Meet The Press: CIA needs liability insurance for obeying the law?
By SilentPatriot Saturday Mar 29, 2008 1:30pm
CIA Director Michael Hayden appeared on Meet The Press this morning and explained to Tim Russert that he has recently urged his CIA employees to buy liability insurance in order to protect them against any lawsuits that may challenge the legality of their legal acts. Got that? Yea, me neither.
Download | play
Download | play (h/t Heather)
The Associated Press has more. It's pretty clear that the CIA just wants to cover it's ass once the DoJ comes to the conclusion that "enhanced interrogation techniques" really just means "illegal torture." It's a shame that the CIA, who really does (for better or worse) important work around the world, is put in such a precarious situation by this lawless administration.

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Doctors don't buy malpractice insurance because they expect to kill someone. It's to cover court costs as much as anything, because people will sue whether or not you were acting within the law. I really don't think this is anything to take issue with - we live in a litigious society.
He also explicitly said in the interview that it was not intended to cover previous acts. I appreciate that. If it is, roast him, but until then, it seems reasonable.
What good is liability insurance if it's classified?
"Buy insurance"? Where can we get that policy?
Privatization of the CIA....Unbelievable crap.
No agent will be sued for following lawful order. Its just an continuation of the mindset of a criminal organization running the government with the clock running out.
He looks like Red Foreman from That 70's Show.
Sounds like he is afraid that a Democratic Administration will revert to the rule of law and the Geneva Conventions. How quaint.
"It’s a shame that the CIA, who really does (for better or worse) important work around the world, is put in such a precarious situation"
Um, what CIA does this refer to? Certainly not the Central Intelligence Agency that Hayden directs. I suppose "important" doesn't carry a moral implication in it's meaning so yeah, 60 years of assassinations, coup de etats, death squads & support for dictators would be important work.
The CIA is put at risk by democrats more worried about elections than national security..
Why is he wearing his generals uniform? Isn't that a violation of some convention. The head of the CIA is a civilian post, not a military post..
ysbaddaden @ 2:
Daaamn - thats it. Thread over - ysbaddaden just stuck destroyed any and all arguments the administration could make.
Seriously, we see it all the time - like how Valerie Plame gets screwed over because elements of the defense are classified.
They should tell the telecom companies to do the same thing. I know why they haven't - because they have this administration stuffed in their pocket so they figure they can save some money on insurance and legal fees (because they know damn well what they did was wrong) by having retroactive immunity stuffed through in the name of national security. What they weren't counting on was the house actually having a backbone.
Woah...that guy's head is amazing! Where's Pinky?
I was also wondering why he is in a military uniform.
I made this film about the CIA getting busted in Italy; the last minute of part 2; I explain "why they hate us" and rip FoxNews a new one... enjoy.
part 1
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=_CVEMysbdOQ
part 2
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=wIFJltamP_A
It’s a shame that the CIA, who really does (for better or worse) important work around the world, is put in such a precarious situation by this lawless administration.
Of course, because God knows, prior to the Bush regime, the CIA has been such a fine, upstanding humanitarian organization.
Hayden gets fourth amendment dead wrong. How did we end with this guy anyway?
http://www.videosift.com/video/CIA-head-Michael-Hayden-explains-the-four...
Waterboarding is too good fore him. I believe I'd use Coca Cola. After all, it ain't torture.
ysbaddaden @ 2:
. . . Let alone for illegal acts.
How can you insure yourself for losses due to breaking the law? What insurance company would sell such a policy?
To the extent that the CIA is a more or less benign intelligence gathering agency I'll agree with you, "the CIA .. really does .. important work around the world."
But other parts of the CIA earned its nickname "The Company" for good reason. They do the bidding of The Companies - United Fruit, ITT, Exxon, etc. They assassinate, torture, perform False Flag operations, etc, etc, all to further the interests of the Latter Day Descendants of the East India Trading Company.
All paid for by The US TaxPayer. And as long as we get our TV, beer, "professional sports" and the freedom to shop most of us neither know about it nor care about it.
The only reason we're even hearing about it now - even a little bit - is that Bush & Cheney have just been that more wide open about it. But it dates back at the very time of the CIA's inception.
Check out "Operation PaperClip" for one example, or look at the CIA involvement in Iran, Guatemala and VietNam during the Eisenhower years, setting the stage for decades of America's bloody involvement in those countries. Or visit the website of the School of the Americas Watch (SOAW.org).
btw ..
"It's" = "it is" .. the apostrophe signifies the missing "i" ..
"Its" is the 3rd person possessive pronoun. No apostrophe.
My question for M.r Hayden is what if the courts decide that the CIA has broken the law?
The DoJ is corrupted, it answers to president Bush and does what it is told to do. So just because the DoJ says something is lawful does not mean it is really lawful. The courts will decide that and should. As a matter of fact Bush should be impeached for corrupting the DoJ. Of course there are a thousand other crimes the rogue president has committed too.
Why pray tell is this fucktard appearing on national TeeBee in uniform!
Last I looked the CIA is part of the civilian executive not the DOD.
Oh....
I forgot our do-nothings in Congress have allowed our nation to become in fact, as well as form, a fascist state.
Seig Heil General Sir!
moondancer @ 4:
The legality of the order the agent followed will not actually be determined until the trial, after the agent gets sued ...
Also, while the CIA does sometimes act as hatchet man, its primary mandate is to gather information. This, rather that invading Iraq, is one of the most significant ways to increase the security of American citizens.
To the extent that the CIA have been gathering information in ways we don't approve of, that's the fault of the administration first, the voters second and the individual CIA operatives third.
'The CIA is put at risk by democrats more worried about elections than national security..'
LOL - There are some really profoundly retarded people here.
Where can I get me some 'MORALITY INSURANCE'???
Oh yes, just take JC as my personal savior and accept that he died on the cross for me...I forgot.
The born agains don't need it but the rest of us should get it!!
I am selling policies which garentee you will get to HEAVEN!!
Morality insurance...Get it while it is hot!
Impeach
[Deleted. Don't advocate violence at this site. This is twice in the last ten minutes. Knock it off! Site Monitor]
Party like it is 1984!!
Yes Dick too.
Imagine a Nation under the rule of law!!
Banks and insurance companies....aka "repug banks of voters". Sure, buy some insurance, and blame it on the Constitution.
What a bunch of shameless idiots. Get rid of these bastards NOW.
Notice how the 'courts' were good enough for Bush in '00
But let the telcoms face the courts of Justice
Or these torturing cowards face the bar of Justice.
HELL NO!
Didn't bush UN-SIGN the international agreement against War Crimes RIGHT AFTER HE CAME TO OFFICE????
Or did he just unsign Clintons 'Intent to sign'...I forget there has been so much shit...
Did anyone every go to jail (or HANG) for the treason involved in the Plame case???
Yeah, I guess that was off the democrats table too...
something about a guy in a military uniform being head of
the CIA that gives me the jitters...
katy @ 25:
You sound too young to remember that Bushes daddy was a former Station Chief for China and the head of the CIA before he was president of the secret goverment, which was before he was acting President of the USA under Regan and finnaly he did become the President of the USA...
So the CIA is a great field league for future dictators and coup plotters!!
Side note..
China was granted 'Most Favored Nation Staice' by Bushes daddy in exchange for China's absaining in the UN's original Gulf WAR vote.
So the collosus that China is would not have been possible with out Daddy Bush.
hmmmm, my post on serving US mil having two job and two chains of commands didnt get posted, and its not just Hayden that does this, other officers also have CIA lapel pins.
We live in a country WHICH RECOGNIZES THE POWER OF THE STATE WITHIN THE JUDICAL SYSTEM TO HANG, SHOOT, ELECTRICUTE, INJECT....
I advocate for justice under the LAWS OF THIS NATION, not Violence
This hayden is one sick amoral son of a bitch like all the bushbots!
I guess you purge all the pro war comments out then?
Annoyed Canuck @ 16:
It's called the American Taxpayers. Look at the S & L scandal, or the current financial mess (Hello, Bear Stearns).
"THE CIA DOES IMPORTANT WORK THROUGHOUT THE WORLD"!!! WTF! The queen in Alice in Wonderland says she believes as many as 9 impossible things before breakfast...whosoever believes the CIA has EVER done anything GOOD for the Ameican people should be queen! This whole outfit has been based on lies from the beginning and has thrived on more and more unbeiliveable lies as the years go by. It is OFTEN said that the biggest lying-est "cover story" is that the CIA is an intelligence gathering organization in the first place. It is a war starting machine for the military industrial complex.THAT'S IT!!! Nothing more. If you read any account of what they have done that THEY didn't write (like the Pentagon papers sham), you know that they couldn't care less what any citizen in this country thinks. Only "The Secret Team" by L.Fletcher Prouty" will tell you just what they are, and it ain't to protect America or Americans. Stop surfing the net for truth, go to your library...get this book and then tell me hoe what the CIA does is so "important" to me....or you.
geneHUSSEIN214 @ 32:
YES!!
Secret Insuracne for those PATRIOTS who do badly in the secret courts and military tribunals...
I can hear it now - "I could prove my inocents but the evidence is secret, as are the charges- So just let me accept the payments"...
AND WE PAY!!!!
26 Bush is Ossama - "You sound too young to remember..."
i'll take that compliment!
there were times during the 70s i don't remember well at all... and otherwise, after the war, did not devote enough attention to politics... and then came the 80s and young children... something about ketchup being declared a vegetable began to wake me up... felt the outrage during the political witchhunts of the 90s... and i could not shake the feelings of dread at the indroduction of the dubya regime... but, until AirAmericaRadio came along, and then the blogs to broaden my education, i only knew enough to understand that it was the democratic party that i wanted to be aligned with...
and now, well, there are times that i fully understand and even pine for that blissful state of mind - ignorance...
too late...
Does C&L have any connection to the CIA or NSA?, because posting a lengthy comment on the legality of serving US mil officiers (not just Hayden but others too) having two jobs and two masters and two chains of command.
got my post 'vanished' without posting and server connection reset errors and C&L unavailable for several minutes.
Just curious if C&L is 'official' or my packets are being hijacked and blocked by others.
[If there's a connection, no one has told us about it! We've been experiencing technical difficulties all day. This monitor has lost connection to the site three times in the last six hours. And I lost one of my own comments, also. Just a bad day for the inter-tubes, I guess. Site Monitor]
why does he wear a uniform ?
detractors of the CIA have always claimed its a cross between the SS and a New England country club dedicated to keeping the status quo established, and the ruling elites in power at all cost.
Servants really being the masters etc.
andy @ 37:
and they lack the Coco Channel designed uniforms of their forebears.
Insurance? Ha! Insurance? Ummmmmm.....who's gonna insure them?
I didn't know you could get "I'm gonna screw over citizens in another nation and need civil protection" insurance.
Jeebus. The CIA. Screwing over nations for over 50 years, but now we need insurance.
"i only knew enough to understand that it was the democratic party that i wanted to be aligned with…
and now, well, there are times that i fully understand and even pine for that blissful state of mind - ignorance…"
Hey your still there don't frett - The off the table party will save US!!
Do you listen to democracynow.org ?
Or the Pacifica stations??
LinkTV
The Dems were right there SIDE by LOCKSTEPPED side with the republicans the entire time my sweet nieve countrywoman...
If a problem as complex as this COULD be solved by voting 'D' then I doubt we would be in this state. Unfortunatly it is clear from the decades of inaction that they are incapable of providing ANY solution.
It may be time to AWAKE - Childhood sounds like it is behind you, you still beleive in the tooth fairy??
ConcernedCanuck @ 40:
I'm gusessin' that all those years that the Rethugs were shouting "Torte reform!", they had shit like this in mind.
Everyone knows Hayden is military; what's news in that? Or, maybe you really DON'T read.
He knows they've done (are doing presently; under orders, perhaps) some scary shit and Alberto Gonzales' Justice Department is gone now, and Bush will be soon. Mukasey won't be around either.
It's not just a matter of Dems taking over, it's a matter of anyone taking over that is not the current criminal cabal.
If a CIA agent has to weigh the morality/legality of his orders, in his mind, they are most likely requests/orders for immoral/illegal acts. The CIA shouldn't even be putting them in that situation, but it looks like they are, and then leaving them on their own to defend themselves. Nice.
ferrofluid @ 36:
YES of course they do, as we all do it is called an internet provider...
Bush is Ossama @ 44:
just curious who censors postings on blogs based on keywords thats all.
[You didn't get censored, or moderated; your post didn't get caught in the spam-filter. You simply lost your connection. Look up at your comment @36 for further clarification. Site Monitor]
I am confused, I thought this was an English speaking Blog...
"To the extent that the CIA is a more or less benign intelligence gathering agency I’ll agree with you, “the CIA .. really does .. important work around the world.”
"They do the bidding of The Companies - United Fruit, ITT, Exxon, etc. They assassinate, torture, perform False Flag operations, etc, etc...
All paid for by The US TaxPayer...it dates back at the very time of the CIA’s inception.
Check out “Operation PaperClip” or look at the CIA involvement in Iran, Guatemala and VietNam during the Eisenhower years, setting the stage for decades of America’s bloody involvement in those countries."
Gee that sounds so... "more or less benign"
I guess “the CIA .. really does .. important work around the world.”
HUH?
It's obvious, he knows, "...the opinions coming out of the DoJ..." will not stand up to scrutiny, once people are actually able to scrutinize them properly and thoroughly. A firestorm may be unleashed.
**ferrofluid, -->I had a few "glitches' trying to post a while back. C&L servers not always perfect. Imagine. (wink)
ferrofluid @ 45:
thanks for clarifying this SiteMonitor, must be oustide forces, sunspots etc ;)
[More likely issues with our servers. Not everyone is losing the connection to the site, but I have been...and so has John Amato(at least once). Site Monitor]
[You didn’t get censored, or moderated; your post didn’t get caught in the spam-filter. You simply lost your connection. Look up at your comment @36 for further clarification. Site Monitor]
But your comments did get recorded by the CIA!!
[I'm not saying that you're paranoid, BiO, because the internet was created for the use of the US military. Al Gore didn't invent it, but he allowed the rest of it to access it easily. But I've always figured that someone's got the capability to watch what we're doing here. And after seeing some of the things I've seen on the internet over the years, I figure that if those nefarious watchers were all that concerned about what we type here, half of us would have already been renditioned to GTMO already. Just sayin'... :D Site Monitor]
If there ever was a closeted gay pervert, this is the one!
.
A rose(enhanced interrogation) by any other name is still a rose(TORTURE) just the same.
Gen. Michael Hayden is just a prick on that rose stem. He doesn't even know what the Fourth Amendment is or isn't.
He'd better have lawyered up by now. He's wise to advise the rest of his team to do the same.
.
Bush is Ossama @ 50:
they are welcome to all and everything I ever said online , its all boring, legal under the law and personal comment and ideas.
If TLA types are using TIA for gauging public opinion but not doing anything illegal with the results, then no big deal.
If on the other hand TIA is used for nefarious purposes in stifling or twisting the election and legal system, then TIA is bad.
Didn't JFK wanted to scatter the CIA into the wind and disolve this agency?
If I remember correctly it was this notion that fed the conspiracy of the CIA ordering the assassination of JFK, for which Bush Sr was photograph at the Book depository in Texas.
If indeed that JFK consider doing without CIA, that maybe it has some merits. This country was found upon one principle of having a fully disclose govt.
Sure, give the CIA protection for their crimes, but our troops still don't have proper armor. Love how they set their priorities!
IMPEACH NOW
BRING THE TROOPS HOME NOW
ferrofluid @ 53:
Yeah, I have heard it before - "If your doing anything wrong then what do you have to worry about?"
It is Americans with that view, that the Total Information Awarness age is neither good nor bad that have allowed our country to go to the DOGS.
But I am sure no one in this GREAT goverment of ours would EVER do anything nefarious so I guess you are correct - Everything is just fine...
paranoia @ 54:
IMO; hands in pockets looking shell shocked going by that photo.
Bush is Ossama @ 56:
that is the big question, do we trust our lords and masters to be 100% honest all the time, NO
"[I’m not saying that you’re paranoid, BiO, because the internet was created for the use of the US military. Al Gore didn’t invent it, but he allowed the rest of it to access it easily. But I’ve always figured that someone’s got the capability to watch what we’re doing here. And after seeing some of the things I’ve seen on the internet over the years, I figure that if those nefarious watchers were all that concerned about what we type here, half of us would have already been renditioned to GTMO already. Just sayin’… :D Site Monitor] "
What ever - You are a very unprofesional "moderator" if you engage in diologe and debate with those of us who are not paid to be here.
Any idea that EVERYTHING is not being monitered is abserd.
What ever the net was created for (like Gun Powder) is not relivent to it's use in the Kenedy assasingnation.
It is a fact that all comunication via electronic means is being monitored.
I would be more suportive of your efforts if you were to correct my spelling or some equally valuable task than I am in your QUASI role as moderator/commenter....
Just saying.
[Wow, I'm supposed to be getting paid to do this? I never knew. I could hop in and discuss it under my own handle, but then I'd blow my cover. BTW, it's "monitored", "dialogue", "assassination" and "relevant" . I could have fixed it for you, but now we'll just let it hang out there for all to see. Maybe I should report it to my handlers in Langley. Or maybe you should just lighten up. Site Monitor]
Bush is Ossama @ 59:
but which dictionary, American English or English English !
In my case its hard moving over to Websters English after 30 plus years of Oxford English :)
Maybe some form of Interweb english will triumph.
CIA gets insurance...when they haven't done anything wrong. Hmmm, me think the man doth protest too much.
And I agree with the numerous other commenters who think it's totally wrong for an intelligence man to be wearing his military uniform while wearing his hat as CIA head. He forgot whose puppet he was today.
Bush Is Osama.....you know, you're not paying for this. You are privileged to be able to post here. C&L does a great service in allowing a forum for folks to discuss and conjecture , and in everything they do. And no doubt the monitor is not getting paid. So please relax and step away from the pipe.
58 ferrofluid Says...
I think that is the point.
We keep 10 year olds from driving cars.
We keep 17 year olds from voting.
But some would put compleate life indexing data bases in the hands of WE KNOW NOT WHO for what ever secret and unacountable purpose they choose...
Not all 10 year olds are bad drivers and not all GOVERMENT officials are FASCIST BASTARDS. They are free by default and technolighy to look at any aspect of your life and they are free to TAKE WHAT EVER ACTION against you they deem prudent...Yet we can't watch them, no oversite, no rule of law - Hell no goverment at all if you are using the constitution as a legal basis for a goverment.
Take the wepons of mass destruction and the tools of mass oppression out of the hands of ten year olds - I double dog dare you.
You can't - They will see you comming before you even rise from your chair.
WHAT CAN WE DO?? Hoping for some ideas here...
I know!!!! We can vote again and this time, this time it may work!!
Our goverment is CORUPT. The form of goverment we have has proven itself incapable of defending itself - The bad guys are too smart and too powerful - They have taken over your goverment and its operations. They have made changes to better suit them and thier purposes...
It is gone, been gone for decades - The secret Goverment rules unfettered by our silly little comments.
max keiser @ 12:
Well done.
No doubt I'm on some government watch-list just for viewing that film. It's a shame that a criminal government has tarnished America's name for generations.
They are just trying to CYA themselves before the dems have the WH and Congress and Americans find out all the crap they did. Prison and bankruptcy are waiting for them--I hope.
TC @ 62:
Boy are you nieve...
A great service??? Yeah, I like to post here somtimes but it is not a service my friend - It is a busness. It provides an income to the owner - That's the service. If it didn't it wouldn't be here.
It is 'private property' and we all post here at the pleasure of the site mongelers as long as it promotes the profit of the propriater.
But correct me if I am wrong - Wouldn't a discussion or comment ABOUT me be "OFF TOPIC" - Where is that darn SM when needed...
They will not allow a discussion on the real politics of this site. And I am not talking about Dems/Repukes or the CIA.
This could be a different and I dare say a MORE USEFULL vehicle for social change - But as I have been remeinded so many times before - That is not it's purpose. It's perpose is to make money for the proprieter, not promote social change. See it's politics are non-political. The politics of capitol.
I am cool with that and will cease and desist from forbidden topics.
[Okay, we've gone way off topic. Feel free to move this conversation to an "Open Thread". But one thing before you do: If you think that Amato can afford to pay his rent with the advertising revenue generated here, just look into how much it costs for servers, security upgrades and bandwidth for a site that gets millions of hits a year. If there's someone out there getting rich off of a top tier political blog, I'd like to meet them. Site Monitor]
[Take it to an open thread. Site Monitor]
If an officer starts to, as Hayden calls it "handicap" the action, does that not mean that this officer is starting to wonder if what he is about to do is a legal action? Hayden says he does not want the officer to have to "Handicap". He wants the officer to do as ordered and not to question!!!! Thus setting up a Nuerenberg defense: : "I was only following orders, I did not question them".
Should an officer not always question the legality, even if mostly that is not an issue.
This is very wrong!
[Take it to an open thread. Site Monitor]
[Deleted. Off topic. Site Monitor]
“The CIA announced Monday that it will now pay the full cost of legal liability insurance for about two-thirds of the agency workforce. The insurance costs about $300 a year. Until now the CIA has paid just half of the premium annually. Only about 15 percent of eligible employees actually apply for reimbursement.”
Sounds like a sweet deal for the insurance company. Watch the rate go from $300/yr to 300/qt to 300/mo to 300/day. And what about insurance for outted agents?
The way I heard it was that the CIA (taxpayers) were going to GIVE them the "insurance", NOT that the CIA employees would pay for it themselves. This is the craziest thing I've ever heard of in my life.
Yet another piece of garage wearing the uniform of our country and spewing horseshit out his mouth. Moral cowardice has no limit with this administration.
jharp @ 14:
Formula is to hire idiots to manipulate them - aka puppets.
Liability insurance? That makes no sense at all.
I assume the interviewer made that exact observation. NOT
71 Roket Says:
... And what about insurance for outted agents?
sorry... can't be covered... pre-existing condition...
I watched some of his stuff this morning, and all I could think of was how in Gods name could one administration put together so many ass holes and when they lose one, to jail or chasing little boys or whatever, they find even a bigger ass hole to replace them with.
You have got to admit, for what they are looking for in this administration they have done some excellent recruting.
Write laws to protect corporations that break the law by spying on citizens and also insurance for individuals who also break the law? Would that insurance be available for all US citizens? Can I get some of that coverage? I guess I'd probably have to be a member of this, the most corrupt administration in the history of this nation. Thanks DiFi.
I have to agree with Hayden here.
People in our society can sue for absolutely anything, legal or otherwise, without risk - so long as they can find a lawyer willing to work on contingency (and there are PLENTY of them out there). Unfortunately, the person being sued is still stuck footing their bill just by defending themselves even if they're 100% right. This exact thing happened to a friend of mine. He owns a small recruiting firm and was slapped with a frivolous lawsuit that was thrown out of court the minute it finally got in front of a judge (which was a long road in itself). It still cost him about $500k in fees because he wasn't willing to settle. The type of insurance he's talking about in this clip would cover exactly that type of situation.
"It’s a shame that the CIA, who really does (for better or worse) important work around the world..."
You lost me there . Exactly how is important work "for the worse" ?
Criminal conduct is not "important work" , unless you happen to be a criminal .
I was shocked when I heard him state, regarding the violence in Bahsra, that the use of violence should be the exclusive right of the Maliki government. WTF?
Through the looking glass indeed.
You know why he's in a uniform. 'coz if he wasn't he'd look exactly like a mini-carl-rove
Aside from being a BushCo corporate asshole shill, that dude is really-really bald.
Could you imagine the sales pitch for this?
"We have the basic waterboarding only policy, which covers you up-to (but not beyond) $350,000 in liabilities. If you choose to go with the Gold plan, that covers all tortures that are really not tortures as defined by G. W. Bush such as, sleep-deprivation, sexual humilation, electroshock genital treatment (including both testicles) and any unspecified tortures you may have been involed in without knowing they were torture because G. W. Bush said-so."
If you pay in full today, you will also recieve this beautiful 2008 calender with photo's from Ahbu Graib that was personally autographed by Donald Rumsfeld.
Has anyone noticed how Hayden resembles a penis with ears?