Energy Expert: $12 and $15 per gallon gas not far away
By SilentPatriot Thursday May 22, 2008 3:10pm
On CNBC's Squawk Box Tuesday, energy analyst Robert Hirsch warned that $4.00 per gallon gasoline will be viewed in the not-so-distant future as "the good old days" because $12 and $15 per gallon is not far away.
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“[T]he prices that we’re paying at the pump today are, I think, going to be ‘the good old days,’ because others who watch this very closely forecast that we’re going to be hitting $12 and $15 per gallon,” Hirsch said. “And then, after that, when oil – world oil production goes into decline, we’re going to talk about rationing. In other words, not only are we going to be paying high prices and have considerable economic problems, but in addition to that, we’re not going to be able to get the fuel when we want it.”
I included the analyst that spoke before Hirsch to illustrate an important point. His "solution" to the astronomical rise in energy costs is, of course, to "drill more" -- never mind that drilling in ANWR would reduce oil imports by a whopping 4% and could irreparably damage the environment and surrounding wildlife. He says this is necessary "while we wait" for alternative energy sources. The only thing we're waiting for is a President with a long-term, big picture solution to a problem that impacts everyones lives in nearly every way on a daily basis.
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And once the depression is in full swing we'll be looking back fondly on this "resheshun".
They will continue to choke Americans with these prices until the public cries "uncle" and decides the environment isn't important after all. Then the fu*king drilling will begin everywhere.
the wakeup call was in 1974!!!
chevy is still making suburbans!!!
Congress needs to step in with price controls, pronto. It should be the first priority.
This is bush's final gift to his oil buddies. They will get to drill the hell out of our coasts, national parks and anywhere else they see an oil stain in the water. Notice repubs always say we must wean ourselves off foreign oil. It's hard to find one who just says we must wean ourselves off oil.
John @ 4:
I'll have some of what you're smokin!
Energy analysts crying about peak oil? Anyone reminded of Enron?
.
How many hours does it take to work a minimum wage job to fill a tank of gas per week if that job is 10 miles away?
It may depend on the milage the car get's, but the 40 hour week is over. It will take a second job just to earn enough money to fill a tank of gas.
.
I work for an energy/fossil fuel expert who is also an ecologist by training. Do not believe 99% of what you hear from the MSM or even environmental groups about our energy future. They are all full of it.
Blue Lensman @ 6:
Let me take another drag, and I'll go even further to say that any member of Congress who does not support price controls on gasoline should expect to lose their job next time they're up for reelection.
I thought we had plenty of oil. That's what the experts told us. What did I miss.
Not three weeks ago, there was one of those high falootin' whiz kid anal-ysts on the Sunday news programs talking about how the price of oil was going to go down.
Geeez, Iraq was the number 2 oil producer in the Middle East. Since we took over the oil has dried up. Hmmm...Bush Family...oil...war...reduction in supply due to war in Iraq...increased prices...increased profits for Bush family...hmmm...naaaaah...couldn't be.
NO BRAINS NO HEADACHES
wvguy @ 9:
Meaning what? More details please.
Don't accept this! $15 gallon gas may indeed be our future unless we all (1) overtly protest, (2) demand government investigations, and (3) demand a cheaper alternative fuel/engine. We may become our own victimized spectators of the oil industry profits; and it is not only Exxon-Mobil.
As long as parents demand they take their children to school in a tank that gets 6 MPG, as long as the auto industry makes care that are gas guzzlers, $10.00 per gallon plus prices are not very far off in the future.
The point is the corporate interests on K street have made sure there has been NO progress with any alternative other than oil. Congress has taken their bribe money and done nothing. Our infrastructure has been based on oil and the greedy corporate scumbags have made sure of that, the alternatives are a long way off with the continued resistance from the greedy corporate pigs.
raye @ 7:
I've seen reports (sorry, no links) that say the market price of oil based purely on supply and demand would be in the range of $60-$80 per barrel. The rest is speculators driving up the price. Look at who's profiting from the present mess and then take a guess as to who's gaming the market.
just setting us up for the okie doke.
all speculative aspects and the falling dollar aspects are being ignored and/or smiled away.
they just telling us were fucked as if it's the hand of god.
I really hate these people.
.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/car/
Why aren't we seeking this solution?
Who is stopping this progress?
.
Bullwinkle @ 16:
the falling dollar has a lot to do with this also.
This is bull%$@#! There is no way consumption has risen 40-50% in the last two months. These speculators have got to go as they are making money on the backs of all of us.
I am also an energy analyst and, like Hirsch, predicted two years ago that we would have $4/gallon gas this summer, and that gas will continue to rise about a dollar per gallon per year until it plateaus out at about $16/gallon in 2020 or so. Lately I have been accelerating that prediction.
Which leads to perhaps my only beef about C&L, which is that you do not cover energy issues nearly enough. Keeping track of the latest "he-said/she-said" outrage from the O'rielly and Limbaugh is important, no doubt, but pales to the fact that the health of our economy, and even the very survival of our species, depends directly on how we use our energy in the coming decades.
Please, we need much more focus on this extremely vital issue.
"Peak oil is a scam to create artificial scarcity and drive prices up. Meanwhile, alternative fuel technologies which have been around for decades are intentionally suppressed."
Embittered-Max-Hussein-1 @ 18:
The greedy corporate pigs are stopping progress. The only progress these bastards see is the record profits based purely on speculation.
Plain and Simple:
Where being jerk; by a small group of people who have
a hole lot of power right now and it needs to be taken away.
Oil:
Lindsey Williams - The Energy Non-Crisis - Part 1 of 8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbakN7SLdbk
Project for a North American Century
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4021186047214511179&q=peak+oil&...
wvguy @ 9:
Every summer we have these off the wall forecasts about fuel prices. Sure the day may come that the prices are at this level. Anyone that has any sort of leadership skills know that we must think ahead and find alternative energy sources and quit giving big oil the tax incentives that is helping bleed this country dry of federal reserve notes. Tax incentives should be going to those that are actually making progress into renewable energies that don't necessarily need biofuel or electricity even. There are larger ideas out there that are quieted because they will completely bring down the current energy fortress that runs our country. Anybody remember perpetual motion, and the engines that were made to generate their own power as they run. Why don't we hear about these sort of solutions?
I recommend people watch A Crude Awakening. You won't sleep very well after watching it.
"And now to respond to Mr. Hirsch's suggestions, we have a representative from the Polar Bear lobby. Mr. Bear, how do you respon --"
"RRRRRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRWWWRRRRR!!!"
"AIYEE!"
(smash, crash)
OneManComotion @ 20:
If speculators are causing an artificial price spike in oil, won't the bubble burst at some point like internet companies did a few years ago, and housing is doing now?
Whenever I tell friends or family that I think we'll be paying $10 a gallon by the end of the year, their faces get very ashen for some reason... then they say "naw, that can't happen here"... then I just shrug my shoulders.
Although I must admit it seems the high price of gas hasn't turned anyone off from traveling this weekend. I live near a busy stretch of Rte. 15 in PA and its friggin' bumper-to-bumper today - with many RVs...
pissed off patricia @ 5:
You bet they will. The Navy's been spending the last seven years driving dolphins and whales crazy while they've been sonar mapping the coast lines searching for oil deposits.
Pawn @ 25:
Good grief, is this a troll comment? I thought leftie blog readers were supposed to be moderately scientifically literate.
Anywho, given the current Wall Street business model of "make-quick-big-bucks-and-then-GTFO" that seems to be universal in all industries, you can damn well expect everyone at the trough, from the drug producers like OPEC, to the drug traffickers, to the drug pushers out on the street corners like Exxon, to the cops on the take like, well, every single one of those worthless fucks in Congress, to gorge themselves as much as possible right up to and during the oil crash that will inevitably come.
I say make it $20 per gallon.
Maybe then people will stop buying these stupid gas-burning cars, and we can go back to good 'ol fashion electric technology from the 50s.
Actually, the solution to the oil crisis is quite simple. All the US has to do is to guarantee a price of US$100 per bbl for 20 years. There are plenty of alternative energy sources that become viable if the price remains at current levels. Various types of workover to recover remaining unproduced oil, tar sands, oil shales, bitumen deposits, coal to oil conversion etc.
The characteristic of these sources is that they usually are very capital intensive, and while relatively low production costs can be achieved (Canadian tar sands projects are under US$20 per bbl cash operating cost), it is challenging for companies to finance these projects, unless of course an oil major owns the deposit. The problem is that financiers are leery of funding these capital intensive projects due to the high volatility of the oil price. Ten years ago, the POO was $12 per bbl for example.
Financiers need guaranteed revenues over a project life (say 20 years) to be comfortable providing funds. It is easy to do, but has to be done at a Federal government level.
If this does come to pass in the near future, this country will undoubtedly collapse. The economy cannot support such prices. Business sectors will cease to exist and so will life as we've known it.
I remember back in 2003 when we were gearing up to go into Iraq. No, no, it wasn't about oil, oh no. But all the R's wouldn't dare say the C word about gas (conserve, hmmm, why is that?) and that we had to "Maintain the American Way Of Life" of driving gas guzzlers and being the world's greatest consumers. But it's not about Iraqi oil (wink, wink). And all that Iraqi oil will pay for reconstruction, right?
In hindsight, it seems the plan was to cause chaos in the middle east and keep the oil in the ground thus limiting the supply to drive the oil prices up. That must be why for Cheney's secret energy plan in 2001 to have Kennyboy Lay there to show everyone the Eron energy game plan.
From $30 to $130 per barrel of oil. Mission Accomplished indeed.
John @ 10:
Price controls will only increase consumption. Increased consumption means the use of more oil, and will aid in the oil companies argument to drill in AK, or maybe promote a war to occupy Azerbaijan, Iran, or Terkmenistan for their access to the Caspian Sea. The only real solution is not using fossil fuels, period. Price controls would never make it through congress, it would be a waste of time. If you want to talk to your senator and congressman, talk to them about removing the tax breaks given to oil companies and give them over to R&D of renewable energies that are not food based or electric. People forget that electricity requires the use of coal or nuclear power, and biofuels will affect the prices of food globally. If there was mass funding into R&D of what I just stated, we would have an alternative energy source within one year, and have it implemented across the country within 5 years.
Pffft, $10/gallon gas bring it on. I'm gonna get me a temporary tax break on *my* gas this summer - that'll take care of that problem.
ranch111 @ 26:
seriously, what nonsense. the energy expert is full of it too.
there are multiple ways to produce fuels on an industrial scale from plants and i don't mean the plants we use for food. it's already being done in minnesota and in new mexico. i'm sure that all they need is capital investment to build more factories.
oil (and everything else) is expensive because they are actively and rapidly devaluing the dollar.
"...OPEC members are unhappy with surging prices, blaming it on speculators and a weak US dollar."
This doesn't seem that complex:
Increased worldwide demand (particularly China because of their coal shortage)
==> Weakening US dollar
====> Speculative investment
======> Rising prices
There's not a "shortage" so much as a crappy dollar and an unwillingness to change our behaviour. So get used to ever increasing prices, folks - congress can't and won't do shite about it.
raye @ 7:
Peak Oil is quite real. But, the problem we have now is due
to Bush a) sending the economy into the toilet and b) screwing
up the middle east. Without those we would still have to deal
with demand exceeding supply, but the impact would be more
gradual.
As well, today's LA Times has a front page report about how
hybrid car sales are "zooming." That kind of reaction is only
about 20 years too late. We should have began planning for
this long ago. Now, we're going to pay plenty for ignoring all
the people who tried to warn us of what was coming...
There's a documentary that sums all this up quite well. If you
have not seen the End Of Suburbia, I highly recommend it:
http://www.endofsuburbia.com/
If you haven't yet read it yet:
The Long Emergency
http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/7203633/the_long_emergency
people...
we have, like, a billion watt generator sitting at Yellowstone National Park...
thermal energy is the most environmentally freindly energy source i am aware of...
consult with Iceland, virtually all of their electricty is thermal...
just saying...
Doubting_Hussein_Terrance @ 35:
Bingo! Cigar time.
Gasoline will reach $10 per gallon and my employers will still be reimbursing travel for only 35 cents per mile -- an amount that was adequate only when gasoline was $1.50 per gallon!!!!!!!
Many of the oil executives say oil should be about $60.00 a barrel. Prices are being drivin up by speculators.
Sum it up, you're getting screwed.
Americans already pay much more for gas than $4.00 per gallon. The military industrial complex is borrowing (stealing from our children) 12 billion from us per month in Iraq to insure access to that oil. That amounts to about 100 bucks every month for us. Next, they will strike Iran for their purposes which includes electing McCain and keeping control of the federal judges and supreme court.
Peter Hollman @ 43:
You start tweeking on that caldera, you do so at all of our peril! ;^)
$12-$15 a gallon? No chance! Our economy will crumble before it reaches that level...And at that point, no one will give a damn!
Pawn @ 36:
Price controls will only increase consumption. Increased consumption means the use of more oil, and will aid in the oil companies argument to drill in AK, or maybe promote a war to occupy Azerbaijan, Iran, or Terkmenistan for their access to the Caspian Sea.
The oil companies are already making the argument that they need to drill in Alaska... (To increase supply and to reduce our dependence on foreign oil). I don't see us just quitting fossil fuels cold turkey. Our current infrastructure is dependent on fossil fuels.
We have tried "supply side" remedies for years-- tax giveaways and incentives to big oil. It's time we got some return on our investment. Congress should limit the price of gasoline, and then leave it up to the oil companies to figure out how to adjust.
The problem with drilling more in the US is the oil companies don't want that.
They'd have to pay American wages and benefits
So it's cheaper to deal with oil rich countries with virtual slave labor.
Additionally, any domestic oil production would go into the international oil market, and the effect will be minimal in terms of supply and costs.
Peter Hollman @ 43:
S'os their underwear.
It's hurting sales at the local Fredericks of Hollywood.
Peter Hollman @ 43:
yellowstone is unstable, as in scary unstable.
yellowstone is too far away from populations centers to be viable as a source of electricity.
there is a long list as to why yellowstone isn't an option. there are a few places in the US were geothermal power generation is viable, maybe like hawaii, but there are all sorts of problems. iceland is a much more stable environment with a political climate that enables that kind of thing to happen.
it's time to line up the bush administration
bush-cheney-and then everyone else...put them in line and then
just stomp the hell out of their balls.
Why do I feel bushco had intended this all along?
The pure tragedy of this is that if we had a president of anything but minimal intellect, empathy for the country he leads and any leadership ability, he would call upon Americans to do things like drive a bit less this Memorial weekend, drive 5 miles per hour slower, etc. Make a call to the people based on patriotism and shared sacrafice. It worked in the 1970's with OPEC left with nothing to do but eat their oil. The price plunged and OPEC was fucked. How much Carter is ridiculed by the fascist right, but how well our country responded before!
Unfortunately our vile, self-indulgent dry-drunk of a president can't feel for his countrymen, lead the country or think for himself.
One Year Wonder @ 31:
One year wonder, why don't you counter it instead of completely going off the handle. The science of perpetual motion is very real if that is what you are challenging. Though no one has been successful, if history has proven anything, the impossible is possible with enough money and research. Perhaps you can be more specific into my scientific illiteracy.
I never said that it's going to be an easy task, but the fact is all the directions we are heading will lead to negative drawbacks. In an earlier comment I stated that electricity will require nuclear or coal energy, and biofuels will require us to invade the world food supply to provide energy.
Whereever the big money is, the snakes and weasels will be right there, that is for sure. After watching some congressional tax debates via an old frontline episode, one thing is for sure, legislators will stab their mom in the back to meet the needs of their friends. So going into the next election, make sure you know who you are voting for, and who their friends are before making your decision. We can't realize our dreams unless we have people who actually care in elected positions. I look forward to your response one year wonder.
I think we probably have the ability to switch to renewable energy tomorrow if we wanted too! The real question for me is how will Big Oil continually crush other forms of safe, cheap, clean energy....? Their freeking crooks and everybody knows it. So what has changed? Bruce Carlsbad Ca...
Well, I have suggested this to just about everyone...tax all commodities including crude spectulators at 95% or more for each trade. It's just a matter of time that action like this will have to happen...it could prevent a bubble and a crash, probably need world cooperation but this is a world economy.
Wait for an alternative solution? There are already plenty of ways to begin. how about all of the sunnier states implementing solar panels on houses, charging electric cars. I mean if some guy can be off the grid in coastal Washington state then WTF? I doubt there will be one panacea for all of this but we have to start now and we can. we need fire under the m-asses.
While oil supplies are guaranteed to decline I, like many, don't believe that is the main cause of the high prices. But unlike those who want the prices lower I would rather have a long term solution being implemented now. So I think the gov should take a hefty portion of those price-gouging oil profiteers and use those billions of dollars to subsidize alternative energy sources (solar panels for home owners, rebates for electric cars, etc..), improved mass transit infrastructure and so forth. (It's a bit like taxes - I'm only against taxes when they don't f"in use them wisely - which is all the time). In case of these newer ways they'll only do that when people get fed up enough to make a stink about it. The unfortunate thing is that they're more likely to find a way to lower oil prices to make people calm down temporarily and the masses are likely to go along with that fix cause they're stupid and self-centered.
A little foresight and we could do so much better with alternative means both environmentally and economically (just think of all those technology jobs..)
That's if we can override that severe dumb streak that runs through our DNA.
What we need is a Manhattan like project for finding alternative energy.
Afterall it's about National Security both internal and external.
Make watts not war!!!
60 Jib
Texas, Arizona, New Mexico, So. California, Nevada could all easily go solar right away.
But they have to come up with some way to power cars, perhaps natural gas, or oat shell based ethanol since we're already throwing that stuff away by the tons.
trevor @ 33:
Venezuela offered their heavy crude at a flat rate of $50 per barrel. The problem is getting the rest of OPEC to go along with it when they are reaping great profits.
Is there a way of getting oil out of hemp?
We'd wouldn't mind exhaust fumes anymore.
I realize that the price of gas is hurting people, and unjustly enriching a small minority at everyone else’s expense, but SHOULD the price of oil be cheaper? Most of us on this site care about the environment, what would happen if the price of oil went down? It would be consumed more, which would pollute the environment more. Oil is also a resource that is finite in amount, so it would make no logical sense that the price would drop as the resource becomes scarcer. The opposite should happen. The other factor is the pricing mechanism in capitalism itself. Market economics cannot capture the costs of industrial activity. When oil is used, we are adding costs to the environment. Should we not include those costs in the prices we pay? We should radically change our economy, go the local, stop energy subsidies for big agro business and leave some energy sources for future generations. Capitalism has not done the planet well, it has just done the minority of the world, the developed world, well at the expense of the environment and everyone else.
The biggest issue isn’t the price of oil, although it may feel that way sometimes. The issue is the fact that there are corporations and individuals profiting off of the price increases unjustly. We should, but won’t at least in the near future, nationalize the oil industry. We need money to fund social services, hopefully for things like universal healthcare. Socializing the benefits, since we already socialize the costs, would do that. Poorer countries, especially those like Bolivia and Venezuela who have progressive governments, usually get negatively harmed by rich countries like ours lowering the price of natural resources far bellow what they’re really worth. It is, in essence, a transfer of wealth from then to us. They don’t benefit from a resource that is extremely valuable so, in essence, we can have various luxuries that result in us having cheaper gas. This is just one of the many ways that the poor countries stay poor.
OPEC is the last issue, as far as I’m concerned. Raw material cartels are not a bad idea for poorer countries. OPEC could be used to raise the price of the raw materials to where they should be. OPEC currently though is dominated by non-democracies, basically authoritarian governments and monarchies. It was originally created by the Third World project to raise the price of oil, for the above mentioned reasons, and the funds were to be used to fund development in the developing countries. That has happened (thanks in large part to the US and Europe), OPEC is ruled by elites and they give a small fraction of their earnings to their countrymen. We should, but won’t, pressure the OPEC countries to use far more of their funds for development. The IMF and World Bank sure as hell don’t have logical polices that benefit the poor, so we could lobby to restructure OPEC. That would require however us going after the Saudis, and that isn’t likely. The left should be thinking about these issues outside of the narrow spectrum of low prices, and we would do ourselves a favor by ignoring what the damn corporate media has to say about the issue. They are no better or different than Pravda in any way.
ysbaddaden -
I can't find the link but there was an article on electric cars charged at home thru solar panels - albeit not the best solution for huge roadtrips but totally functional for most commuters etc..
I think it was via the Sierra club. There are people already doing this..it is already viable.
We're crazy - most of the drivers in the western states could be doing this.
If anyone thinks there is NOT a conspiracy by big oil then why is big oil fighting and lobbying against solar and wind energy in Congress?
John @ 49:
The oil companies are already making the argument that they need to drill in Alaska... (To increase supply and to reduce our dependence on foreign oil). I don't see us just quitting fossil fuels cold turkey. Our current infrastructure is dependent on fossil fuels.
We have tried "supply side" remedies for years-- tax giveaways and incentives to big oil. It's time we got some return on our investment. Congress should limit the price of gasoline, and then leave it up to the oil companies to figure out how to adjust.
Leave it up to the oil companies, and we will all be in a mad max universe chasing a gasoline trailer. The people of America should wait for no one to adjust from our current state of affairs. Capping the gas price may help our pocketbooks now, but in the long run, we will still be pushing off a solution to the big picture for our children and grandchildren's children.
Doesn't anyone find it odd that they keep harping on the scarcity of crude oil, yet we drink water from individualized plastic bottles, and the straws at Wendy's are each wrapped in plastic? You could never tell there was a petroleum shortage based on all the packaging...
All the oil and energy companies will be achieve by hiking prices that high is their own extinction. Even at current prices, alternatives are cheaper. and the best thing about all emerging trends and technologies is that they are breaking the monopolies of centralization, and are doing it without causing environmental burdens or degradation. I suspect that the closer truth is that we'll collectively look back at these times as the last effort that a lot of greedy, amoral and self-serving scumbags used what power they had to take the world to the cleaners one last time.
ysbaddaden @ 64:
Yes, in fact there is. Anybody can do it.
"$12 and $15 gas not far away"
you could have knocked me off my chair with a feather.
it's not really surprising though, when one stops and thinks. i mean, i was laughing pretty hard when all the chatter was "oh, no, oil will never go over $100/barrel."
but if anyone out there thinks they have a clue what inflation is, they're going to be in for a horrible surprise -- everything you buy just to eat, sleep and go to work is affected by the price of oil. i am self-employed and am already considering an energy surcharge on all my invoices -- and i "just" type legal transcripts! if someone had suggested even six months ago that i would be thinking about doing such a thing, i would have said they were nuts. but i have just paid $311 for my last winter-month gas bill after having kept my thermostat at 64 degrees for the entire winter (i spent a lot of time either in bed under five blankets or sitting in my office chair, working, three feet from a space heater.
i used half as much actual natural gas to heat my house but my heating costs for this past winter almost tripled.
when i bought my car in july 2001 (it's a long story) it cost $15 to fill it up. today it costs me $40 and going up at a rapid rate. (i'm now really sorry i didn't "top off the tank" after my trip up to boston two weeks ago, the last time i used the car, as it will cost me at least $5 more than when i was last at the gas station.
thanks for this post. i prefer to be aware of the inevitable more than five minutes ahead of it actually occurring. thanks, c&l, for being a source of valuable information on a regular basis!
speaking of valuable information ...
there is an interesting post over at "down with tyranny" (http://downwithtyranny.blogspot.com/) titled "GASOLINE PRICE INCREASES ARE NOT A COINCIDENCE-- THEY ARE PART OF THE BUSH ECONOMIC MIRACLE" that others may find enlightening.
henry wallace @ 67:
Is the issue, in the end, the fact that we don't really have a functioning democracy? The idiots in government don't consult us on policy, we have no direct power, they and the lobbyists get together and create policies that most of us, across the political spectrum, disagree with and largely are in their on not our interest. To me it would make sense to try to organize to get more direct power. One way Venezuelans have far more direct power is the ability to have things like national referendums when a law is created that the public doesn't want. If we had that we could stop every damn corporate dominated law that's created and send it back to be negotiated again. Why, in years past, did the car companies buy up the public trolley and transportation systems only to immediately dismantle them? Why were they allowed to do that, especially if it wasn't in the country's best interest? Because we have no functioning democracy and the economic system itself is the exact opposite of democracy. Money trumps, and controls, democracy, not the other way around.
cg @ 69:
Ahh, the great refreshment of what many people don't realize, plastics are created from oil. Just another way that America and the world must change their consumption habits.
Lets Pull Down Our Pants A Little Lower
This $12, $14 gas per gallon prediction is a speculation setup. It is design to make us accept the current gas prices with a sense that we are donging a much worse situation. Just be quite and don't make the oil giants mad. After all, they are doing us a big favor by selling their gas at $4 per gallon.
The minute we come up with a alternative fuel solution the oil companies will be trying to give their product away. I suspect they own many solutions to this problem and have it locked away in a safe place where the masses can't see it. This may be an urban legend, but I heard that the oil companies bought the rights to a fuel efficient carburetor in the 1960s that would bring about 60 miles per gallon with little trade off in performance. So where is it? We have the technology now to end this speculation nightmare.
Are we going to sit by and let $14 per gallon gas ruin our country's way of living? I say we need to start the conversation that would lead to nationalizing the oil companies. Our way of living depends on it. It is a national security issue. At this point, the oil companies have all the money they can spend in 3 or 4 rich lifetimes.
We cannot be subject to this kind of speculation without putting it in a bigger picture. We are already at an outrageous price to be paying for gas. How dare they come to us and say soon we will be saying these prices our a bargain. We are being conditioned to a price acceptance , and if we don't watch out, we will be the next third world country.
Joseph
(_(_) @ 55:
Bush and his maladministration may have inadvertantly started an alternative fuel drive like no piece of legislation during more normal times ever could have. We may look back and be thankful for W some day . . now I've gone too far.
Pawn @ 74:
When was the last time you saw a can of soda at the convenience store? Plenty of plastic bottles - no cans or glass bottles though...
sweet. I wonder if my next COLA on my SS Disability will reflect that bullshit. 'Cause I know the last one didn't (2.4% for 2008)
Thanks motherfuckerGeorge.
Joseph @ 75:
Commie. Next you'll be advocating single payer universal health care ;)
John @ 4:
Ain't gonna happen. Congress rarely if ever steps up to the plate and does the right thing. As far as gas prices go, please remember that Congress runs on big-business money and remember that the oil barons play a big part in financing them. They are all hypocrites, thieves and liars. So don't get your hopes up.
Here's a part of the solution, the little car from India that runs on compressed air, is cheap to buy, cheap to run, and 0% emissions impact on the environment.
http://www.businessweek.com/autos/content/mar2007/bw20070319_949435.htm?...
miss_kitty @ 80:
Republican: It would be a step up from what we have now.
Joseph
Here's part of the solution: the air car from India that runs on compressed air, cheap to buy, cheap to run and 0% emissions impact on the environment. So why can't we (meaning us incredibly wealthy, smart, greedy business types who KNOW they'd have a huge market baying at the doors for a car like this) build our own?
http://www.businessweek.com/autos/content/mar2007/bw20070319_949435.htm?...
pissed off patricia @ 2:
Even if we started drilling in ANWR tomorrow - does the public realize how long it would take for it to produce 1 gallon of gas for consumption in the lower States? 10 yrs??
Why are speculators allowed to determine prices?
This is this week's commentary from the president of Euro Pacific Capital, Peter Schiff, who has been completely right on the money about oil for many years. Back when oil was still around $35-40/barrel, he was saying it'd be going to $100. He was laughed at back then. Back in February of this year, after oil closed above $100, he said it's well on its way to $150, and again he was laughed at. Anyway, here's the commentary for your consumption:
**********************************************
It is unfortunate that the Supreme Court, in its ruling this week that U.S. currency is unfair to the blind, did not make the next logical step and declare it unfair to everyone who buys gasoline.
In their search for explanations as to why oil has surged past $130 per barrel, Washington, Wall Street, and the financial media are as clueless as cavemen after a freak summer snow storm. Despite the head scratching, the blame game is nevertheless in full force. Speculators and big oil companies are being trotted out as scapegoats, and increased margin requirements and taxes on windfall profits and futures trading have been mentioned as appropriate sanctions. It should be clear that this is pure farce, and that no one understands what is actually happening.
The reality is that after years of reckless consumption and dollar debasement, Americans are now being priced out of markets over which they formerly held unchallenged title. As more affluent foreigners consume more of the resources and products they previously supplied to us, Americans are being forced to cut back. The rising dollar-based price of gasoline is simply an illustration of this global trend.
Poorly concealed behind contrived government statistics, the signs of America’s falling standard of living are everywhere; all one has to do is look. We are unloading SUVs for less desirable compacts, and are paying more to fly on crowded planes (where we pay to check luggage and dine only on what we bring onboard). We drink our lattes at McDonalds or not at all, and we increasingly forego dining out, trips to the mall, and vacations, just so we can scrape together enough to fill our gas tanks and kitchen pantries, pay taxes and insurance, or make credit card, mortgage or car payments.
The collective belt tightening is simply the down payment on the Government’s massive bailout of Wall Street investment banks and mortgage lenders. As the Fed creates money to buy bad mortgages and other shaky securities held by banks and brokerage firms, the value of the savings and wages of everyone on Main Street will continue to fall. As a result, the costs of products previously taken for granted have begun to bite.
The various housing bills and stimulus packages now passing through Congress will add significantly to the staggering final price tag. In the end, the “free lunch” currently being dished out by Washington will be the most expensive meal ever served. The cost will be borne by ordinary Americans citizens every time they open their wallets. Four dollar gasoline is just the beginning.
For all the talk of increased global demand, few seem to understand from where it actually comes. The surge in global demand is both a function of the increased purchasing power of foreign currencies and the fact that foreigners are choosing to spend more of their incomes themselves. In other words Greenspan’s famous “global savings glut” is turning into a global consumption binge, with Americans unable to crash the party. This trend will only get worse as the dollar-denominated price of just about everything that is either imported, or capable of being exported, goes through the roof.
We can look for scapegoats all we want but the simply fact is Americans are going to have to get used to a much lower standard of living. Those who have been putting all the food on our tables are finally pulling up chairs themselves.
**********************************************
nonny mouse @ 84:
Hey nonny! this was rereun last night on the tiny PBS station...Car of the Future
I dream of taking my SS money and buying a $92,000 Tesla...it is teh SWEET.
Hirsch isn't the kind of "Energy analyst" you're used to seeing on CNBC.
Feel free to read his report: PEAKING OF WORLD OIL PRODUCTION: IMPACTS, MITIGATION, & RISK MANAGEMENT from 2005 online at the DOE website:
http://www.netl.doe.gov/publications/others/pdf/Oil_Peaking_NETL.pdf
The good news is, this really is supply and demand.
The bad news is that while Oil demand still bows to economic rules, Oil supply is now and forever firmly under the rules of geology.
Water powered cars, or HHO. There are people already running cars/trucks off of this technology.
If I had the know-how and the resources, I'd build an electric car. And if the government doesn't make me disappear or label me an "enemy combatant", I'll sell them to everyone cheap.
Screw Big Oil!
wvguy @ 9:
The oil companies are lying through their teeth about all of this.
World oil consumption IS NOT growing in leaps and bounds; if you watched the snaky oil executives in front of Congress earlier this week, you would have heard the representative from Wisconsin telling them the facts.
Cheeeeeeeeeney and Bush have grabbed Uncle Sam by the balls, and I believe they ultimately intend to commit castration.
The heist continues as the lower classes become slaves to the wealthy power-elite.
The United States went through all of this in the 1970s: You HAVE to ask yourself why, after nearly 4 decades, our automobiles are still running on fossil fuels. Ya think it's only coincidence? If so, you probably vote republican, too.
miss_kitty @ 88:
You'll be spending the $92,000 on bread and milk if fuel hits 15$ a gallon. How do you think food and everyday nessesities get to us? Everything we consume gets trucked to us.
I guess we could all farm a 1/4 section, maybe grow some wheat for bread. Then hire illegal migrant workers to harvest the crops because we can't afford the fuel for the combine.
When did being liberal move to crazy? I must have missed the boat on that. :)
Go ahead and educate yourself a little:
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601109&sid=amO.EpcDfEls&refer=e...
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/anatole_kaletsky/art...
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Global_Economy/JE24Dj02.html
http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnflash/content/may2008/db20080520_5...
People who think that its supply issues forcing the price of gas to these levels aren't looking at the facts and the real numbers. Sorry, supply is not the issue here. I know C&L likes to link to things that get the flags waving for energy reform (and that is good on its own), but don't perpetuate the lie any further, please.
Lollimom @ 92:
I would just like to point out that the representative from the Royal Dutch Shell company did indeed tell the truth in these hearings, which was very refreshing. He's the one that said that oil should be around the $60 mark according to supply/demand... and to hear an oil rep say that was like a ray of sunshine on a rainy day.
Unfortunately as the gas crisis worsens, each group with its own agenda points to one or two reasons for the price being so high. The reality however is much more complex:
1. We are running out of cheap oil. We have plenty of oil reserves world-wide to last over a hundred years, but it's much more expensive to obtain. The surface oil that we have been accustomed to paying for is running out. Shale, sand oil, and deep ocean drilling is the future, but it will cost 5-6x what we pay to drill now.
2. Due to a crumbling manufacturing sector and lack of exported consumer goods (been to Walmart lately?), our dollar is weakening. We are losing our global buying power.
3. Iraq. This illiegal occupation was supposed to ensure cheap oil, but it has caused the opposite to occur. We have disrupted the oil market significantly.
4. Exponential world fuel consumption. China and India and the rest of the world are using more. When standards of living increase, so does oil consumption. However, it's important to note that per capita, the rest of the world uses far less than we do.
5. US consumption: Our overall MPG is now on par with the 1970's due to the explosion in numbers of full-size trucks and SUV's. We are more wasteful than ever.
6. Plastics (polytheylene, polystyrene, etc.). They are everywhere now and they are the chief material in manufacturing due to rising costs of metal such as steel. They are made of petroleum.
7. Finally, speculation. Many funds (such as retirement, 401k's, etc.) are now comprised of futures and their dividends. Because of the other factors influencing oil prices, it is a sure bet that prices will rise, thus speculation is at an all-time high, pushing the price even higher.
Basically, a perfect storm...brought to you by your own inept and corrupt government. Congratulations America. You've managed to destroy yourself.
JohnnyBravo @ 91:
Don't feel bad about the know-how thing. As things currently stand there is no electric care that doesn't use more energy than than a gasoline powered car all other things (such as vehicle mass) being equal. Not to worry though since there's lots of people working on it . Hopefully Ballard Power systems or some other group will get it right soon.
peak oil means very expensive oil.
Google Cheney's speech 1999. The Bush Crime family knew about Peak Oil when they took office and their solution was the invasion of Iraq. So far we have only gotten up to the pre-war 2 to 2.5 million barrels a day. But Bush and company got stinkin rich.
That doesn't mean that there is no Peak Oil. That just means that the oil/military/industrial complex got rich off the waning days of the expanding economy.
As for those who think that they can point their fingers and solve the problem. Grow up. It's going to hurt everyone and there is nothing that we can do about it. At best, if Obama gets elected and does the right thing- starting a Manhattan Project for alternative energy then we will still have a painful transition. It's a rapidly depleting resource and we have wasted it on our suburban life-styles.
yakfitguy, where are the facts to back these claims? I'm not saying that they are all wrong, but demand inside the US has been going down recently which offsets the increase in demand from China (see the report from Citigroup and others), which is far from 'exponential'. Oil exporting countries can't even sell the stock they have now and are storing it on ships because their land storages are overfilled with oil waiting to be bought (see reports on bloomberg and Ed Wallace's reports on gas prices on business week and elsewhere).
The market didn't just magically find out about these things you listed in the past 6-12 months and decide that the prices had to rise drastically to compensate. I agree many of your points are valid for the long term, but for the short term problem, the answer is almost solely speculation and market manipulation, even the Royal Dutch Shell OIL COMPANY is admitting that fact.
Would I perhaps be correct in assuming that this Robert Hirsch is the very same person for whom the Hirsch Report was named? As in the Hirsch Report published by our very own US Department of Energy in early 2005, the results of which concluded that the United States would need to begin planning no less than twenty years in advance of the global Hubbert Peak in order to make the transition away from petroleum with little impact -- a figure which could potentially be reduced to a period of no less than ten years provided upon "extraordinary efforts" from consumers, industry, and government?!?
I've said this before but might as well say it again here and now...while it's possible that the weakening dollar has played a role in the recent dramatic climb in oil prices, we simply cannot afford to ignore or dismiss the possibility that Peak Oil may be playing a role in this as well. If the Saudis and/or the other oil-producing nations know that they're close to reaching or have already passed the Hubbert Peak of production, is there anyone here naive enough to honestly believe that they'll admit it voluntarily? The laws of supply and demand suggest otherwise. Decreasing supply plus increasing demand for a basic commodity such as petroleum not only means increasingly high prices -- it means that the sky is practically the limit. Reaching the Hubbert Peak of oil production means that every gallon of oil becomes more expensive than the one before it since more effort has to be put into extraction and refinement, and these costs are inevitably passed along to the consumer. Add to that one of the main consequences resulting from the law of supply and demand -- that someone with the need for a commodity and the means to pay for it will quite literally and quite willingly pay virtually any price -- and it's not too hard to see where this is going.
If the Saudis and/or other oil-producing nations were to admit that they're reaching or have reached the Hubbert Peak, this would quite possibly trigger a worldwide conservation effort potentially up to and including rationing. What impact would that be likely to have on those countries? Usage would decrease meaning that demand would decrease, and the decrease in demand would mean a decrease in profits for these countries -- and while the decrease in profits might provide an incentive for these countries to lower the price of petroleum, the revelation that global petroleum supplies have hit the Hubbert Peak would quite possibly keep demand from rising to pre-Hubbert levels. In short, even if the oil-producing countries have reached the Hubbert Peak -- as some, like Matthew Simmons, suspect the Saudis may already have) -- it is not in their economic interests to admit it unless or until they have weaned their own economies away from dependence upon petroleum.
Get us out of Iraq and cure our dollar... that's most of the reason. But then again, once China and India have hundreds of millions of cars on the road, it won't matter. But until then, fix our debt and cure our dollar.
Everyone knows the Oil companies aren't gouging anyone. And forcing the price back will only enrage crazy free marketers (there's a lot of them roaming around) and not really help anyone.
And considering nearly 40% of the nation thinks it's congress' fault the oil prices are high, it just goes to show how incredibly misinformed the public is.
jake39888 @ 102:
Your right, congress is addressing the problem right now and has partly addressed the problem in the past. The Bush administration is not doing its duty and enforcing the regulations in the already nearly unregulated oil market that have been passed.
Bullshit fear mongering.
If they say it will go up than they are free to raise the price to whatever they want, regardless of the truth of the situation.
If they say there is a threat than they can start a war, regardless of the truth of the situation.
"We need more refineries!", the gas companies cry. Did you know they are only operating at 81% capacity? Tell them to use the ones they fucking have already. They spend more on advertisements than they do on actual investments into alternative energy- 15 Million is all Exxon spent, yes Million with an M. That investment in turn goes to junk science saying they dont need alternative energies. They claim they are doing us and alternative energy a favor by having gas prices so high. Whats my cite? These fuckers under oath before the Senate earlier this week. Remember a few years ago when whatever repug shit head refused to make them go under oath?
Fuck these asshole. Fight back OPEC(I know the gas companies are seperate but they go along with em)
marko @ 3:
YUP.
you took the words out of my mouth.
As I was watching this I was remembering the 1970's and how many of us were pushing for a mass transit infrastructure, something akin to Europe which would be nation wide and also built up in each state so people would be able to do without cars entirely without having to live in a city.
Those shared cars (zip cars I think) that are left in one spot and you reserve them for a fgee and a yearly membership seem like a great idea. I wish they were nationwide too. They seem to be working out well.
I am seriously considering moving to one of those 55 and older (ACK! how did that happen! LOL) communities because they have shuttles to the grocery stores shopping etc and will take you to your doctor's etc. Plus the rent is reasonable on condos. OMG, how did this happen?
God, scary to contemplate, what's next, shuffleboard?
jake39888 @ 102:
I don't think anything can fix our dollar at this point. Lowering and keeping interest rates this low (2.0%) isn't helping since that's just increasing the money supply (causing inflation), and raising them isn't going to help things either (at least in the long run). As long as the dollar continues to drop, prices for everything that we import (and most things we export) will continue to go up. I already got my money out of the US dollar, so I'm not feeling the same pinch everyone else is, and I advise you to do the same.
I have been watching oil prices every day for the last four years when I first saw the End of Suburbia. In 2003 oil was going for $28 a barrel.
Since that time I've watched the prices go up, up, up and the same old tired dogs being trotted out to explain the price run up: the Iraq war, speculation, the terror tax blah, blah, blah.
Supply and demand is causing the run up in prices.
The Saudis have been the swing producers for the last 30 years. If there was a lack of supply they made up for it. If the price got too low they would withhold oil from the market.
The Saudis no longer have any surplus supply. They are producing all out. If they had it, they would put it on the market because a recession in the United States and the world would cause them to lose more money in lost investments then they could ever make through high prices. If the U.S. thought Saudi Arabia was yanking our chains our tanks would be occupying their fields right now.
World Production has plateaued at between 84 and 86 million barrels ever since 2004. Eventually it will decline and we will look back on $4 a gallon as the good ol' days.
Denial- The oil companies and Bush are doing it. Once Obama is elected the price will go down.
Bargaining- Maybe there is some alternative fuel that could replace oil.
Anger- Those damn oil companies.
Depression- Peak Oil is real.
Acceptance- maybe my life will be better without consumerism, not easier and more comfortable but better.
ALThomas @ 95:
You mean the one making the relative poverty wages of $2 million/year? I'll grant that he was more honest than the rest.
marko @ 3:
and the chasis and train drive hasn't really been overhauled since then either. individually owned automobiles will cease to be viable. GM took its electric car offline, because they paid off the California board. They will put it back online if they are required. But, why should Americans be dependent on such a corrupt corporation.
John @ 10:
Price controls would lead to shortages........
Typically White & Bitter Agent Huessein Provocateur @ 104:
Price= supply AND demand. If we reduce demand, the price will fall. The execs and Bush/Cheney will only talk about increasing supply and not coordinating it with decreased demand. Our lifestyle is not subject to negotiation, remember? LOL. Our patriotic and honest oil and car manufacturers made us the most vulnerable country in the world.
Of course we need to wean ourselves off all oil, but the key term is wean. If we allow drilling in ANWR, we can create a buffer of oil supply to allow new technologies on-line. Thos who talk about drilling in the Arctic as ruinous to the environment has not seen or paid attention to the fact that cariboue numbers around Prudoe Bay are increasing. So are POLAR BEAR numbers, despite what a lot of eco groups are saying. It took mankind at least a 100 years to get ourselves into this problem, we can't just cut it off cold turkey. Our economy ans society can't do it. So where are you going to put your horse and buggy, how are you going to feed the horse, what are you going to do with the manure. We should be thinking ahead and not "throwing the baby out with the bathwater". What we should do is pump the heck out of the known US supplies of oil, and thumb our nose at foriegn oil altogether. Then after a year or so OPEC will be selling us cheap oil again, better a little profit than no profit at all. The next thing we should do is Nationalize the oil companies in the US,(like Amtrack).
Bob White @ 14:
The only way to decrease the price of gasoline is to decrease demand for it. This is what happened when Americans drove 55 MPH in their Pintos and wore sweaters in their suburban homes during winter. Lower demand ensued, and was combined with new supplies from Alaska and then Mexico and Russia. OK, we're back to 70 MPH and Alaska and Mexico are running out of oil and Russia nationalized their oil and is keeping it mostly for stability at home.
Other ways to decrease to demand are to finally put effective and enjoyable mass transit systems in place and to insist on electric cars to be built again with solar power plants built to sustain new demand. We should have done most of this years ago, but our lifestyle is not negotiable.
Tom Guilliam @ 111:
There are other ways to wean. However, Reagan brought to government an ideology of pure markets will solve society's problems, and it proved so successful in the short term, that even the Democratic Party accepted this far right wing idea of market solutions to everything. If you increase the supplies via ANWR drilling, theoretically prices will drop, which will mean less demand for alternative energies, again. So, we would have yet again postponed effective long term solutions.
BTW, check your numbers for how little effect ANWR production will have when compared to total American demand. The average prediction is ANWR will satisfy 2% ~ 3% of American demand, that is if the oil companies are forced to sell to refineries in the US only.
At this rate, the ol shoe leather express is not too far away...
Go ahead big oil, price yourselves right out of a consumer market...
See where that gets your greed driven asses..... When everyone is walking, you soon see your industry needed us at least if not more than we needed you.... And then we can all watch three industries whether and die...
Autos, rubber (tires) and big oil itself.....That ought to be good for the economy...(snark on, snark off).............JD
Daniel @ 38:
Hemp can be processed into fuel -- NO, not the kind you smoke. Of course, the growing of hemp is illegal as the government is afraid we would all turn into hemp smokers (you would have to smoke a box car full to get even the slightest buzz as hemp has less than 1% of the magic stuff). Be not afraid, the government allowed hemp to be grown during WWII to make rope for the war effort. Hemp is easily grown and I think four harvests a year is the norm. Of course, the oil interests would not be happy if 100% of our oil was made from hemp. Then oil would be $2.00 a barrel with no U.S. takers. So sad for them.
On the otherhand i didn't stay at a holiday inn today but i did see an ev on the road today !!!
More drilling can't get you out of it. It takes years to get operations online after you start and the finite amount in ANWR would have little impact on these prices or the larger ones to come.
There is a good argument that temporary supply disruptions are driving this, combined with the speculation, but the overall trend hasnt changed regardless of the current issues. Supply and demand is going to cause many problems like this. Some of the best energy analysts have said that because its completely obvious.
I hope all those good old boy truckers that voted BushCo are happy with the results.
meh @ 39:
So according to you, oil production will never peak, and the weakening dollar is the sole cause. How do you explain that oil prices are higher in Euros, too? Euros have grown stronger against the dollar over the past couple of years. Cheap, easy to get at oil is becoming scarce, my friend. It is in OPEC's interest that oil remain cheap enough to dissuade the widespread adoption of alternatives. Perhaps they think $135/barrel is still cheap enough--I don't know--but OPEC clearly has not been able to live up to its claim that their production can keep pace with the world's demand.
if we produced our own oil it would be cheaper...
how much oil do they produce in countries that use the euro?
:)
Where is Bush in all this? Not a peep out of him. Is he still hearing voices, or is he just sitting back with Cheney and their oil buddies reaping the wind while raping average Americans?
neoconned @ 107:
Thank you. That was part of the point that I was trying to make in my previous post. Given the fact that Saudi Arabia leads the world in proven oil reserves and the fact that their economy is heavily dependent upon petroleum -- roughly 75% of budget revenues, 40% of the gross domestic product, and 90% of export earnings according to one source I found -- we unfortunately can't afford to count on them leveling with us when (not if) they realize that they're close to reaching the Hubbert Peak or have already passed it. I don't think the possibility can be ruled out that perhaps the reason why the Saudis rejected Bush's recent plea to increase production is because they know they've already reached that point and literally can't increase production but also know that they don't dare admit it because it would mean risking an inevitable and most likely irreversible decline in their economy.
The airlines are going to get hammered.
It will be interesting to see who goes under in 2008.
Some are already saying ouch.
It will also be interesting to see how the Pentagon deals with this.
"If the U.S. thought Saudi Arabia was yanking our chains our tanks would be occupying their fields right now."
LOL
Never mind that most Alaskan oil is sold to Japan. It is a shorter shipping rout. Most of our oil comes from south and central America.
You think T. Boone Pickens isnt buying up oil futures as we write?
The price of oil should go up. But the speculators are driving it into the stratosphere.
liberalal @ 120:
Yeah, great leadership there.
(_(_) @ 56:
It's called 'Code Speak'.......MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!
Rufus @ 115:
besides the pharmaceutical use, hemp is a food and fiber source. it wouldn't be good for industrial scale fuel production. regardless, the battle to make it available as an agricultural crop due to the hysterical nature of our political machine is at best one that is up hill.
there are other better options that can be employed in the short term.
It's almost $10 a gallon here in Korea. It doesn't seem to have stopped many people from using their cars, even with an excellent mass-transit system. They have cut back on going out of the city, but still drive their cars everywhere in the city.
I bought a ticket to go to Canada this summer, to see my family,. The fuel surcharge is $300, on top of all the other regular costs. (Hey, my family is over there, and I'm over here. I want to stop flying eventually. When I return "home".)
Hello America the debtor nation. Get ready for the fall of the middle class. You may not know it
but many of our largest companies are already foreign owned. And many more are up for sale.
Why Budweiser looks to be next.
Sandy Weill, formally of Citibank, was saying just the other night that sovereign wealth funds
(my impression was he was mainly referring to oil wealth) are going to climb to 13, 14 trillion dollars in the next decade if oil stays at the todays prices. Going up exponentially if oil goes even higher.
I know most Americans don't get it yet, but we are going to be their slaves.
Vic @ 15:
Perfectly said.
I think the price of gas has been "artificially low" in North America for far too long. It has prevented North Americans from exploring alternative fules for far too long. In Japan, you see Smart cars, and all kinds of funky-little-cars everywhere. "Low gas prices" have encouraged people to drive wasteful SUVs and the like. People have not adjusted their "reality" to conditions "on the ground" (oh, geez-- right wing talking points. Help me.) $4.00 ain't bad.
I remember just a few months prior to Bush being selected the first time. I caught a snippet of El Rushbo addressing concerns of having oil men (Bush and Cheney) in the White House. Rush's point was, who better to have in charge and protecting our interests than oil men, people who really knew and understood the oil business.......I thought then, fox guarding chicken coop. And history has proven me right. Oil prices have quadrupled under Bush and Cheney. So go ahead and defend Bush, its not his fault, blah, blah.....and enjoy those gas prices, they are only going up.
Edwin Hussein the Appeaser @ 132:
Maybe so........but give me some options. Currently, other than the internal combustion engine, I have none!
Why one of the Big Three automakers hasn't yet offered an economically priced, all electric, plug in commuter car, I do not know. They could sell every one they make. And don't tell me the technology isn't there............it is, and they are simply dragging their feet.
I commute 40 miles one way in bumper to bumper traffic every day. I would buy an all electric commuter car tomorrow, if it were available.
fuddled @ 110:
The problem with using "supply and demand" as an example of market economics is over-simplification. Supply and demand assumes a marketplace without tax subsidies, penalties, collusion, cartels, speculation, or political manipulation. I had a professor who joked once that the only true "free market" is for fencing stolen goods.
lucid fiction @ 128:
Looks like Barack Obama 'speaks the code' too.
Speaking Truth to Horsepower
Another 'Do as I say, not as I do' elitist, liberal politician.
Un-F'ing-believable.
dennis @ 137:
As much as I loathe SUVs, aren't they supplied to the presidential candidates by the Secret Service? Aren't the armored up to protect against attacks? Could that be the reason?
jwf @ 138:
Maybe, jwf. But we can all say SUV's protect us and make us and our families safer, can't we?
Our government loves Chevy Suburbans. Everytime the Secret Service come to town it's black with them. They love them and they love the Tahoe.
And why shouldn't they. Quiet, roomy and the American taxpayer picks up the tab for the gas.
Well there goes the rednecks and pick-ups , but the good news is , there will always be Hummers on the streets . Walk up windows the next phase .
jwf @ 136:
True in the sense of incrementalism. However, on a fundamental level, if there was no U.S. demand from autos, oil prices would plummet.
Wonder about high gas prices?
Ask the price fixing Saudis and their business partners, the Bush family. It cost the Saudis $4 to deliver a barrel of oil to market and current price is over $132. Bush recently went to Saudi and the price has gone up.
Spin and lie this one Republicans.
jwf @ 138:
Oh, yes, attacks. aren't we still in code orange? we must always be vigilant. we should all drive in armored gas guzzling SUVs. Besides, it makes us look cool. Yes, black ones. So cool. Europeans are so wimpy.
Dennis @ 125:
Exactly. I laugh at the politicos fighting for ANWR and the deluded voters who think ANWR will solve even a little bit our problems. Mexico's Cantrel oil field supplies 7% of our annual needs, and it's output is dropping like a rock. The Mexican gov't is already planning to be a net importer of oil in 3 years. At least they're planning. Of course, our fed gov't knew about this years ago, but with 2 oil men running the show, you cannot expect viable long term solutions until they leave.
PEAK OIL has got NOTHING to do with the current prices of gas. The REASON prices are so high is because oil companies along with speculators are gouging the consumer.
Crying bullshit on this "expert".
It's not about oil supply, it's about refinery capacity. For 30 years the petroleum majors bought out their smaller competitors while everyone looked the other way. In so doing, they allowed the refineries to be closed thereby reducing gasoline production capacity. Which is what the majors now claim is the major reason for our pump prices. That and some serious gaming of the system by the speculators.
Slowing down while driving would be a huge first step in helping to reduce consumption BTW.
If we reduce demand, the price will fall...
Okay. Just out of curiosity, how ya going to 'reduce demand'?
You going to walk or ride a bike to work every day? What if you live too far from your work to make this possible, you going to quit working? Carry your groceries home on the bus - if there is a bus? Farmers going to start plowing the fields with horse drawn plows again? Airplanes going to stop flying? Trucks going to stop delivering goods to markets? You going to stop using anything made out of plastic, like milk jugs or tampax tubes or DVDs or rubber bands or bicycle tyres or - god forbid - your computer? How about all those folks, like me, who would love to have an air compression car a la the Indian model... which isn't in production yet... and won't be available on the American market for awhile.
Reducing demand means having the luxury of alternative options. We don't have much for alternatives. And until we do, 'reducing demand' is an empty threat, and the oil companies know it.
nonny mouse @ 148:
Always used the cardboard ones, me. :)
I've said it before, and hundred times. We need to desperately be making solar energy collection and storage in batteries cheap and easily manufactured, pronto! We should be poring money into research and educated new generations of researchers for nanotechnology and nanomaterials....
Oh, and investing in mass transit!
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