Arlen Specter calls Chuck Grassley on cell phone about his "death to Grandma lies" on health care. Twitter war follows
By John Amato Friday Aug 14, 2009 12:00pm
I went to the Arlen Specter/Joe Sestak Q&A panel today at Netroots Nation that was led by our own Susie Madrak. Specter answered questions about why we should trust him since he switched parties and he made his case. He's a skilled politician and did a pretty good job trying to defend his lefty creds. We didn't act like the Beckerwocky teabaggers do and he was treated with dignity, even if most of the audience supports Joe.
When he was questioned about Chuck Grassley's ""We should not have a government program that determines if you're going to pull the plug on grandma" he adamantly said Grassley was wrong and he said he would speak to him later today. I yelled out "call him now!" and several other audience members also yelled the same thing. I waved my phone and said, "You can use my cell phone!" He said he would call him right away.
I followed him to the back of the arena and a bunch of us surrounded him as he made good on his promise. He tried to reach Grassley, but got no answer. As he was leaving, I was able to ask Specter if President Obama should kick Grassley out of the negotiating position he has for spreading egregious statements and falsehoods about health care.
Specter said that we shouldn't kick Grassley out of the Finance committee because senators are wrong at times, but he promised to stay after Grassley. I think Obama should have Baucus kick him out of the negotiating process because he's violated his duty by spreading lies about a health care bill he's trying to legislate over.
UPDATE:
John Amato: Senator, one more quick question. I'm John Amato of CrooksandLiars. Does Senator Grassley's irresponsible statements and the fact that he's on the committee that's negotiating for this health care bill, doesn't that disqualify him, in other words, shouldn't Obama say, why should I even have him at the table if he's going to make such outrageous statements?
Specter: Does it disqualify him, no. When he made that statement, it's wrong. If you disqualified every Senator who is wrong about something, there wouldn't be any Senators.OK?..
Well, now Specter and Grassley are involved in a Twitter war:
Well, Grassley never picked up. So Specter tweeted all about it.
And Grassley is not pleased.
And in a narrow sense, Grassley's right. He didn't use the term "death boards" or "death panels." He said "There is some fear because in the House bill, there is counseling for end-of-life. And from that standpoint, you have every right to fear.... We should not have a government program that determines if you're going to pull the plug on grandma."
But in the broader sense, Specter's got Grassley pegged.
Citizen journalism rocks! We proved that once again.
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http://i538.photobucket.com/albums/ff347/bilb...
I simply cannot believe this is how our senators spend their time. It speaks volumes about them and all of DC. What a bunch of babies.
It's funny though.
*
except for the *
};)>
So....twat's a new word? I mean, another meaning, to have twittered? It's OK to say twat again!
Always has been for me as in The Book of the Am Tuat.
By him running on the democrat ticket is how the Blue dogs CAME to BE..
Emanuel supports running republicans on the democrat ticket... I wonder why Emanuel is doing this... Must be against the progressive democrats only answer there could be..
This is why the democrat party is falling apart and the republicans are still passing their policies..
The problem with this whole war of words is that educated and enlightened people will not sink to the levels of stupidity necessary to argue with the assinie arguements of their opponent.
Is Obama bending over backwards to please the republicans and let them insert their BS into the democrats policies which destroys any bill ,, democrats try to past..
There is no bi-partisan with the right wing republicans.. Republicans after 8 years their fear tactics with no interruption of their control and criminal destruction of our country ,, they reject democrats winning the election and they want their their same BS..
...I have a thought about that. Just objectively speaking, maybe this is one of the things he wants to leave as his legacy. I mean, I imagine most politicians, and especially presidents, want to leave a legacy of some sort. They spend time building it, nurturing it, planning for it, protecting it and promoting it. I don't think this is the worst thing in the world; maybe a tad egotistical, but without planning or caring about what your life's work looks like, not as much gets done? Anyway! Some people want to be 'war presidents' (jeebus christo, for 8 years I wanted to slap that monkey and say, "It's WARTIME PRESIDENT. At least say it correctly!"). Perhaps part of what Obama wants to leave behind is a record of success that was brought about in large part with bipartisan support. Seriously: a united Congress and by extension a united America.
Now, back to being NON-objective, I actually sort of like that idea. Better than being a war-monger or some sort of partisan bully.
Politicians in general and Republicans in particular, parse their words very carefully.
Grassley, as he's tried all along, was trying to have it both ways politically.
His statement left him room to deny deny deny, while at the same time playing to the right wing nutcase base of his local constituency.
They would be wise to communicate like adults and maybe take some lessons from the real adult who just spoke at a town hall meeting just about three minutes ago. I know there is ample criticism of the President here but if you listened to his town hall speech and the way he was able to answer the questions, I don't think you could have found a better person to do that job.
This playing with words is childish. We all know exactly what Grassley said and why he said it. He played into the hands of the stupid and those determined to try to kill this whole reform bill. He's playing to the republican base and he sure as hell knows it.
..and Grassley knew the issue was imflammatory. But in spite of what he didn't say, he did say "..you're going to pull the plug on grandma" and that is false, wrong, mean and evil. And he should be removed from the committee for it.
He showed his true colors so now how the hell can he compromise or negotiate in good faith? Answer, he can't. He really should have his butt kicked as a way of removing him.
Those who are not lying strive to clarify issues. Weasel, bribee, dishonest asshole, C Street/Family member, all describe Grassely. No one will ever accuse him of being a rocket surgeon, though.
I'm not sure I know what a rocket surgeon does, but I'm pretty sure Grassley can't do it.
You got the gist. Struck me funny first time I heard it. Makes people look at you funny when you say it to their faces.
I looked at you funny when you said it on my screen. :)
said it. Anyone?
kind of the "if you didn't see me do it, it didn't happen" denial. All criminals use it.
I see you called "weasel" before I did. It is definitely a form of lying. It's well-known in the Washington D.C. Village, but I suspect a lot of them are so compromised that they think it is a normal mode of thought and communication and isn't lying at all.
Cellphones are not secure
It's what got eye-of-newt in trouble with an ethics charge.
Although he tried to blame Joe Citizen for picking it up accidentally on his car radio and turning it in.
i shouldn't have believed my lying eyes and ears.
what a disingenuous, lying prck.
to play around with semantics until they get want they want. They do it because it distracts and it works. The real issue isn't wether or not Specter or Grassley used "board" or "panel" but if that becomes the new issue than Grassley wins.
And why the fuck are they Tweetering like high school girls? They're the richest and most powerful men in the world!
If Twitter existed in WW2:
Churchill: Just called Hitler a Nazi.
FDR: Daaaaaammn, dude!
Hitler: Say "hello" to my V2 rocket program, oh, no, I didn't just go there!
Twittering is the perfect melding of politics and media: pointless and irrelevant.
There is just something that sounds so wrong when you hear that one Senator "tweeted" to another Senator about something as serious as health care reform bill. Especially since the words are there for anyone to read and they use the cool new spelling to get their message across.
phone. So 7th grade. The other day, Alice called them "twittering twats." She's been proven correct, yet again.
I think that they think if they "tweet" they are as cool as 7th graders.
I remember not so very long ago John McCain stood on the Senate floor and told about how he and another senator had been "tweeting" about something. It just sounded so insane. He could as easily have just said they were discussing something, but he seemed to want to alert the world that he was now hep and totally with it.
You made me think of this:
Dr Evil/McCain
"I'm with it. I'm hip. Tuckaduckaducka....Give daddy a hug!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UeS-Xb5u4-U
Obama should kick out Baucus.
we should demand that. Grassely made a "mistake?" Is that what lying and fear mongering is called in DC? That explains a lot.
This morning on teevee everyone was talking about Michael Vick being signed by the Eagles and several people said what Vick did to the dogs was a "mistake". Vick just made a mistake when he killed dogs in horrible ways.
elsewhere is defined as "the appearance of impropriety." In all other places, it is defined as having a vested interest in something that you benefit from. WTF is either Grassely or Baucus doing working the health insurance reform matter? This whole thing is so glaringly farcical that I want to stand on my front porch and scream about it. I have a slogan: If you can't do it right, don't do it at all. We are going to get nothing but screwed.
NEWS FLASH: Lawrence O'Donnell just made himself the biggest hero to our point of view that anyone ever has. I am in absolute love. No "pea bodies" on him. Do NOT miss the rerun of "Hardball" if you missed the first showing.
OMG. I cannot believe what I just saw. Culberson is an inept tool. All you Texans, who IS this guy? We all asked for it, and we got it. Someone got called out right to their face. Or should I say "faces."
while making a second definition of conflict of interest which is having a vested interest and benefiting from a process that you form and control. Abramoff is in jail. These two crooks and liars aren't. Why is that? Who is worse?
On the secret White House deals with big pharma…
And a very good understanding of what is at play.
Amy Goodman with RN here
read the entire interview here
leads me to believe that the movie "Idiocracy" was a documentary not a comedy.
...practically deserves a Nobel Prize.
Nitpicking over the exact wording of a statement when the meaning of the statement is perfectly clear.
to give back the MILLIONS OF FUCKING DOLLARS they have BOTH scarfed up from the health insurance parasites to buy their support for the status quo...
It took a while to get it processed, but it's up now so check it out at the top of the post now...:-)
I kinda wanted to ring him up....
Nice job John. Spector might as well have said "If you disqualified every senator for doing something illegal, there wouldn't be any senators."
What a wonderful world that would be.
I found this little jewel over at Kos
CHUCK GRASSLEY (Aug 13): If I had not been at the table, there would have been a bill through the committee the week of June 22, and it would have been through the Senate by now because there's sixty Democrats.
So old chuck is taking credit for holding this bill up and not letting it pass. And they are working with him because .....?
They, being Obama and his 'Democrats', are working with him, because they are all on the same side.
The side of the Corporations.
Amy Goodman with RN here
......as long as "those in charge", whomever they might be, all this man to continue doing what he is doing, then I have lost all respect (what little I had) , for those in charge!! I'm sick and tired of watching them play with people's lives, like we are insects they can just swat around at their pleasure. Enough already!!
keep grassley out of the vote process for health care cost reform. he's misinforming/lying to the public.
Just in case anyone is wondering where the tow hall protesters learned their manners.
Watch this clip and pass it on.
http://progressnotcongress.org/?p=2540
No, Grassley didn't use those exact words...he just played the politician's favorite game: use an euphemism so you can CYA.
But you better bet everyone at his rally knew what he was calling it....
Next Specter twitter:
"Chuck, if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, it's a "death board"
Now that most congressmen have staked out their positions, Obama is coming out swinging:
"We are held hostage at any given moment by health insurance companies that deny coverage or drop coverage or charge fees that people can't afford," Obama told a crowd of some 1,000 people in Montana.
"It's wrong. It's bankrupting families. It's bankrupting businesses. And we are going to fix it when we pass health insurance reform this year," he said.
Finally! It's not health care reform - it's health insurance reform!
...that the O-man might truly be playing chess.
Ohhhh, I hope so. I am not totally sold yet, but it's still better than what would have been the Republican alternative.
hero status with me for the day.
Awesome work.
"Specter's got Grassley pegged."
In the strictest sense, which is the use of truth, liberals who claimed Grassley was saying the provision of death panels was in the bill are as guilty of distortion as anyone on the right. And many have made that claim.
If we are going to attack what the right is doing as wrong, we should not similarly raise false claims.
What Grassley said was despicable pandering. And the way he has conducted himself demonstrates a lack of good faith as a negotiator. But he said we should not have "a government program that determines if you are going to pull the plug on grandma." Does anyone want to argue that we should?
question. He wants you to assume that there is going to be a clause that pulls the plug on Grandma, and that he is against it? See?
is to argue that there should be a death panel.
You correctly characterize Grassley as begging the question. However, you cannot say "he wants you to..." do anything because that would require you to know something about his intentions that I doubt you could possible know.
Grassley explained clearly why some thought there was a death panel. Then he said people should be afraid. Then he said there should not be such a panel. That is pandering. It is not spreading a falsehood about what is in the bill. If we are going to argue against falsehoods and distortions we should be careful not to use them ourselves.
I actually think Obama made a mistake by not beating Grassley to the punch. The minute this distortion began to get traction he should have said if such a provision was proposed he would veto the bill if it remained in the bill when it got to his desk. Then he gets the credit and the right is left to sputter about something else.
If you wait for proof positive--beyond all doubt--you'll never be able to rebut anything they say. You are trying to play fair with scoundrels. Good luck with that. When I said "I'll bite," I meant to continue the discussion, not to argue the point about the "death panels." Bad choice of words from me. I do not agree with your use of the word, "pandering." He is implying that death panels are included in the bill. "Pander" means to solicit, to procure. It is usually used in conjunction with someone producing persons for sexual purposes. If you know something about Grassely that I don't, do tell. BTW, that provision for death panels is not in the proposed and current version of the bill. Go here if you want to read it: http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h3200/show
I want Grandma to know she has a right to say don't plug me in, at all. In the first place.
There is an enormous difference.
I lived through this with both of my parents. Neither wanted to be on a ventilator in a vegetative state.
Which, of course, you can do for a long time, until your accounts are all drained and then…
Both of them passed peacefully without the family needing to address those horrible choices.
Not everyone is so lucky.
politician... he emulates everything that's despicable about the word politician!
and am totally mesmerized by the Health Care debate. It's somewhat akin to witnessing the put-down of the uprising in Iran, the lies and misdirection offered by the right are waaayyy too Amedinejad for my liking. They readily compare folks to Hitler/fascists...perhaps it's time somebody compared them to the Old Regime desperately clinging to any semblance of power, even as it dissolves in front of them. I don't know if this is an appropriate forum to discuss this, but I am sickened to see that such closed-minded, intellectually challenged folk are gaining ground! What was the notation about underestimating the stupidity of the American people? I don't know why I am so attracted to this and other (similar) sites...I suppose it's to reinforce the notion that there is SOME hope, that perhaps you folks can get it together enough to out-smart the deniers of human progress--much like Islam prefers the 5th century, America likes the 50's, with its segregation/barefoot&pregnant/god fearing ideology...simpler times when you could shoot a n**** without penalty.
Current American turmoil is not that far from the upset in Muslim countries, with backward thinkers resisting change at all costs.
It is truly a shame that sites as this, Daily Beast/HuffPost etc are preaching to the choir. Your readers know...as much as the Fox followers know, thing's ain't right. Something is needed to cruise up the middle to hold a mirror to the right, so they can be justifiably disgusted with themselves. Hollywood needs to jump in there and polish that mirror...some 'A' list actors portraying lying fucks manipulating the message...
Canada! Who needs Hollywood.
not to feel slightly superior. We don't have armed thugs railing against government, they stick to shooting folks on the basketball courts. What little anger we have is directed at government waste...
myself if I were Canadian.
as some Freudian revelation, but perhaps it is indicative of living next to chest-thumping patriots chanting YouEssAyy at every opportunity.
was a lowly Canadian.
A voice of intelligence.
Grassley has learned his deniability well in D.C.; he said "death panel" without saying it and then tries to squirm out of it. This defines "weaseling". We ought to forgive him, though. All he did was frighten old people with their plug being pulled, in order to score a political point. Don't we all do that? What a great guy.*
*sarcasm alert
So, the Huffington Post reports.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/14/gras...
Death panels aside, wadda flip-flopper.
We have spent weeks arguing over whether the provision in the bill is a death panel and why the provision that is distorted is a good provision. We should have said, "well if there is a death panel, it should be out of the bill." And then the provision should have been removed. It can always be rewritten and reinserted.
... we have some ammo on credibility, and believability in the upcoming 2010 elections. We got lied into wasting $1 trillion over Iraq over several years, and now, we're being lied into spending maybe $600B/year more on health than could be otherwise. It'll be nice to point out the biggest liars. The health care issue isn't going away because the increasing chunk of change being spent on it is coming out of everyone's standard of living.
meaningful health care reform now.
Grassley is one of the Republicans in the "gang of 6", Max Baucus, is the heavily lobbied lead Democrat Senator, and we see Harold and Louise advertising for passage, and Obama's deals with big pharmaceutical companies, for some reason, this is change that I'm having a hard time believing in.
This article sums it up....
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-brenner...
what fabrication would that be....asshole
Forcing Senator Magic Bullet to walk the walk instead of his usual just talking the talk.
I am so proud to be a part of this web site, a small part but apart none the less. Very good job to John and Susie.
can we change the constitution and add the following into election qualifications for a senator?
if as senator, one ever knowingly says something wrong, that would disqualify one from holding office
we could clean up the senate...lickity split
Allowing doctors to be paid for the time they spend giving advice on right to life information? If that's the case, why shouldn't they? Seniors are not stupid. Most have the information at hand and are very understanding of the importance of good solid information. They ask the questions to doctors during visits and doctors should be paid for the information they give. Do we pay a lawyer for a will? The egg heads out there like Palin need to shut up and get out of the way. Health care is a necessary reform. We live in the twenty first century. If Glenn Beck and Sarah Palin want to live in the leave it to beaver fantasy world I got news...it doesn't exist and never did.
You would think that these reichwingers were sane.
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