, it really shows how you stereotype over 1 billion people. I live in New York City, work in the financial district a few blocks away from the WTC site. Unlike you in your trailer park in some red state a terrorist cannot find on a map, I'm their target. And why is it that 75% of New Yorkers vote democratic? We see that GWB did nothing to protect us and his policies and this disaster of a war make us less safe (besides the fact that we like our freedoms and are not religious nuts, among many other reasons).
Unlike you, I have traveled outside of the US extensively, including "scary" Islamic countries. And as someone who does travel, it's amazing how worthless our dollar has become, that is a true, concrete sign of this nation's sad decline over the last 7 years.
Get a grip, we were attacked by 19 men with box cutters and instead of taking out al qaeda in Afghanistan, he fought a dumb war with Iraq and seems to want to do the same with Iran. Idiots like you that support him are the traitors and unpatriotic, not us.
mudshark @ 430:
And you are still not answering my questions.
fishboots @ 429:
Exactly!
peoples Front of Judea @ 434:
dumbass...
Finally someone said what most of us have been thinking! I literally cry sometimes about what my country has become under the presidency of George W. Bush. They say I'm not a patriot. The truth is I am not a terrorist. I am not an idiot. I am a patriot and I want my fucking country back!
wow this thread got long. thanks to the ppl who defended me as simply asking a question. I think in general there should be less name calling like dumbass and retards. not everyoen knows as much as someone else. Im sure ppl come on C&l to learn new stuff too. i also appreciate the kind responses too!
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