Alan Colmes Whips Up on Karl Rove Over War Powers/Detainees/habeas corpus
By John Amato Thursday Jul 03, 2008 2:00pm
Alan Colmes took on Karl Rove over Gitmo and habeas corpus rights. Wow, Rover certainly had a problem with the wingnut court he helped create. They always play the fear card as far as they can go. WWI comes up as usual along with the Nazis. Rove starts screaming at Colmes. You see, they set up the Gitmo card like Republicans do with all regulations---so they could get around them. Here's the new White House scare line now:
The White House said Thursday that dangerous detainees at Guantanamo Bay could end up walking Main Street U.S.A. as a result of last month's Supreme Court ruling about detainees' legal rights. Federal appeals courts, however, have indicated they have no intention of letting that happen.
Download | play 
Download | play (very rough transcript. It's 1:28 am as I'm writing this.)
Colmes: This is a great decision that dates back to the Magna Carter and habeas corpus and refers back to....The constitution applies to persons not just citizens. That is in keeping with what the constitution says.
Rove: This is a ridiculous decision. This is not the criminal justice system, this is a WAR! With all due respect Alan.
When was war declared? Did Congress declare war?...It was not a declaration of war...
Colmes: If you want to go by the US constitution, don't they get to declare war?
Rove: If you feel that strongly, go get yourself an ACLU attorney. File a declaration in the court...
Colmes: If you're going by the Constitution...If you're a strict constructionist, habeas corpus is key..you have to go through the Constitution...
Heather says:
He took on Rove over the detainees at Gitmo and the President's war powers tonight and pretty well put a big can of the whoop ass on Rove...lol. He had Rove screaming at him before it was over and trying to talk over him. Colmes stood his ground against him.
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Very good, Alan.
Rove is also on my detainee list, along with John Yoo.
"Congress did not declare war"
Republicans lose again.
Rove actually said something correct right at the end. He said we should treat the Guantanamo detainees like any POW we have had in any other conflict.
That's all we are asking, Karl, you gas bag.
It's a sorry time when a Brit has to remind the White House of the wisdom of the Founding Fathers:
Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.
Benjamin Franklin.
I guess they don't want to solve the problem so it remains as a problem for Obama...
Karl Rove must be the most despicable human being in the administration. And Lord knows, there are plenty of despicable people to choose from. The failure to address the question of war vs use of force is the question that continually gets shoved under the media rug. Alan Colmes has appeared as the wimpy liberal for seven years - lately it seems he has been given the go ahead to go after questions he wouldn't have touched even six months ago.
BTW, I saw a news item yesterday wherein White House Spokesmodel Dana Peroxide worried at a press briefing that we might soon have ex-Gitmo detainees roaming our streets.
Terrah Terrah Terrah Boogah Boogah Boogah.
{Deleted, Off Topic. SiteMonitor}
Yeah ... it'll be difficult to hold 'people we capture on the battlefield'
in the 'War on Terror' because you chose to ignore Geneva Conventions, ya chubby putz ...
Heres a nugget they choose to ignore:
"Most combatants who do not qualify for protection under the Third Geneva Convention do so under the Fourth Geneva Convention (GCIV), which concerns civilians, until they have had a "fair and regular trial". If found guilty at a regular trial, they can be punished under the civilian laws of the detaining power. The last time that American and British unlawful combatants were executed after "a regularly constituted court" was Luanda Trial in Angola in June 1976. "
You know that the Repugnican movement is dead when Alan Colmes can take
Emperor Palpatine Dick CheneyKarl Rove down.-- Rob
That was weak - all Colmes did was poke & prod. He had Rove on the ropes and could have really torn into him, but he didn't. Colmes is weak.
And who was that preeny little Ken doll in the first half of the segment? Cheez, what a weenie!
When the truth is on your side it's hard to lose a debate. We all know facts have a well known liberal bias. H/T stephen colbert
{Deleted, Off Topic. SiteMonitor}
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/detainees/
watch this well done short video
you never hear much if anything about released detainees that were innocent......this supreme court ruling regarding
habeas corpus allows the prisoners to file for a hearing they're not guareenteed a hearing just the ability to file
this administration wants to solely be the one to judge their judgments
Wow, pretty amazing stuff.
Wonder if Fox told Alan he could go for the jugular because Fox wants some of Olbermann's audience back.
Great work, Alan. Put that worm in a box he could not climb out of.
POW's must be held in accordance with the Geneva Conventions, which was ratified by the US Senate in 1955.
http://www.unhchr.ch/html/menu3/b/91.htm
Great to see this on the Fourth of July. I don't know about anybody else, but when anti-habeas corpus authoritarians have the main stage of television, I feel very little reason to celebrate being American. This year, at least.
Karl Rove either has no idea just how easy it is to meet the burdens of production and proof pre-trial to say that the government may detain someone for trial, or he is an outright liar. I'll bet the farm that it's the latter.
Happy fucking Fourth, everyone.
War-pig and chicken-hawk Rove wouldn't know the constitution if it was jammed up his tush and lit on fire.
Perhaps he'll read it in his cell as he lives the rest of his pathetic life behind bars for war crimes.
Bitter Bud @ 11:
He was better than he often is, but yeah, the show is still Insanity & Coma.
Bitter Bud @ 11:
I have to agree. I'm almost always disappointed when John Amato puts up a video saying that so and so really tore into and humiliated some wingnut. It hardly ever proves to be the case to the extent that someone who was predisposed to the con agenda would be convinced otherwise of whatever bullshit the con was spewing.
Please great being above, let me see Karl Rove and his facist friends in a prison cell for an extended time, please. Its funny how the Supreme Court is good if it does what they like, but stinks when it does what they don't like. Alan's balls must have grown a short time ago for him to finally take on the great Rove dude.
Its fun to watch them try to cover their asses when theis illegal decisions are brought to justice.
I appreciate these short snips of these shows, I can't stand watching them on TV and actually refuse to view Faux News.
whoa... good on ya, alan...
john edwards should have an easy time of it:
Thugs of a crime family don't need no stinkin' constitution...if they did they would have to appear before congressional hearings under oath. The Bush Crime Family has thrown the constitution aside to accomplish their fascist takeover of the USA for the profits of the military industrial complex and oil companies. This is so obvious it jumps out at us. The MSM still doesn't have a clue.
Everytime I force myself to watch Karl Rove, my mind wanders to this image...
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3087/2297145520_a72a8d1a65.jpg
katy @ 22:
If Rove cant make it they can just roll a big tub of stinking used kitchen lard onto the stage and make squishing noises every once in a while.
I wonder if Karl yet grasps that he's going to jail.
The shrubniks always want it both ways. Shitbloom gives it away when he states in the video that the reason they put the evil doers off shore was to avoid this whole habeas issue in the first place. Because...they ...knew...it ...was...ILLEGAL... to detain non-war prisoners without due process. He then dismisses the whole habeas concept as not applying to these enemy combatants because by jove, "This is a war," and immediately backtracks when Alan calls him on it.
Pure unadulterated Bullshit!
.
And yet ROVER refuses to fetch subpoenas.
.
"Shitbloom gives it away when he states in the video that the reason they put the evil doers off shore was to avoid this whole habeas issue in the first place. Because…they …knew…it …was…ILLEGAL…"
B I N G O.
Right there.
Prison for life.
I resent this human waste using World War II in one of his arguments, putting the Iraq Oil Occupation on the same level. How opportunistic; how cowardly.
Similarly, he got in his back-handed jabs about the "West Coast" and the ACLU, in that sneering tone that neo-con pigs have mastered.
I want him to be tried for the treason he likely committed against the United States. And I want him to be tried for using political force to unfairly put a man in prison on bogus charges.
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/detainees/
I found Rove's comments about the WWII German prisoners interesting. I live in a city that had a military hospital that included a small contingent of German prisoners. This is what local historian and former judge Harry Buckeley recently wrote in a newspaper article.
"There was even a contingent of German prisoners of war who worked there. Look at the large old trees scattered around the campus - they were planted by the prisoners. Longtime residents will tell you that the Germans were free enough to come downtown in the afternoon for a Coke at Cliff Bower's drug store. They didn't need a guard. They were thousands of miles from home and had no desire to go back anyway. Life in Galesburg was better for them than for many of the wounded."
http://www.galesburg.com/the_paper/x165091049/Remembering-Hawthorne-Center
Hell's bells.
(1) Rove keeps chanting "enemy combatants."
(2) A major point at issue is, are they enemy combatants? That's not a given.
(3) Why use extreme techniques designed to produce false confessions? Easy: to get them to admit they're enemy combatants.
(4) You need to torture the detainees simply in order to get confessions which justify having detained them in the first place.
To be honest, I am glad that Colmes, FINALLY grew a set. All to often he sits there like a wuss while Hannity and his right wing guest walk all over him.
As a practical matter, where are prisoners going to go if/when they are released? Now that they are exclusively in American custody, it's my understanding that it's harder to get rid of them... i.e. other countries don't want to take the prisoners back even if they are their citizens.
Serious question; why did the US set up Guantanamo instead of keeping these prisoners at a facility in Afghanistan? If they had stayed in Afghanistan would the US have been able to release innocent and/or low priority prisoners without worrying about their status in that country?
the problem with many of these detainees is that they were not captured on the battlefield. many of these POW's(?) were arrested not captured. people where paid money for information on SUSPECTED terrorists and the U.S. promptly when in an arrested them, and has been holding them for years, no proof or evidence. Hey, if they are guilty, put them on trial and then do whatever to them (well maybe not whatever but you i mean). this administration has put the U.S. in bad standing with many countries over our two faced stance on POWs, it is more than the Geneva convention its our Constitution their shitting on. I never thought we would be talking about war crimes of our own administration.
Vman @ 20:
I don't blame Mssr. Amato at all - I like it when he posts video like this. But I just think Alan could have gone after him more - I'm just an armchair quarterback I guess...
Bush is the weakest president ever. We've held possibly innocent "detainees" and "suspects" longer than the duration of any real war in our history, and there is still no end in sight in Iraq or Afghanistan.
DiggyG @ 35:
http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=59947§ionid=351020403
I want to see the fucker shout down foreign judges in the Hague.
One question keeps popping up in my mind over this topic of habeas corpus.
How do they know their guilty, if they haven't had a trial?
I know that sounds simple or naive. But it's a basic question, that they've never answered.
mudshark @ 41:
AmIdreaming @33
said to be identified as enemy combatants at the place of battle....therefore guilty
I imagine any American city would be safer with any of the gitmo detainees walking their streets then with rove, bush, or cheney walking their streets.
When did Alan Colmes grow a pair?
or, plausibly presuming he always had them, when and why did Faux/Hannity decide to let him have them back?
seevee @ 42:
right. ok. Torture them to admit to something they may or may not be. I see the point. That's why they never actually declared war. If they did, they'd have to follow the Geneva Convention. But they didn't actually declare war. Colmes should have finished him off. He was right there. He had to have known he had Rove.
Karl Rove is Satan's spawn.
mudshark @ 41:
Back in the nam, there was a saying: If they're dead, they were Charlie...the ultimate self-confirming prophesy...same/ssame here: if they're in custody, they're guilty.
Rove: "Alan... Alan... Alan... (Please don't cite law to me, you know I don't have a leg to stand on)"
rove is an arrogant, anti-american tool of the corporate class . . . his kind will be the death of this democracy . . . assuming, of course, that there is any life left in this corpse
mudshark @ 41:
Hi, Edwin Meese here. If You're Not Guilty, You're Not A Suspect, By Definition. That Would Be Contradictory.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/06/16/AR200806...
short and somewhat interesting opinion regarding habeas corpus
this administraton wants to be the judge of it's own
judgements.....no checks and balances
Thomas Stone @ 24:
i thought for sure you were talking about this image
It's interesting Rove brings up WWII prisoners. What was his grandfather doing to WWII prisoners? See I think the problem here is when Rove talks about WWII prisoners he's speaking from his grandfathers perspective that they don't have rights and make dandy slave labor to help out that Prescott Bush guy.
Obviously Rove has read about the judge's reference to 'The Hunting of the Snark" and stated several things at least 3 times so we would know that what he said was true!
republican tactic number 23
when losing mention ACLU lawyer.
it's a knee jerk reaction code word the rank in file use to turn off their brain.
i wouldn't be surprised if they have done clinical tests.
woody, tokin librul @ 45:
Hannity and the producers are on vacation for the holiday, thus Dukakis' beat down of Steele yesterday and Colmes' hint of a backbone today - there's no one to rig the show right now.
Monday it will be business as usual.
I think rove is a terrorist. Send him to GITMO and let him stay there (without rights) until someone decides to get to his case.
innocent bystander @ 50:
Unfortunately he is VERY representative of the public face of the US to the world and the same kind of attitude that americans abroad have, unrelenting arrogance wrapped in ignorance.
Alan is like Chris Matthews, they realize now they have been paid shills and trying to sound like CIA plants O'Rielly, Scarborough Coultier etc..
A Shill can be dangerous when you only recently bent him over a table to make him complicit in the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people.
They tend to get Uppity.
Alan grew a pair? Yet another sign of the impending Apocalypse!!! Watch for horses !!
why isnt that fat fuck in jail?
Old Billy Hussein @ 16:
Thanks for commenting on this Old Billy Hussein, after all the issue here is much more important than the characters involved. This isn't some comic book plot. This is our future and OUR legacy.
By definition a lawful enemy combatant is a member of the armed forces of a state in conflict with another state or someone engaged in organized armed resistance against an occupying force. If captured during military operations such persons are to be considered prisoners of war under the Geneva Conventions. Anyone else (unlawful enemy combatant) including spies, mercenaries and terrorists, may be executed. If taken into custody they are to be considered criminals, tried according to the laws of the detaining power but treated humanely and in accordance with the provisions of article 3 of the Geneva Conventions. No where is being tortured or being held incommunicado indefinitely a legal act. Fact is, Karl Rove is a war criminal working for Fox News. Imagine that.
.
Rover makes a disingenuous argument bent on spurring fear amongst the populace.
See, even when we bring them to US courts on US soil and IF they are found not guilty, none of these people will be free to roam the streets in the USA.
The truth is that any foreigner found not guilty in a US court who does not have legal status, automatically gets sent back to their country of origin.
But he never states this fact because in doing so, he lessens the effect his FEAR mongering in intended to coerce... a citizenry void of the truth...
... Because we all know a citizenry well informed is a dangerous thing!
.
So when did Colmes grow a pair? He's typically plays the whipping boy on Fox.
I would love for Rove to declare the prisoners held at Gitmo as POWs. That opens a nasty Pandora's box of trouble with the Geneva Conventions and war crimes prosecution for this corrupt administration.
Darsan54 @ 61:
The horse's asses are already here.
sulphurdunn @ 64:
Q U E S T I O N:
If my neighbor sold me to US mercs who handed me over into the custody of the US military, am I still considered an enemy combatant...
... Or just a trafficked human?
.
it just puts into light exactly how fascist this administration is. They don't care about habeus. They don't see any principle in caring about it, they see it as something to find a way around.
:\
happy 4th of july.
The U.S is not at war, congress which represents the people decide when to go to war, only the crooked Bush administration and it's corporate backing are at war...and if they are at war, and not the country...then that means they can do whatever they like. Unfortunately, we the people will pay the debt that incurs as a result of their wars...through money and the loss of life. It's sick and twisted, but thats how the neo-cons role.
And what did the oil companies have to pay to secure their business interests in Iraq??? If you ask me, they should use their profits to pay back this war.
Cause, what exactly did Americans get out of this war besides debt and death??? There was no threat to this country! Only the oil companies won in the end of all this.
rove, cheney and addington
THE SLIME OF THE DUNG PIT
whatever happened to the grand american tradition of political assassination ??
sulphurdunn @ 64:
As Ali-G would say, Buyakasha!!!
Alan Colmes, was missing a single fundamental argument in his almost confrontation with Rove.
Q: If the congress authorization was in fact a declaration of war, then why aren't the people captured in the battle field POWs?
A: Oh, but Al Queda is not a legitimate army recognized by the US. So they are not POWs.
Conclusion: In that case they are not POWs and are subject to US criminal law just like spies, merceneries, and hell... Pirates ( A.K.A Terrorists of the sea)!!!
BobbyG @ 51:
That's right, it's the same scientific procedure they used in witches back in the day:
First you torture the guy.
If he confesses, then he's guilty.
If he doesn't, you keep torturing until he dies.
When he dies you know he's inocent.
sulphurdunn @ 64:
Maybe Faux Snooze is going after KKKarl because they can sense the upcomming republican conflaguration this November - and they are trying to cover their ass? "Let Alan go after Rove, and maybe when can buy ourselves some goodwill from the future of American politics!" I could see Rupert "bailing" on the repukes like that. The old SOB would do anything for his financial empire.
Thomas Stone @ 24:
I have never seen that picture before, but the image has formed in my mind on several occasions. It is such a perfect fit. Yes, Rove would have fit in nicely with the German Nazi Party. Now, he fits in nicely with the Bushco Nazi Party.
If you are expecting AC to do something that is 'out there', it is not going to happen. A few years ago, I listened to a radio interview with him, on the Bob Rivers Show. He told the story of how he got on FOX. At first, Ailes did not like the idea of having a "Both Sides Now" type of show. He did not want to have any left-wing dialog on his show, except guests, who could have their mikes turned off, if they started making contrary points. Eventually he gave in, but he wanted a liberal nut case, who could embarrass the liberal message. Although he was the man in charge, he did listen to his producers. They thought it would be too transparent if they did that. They recommended someone who would be well-mannered, and play within the narrow parameters being allowed. Alan seemed like a very good choice and was hired. Alan explained, he does not have (at that time) the freedom to speak candidly, or step outside his boundaries. He was not allowed to challenge Hannity, no matter how bad his points, or how grievous his facts, were (as we have seen first-hand). It appears to me that he is allowed a little more freedom, but also notice, he only speaks out when there are (at least) 2:1 right-wingers against him.
gitrdone @ 70:
American's got $5 a gallon gas from our leaders who run the Bush family crime syndicate. And 9 trillion dollars in debt for the honor to pay $5 a gallon. Sounds like a win-win for the Bush cartel. And as we all know, if things are going well for the Bushies and their cronies, then things must be going well for everyone; even if they're not.
I've seen countless attacks about Alan being a bit namby in his counter arguments, but the truth is he always conducts himself with class and intelligence, and quietly puts the Right in their place - when he is allowed to, that is. FoxNews usually manages to lower his mic's volume and allow the rudeness to steamroll over his words. I think it is a disgrace what guys like Rove are allowed to get away with - the fact that he has a voice ANYwhere that is seriously considered as valid, is just breathtakingly wrong.
I hope Karl has a good physician. I want him to live a long life in a small cell.
Max Hussain (65)
Thank you!!! I thought l was the only one who registered the fallacy of this particular talking point. The idea that a person who has been illegally held at Gitmo then released with no charge would just be released into the community is one of the dumbest things l have ever heard as a justification for illegal detention.
For a start, why the hell would they want to stay? What, they finally get a view, and a chance to walk around? They think, "Hey it's nice here, l think i'll hang around"?, You really think that they wouldn't be put on a plane out of there as fast a possible? Really?
The second one hasn't been mentioned, mainly due to the fact that people have been stunned into insensibility by the stupidity of the first statement, and that is the talking point that 37 (a number obviously pulled out of someones arse) released Gitmo detainees returned to commit terrorist acts against the US on US soil.
What Are you trying to tell me that the US Intelligence Service is really that shit? That you haven't flagged these guys and can't find a reason to keep them out of the US? As we say in the UK, "The mind boggles!!!!"
The quotation "All men are created equal" is arguably the best-known phrase in any of America's political documents, as the idea it expresses is generally considered the foundation of American democracy. Thomas Jefferson first used the phrase in the Declaration of Independence as a rebuttal to the going political theory of the day: the Divine Right of Kings.
Ok, great. So wtf is the question here? It would seem to me that even the President himself cannot alienate a man from his right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Ergo, a fair trial must by definition be the only acceptable option. ANYone espousing the contrary should be considered tyrannical and removed from (whatever)office post-haste, since their presence in the leadership is in direct conflict with the goal of Democracy.
Interesting. Did Karl Rove just admit that the US tried to skirt US law by keeping the detainees off of American soil?
And people wonder where the claims of an unconstitutional war, illegal activity, etc come from...
I understand the same thing happens to people found not guilty at trial. We call that the Justice System. It keeps innocent people out of jail. I am all for it. Being against this idea is Un American, in fact it is inhuman and barbaric. We actually are celebrating denouncing the concept of locking people up without just cause today.
Celebrating it, just not practicing it.
So if Karl is correct and Congress declared war then people in Gitmo are POWs and we must abide by the Geneva Convention. No only can Bush be brought up on war crimes charges for torture but once war is declared over (as when Bush declared the military operations are over) the POWs have to be set free.
Either way Rove is in the wrong.
Doug @ 83:
Nice catch-22 Karl wrapped himself up in! Lol.
Nice, but Alan's still a straw-man liberal. He's part of the Faux News conspiracy, he just plays a role like the actor he is.
Phillybits @ 81:
See my post at 27
seevee @ 86:
Lol. Like I said in 84 - with Doug providing one half of the equation and you providing the other, it would seem to me that Karl just put himself in a catch-22.
Personally, I think he just let the cat out of the bag. Sounds like something Conyers should ask him about.
When he dies you know he’s innocent.
by not floating??? Yep, that's right...
It was nice to see Rove froth at the mouth even if Alan didn’t finish him off, probably because Alan has to see him at work. God that would be hard for me, I’d want to punch the bastard every day, repeatedly. Fricken amazing, Rove has so little faith in our justice system (even with Mr. I can’t recall at the justices helm) he literally enjoys the idea of denying another human being basic rights and allowing due process to work.
Rove is not about justice, he is about revenge even if it means mistakes are made leading to terrible gross injustice, just so long as they mostly get it right. Rove revealed what Bush administrations sense of ethics is. Net fishing for terrorists, you know it will capture, injure, and probably kill a bunch of innocents in the net but as long as you get what your after who cares. What worthless piece of shit.
He who yells first... loses.
I get the feeling KKKArl doesn't spend any time around those who don't agree with him.
This video shows the reason why we need to oppose the neocons, because of their hate for civil liberties and freedom. What is wrong with there being fair trials in a timely manner? What is wrong with a defendant, and their defense attorney being able to see all of the evidence against them? What happened to innocent until proven guilty? Why is it that the Bush administration and neocons are so afraid of the American justice system finding the detainees either innocent or guilty? The primary reason is because they are afraid of the truth.
Not all of the detainees locked up in Guantanamo Bay are terrorists. Some of them are innocent people who were in the wrong place at the wrong time. While others were captured, and turned over to the US government for a bounty even though they had never fought US forces, or conspired to attack America.
Detainees in both US custody, and in the custody of foreign nations at the request of the US government have been tortured. The Bush administration and it's neocon supporters have made America look more like a dictatorship that follows no laws, than a example of freedom and liberty. Note especially in the video Rove's disdain for the ACLU, and for the American justice system. His views are the same held by both the fascists and neocons within America. Bush, Cheney, and others who think like them say that people who hate America, hate us for our freedom. The truth is Addington, Bush, Cheney, Rove, Yoo and others who think like them are the ones who hate freedom (and civil liberties) here in America.
Bitter Bud @ 37:
I am immensely grateful that John has this site and posts videos like this. I read this more than any other blog. I'm just saying that he often overstates the effect that those who oppose the nutjobs have on the viewers. I sincerely wish that their performances would always match his hyperbole. (Sometimes they do.)
I also agree with GoodScout, #85. AC is just the token that faux news viewers can point to as the "Balanced" part of "Fair and Balanced."
Wow. Alan shut down Rove. Rove didn't admit such, but he did indeed.
"WWI comes up as usual along with the Nazi"
wrong war.
I only wish Colmes has called Bitch-Tits on his lie about 30 detainees being released and returning to the battlefield, which Seton Hall proved was lie.
But then, how much can we expect from a Faux News "liberal".
KKKarl isn't really that clever. I could take him on. He was good behind the scenes giving strategy tips to get the voters brainwashed. That's all.
Most of em are just goat herders, taxi drivers and al jazeera camera men anyway, let em out.
Edwin Hussein @ 96:
Agreed, he's good when no one can see him.
We should stop calling it "war". It's a US police action, an occupation of a foreign country, but it's not war. There is fighting going on, but it's not war. Just like the US is not at war with Columbia, but there's lots of fighting going on.
mudshark @ 98:
Maybe it's good he's on Fux news. His arguments are very hollow. Easy to see that, too.
It's like the war on drugs. It's not really a war, they just call it war. There's a war on obesity too. Everything is called "war" in the USA. Let's see, if we made a list of all the things that the administraion is "at war" against...
God I love it when they begin to eat their own!!
Alan still doesn't impress me. I think he sucks as a pundit. I wish Rove would've been put up against Cenk Uyger.
Ukobserver @ 79:
These critters, like ROVER, are self proffessed NIMBY experts.
They love to use their NIMBY skills at every opportunity.
Why the hell do they ask rove anything. The guy is a stooge.
Didnt the military operation in Panama lead to a trial?
This weasel (apology to weasels) should be behind bars. My wish is that this traitor is giving his opinion on Flops News one evening and the police come and yank his ass out of that chair and take him to jail. One thing the Bush administration has proved is that crime does pay.
Sometimes Colmes, or "Token", takes his balls out and wacks a few Faux news pundits on the face. But most of the time they light him up like a wickerman.
Calmes did OK, but even when he is 100% correct, even when he wins the argument, he comes off so weak that it doesn't really have much of an impact the average moronic faux news viewer.
So NOW Colmes wants to support the Constitution. Did Hannity finally give Colmes permission to take his balls of the case they've been kept in or something? I think it's a bit late after eight years of sitting there next to Sean Hannity whimpering like a whipped puppy every time someone calls Liberals traitors for him to suddenly decide to join in on the fight.
Remember, we're dealing with people for whom the Constitution is "Not a suicide pact". In other words, it can be placed into some kind of hibernation state whenever it becomes too inconvenient.
Mr. Rove -- as much as I believe you and your's to be responsible for the killing of literally hundreds of thousands of people, I would still give you a lawyer and a right to Habeas.
does anyone see that carl rove has been placed into the media to add to the distraction that the bush admin is do deep into crime? we need to get the people mobilized to resist this type of problem.
When that asshole Rove says: "with all due respect"
I wanna barf!
Battlefield? How many of these detainees were taken from their homes, at their job, at an airport?
Rove needs a prison cell!
rob @ 113:
He is also playing the CYA game, he is spewing the same old lies about crimes he has direct involvement but still refuses to go under oath.
The best way to shut up Rove? Put him under oath!
Very funny seeing Rove totally nonplussed trying to explain that authority to use force was really a declaration of war. I may be wrong, but I think the US Congress can only declare war against another state. It's not possible to declare "war on terror" ... or even "war on terrorism" ... either of which would be a declaration of war against an idea or a method of waging political or military aggression. Rove and his Republican allies are all liars and scum and they should all go to jail for war crimes.
I can't believe the shit coming out of this assclown's mouth. How does he call himself an American? He and Hannity's replacement talking about sticking prisoners offshore because we certainly wouldn't allow for the inconvenience of due process, a court trial, a real judge and careful reflection of their crimes, I mean, my God!, everyone knows that American only deals with lite crimes such as burglary, I mean, Holy Cow!, no white person in American EVER commits acts of terrorism (Timothy Mcveigh, cough, cough, illegal Iraq invasion, haaack), and allowing murderers to be tried through a "fair" system like the US court system (US: murder capital of the world, cough, cough, wheeeze), they would certainly be let go (US: highest incarceration rate, capital pushinment, hummMMMM! (clears throat). So let us never give those animals the chance to be tried in a fair court system like good ol' white...I mean...Americans are. And let's all love the Constitution together.
God Bless me...I mean...America!
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Congresses' authorization to use military force should be null and void.
Bush LIED and breached practically every major condition in that authorization.
This is an illegal war, by every definition.
Jeezus, why can't democrats get that through their heads!!
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This porcine rat fucker is so stupid it's staggering. Apparently, he sees no difference between a declaration of war by the Congress as per the constitution (the last time was the 1941 after Hitler declared war on the US) and a directive from the same Congress to use whatever force required to hunt down the 9/11 terrorists (whoever they were!). A moderately bright 9th grader should be able to help him out. If there is no declared state of war between the US and another sovereign nation, then the only concusion that one can logically come to is that the US invaded that country. If true, then let the war crimes trial begin and put that perverted, self-inflated, sycophantic, self-loathing little turd on the stand first.
I would love to see Rove take it up the cheeks in a Fed Pen.
gitrdone @ 70:
Exactly. I don't remember Congress declaring war on anyone. We went after terrorists which is a criminal matter. Then we illegally occupied a foreign country and brutalized it's people for the last 5 years.
That's not war Mr. Rove.
Joe @ 120:
LOL. I'd pay to see some of the folks you see on MSNBC's Lockdown make that traitor their bitch.
Hmmmm, dis-enfranchised, poverty-stricken, violent, angry people, who hate the government, locked up with porky the turdblossom.
I know what they would be thinking: MEAT.
Epinnoia @ 112:
Screw that. Justice would be to hand him and his neocon buddies over to the Iraqis once we're out.
Let Shiites taunt them like they did Saddam right before they hang them for ruining their country.
I keep asking one question? Why is Karl Rove not wearing a ORANGE jump suit. Answer he is protected by the CORPORATE CONTROLED MEDIA. If the DEMS., ever get the GUTS to have ROVE brought in in legg irons you will hear such a HOWL from the CORPORATE CONTROLED MEDIA that you will not believe. ROVE and LIMAUGH are the same both are CHICKENHAWKS they love war as long that they do none of THE BLEEDING DYING. LOOK at how LINBAUGH was rewarded for not serving his country in the Viet-Nam era because his PIMPLE ON A--. ($400 hundred million contract) how many GI are maimed for life because of ROVE and LIMBAUH support by the CORPORATE CONTROLED MEDIA.These two Questioned John Kerrys sevice to his country and the CORPORATE CONTROLED MEDIA loved it and went along with there lies, but no one in CORPORATE CONTROLED MEDIA has ever said a word about ROVES or LINBAUGH Ducking out when called upon to serve this CONTRY.
SJD @ 1:
Now the people of America should show the rest of us that they are truly free and , impeach those criminals for getting them into an illegal and disastarous war that they cannot win.
Edwin Hussein @ 99:
Edwin - you are correct it isn't a war. It's just a larger scale Panama. We supported Noriega just as we did Saddam. But when they both felt they didn't need the US telling what do to anymore - our administrations decided they weren't fit to run their countries any longer. Called them criminals and invaded their countries. There was a trial for Saddam - remember he was hanged.
And there should be more trials - Bush, Chaney, Rove, Rumsfeld and the others of this horrible administration who has committed all of these crimes - war and civil.
The one hole in Rove's argument that we are at war, is then that all who were captured are POW's, regardless of the fact that Bushco coined the term "illegal" enemy combatant as a deliberate subtrefuge intended to deny POWs status as POWs. As POWs they have a number of rights, and under the rules and laws governing warfare and treatment of POW's, what the Bush regime is doing to these people are war crimes. You cannot subject POW's to trial of any kind. They must have access to Red Cross or the equivalent. They cannot be held incommunicado. They can not be subjected to torture.
If they are criminals, as the Bush regime claims, then they are subject to the full protections and due process as granted by the Constitutionm, including right to counsel, habeus corpus, the right not to self-incriminate and so-on. The terrorism issue is a law enforcement issue. What must be remembered is that wherever terrorists have been subjected to our criminal justice system, enjoying all rights of the accussed, the government made the cases, those cases were vetted by juries, and the terrorists were convicted and sentenced, from McVeigh(sp?) to the guys who did the '93 WTC bombing.
Rove and his fellow war criminals in the Bush regime can spew all the nonsense they like or interrupt or smear other voices and attempt not to let others get a word in edgewise. Their intent was always to evade or nullify the authority of our own and international laws and to innoculate themselves from the consequences of what they knew to be war crimes and crimes against humanity. I have always suspected that an additional intent was to establish precedents against a group of people whom it was easy to hate, whose welfare and well-being was an easy thing to treat callously; to the degree that they got away with it, it would later be easier to argue that it was legitimate to apply those same precedent establishing practices against others. For example: you and I.
They (they being everybody from Bush down to the prison guard or CIA agent inflcting torture, including doctors and psychologists who helped make it possible) all need to be brought to tribunal and be subjected to justice by competent global authority.
i love seeing the turd blossom get bitched slapped...
Magna Carter, huh? "Magna carta cum statutis angliae", but most intelligentsia will settle for Magna Carta....
Shorter Turdblossom: "We didn't get out way. Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!"
That crowd, for all their macho bluster, are nothing but a pack of Whiney Ass Titty Babies!
Oops - OUR way, not out way.
Conyers has said TIME FOR KKKKK arl to go !
Wish he'd get out his kit of whoopass, and alligator wrestle Karl in an arena.
As for US, there WILL be a war crimes tribunal. Book your tickets now!!
http://velvelonnationalaffairs.blogspot.com/2008/06/prosecuting-for-war-...
They're taking calls on an answering machine. See if you can get a busload to go from your city !!
You can email me too - I'm taking email addys! I have the best counter-culture/anti torture, anti du progandists already lined up to help us!!
THERE WILL BE WAR CRIMES proceedings.
[Deleted. Please don't link e-mail addresses in the comments section. Thank you. Site Monitor]
We need to see a lot more of this with Rove. This liar's been running his mouth off unchallenged too long on Fox. See want happens when he is challenged? He starts whining like a baby not getting his way. They keep comparing Iraq to WWII and their is NO comparison. Iraq is a war of choice,WWI wasn't. They need to Rove on more panels with opposing views to expose this lying SOB.
Pricks; and what if they are NOT guilty? Ever wondered about that little gem?
pwned by colmes? colmes defends the war declaration powers? Rove should be in prison, maximum security, toss my salad prison. Not on television!
Karl Rove is a liar and a criminal!
Don't believe ANYTHING he says.
Betcha' dollars to donuts less than 5% of those held
are enemy combatants.
I wish KKKarl would finally have his big Happy Meal arse frog-marched to prison. He deserves to stand trial for treason, at the very least.
In addition, I'm always fascinated by the Reich Wing's constant bashing of the ACLU. They parrot how much they love freedom and liberty, but if anyone tries to stand up for their civil liberties via the American Civil Liberties Union, then they must be communists or something. It's one of the most hilarious examples of Reich Wing hypocrisies. "Oh, yeah, you got liberty, buddy... you're free to think whatever you want, as long as it falls in line with whatever we say."
Don't forget, the Reich Wing has some people convinced that it's acceptable to give up some of your liberty in order to preserve your freedom...psst, liberty and freedom are the same f-ing thing! Quite Orwellian "double-think" indeed.
P.S. KKKarl might need to be reminded that the ACLU defended fellow Fox News knee-padder Oliver North concerning his role in Reagan's Iran-Contra scandal. But, of course, KKKarl thinks that was wrong for them to do too, right?
"During the 2004 trial regarding allegations of Rush Limbaugh's drug abuse, the ACLU argued that his privacy should not have been compromised by allowing law enforcement examination of his medical records."
The ACLU defended Rush Limbaugh? Gee, I wonder what KKKarl has to say about that...
good grief, wonders will never cease,
Actually Alan Colmes does a great job each and every day pointing out the BS coming from the dark side.
Side point: Up until last week my hospital, UIC in Chicago, had CNN News on the monitors in the lobby. Now they have Fox News. My tax money at work. Must be the new hospital boss is a rebub.
Mike Schmitt @ 143:
Fox News at the hospital? That's going to create an endless loop of patients with stomach ailments. ;-)
THAT'S whipping up on Rove???? What a pitifull "debate"!
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