Rick Warren's vision of Christianity inspired by totalitarians
Bruce Wilson at Talk2Action has come up with easily the most disturbing audio clip of a Rick Warren sermon I've heard yet -- and that's saying something:
On April 17, 2005, at the southern California Anaheim Angels sports stadium thirty thousand Saddleback Church members, more than ever gathered in one spot, assembled to celebrate Saddleback's 25th anniversary and listened as Rick Warren announced his vision for the next 25 years of the church: the P.E.A.C.E. Plan.
Towards the close of his nearly one hour speech, Pastor Warren asked his followers to be as committed to Jesus as the young Nazi men and women who spelled out in mass formation with their bodies the words "Hitler, we are yours," in 1939 at the Munich Stadium, were committed to the Führer of the Third Reich, a major instigator of a World War that claimed 55 million lives. Rick Warren has exhorted Christians towards Nazi-like dedication in at least several public speeches and also during a one hour video recording of a talk by Warren, explaining his P.E.A.C.E. Plan, that is currently hosted on the official P.E.A.C.E. Plan website. A version of the anecdote can also be found on page 357 of Rick Warren's 1995 book The Purpose Driven Church, which sold over one million copies.
Here's what Warren says, exactly:
What is the vision for the next 25 years ? I'll tell you what it is.
It is the global expansion of the kingdom of God.
It is the total mobilization of his church.
And the third part is the goal of a radical devotion of every believer.
Now, I choose that word 'radical' intentionally, because only radicals change the world.
Everything great done in this world is done by passionate people.
Moderate people get moderately nothing done. And moderation will never slay the global giants. . ."
At which point he launches into a recitation of the achievements of past radicals -- notably, Hitler and Mao:
"In 1939, in a stadium much like this, in Munich Germany, they packed it out with young men and women in brown shirts, for a fanatical man standing behind a podium named Adolf Hitler, the personification of evil.
And in that stadium, those in brown shirts formed with their bodies a sign that said, in the whole stadium, "Hitler, we are yours."
And they nearly took the world.
Lenin once said, "give me 100 committed, totally committed men and I'll change the world." And, he nearly did.
A few years ago, they took the sayings of Chairman Mao, in China, put them in a little red book, and a group of young people committed them to memory and put it in their minds and they took that nation, the largest nation in the world by storm because they committed to memory the sayings of the Chairman Mao.
When I hear those kinds of stories, I think 'what would happen if American Christians, if world Christians, if just the Christians in this stadium, followers of Christ, would say 'Jesus, we are yours' ?
What kind of spiritual awakening would we have ?
What kind indeed.
It probably didn't cross Warren's mind, but the examples he cites are two of the world's most classic cases of totalitarianism. The products of their regimes -- beyond millions of people dead -- included the forced regimentation of thought and no press or free-speech protections whatsoever.
If that's the kind of fervent "radicalism" he admires, then we badly need to ought to take a long look at just what his agenda really is. And so ought Barack Obama.
Digby has more.
[H/t to Lisa Derrick at La Figa.]
Warren identfies with
http://www.ibiblio.org/wm/paint/auth/baldung/...
The ones on the other side.
"Great race, the Romans."
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
Hitchens said it best and I paraphrase...
If you were there at the crucifixion, you would be compelled by your morals to try to stop the murder and torture of a human being, but by doing that you would throw away the salvation of everyone...according to the twisted logic of christianity.
I love Roman history but they scare me. The Romans did not fuck around.
Since Mojo Nixon is invoked throughout this thread, lets get to why religion diverts us from who really got jesus mad....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=brL1AKdhLyQ&fe...
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
Sure loved them Jewish Swizzle Sticks.
Now with "gliding" action!
http://www.accoutrements.com/products/10746.html
anyone surprised by this didnt read the bible
19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in[a] the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you.
But all those begats made my eyes bleed.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IaE3EaQte78
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
i know from watching cn that the porta potties will be in short supply and the stench should be unbearable, but what will obummer use to help the spectators when they start vommiting profusely from this evangelico pricks invocation beseaching god to kill all of americas enemys, evangilicos call it tough love! obummer picks another winner!
for this guy?
It's all about $$$$$$ and to get it, you get these suckers to follow and give MONEY. TAX FREE MONEY.....pay as you follow,step right up and I'll lead you to heaven...give give give.
At least he didn't stand up and call them to Christ by shouting "OK everybody, after me. Give me a J."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nPmpUToWFpo&NR=1
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
A peddler of lies that imposes a sadistic and evil liturgy on people to hate and kill in the name of peace and love.
Hey Warren, guess what, the world is turning away from you.
The mythology of cannibalism and fear is done.
This is my favorite J.C. quote from John, I think 13:34....
"Love one another as I have loved you. For this ye shall be my disciples."
"Rev." Warren doesn't understand how to love everyone (including our Arab/Muslim brothers and sisters) and I seriously doubt he preaches this commandment from J.C. to his "followers".
It's far too radical an idea for him to contemplate, to love everyone just as Jesus did.
"Rev." Warren is a fraud and Obama is a tool of the Right Wing Wacko's to have invited him to kick off his presidency.
Rev. Wright gets being a disciple of J.C. Too bad Obama was a Judas and denied him.
"The US has an army of 90,000 soldiers in Afghanistan and is spending $100bn a year, but has still been unable to defeat 20,000-25,000 Taliban who receive no pay at all." - Patrick Cockburn
"It probably didn't cross Warren's mind, but the examples he cites are two of the world's most classic cases of totalitarianism. The products of their regimes -- beyond millions of people dead -- included the forced regimentation of thought and no press or free-speech protections whatsoever."
Scarier thought: It did cross his mind, and that's why he chose them.
wow, rick warren is one scary fuck
"what would happen if American Christians, if world Christians, if just the Christians in this stadium, followers of Christ, would say 'Jesus, we are yours"
not sure, but i can imagine it would entail some book burning, some atheist/agnostic lynching, some forced conversion of other religions and, possibly, a touch of genocide.
rick 'hitler was on to something' warren, obama's choice to give the invocation. nice.
but in this case it takes his rhetoric out context to say that he thinks his followers should emulate the actions of Hitler and Mao as too their atrocities. Dedication to a cause seems to be the message. Having said that it is so his style to draw attention through outrageousness. There are plenty of examples of moral determination. Gandhi comes immediately to mind
Politics is ugly
I don't think he's urging their atrocities. I think he's urging the single-minded uniformity of religious (and political) thought.
such atrocities David...
Weren't the nazis uniformly singular in their religious and political thought?
the 'turn your mind off, my loyal and unquestioning followers' form of social movement can only lead to trouble.
The most clear and frightening example of absolute brainwashing is the religious zealot. the zealot commits acts of unspeakable horror in the name of one deity or another, but it's ok if it's for teh jebus, allah, yahweh, or jehovah...fuck that, and fuck them!
Nazis were Christians. Hitler was the most famous Christian of all. The Nazis were supported by Christians around the world including George W. Bush's grandfather and grandmother. Granddad was fined by Congress for doing business with Hitler, and Grandma brought Hitler's Eugenics experts to America to promote the Nazi brand of racism. It if were not for Christians, the Nazis could never have come to power. If it were not for the anti-semitic hate spread and promoted by Christians, the holocaust would have never taken place. Christians are the most violent people on the planet--the stats prove it conclusively.
Didn't you just nail partisan politics, in the same sweep David? I see many posters on the "leftwing" (damn I hate those terms) that carry on the exact same way in supporting the Dems. Also see it in rightwing sites. Guess it proves, politics and religion are both lead by the same type of brainwashing people.
... cite him, not Adolf or Mao. Simple.
would do the Christian movement more good at the Inauguration.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gi7uGdCzKIA&fe...
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
would never demand such fanatical devotion and subordination. In his noodley goodness, he is much more wiggly and laid back.
Jesusfreaks never cease to amuse. Thanks for posting this!
I suggest you have never ventured close to the burning hellfire of XXX Chipotle Pesto communion wafers, my brutha.
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
The Habanero Holy Water...that shit REALLY burns!
I swear ta the GREAT and POWERFUL FSM...I wish these fucking pseudo-xtians would fuck off.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krb2OdQksMc
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
...in order to fuck.
God only had 1 son.
And his name is ELVIS!
Costello?
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
To quote Mojo Nixon: "Elvis is everywhere! Elvis is everything!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e_hkIN38qnY
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
Right on, I agree!
cheeseburger!
Ask, and ye shall git it...so sayeth the Big "E"
http://www.wikio.com/video/511914
tunage that is Mojo Nixon..this here's my favrit sawng o' his....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=auFz6AYB0h4
Since Mojo Nixon is invoked throughout this thread, lets get to why religion diverts us from who really got jesus mad....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=brL1AKdhLyQ&fe...
Reposted from earlier inj the thread (because it is that importatnt.)
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
;)
Good stuff man!
if I was addressing you. Economy is the size.
Stupid is the brand name. It is thee stupid that is larger than Family size but smaller than Whole Congregational.
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
Of all the examples he could choose...yeesh. Remember, Rick. There's a very short distance between religious fervor and megolamania.
http://loltheist.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/...
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
Where can I get one of those??
"You were made by God and for God, and until you understand that, life will never make sense."
[Rick Warren]
Please ignore that stem cell crap... :-P
Study the symptoms not the virus...
Scratch the surface of most of the evangelical organizations and you'll find varying concentrations of Dominionist Theology, the belief that it is the responsibility of the church to take over the world governments and institute a sweeping theocracy. They've been mouthing this stuff for years. That's why the Religious Right gets so rabidly bent out-of-shape when their plans collapse.
Warren's beliefs are pretty typical of the movement, militant evangelism couched behind a thin veil of respectability. These people scare me because I used to be one of them and I know how they think.
Check out the latest nefarious doings of Sally Kern. She's aligned w/the John Birch Society. W/the Okla. Leg. being majority Republican, they'll probably get pretty far w/some of their cockeyed ideas.
http://www.gossip-boy.com/Clouds_Over_America...
EXCERPT: Oklahoma State Representative Sally Kern will be giving her speech about the Homosexual Agenda at the 'Clouds Over America' conference on Friday, January 23rd, at 8:30 PM. [520 W. Main, Oklahoma City]
The two-day conference sees Paul Blair's 'Reclaim Oklahoma' joining forces with the John Birch Society to draw in patriots and religious leaders from across Oklahoma to detail this year's plans to "reclaim" Oklahoma for God. Called a "God, Guns, and Gays" call to action, approximately 275 will gather to discuss ways to bring their extremist Christian ideology into state and local government, libraries, and schools. Additional topics include Islamic Terrorism, Obama's Radical Influences, and the Founding of America -God's Sovereign Hand.
But he's backed himself into a corner.
If he cancels Rick Warren, the radical, rightwing Bible thumpers will call for a new Crusades with Barry as their target.
So, those of us in the LGBT community, have to accept being tossed under the bus once more. But Barry needs to understand: we will not be marginalized again. The stakes are high and we will hold his feet to the fire on the repeal of DADT and DOMA and full Federal benefits for Civil Unions.
If he doesn't deliver, all eyes will be on 2012.
... having a gay Episcopalian bishop participate.
Barry is better than the Old Coot. So, I'm happy. It could be worse.
Imagine if the Old Coot and McCandy were about to be sworn in as president and vice president? I would have to move off world.
From what I remember, when Jesus entered Jerusalem he did it on the back of a donkey not infront of an army. An army couldn't do what he was trying to accomplish.
http://www.starstore.com/acatalog/Shrek_2_Don...
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
the Palestinians and Jews both got the place promised to them by their Gods.
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
Christofascist. Heckuva way to start off your presidency, Barry. Hope you know what you're doing.
they'll be passing out the laced fla-vor-aid.
http://media.ebaumsworld.com/picture/csg290/A...
by associating with pastor Rick. Bring in someone else.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fKln1sQXvmo&fe...
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
Religious crackpots have always been quite the hoot. Also quite dangerous since blood sacrifice is the foundation of their doctrines. Gotta keep that blood flowing to appease the god or gods whichever it may be. With Father, Son & Holy Ghost one would think its plural gods. More than likely Brahma, Vishnu & Shiva underwent a name change. The Blood of Krishna became the blood of Christ.
I wonder how long it is before his flock drinks the grape cool aid that smells like wallnuts.
http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php...
Upchuck writes: "I wonder how long it is before his flock drinks the grape cool aid that smells like wallnuts."
If you're referring to cyanide, that smells like almonds, not walnuts.
Grown men wearing pretty dresses and fancy hats, convincing untold millions to believe in a "loving Gawd" that truly hates his own creation's guts enough to sit back and watch them kill each other in his/her name. I'll pass. Don't care what anyone's religion is, but it should be illegal to preach it constantly and it should be NO WHERE near politicians, or government. No putting hand on bible to "swear" your oaths. No more "God Bless ____" country.
I think we should swear Roman style, on our nuts.
Testament and testify both come from the root word testes.
And since I'm straight
I'll have to put my hands on a chicks crotch to swear.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
... that if your oath proved false, your nuts were forfeit.
Ann "bury me in a Y-Shaped casket" Coulter's?
He said a CHICKS crotch...
Good thing you didn't title your comment Ahim!!!
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
A round of applause for our dear friend ysbaddaden!!!
LOL!!
for transgender transgressions or gender insensitivity last we touched (METAPHORICALLY)
the golden paradox of Coulter.
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
Coulter has a Golden Paradox?
Kinky!
please stop second guessing obummers decisions wtf does this guy being picked by obummer say about his judgment, is he more stupid then hes given credit for? or does he just not give a crap who he uses to represent him! its allmost like hes just another bush but can give a great prewritten by someone elses speach!
Warren is actually using a variant of what is known now as the "Seven Mountains" Strategy--a literal NAR playbook on how to essentially set up a Joel's Army "fifth column" to take over the very foundations of modern society: (Sarah Palin is a one of the footsoldiers http://open.salon.com/content.php?cid=17604)
http://www.correntewire.com/rick_warrens_conn...
A key aspect of dominionist thought is a conviction that the Scripture gives the church a mandate to take dominion over this world socially and culturally before the return of Jesus Christ.
Mr. Warren's global plan is a strategy to realize a dominionist vision of churches, states, and corporations forming partnerships to bring about a new world order to make way for Christ's return by establishing a literal, physical kingdom of God on earth. In order to build this earthly kingdom, Mr. Warren plans marketplace ministries - business ventures with a veneer of missionary compassion that slip into a country in order to transform it systematically through the governmental, corporate, and social sectors. And that is why Mr. Warren calls himself a "stealth evangelist" - because he wishes to cloak his dominionist agenda, which is the establishment of an earthly kingdom that reflects his skewed vision of Christianity.
Don't be good merely to be better than others.
Actually so's sarah palin and her minister.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
the reins to Jesus when he comes back in a cloud of glory. Methinks it'll be damn difficult for them, w/their hubris. That's why I think these people believe in nothing, really, except themselves and their drive for power and control, not to mention money.
Crucify their dear and fluffy lord all over again...if he did come back.
.
To the pseudo-xtians...the real christ (assuming he actually exists and is not a mythological deity) would be considered a filthy hippy liberal, and therefore would automatically be considered the "enemy".
if an enviromentalist said the same thing as Rev. Rick at a conference. The veins on his forehead would be pulsating with righteous outrage.
How people that call themselves christians can be such zealots, no that is not the right thought. How they can break all of the teachings of jesus and still call themselves christians?
You cannot be a christian and be a republican.
Don't forget the Democrats! I'd say you can't be a Christian and a Democrat either!
Especially considering all the Congressional Democrats who are cheering on Israel's destruction of Gaza and the people there, plus the "Shock and Awe" in Iraq etc.
"The US has an army of 90,000 soldiers in Afghanistan and is spending $100bn a year, but has still been unable to defeat 20,000-25,000 Taliban who receive no pay at all." - Patrick Cockburn
the archives.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3H1YJCzjWeI
Any association with religion is bound to begat the kind of nonsense Warren, Wright, and many here have given us.
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
Will anything be enough for this disgrace to be turned away at the last minute? The choice of this criminal to talk about his pathetic view of god is enough to make me wish I hadn't voted for Obama and voted for a real candidate that has plans for the future of this country. I have to ask. Isn't allowing this schmuck a speaking engagement more likely to end the future of the country?
... and while it's fair to hold the opinion that 'we don't need Warren and his kind,' inviting him to the inaugural is a shrewd move.
He's gotta bless Obama and his term in office. The rapture-ready crowd whining about false birth certificates, secret Muslims, and Obama not being a 'real Christian' either have to join Warren in asking for God's blessing ... or be exposed as hypocrites.
Yeah, I know - it's kind of self-evident they're hypocrites already, and I'm tired of giving these asshats a fresh start, as if we've never heard their dominionist tripe or seen how deep the hatred runs in their veins.
I'm curious, if they wear asshats, wouldn't that make their heads sodomites?
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
But I'm sure there's an exception like IOKIYAR. (IOKIYAEC, perhaps?)
Shadowgm writes: "But I'm sure there's an exception like IOKIYAR. (IOKIYAEC, perhaps?)"
Acronym translation, please? Thanks!
Hate the sin but love the sinner.
http://joebrower.com/PHILE_PILE/PIX/FR/jlu_as...
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
Looks a tad too swarthy.
Everyone knows he's a swish:
http://www.funny-potato.com/blog/wp-content/u...
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
Not only can he ride the swells, but he comes with all the references you'll need for future posting pleasure on this thread if you catch my hint.
http://www.jesusoftheweek.com/
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LRIypcaIX4
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
ricky...words cannot express my gratitude for introducing me to that site...
unless you prefer the swarthy J.
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
no luck...:(
I linked.
But if you need a better web browser, try here.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xp9Gm-aRe5A&fe...
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
...the Obama Jesus on that site....he looks pretty good with long hair...!
"Egotism is the anesthetic that dulls the pain of Stupidity" - Frank Leahy
I got firefox...
That jebus is a wimp...this here's the real jebus...
a mans jebus!
http://media.jesusoftheweek.com/1328340.0.gif
weird...
http://images.hasbro.com/gijoe/images/history...
When the chief of the Supreme Court says the words, "Do you, Barack Hussein Obama, solemnly swear, or affirm, to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States of America?"
My understanding is that Obama has insisted his middle name be part of the swearing in.
Oh, boy. To be a fly on the walls of O'Reilly, Hannity, Coulter and even Rick Warren's brains after the name "Hussein" is spoken.
Ouch.
"The US has an army of 90,000 soldiers in Afghanistan and is spending $100bn a year, but has still been unable to defeat 20,000-25,000 Taliban who receive no pay at all." - Patrick Cockburn
Ya sure Abbybwood?
I thought it was customary.
i have a feeling that if jerry fallwell wasnt in hell at this very second servusing his masters member with an oral sermon that he would have been obummers first prick er sorry pick !
Could Ricky Warren be Jerry Falwell's devil child???
...there really is quite a resemblance.!
"Egotism is the anesthetic that dulls the pain of Stupidity" - Frank Leahy
Which one's the mother?
http://www.kristinawright.com/Lilith.jpg
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
They both have the same gut and chin.
I wouldn't know; I can't seem to get my eyes past her poon.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
"We're a nation of laws, but the good thing about America, is that laws reside in the people and people can change the laws."
[Rick Warren]
I had never heard of Mr. Warren until recently. I'm glad he has his intentions exposed for the world too see.
How is this for projection...
Humility is not thinking less of yourself, it's thinking of yourself less.
[Rick Warren]
"Liberals who have actually read the Bible rationalize their adherence
to Christianity by saying that the Bible doesn't really mean what it
says. In calling themselves Christians, they are appropriating a
hallowed name and applying it to a made-up religion of their own."
[C. W. Dalton, "The Right Brain and Religion"]
Study the symptoms not the virus...
... selfless acts performed in the name of God and mindless devotion to a heavily-commercialized version of that same deity.
IMHO, God would much rather individuals take a moment in the day to do something in keeping with Christ's teachings than gather in a throng to worship some lard-arsed hypocrite telling them that God wants an army of unquestioning zealots.
I for one admire your individual view and caring intent. At the same time I believe it comes naturally, not unlike the brave individuals involved in the NY. airplane dilemma yesterday. Caring comes naturally in my opinion, especially when there is no time too think.
Study the symptoms not the virus...
The union workers who grabbed their tools and said, "Let's get to work," as they left their construction sites and marched to the crash site weren't thinking "Gosh, this'll get me into heaven for sure!"
I believe God puts us in places where we can be of assistance to others. But we can't see the task, or even necessarily know that we've accomplished it - we do what we are taught, and hopefully, that's something positive and caring.
Or, if you choose, we're just like any other particle in a random universe. We collide, impart a bit of energy to another particle, and move on. Particles may bond, or they may never cross paths again, but it's not anything the individual particle can grasp.
A Teamster myself, I'm not sure how many of them were "union workers", or the bearing it has on the rescue?
I agree, "We do what we are taught", though I would [include], learn as well.
"Science is bad" Religio-Fascist thought police at work
http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/293.html
Study the symptoms not the virus...
If the Romans used Teamsters to crucify Christ, he'd still be alive.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
10-4 :-P
Study the symptoms not the virus...
Since Mojo Nixon is invoked throughout this thread, lets get to why religion diverts us from who really got jesus mad....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=brL1AKdhLyQ&fe...
Reposted from earlier in the thread.
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
What fantastic role models! Hitler, Lenin, Mao! Now THAT sends a clear message and communicates a real Utopian vision for the future!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-tJKP1bWFw&fe...
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
but how many stations of the cross will we pass along the way.
I have that middle aged male prostate thing.
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
... the old Star Trek episode 'Patterns of Force,' where Kirk goes to find his old history teacher, John Gill. But when they arrive, they find themselves caught in a war between two planets, and Gill is apparently the Furher.
It later turns out that Gill wanted to emulate the efficiency of Hitler's Germany, and one of his subordinates drugged Gill and took the place over.
Just because Emperor Shih Huang-Tse built the Great Wall of China doesn't mean I want to emulate his work ethic or building code (slave labor, with the bodies of slaves who collapsed mixed in with the clay).
Even as an agnostic I can easily understand Warren's point: "These bastards are out there using devotion for evil — imagine what we could do if we could harness it for good."
That's all he's saying and he's making a completely valid — if cliche — point. I personally would love to see thousands of Americans gather together and say "World peace, we are yours!" Or "Global Warming — you're on notice!" Imagine a stadium full of people committed to turning around Bush's morally bankrupt foreign policies. Oh, wait — you don't have to imagine it. It just happened. And yeah, sure he could have cited Gandhi, but if your rhetorical device of choice is counter-example, dropping in a parallel example is just confusing.
If you're not cool with bible-thumping hypocrites, that's fine, but associating ANYONE with Nazis just because he used them as a COUNTER-EXAMPLE is absurd.
Don't they make beer out of Barleymash?
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
Why yes, they do! Just another thing to love about me. :-)
That we can boil you, stuff you in a keg for several months and you'll be universally loved when we finally get around to pouring you out?
"Beer is proof that God wants us to be happy."
-- Benjamin Franklin
Once again, the problem with these remarks is the totalitarianism, not the Nazism per se. It's about getting everyone to adhere to the same belief system.
Look, the Nazis and the Maoists believed they were forces for good, too. And look what happened.
...he was talking about taking the kind of commitment that had been harnessed by murderous totalitarians and using it on behalf of Christianiaty.
But it still is a distinctly creepy metaphor.
but it doesn't make him a Nazi or suggest he's "inspired" by totalitarians.
Warren wants to harness such...fervor for xtianity...
Now...looking at how xtians in this country have behaved over our history, and especially in the last 8 years. I would say, that is exactly the LAST fucking thing the world needs right now, a bunch of glassy-eyed, AMERICAN bible thumpers spreadin the "good word". Yeah...GREAT fuckin idea Warren, you god damn cocksmack! Here's a an idea for ya...keep your damn religion and your deity to your fuckin selves!
Nobody, ESCPECIALLY the good folks that populate places OTHER than the US need or want American style religion. SOme here don't even want that shit!
Keep your holier than thou lard asses at home, you fucking FUCKS!
The world would be a better place without you assholes proselytizing the fuckin planet...have FAITH in that.
Fuckin sheep.
GAAAAAAAAAH!
Don't hold back, tell us what you really feel:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nf6wZFMWJeU
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
ALL denominations are and have been a cancer on civilization since the first snake oil salesman claimed to hear "God's" voice on a desolate mountaintop or from a talking burning bush.
Testify brutha!
Seriously though...I couldn't agree more.
George Carlin observed, it's all about the money. Sayeth Carlin: God is all seeing, all knowing, all caring, all powerful, all loving, all things to all people, but he's always broke; He just can't handle money.
Carlin was friggin awesome...
Napoleon almost conquered Europe. Imagine what we could do with that kind of military expertise ...
No, that's not right.
Genghis Khan almost conquered Europe. One of his grandsons ruled China. If only we could ride into town and say, 'submit or die!' for Christ. Yeah!
No, that's not right, either.
What kind of commitment are you thinking of? Making the trains run on time? While I don't dispute that God is capable of taking our worst moments and building something out of the wreckage, I don't harbor any illusions about humans taking that same wreckage and repeating their mistakes, all the while patting themselves on the back for their 'moral clarity.'
Hitler blamed the Jews. Evangelicals blame the gays. And the pagans. And the secular progressive liberal crowd. How is this anything but a redress of Hitler's methodology?
And if I really wanted to dedicate myself and my life's work to God, the path doesn't begin by kneeling before Rick Warren or selling my soul to impress a bunch of fearmongering holier-than-thou hypocrites who think they're all going to hop on some spiritual express line to Jesusville while the fruits of their labor - Armageddon - roil down below.
With these evangicals, it is all about money, power, prestige, dominance. Oh, but I hear, Rick Warren is different, he gives 99 percent of his proceeds back to the church and charities. The one percent he lives on is more than likely $150K or better. He lives in a mansion. He travels the world. He has the power. Now he wants to the change the world.
Americans are sheep..baaa, baaa. Just be careful he doesn't lead you off a cliff you powerless sheep.
Our society won't change unless people take their power back from these idiot people. Listen people of the United States, you are not powerless, people like Warren, Rush, Hannity, ..these people don't know anymore than you do. They tell you untruths and you believe. They don't make sense and either do you if you continue to follow their path.
Like all major religions there are the "ying and the yangs". Christianity is no different. In the Christian faith you have "two" kinds of Christians. 1) The "Demonic" Christian: Believes in "serving two masters" ie: God and a devil. They lead with fear of "the end of the world". The "devil" runs their life and fear. They don't live for "the day" they project fear for the future. Hitler used "demonic"Christianity on his public. They "twist" the "Word", not to encourage but to control. Look how Joseph Smith took over the Mormons, with fear.(I know this as a life experience).
2) The "Messanic" Christian: Lives with "love one another and worship God;"the truth". Serves only one master, be it Christ or God, usually seen to be the same. They live for the day and "don't seek the signs" but are "aware". Their belief in a "devil" is not the supreme evil the "Demonic" Christians preach of, but the "devil" is "mankind" himself. You see, the Messanic Christian lives by "truth" as the greatest, immaculate concept called God. Men have destroyed this planet, not devils...unless they are "men".
This is Rick Warrens problem...He believes more in a Devil than God. Christ said"you cannot serve two masters". This means you can't believe 100% in God and believe in a devil. You can't serve either well. I've seen God...a flower, a baby...For evil I've only seen "men" do bad deeds then say...."the devil made me do it".....
Barrack should keep his eyes open and his sheild up with Warren.
http://th258.photobucket.com/albums/hh263/Gho...
Awesome words, going to save your post. Thank you for sharing.
Something I like to read while on the toilet:
M.A. Persinger's Feelings of past lives as expected perturbations within the neurocognitive processes that generate the sense of self: contributions from limbic lability and vectorial hemisphericity. Perceptual and Motor Skills,
1996, 83, 1107-1121.?
I'd love to get my hands on a copy of Phantasmagoriana et la Recuel Phantomes, Esprit, Revenans etc etc etc.
But I guess I'll have to stick with Captain Underpants and the Big, Bad Battle of the Bionic Booger Boy Part 2: The Revenge of the Ridiculous Robo-Boogers.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
the Goosy Grow 4000 in your left while you peruse the Poop O Rama's.
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
What's the suprise at Nazis calling for more people to be Nazis?
WWHD?
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
limbic lability in the name of tart reform. Or was that lymnic liability.
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
http://www.emoware.org/photos/hitler-rape.jpg
http://kindlerama.com/wp-content/uploads/2008...
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
a Tickle me Emo a few Christmases back but they were out of stock.
He's old enough for this one now.
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
Tickle Me Elmos have proven so popular these are coming out with the same option:
Emailing: 0231-7_lg
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
So maybe the Gerbil Jogger 2000 will have to do.
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
http://blog.indecision2008.com/2008/10/09/of-...
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
in the Wendy's Pop Up ad on that page to point spasmodically at their crotch, and if so, is it some warning about STDs?
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
I am so completely disappointed in Obama's choice to be connected so closely to this man. I can't say that I feel I will forgive him for it - he hurts too many people with this connection. And I actually don't care if his reasons ARE completely cynical in their own way.
*
Reverends Warren and Wright are just in the "W" section of Obama's little black book of naughty pastors there is no telling how many people he will alienate before he gets to Malcolm X or Pastor Zamboni.
"I mean Romney is the most conservative on illegal immigration and I don't think Ronald Reagan could get elected in California today."
Ann "Clipped" Coulter
I can't begin to tell you how NOT new this is, and how completely UNshocking it is. i have been to numerous churches and the Pastors all say the same thing about the vision of God for this nation and the world. They all say "if only christians had the same amount of dedication" as the 3rd Reich, or Mao's followers, or the Terminator (i'm not kidding).
It's not new, and i'm not shocked, surprised or the least bit disturbed by the fact that yet another pastor said the same thing as so many others.
It has never been indicated that this man will have the batphone to the president or any other kind of connection after the inauguration. He might get an interview or two, but i doubt it. He's not worth fearing. If he ever becomes so, i'll be the first to eat my words, but don't bet on it.
If it behooves Christians to find it meet and proper to aspire to Hitlerian fanatacism wouldn't Jesus have gassed himself?
Gefilte fish and matzoh balls will do it.
Do Matzohs sing soprano?
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
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