September 14, 2008 02:00 PM
Obama Releases New Ad Hitting Hard On McCain's Lobbyist Ties
Barack Obama asks Americans to envision a McCain White House with all its lobbyists ties and how it will play to special interests. George Lakoff wonders if enough Americans even know what a lobbyist is.
[An earlier Obama ad] correctly observes that McCain's campaign is loaded with "lobbyists." But most of the people the ad is trying to reach don't know just what a "lobbyist" is. McCain is saying he is fighting against the Washington power structure. A lobbyist is a "member of the Washington power structure." If you use such a phrase, you can point out that McCain campaign itself is part of the Washington power structure, the old-boy network.
Beautiful!
George Lakoff was one of my professors. I learned so much from his class.
McCain represents change. Change for the worst.
Well.. let's assume they don't know what a 'lobbyist' is.
You'd still get the impression: "Someone being paid to do ... something ... for oil and credit card companies"
Which isn't that far off the mark :)
Great response to McCain's ridiculous claim that only he and Palin can bring about the needed change in DC. This one hits him right between the eyes.
And so it begins.
Weaseldog @ 3:
He represents Chump Change.
phantom @ 2:
I envy you - his books on linguistics are brilliant.
Why is it that Democrats have such a hard time explaining their position and what is wrong with the other guy?
The only thing I can think of is that the Rebpublicans have mastered the art of talking to the fools. Things that you would think everyone knows, simple facts that are out there for everyone to see. But the Republican's art of misdirection works not only on the lowest common denominator but even to the smarter people who should know better, and it remains a slim minority that actually knows what is going on and the apathetic general public just keeps bringing us down.
sorry, the line should have been: Things that you would think everyone knows, simple facts that are out there for everyone to see yet you ask around and most people don't have a clue.
Obama on McCain's lobbyists:
"if you think those lobbyists are working day and night for John McCain just to put themselves out of business, well then I've got a bridge to sell you up in Alaska."
As I said, Obama's better than his opposite number. Just don't expect him to deliver on every promise he gives. That way lies disappointment.
I think most people know what a lobbyist is. It's not enough to swing this election, but it eats away at the myth of McCain and Palin. There's been a lot of that eating away in the past few days and it needs to continue.
Obama is going to lose this election. I'll tell you why....
Liberals can't seem to get their minds around the fact that MOST voters vote on an EMOTIONAL basis, not a rational basis. The same morons who voted for Bush in 2000 and 2004 because he "loves Jesus" (in spite of the fact that their kids' teeth are rotting out of their head because they have no insurance and they are living in a trailer) will vote for McCain because "he's an American hero, he's 'strong'", or some similar type of bullshit.
Also, Palin appeals to Republican women because she's been successful based on how she looks, and she appeals to Republican men because they want to fuck her.
Finally, we can all assume that Obama is 4-6 points BELOW where he's currently polling due to the hidden racism of too many white voters.
This is the bottom line, folks. Yes, Obama SHOULD be 15-20 points ahead due to the lousy economy and the fact that neocon foreign policies have bred hatred toward the US abroad. However, thinking this way necessitates foresight and REASON--something the majority of voters lack.
Go ahead and call this attitude "arrogant." I don't give a shit. Democracy might be "the worst form of government, except for all the others " (Churchill's statement, I believe), but its major flaw is it allows stupid people to decide the type of government I have to live under. I'm getting sick of it.
Van @ 14:
So? Van?
What would you put in its place?
People knowing what a lobbyist is doesn't matter; what they already think a lobbyist is is good enough.
If the last 7 1/2 years have proven anything it's that Americans ARE that stupid. Hell, they voted for Dipshit McChimpy... TWICE!
My advice to Obama? Use smaller words.
Obama released another ad today that basically calls McCain out on his lies and the deceptive things he has said and done. I wish I could provide a link to it, but I've only seen it on tv.
As for lobbyist, even if many Americans don't know exactly what they do, they know that their involvement in this administration has not been for the betterment of the average family.
"Obama and Biden were marketed (honestly) as realizations of the American Dream, living hope that it is still possible"
While McCain is a realization of The American Wet Dream: Marry a hot blond with 200 million dollars.
Yes, I realize "hot" is subjective, but it fit the comedic paradigm.
"So? Van?
What would you put in its place?"
A country, or 'state' in this context, is simply a group of people within a certain geographical area who share a broad consensus on a certain system of government. Once this consensus breaks down, the state no longer exists.
Break the US up. Give the South back to the rednecks and build a wall from El Paso along the Confederate border areas to the Atlantic. Let 'em have their fucking racist government, but keep them the hell away from the rest of us.
Here's something that Republican strategists know that Democratic strategists haven't learned yet regarding words like "lobbyist"; everyday American citizens don't need to know exactly what the word means, they just need to know that it's very, very bad. You think the average Joe American knows the intricacies of being a "trial lawyer"? Of course not... but they're to be despised! Same goes for socialism, the NAACP, "special interests", etc. Stop thinking about educating the public, Dems, and think about winning. Lobbyists = bad, lobbyists = corruption, lobbyists = Jack Abramoff.
McCain has Phil Gramm as a senior financial advisor, and relies on his economic advise.
The same Phil Gramm that fought and lobbied for financial market de-regulation that resulted in the current market melt-down.
The same Phil Gramm that tells us that we're a bunch of whiners.
That's not change we can believe in, my friends!
Van @ 20:
Figures. Come along, say something that requires a lot of thought, come up with an idea that makes no sense whatsoever.
That's not smashing the system, that's dividing and still keeping the system intact. Funny, every time the Chinese did that in 100-200 years some enterprising busybody re-united them. You said you're sick of democracy. What. Comes. In. Its. Place?
Van @ 14:
Van, you are venting against the wrong people. If the MSM would report news instead of trying to entertain, perhaps the voters wouldn't be ignorant of the facts.
I might also add that McCain voters don't care that he's lying about lobbyists because, after all, "all politicians lie." In their minds, "I'm just not voting for the Black guy! I don't care if McCain is a liar and Palin is a moron. Better them then the Black dude!"
tx @ 11:
Good one!
The Connecticut Forum has it's first event September 27 and it's all about The Presidency! Featured guests include Elizabeth Edwards, Matthew Dowd, and Joseph Ellis, they will be discussing and debating the 2008 presidential candidates and campaigns. Be prepared for an unscripted, provocative evening at the Bushnell Theater in Hartford...come join us!
Van, I live in Wisconsin, and there are THOUSANDS of moron/redneck/Jesus-loves-NASCAR Republicans around. I know lots of progressive, intelligent well-educated thinkers in/from Texas and other Southen states. Re-secession wouldn't change much.
I totally agree - think about this: If you don't know who you're voting for already, you have a head like a melon full of jell-o. Everyone who has THOUGHT about the issues and KNOWS who they're voting for this November, isn't going to be convinced one way or the other by a political ad. Therefore political ads are aimed DIRECTLY at, essentially, IDIOTS.
THEREFORE:
using a word like "lobbyist" might be a little obtuse for a political ad. You need to define it first - say something like, "do you know what a lobbyist is? It's a person who bribes Washington politicians with fancy words, money and gifts, in order to get certain laws passed. John McCain's entire campaign staff is lobbyists, which means John McCain is LYING to you when he says he's a Washington outsider."
something like that. just define the word in simple, if inflammatory, terms.
Man, if I were the guy does ALL these political ad voice overs, I would annoy my friends with it so much.
"First he said he was bringing Guinness for the poker game. Then he said it was Heinekin. Now Jason Johnson shows up at the door and what does he have? Coors Light.
Jason Johnson. We just can't afford to trust him anymore."
Lobbyist get paid to ask Congress to favor ' Fill in the Blank' ...Enron, Halliburton, etc
I'd like one of these Ads to end with:
"change, may a$$."
;)
Van @ 25:
Big Claim. Very broad. Provide sources. Preferably ones that show rank-and-file conservatives that believe this, not the hierarchy.
I hear this claim all the time. Surely, if it is stated, there must be proof that Joe Sixpack vote for Hillary over Obama because of sheer racism as opposed to her populist, concise message as opposed to Obama's paragraph-long statements in answer to questions that only require three words to answer them. Surely, there must be some evidence that McCain voters don't go to McCain because he saw how she appealed to the rank-and-file Dems and is copying her idea?
For the record, I leaned more towards Hillary in the primaries than Obama. Especially in the last bit of it.
Furthermore, Van, where is the mass support for secession? It didn't exist in 1860, and after Sherman and his buddies turned large areas of the South into wastelands, it sure ain't gonna show up now.
CatAtomic @ 30:
Aaaah dude! That would be awesome!
"It didn’t exist in 1860"
Uh huh.....:-(
Great ad! Of course it will be all over the media like the mindless lipstick and good touch/bad touch "controversies," right? Hopefully, this ad is indicative of an aggressive stretch run.
I'm having trouble processing this... it's a political ad and it isn't about some insult or vague "character" issue? Is this legal?
"Big Claim. Very broad. Provide sources..."
The source will be revealed when McCain wins. Bet on it.
Perhaps the disaster we've experienced in recent years is attributable in part to the fact that those who would do the best job of governing spend their time studying problems, and figuring ways to solve them, while those who actually win elections are those who study the average voter's fears, and figuring ways to exploit them.
And Joe Biden isn't?!!!!!!
Joe Biden, they call him Mr. Plastic, after the credit card Corporations in Delaware.
Just saying…
Van @ 39:
Bullshit. That's not what I asked you. You claim this now. Provide sources for current events. If you make this claim and have no evidence, you revise. the. damn. claim.
Dahgrostab'ph-r-i @ 9:
because we spend all our time refuting the lies of the right. it makes us sound whiney and ineffective. the logical (albeit incorrect) conclusion is that these scoundrels can't possibly be lying as much as the Dems say they are!
Anyone who has not made up their mind by now probably will vote on a whim rather than the facts. You never know what word or phrase might get their attention. Maybe it's someone who is lost in space on many of the issues, but for some reason they do know about lobbyist and this ad just might get their attention.
McCain is just whistling a happy tune as he totters on. He doesn't have a clue what the American voters are looking for except someone to keep them safe from the "terrorists". He may be surprised to discover that fear of home foreclosure has pushed the fear of terrorism into the backseat. People have heard of the great depression and they know what that was all about. Only an idiot would want to follow a man who represents all that is wrong with their lives today. I know, I know, we do have a certain population of idiots in our country.
"What. Comes. In. Its. Place?"
Google "participatory economics" to find out more. This is too complex an issue to be discussed on a blog.
who the fuck is making these ads????
the music is wrong
the voice over guy puts you to sleep
the music needed to be over the top scary and the voice needs to be female
goddamit, i aint a media specialist, but i know what hits me in the gut, and that is just a straight informational ad....and boring
why not remake the ads using mccain in his own words
there will be more wars and less jobs...this i can promise you my friends
McCain's biggest weakness is the apathy and demoralization of his base. Obama's best strategy is to ignore him and Palin completely, offering himself and Biden and the solutions to America's problems to the independents and undecideds and NOT do anything that will encourage McCain's base to get out and vote.
John McCain's Health Records Must Be Released
http://www.alternet.org/blogs/video/98752/john_mccain%27s_health_records...
Hey Obama Campaign, Have You Seen This?
http://www.alternet.org/blogs/video/98581/hey_obama_campaign%2C_have_you...
Warning: The second is rather graphic and upsetting.
McCANE thinks the unfettered crony capitalist fundamentals are sound. 'We the people' sounds too socialistic.
General Pavel Rennenkampf Xocoyoztin @ 33:
http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2007/05/04/publiceye/entry2761854.shtml
http://mediamatters.org/items/200701240010
http://rawstory.com/news/2007/MSNBC_Analyst_Rove_Obama_attack_almost_011...
#16 grimc Says: People knowing what a lobbyist is doesn’t matter; what they already think a lobbyist is is good enough.
-------
You can't be serious.
Van @ 45:
Oh, shit. Another great, shiny socialist ideal. Yeah, that works so well on a big scale.
That's also economics. You're talking politics. Answer the damn question. What replaces the POLITICAL system. First, you refused to answer. Then, you give an answer in a separate sphere of a modern state. Please answer my actual question instead of evading me, I'm starting to think you have no goddamn idea what you want in place of the current 21st Century system.
General Pavel Rennenkampf Xocoyoztin @ 42:
Ah General...he's cloned troll of dennis...just parroting talking points without understanding them.
"Bullshit. That’s not what I asked you"
Google "Bradley Effect". Look it up on Wikipedia. All the evidence based on past elections is there.
Is the Coast Clear?--- @ 50:
Only the first even approximates what I asked for. I asked for Joe Sixpack and Betty Winebox. You give me the leaders.
Answer my damned question. The Obama comments closing I already knew about. The sources you provided are not current events, and two of them are not what I asked for.
I think it is a good strategy to show the lobbyist influence, moving into the WH, and not simply being a temporary campaign strategy. For some people, you have to connect ALL the dots.
"Another great, shiny socialist ideal"...
Lay off the ad hominem attacks. Read about it and become informed.
General Pavel Rennenkampf Xocoyoztin @ 15:
I tend to agree with Van. When it come to the presidency, and in elections generally, voters are looking for an ethos. They're looking for someone not necessarily who is "one of them," but for someone who gets them, and whom they get. Someone with whom they're comfortable. Someone whom they trust. Someone who is perceived as having integrity and being strong and trustworthy, but who disagrees with voters on issues, will win over someone who is perceived as not getting them, not being trustworthy and being weak, but who agrees with them on the issues.
As for what we should put in democracy's place, well, that's not really a fair question for Van, since he was quoting the, "democracy's the worst government except for all the others" notion. That quote is a nod to the fact that no matter it's faults, there's nothing better to put in its place.
But I'll tell ya, the FOUNDING FATHERS DISAGREED. They were TERRIFIED of democracy. They weren't so much afraid of "stupid voters," but tyranny of the majority, and the people's proven inability to govern themselves in a manner that benefited "the people" as a whole.
So, they drafted our Constitution. Our government is supposed to be a republic, not a democracy. And republican governments are not merely representative democracies. They are governments deliberately set up so that "the people" are sovereign, but do not directly rule, and which governing is split up among competing branches. They're governments in which "the people" have no legitimate reason to obey tyrannical laws -- or any laws, really, unless that law has stood the test of being passed by representatives of the people, willingness to be enforced by a, executive separate from those representatives, and adjudged to be consistent with the Constitutional bases upon which the nation rests. If the law can't survive all that, among competing branches of government, the law should not survive, no matter how big a majority of stupid people want it.
The history of America has been to "democratize" our "republic." Whigs vs. Democrats. Elites vs. Common Man. Have the Senate elected directly by the people. We've expanded suffrage continually. Etc.
A lot of that is fantastic. And necessary. But now the big thing is to attack "activist judges." It's a further democratization, saying that the ultimate principle of our nation is "democracy." It's not. Our principles are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, for all persons created equal. With a pure democracy, you don't get that.
There are plenty of things we can do now to amend our Constitution to restore our republic while keeping the good democratic gains we have made. But pure democracy is not something I think is wise.
Well, the Republican ticket has helped to liberate my inner drunk. If Obama wins, I might just open a 43 year old bottle of Lonach Scotch Whisky. If McCain wins it's a bottle of Aqua Velva strained through a loaf of wonder bread.
Great answer, Karen! I couldn't have said it better. Thanks.
http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:vCeoy9XL50QJ:www.splcenter.org/blog...
http://www.capveterans.com/the_year_2007/id59.html
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=c3e_1214819199
#55
Here a slam to your damn question----
Bamm---Got you----
If the people needing to be reached don't know what a lobbyist is, a simple explanation will be required in all future references to lobbyists:
"People the the rich, the privileged and the corporations hire to bribe the elected officials whom you thought you could trust".
or
"People who work for companies that monied interests hire for the specific purpose of corrupting your government".
Lobbying is bribary. It has not yet been made illegal, because lobbyists have bribed the people who write the laws".
or, by analogy,
"Lobbyists are like drug pushers, who get you hooked on drugs and then end up owning you. Corporations, the rich and the privileged hire lobbyists to corrupt the people you voted for. They get them hooked on money and vices, and end up owning them. <em.You pay for it when your corrupted congressmen, senators, presidents or government officials see to the needs of the lobbyists who own them, instead upholding the trusts you placed in them."
Or something along that line.
maybe it's my obvious bias but i believe sarah palin is
voicing words in her speech today that she has NEVER
literally spoken.
Obama is to change as in different policies to help Americans.
McCain is to change as in what will be left in your bank accounts when he's done.
Will the media talk about it for days and give Obama free airtime like they do with so many of McCain's ads? I doubt it.
Karen @ 58:
Yeah, and the Founders were almost uniformly slaveowners. Slavery, while still in existence today, is at least illegal according to every government around the globe. That's change. The last time a major movement in the US wanted to fully restrict the popular vote, that was in my part of the country, the Confederacy and its leaders.
Those assholes ensured the death of hundreds of thousands of our boys and turned a previously prosperous part of the country into a Third-World shithole. Fuck Aristocracy! This Southerners says: No more Confederacies!
I also think that idea comes dangerously close to actual fascist thinking. If the common man cannot speak for himself, and people must speak for them, and those people are not accountable, that's the kind of thinking that inspired Mussolini and Hitler to create their horrors. No to restricting the right of the masses to speak! No to the Domination!
constituent @ 63:
I think she's been doing that a lot.
What should really offend people is not that she isn't "experienced." What should offend people is that she thinks that she can learn everything she needs to know about the world in a crash course in the two months leading up to the election. That right there shows you she lacks the judgment to lead.
Dahgrostab'ph-r-i @ 9:
they don't... democrats are rather eloquent... the problem is entrenched and insular stupidity... breaking through that barrier in order to make someone receptive to facts is where the challenge lies..
Obama ad idea:
A regular, middle-age (40-55 yo) checks into his/hers 401K account. Sees a rapid decline, especially after today, of course.
Link McCain to the current market melt-down. (Less regulation???? You're kidding, right, because this is what happens when regulations get lessened!!0
Push people into checking what's in their 401K accounts right now. Then ask the question:
Can YOU afford more of the same????
I can't....
The problem is not the people. The problem is the media. There is not a liberal media. The media fails to inform us of the facts. The media thinks we merely want to be entertained. The media is losing investors. If the media would inform us, perhaps they would get more viewers or readers because we do want to know the facts. Because we want to be more knowledgeable about the facts the media might get more revenue. If they have more revenue they might even get more investors.
Van @ 57:
I've heard that sort of thinking before. It greatly inspired Lenin, and his beloved ideal of creating a Russia with a participatory economy. I'm sure the millions of starving Ukrainians in their charnel house villages were quite comforted by the thought that by starving they were participating in the economy.
Is the Coast Clear?--- @ 61:
Not quite. You've shown examples of individuals.
Now, show great numbers of these people. I can find any number of kooks, especially when a black man is running. What I have not seen is mass effect of these kooks on millions of Americans.
CMINCA @ 48:
Man, That second Video is Really Powerful. That YouTube link should be all over the Net. We should be sending it to everyone we know, it is probably the most powerful Video i have seen to tell how bad a Choice Mccain would be.
Karen @ 67:
it's interesting to hear sarah palin criticize obama's tax
proposals..........when she herself raised taxes on oil
co. profits...i guess that's okay.
General Pavel Rennenkampf Xocoyoztin @ 12:
thanks for the cautionary note... but that's just another way of saying beware, i'm here to demoralize you... the issues are nothing less than a study in contrasts... obama not delivering on every promise he gives is still a exceedingly superior alternative to a scenario of mcliar providing a 10% promise fulfillment ratio... the choice is simple... either you want to continue to drive the country into ruin under a corporate oligarchy or you want someone who believes in the fundamental principle of "we the people"...
General Pavel Rennenkampf Xocoyoztin @ 66
You should lose this round based on Godwin's Law.
If you think discussing the founders' views of republican governments -- where THE PEOPLE ARE SOVEREIGN -- vs. purely democratic governments is the kind of talk that leads to "restricting the right of the masses to speak," you're not thinking very deeply.
The founders had plenty of horrible, disgusting flaws. I did not invoke them, and argue based on their authority. I invoked their arguments about protecting EQUALITY AND LIBERTY from TYRANNICAL MAJORITIES.
Frankly, General, the first amendment's guarantee of free speech is an INHERENTLY UNDEMOCRATIC guarantee. It PREVENTS MAJORITIES, no matter how big, from interfering with any individual's right to speak.
And a lot of the rights you enjoy were not given to you by majorities of the people. They've been upheld by what the right wing now thinks are tyrannical governments.
Spare me your chants about Hitler. We've got the loud legion of theocrats here to deal with, who can EASILY get a majority of the votes in many, many states!
View THIS and pass it on to as many as you can.
Ron @ 70:
Wasn't it Poppy Bush that cooked up that term the "Liberal Media". I think it was about the same time he started calling liberals the "L-word".
shaggles @ 65:
Tragic, isn't it...
Obama is the more intelligent, articulate, compelling, younger, stronger, and dammit just has a better strategy than McCain...
Still decks is stacked not in our favor as far as the media attention is concerned....
Why?
Also would any person of color that has the general skill level, aptitude, or competence of this GOP Prez ticket would be even remotely considered?
Karen @ 75:
The Confederate leaders would emphatically agree with your ideas. Do you care to have Jefferson Davis (may that sonofabitch burn in Hell with hot pokers up his ass and out his mouth) as an ideological agreer with you?
This ideology is exactly what the Fascists wanted in the 1930s. The Founders would have found Hitler right up their alley, as a matter of fact in a lot of ways, they were quite conservative by 2000s standards.
But anywho, talk of shutting down the right of protest and disagreement with a particular model of politics has already been done in these parts. I loathe the result. Fuck the Confederacy and modern wannabe Confederates!
when you have time watch this bill moyer's journal
it's about the lobbyist and their dominate power on
capitol hill. the number of lobbyist in the beltway has
grown to 30k. lobbyist are needed but their presence
is out of balance...the mccain campaign reveals this.
http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07252008/profile3.html
Van @ 25:
No, Van. Your politician lies. Your racism clouds your better judgment.
I was at a Republican gathering this past weekend, and the buzz words were "change" and "maverick." It's almost as if the Republican Party has abandoned George Bush...because the only way McCain could represent "change" is if no one remembers who currently resides in the White House. Not once that I heard did anyone mention the names George Bush or Dick Cheney.
And, perhaps an indication that Republicans are trying too hard to make Sarah Palin's resume more robust than it actually is, I also heard (and have on tape) my current Congressman...Jeff Fortenberry (not the brightest bulb in the bunch)....tout Palin's experience as PTA president, which he unabashedly claimed is a tough "political" position. I wasn't even aware that the PTA was even a political organization.
General Pavel Rennenkampf Xocoyoztin @ 79:
Take a deep breath, General, you're not usually like this. Trust me, Jefferson Davis would not agree with what I'm saying. If you think he would you're misinterpreting me. And even if he would agree with me, it means he'd have been right about something.
No, Hitler would not have gotten along with the founders. That's just fucking stupid. They'd both be racists and bigots, but they would have a completely different understanding of government.
How old are you? Let me guess? 22? 23? Just basically starting to study this stuff?
I'm talking about republics vs. democracies. You're talking about democracies vs. fascist totalitarianism. You're completely missing the point, which is that pure democracies can lead to the kind of tyranny you despise.
Van @ 25:
i liked to see have that tough talk attitude around a platoon of u.s. active duty marines. tough guy!
upchuck @ 77:
I'm not sure, but I think it might have been Gingrich. I do know that I used to read the newspaper everyday and now very seldom do so. T.V. is just as bad.
constituent @ 84:
S/He's describing the idiocy s/he sees in the minds of McCain voters, so relax.
Van @ 20:
not only is that a rather defeatist attitude, it's one that demonstrates obliviousness to the issues surrounding mid-east policies that have led to escalation and not peace... ignoring a problem and walling oneself off to it doesn't make it go away... instead, what you end up with is a disease that festers and grows... and inevitably bites you on the ass... the ONLY solution is education... and getting down into the gutter to dig the garbage out... peace and prosperity has never been accomplished by any means other than through struggle...
the world is shrinking... and that simply means that the clashes between idiotologies will escalate... no amount of insularity on either side will achieve equanimity between polaric opposites... what is necessary is the resolve to make this world a better place... and that takes hard work and pain and sacrifice... to believe otherwise is delusional...
Karen @ 86:
relaxing....
Ron @ 85:
Making "liberal" a bad word was Reagan's idea. Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush started floating the "liberals are bad" meme in 1979 and 1980. By the time Bush Sr. was running against Dukakis, they had perfected it.
constituent @ 88:
:)
Karen @ 89:
Thank you, I was considering Reagan, but wasn't sure.
If a 18+ year-old citizen in a democracy does not know and will not expend an effort to find out what a lobbyist is in spite of civics education in high school (attendance required by law until 16 years of age), libraries and on-line access to a myriad of resources, then that individual deserves all of the abuse and neglect that the failed and self-serving elites in that country will rain down on his or her head. How low can the bar go?
General Pavel Rennenkampf Xocoyoztin @ 12:
get a reality check........with all the problems the
bush/cheney reichwingneocon bastards have created
and will leave behind.....obama will be fighting an
uphill battle, that we ALL will need to help solve
and we ALL will suffer the consequences of this bush/cheney
administration. you are like a lot of nay-sayers. you can
bitch and bitch and bitch........where's your offerings
of solutions for the upcoming struggle?
just like i said...you have NONE, just bitching....
so, either come up with some help or STFU!
speaking of 'promises' mccain said he will balance the federal budget in one term.........how?
dadams @ 93:
Even Obama says that we have to build from the bottom up. It's not all going to magically happen from the top down. All he can help with is the right guidelines.
Alice X - (Chomsky Nader) - status quObama - change you can pretend in - @ 41:
...of course you are... because before you, no one's called him that.. but, do go ahead and provide some cites that reveal who that mysterious "they" is that you refer to...
the saddest things about rethuglican trolls is their belief that they can manufacture any sort of bs and their "dupes" will buy it... and this is sad because it stems from a belief that one's fellow citizens deserve to be duped as a result of their naivety and because it actually reveals stupidity on behalf of the idiot whom adopts such a position...
iow... your bs says more about YOU than it does about the people who have to endure it... if you actually had a leg to stand on... and if you actually possessed a modicum of intelligence yourself, you'd be armed with facts... and because you insult EVERY thinking human being with such a degrading attitude, you inevitably only smear yourself with your own crap...
i'm just sayin'
Good.
This is the home stretch people. Keep those ads coming - hard and strong. It's going to take a lot of money to get them on the air. We need to break the fund raising record for September and October too.
Swiftboaters are coming -- the corporate owned and run media are putting out terror DVD's to terrify people and help crown McSame king. The reporters are still licking McSame's BBQ covered Ass while they wank.
They're push-polling in Florida already. The student vote is already being challenged. Poor black communities are already being swamped with misleading literature.
More ads - more exposure to the crimes - more exposure of the failed Bush/McSame policies. More exposures of how the middle class is hurting. More exposure of how the Constitution is being subverted.
More, more, more. Heavier and harder, more.
*
General Pavel Rennenkampf Xocoyoztin @ 15:
You know what they say, "Democracy is the worst form of government except for all the others tried before it."
Paul @ 29:
i agree that it is as important to be succinct and blunt as it is to maintain the high road... which is not too much of a challenge for obama... media which appeals to a populist audience tends to downgrade its language to that of a grade school level of comprehension... therefore, i also believe it is important to simplify language and concepts to appeal to that same audience... and some measure of "forcefulness" to appeal to entrenched attitudes of voters who's primary "mode of operation" is emotional... like spielberg once opined about his work... he seeks to target a balance between the head and the gut...
McCain stuff really starts at about 1:10, but this is what I call a hard-hitting ad...
http://www.alternet.org/blogs/video/98581/hey_obama_campaign%2C_have_you...
Van @ 14:
100% dead-on balls accurate. Unfortunately.
This means nothing to the average American. Lobbyists? So what. Lies? So what.
Obama needs to get the attention of Americans and connect with their concerns more directly...for example, if McCain is elected, it is far more probable that there will be a draft. There is no way that the US can support military excursions into Iran and Georgia in addition to maintaining forces in Iraq and Afghanistan with an all-volunteer military. So, if you're in your teens or twenties, and McCain is elected, be prepared to report for duty.
Ron @ 95:
...because that's the only way to institute change... his words about change coming to washington and not from washington are in essence, no different than JFK's "ask not what your country can do for you"...
"No, Van. Your politician lies. Your racism clouds your better judgment."
Uh, no.....It's not "my" racism. I was paraphrasing the racist attitudes so many Republican voters hold.
#71
Let's be clear about "individual"---these are groups of potentially dangerous individuals who carry a hate message---web sites that give a platform to racist venting----
You are right though, they are kooks, I would not just designate the term "individual", they are groups of individuals...
Racism comes in all brands, some extreme, some very, very subtle....
Some people are obviously more pronounced....more twisted...just like the websites I sited....
Because you cannot actually gauge the more subtle racist inclinations regarding individuals does not mean it does not exist that's ludicrous....
And I do believe subtle racists comments would compel a fair amount of the population who have this particular inclination could be as a general rule manipulated in a predictable manner to the benefit of the person initiating the comment....
Is the Coast Clear?--- @ 105:
Correction----
And I do believe subtle racist comments would manipulation a fair amount of the population who have this particular inclination in a predictable manner to the benefit of the person initiating the comment….
Would it translate into votes?....
Damn right it would....
Because you cannot actually gauge the more subtle racist inclinations regarding individuals does not mean it does not exist that's ludicrous....
And I do believe subtle racists comments would compel a fair amount of the population who have this particular inclination could be as a general rule manipulated in a predictable manner to the benefit of the person initiating the comment....
Damn another Correction----
And I do believe subtle racist comments would manipulate a fair amount of the population who have this particular inclination in a predictable manner to the benefit of the person initiating the comment….
Would it translate into votes?....
Damn right it would....
A few of mccain's lobbyist(s)
*randy scheunemann........Georgia conflict
*charlie black...............a conflict could help mccain
*phil gramm.........americans'whiners' enron,mortgage deregulation,on ubs board
*rick davis.........big time lobbyist....always fighting
corporate taxes
Neo-classical secular humanist @ 92:
the bar's been in the gutter for quite some time now... it is irrelevant how informed someone is in the nuances of the lobbyist role in government... what matters today, is the widespread notion that it is due to their efforts that government has failed... and in this respect, the rethugs are actually helping to deliver this message... the key is in associating that negative perception with the facts about mcliar being in the lobbyists' back pockets...
the only long-term solution to such a misapprehension is educational in nature... schools have failed miserably to educate their students on a number of levels... and the most significant being the near absence of developing insight into every student and citizen's role in the political process...
learning about government structure and about how to work with government in order to facilitate change and justice and sound policy is fundamental knowledge which leads to an effective citizenship... most people develop interest in government only after they've been confronted with enough issues to pay attention... otherwise many, if not most people, easily sail through life without the slightest comprehension of their own roles and responsibilities in a system of (essentially) self-governance...
iow... to teach kids about the constitution is not enough... to teach kids about the history of a country is not enough... to teach kids "arcane" concepts which they cannot relate to on a personal level is essentially a waste of time and a huge turnoff that leads to disinterest and that disinterest leads to the current state of affairs...
school curricula needs to adapt to an affective form of education... iow, students need to be encouraged to develop their own student governments, students need to literally experience their own microcosms of real-world political systems in order to be able to develop the wherewithal to process the intricacies of governance...
the upside is that much work has already being done in this area, unfortunately, it is most often being referred to as the development of "soft skills" or "interpersonal skills"... the next stage in such development is literally "community development skills"...
btw... when is someone going to demand an apology from both painlin and 9/11guilliani for their ignorance at the rnc convention...?... they insulted literally millions of hard working people with their remarks... and that should not go unchallenged....
I just want to thank Karen for explaining what's what when it has to do with the historical and political tenets of this Union. It is the expository excellence and thinking behind her statements that make her points most succinct, clear and enjoyable to read.
Brava. Keep it coming.
Is the Coast Clear?--- @ 107:
See, it has always bothered me about folks who "can't see" the nuances of racism. And what is worse is that they will throw the kitchen sink along with any theory to disprove what they can't see. With that type of thinking, it typically contributes to privileged thinking aligned with the dominant culture. Because "one culture" can't or won't see it, that means it doesn't exist. That alone speaks of arrogance of the worst kind.
What those folks cannot realize is that the most subtlest brand of racism is there whether or not they try to say that it doesn't exist.
That's why Mr. Obama's historical run is eye-opening on many fronts.
Obama Releases New Ad Hitting Hard On McCain’s Lobbyist Ties
I didn't know mcgramps and his lobbyist girlfriend were into bondage.
Is the Coast Clear?--- @ 61:
actually... any cursory cruise through usenut (alt.fan.rush-limbaugh or alt.plolitics.republican or any such group) and you will see rampant and uncensored racism... many threads use moonni***r in their subject line... one guy who calls himself "pappy" has boasted about lying in wait at public parking lots for hispanics to park their cars so that he can slash their tires while they're inside shopping...
some of these people are outright contemptible and the very fact that they exist and express themselves thusly in such an indignant fashion is a testament to the failures we have had in confronting these as*****s head on... in such cases, tolerance for the intolerable is where the "more evolved sensiblity" has accomplished little more than the same enabling behavior of that of an alcoholic in a family which turns a blind eye to the elephant in the room...
The Obama campaign needs to hit hard and often against McCain on the economy. 2, 3, 4 ads a day. Pepper these guys with ads so fast that they don't have time to react. The economy is in the tank and Grampy McCain has no clue how to respond to it.
I don't see much about McSame talking more about the issues than attacking/smearing Obama. Why would any decent American want to vote for him??
At least Obama is catching up in the polls, even though they should be more of a landslide apart.
It's probably too difficult for McSame to relate to regular America since he considers that the min. wealth income is $5 million.
Unless people really aren't smart and continue to fall for lies repeated over and over again, there is no reason why Obama shouldn't be our next POTUS.
Even so, there is a discrepancy between the wrong person getting elected, either fairly or by cheating, and the right person who should get elected.
Nobody asked me, but that ad is not hard enough.
His new ad showcasing all the indepenant sources calling McCain out as a liar is even better.
The Very Bitter Ceci Hussein @ 110:
Wow. Thank you! I truly appreciate that.
Do people actually listen to these Ads? After watching Political Campaign Ads, my opinion of the candidate being targeted never changes. If anything, I think it makes the Presidential Candidates look like they are in junior high. I believe the presidential candidates should be held to a higher degree and have more responsibility with their advertising. That's a lot of money being spent just to slander someone's name.
Sunday Bloody Sunday
The Wall Street Shuffle
ralph DR RON cynthia
What have they done to the earth?
What have they done to our fair sister?
Ravaged & plundered & ripped her & bit her
Stuck her with knives in the side of the dawn
& tied her with fences &
Dragged her down!
mike dennis jesse ross
This ad is going in the right direction... but it's not HARD ENOUGH!
You have to break thru the clutter...
Call 'em GANGSTERS 'n SCHYSTERS!
They will WASTE THE BLOOD of young Americans for a war that nobody wants and is gaining NOTHING.
Where will they get the credit to pay for the war in Iraq??? FROM CHINA???
We're talkin' the biggest national deficit IN THE HISTORY OF THE WORLD!
How will they put Americans back to work when they give TAX CRIDITS to companies that ship jobs to INDIA and KOREA and CHINA and MEXICO?
He voted against HEALTH CARE FOR THE TROOPS!
He voted against EXTENDING HEALTH CARE FOR CHILDREN!
He voted against EQUAL PAY FOR EQUAL WORK!
He HUGGED AND KISSED George W. Bush!
He went shopping in a market in Baghdad... AND LIED ABOUT THE SECURITY CONDITIONS!
HE SEZ WE'RE WINNING in Iraq... but does not tell us how to END the Occupation. He didn't know who was being trained in Iran... to kill Americans!
He accused Obama of calling Palin A PIG!
He accused Obama of wanting to teach comprehensive birth control to pre-schoolers.
He's an IDIOT... and a LIAR!
There... I just wrote you a good sixty-second campaign ad... and it's not even NEGATIVE... IT'S FACTUAL!
I really think this is one of Obama's greatest ads yet.
I also think we should all think positive and visualize victory. All those young people with cell phones are not included in the polls.
Hopefully the economy - sadly - will give Obama a big boost and the Palin frenzy will die down. Geezus. I'm sending in one of my letters to the editor tonight.
klunk @ 96:
It is hilarious you call a socialist a republican troll. You nitwit!
You should listen to Ralph Nader rather than watching TV.
Nader crucifies these people, which is why the Corporate Media avoid him like the plague.
Vote NADER '08.
Here is Biden with Republican bankruptcy bill of 2001.
A horrible piece of pro corporation legislative claptrap garbage.
Here is what Daily Kos said about the "Bankruptcy Abuse Prevention and Consumer Protection Act of 2005" which was anything but.
Here is the vote of the Republicrats.
At least Obama voted no.
There is plenty more. MBNA, now held by Bank of America, was a huge presence in Delaware and in Washington DC for a long time.
You owe me an apology.
Alice X - (Chomsky Nader) - status quObama - change you can pretend in - @ 123:
From your first link:
"The bill's supporters say that it would end abuses of the bankruptcy system by debtors who can repay some of their loans. The legislation would disqualify many debtors from filing for Chapter 7 bankruptcy, which allows them to wipe out credit card debts and other unsecured loans, and force them into Chapter 13, which requires some repayment.
''Our current bankruptcy system is broken,'' said Senator Orrin G. Hatch, the Utah Republican who is chairman of the Judiciary Committee. ''Under the current system, people with high incomes can run up massive debts and then use bankruptcy to get out of honoring them.''"
From your second link:
"The laws have caused controversy in the past for the obvious reasons -- corporate officers responsible for criminal, fraudulent, or simply negligent behaviors by their companies (think WorldCom) can pump an unlimited amount of money into their own property, and that property then cannot be touched in bankruptcy proceedings."
clearly, you have a selective approach toward determining what facts fit your bias...
thankfully, you are at least not a rethuglican troll... so i will retract that part of my post... i actually do support alternatives to the currently destructive two-party system and nader does have some worthwhile arguments... the sad part of his campaign is the notion of running as an independent is much like a disneyesque fantasy of waiting for some magical hero to swoop down and save the day... his efforts would be far more productive if he put his ego aside for a moment and accepted the simple fact that the *real* issues are far bigger than him... and will take more than an independent multimillionaire to fix... his strategy should be focused on developing a third party for the country that can actually grow and affect change by embedding itself permanently into the political system...
aside from that... you still haven't provided any evidence of biden being called mr. plastic... that slur, for all intents and purposes, is still one of your making... so, no... you do not get an apology, my deluded friend... ;-)
klunk @ 124:
You quote the bills sponsors. Of course they say things that sound pleasant.
It is the exact same propaganda you get with all of this bullshit.
The sponsors of the FISA bill say it is good for you. It was good for the corporations who got the illegal contracts and seem to have gotten off scott free though they broke the law.
The sponsors of every war funding bill say it is good for you. They ARE good for the war profiteers.
The sponsors of the recent housing bill say it is good for you. Heavily waited in favor of the corporations.
Here is Arianna Huffington on the 2005 Bankruptcy bill from Salon:
The Obama campaign ad talking about McCain's lobbyist problem isn't going to talk about its own lobbyist problems. But they are there. The fact that Obama hasn't been in Washington was his strength. Biden has, thirty four years. Senator Plastic. Maybe he would be like Lyndon Johnson and do an about face from his Senate days.
The entire mission of American politics is propaganda and manipulation.
They learn to smile when they stand there with a knife in your back.
Incidentally I will give a tip to know a Republican troll from a leftist.
Republicans try to claim that the Democrats are socialists and extreme liberals. They NEVER claim that the two parties are all but the same. NEVER!
The real leftist know better and call the Democrats what so many of them have become, Republicrats.
Alice X - (Chomsky Nader) -
Ralph Nader had a convention the other day to nominate himself for president.
The noise was overwhelming from the crowd of
Crickets
It almost waked the night-watchman.
Alice X - (Chomsky Nader) - status quObama - change you can pretend in - @ 125:
lol.... nice job at completely missing the point... there's only one of two parties that will win this election... and so, there's only one of two choices for president... sure... the independents get some airtime.... sure... the independents can forward their views on what's ailing the country... beyond that... bupkas.... the entire notion of independents running on a federal level is nothing more than a smokescreen you've bought into which gives you an opportunity to feels as if you can elevate your disdain for politics above the crowd... but, in reality... you've bought into a delusion on a grander scale than that which the rethugs are selling the american people...
if you truly want to see an alternative to the polarizing rhetoric, and if you truly want to see progress on the issues you care about... and if nader truly believes in the issues, not his own ego, he would dedicate himself toward a strategy which has long term implications... bush took 8 years to do the damage he did... after 12 years of similar (but not quite so stupid) rethug management (which, thankfully... had a short break in between)...
there is no bloody way that an independent (even if he's in for two terms... which is less than a pipe dream) will be able to forward any sort of policy that will stick in the long term... have you not been paying attention to what's been happening with rethuglican childishness in congress...?... (even though the dems are supposedly the majority power)...
the only true value that nader can bring to american politics is to push for a permanent, third alternative to the american people... otherwise, you're just another deluded lemming following the sound of a disabled pied piper playing a slightly different tune than the other two...
but... you go ahead and vote nader... at least you're not voting rethuglican... because anyone who does after these last (almost) 3 decades is a complete and utter idiot...
Alice X - (Chomsky Nader) - status quObama - change you can pretend in - @ 125:
btw... here's a clue for you.... lobbying is a part of the political system... it will NEVER go away... earmarks are a part of the negotiations for enabling bills... they will NEVER go away... learn to deal with these two very basic facts and you will have taken a step forward in understanding some of the nuances of politics...
the rethugs claim they're against earmarks and lobbyists... (and meanwhile, their entire campaign is run by corporate lobbyists)... this is no different than their idiotic position on being against government... which is the same as a murderer saying he's against the death penalty...
the dems claim that lobbying needs to be reformed.... BIG difference...
once you learn to recognize the differences in the messages and the intent behind their platforms, then there should be no question in your mind which party needs to oust which party in order to begin to fix the crap that's been done by the incumbents...
believing that "super-nader" will be able to accomplish anything more than being a flash-in-the-pan is a "super-delusion" on its own... for all intents and purposes, he's just spinning his wheels and taking idealists along on a magical mystery ride to nowhere...
now... please do not misconstrue my view as being against his views... as i've already said he has some lucid arguments... so does ron paul... the point that really matters however, is not that people have good ideas... it's how are they going to actually affect change when their efforts amount to an impact even less significant than building up your own propaganda machine to drone your platform on endlessly... day after day after day... like faux noise...
in this context... if nader really wants to make change... and he doesn't want to dedicate himself to doing the necessary work of building a permanent, third alternative party for the electorate, then he should start up his own network... at least then, he would have the benefit of of forwarding his message on a consistent enough basis for people to actually have an opportunity to absorb it... as it stands... his efforts amount to little more than even less of a fascination the public demonstrated over britney spears' vagina...
OMG... Nader is using a parrot as his symbol of whining about not getting news coverage...?... you have got to be kidding!!!.... Hillary gets lambasted by the media by correctly pointing out the rampant misogyny and branded as a whiner hiding behind her apron strings... and the best that nader can do is whine to a parrot.... puh-leeze... aliceX... if that is your view of what constitutes leadership that can change america, then you have been drinking some seriously tainted kookaid...
[Deleted. Worst spamming concern troll ever. BTW, Aco!, you're banned. Site Monitor]
As I said, the entire mission of American politics is propaganda and manipulation.
The Democrats and the Republicans want you to believe that only two parties are possible, THEM. Meanwhile they feed at the same corporate trough.
In '92 Ross Perot, a COLOSSAL EGO, got 19 million votes which gave the election to Clinton.
Had Perot not been something of a nut case, quit the race and then started again, he might actually have won, he was ahead in the polls before he quit.
So congratulations to everyone taken in by the mantra: There are ONLY two parties that can win.
THAT IS PRECISELY WHAT THEY WANT YOU TO SAY.
Alice X - (Chomsky Nader) - status quObama - change you can pretend in - @ 131:
lol... so... your argument is to sidestep the arguments presented by entrenching yourself in an unsubstantiated position that simply sweeps past the rationale presented to you... nice... just like a loon...
no... that is NOT "precisely what they want" (whoever that ephemeral "they" is that loons like to cite)... it is a FACT... there are only two parties that have any chance of establishing leadership in this election. period. When it comes to fantasies based upon egotistically driven heroes, Nader is just another Ross Perot... the point of the matter is that if you truly want to seen an alternative, you have to work specifically toward establishing, developing and growing that alternative. period.
19 million votes in a nation of over 300 million is an irrelevant blip which accomplishes little more than public protests... nothing more.
Of course the dems and the rethugs don't want competition... and that is EXACTLY why you should be pushing Nader toward developing REAL competition.
To smear the entire American political process as a vehicle for propaganda and manipulation is weak at best... in this sweeping context, try not to forget that YOU also are only forwarding your own version of propaganda and manipulation as well... okay?
Comments are closed on this entry