Romney May Have Paid Zero Taxes In 2009
I spent some time yesterday going through Willard's 2010 return and 2011 estimates of his taxes, and I agree with David Shuster in this segment. There's every possibility that the Romneys paid no income taxes at all in 2009 and possibly also in 2008. Here's why, starting at about 1:08 in the video above:
SHUSTER: Actually, Governor, if you think a limited release is going to put this issue behind you, you're politically tone-deaf. First, your 2010 return indicates you paid a rate of 13.9 percent. Furthermore, it suggests you paid far lower than that in 2009. You see, the 2010 return reveals you carried over $4.9 million dollars in losses from the previous year. That means you paid no taxes on capital gains in 2009, including no taxes on your carried interest.
So how much did you pay in 2009? Zero? How close to zero was it, Governor? Or how about the 2008 year, where the investment market first crashed?
Taxpayers are limited on the amount of capital losses they can use to offset income. In a year with low capital gains, high capital losses can offset the amount of those gains for a net-zero result. Any losses not used are carried forward to the following year, where they can be used there. The bottom line on Romney's tax return is that he likely paid minimal taxes in 2009, since his charitable deductions probably offset any speaker's fees, dividends and interest he was paid. I'm guessing he paid payroll tax on the speaker's fees up to the cap, and that is about it. Must be pretty nice, eh? Perhaps that's why Ann Romney thinks it's unfortunate that he had to release even 2010, since she's concerned about people knowing how successful he is.
Willard's financial disclosures also indicate he profited greatly from foreclosures in Florida, which would certainly explain his desire to let the housing market fall into the tank while he reaped the benefits, both tax-wise and personally.
There's been a lot of spin from Romney on these tax returns, and particularly on the fact that his income is comprised mostly of "carried interest". But that, too, is all smoke and mirrors. He claims that carried interest payments are already taxed at corporate rates. The problem with that, as we all know, is that very, very few corporations pay the full corporate tax rate of 35 percent. In fact, many corporations have an effective tax rate of zero or even negative rates. There is no reason to expect some specific reason for Romney's carried interest payments to be from companies that pay the full corporate rate.
All of this is legal. Even Romney's Swiss bank account is legal. But it speaks to the larger question of whether or not anyone who has never known what it's like to wonder if the kids will eat or the mortgage will be paid can possibly formulate tax policy that would make a lick of sense for anyone but the 1 percent. Since Romney has not exactly demonstrated an aptitude for empathy, I'm guessing not.
If I'm wrong about this, I'd suggest the Romney campaign release a few more years' tax returns. Let's see if he has ever worried about "putting food on his family." Odds, anyone?
There is a very real possibility that there are years following the Bush tax cuts that Romney had a tax bill of zero, just like GE.
Obama's right. At some point we need to kick the lobbyists out of Congress and pass a minimum alternative tax of 30% for individuals and corporations worth more than 250K. The end.
The odd thing is once the lobbyists and tax attorneys are unemployed, congress might do something about unemployment! And many corporations (as Elizabeth Warren pointed out on The Daily Show) will actually SAVE money to just pay the tax rather than the lobbyists.
How would a minimum INCOME tax based on a person's NET WORTH work out well? We should just stop treating capital gains differently than earned income. Or start taxing it at higher rates.
exactly, as i state in my post below. capital gains has long ceased being a reward for actual investment, and more a way to skim profits.
Aren't the returns on investment reward enough? Why do we need to encourage investment even more with tax dollars?
is not investment. It's casino money.
"Parachutes are allowed in checked or carry-on baggage, but may not be worn in flight."
---Southwest Airlines
You can use them to offset gains, dollar for dollar. And if you have no gains, you can carry the loss and deduct 3K per year from the last line, "This is your taxable income" line, for a total of 30K for no more than 10 years. That's how it was back in the day, the 1990s. I don't know if that's changed at all.
me-oww!
What the hell does he do with all that money!
I guess one can really be OCCUPIED spending
your time in your counting house counting it!
or a church (in this instance) and write it off, if money from the church goes to fund political objectives - as what happened pertaining to Prop. 8?
That would certainly be a good question to ask during the presidential debates, once Mitt emerges as a weakened candidate from the GOP bloodbath.
:o)
When I kept seeing Catholic churches in Missouri putting up signs and sponsoring commercials and ads opposing a stem cell research bill (or something like that) I checked with the IRS. I assumed that a not-for-profit couldn't do that.
Turns out that a NFP can advocate for "issues" but not candidates. So something like the Missouri ballot initiative, or the California Prop. 8 would be fair game. (This is probably a gross oversimplification, do not rely on this as tax advice since it isn't.)
Now I understand that all kinds of NFPs would have opinions on varieties of political issues, and that's OK. But if I ruled the world, I'd force them to keep separate books for political purposes vs. general stuff. Donors could specify how much went to general operations and how much went to advocacy, and advocacy wouldn't be tax deductible.
Perhaps this would be too complicated in an already complex tax code. In that case, I'd eliminate tax exempt status for any group practicing any form of political advocacy.
But I don't rule the world, so none of that matters.
I agree with you by the way. If money is used to influence policies then it shouldn't be tax exempt.
Biff Romney has big big problems . Newt going nuclear on Biff ... what a surprise , I thought Gingrich was above that sort of thing . LOL . This is fun !
Insanity , it is what it is , there is no understanding it .
. . . the guy didn't want to release his tax returns.
They are going to be the gift that keeps on giving, right up to November.
The Republicons , CU , the sabotaged Supreme court , the many supposed Democrats who aren't ? Goooood luck . The corporations thinking long term ? Hell no , it's make every nickle they can today no matter the consequences , to hell with tomorrow , we just witnessed that ( once again ) , is what caused the world wide economic meltdown , what's worse is that nothing has changed . Their grip on power , on Congress , even on State Government , it is as strong as ever . Look at the Walker recall , he still leads in the polls against anyone they put up against him ! That's another problem , a big one , besides the $ in politics consider our electorate , as ignorant and dumb as could possibly be .
Insanity , it is what it is , there is no understanding it .
While 45% of the American population are beyond stupid, they got almost 1.2 million signatures to recall the prick Walker.
Considering that he only got 1.2 million votes when he was elected in a massive GOP year, and take into consideration that an extremely high % of the 1.2 million recall signers will show up to vote his ass out; I think it's a pretty good bet that his fascist ass is toast.
If I were a psychopath, I would join the republican party, and get in on the gravy train taking the Teabircher morons to the cleaners.
I hope so , can you imagine if that Nazi survives ? Is mind blowing that Walker's ouster is not a given at this point .
Insanity , it is what it is , there is no understanding it .
been there, done that, when we had a home business, so i went to the day labor place until checks came in, put food on the table.
to the point on taxes, capital gains rates are supposed to be for investment in plant and equipment, at least that is the justification, in practice fat cats cash out their stock options at 15%, that's why they want to be paid that way. the solution is to tax any and all monies as income, period end of story.
to borrow a right wing talking point, abolish corporate taxes, zero, nada, zilch; any money disbursed is income, tax it, any money plowed back into the business? no taxes paid on that, encourage actual investment instead of speculation. money made on commodities? income, tax it. etc. etc.
the meme about consumers paying corporate taxes thru payment for goods? seems true to me. if i ran a corporation? and my corporate taxes were raised? i would just raise prices, which is easy to do when you are monsanto, con-agra, exxon, mobil, any of these corps that are monopolies. this leaves completely aside the fact that these major corporations should be treated as public utilities, but then that's just commie talk.
but back to capital gains, how many overseas investments have been written off when all they do is create jobs offshore? at the least capital gains should be limited to actual physical plant investment right here in the good old USA. maybe weapons manufacture should be ineligible? what does an atomic bomb create anyway? besides death and destruction? but then suppose if we did disqualify weapons? what would that do to our balance of trade?
point being, there is more than one way to skin a cat.
of the Bush tax cuts. Bush's cuts went to personal income. I don't have any problem with giving a tax break to companies that are trying to expand here. But Bush's cuts caused the CEO's (and other 1%ers) to keep the cash for themselves instead of redirecting it back to the companies. This is the reason that job creators are mythical characters.
"Someday somebody related to some of these sufferers, these victims, these collaterally damaged souls, may try to kill you. And I have to tell you, I think you’ll have it coming." - Christopher Cooper
Reinstate 90% marginal rates. Like that republican president Eisenhower had in the glorious 50's.
Say it everyday, and all day long. The Romney's of the world have had a free pass at brainwashing the dim bulbs for 30 years.
Must play catch-up.
If I were a psychopath, I would join the republican party, and get in on the gravy train taking the Teabircher morons to the cleaners.
You cannot lower taxes when you are at war. But Bush both lowered taxes when we should have had a war tax (since no one listened that the wars were stupid), AND he funded the wars off the books. When Obama put them into the budget, the deficit went into the stratosphere.
"Someday somebody related to some of these sufferers, these victims, these collaterally damaged souls, may try to kill you. And I have to tell you, I think you’ll have it coming." - Christopher Cooper
So, if I understand Mitt's position on taxes; if I work for a corporation or am the CEO of a corporation and that corporation pays taxes, then the IRS should accept that as my taxes through the corporation. So if my corporation pays 35% (minus deductions) then that is the same as me paying that tax rate.
Basically Mitt is saying he is being "double taxed."
After deductions the goddamn corporations don't EVER pay 35%.
EVER!!!
"Someday somebody related to some of these sufferers, these victims, these collaterally damaged souls, may try to kill you. And I have to tell you, I think you’ll have it coming." - Christopher Cooper
Yeah, and the IRS should have just considered all the taxes paid by my employer's as my tax, and let me off scott free so I wouldn't be double taxed.
Double taxed my ass. More like doublespeak. As in GOP bullshit. Why should a CEO be treated any differently than the other workers?
Isn't it enough that the SOB's make more in a day, than most of their workers make in a year?
We have 40% of the people in this country on economic life support; and I tell ya' folks, I really have had my fill of listening to these trust fund multi millionaires bitch about paying taxes!
These greedy evil self-centered sociopath's, make me sick.
If I were a psychopath, I would join the republican party, and get in on the gravy train taking the Teabircher morons to the cleaners.
those that never worked for a corporation who hired a corporate raider like ole mittens just dont know how friggin heartless the bastard can be- you lose all you have worked for and he doesnt bat an eye- just moves on to the next job to get rid of jobs - once he is exposed and out of the race Newt will be the front runner and that is a clown show within its self - colonize the moon ! what a goof ball !
roger allen
By not releasing his tax returns from previous years Romney is jeopardizing himself as a presidential candidate.
If he had nothing to hide, Romney would release his tax returns from previous years in a heart beat.
Therefore, if Romney does not release his tax returns from previous years there can be only one conclusion - Romney is hiding something in his tax returns from previous years that would eliminate him as a presidential candidate for certain.
"Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob"
-= Franklin Delano Roosevelt =-
There is a real chance if Mitt Romney wins the primary, that a leak will spring up at the worst possible time of undeclared income buried in tax havens.
A certainty for conviction for tax evasion, so opportunity for blackmail by his ex-Bain pals (there are no friends when hundreds of millions of dollars are to be made) or just expose his ass.
Could the IRS already be investigating...or is that not possible (privacy etc.)?
"With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine"
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