Rove: war opposition 'may pose a threat' to Dems
I wouldn’t want to alarm anyone, but it appears that Karl Rove isn’t an especially honest person. Yes, this may come as a surprise to, well, maybe somebody out there, but his latest Wall Street Journal column helps drive the point home.
For example, Rove argued at length that Democrats are out of touch with public opinion when it comes to the war in Iraq. Seriously.
One out of five is not a majority. Democrats should keep that simple fact of political life in mind as they pursue the White House.
For a party whose presidential candidates pledge they’ll remove U.S. troops from Iraq immediately upon taking office — without regard to conditions on the ground or the consequences to America’s security — a late February Gallup Poll was bad news. The Obama/Clinton vow to pull out of Iraq immediately appears to be the position of less than one-fifth of the voters.
Only 18% of those surveyed by Gallup agreed U.S. troops should be withdrawn “on a timetable as soon as possible.” And only 20% felt the surge was making things worse in Iraq. Twice as many respondents felt the surge was making conditions better. […]
Just a year ago it was almost universally accepted that Iraq would wreck the GOP chances in November. Now the issue may pose a threat to the Democratic efforts to gain power. For while the American people are acknowledging the positive impact of the surge, Democratic leaders are not.
So, to summarize, Karl Rove — the alleged strategic genius of the Republican Party — believes the Dems’ withdrawal plans are unpopular with the public, while the Bush administration policy is gaining favor.
It’s a pretty silly argument for a top former White House aide to make in print, but as long as Rove is pushing the line, and Rove is going to be a major media player, we might as well go to the trouble of highlighting how wrong he is.
The Rove argument is pretty straightforward: Dems support withdrawal; the public in general does not. Dems think the war will help the party in the elections, but it’s more likely to hurt. Got it.
The problem is equally straightforward: Rove has engaged in some poll cherry-picking, overlooking the overwhelming data that contradicts his odd worldview. Consider some of the most recent numbers that Rove prefers to pretend doesn’t exist.
* CBS News: “Do you approve or disapprove of the way George W. Bush is handling the situation with Iraq?” 65% disapprove, 30% approve
* CNN: “If you had to choose, would you rather see the next president keep the same number of troops in Iraq that are currently stationed there, or would you rather see the next president remove most U.S. troops in Iraq within a few months of taking office?” 61% remove, 33% keep the same number
* Washington Post/ABC News: “Which political party, the Democrats or the Republicans, do you trust to do a better job handling the situation in Iraq?” 48% Democrats, 34% Republicans
Now, I will gladly concede that popular opinion with regards to the war is complicated. For example, we’ve seen, in a variety of instances, polls showing Americans wanting a withdrawal within a year. Twelve months later, they once again say they want withdrawal within a year. It makes reading the tea leaves a little tricky.
But for Rove to argue that Dems are at odds with the public (and, implicitly, that Republicans are in line with popular opinion) is just foolish. We can debate the severity of the White House’s fiasco and what might happen if we began implementing a sensible policy for a change, but to argue insist that Democratic proposals are out of step with voters simply isn’t supported by reality. In fact, it’s far more likely that the opposite is true — Dems’ poll numbers began falling last year when voters thought the majority party wasn’t doing enough to challenge Bush on the war.
The surge is working.
We have been greeted as liberators.
The economy is experiencing a rough patch.
Lies.
Lies.
Lies.
Bush's War on Frontline
I don't think I can type long enough to say every thing I want to about turdblossoms premise. I'll condense it by sayin What an Ahole
If America voters believe this guy again, then they fully deserve more of the same of what they've received the last seven years.
Who the hell in thier right mind would hire karla as a commentor for anything? as a tormentor sure that i can see, the mans sick inside the head. Oh hes probably ticked off the easter bunny didint leave em jack chit !
Pudge boy acts like that of joe gobbels,nothing but bullshit coming from its mouth.
I'm going out to join some Iraq Vets at San Francisco Civic Center to light 4,000 candles. Remind yourself and others of that. Their lies are no longer important. It is our dieing kids who are more important.
Dave
Viet Vet
Why does anybody care what this treasonous coward has to say?
Like all other neo-cons (neo-nazis, "if you will"), shitblossom is incapable of uttering/penning anything but lies.
We're talking about Karl Rove the most professional of all professionals in how to lie to make a loser's lying image more visible.
Cheney say so? Rove says "nuh uh they don't even exist in my beautiful mind." lol
I think I remember somebody somewhere saying that we would be as careful getting out as we were careless getting in. Rove's words about a so-called pledge to "remove U.S. troops from Iraq immediately upon taking office" is one of those Republican lies that when repeated often and loudly enough, will take hold with the American people. It's worked for them in the past. Why wouldn't they try it again?
Don't let him frame anything to Dems. That old trick can't work anymore.
You are their Property
pay your taxes, give them your kids, watch tv, drink beer, turn on the game and stfu!
I'd wager a VAST majority of Americans believe nothing at all that Karl Rove says.
I'd wager that his propaganda gig will last less than six months.
Karl Rove is a liar, with absolutely no credibility whatsoever.
Everytime any one of the bush crime family speaks it further proves that the whole bunch of GOP clowns are LUNATIC.
it could just be my math anxiety but that is one ass boring article for a writer that is gifted at dumbing down his material-- i think he makes his whole point right up front and expects no-one to finish the piece-- do we really think hillary or obama will immediately pull the troops out??? rove is a dick--
He does it to scare the Bush Dog Democrats. The sad thing is, they still listen and believe.
Friar Tuck @ 5:
Sorry to state the obvious, but
Ruppert Murdock
What a delusional, dangerous, and as Homer Simpson would observe,"A Jerk-ass!" God, what planet is this fool living on?
Dave @ 6:
That sounds like a very good statement. I hope you guys take pictures and get them up on the web. If you do let us know where.
why is this a surprise? Its right out of the rovian playbook that got bush elected twice and will likely get mccain elected despite all the percieved advantages for the Dems... you zero in on your opponent's strengths, not their weaknesses...in other words, the GOP has an unpopular war, a crap economy and a general malaise in the country, so Dems are ripe to win in November, right? wrong, he's scum but to sarcastically call him a genius is shortsighted. he is a genius, an evil one, but a brilliant strategist nonetheless.....
"Before the elections Karl Rove boldly predicted that the Republicans would continue to hold a majority in both the House and the Senate. The White House political strategist boldly predicted that the Republican Party would overcome the Foley sex scandal and the Iraq War. In May he stated that Republicans would pick up 10 seats in the House. In October he refused to acknowledge the dismal Republican prospects. At a luncheon with reports, Rove reaffirmed his confidence in a Republican midterm victory."
Helium
Karl Rove
Some songs I can think of when it comes to Karl Rove .
Girl dont go away mad, just go away.
(this one is self explanitory think condi!)
I hate everything about you.
(karls feelings about colon powel)
killing me softly with his bombs.
(Richard clark coming clean with the 911 mess up)
Walk like a man.
Your no good.
(andrew card at his attempt to aid bush without karls knowledge)
Hit the road jack.
(The cake decoration karl had done for rummy when he left office)
Get over it.
(for john kerry hey you had a chance to slam me back pussy)
Wasted days and wasted nights
(Karls time alone inside his dorm room on weekends, and now today)
Iam getting nothing for xmas.
( Think GRINCH)
Mudrer incorporated .
(Iraq,,,done deal,iran he hopes)
Dancing queen.
( Oh jeeze, picture him at the new interns coming thru the hill)
Lies lies lies.
(everything in his life he strived to hide from the press)
Smoking in the boys room.
(after the fake war build up , sitting there in the oval office knocking back a cuban hand rolled stogie)
Shit folks add your own , its just a endless possiblity. My apologies to the artists writers and singers of those tunes as well.!
Sorry but the only way to deal with this insanity is by laughter. Otherwise we would all be mad!
How long before fate sticks it's fickle finger in this little pricks eyeball! He has got to be the biggest bag of slime that ever walked the planet. thanks ruppert, we will indeed long remember you. Thank our luckly stars that nothing has changed at foxstreet news after news corp bought it. For ruppert we reserve the hope fate sticks it's finger elsewhere!
Bush
By some
Was annointed and Sainted
Never mind that his
Presidency’s tainted
His remarks
Though absurd
Were blessed by the Turd
Blossomed into the worst
Period of History
Denounced in this verse
If a eulogy
I would be obliged to scree
When death has taken
Bush far from our remorse
It might simply be this:
First he was priveledged
With no reguard for any
‘cept he
Now that he’s planted
Let us all pee
That is rich. This pork is so fat with lies, that he doesn't even know his head is up his ass.
Why pay attention to this jerk???
Poets sighhhhhhh they are so much better then politicans at getting thier words across.
Even without donations!
be back later folks,, if not,, take care and have a good night. and a even better tomorow.
best regards,,
Friar Tuck @ 25:
You too, Sir. :)
Rove may pose threat to GOP.
Rove is a criminal who will break any law to keep republicans in power as long as he doesn't get caught.
The man reminds me of Golem on Lord of the Rings. A pathetic manipulative low life.
Rove is smart but his arrogance and self-centered nature is why his party is in shambles now. For all his cleverness, his partisan warfare has cost his party dearly. That's why this president is deeply unpopular even among his unfortunate desciples.
For the last two elections, noone would have lost money betting against the Dems. Remember how Gore and Kerry were supposed to both be shoe-ins? They went into their elections with lots of voter boosterism, and anemic single-digit leads... that were easily overturned by GOP tricks and machinations.
And you did NOTHING about it.
If truth is what Dems are selling, about half of the country wasn't buying it before. What makes you think it's any more popular this year?
Step out of the Demeocrat/blog echo chamber, and join me over here in reality.
Al @ 4:
That's not so far fetched my friend.
With the Democrat's imploding, the low IQ of the American masses and the short memory of us all. McCain could win on fear and keep the war going another 100 years.
At least all at MSNBC will be able to keep their jobs and we will still have someone to rag on everyday.
Hah! Reality? They never dealt with reality before. Why would they start now?
Jasper von Holywater @ 29:
No, i really don't recall either of them being shoe-ins. I recall Bolton going down to Florida to stop the recount. I recall Florida purging black people from the voter rolls. I also remember Bush getting 16,000 vote from a precinct in Ohio with only 3,000 voters total.
420 invesco @ 30:
And the idiots drag me with them again.
Jasper von Holywater @ 29:
The directions to "reality?"
Well, you go down this path until you see victory in Iraq thern you hang a right until you are convinced Iran has nuclear weapons and then hop on the bandwagon for invasion. Stay on the bandwagon until the wheels fall off and the flip flop on over to where their thinking about putting in that new Rapture Center.
This coming from the man who said that the Dems would lose big time in 2006.
Blue Taliban Osama Buddha @ 35:
Exactly right.
This is not Texas Karl, you may control that one state but we have 49 more.
For a party whose presidential candidates pledge they’ll remove U.S. troops from Iraq immediately upon taking office — without regard to conditions on the ground or the consequences to America’s security — a late February Gallup Poll was bad news. The Obama/Clinton vow to pull out of Iraq immediately appears to be the position of less than one-fifth of the voters.
Oh really?
Bush, Powell, Bremer, and Sen. Mitch McConnell have all said in the past that we'd leave Iraq if the Iraqis asked us to. Not a damned concern about, you know, conditions on the ground or the opinions of the generals, or of the terrorists taking over Iraq and the Middle East region going to hell.
A few select quotes from the archives of ThinkProgress and Newsmax:
Secretary of State Colin Powell emphatically said yesterday that if the incoming Iraqi interim government ordered the departure of foreign troops after June 30, they would pack up without protest, but emphasized he doubted such a request would be made.
… “If the provisional government asks us to leave, we will leave,” Bremer said, referring to an Iraqi administration due to take power June 30. “I don’t think that will happen, but obviously we don’t stay in countries where we’re not welcome.”
President Bush said in an interview on Thursday that he would withdraw American forces from Iraq if the new government that is elected on Sunday asked him to do so, but that he expected Iraq’s first democratically elected leaders would want the troops to remain as helpers, not as occupiers.
Citing media reports, McConnell said some lawmakers in Iraq's parliament wanted a vote to ask the United States to leave.
"I want to assure you, if they vote to ask us to leave, we'll be glad to comply with their request," he said.
KKKarl Rove was the one who believed he had laid the groundwork for FIFTY YEARS of Republican majorities in all three branches of federal government!
KKKarl's MAJIC MATH was most certainly going to deliver Republican GAINS in the mid-terms of 2006 for both the House and Senate.
... and now, after driving the whole Republican Party into a deep ditch, he's' trying to save his own political career by lying his ass off and cherry-picking meaningless polls.
WC @ 37:
Oh, but the right people have to ask in the right way at the right time. Say, after US-backed Big Oil corporations have extracted the last drop of retrievable oil. Before then nothing anyone says counts.
I know - where little piggy rove stands on wall street - IT'S OPPOSITE DAY!
Yeah that's it - we need to just hear exactly the OPPOSITE of what this little treasonous piggy says.
biff @ 18:
Don't be a FOOL - its easy to look "smart" when you have a criminal cabal behind you that will STEAL the elections.
His strategies have all been WRONG - they actually LOST the 2000 and 2004 elections and we know what happened in 2006.
All he can do is put the lies out in the MSM so that the "echo-chamber" repeats them to establish the memes and excuses that will be used to justify more stolen elections.
This does not make kkkarl a genius - he is just repeating the same lies to cover the criminality of the folks BEHIND all of this.
Isn't opposition or rocking the boat like the average Joe knows, it is accountability and taking US and other unscrupulous governments into an illegal war. For various interests the people’s representatives of several nations ganged up into a preemptive war. Or if, contrary to my opinion and few others, the war was legal then yes the dems are just rocking the boat. Can for example Ms. Pelosi grasp lawlessness of Iraq invasion? If she can’t, a photo-op hand in hand with Dalai Lama – not that I have anything against the Tibetan struggle – values next to nothing.
Not much time left for the other one in WH cross-hairs: shock&awe Iran is coming at a theater near you.
It seems that the public who cares to read the WSJ are also at odds with Rove. Absolutely NO one in the comments agrees with Rove.
Why oh why does the WSJ print this crap when reporters complain about competing for space for their Iraq articles?
amen brother..afreakingmen....
Jasper von Holywater @ 30:
kkkarl's been smoking the crack pipe again
that's what he means when he says he's got "THE MATH"
whose the fool? you are still whining about the elections? jeez, how pathetic. the gop wants it more, they fight nastier, dirtier and drive the daily journalistic narrative with a fearful, scared complicit press that IS liberal but overcompensates to extreme to curry favor with the GOP after 25 years of GOP whining about "The LEEbral Media."
Its not PC on this site to dish out some hard truth but maybe if you all accepted it, you would move on from false elections etc. and figure out a way to beat the GOP instead of dropping mindless KKK Rove refrences, oh i get it... his first name is Karl with a K and he's just a like a member of the Klu Klux Klan....don't be a douchebag....
little bear @ 42:
Don't forget that the majority of the American electorate gets their information from the corporate media and everyone knows who the corporate media works for. Don't underestimate the power of the Republican Party or the intelligence of the public.
odanny @ 2:
I am going to try my limited technology skills to copy it to DVD.
dosido @ 44:
If the journalists/reporters had any integrity they would wallk out the front door. There in it for the money, principles be damned.
xoites Hussein defends Constitution @ 37:
i've actually taken the somewhat drastic measure of cutting one star out of my american flag, that one star representing texas.
between halliburton, enron, the bush family and roger clemens -i've seen enough. i keep waiting for some real cowboys to come out from hiding and round up all the outlaws, but it never happens.
so i say let the lone star state secede. or perhaps we could start a new war to force them to secede, kind of like the opposite of the civil war.
it's really not much more complex than kicking your drunk uncle pooch out of the house on account of him ruining easter.
SAYONARA, KEMO SABE'S. SAYONARA.
and we'll bring puerto rico in just to make it an even fifty again.
Who the hell in thier right mind would hire karla as a commentor for anything? You answered your own question...
Translation: "We are at war with Eastasia. We have always been at war with Eastasia."
Ha ha, charade you are.
The WSJ is going to get a makeover soon, thanks to Rupert Turdock.
It's going to become The Turdblossom Gazette.
-GSD
Sadly he's probably correct.
Once the Republicans work over the American Citizens and get them revitalized into a patriotic and religious fervor, they will gladly vote for McCain.
Americans have short term memories only. They are easily influenced even with the most simplistic lies. Logic and reason go by the wayside very quickly. The Republicans know it. Hillary knows it. Joe Lieberman knows it.
The clencher will be some major battle (made up by the Bush Administration) in Iraq will occur a few days before the Presidential Election and all the media will get the Republican talking points and Americans will forget everything up to that point and vote for McCain.
Come Nov 08 Democrats will be asking. What in the hell happened?
xoites Hussein defends Constitution @ 18:
It was windy tonight. The candles would not stay lit. Fitting actually. Small crowed. Mostly older. But a few young people. Iraq vets spoke. Very difficult to watch and listen. This war is really worse then Viet Nam.
Dave
Viet Vet
Definitely resembles porky pig .
Must be that same "fuzzy math" ole' turd-blossom was using the week before the 2006 election; when the repukes were gonna hold both houses of congress.
If you tell a lie often enough it will become the truth! Can we equate KKKarlRove with Heir Goebbels now?
Stop repeating his lies. You're actually helping him.
Denials of bad information simply reinforce it
Do not deny lies. Counter with a positive truthful statement - like "Karl Rove is a liar."
Wrong: "Obama is not a Muslim"
Right: "Obama is a committed Christian and Karl Rove is a liar."
Wrong: "Opposition to the war will not hurt Democrats"
Right: "Most Americans want out of Iraq, and Karl Rove is a liar."
Now repeat 50,000 times.
If Murdock owns the Wall Street Journal then why should anyone consider it not slighted highly to what most people think is to the right? I don't waste my time on news associated with him.
So I see Rove is reading tarot cards again.
I'm sure those contractor feel threatened by a Dem presidential candidate because it may cut off their war welfare profiteering.
Douche bags like Karl Rove believe if they repeat the lies over and over again, they become reality and people believe them. Since the media doesn't bother to challenge their assertions, it's actually worked out quite well for them. Most Americans are either too busy with their own lives or too blind to seek the truth, so make stupid choices. I believe it will happen again. Bush, Cheney, McCain, etc. all want to take military action against Iran. I'm wondering if that's the October surprise. They'll open up a new front in the "war on terror", leaving us in an even bigger mess that will be hard to escape from.
h a ha ha ha ....sure Karl, whatever you say dude.
eroded47095 @ 12:
That's right, KKKarl... nobody with an ounce of brains listens to you so STFU!
dosido @ 44:
I think old Rupert "the evil" has something to do with it.
Robt @ 62:
And what a welfare system it is! Socialism on steroids, for the richest 1%.
kerplunk @ 55:
The 2nd "Republican Great Depression" will trump Iraq! The only thing that can beat the democrats, are the democrats. Now that is something to worry about!
ONCE AGAIN ROVE, where are you getting these numbers from.....
Is is 1 out of 5 PENTACOSTALS oppose the war or....
18% believe that we aren't in a recession!
....Isn't it easy to create numbers to polls that don't exist.
Our security is also determined by OUR EMPERORS' diplomatic efforts, which haven't been admirable or existant. I thought that we were supposed to be the frontrunners of peacefull negotiations? We are in a sad state of affairs when we have to fix bayonnetts at our borders to create Fortress America. In retrospect, isn't this EXACTLY how Rome came to its demise?
One of the things that needs to be established when doing these polls is, of those people polled, how many believe that Iraq was responsible/involved in 9/11? I would bet that percentages about pulling out and Iraq involvement in 9/11 would mirror each other.
Rove as usually is spinning like a top. Took all of 2 minutes to find the poll he references on the Gallup website and here's what it really said as to prefences for troop dsiposition in Iraq.
18% favor withdrawal of all troops on a timetable ASAP ( which, incidentally neither reamining democratic cadidate is proprosing)
41% favor setting a timetable fro gradual withdrawal
35% favor keeping troops until situation improves
1% favor a timetable but have no pefence on immediate or gradual withdrawal.
Put another way, 60% of Americans favor timetables for GETTING OUT, with the issue being how fast.
Karl is right that 1 of 5 is not a majority, but 6 of 10 IS.
You are all missing the point. Rove is playing to a meme. That being it is physically possible to lift all the troops out of iraq in a moment. ANY withdrawal has to be done in a serial fashion, one that allows troops protection as they pack up and leave. It is impossible to "just leave day 1". Non of the dems have advocated that. THey say "start the withdrawal process day 1" that is it. So. Rove is
SAYING THE DEMS WILL JEOPARDIZE THE TROOPS BY DOING THE IMPOSSIBLE. with this meme HE IS CORRECT> the right and most of america will not support this (the impossible) but rove gives this meme gas by talking about it like it is actually phsically possible.
He must be carrying over his calculations from 2006.
VC776 @ 71:
Linkie:
http://www.gallup.com/poll/104398/Majority-Still-Favors-Timetable-Troop-...
Hate to say it but Rove is correct. The preference for a very gradual withdrawl over at least a year or more instead of an immediate withdrawl within a year was shown in the polls during most of Congressional midterm election year 2006 as well.
Which puts a lie to the GOP and wimpy Democrat spin that the newly-elected 2007 Democrat-controlled Congress "betrayed" the electorate and failed to respond to a mandate to end the war and get us out of Iraq immediately. There was no such mandate from the American people indicated by the major polls during almost all of that year and no such pre-election promise was made by the vast majority of Democratic Congressional candidates.
History has shown that the more perceived hawkish nominee in the two major Parties wins the U.S. presidential general election during a time of war. Period. No exceptions on that in U.S. history.
Therefore, John McCain actually has a major edge over either Dem candidate, particularly Obama.
And that has been reflected in many of the major polls siince at least September of last year and in some cases earlier. McCain has quite often polled higher as America's preference for president over either Obama or Clinton since they announced their candidacies.
Remember, during the 2006 campaign, ol' Karl said that has some secret numbers the rest of us don't know about. I can only surmise that he's getting this version of the "facts" from the same source.
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