Have Gun Will Travel II
By Cliff Schecter Wednesday Jul 22, 2009 6:45am
As I was pleased to note last night in an update, pressure from the Netroots was instrumental in getting Sens. McCaskill (D-MO) and Specter (D-PA) to come out against the Thune Amendment, an assault on federalism, personal security and the proposition that Dems might actually stand up for something.
The vote is at noon. Keep your calls coming, as we are on the cusp of wining this one and saving countless lives, not to mention shutting down a key element of the right-wing machine in DC: The NRA.
Here are your numbers once again:
Those whose minds need to be changed
Bayh (D IN) 202-224-5623
Bennet (D CO) (202) 224-5852
Collins (R ME) (202) 224-2523
Conrad (D ND) (202) 224-2043
Feingold (D WI) 202/224-5323
Hagan (D NC) 202-224-6342
Landrieu (D LA) (202)224-5824
Lincoln (D AR) (202) 224-4843
McCain (R- AZ) (202) 224-2235
Pryor (D-AR) (202) 224-2353
Reid (D – NV) 202-224-3542
Snowe (R – ME) (202) 224-5344
Udall (D – NM) 202-224-6621
Udall (D – CO) 202-224-5941
Voinovich (R- OH) (202) 224-3353
Warner (D – VA) 202-224-2023
Webb (D –VA) 202-224-4024
Those we must hold:
Kohl (D – WI) (202) 224-5653
Klobuchar (D – MN) 202-224-3244
Nelson (D - FL) 202-224-5274
UPDATE: (Nicole) The Thune Amendment, which needed 60 votes to pass, went down 58-39) Thanks to all who called. Nice to see we can beat the NRA.
Full disclosure: I have been hired to work with Mayors Against Illegal Guns on this effort, and couldn't be happier or more passionate about it.
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Who in their right minds would vote to allow terrorist Right wing-nuts and other looneys to pack a gun anywhere, even church?
right wing-nuts and other looney's.
and their constituents aren't wrapped too tight these days
this amendment grant people the ability to carry anywhere? It mandates reciprocity, the permit/license holder would still have to abide by the laws of the state that they are in. Like a drivers license.
Last time I heard he was in Frisco
http://www.uclick.com/client/nyt/tt/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QclVGUHvRvE
apparently the NRA controlled Hollywood back then.
until the electric guitar became the weapon of choice when The Beatles invaded the U.S.
...pretty dismayed that he's on the "on the fence" list.
And what I'm dismayed about is the shocking about of disinformation that both C&L and posters on this board have put out about this bill.
The tactics being demonstrated here by C&L and many of it's users are the exact same kind that Freerepublic use day in and day out, and it honestly sickens me to see it happen.
You should be ashamed C&L.
for equating us with them. This amendment had nothing good in it, and we did the "democratic" thing...we pressured those who represent us.
I seem to always part with people here regarding gun issues because I am a pro gun person. But this Thune Amendment is loony tunes crazy.
If I were to argue for this idea at all I would suggest, at very least, taking the strictest concealed carry requirements of all the states and turning that into requirements for a Federal concealed carry permit issued by the ATF. That permit would allow interstate travel with a concealed gun but you would need to pass a lot of requirements and be on the ATF database to get it.
are you also for a federal drivers license, for interstate driving? With the strictest driving tests? And having to pass a lot of requirements to get one? Interstate travel is a right, so is keeping and bearing arms, driving is just a privilege but my Drivers license is good anywhere in the US but my license to carry a handgun isn't good in half of my neighboring states.
I keep coming back to the fact that no one really seems to be able to frame the argument rationally or honestly. A lot of false stats from both sides, a lot of fear mongering and hate from both sides. I suppose there isn't any room for dispassionate arguments any more.
and your analogy is flawed, at best. A driver's license cannot kill someone, nor can it be taken from its owner and turned on him/her in the commission of a crime.
And before you go all "gun rights-y" on me, I'm a proud gun owner and hunter, and have been since I was a teen. I went through proper gun safety classes, have my weapons registered with the local police, and keep them secure in my house when not using them. Do I fear for my life enough to want to "pack a piece" when I'm on my way to the grocery store? No. Because I'm an adult; not a scared child, which is how far too many "adults" in this country are acting lately.
This amendment was ridiculous when it was proposed, and I am thankful it was defeated. Police and other law enforcement officers are the only ones who need to carry concealed weapons, and there are enough laws, statutes and restrictions in place to allow them to do so. The general public, contrary to "common" thought, has no business carrying weapons "just in case". This ain't the Wild Wild West anymore, bucko, and its time you throwbacks wake up and accept it.
about a drivers license cannot kill someone, neither can my license to carry. But the vehicle being driven can, just like my firearms can. And cars can be taken from someone and used against them. Here is one example.
http://www.wsmv.com/news/15578139/detail.html
How many people are killed by out of state drivers compared to people from out of state that have a carry permit?
And LEO are the only ones who need to carry concealed weapons?
Do you really want me to post examples of law abiding citizens who have used firearms to defend themselves and others? I'll post one where the person wished they were able to carry theirs.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M1u0Byq5Qis
And do you remember I think it was in the late '80s or early '90s the police asking car rental companies in FL to remove the rental company stickers because criminals were targeting them because they knew the tourists were unarmed? This was shortly after FL passed right to carry legislation.
Quote all the biased statistics and video you want... the fact remains, there is no good reason for forcing states to honour another state's regulations when it comes to concealed weapons permits.
Sad to know you are that afraid of "boogeymen" that you would need to carry a gun "to protect yourself".
article 4 sec 1 of the constitution
"Section 1. Full faith and credit shall be given in each state to the public acts, records, and judicial proceedings of every other state. And the Congress may by general laws prescribe the manner in which such acts, records, and proceedings shall be proved, and the effect thereof."
Also the 14th amendment, sec 1 which has been interpreted by the supreme court that the states may not discriminate between residents of their state and residents of other states. ie If they allow it for their residents they have to allow it for non-residents.
and sec 5 of the same amendment gives congress the power to enact legislation to enforce it.
And I'm not afraid of "boogeymen" I'm concerned about criminals. There are bad people everywhere. And to use a cliche "When seconds count the police are only minutes away" And here is a 911 call that backs it up.
Caution Graphic
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NooudPBkeSQ
mods please delete, computer glich
mods please delete, computer glich
This legislation would require ALL states to recognize concealed carry permits from all other states, including states that grant permits without regard to criminal records. In Virginia, this would allow convicted criminals to carry weapons onto parks and playgrounds. Potentially violent individuals could obtain permits in the several states that have virtually no standards for issuing concealed carry permits.
What does the Republican Party really stand for? Really! At their last convention we witnessed them holding up signs saying "Country First"; yet, they are determined to kill healthcare reform legislation which will improve our economy and peoples' lives. We witnessed them overstepping their bounds by attempting to overturn Florida law in the Terry Schiavo ordeal. And now we see John Thune's bill.
If this bill passes, then surely the Republicans would have no problem with Same Sex Marriage being recognized in all states overruling those states who have voted against it.
I called Klobuchar's office.
accurate, it would require all states that issue concealed carry permits, to honor others. If the state does not issue/allow concealed carry it doesn't effect them.
again.
See ya later
is God, Guns and Gays
They are the party of nothing
McCaskill's office and reinforced the issue... just to be sure.. Can't hurt.. and she has been a little weak on some of these things.. Health Care, Cap & Trade.. It took me 3 weeks to get an answer from her on Public Option and then she put a qualifier on it.. Yes that was in response to my tweet from the other night where she famously said she supported the "pubic option", I had been pushing her for 3 days on it after sending her about 6 emails and getting no response.. she keeps saying she is looking into the emails, yet I am still getting nothing from her office or her.. But at least I got her on the record about Health Care..such as it is.
Just another repig bullshit waste of time and money.
Instead of working on vital issues, such as health insurance reform, they come up with crap like this, all to please an extremist organization, the NRA.
and almost 25% of dem senators.
God bless, nay save, us of a indeed.
I'm totally stunned to see Feingold on that list. Are you sure you don't mean Feinstein? That wouldn't surprise me in the least.
about Feingold, but no, I think DiFi has been consistent on being for gun control.
There was a famous exchange earlier in her congressional career where a pro gun congress made the mistake of asking her what experience and knowledge she could possibly have about guns. She completely annihilated the guy with her answer about her first husband being shot down dead with a gun, and her mayor and fellow supervisor (Moscone and Milk) being shot down by guns. She just obliterated the guy.
That's good to know. I've always thought of her as a DINO. I'm happy to hear that she is with Dems on some issues.
That doesn't necessarily mean she has any real knowledge about guns aside from they can kill you. Just because you know people that got plowed by a car mean that you really know anything about cars and auto accidents aside from you can die in one.
For example, does she know anything about ballistics? Does she know anything about statistics involving gun crimes? For example her support of the Assault Weapon Ban, there are Justice Dept. stats showing the gun most used in crimes were handguns and not automatic rifles. So why even hassle with rifles when the majority of guns involved in crimes are handguns? Not too long ago Ca passed a law banning the .50 cal BMG round, does she know what calibers are most used in crimes?
Is she aware that a WWII era sniper rifles (that you can pick up for about $500, half of what a modern semi-auto pistol goes for) out ranges an assault rifle? Meaning if some guy is holed up in a clock tower Charlie Whittman style, until a police sniper shows up, or the SWAT team manages to storm his holdout, he can pick anyone off with impunity? The gun that took out JFK, I see that thing in almost every Big 5 and gunshop I've been to.
I feel bad for her loss, but that doesn't necessarily mean that she has the knowledge to pass reasonable gun laws.
the list of names is almost always about 80% the same. If we could get rid of them, we would get rid of lot our problems and a lot of wasted time in government.
A win against the NRA!
Chalk one up for the good guys.
Your country is very, very sick.
Thune introduces this fricking unnecessary bill, it gets voted down, and bingo! see? Obama is taking your guns away.
Thune's an idiot.
YEAs ---58
Alexander (R-TN)
Barrasso (R-WY)
Baucus (D-MT)
Bayh (D-IN)
Begich (D-AK)
Bennet (D-CO)
Bennett (R-UT)
Bond (R-MO)
Brownback (R-KS)
Bunning (R-KY)
Burr (R-NC)
Casey (D-PA)
Chambliss (R-GA)
Coburn (R-OK)
Cochran (R-MS)
Collins (R-ME)
Conrad (D-ND)
Corker (R-TN)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Crapo (R-ID)
DeMint (R-SC)
Dorgan (D-ND)
Ensign (R-NV)
Enzi (R-WY)
Feingold (D-WI)
Graham (R-SC)
Grassley (R-IA)
Gregg (R-NH)
Hagan (D-NC)
Hatch (R-UT)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Isakson (R-GA)
Johanns (R-NE)
Johnson (D-SD)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lincoln (D-AR)
Martinez (R-FL)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Nelson (D-NE)
Pryor (D-AR)
Reid (D-NV)
Risch (R-ID)
Roberts (R-KS)
Sessions (R-AL)
Shelby (R-AL)
Snowe (R-ME)
Tester (D-MT)
Thune (R-SD)
Udall (D-CO)
Udall (D-NM)
Vitter (R-LA)
Warner (D-VA)
Webb (D-VA)
Wicker (R-MS)
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_CON...
we need gun control laws
We need reasonable and effective gun control laws.
(And no I didn't support this bill, I don't want to be around some dumb-ass with a concealed handgun from a state with lax requirements to get a CCL)
When was that "full disclosure" line added? When was the author hired? Please respond.
Cliff Schecter (author of The Real McCain) has been a guest contributor to C&L many times in the last four years.
The disclosure shows up after the update, so I was confused. I apparently missed it the first time I read the post.
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