Global Markets Tanking Due To Fears of US Recession; Fox Business Channel sez "Don't Panic!"
By Nicole Belle Sunday Jan 20, 2008 5:58pm
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At risk of being accused of being a fear-mongerer, I've made several posts recently pointing to very ominous signs on the direction US markets appear to be going. At least I haven't invoked the Four Horsemen...yet. I'm not the only one who is being a Nervous Nellie about it either. Today, though US markets are closed in honor of MLK, global markets are tanking in anticipation of a US recession:
Asian stock markets plunged Monday following declines on Wall Street last week amid investor pessimism over the U.S. government's stimulus plan to prevent a recession.
Japan's benchmark Nikkei 225 index slid 3.9 percent to close at 13,325.94 points, the lowest in more than 2 years. China's Shanghai Composite index plunged 5.1 percent, the biggest percentage drop since July 5, to 4,914.44.
India's benchmark Sensex stock index fell as much as 10.9 percent before closing down 7.4 percent. Hong Kong's blue chip Hang Seng index, meanwhile, plummeted 5.5 percent to 23,818.86, its biggest percentage drop since the Sept. 11, 2001, terror attacks.
Investors dumped shares because they were skeptical about an economic stimulus plan President Bush announced Friday. The plan, which requires approval by Congress, calls for about $145 billion worth of tax relief to encourage consumer spending.[..]
Markets in South Korea, Australia, Singapore, Taiwan and the Philippines also sank.
But on FOX Business Channel, things will be just fine if no one panics, because the global markets are tanking not because of US market issues, but because of the valuations in their own markets were over-inflated. Uh huh.
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[Deleted. Off topic-Sitemonitor]
[Deleted. Off topic-Sitemonitor]
The NYSE may be closed but that only means "outsiders" cannot see what is going on.
Upon opening, this is what you'll see.
http://bigpicture.typepad.com/comments/2008/01/dow-futures-loo.html
a system based on debt is bound to fail duhhh
Don't panic, so they can get out first.
They said that world markets dropped today like post-9/11.
I mean, seriously, we have floored an overheated engine for how long now? The last of the oil is gone and now the radiator is leaking. She's gonna blow.
I won't panic, but I will:
- sell all my stock
- invest the proceeds in copper jacketed lead
- lock the doors and hide under my bed
There is money to be made.
When markets tank, those in the know know how to invest.
The world economy is not about to collapse. Just a buying opportunity.
Look at history.
Oh, some people get fucked in the meantime.
The world just realized that the dems aren't going to impeach bush or cheney, and that the neocon crooks have another full year (365 days) to rape and pillage and murder.
Bad news for many...
Faux gets business news right about as often as it gets
political news right....
But, if the market does tank, I'm taking less then 5 minutes
in the betting pool, before they blame "The Liberal Elites and
the Democrats in Congress!"
And, I can't wait for Allan (trust the free market) Greenspan
to weigh in...
Kind of like asking the guy that filled the Hindenburgh with Hydrogen
what he thinks it burned up?
Ready for round two?
Autralian Markets tanks for second straight session...
'Blood on the floor' as market slides
Email Print Normal font Large font AdvertisementAdvertisementJanuary 22, 2008 - 10:53AM
Australian shares resumed their rout this morning, with investors joining counterparts around the world to dump their holdings ahead of an expected slowdown in global growth.
http://business.theage.com.au/blood-on-the-floor-as-market-slides/200801...
I remember a few months ago Fox News had a graphic up that read something like "Dow down 300 today, why it could reach 15,000 in coming weeks!"
Helluva prediction there. Joke of a news network.
Mike @ 2:
One of the main reasons why we are in the toilet is because the Vienna School retards got their policies implemented in the past few decades. You know, the same policies that ended up in disaster at the end of the Gilded age and the "roaring 20s" both of which ended up in catastrophic depressions. The same policies that were update to a more market-friendly "trickle down" moniker, which ended up in the crash of the mid 80s, and the recession under poppy Bush.
So I fail to see how a libertarian, and avid drinker of the KoolAid of the Viennese persuasion would be more popular due to the clusterfuck that libertarian policies have brought upon us.
Then again, the common right winger is dumber than a bag of rocks... so such nuance as Mr. Paul's libertarian baggage will surely fly over their feeble little minds.
We need massive surgery, and some conservatives are heralding an expert in horse medicine as the best thing since sliced bread. Jesus H. Christ on a pogo stick we are beyond fucked...
I've been tanked for years.
Gary Busey is my role model.
Don't panic? Sorry, but Fox Biz ain't the Hitchiker's Guide to the Galaxy.
Still, it'd be a good idea to pick out your travelin' towel, since the ride's gonna get rough
FreedomOfInformationAct @ 9:
No the world knows that Bush doesn't know what the fuck he is doing, the Americans are living off credit, and they are tired of buying their worthless debt.
This is just the expected correction, the house needs to be cleaned... and if the americans don't want to do their damn jobs, starting with their political system doing its job and requesting responsibilities. Then it is time to move on, and let the American market absorb the magnitude of the clusterfuck this cabal is leaving. Tomorrow is going to be interesting in the States. I think that we need a darker color than black to characterize what Tuesday is going to look like.
Toronto Stock Exchange down today too.
Now if all you fox viewers bought 'NewsCorp' stock...like I know your going to...everything will be fine.
justadood @ 15:
Ironically, FOX is channel #42 on my cable system... Sometimes one has to wonder if all of this is coincidence, or if the deity d' jour is just fucking with us :-)
Bush doesn't care about Americans.
Which of the candidates does? I'd say, Ron Paul.
BTW, I've given to a lot of Dem candidates for the House, such as Marc Pera and Donna Edwards, just so nobody gets me wrong.
Economy in the dumper?
Stagflation on the way? Cost of food about to go through the roof?
Lay-offs coming all over the midwest?
Time for the Republic candidates to start talking about "Gay Marriage!"
What does Michael Lewis, the author of Liar's Poker, know that we don't know?
That if you dig deep enough, in places like Goldman Sachs, then you'll see that Wall Street really is nothing more than a rigged shell game, with those at the top doing nothing more than to play both ends against the middle to earn their fees.
Unless, of course, there's another credible explanation for this trading strategerey.
~Nyc
PS: What I'm not getting is that in the middle of all this across the board blood-letting somehow the US Dollar managed to pick up .03¢ against the Euro this past week. :(
What's up with that nonsense?
Always something out there to muck up a perfectly good wet-dream of mines.
Don't panic. On Monday Jan.28 at 9:00 pm Bush will give the " State of the Union Address 2008" in which he will paint a beautiful picture and instruct the nation on what has to be done . You have heard it before , " I encourage you all to go out and do more shopping ". I hope he is not intoxicated as that would not go over very well . I have avoided watching Bush give any talk for the last 4 or 5 years as in the past I usually ended up with a headache and became nauseous but this one should be interesting . In fact , this may be a classic .
It's pure rubbish if anyone thinks that a government can do anything about an economy. People say "look how great it was under Clinton" but Clinton had NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. Just as now. There is nothing any political leader can do about this. The MSM talking experts use lots of talking points, but they don't know jacksh** the reasoning for it. Economic cycles go up, and down. This is down. Sure the Bushie Regime hasn't helped much with world consumer confidence, but that has nothing to do with investors.
The should have fears $ goes down as oil and gold increases, wasnt like that in the day, anywho its a holiday. my post about the King THANK WE FREE
Tyler Durden @ 19:
Same number as the number of viewers they had today, too. Fox Business is a dud just like their comrades over at
PravdaFox News are. And yes we are in for a tough time. Batten down the hatches, but don't panic.Blue Lensman @ 7:
What a lovely way to spend the rest of your life. Expecting canabalism or what?
I trust Faux for reliable economic news as much as I trust them for general news.
Look, heres the problem. If you bail out now, Berneke can come in with a 100bp rate
cut, kill the shorts and send markets to the moon, also killing the dollar. On the other hand,
he may not, and you will be screwed if you stay invested! What to do, besides getting rid
of the FED that cause this in the first place.
John Stewart has died.
VietVet8666 @ 20:
Thanks for mentioning Donna. I hope she wins so that we can send a big f--k you to the Democratic party establishment. The best people need to win, not the party's anointed incumbent syncophants.
Everyone can thank Greenspan and loose regs.
We'll weather this OK in the end, but it could hurt.
Remember: Dollar Cost Averaging is your friend.
If you are in it for the long haul, you should be buying a mix of foreign and domestic stock funds right now.
If you are in if for the short haul, you should NOT have been in equity instruments.
What's sad is that once again, we've allowed a criminal (Bush) to loot the Treasury.
ConcernedCanuck @ 24:
Business is cyclic in nature. It is however fairly well understood that government action can help dampen and recover the descending part of the cycle.
The you have king midas in reverse at the helm of the US policies, a recipe for disaster under normal economic circumstances... so you can imagine how much worse it is going to be under the current context of bad economic indicators.
A government with trillions of dollars in debt and amassing more of it as if it were free air does really impact the economy, whether you want to minimize it or not.
ysbaddaden @ 30:
Daily show Jon Stewart? Oh no, I hope not!
Mike V. @ 32:
What about free downloads and file sharing. Will that be affected? Free Stuff in general?
bmw 528 @ 34:
No,
http://news.google.com/news?sourceid=navclient&hl=en&ned=us&q=john+stewart
VietVet8666 @ 8:
yes, this will be a business opportunity for some, but like the crash of the 1930's that crash ruined a great many people's only funds. so, your optimistic attitude is commendable, but there are two sides here and those who don't have the funds to swim will suffer immensely.
bmw 528 @ 34:
Never mind, it was Kingston Trio John Stewart. Rest in Peace, friend.
Buy tulips!
bmw 528 @ 34:
No a songwriter
So how exactly are the dems going to change things? Where are their list of policies, foreign and domestic? Are they immune to starting wars on a whim? Be honest now.
justadood @ 15:
I hope anyone dumb enough to take their news from faux follows that advice.....and hangs on to panic sell lower.
I actually view the economic collapse as a good thing........it's an opportunity to absolutely repudiate except for among the biggest kool aid drinkers the trickle down, what's good for business is good for everything, it's their own fault their poor school of thought...............basically, we will have no choice (despite their protestations via media mouthpieces) but to EXTRACT the money stolen by the aristocrasy over the last 7 years via reinstatement of the estate tax, jumping the top marginal rate up to at least 65%, and raising the minimum wage up to a LIVING wage so the people who spend the most money (DRIVING THE ECONOMY) actually fucking HAVE SOME........this is what a REAL economy is built on, not fucking overvalued real estate.
V V
Nicolle, I feel your frustration, believe me. It is absolutely disgusting and morally bankrupting of Fox to paint a rosy picture over the truth, which will inevitably cause at least a few people to lose money (Fox viewers!!!). This is proof that Fox does not care about not only the country in general, but its own viewers!
You know what? I have come to understand something. Whatever Fox says, the truth is the opposite. If we all treat Fox this way (it's hard of course), then we can understand what is going on.
The head of Fox years ago made a mandate for all Fox employees NOT to say ANYTHING negative about the Bush administration and the government in general. So, according to the principle that what Fox says is false, then the truth can be easily seen.
If Fox says the economy is all rosy, and you combine this with its pledge of allegiance to Bush and his government, then the reason why there is a recession is because of Bush and the government! For if Fox tells the truth, and that this country is in a recession, then what would be the ramifications?
If Fox accepts it, then the next logical step would be for them to "investigate" WHY there is a recession. Since the government is at fault, and the fact that they can never blame Bush for anything, they would be stuck between a rock and a hard place. So, they instead choose to IGNORE the recession altogether! Why call a duck a duck when you can just not even get to the point where a judgment has to be made!! What duck? I don't see any duck!
The establishment's faulty economic knowledge (caused by faulty economists galore), is that consumer spending is the most important thing in the economy. They do not see that savings and investment are infinitely more important than buying final product. Their monetary policies are designed to maximize consumer spending, which directly results in a decrease savings. These real savings WOULD have gone into such things as improving and expanding production, as well as paying higher wages, because wages come out of savings, not consuming. Because this country has a bunch of pompous ignoramuses running the economic show, the result is exactly what we are seeing. But they won't listen, because if they knew and acted upon the truth, then most of them would be out of a job, and maintaining a job by any means possible is the strongest force in the universe, because it can be based on lies in addition to truth, which the universe cannot even do.
So this is why the truth is so threatening to them, if the truth really were known and acted upon, this country would be a paradise. But power usurps truth when there is widespread ignorance caused by a substandard education system. Everything starts with being informed, being informed is the most powerful weapon in the world. I wish we were living in such a world.
ysbaddaden @ 30:
Cheer up sleepy Jean...Oh what can it mean.....
Wanna see something really cool?
Here's the NYT one day chart for the Nikkei from this morning that shows the first 15 minutes of trading today.
Literally looks like it fell off a cliff.
Champagne for everybody!
Especially all you out there in short-seller land.
:-)
~Nyc
When the market went to 14k a few months ago, I bailed out and got long-term 5.6% CD's. Hardly better than inflation after taxes, but try beating it. No adrenaline here. I like it that way. I think there'll be some bargains later in the year. We'll see.
No, I didn't get Google the first day when it was claimed to be worth more than Ford, or buy Euros when they were $.85. I'm not that smart. Or poor.
WashStateBlue @ 21:
Romney is way ahead of you , he's singing 'Who let the dogs out?' and is talking with real life African-Americans! I think he's also ran an ad in spanish (so much for that non-bilingual nation). Who knows , Huckabee might guest appear on Ellen!
ConcernedCanuck @ 24:
But what makes it go up and then down then? Things don't just happen without cause. Why is it that everyone makes mistakes all at the same time? Isn't the probability of that too low to be attributed to the economy? Also, why do capital goods industries always up and down more than consumer industries? These questions are impossible to attribute to the market because the market is comprised of different industries and different periods of production.
Don't buy yet. Down turn just begun. More bad news this week.
Think about it folks. This mortgage crisis is a lot like the s & l's in the late 80's. Financial buggery is one thing but we haven't heard about the criminal wrong doing and the cover ups of just how much money has really been lost.
Or did you think this was just due to fiscal incompetence?
OK OK...
We at FOX were just kidding...
You can panic! now...
This mortgage crisis is a lot like the s & l’s in the late 80’s.
Yah mean Neil Bush is behind it? Silverado Savings Redo?
Where is Neil anyway.......
Dustin de Wynde @ 45:
Ouch
If you had listened to the warnings in December, and sold then, you'd be up 10% now.
yes Bush the economy is so strong it needs a stimulus package.
What FOX doesn't understand is that with FOX News you can get the knuckle-draggers/mouth breathers to believe anything because, well, they are stupid. And yes trolls, polls all over demonstrate that you are the least intelligent and most uneducated demographic out there. With FOX business their market is with people that, by definition, must be intelligent to be successful in business. They may be conservative and they may use FOX News to keep the sheep in line, but (as the surveys demonstrate) do NOT watch FOX Business and consider it a joke. So FOX Business can say what it wants . . . no one is listening. Well, cept Insanity maybe.
Drew @ 48:
Lots of things make it go up and down, and no one thing impacts it this way. If that is the case, the only thing done in the last couple weeks in the US that would impact would be the BushJr. talking about giving middle class a tax rebate. Hey, maybe the world's rich are saying "no damn way, it's ours and ours to keep". Who knows really?
My gold is doing well.
They are selling banks to the Saudis and war to keep the price of oil high.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/20/opinion/20dowd.html
The United States of Arabia.
ConcernedCanuck @ 24:
yes there is definitely something bush and cheney both could do to greatly improve the economy of the USA, they can tie a rope to the top banister of a very high stairwell, place the other end tightly around their necks and then jump off.
if that seems harsh, that is exactly what bush and cheney have done to America.
OK this is fucking funny:
http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2008/01/face-of-the...
It seems even the youngins are starting to be informed. Way to go girl!
Better to be prepared then clueless.
Is This The Big One?
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article19126.htm
Perhaps the world's 1% want another world war? Happened before, not?
ysbaddaden @ 14:
Head injury much?
Dustin de Wynde @ 45:
HOLY CREEPIN' SHIT!! Can't wait to see tomorrow's NYSE chart!!!
ConcernedCanuck @ 55:
Who knows? I do. There IS one thing that creates recessions, and it is credit expansion coupled with fractional reserve banking. Oh and I think there should be a tax rebate, but only if government spending goes down along with it. We don't need more debt.
Another Great Page in The bush LEGACY Book.
This must be the best president EVER!
I can barely wait until tomorrow morning at 9:30 AM EST.
Here is another one about w's trip to our new owners:
http://www.gregpalast.com/george-of-arabia-better-kiss-your-abe-goodbye/
L.A. Confidential @ 59:
Interesting.......maybe even true.....hard to say though. The US money influence on the world seems to have crested. Perhaps nations switching to the Euro for oil, etc, are having an impact
L.A. Confidential @ 59:
Wow half way through that article I jumped out the window.
dadams @ 57:
They didn't do it without alot of help from Dems and Reps alike though you are right in your thinking of a part solution.
Maybe this election's campaign slogan will be, "It's the economy, religious nut!"
Drew @ 63:
The American Military Dictatorship is very hungry for cash to finance global "wars on terrists".....both parties say that is number one priority, so can't see any changes there.
ConcernedCanuck @ 24:
You are a brilliant economist. Heh.
ConcernedCanuck @ 66:
Were in uncharted territory. Thats a a given.
Dow futures are around 625 points down from Fri. close. S&P futures down 62.50 from Fri. close. Good thing I have a futures account. I know how I'm going to trade tomorrow. ;)
ConcernedCanuck @ 24:
Right on Mon!
The current situation has everything to do w/the (privately owned) Federal Reserve! (declining dollar)
...and Bernanke's bosses are under no obligation (or law) to answer to anyone in congress...
Repeat... The Fed answers not!
of course, congress does'nt aswer to We The People either but...
Markets in China, India, South Korea, Singapore, Taiwan and the Philippines all fell.
In Mumbai, the main Sensex index fell 1,408 points, or 7.4%, adding to an 8% fall last week. Hong Kong's Hang Seng slumped 1,383.0 points, or 5.5%, to close at 23,818.9. Tokyo's main Nikkei 225 index fell 3.9%.
Australia's benchmark ASX 200 index closed down 2.9%, or 166.9, points at 5,580.4, which is its lowest level for a year.
It was also the 11th consecutive negative day for the index, the longest losing streak in more than 25 years.
Don't know what all the fuss is about..........as soon as I get my $800 tax rebate I'll go out and buy a new set of wheels for my ride and everything will be fine.
Don't worry..........George has a plan...........
Canada tanked today too. The Toronto Stock Exchange (TSX) was down 605 points, or 4.75%. Worst one-day fall since Feb. 2001.
It's no coincidence this came one business day after Bush's stimulus package. It has totally backfired - and only serves to show how desparate the Bush admin is to prop up the economy at any cost. As if more debt and tax cuts will create real wealth. This is what caused the current mess in the first place.
Nicole Belle said,
""At risk of being accused of being a fear-mongerer, I’ve made several posts recently pointing to very ominous signs on the direction US markets appear to be going.""
OMG Nicole, its too late now!
Just think Nicole, now thousands and thousands of your crooksnliars fans will see this and pull out of the market!!!
...and the burden the crash of 08' as it will be called...
...will ride upon your shoulders (for the rest of your life)!!!
how do you feel now Nicole? (insert smiley face)
JHR @ 76:
Or you can get 8 cases of Cheap Whiskey
ConcernedCanuck @ 70:
That's because the military industrial complex has an unfair advantage of being closest to the point of money creation. These "companies" are given billions of dollars created from nothing. They are thus able to have a higher purchasing power as well as having first dibs on government contracts, contracts which are funded by the Fed.
So if a small business across the country is to compete, they have a hard time because their purchasing power goes down. Prices around them rise before their incomes do. So they cannot grow and compete with Halliburton for example, or any large investment firm that is very high up in the chain of money creation. This is why there is a systematic transfer of wealth from those far away from the Fed, to those more closer to the Fed. This is the actual cause for almost all of the economic inequalities in this country.
Think about it. If you had a money printing press in your basement, who would be the richest people in the country? You and your family and friends! This is exactly how our monetary system works. It's a group of people all clamoring to get closer access to the origin of money creation. This is why in a relatively free country, businessmen adapt to this environment and create a huge "financial innovation" explosion in commerce. Businessmen are by their nature in search of profits. In a free economy without a Fed, this would act to raise our standard of living by searching for innovation and production improvements. But when there is a Fed, the creme de la creme of the most profits lie in the industries that are about financial securities, equity, derivatives, etc, which all become super profitable in the face of large money supply increases.
But the market is powerful. The market acts as our protector in a sense, because this cheating, this unfair advantage of being close to the point of money creation, and shifting all the labor and resources to financial services, is UNSUSTAINABLE. Thank God. They may get away with it for awhile, but the market will ALWAYS correct this huge imbalance.
This one is particularly big, because the supply of money increased A LOT. Go to wiki and look at the M1, M2 and M3 money supply figures since 1990.
HOLY SHIT...
Why is anyone surprised?
The economy's been totally unstable since NAFTA.
Bush has relied on printing vast sums of money & military/homeland-security spending to keep the economy afloat .. no real production.
Anyone who's been paying attention has seen this coming for at least 5 years.
Some suspect the same players who pushed the world into depression in 1929 are doing it again - part of the "Creative Destruction" that is part of the CREED of the neocons (Naomi Klein calls it "Disaster Capitalism").
They suck up all the cash, put the rest of the world into bankruptcy, then buy what they want at firesale prices & dictate how the world is re-formed afterwards.
They've been planning this since the late 1800's when Malthus demonstrated that the world population would soon exceed the carrying capacity of the planet. They decided then that they would be the survivors in the life boat.
I got out in 2000.
L.A. Confidential @ 79:
I'll stick with canned goods, water and munitions.
MountainMan23 @ 81:
You nailed it right there. Bushenomics Perfected.
It's good to be in a
panicdepressionrecession if you're very wealthy. Bargains! Bargains! Everywhere!Bubble Bubble Bubble
http://tinyurl.com/18r
Asian stocks extends losses into a second day
By V. Phani Kumar , MarketWatch
Last Update: 7:52 PM ET Jan 21, 2008
HONG KONG (MarketWatch) -- Asian stocks came under relentless selling pressure for the second straight session on Tuesday, a day after fears the U.S. economy could slip into a recession triggered a sell-off that spread to Europe and Latin America.
L.A. Confidential @ 79:
There actually is something to this, and it's good Keneysian economics (the converse of supply side idiocy.....which these fucking morons seem to have suddenly discovered as the ship is sinking).......monies spent by poor people get cycled through the economy time and again....your 800 buys at K-mart wages for poor people, who spend it, giving wages to more poor people.....it's called the multiplier effect.
V V
January 21, 2008: 11:29 AM EST
OSLO (AFP)--Eight Norwegian towns plunged into financial crisis after making investments linked to U.S. subprime housing loans were chastised Monday by local officials who deemed the transactions illegal.
The verdict, handed down by the local county governors, forces the towns to sell off their investments and rake in hundreds of millions of kroner in losses.
Hoping to make huge gains, the small towns, several clustered near the Arctic Circle, invested anticipated profits from local hydropower plants in high-risk securities linked to the U.S. mortgage market which were created by Citigroup Inc. (C).
The value of the investments first soared, but soon crumbled under the weight of the U.S. subprime housing market, while a clause in the agreement forced the towns to keep pumping in more money, pushing some of them to the brink of bankruptcy.
Subprime mortgages are U.S. housing loans made by lenders to individuals with poor credit histories.
In all, the towns, none of which count more than 25,000 inhabitants, stand to lose as much as NOK687 million ($124 million), the Norwegian newspaper Verdens Gang reported.
The county governors ruled the eight municipalities - Vik, Haugesund, Bremanger, Kvinesdal, Hattfjelldal, Hemnes, Rana and Narvik - broke a law banning high-risk investments of public funds.
Hopes the Norwegian brokerage that set up the investments, Terra Securities, would compensate the towns for some of their losses were dashed last November when the company filed for bankruptcy.
Terra Securities, which was owned by a consortium of 78 Norwegian banks, went under after Norway's Financial Supervisory Authority withdrew its operating license over its failure to provide sufficient information about the risks involved in the investments.
Faux News expected spin:
I'm ready...been watching The Grapes of Wrath and Bound For Glory.
Vitam Vas @ 87:
The multiplier effect is completely fallacious. Also, if you know Keynes, you would at least know how to spell his name. Keynes is wrong in almost every way, I hope you one day come to see this. Keynes makes the mistake of assuming that an initial net investment results in a series of income increases that can pay more wages.
Keynes cannot claim that what he really meant when he propounded the multiplier doctrine is only that an inflation-financed rise in consumer demand results in a rise in the demand for labor and other factors of production because business enterprises will spend their additional sales revenues in buying factors of production. The Keynesian analysis explicitly argues that income is
raised insofar as the additional incomes corresponding to the additional sales revenues are consumed, i.e., are not spent for business purposes, and that the rise in incomes will be the greater, the higher is the “marginal propensity to consume” and the lower is the “marginal propensity to save.”
Keynes is utterly unaware that the overwhelmingly greater part of any income that could possibly be increased by virtue of the process they have described would be profit income. That is the only income that is earned on additional business sales revenue, and business sales revenue is the only receipt that private consumption spending generates. It is also the only receipt that is generated by investment spending insofar as investment spending is for such things as the purchase of the lumber for example. Thus, for example, if I take $1,000 and go into a shopping mall and spend it in buying clothes, say, my expenditure is $1,000 of sales revenue to the seller of the clothes. The only income earned on those sales revenues is profit, not wages.
The multiplier doctrine also contradicts another of Keynes own doctrines!
When he propounds the marginal-efficiency-of-capital doctrine, he claim that the effect of more net investment
is a reduction in the rate of profit. Yet when he propounds the multiplier doctrine, he claims that the effect of more net investment is a multiplied increase in aggregate demand. But doesn't more demand raise profits?
C.O.N.T.R.A.D.I.C.T.I.O.N.
Drew @ 91:
We're broke. Thats the bottom line.
Annoyed Canuck @ 77:
So, which is it? The economy runs in cycles and nothing the Bush administration did has anything to do with it? Or "This is what caused the current mess in the first place?"
Sure, things are still going swimmingly...as long as you continue to ignore Reality!
Stock Markets Plunge Worldwide
TOBY ANDERSON | January 21, 2008 04:33 PM EST |
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/01/21/stock-markets-plunge-worl_n_824...
and
http://www.rawstory.com/news/mochila/Stock_markets_plunge_worldwide_0121...
The Economy Is a Problem
Posted January 21, 2008 | 03:59 PM (EST)
Larry Beinhart
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/larry-beinhart/the-economy-is-a-problem_b_...
The McLaughlin Group: The Economy Tanking
By: Nicole Belle on Sunday, January 20th, 2008 at 6:01 PM - PST
Guest blogged by Heather, cross posted at DailyKos
Video, article and comments
http://www.crooksandliars.com/2008/01/20/the-mclaughlin-group-the-econom...
Too Late To the Downturn
By David Ignatius
Sunday, January 20, 2008; Page B07
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/01/18/AR200801...
The Fraud of Bushenomics: They’re Looting the Country
by Larry Beinhart | January 19, 2008 - 10:47am
http://www.smirkingchimp.com/thread/12268
Bush Economy Gives Working People The Finger
By: Blue Texan Thursday January 17, 2008 7:02 am
http://firedoglake.com/2008/01/17/bush-economy-gives-working-people-the-...
President Bush Shouldn't Play With Sharp Objects
Bob Cesca
Posted January 17, 2008 | 12:14 PM (EST)
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/bob-cesca/president-bush-shouldnt-_b_81998...
"The economy, stupid," 16 years later
Submitted by BuzzFlash on Tue, 01/15/2008 - 12:52pm. Be-Elected
Some things never change -- like the economy in Michigan. -- Chad
http://www.buzzflash.com/articles/election08/022
Why The Bush Economy Really Stinks
January 14, 2008
By Mary Ratcliff
http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/print_friendly.php?p=opedne_mary_rat_08...
Poll: Americans Think U.S. On Wrong Track
Economy And The War Have Americans Voicing Pessimism About The Future Of The Country
Comments 303
Jan. 13, 2008
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/01/13/opinion/polls/main3706504.shtml
Bush tanked the U.S. economy
By BONNIE ERBE
GUEST COLUMNIST
Last updated January 11, 2008 5:01 p.m. PT
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinion/347046_erbe13.html?source=rss
ABU DHABI (Reuters) - U.S. Energy Secretary Sam Bodman repeated his plea on Monday for more oil from top exporter Saudi Arabia, undeterred by OPEC's cautious response to Washington's request so far.
Maybe he should just bend over and bite the bullet.
L.A. Confidential @ 92:
Technically we've been broke since 1971. The brokeness just got so big that the world doesn't want to take it anymore.
crushburger higanbotham @ 93:
You can thank Bush Co for this mess.
Drew @ 95:
Thats right big daddy U.S. is being booted out the door and it's time to sink or swim on our own.
So when do we start setting fire to things?
Bud @ 98:
As soon as we can find a match for the worthless paper dollars?
haha
Well. Think I'll kick back and enjoy the last 12 hours of "prosperity".
Now's a good time for smokin' and playin' acoustic guitar with your children. Turn off the TV and refocus on what's important in life. Have a drink.
Don't panic there's still time the save the US economy! Go run out now and buy a bunch of Thigh Masters and Chia Pets!
Right now, it looks like the futures are predicting about a 5% drop in the S&P 500. Perhaps if they throw out some dividend paying babies with the bath water, I'll do some buying, since it looks like interest rates are going down.
The Markets are still falling
It's Tuesday in Asia and markets are open for business. Prices are down big time:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7201658.stm
Current trading on Asian exchanges:
http://ca.finance.yahoo.com/intlindices?e=asia
Scary.
Those who panic stay ahead of the crowd.
Sometimes calm people burn and drown.
Run. Run and don't look back.
Wheeeeee!!!!!
Hang Seng Index 22,527.01 -1,291.85 -5.42% 10:06
The beatings will continue until morale improves.
~Nyc
PS: Wasn't Wall Street that said George Busch is good for business?
Guess we're seeing the truth of that now....
Annoyed Canuck @ 104:
Man their freaking out over there.
Wear shorts to the market tomorrow.
Does anyone here want to know how to put the monetary authorities into super duper panic mode, and at the same time benefiting yourself by raising the purchasing power of dollars?
Here's my handy dandy 4 step plan to ruin the intellectual economic establishment, as well as making your own life better off. I know, can it really be done? Absolutely:
1. Accumulate dollars and don't spend them on anything beyond the absolute minimum to stay healthy, in fact...
2. ...take out ALL your money (whatever is left) from the bank and stuff it under your mattress.
3. Say the words "BANK RUN" or "THIS BANK IS BANKRUPT!" really loud next time you go to the bank.
4. Take the $300 rebate check and cash it. Put money under mattress.
If many people do these things, what will happen is that there will be a huge deflationary effect in the economy. Your cash balances will increase while at the same time the prices of goods will decrease. More cash plus lower prices equals better life.
The government, in response to this, will no doubt engage in a gigantic monetary expansion of the money supply in order to encourage spending. They will print a trillion dollars if they have to, causing huge increases in wages, business profitability, and revenues. But guess what? If they do that, then repeat steps 1 to 4.
Two words: "Bush Bubble".
Can we start hearing those words on the TeeVee now?
It is, after all, Bush's "legacy year".
Remember the Peace Dividend?
ConcernedCanuck @ 70:
Goes back to a comment by David Walker, Comptroller General of the United States: "I would argue that the most serious threat to the United States is not someone hiding in a cave in Afghanistan or Pakistan but our own fiscal irresponsibility."
Repeat after me...
"THE BUSH RECESSION"
THE BUSH RECESSION
THE BUSH RECESSION
THE BUSH RECESSION
THE BUSH RECESSION
THE BUSH RECESSION
THE BUSH RECESSION
L.A. Confidential @ 112:
A "Peace" dividend to George H.W. Bush is like a "Diet" dividend to King Kong Bundy.
Chimpinomics do not work.
Surprise surprise.
Republicans think you can double the national debt and not have any consequences.
Republicans are so stupid.
Keith Olbermann referred to dumbya as president hoover last week, how prophetic and applicable to this miserable failure of an Administration.
Misery Accomplished Neocons, now go directly to jail, do not pass GO, do not collect $200.00.
TC-14 @ 114:
OK,
THE GREENSPAN RECESSION
THE BUSH RECESSION
THE WAR RECESSION
THE KEYNES RECESSION
THE FRIEDMAN RECESSION
THE FEDERAL RESERVE RECESSION
Oh, wait a sec...
When your grandchildren ask, tell them where you were and who you supported when the Great Bush Depression took its deathgrip hold on the World Economy.
Don't forget these are the same guys who were in charge when Katrina hit New Orleans.
There is nothing that happens in this world unless the worlds leaders aren i on it, and they are the ones bringing the markets down because they know the system of fiat is a bust. They are in fact causing a controlled panic ad when the dust settles, there willbe a new international banking system. The major banks in the US willbe the first to be changed ito Treasury baks, and for the first time, you will be able to exchange Federal reservenotes for currencies in other coutries denominations.
What they have required all this time is an excuse to change the system and they are going to use a US recession as that excuse. It makes perfect sense because you are going to see 500 trillions in derivitves go up in smoke. I wouldn't be surprised if Paulson up's the ante and the much talked about reabte checks grow in size. Watch and see how it all unfolds.
You know those three little birds in that Marley song? The ones singing, "Every little thing, is going to be alright."?
Cheney just shot them.
All three.
This should make for interesting viewing: http://money.cnn.com/data/world_markets/
Imagine if the chimp had privatized social security.
Andrew @ 121:
Fuck yeah dude, this is exactly what the goal is. The international bankers want a world currency fiat system.
The ULTIMATE goal is for all the people of the world to have RFID chips with money on them. Then, if you dissent, you will have your chip turned off.
Acting Patriotic @ 123:
WTF is going on in Norway???
These bastards could spin a nuclear war.
Drew @ 126:
They Got Screwed. By Citibank.
I agree. Don't panic. Just buy some duct tape and you'll be all set.
Lord Balto @ 127:
HERZLIYA, Israel (AFP) - Former US ambassador to the United Nations John Bolton said on Monday that Israel may have to take military action to prevent its archfoe Iran from acquiring an atomic bomb.
L.A. Confidential @ 128:
No, I mean they are the only country UP!
Couldn't have anything to do with the price of oil? There is a a great sound, and it's the sound of your money whisking out of your wallet and into the fat-cat Oil tycoons pocket.
These are the early symptoms of an impending crash. The real question becomes, what deflection will the thieves try to conjure up to get you to blame someone else?
Jim @ 129:
HAHAHA
Good ol' Mexiacan sauder
Ah Well, I guess this is another mission accomplished moment for the president who has ruined everything he's every touched.
On the upside with 6.5% unemployment being predicted for next year, military recruiters should be able to fulfill their quotas with ease :twisted:
Drew @ 131:
No one knows. Not even the Feds or Wall Street knows WTF is happening.
LOL. Those guys suck at hiding their fear. The markets are in a panic, full tilt.
Everybody is scared, which means to buck the trend and look for a buying oppurtunity. Gold glitters but there's a giant selloff waiting for that too. Best bet is to lie low and wait til the dust settles. If the market is still around afterwards, then it's back to bidness otherwise we're fucked anyway.
I'm glad I got out of all investments before the new year. It's true, operators, like those Fox
analystsmorons, like that want you to stay in the market so that they can get out and leave you holding the bag. I've seen it happen more than once.Look at Cramer's fear. He's probably crapping his pants as we speak. IMO, the problem with the markets is guys like him want to ALWAYS be trading. They want to make money EVERY DAY. The broker's live off of commission, so if you're not trading into heaven or hell, they don't make money. Smart Money knows when to get out, not like what these guys want you to do. And getting out of the market is probably what Smart Money did a month ago.
I'm not panicking. I'm short.
Hong Kong is down another 7.5% tonight.
Dow futures indicate an open of -500 points tomorrow.
This will go down in history as the crash of 2008.
Snore @ 136:
It's total insanity. Out of control.
Someone up above had alluded to a conspiracy of sorts...this article lays it down pretty clearly as to why our economy is failing...
ARTICLE BY LARRY BEINART, author of "Wag The Dog"
OK, so if the solutions is for fiscal stimulus, then I say we give Iraqi's tax breaks from this point forward.
Chimpy McStagger can give rich Iraqi's the biggest tax breaks (because THAT is a solution to everything that ails you economically). The Iraqi parliament can then vote to extend those tax breaks, which will provide extra stimulation. And just to be sure the economy hums along, why don't you remove all the capital gains taxes, estate taxes, and gas guzzler taxes.
With the Iraqi economy set for perpetual bliss Bush-style, we can spend all that money here at home. Meanwhile, we'll bring our troops home. Redirect all funds to domestic projects (roads, bridges, children's health care, unemployment insurance.)
Tax breaks for Iraqi's, dollars for Americans!
Everyone,
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE
watch this video...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWyygiyPbdA
Please understand that this video is going to be THE answer, when the days and years go by, when all is said and done, let it be said that there WERE objections to our monetary system, that there WERE people who tried and tried and tried to tell everyone, selflessly, without concern for one's own benefit, that we were headed for this result.
I hope nobody says "but we didn't know!!", because the answers are right here in this video.
Please watch it, spread the truth, and help make this country better for the next generation.
Jesus, the Hang Seng is down almost 8% in intra-day, near 2,000 points, can't remember that big a drop, ever.
Not near as dramatic as the Nikkei drop this morning at the open, but this two day of the Hang Seng also has the look of dropping off of a cliff.
Maybe now the people I talk to everyday in China will understand what I've been trying to tell them about their respect, and blind worship, of all things American might be a tad bit misplaced, because nothing else I've been telling them about our decline has been sinking into their heads.
We greed-head Americans created this mess and the world's gonna pay now.
How is that going burnish our prestige with the international community?
~Nyc
Jeremias X @ 139:
Thank you, that was a good article. I have passed it on.
An aid to understanding. Some real gems:
http://www.financialsense.com/editorials/fekete/2008/0118.html
...
breaking news, hell has frozen over!
Read 'em and weep.
http://ca.finance.yahoo.com/intlindices?e=asia
Jeremias X @ 139:
Thanx...good link. Now it makes sense to me.
Stocks tumble worldwide on fears of U.S. recession
Volatile day forecast for Wall Street traders
By William Sluis | Tribune reporter
11:11 PM CST, January 21, 2008
1 2 next Article tools
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Digg Del.icio.us Facebook Fark Google Newsvine Reddit Yahoo Print Single page view Reprints Post comment Text size: A sell-off in global stock markets on a day when Wall Street was taking a respite, celebrating Martin Luther King Jr. Day, sent a chill through investors anticipating that Tuesday may bring a chaotic start to trading when U.S. markets reopen.
In a grim portent, futures on the Dow Jones industrial average were off by as much as 500 points. The Dow has fallen by more than 2,000 points, or about 14 percent, from its peak reached in October.
"We could have a messy opening," said Chicago economist Carl Tannenbaum, who said the wave of overseas pessimism seen Monday is hard to explain. "Much of the blame was placed on recession fears, but those fears have been expressed many times in recent weeks."
http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/chi-tue_marketsjan22,1,3164321.story
Like everything in life, it's a bit more complicated than that. And with all complicated things, American media believes you are too stupid to understand them, so they lie to you.
Global markets ARE over-inflated because all the money that used to go into US investments (making the US markets over inflated) is now going into other markets that have more stable currencies like India, China and Brazil. The instability in the dollar was created by complete lack of fiscal policy for 7 years, borrowing a trillion dollars for a useless war and a tax structure that encourages disinvestment in the US.
The relative stability of the US dollar was the only thing that forestalled this collapse for this long. Now that the dollar is junk currency, the wolves will be arriving to take what they can from the carcass. Now it is way to late to correct any of these problems. It is now time to pay the piper. So get your check books out because it's going to be YOU who does the paying, not the fat cats who created this problem.
I find it hilarious that these supposedly knowledgeable financial professionals are saying they aren't going to panic tomorrow. Of course they aren't going to panic. Anyone with half a brain in their heads completely sold off everything a month or even two months ago because this disaster has been obvious for 6 months now. The smart people are having a great fire sale shopping day tomorrow. There will be a nicely lucrative bounce from this collapse just before the whole thing sickeningly skids sideways and then starts it's final death spiral.
Great way to start the new year. Thanks chimpy and dick. Enjoy all our money you stole, you sick twisted fucks.
and the US market is virtually unaware of the markets meltdown, with MSM news blackouts and zombie Americans glued to nonsense 'reality programs' and lame-duck comedy to block out the bad news.
I see lots of blood on tomorrows U.S. open, good luck!
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