Chuck Todd disses Move On's new ad: 'I think it was a borderline shameless ad'
Well, well, well. I hate to say I told you so to all the bloggers that praised him, but in the blink of an eye the Villagers have turned on MoveOn. For all those that thought Chuck Todd was so cool---guess what? He's going to stick with the Villagers every time. I'm not saying that he's wrong all the time, but in the end, you'll wind up with this. And the right wing doesn't even have to engage them in the MoveOn ad because the Chuck Todd's will never need any convincing to attack the left. They will instinctively do it to appease the right wing and demonstrate to them that "I'm not part of that crowd." That's why I focus on the media so much.
Geist: It might be fair, it might be effective, I just opposed dangling babies. <corrected>
Todd: I think it was a borderline shameless ad, using a baby like that. It just seemed like a sledge hammer on the message...
I'm sorry, but there was nothing wrong about MoveOn's ad and if the Republicans had done a similar one the same Villagers would be praising it as making a cutting edge ad that makes liberals look weak. John McCain saying he'll stay in Iraq for 100 years is OK to criticism him with. The DNC made an ad about it. Just because the RNC cried about it and McCain has flip flopped his position on it doesn't excuse his words and actions on the Iraq war. Mika defends McCain's refuting his horrible position. Even The Scar said it was fair game.
Mika: At this point it looks like a cheap shot. That line has almost practically been revoked by John McCain. Or at least clarified.
The Scar...that being said, if you say things like that, it's going to come back and you're going to hear time and time again in the campaign.
Here are a few more posts on this subject:
John McCain: Let’s Stay In Iraq For “100 Years”!
The Media’s defense of McCain’s 100-years in Iraq comment
I didn't notice any outcry from NBC when Progress for America aired this ad - one of the largest political TV ad purchases in 2004 - exploiting American deaths on 9/11 to promote Bush's reelection.
Do you still want Chuck Todd to be the host of Meet the Press?
If it's on tv, it is BS. never forget they edit everything. Try to realize it is never anything but weak entertainment value they shoot for. It isn't real.
No, the next host of MTP should be someone who knows what real journalism is like. Someone like George Clooney.
It isn't shameless to kill people in the name of Oil for Todd. Remember who his bosses are!
It is shameless, Chuck Todd, to send those babies when they grow up to die and get maimed in useless wars or for the glory of some fucking politician.
Quick! Someone get that baby some hot bottle water!
I think its very telling that the Scar thinks that he can recognize a great book because he has seen the movie. I think that says it all.
Never did want him!!!! Or Andrea...she's as biased as any of them.
Never did want him!!!! Or Andrea...she's as biased as any of them.
I vote to stop using "journalism". It's gone, time to move on (sorry). Let's call them what they are, "newspeople". And I always go to "Scar" for the definitive "cheapshot". Aaarrrgghh.
So it's shameless to remind people of the human and future costs of war, but not shameless to unleash those costs upon this generation and future generations? Let's face it, if John McCain becomes President, more troops will be put in harm's way and, yes, die.
I think this ad is over the top and it will certainly not help Obama with swing voters. Anti-war voters, like me, are going to vote for Obama anyway. Let's be smart about this campaign and not simply right.
I have know of no election in our country, especially one where the incumbent was not running for reelection, where the choice has been clearer. If you are happy with the ways things are and are headed in this country, then by all means vote for McCain. But if you aren't, I can't understand how you can possible justify voting for that man.
More balanced news...ugh.....they don't have the guts to have someone from moveon there. Might make them look like the stupid effin idiots they really are.
Chuck Todd is listed on the screen as "NBC Political News Director".
What the hell does that mean? Is he a journalist? A reporter? An investigator?
This is bullshit... Move On's first advertisement against the Iraq War 5 years and 4,100 dead too late.
By the time those butthole surfers at Move On make any noise let alone, a difference, in ending the Iraq War lil' Alex will be the late big Alex with a white grave marker adorning his plot.
So sorry Mommy but, if you're counting on Alex being protected by Move On my suggestion is that you start dressing the kid in camo and learn to love it.
What strikes me about pundits gathering around a table to discuss the hypothetical ramifications of any particular issue (and I use that term loosely, considering we have to contend with headlines like "Terrorist Fist Jab?") is that those pundits are creating said backlash by repeating the rhetoric surrounding an event. Perhaps this sounds a little too much like a conspiracy theory, but I honestly find it entirely disingenuous to hear talking heads say something to the effect of, 'I think this will have some serious ramifications for Democrats!' because the subtext is, We're trying to stir up some controversy about this topic. In short, the people talking about blowback are themselves intentionally creating blowback, or at least adding their white noise to the heap. It's impossible to believe that every single network's panel of blabbering pundits thinks of themselves as above the fray, able to discuss 'what people will think' without realizing that they're really talking about themselves.
Ehh... the video was kind of lame.
I've always known Chuck Todd to be a rightwinger since I first saw him on C-Span years back. I've always taken his political analysis with a grain of salt.
that ad of bush just made me incontinent........
The talking assholes on TV will always pull for McCain. Todd is no different from the other excrement filled head's.
RE: #8
Such as when she discussed the economy during Greenspan's term and never mentioned her marriage or when she went to Darfur with Condi and made the story about herself??
ciloisin @ 20:
the corporate mastrs back the war pig. fuckem all.
shameless is backing a genocide in the name of jesus!!!
Wasn't subjected to that wee betrayal. It's one of the advantages to living in the ultimate no-spin zone; my no-TV zone home. You won't miss it... trust me! On the other hand - now having read about it, I will be forced to make a contribution to MoveOn. It gives me a warm feeling when they rattle these suits, exposing them for the corporate hypocrites that they are.
Are these people serious? And what is with the one dipship who seemed to think that kid would be of age to fight McSame's 100 years war IN 100 YEARS?!?
And Sorry, Chuck Todd is no different from the rest of the media. You want shameless? I can't think of anything as shameless as our main stream media. So sorry Chuck, you don't hold any water on this subject. In fact the whole group seems to be carrying water for the Conservo-Bots.
killing innocent iraqi children that's shameless
That's Willie Geist not Chuck Todd who says "It might be fair. It might be effective. I just oppose dangling babies"
don't trust any of these assholes in the media except olbermann or moyers. they are all rightwingers. maybe because of olbermanns backround in sports, the fact that in athletics your are going to be exposed to a lot of different people from a lot of different backrounds you naturally will become more progressive. with moyers, he's just old school where people in the media were real journalists, instead of tv stars. the rest are all suckups to the right because they've benefited greatly from tax cuts and want more of the same.
What is the diffrence between this young woman "dangling" her baby or me dangling my 22, 23 and 24 year old sons? Parents do not want to lose children, period. Not now, not in 10 years, not in 15 or 20 years.
And I suppose Swift Boating John Kerry is justified? Puh-lease. Spare me the santimonious bullshit.
"It might be fair, it might be effective, I just opposed dangling babies." is not a quote from Chuck Todd. it is from the other white guy who is neither the Scar nor Chuck Todd.
No, not at all a biased critique.
This ad isn't aimed at these low-level blowhards. None of their kids will ever see the wrong side of a battle zone or shit themselves in fear of being killed or maimed. The ad is for those morons sitting on the fence trying to "decide" who the next president is. The ones who think John McSame really gives a crap about them or their kids.
David Shuster did a much smarter segment on the moveon.org ad this afternoon on msnbc at 4pm. Shuster asked tough questions of Eli Pariser and a republican from the american spectator. Imagine that? Tough questions for all guests.
Anyway, at the end of the segment, Shuster said he thought the ad was "very effective," regardless of the debate over the content.
I agree.
I also agree that Shuster should be in the running for MTP. He's the only journalist on MSNBC who always holds everybody's feet to the fire. Plus, he knows politics. Isn't that the combo MTP is looking for?
Judging from the reaction of these media whores, all I can say is...
Keep up the good work, MoveOn!
The bottom line: Is the ad effective?
MoveOn ran tests and it is a very effective ad as to the response they were seeking. So it is not backfiring. What it is doing is making people think ahead a little about the future. Do they want to sacrifice their kids to save face for some idiot in the White House? As the Fox crew sits in their comfortable little chairs, in their air conditioned buildings, collecting their fat paychecks, America's young men and women are being killed killed in a desert far from home in a country where we are not wanted so oil men and other contractors can become even wealthier.
MoveOn's ad is a reality check for parents all across America.
Chuck, Chuck, banana dana bo, *uck, Chuck!
It matters not whom I want for moderator of Meat the Press (misspelled on purpose). I did not join in on the hagiographies and eulogizing commentary last week when the job opening became available. A tool has broken and another tool will fill the slot and drive the Golden Screw of propaganda infotainment disguised as insightful inquiry and controlled by the one of the largest arms manufacturers in America spoon feeding the pablum to the masses.
NOTE TO ASHLEY:
The Criminals currently in office are responsible for your mother's death.
Didn't you see the blood on G-Dub's hands when he tried to smother the life out of you?
FROM A CONCERNED PATRIOT
The other two champion douche bags on TV are Joe Scarborough and that nitwit Tucker Carlson both of whom seem to be unbelievably jealous of Obama's success. They literally spit venom from their teeth when they talk about him. In the case of Scarface, his jealousy stems from the fact that he made an complete and utter idiot of himself when he publicly predicted Hilary would crush Barak and now he grinds that big jaw of his ever time he has to discuss Obama's success.
This sort of knee-jerk reaction to any statement made by a pundit is ridiculous. So Chuck Todd didn't like MoveOn's ad. Now he's automatically a die hard Republican who should be thrown to the wolves? Are you seriously asking your readers to question his possible succession to Tim Russert on Meet the Press based on this statement? Mr. Amato, your disagreement with Chuck Todd on one small point doesn't warrant the kind of vehemece with which you're attacking him.
namvetted @ 30:
The ad is genius. If something like this would of come out in '04 Kerry could have won the election.
the ad was just okay, not great. I did object quite strongly to the conservatives on the program crying foul. after all they have done, any cry of foul is going to fall on deaf ears. when the lady says I think the american electorate is smarter than that in reference to "a hundred years, she clearly has not been paying attention. Middle America is ready to buy anything that is fed to them. Even the threat of $7.00 a gallon gas may not shake them out of their doldrums. McCain said it and perhaps has tried to explain or soften it, but he in fact did say it. How can some of these conservatives stand up for causes that are clearly against their best interests? That only serves to say to me how much they are anxious to join the mainstream media prostitutes who will sell their souls for an anchor position on one of the major networks. The Media is to blame. Then the political players.
Chuck Todd is awesome. The ad is mawkish and intellectually dishonest. If you watch the 100 years quote, McCain makes clear that we can't sustain casualties for 100 years, but only that there may need to be some US presence for that long (which is certainly debatable, but even in the original quote he says he is not advocating a presence like we have now and that we cannot tolerate casualties for that long). The Democrats will lose if they hang their hat on the 100 years line (though the Republicans won with the shameful "I voted for the funding before I voted against it" smear, so what do I know?). You don't have to beat McCain by distorting what he says -- the man is more of a crazy hawk than Bush.
All of these ads suck - on both sides - and I'm sick of all of them! We're supposed to be having a political campaign to aid citizens in selecting the folks who will be our leaders for the next number of years.
So, I'm thinking we need to get Madison Ave types (or wherever they reside nowadays) and the Karl Rove types out of it. The slick, single issue, gotcha ads do nothing but confuse and/or conflate - they add no value. We don't need any more sarcasm, entertainment, emotional crap, fear-mongering, and most of all - we don't need more LIES! What we need would be TRUTH, information, ideas, honesty, integrity, TRUTH, doable plans, inclusion, and...did I mention TRUTH.
I should say that I've been a reg. Independent for decades and I've never been swayed to vote one way or another by campaign ads. However, being thorough;y disgusted by the morons currently in office, in 2004 I contributed to MovOn's efforts by making phone calls to get out the vote for Dems. If they really want to do ads in support of the Democrats, they should just make simple ads, using real facts. Cheney & Bush and their buds (including McCain) have provided enough fodder for thousands of information-packed spots. Let's leave the babies out of it.
The sentiment is right on but it's a bad ad with overwritten copy and awful acting. MoveOn can do better.
How about Adam Boulton?
The ad isn't going to change my mind, I'm still voting Obama without thinking twice about it...but the ad didn't do anything for me. Maybe MoveOn's focus groups had a better result, but to me it didn't really add anything new other than a baby's face.
To me, the ad won't sway anyone. The people who're die hard McCain people are going to see the 100 years bit, and go back to Mika's point. The Obama supporters are going to say right on, and it won't change their vote. The people in the middle need to be bought with pudding cups because to not know what's going on right now means you're lacking in human functioning, and should sit in a nice padded room with a pudding cup where you can't hurt anyone.
From the video-
"What I saw is what I want to see"
Truer words were never spoken.
Each time I saw Chuck Todd on the Keith Olberman show, I was reaching for my remote. At best Mr."Todd" (with the snake charmers grin on his face), is always stating the obvious, which is of course very much in line with the whole NBC news department. Apart from Olberman (although he can be uneven at times) there is not a single original voice at NBC. It is a typical corporate syndrome, original voices are to be avoided at all costs. The declaration of Sainthood of Tim Russert (in a quite distasteful teary eyed spectacle not unworthy of FOX TV( by all the key members of the MSM, shows clearly that the only thing they all have in mind is, how do I please the Boss and what kind of bonus will I get at the end of my year, or life. Mr."Todd" would be a perfect addition to the long list of mediocrity at NBC and the other Networks. They are just word 'sayers'.
Whassa Chuck Todd?
yes, you misquoted him in part.
and yes, you are still right about Chuck Todd.
Each time I saw Chuck Todd on the Keith Olberman show, I was reaching for my remote. At best Mr."Todd" (with the snake charmers grin on his face), is always stating the obvious, which is of course very much in line with the whole NBC news department. Apart from Olberman (although he can be uneven at times) there is not a single original voice at NBC. It is a typical corporate syndrome, original voices are to be avoided at all costs. The universal declaration of Sainthood of Tim Russert by the MSM(in a quite distasteful teary eyed spectacle not unworthy of FOX TV) shows clearly that the only thing they all have in common is, how do I please the Boss. What kind of bonus will I get at the end of my day. month, year, or life. Maybe even such a send-off as Mr. Tim. Therefor Mr."Todd" would be a perfect addition to the long list of mediocrity at NBC and the other Networks. Just let the mouth do the talking and not the brain.
Who has bee praising this guy? Certainly not anyone who has watched him on C-Span.
Hey, he's right. It's a pretty shameless ad. And it does more harm than good.
the message is clear mccain wants to take us to war and it will affect our future for some time
Hey people - that's not Chuck Todd!!!! It's Willie Geist. Nice attention to detail.
May Chuck Todd be waterboarded with the blood of 1000 Iraqi children.
If I had cable I might know who this guy is,but I don`t have it.I consider most pundits in this country full of shit.My feeling without having seen the ad,is that it`s about time someone on the left used shamelessness as a rhetorical tool. The wrong Right has been shameless for decades.
Maybe a more effective add would be a real person who has had her baby taken away from her - like Mary Tillman and her son
Mike who lost his brother Pat. Maybe they could explain how the government lied to them about how their baby died in order to
help the REPUBLICAN party. Maybe this would shut Todd's face. Borderline shameless?? The republicans are not borderline.
sam @ 52:
there is no shameless way to speak the truth....it may be uncomfortable, it might seem inappropriate at times or in certain contexts, but truth is truth....and sometimes scumbags like mccain and bush need to be confronted with the truth....
shameless? check out fox news... (terrorist fist jab)
"This sort of knee-jerk reaction to any statement made by a pundit is ridiculous. So Chuck Todd didn’t like MoveOn’s ad. Now he’s automatically a die hard Republican who should be thrown to the wolves? Are you seriously asking your readers to question his possible succession to Tim Russert on Meet the Press based on this statement? Mr. Amato, your disagreement with Chuck Todd on one small point doesn’t warrant the kind of vehemece with which you’re attacking him."
KNEE JERK REACTION MY ASS! THESE TV PUNDITS HAVE AS MUCH RESPONSIBILITY FOR 4,000 + DEAD SOLDIERS AND THE HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF DEAD IRAQI AS BUSH/CHENEY & THE OTHER CAVE MEN IN THE ADMINISTRATION. AS FOR HIS SUCCESSION TO MEET THE PRESS , PLEASE SPARE US FROM ANY MORE OF THAT STUPID SUNDAY MORNING SHOW WHERE THE MOST EXCITING THAT HAPPENS IS WHEN MARY MATALIN & JAMES CARVILLE PLAY FOOTSY WITH EACH OTHER.
The ad sticks the Iraq debacle right in the republicans' faces and McCain in particular for blindly supporting it. I think MoveOn was smart in picking someone who is not dressed up like she is about to go to the country club. She looks and acts natural. It is emotional. Getting your kid killed in a war is emotional. Remember that Cheney said it didn't matter what the American people thought about the war. Well, I think there are millions of mothers out their who would disagree with him.
1) I nominate Rachel Maddow for Meet the Press moderator.
2) Chuck Todd and the whole sick "morning joe" crew ought to be stuffed in a wine bottle and thrown out on the morning tide.
sc
Yeah, I just hate it when people just DANGLE babies (on their laps?) and try to underscore the senseless sacrifice of the thousands in the sands of Iraq.
Don't the Repubs care about babies? I mean, isn't EVERY life worth saving?
Tweedy will probably get Russert's corporate gig, I think Think Progress has it on today.
I do agree that it was a pretty crappy add, but the right has been using this teary-eyed crap for as long as they've been in power. No Todd shouldn't be the new host of MTP.
Chuck is still cool.
And the ad is pathetic.
There is nothing wrong with Chuck Todd's view or him expressing his view. He doesn't have to be an extreme liberal to be fair and honest. I am quite liberal myself, but I will be the first to tell tell you that MoveOn.Org is the heaviest burden on the Democratic Party and it is certainly a prime example of how partisan politics are ruining America. It takes people of all walks and opinions to make this country great.
The minute you start dismissing someone for stating their opinion, you have become part of that move to suppress the voices. I love Crooks and Liars, but I won't hesitate to delete this site from my bookmarks just like I did with MoveOn and the HuffingtonPost. It'll join the depths of Lou Dobbs and Bill Orly.
Chuck Todd is an analyst, not an activist. The fact that he doesn't run to extreme left makes me just as proud of him as it would if Republicans turned their back on the extreme right.
(Although I think a few of the extreme rights should stay there for this election season. A nice gives the D the extra push to get over the top that we could have used the past two elections.)
Comparing the two videos, it's obvious the Bush one is worse. Nauseatingly worse.
The problem is, they're both done in the same old style...
"Republican Style"
Over the top.
Using tired lines from the past.
Bullshit tearing at the heart strings.
It's a Democratic ad done in the Republican style.
Is it really necessary to stoop to their level?
This was Chuck Todd's Britney Spear moment, like when she shaved her head. Tomorrow Chuck will shave his ass for us on MSNBC.
These guys are vaudevillians like Ann Coulter.
Screw Chuck Todd. I think he is just another republican kiss ass. I hate to see him in Meet the Press. I have never heard him complain about republican adds which are far worst than this add. This add speaks the true and there is something the madia does not know what that is any more.
Oh no! We don't want to upset anybody! I mean, Vietraq has gotten so,so upsetting that the profitmedia has been forced to cut waaay, way down on it's coverage. Shame on move on for reminding Americans that there's awful war going on -and with a baby yet! What awful taste! snark! I guess that I'll double that donation to MoveOn; the ad is doing what it's supposed to do here on our C & L test audience. YOU BET it's offensive! Would somebody like to explain to me what benefit "taking the high road" has give moderates and the Left for the last couple decades? Where's Abby Hoffman when you need him?
Amitola Says @42
Madison Avenue types out, why? Supporting Obama is sexy and will get a guy laid is a great message to get that white male vote.
What do you expect from a bunch of clowns who thought the Swift Boat ads were fair because John Kerry let his army buddies come on stage with him?
If it were up to me, Carrot Top would be the new host of MTP.
What SHOULD be expected, no demanded, is that John McCain, the alleged maverick and straight-talker, get his facts and statements right the FIRST time he utters them. and not be allowed a clarification by some lapdog employee. he's presuming to be President and after the mushmouth Bush is, its not too much expect him to be clear on what he means the first time. he claims and some believe that he's up on the facts, esp when it comes to national security issues, yet when he cant even get Shia and Sunni differentiated, well then he isnt qualified. yes it is that simple.
Fine! Screw Chuck Todd! He's an idiot if he can't see through all the rethuglican bullshit! I'm amazed that any newsman or woman could be anything other than Democrats. With access to all that information, they just aren't paying attention! There's no excuse for that either!
Up Chuck's. He has learned from the master, Brian Lamb, who would rather dish the dirt with right-wing gossipmongers and quote the Washington Times as if it were legit than to allow anyone to criticise his modus operandi.
Chuck is an empty vessel. A corporate whore.
The ad is ok, not great. I wish Move On would spend their money more on getting the facts out on McCain's flip flopping than emotional appeals that will only be effective on people who already agree. They should have Glenn Greenwald produce and direct their commercials for them.
Maybe Chuck Todd is hoping to send his kid over to Iraq.
They need to chip away at McCain's PR constructed Corporate Media manipulated image as the straight talking moderate maverick non-Republican Republican. This won't do it.
I'll play devil's advocate here. Just because Chuck Todd doesn't agree with something MoveOn produced or with the lefty blogosphere doesn't mean he's instantly turned into Billo or Fatty Limbaugh. The guy is allowed to have an opinion now and then. As for Move On, I half wonder if they have been infiltrated by Neocon ringers, because every now and then they make a ballsy ad that says what a lot of us think, but says it in a provocative way that the GOP can use against the left -- such as the Betrayus/Patreus ad. This is another ad that will now become an "issue" and tie up the political discourse, and allow the wurlitzer of hate to demonize the left, instead of actually having nothing to talk about and actually defaulting to real issues until the next white girl goes missing.
To continue, I find a lot of MoveOn's advertising to be preaching to the lefty choir, looking for lefty "atta-boys!" from the base instead of convincing undecided people.
I agree with you. I don't see what was borderline shameless about the ad. If McCain wants "the U.S." to be in Iraq for 100 years, that means that the babies of today will be the ones getting blown up by roadside bombs in Iraq 18 or 20 years from now. If Todd wants to talk about "shameless," he should talk about McCain's flip-flops on big issues such as torture, sucking up to Jerry Falwell and the right wing "agents of intolerance," and permanent tax cuts for the rich in the middle of two wars. Todd really crawled back to the relative safety of the MSM on this one.
WHAT IS WRONG WITH WHAT WAS SAID ? SO NOW CHUCK TODD IS A TOADY,WILLY IS A TOADY.. THE AD WAS WEAK BEFORE WE GOT TO THE BABY
PICTURES.
I ALWAYS HAVE TO ASK "WHAT ARE YOU AFRAID OF "
I HEAR CONSERATIVE RADIO AND THE CALLERS ARE SO SCARED OF OBAMA..THAT
THEY ARE "AFRAID OF A BLACK MAN RUNNING THIS COUNTRY"
IS THAT WHO YOU ARE ? ARE YOU AFRAID OF WORDS, HARMLESS WORDS A POLITICAL PUNDIT?
FEAR BRINGS FAILURE.....I HAVE "NO FEAR"
Boy, I'll bet Mom would be pissed if little Alex grew up, VOLUNTARILLY ENLISTED, and joined the Special Forces. She'd go Sheehan!
And Chuck Todd is the least biased of the current msnbc talking pointers and still we get that comment. He could never be considered a replacement for Russert since he lacks the interview experience anyway. The only name on the roster is Gwen. Everyone else, even the sainted Keith, is far too biased in one way or another. Anyone notice tweety turning up the heat on Obama every day with his obvious man crush on McCain? Today he's pimping the "drill everywhere" line as a matter of "national security". Gregory is out to lunch & lies as blithely as as Cheney. He said that Obama wasn't "mentored" by Clinton which is patently false. Maddow, in spite of her obvious bias, is probably the 2nd strongest at msnbc. We could only hope that Moyers would do that job and elevate MTP to an honest forum.
I'm glad MoveOn is hitting early and I know they can hit hard. At least Obama has swifter boats in the water this season with MoveOn taking the heat.
Tell ya what. I have a kid. His name is also Alex. He's better at math than most of you ever wanted to be, he can fix your computer, and he's in top physical condition. He's also nineteen years old. And no, Senator McCain, you can't have him either. Not now, and not ever. I will personally put him on a plane out of the country if you try to grab him for your stupid bullshit war, so there.
As a parent of a 12 yo, this ad speaks directly to my heart. There are an enormous number of parent with whom this ad will resonate consciously, not on a subliminal level. My wife and I have had this conversation...
My 12 yo is the bane of my existence and my pride and joy.
Shame on Todd for wanting us to shut up.
I don't like the ad either. I think it will hurt Obama far more than it will help him.
Are you guys going to call me names, too?
Chill out, seriously. You are being the kinds of liberals that conservative pundits always make you out to be.
Next MTP host sweepstakes:
Possible: Tweety, Chuck Todd
Hopefully not, but NBC may do it: Noron O'Donnel, David "Dances with Roves" Gregory
Not gonna happen: The shrew Andrea Mitchell, K.O., Rachel Maddow
Interesting Long shots: Phil Donoghue, Bill Moyers, Scott McClellan (he has the Tim Russert form factor)
I'm going to dissent from y'all-- I like Chuck Todd quite a bit. I also like the ad. I don't know if it's effective or if it will turn off most audiences. I don't have a sense of that. But it seemed to me Todd was primarily commenting on whether or not the ad will have its intended effect (as well as making a value judgment).
A criticism of the ad is not = to a criticism of the policy in the ad.
B
There's nothing shameless about the ad, and it doesn't come close to the naked emotional manipulation of the Bush 9/11 campaign ad. These Corporate Media hacks a paid to demonstrate faux outrage over any anti McCain ad. That's their job, to manage public perception and create the illusion of consensus that John McCain is unassailable and anyone who criticizes his policy positions is being over the top or unfair. The fact is, John McCain did say he was willing to stay in Iraq for 100 years and then flip flopped and denied it. The Corporate Media's job is to characterize McCain's flip flopping as "clarification."
A better ad would have John McCain's quote about staying in Iraq for 100 years and then denying that's what he meant.
i JUST TOOK THE TIME TO GO BACK AND READ A LOT OF COMMENTS..AGAIN YOU PEOPLE MAKE MAY HEAD HURT!" CHUCK TODDS' AN ASSHOLE" ",HE WANTS HIS KID TO GO IRAQ".....HIT BACK AGAINST MC CANN..HIT BACK AGAINST THE LIMBAUGHS, THE HANNITYS...THE BILL KRISTOLS....DON'T WASTE YOUR ANGER ON
CHUCK TODD,MIKA OR SOMETHING CHRIS MATTHEWS SAID WEEKS AGO. KEEP YOUR EYE ON THE PRIZE.
SORRY I GOT A SAY IT.
CLOISIAN....YOU ARE A DOUCHEBAG....
These commenting bimbos think this ad is gonna' backfire.
they are wrong. They should get in touch with the
mothers and fathers of the brave sons and daughters
that came back from Iraq in coffins.
Awful Ad. What did they take the best entry from a class of 5th graders? If thats the best Move On can do, I'd prefer they stay on the sidelines.
CYCLEMAN3...YOU GOT IT RIGHT..DON'T BACK DONE
Larry,
You'd impress everyone more, if you discovered what a shift key is for.
And as someone who often comments here while drunk, I never sink to your level of incomprehensibility.(
Excessive alcohol use, the only thing I got from my experience in the Air Force.
anytime any MSM talking head steps out of line (LOOKS liberal), limbaugh and hannity and crew mention his or her name, like they do with GOP reps and blue dog dems, and a thousands of their lathering dittoheads call and write their offices on cue. it really works, and progressives who don't listen to talk radio believe these are real social movements at work instead of a single coordinated soapbox blathering uncontested repetition to 50 -70 Mil people. the most dominant political medium in the US is the talk radio monopoly, enabled since reagan killed the Fairness Doctrine 20 years ago.
Mediocre ad that preaches to the choir and pisses off people who don't want to hear the music.
I don't care about the ad. I'm voting a straight american ticket. Well, gay and/or straight. Which is to say Democratic, of course.
But the ad is not going to bring in any swing voters and might give some independents a push to the right.
About MPT: I didn't watch it when Tim Russert was hosting, I won't watch it when his replacement -- whoever it is -- takes over. I get my news from TDS, Colbert, Keith, C&L, Democraticunderground, Amy Goodman, and the rest of the good guys who constantly piss off the right wing by throwing truth in their faces.
It's a very effective and emotionally compelling ad, but it does not sit well with me. Of course it is fine to attack McCain for dismissing the urgency of our withdrawal from Iraq. It's fair to bring up the 100 years line constantly, and I hope that continues to be a strategy practiced by the non-profit anti-war anti-mccain messagers.
I can't tell if it's an actor or a real mom -- I would assume it's a real mom. Her pain and fear and outrage over this war and the current leadership read as deeply real. They mirror my own. I kind of wanted to cry when I watched her speak. And I still can't support this video being an advertisement in service of our cause.
The message of this ad, on some level, is MCCAIN WANTS TO KILL MY BABY, which is not fair. McCain does not have like a whole baby killing agenda, as opposed to your average Kissinger or Cheney. McCain might suck at ending this war. McCain doesn't understand how america feels about ending this war quickly. There's a moral urgency to ending the war quickly and starting to undo the damage. More iraqi children are going to die before this is over, more american teenagers are going to get shot and exploded, and so it needs to be over soon. These are all excellent arguments. HE WANTS TO TAKE MY BABY AND KILL HIM is the kind of fearmongerly bullshit that is closer to propaganda than debate, and I hate seeing it from MoveOn, an org I've given money to, an org whose politics could not be more closely aligned with my own.
It's more like what I expect out of every facet of the right wing's publicity machinery.
It's shameless, sending our troops to Iraq to be killed and maimed.
It's shameless bombing the hell out of a country and killing all those Iraqi people because of a LIE.
It's shameless wanting to bomb Iran because of the very same fucking LIE.
How is it shameless having a young mother speak truth? Chuck Todd you are nothing but a McBush shill. Shame on You!
I feel the same way about Dana Milbank. He usually makes sense on Keith Olbermann's "Countdown" program, but often in his columns sounds like a neocon.
The fearmongering bullshit has been working for the last 8 years, can't blame em for trying.
The Villagers will simply pick one of their own for MTP, if by some miracle a non-Villager ascends to the job that person will in all likelihood be infected by the disease that comes with the MSM circle jerk. Put Todd in the job, it'll be more fun to attack him than Timmeh.
wow. so many of you are so quick to throw Todd under the bus just because he had a negative opinion about ONE television ad. So that makes him a right winger? I think it is a crappy ad too. I am hardly a right winger. Yeah, I think the ad was is shameless and as the mother of 3 sons I can tell you right now they ain't gonna fight in any war for oil. But I hardly think that ones negative opinion over one sorry low-budget ad makes one a turncoat or something. deep breaths people, deep breaths.
The commercial sounds reminiscent of one between LBJ versus Goldwater, where a little girl is picking a daisy, and a atomic mushroom cloud appears.
No, she wasn't kindanasty rice.
No, they weren't saying it would happen in her girlhood.
But yes, they were saying it was a possibility in her lifetime.
And it's considered a classic of political commercials
And an episode of the Simpsons.
I think that it is a great ad. So Chuck and I have a difference of opinion on one ad. I still have a lot of respect for his numbers savy. Perfect fits never happen. We did not hear his comments on the 9-11 ad, which may have been more harsh. Let's not throw him under the bus, we'll agree to disagree on this one. Mostly I think he agrees with me though.
Everyone of those talking heads don't know what they are talking about. That ad showed exactly why we don't have the draft anymore: because we will not bare children so the politicians can use them in obscene wars for someone elses greed. The ad shows what a lot of Americans think. They persuade their children not to go into the service while this atrocity continues. The 4412 GI's that have died in Iraq did not die for our freedom--they died because of Bush greed and ambition.
I like to see within my core of being a hirsute Celtic warrior
Of mighty thews, and supple sinews
Dressed in a mail shirt
And leathern pants
And soft cordovan shoes that lace up to beneath my knees
With my round shield beside me
My polished helmet upon my knee
And a meditative look upon my face
Leaning on by grand broadsword
Awaiting the call for action.
But we live in the age of Kali Durga
Where the wise are foolish
Our lawmakers selfish
And our judges unjust.
Okay, I admit it, I'm drunk again.
106 Impeach cheney and bush
republicans like bare children
So they can use them
But not necessarily only for obscene war
They hate it when they fight back.
Please Todd keep your carrot mouth out of a mother's concern for her child. When you endure the labor pain of birth then you can speak. your role in the child arriving as a human being was the pleasure. SO SHUT THE HELL UP
And besides we saw it on a national outlet (conservative show too) which is the point. By critisizing it Chuck made it something more people will see (Isn't this what repukes do all the time?). Maybe I, don't disagree. Maybe it's time to swiftboat Bush's war.
Sometimes The Truth Can Hurt
The Move-on add did not strike me as dirty. There is a real possibility that the kid in the video could be in Iraq for John McCain's prediction of 100 years. The add of could added an element of time in it by showing that kids wife asking the same question.
The right-wing media does not want to admit they have a candidate who is on the wrong side of every issue the people are concerned about. A George Bush special candidate who can't remember half the things he says and seems to be fighting the war we lost in the 1970s from being on the wrong side of the truth. This is a hurting truth the Republicans and their media darlings can't stomach.
Where is this golden standard coming from? The right-wing media is not the barer of standards. MSNBC is the same group who made the comment about Hillary Clinton pimping her own daughter. They have a lot of nerve. The same group, who on national TV, had one of their premier commentators make the claim the only reason a certain women made any advances was because her husband messed around on her. You did not hear a god dam thing about standards for the given examples. You got a dry apology only when the public demanded it. As far as I am concerned, they can take their standard and start applying to their own.
Joseph
If the radical right can't take the heat for their words then maybe they ought to keep their mouths shut?
John McCain said we'd be in Iraq for 100 years. The ad shows a mother saying to John McCain sorry, you can't have my son. What the hell is wrong with that?
That ad looks like it will be very effective. American women seem to be better able to see the concrete side of war than American men. It's a lot easier to wage a war if you view deaths as another soldier kill in action rather than the tragic end of some mother's beloved child.
The Move On ad was truer than these meat puppets know.
Last year my sister in law moved to Canada with her three boys, all under 12, rather than risk losing them to the Republican war machine.
Chuck Todd is just another whore working for the Zionists.
Terrible @ 112:
It's interesting how whenever C&L posts an attack on any Republican, "concerned" posters show up here to say how awful it is and how this will just backfire. Notice how they never appear on any other threads. I'm not a big fan of the ad myself, as I've stated above, but it hardly merits the hyperbole of many of the posts on this thread. Nor do I think it's unfair, I fully believe this mother is concerned about the future her child would have if McCain is elected, and she's right to be so. The ridiculous comparison to holding a baby up as a human shield by Scarbourough is what's over the top and uncalled for. His comment was insulting and inhuman.
The fact remains, McCain said he would support occupying Iraq for 100 years. It's fair to point that out whether or not you're holding a baby. These talking heads are willfully lying when they claim he clarified his remark.
republicanSScareme @ 116:
Oh, and you're either an idiot or a troll.
John, McCains comment regarding a long stay in Iraq goes directly to the point that future soldiers (who are currently pooping into a diaper) will be in Iraq - in as little as 15 years NOT 100.
The baby was fair precisely because it will be todays little ankle biters that will be occupying Iraq in 15 years.
Well, break my heart about Chuck Todd. :-(......
I think he's just too upset right now..... maybe?
The ad is heavy..... but you know what, so is war. I think it drives an ugly point that our babies are at stake here. I think its effective.
Chuck Todd does not have one iota of human decency. When he stereotypes anyone voting against Obama as "Bubba's", that is very unkind.
And how in the hell does he get the statistics on old white women voting for Hillary. Does he ask them their age when they leave the voting booth?
A vote is private...even what a person tells a newscaster cannot be relied on. He would have had to be in the actual booth with the Old White Woman and "Bubba".
Chuck Todd is trying to be the most elite of elitist.
Calling people Bubba's and old white women is disrespectful and hurts feelings.
He sure did not learn much about how to treat people from Russert. That is probably the reason he will never succeed...he categories people too much...no one is as smart as him....it is difficult being the smartest person in the room...and not respected....
While y'all seem to have trouble with Chuck Todd, and Willie Geist, let me weigh in on Mika Brezinski.
Is there a bigger idiot on cable television than Mika?
Mika's contribution to the "conversation" is giggles, grunts and pointless expressions ("wow", "gee", guttural sounds, and the repetitive "interesting"). Do you consider asking everybody including the janitor on the set if they want to be Vice Prez journalism? (Even the dreadful Carly Fiorina told Mika to find a new question when she was asked the question for the 50th time.) The woman is an idiot, but I repeat myself.
I have no idea how she got the gig, but I have decided to include myself out by not watching.
FIRST let me say that McCain can't have my brand new grandson either.
What's shameless is the amount of money that these putzes make to spew this bullKrap on TV every morning.
What's shameless is the number of innocent civilians that have dies in Iraq in the name of "defending ourselves from TERROR." It's Bush and Cheney that have created the terror of the war in Iraq.
What's shameless is that this program is stocked with political hacks whose goal is to support the Status Quo.
Joe The Scar is a pompous airbag who bloviates and pontificates and can't move himself out of The Nineties.
Oh yea... I wanted to agree with Ginger Oaks (at 110:)
Maybe it's time to SWIFT-BOAT Bush's war.
A lot of people like Chuck Todd, but something about the guy creeps me out? It goes all the way back to his C-Span days. When I hear him talk the "Neocon Warning Bells" keep going off.
I don't think the ad was distasteful. I thought it was fantastically stupid. Some bleary-eyed woman bouncing a baby on her leg that she thinks might get drafted in 18 years? People are laughing.
yet another example of how out of touch Moveon is with the country.
The Republicans have surely done worse, but call that moveon ad what it is: propaganda. It's no more than a play on people's emotions. How is that any different than when the Republicans play on fear? What ever happened to making arguments?
Really? We hate Chuck Todd now? Chuck Todd? For not liking something? Wow, there's not going to be anyone left to hate pretty soon.
Amazing journalism. Analyzing a commercial. Good use of TV time. Guess there's nothing else important to talk about.
Oh please . . . spare me your phony expertise, Joe and Co. You all remind me of hyenas.
128,
Well Paul, did we ever like Chuck Todd??
I heard that he was great, by his colleagues,
I heard that he was fair, by his colleagues.
I heard that he is well liked by his colleagues.
I never did like him, I always felt that his likeability, or more properly, the perception of his likeability was one big fat NBC snowjob.
So, no, I never liked him, and I will never forgive his
self-serving spinanalysis which dragged the primary season way too long, way past the due-date, with BigMedia as chief beneficiary...And as far as Andrea? She is married to Greenspan. ?!? Does that qualify for a "nuff said?"
Me, if you ask me, it should be Karl Rove to head the new Meet the Press.
At least with Rove there are no illusions.
Karl Rove won't have to hide his Bush pins under his lapel, like Russert...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
WHAT ABOUT THE CHILDREN???
morning joe, abrams -- all thsoe fuckers should be on FOX-SAPN 2
"FOX-SPAN 2" damnit
Their commentary is completely brain-dead. What a bunch of re-PIG-lic imbecils.
What they're CLEARLY trying to do in this orchestrated dialogue, is dictate the public's response to the ad. "WE think" - waiting for the rest of the country to parrot their carefully staged talking-points.
"You need to think what we just told you to think. Say what we just told you to say. React the way we just told you to react."
But because the ad hits a real nerve, that IS NOT going to happen.
Nice try you puffed-up brainless media buffoons.
*
Paul @ 128:
Seriously. I happen to agree with Chuck on this one. The ad is poorly done and there are MUCH better ways to convey the message than that. MoveOn.org isn't going to attract anyone over with that kind of attack ad. They are preaching to the choir and alienating the center. If you really want to go against McCain, keep the emotional bull to a minimum and keep the ads about facts. Plain and simple.
And I'm seriously dismayed at this site lately. Chuck Todd's analysis of the numbers has proven accurate thus far in the primaries and he's a reliable source of information. He was giving an analysis of the ad and since it doesn't agree with the left's prospective, he's now the enemy? Give me a break. I don't know about everyone here, but I have both Liberal and Conservative views. I'm a true progressive in that sense of the word. I don't care what end of the political spectrum people are on, I care about integrity. I've ignored a majority of the radical users on this site because they really don't represent the site. Mr. Amato, I'm very disappointed with you for your, "I told you so" mentality.
Oh I'm going to puke after seeing that Bush blow chunks propoganda
This ad is right on many fronts. The right of a mother to care for and protect. The right of any citizen to protest or support or take a stand against what they believe. The emotional response of anyone seeing the future and doing something about it. The knee jerk Todd twit can return beneath his rock.
Man, you guys are jerks. He doesn't agree with you 100% and you go for the throat. You're worse then freepers. Since when is someone disagreeing with you about a freaking commercial instantly paint them a right wing loony? Your amazing powers of group-think are something mighty to behold.
With the exception of Scarboro, Willy Guice and Andrea Mitchell (not unlike Tweety, she seems to vary from topic to topic), the entire MSNBC cast and crew are often painfully friendly to the left. They are on your side, maybe they don't hold every single one of your beliefs, but enough that they are in your camp.
So what's difference between Chuck Todd and the Senate Democrats who voted for condemning the Move On's ad criticizing General Petraeus?
The measure was passed by 72-25 vote.
It would be pretty easy to check if he's ever called a right wing ad "shameless" or some such thing. Given the swifties you'd think he would have had many chances.
The whole thing smacks of, "I'm shocked, shocked to discover politicians engaging in politics".
it's interesting...republicans get all pissy and whiney if a child's mother is protective about it in an ad, however in real life people like malkin, limbaugh, and sen. mitch mcconnell had no problem ripping apart a 12 yr old brain damaged kid Graeme Frost and his family during the SCHIP fiasco.
screw 'em if they don't like the ad, it accurately portrays their candidate and them as the people they are: heartless warmongers.
Sorry... I want out of that war yesterday. I think that advertisement is a crass, lazy way to make an almost incoherent point. It's not going to change anyone's mind, that's for damn sure.
MoveOn really needs to stop shooting themselves in the foot like this. They need to play their ads for a wider audience and focus their efforts on the ones that are convincing to that wider audience.
Yes, isn't it amazing what Joe and other accept on McCain's behalf and what they do not?
Why doesn't Joe simply have Hannity on one day so the can agree. Then Rush the next day, Then O Rielly, then Rove, Cheney and Bush for balance.
Poster # 122 is soooooooo right..I've been away from this site for a few weeks
but HOW could this Mica chick get on TV ?? She is beyond awful...it actually
pains me to watch when she natters in the background..man if this is the
best MSNBC can do....they are in real trouble...
It's not Todd's fault, it's MoveOn's; the Petreus ad left simply no room to safely embrace MoveOn. one of the closest things in our little world to a king is a sitting general. if you're going to aim to kill the king, it's very bad to miss.
MoveOn needs to disband, sadly, and regroup under totally new branding. The tarnish will not wash off.
Are these MSM Bush toadies not the biggest assholes in the world? Granted, the world seems to have no shortage of biggest assholes, but certainly these condescending whores are among the most tubular of this planet's fecal orifices.
Wow. I'd forgotten that Progress for America ad. Our Prez has magical healing powers.
I am probably what most would call a radical liberal, and I have been a member of MoveOn for four+ years, and I have to say the ad, while it may be very effective, left me feeling a little cold. Remember that one Republican Convention when the Republicans each had their own baby? It reminded me of that. Baby dangling is irritating, annoying and cheap. And right now Democrats don't need to be irritating, annoying or cheap because we *have* the moral high ground and much of America agrees with us.
If it works, great, I guess, but I'd rather point out the many realities of John McCain's records, policies, neverending flip-flops and pandering than to put out the message: ZOMG JOHN MCCAIN WANTS TO KILL YOUR BABIES! So I'm with Chuck Todd on this one. It IS shameless.
We, and MoveOn, can do better with this. Apparently it tested well with focus groups, but that doesn't mean it's not shameless.
Comments are closed on this entry