The Hat of Moral Turpitude
By John Amato Saturday Mar 29, 2008 12:00pm
It was the hat all along! I posted about Sebastian Horsley, a British author who was detained at Newark airport and then not allowed into America all because---he wrote a book that Lucille Cirillo, a spokeswoman for the New York office of United States Customs and Border Protection said didn't meet the moral standards of the USA and he was therefore not admissible to our country. Now we find out a little more of the story:
To Mr. Horsley, who has in the past entered the country without incident, the recent fracas arose less from his past indulgences than a current one. In short, his very tall top hat. “It’s a stovepipe,” he said, referring to the subspecies made famous seven score and seven years ago by Abraham Lincoln. “They asked my girlfriend, ‘Why is he wearing that hat?’ And she told them, ‘Because it wouldn’t fit in his suitcase.’
One of the first questions they asked me was, ‘What have you got inside that hat?’ I said, ’My head.’ ”
This is just insane. I wonder if Lucille Cirillo was a graduate of Regent University just like the former top DoJ aide Monica Goodling?
This is a laughably, lamentably pathetic state of affairs for the United States, that paragon of freedom and of The Individual. Yes, we love the individual -- just so long as he is an individual like most others.
Nonetheless, on we go. Careful what you dare to think, and careful what you wear. You wouldn't want to be too threatening to the complacency that envelops most people, a complacency of such depth and pervasiveness that it becomes indistinguishable from death...read on
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In this case it's not the hatter that is mad.
I would think this story was almost an Onion parody, in that it's so antiquated and ridiculous in this day and age. And, of course, the hypocrisy, the hypocrity, ladies and gentlemen, is astounding. Than this author/celebrity, who I've never heard of until this story broke, was denied entry into the US because of his "immoral" behaviour. After 7 years of open sanctioning torture, Abu Ghrabib, murdering of millions of Iraqis, etc., etc., we actually possess the audacity to do something like this is a true moral outrage....
Well, this could be more serious than you think...I hear you can turn a stovepipe hat into a cantaloupe-firing mortar.
Sorry. Don't know they guy, don't care what he writes. if you think that you can go through a modern, post-911 security airport in full costume without having problems, you're FOS. leave the stovepipe hats, nipple rings, fancy shoes, and whatever other personal statements you want to make in your checked bags. I think I've had to go through screening behind this asshat before.
Mike
Why didn't Ayatollah Bush just issue a fatwah?
'Zounds, are you all balmy!?!? Of course we want to keep out ne'er-do-wells like this, clearly stovepipehatism will lead to reefer smoking which will lead to pre-marital [x-e-s], which of course leads to islamo-leftism.
The future is stovepipehatless my friends. Naturally soon we'll also "need" to keep out those wearing burkhas and turbans - those days will be grand my friends, they will be grand.
Now I've got to find my "John Deere" baseball cap, I've got a plane to catch...
Well, to be fair, it IS a very unusual hat.
VERY unusual.
And if he wore matching shoes, well...he was practically begging for in-admittance, a body cavity search, and expungement of his works from the American library system.
Come on now. Admit it. It IS a very unusual hat.
Yes, Abraham Lincoln wore one. And look what happened to him.
There might be a turban under that hat! Or maybe some toenail clippers! He should have to take off the hat, unless he has something to hide.
There's nothing the the constitution that gives international visitors the right to dress like Willy Wonka. Don't we have secret prisons for people that dress like this?
When you put a bunch of morons in charge of a country!!!!!!!!!!!!
Cirillo does seem to take "stupid" to the level of an art form.
"Individuality's fine. As long as we do it together." Frank Burns
For Chrissakes, he wasn't turned back because of the hat. He was detained and questioned because of the book and his past record. That his girlfriend was asked a question about the hat was coincidence.
Different Anonymous @ 7:
Finally, FINALLY someone with a clear grasp of The Big Picture.
I salute you, Anonymous.
Somebody better tell Slash that his Guitar Hero Hat is not gonna make it through the airports. Unless he is a God-fearing neocon of course......
Why is it shocking that a giant anachronistic hat would not escape scrutiny? If you are an official whose job it is to find hidden weapons or contraband you would be negligent NOT to examine the hat. People have smuggled freakin' monkeys on planes under hats! (Google it.) Outrage over "moral turpitude" as grounds to bar entry is one thing, but the hat issue is just complaining about a customs official doing their job the right way.
I pulled this getting off an international flight at Newark International as well, because I didn't want my $2000 suit and fedora hat getting ruined.
Yes, I did get called to the front of the plane, but instead of giving me a rubber glove cavity search, I got escorted off the plane!
If indeed he was denied entry because of his book, well, that just raises the bar doesn't it? I think if you changed the name of the bible to "Confessions of a man lover," it's author would have a tough time gaining enrty to this bastion of moral highground that is this US of A.
Andy "George W. Bush has never been elected. The ‘Machine’ took it and gave it to him." K Jong Il @ 13:
A, OK then...
I guess at this point is like trying to make a point for which part of a shit stinks less...
Wait 'til Cory Booker hears of this.
Yet another small sign of the decline and fall of Liberty.
A quote from John Stuart Mill, the great 19th century radical liberal, who wrote about the exact subject of this article in his book "On Liberty" (1859):
"Eccentricity has always abounded when and where strength of character had abounded; and the amount of eccentricity in a society has generally been proportional to the amount of genius, mental vigor, and courage which it contained."
mike @ 5:
Mike, sorry dude, but your lapel pin must be sticking in your butt.
The country is still America, you can go through with a surf-board or a lap-top or hand-held calculator. This was a case of him being selected out of a group because of who he was. Sure the hat brought attention, big deal, a pair of Red Zorries would also, but so what. So you sir are willing to give up part of what you have called liberty just because some jerk on part of this whitehouse's staff didn't like what you wrote in a book.
I guess you one of the idiots who voted these character in office and still wont admit your mistake eh?
Try trolling with some better bait.
As ridiculous as this is, I think you're making something out of nothing. The outfit may have drawn Homeland Security's attention, but it was the drug arrest that got him bounced.
This stuff has been on the books forever. I travelled into Washington state from Canada 25 years ago with an R&B band and the drummer got turned back because of a 12 year old pot bust. Happens all the time.
If you're going to get outraged about something, there's plenty of better stuff than this.
I'm sure a dangerous person would wear a costume such as this to board a plane. You know how they love to draw attention to themselves. (snark bite)
Yeah, the guy probably looked strange, but are we to the point now that if what you are wearing is strange you aren't allowed to come into our country. Whether it was due to his book or his looks, neither reason should deny someone a visit to our country.
♣Bangkok Bob♠ @ 22:
Settle down, sparky. It was the drug bust that got him bounced, not the hat.
sammy @ 16:
It is/was none of the business of the security folk what the purpose of the hat was, as far as they are concerned they just need to check it through the X-Rays and be done with it. But I guess you can expect fun things to happen when you put illiterate underpaid hicks in charge of our collective transport security.
The issue with the hat is peripheral to the real one: why are people denied entry on ground of "morality"? WHAT THE FUCK!!!!
John Doheny @ 25:
I've had a couple of drug arrests in my younger life and I travel the world very extensively, so that doesn't fly very well in my mind.
"This is a laughably, lamentably pathetic state of affairs for the United States, that paragon of freedom and of The Individual."
LOL - This dumb ass must be talking about the days of the Munsters, I dream of Jeanie, The Adams Family...Days Long, long gone where outlandish was almost the norm. But to make such a statment NOW in these days and times just indicates a compleate lack of reality grounding.
"Well, to be fair, it IS a very unusual hat.
VERY unusual."
Now there is the voice of the true average American - Stupid and afriad of everything outside of the norm.
And this story is relevant to us how again???
We need our counciousness raised to be more accepting of alternative fashion..?
THAT'S WHAT'S WRONG WITH AMERICA - Our fashion sense is way too restrictive!!!!!
BK Bob.
Nope, voted against all of them, hate to bust your stereotype.
But to wrap a patina of outrage around a dude that tries to fly wearing a flipping costume and is surprised when it attracts attention? Sorry. It may be my right to wear a Barney the purple dinosaur costume, and it may show how unique and special I am, but it screws up the world for everyone around. He isn't special. He's a guy in a costume with a big hat and a drug conviction. We all give up liberty to get on a plane.
Now, if you want to discuss his writing, I think that's fine.
Mike
OK, since both Cheney and Bush have multiple DUIs under their belt. Shouldn't they be denied entry to other countries?
Some more thought-provoking quotes from John Stuart Mill:
"That so few now dare to be eccentric, marks the chief danger of the time."
"Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives."
"All good things which exist are the fruits of originality."
"Whatever crushes individuality is despotism, by whatever name it may be called and whether it professes to be enforcing the will of God or the injunctions of men."
mike @ 29:
Ohhh, (shudder) I guess I should worry about coming through next time with my pineapple shit and panama hat, I'll be singled out for my individuality.
When people can't act like individuals that is called something other than freedom.
I will never live down to the "moral standards" of the war criminals and profiteers. Our job: to fuck with them constantly.
The Dude @ 19:
Not saying it's right, but past drug use has been a deportable offense for quite some time. When the Nixon administration tried to kick John Lennon out, they used his past drug offenses to do it.
-----------------------------------
The Dude @ 30:
Because of the DUI I got a few years back I can't enter Canada without paying a fee(last time I checked it was something like $250).
TSA are just like anyone else you put in a uniform. My experience (with a lot of international travel) is that the U.S. is by far the most unpleasant country to enter. They are officious, rude, unsympathetic, arrogant, completely lacking in humor or common sense and are a disgrace to the country.
I have had to help foreigners who did not speak the language and had no idea what they were being asked to do.
This story does not surprise me at all.
c. atrox @ 33:
You got that right. It's our JOB to question authority and to act out on abuse.
♣Bangkok Bob♠ @ 27:
Not all countries restrict entry for crimes of moral turpitude. The United States does. Sure you can cross borders for years without trouble if the agent doesn't do a computer search on you, but that just means you've been lucky.
You'd probably do well to research this stuff and find out which countries have these restrictions (besides the U.S). Otherwise you could be in for an unpleasant surprise someday.
My girlfriend and I went to an airport once long before 9-11 and we were there to meet her boyfriend who was flying in. When we got to the airport she went into the lady's room and put on a great alligator costume to wear to welcome her boyfriend to Florida. This was a big fuzzy green costume with an alligator head...all very professional. When she came out of the restroom wearing the costume, we went to the area where his plane was to arrive. A few people took pictures of her and with her, but no cops bothered us. Imagine if we did something like that today.
That was what was nice about those times, no one thought if you did something different you were some sort of criminal. For the most part you thought the best of people not the worst.
Now I'm totally confused, is it individuals who are fucked up, or the world... or America... or flying... or airport security... or Sebastian horsley... or John Amato... or me... or...
Don't answer that one about me.
John Doheny @ 36:
Been doing it for years, all through S.E.A, Asia proper, Russia, and all through Europe many times, even in the Saudi Republic and Yemen and Syria, so, guess they really don't do it unless they have a grudge.
mike @ 29:
Now, if you want to discuss his writing, I think that's fine.
Mike
That's bullshit. He got on the plane in his costume with no problem.
His costume and his writings got him banned from the USA. If you don't see anything wrong with that, you have rocks in your head.
BTW, a drug conviction will not necessarily get you banned from the country. Those laws are applied selectively, at the discretion of the Immigration Dept. What you're wearing at the damned airport should have no damn bearing on the matter.
Here in the cultural cesspool of American Politics - As I have often said, we define our freedom in personal terms TYPIFIED by spinny rims on our cars...
"When people can’t act like individuals that is called something other than freedom."
We have to act that way because we hate the reality that we are lemmings...
Superficailality stands in for the profound.
Surprized I didn't read - "Just let some one try to dress or act like that in Cuba, Iran, Afganistan or North Korea and let them see what happens THERE - They hate our freedom!!"
Now lets all go down to our local mono culture costume shop and buy our FREEDOM?
Impeach
Hang
Party like it is 1984!!
I think that he's just lucky that he didn't have any nipple piercings that had to be removed with pliers.
http://laist.com/2008/03/27/alert_nipple_ri.php
Annoyed Canuck @ 41:
No doubt, the guys wit the drugs seem to be doing fine.
♣Bangkok Bob♠ @ 40:
An ex-student of my father's was a customs agent, and he ran it down for us. Since doing a computer search on every traveller would create huge congestion at the border, they are trained to pick out 'suspicious' behaviour and then subject those individuals to the next level of scrutiny, which is a quick computer search for outstanding warrants or past convictions . His advice was "look the agent in the eye." I assume he'd also advise against copping an attitude and dressing like a 19th century fop.
My point though, is that there's no restriction on entering the U.S. wearing a top hat, or anything else for that matter. But if you know you have an arrest record that will deny you entry if discovered, it's probably best to keep a low profile.
Getting into a lather over this guy is a waste of energy.
Annoyed Canuck @ 41:
That's bullshit. He got on the plane in his costume with no problem.
His costume and his writings got him banned from the USA. If you don't see anything wrong with that, you have rocks in your head.
BTW, a drug conviction will not necessarily get you banned from the country. Those laws are applied selectively, at the discretion of the Immigration Dept. What you're wearing at the damned airport should have no damn bearing on the matter.
His costume probably had nothing to do with it.
He went through customs, they ran his name through the computer when he handed them his passport, and they stopped him because his name set off the bells and whistles.
He's probably on "the list" because of his writing...kinda. If his record was completely clean, they couldn't turn him back. But with the drug and prostitution busts....
Nixon and pals wanted to get Lennon out of the States because they thought he might cause a groundswell of Democratic "youth" votes. But they couldn't toss Lennon for trying to register 18-20 year olds to vote. But they could try to deport him for his past drug busts. So when deportation papers were filed, there were no mentions of Lennon's politics in those legal documents, only references to his drug transgressions.
The Dude @ 30:
You forgot Bush's coke bust were the evidence disappeared!
This thinking makes a lot of sense. Generally, hijackers and terrorists wear very conspicuous costumes. The 9/11 hijackers were dressed all dressed like The Artist Formerly Known as Prince, but the liberal media won't report it.
Besides, the top hat could have easily been a weapon of some kind, or it could have been used to conceal his true identity. He could have been trained to throw it like that Asian James Bond villain, or his real head could be under his hat, while his neck is painted to look like his face.
Oh, it's like the 80 year old man arrested for wearing a protest shirt. A little silliness here, a little silliness there adds up after a while.
An 80-year-old church deacon was removed from the Smith Haven Mall yesterday in a wheelchair and arrested by police for refusing to remove a T-shirt protesting the Iraq War.
Andy "George W. Bush has never been elected. The ‘Machine’ took it and gave it to him." K Jong Il @ 46:
Or he just pissed the agent off.
Look, I'm not defending these policies, I'm just pointing out the way things are at international border checkpoints. Most Americans don't travel outside their own country, and many of them don't realize that 'rights' of any sort don't exist at these checkpoints. Customs agents have enormous descretion, they can and will detain anyone they deem to be suspicious. This goes back far before 9/11, but cetainly has been ramped up since. I have a Canadian friend who no longer visits his family's vacation property in Point Roberts because he got tired (after two consecutive post 9/11 incidents ) of being literally finger-fucked by US customs.
Peope travelling into the United States routinely endure far worse than this fop, even when (like my friend) they have no criminal record.
Save your outrage for people who really deserve it, like Maher Arar.
Maybe the coneheads are on the list and they thought he was one of them hiding his cone under the hat.
jrg @ 48:
You've completely missed my point. The restrictions on entry for people convicted of crimes of moral turpitude, as well as the policy of customs guards to subject 'suspicious' individuals to further scrutiny, date back to long before 9/11.
Stop trying to make a martyr out of this goof, he's a poor choice for it.
DonsBlog @ 49:
So I wonder what will happen to me if I wear my 'I'm a terrorist' t-shirt to a mall? LOL
John Doheny @ 50:
John Doheny -
Point taken about Maher Arar. But if it's still valid to get angry about arbitrary exclusion from the US, based on whatever combination of eccentric costume, politically incorrect writing or old drug busts Immigration is using as an excuse.
They finger-fuck people at the Point Roberts crossing ?!? Good Christ. Yeccchhh. And I thought Blaine, WA was bad. I'm always extremely polite whenever I cross the US border. Some of those border guys act like they want to pick a fight with you. The aggression just radiates off them. I stay calm, give 'em plenty of eye contact, respond to whatever they ask completely and without pause. Once they've put a notation on your computer file, you're fucked.
danger hussein al-malak @ 53:
You'd be detained and questioned most likely.
He didn't have any problems getting into Canada.
If you need any info on this guy here it is http://www.cbc.ca/thehour/video.php?id=1983
And if you really would like to know about free speech in the MSM give this site a look http://www.cbc.ca/thehour/ on the web or if you can get it on cable even better.
Didn't meet the "high moral standards of the United States"?!? The only rogue nation on the planet of any significance, a government run by amoral war criminals, by mass, serial-murderers, by thieves, by pathological liars, by sociopathic predators....good God. This government is the most morally and spiritually diseased government on the face of the planet, corrupt to its core, lost in the darkest dreams of depraved despots. And they've got the nerve to talk about moral standards? Talk about the banality of evil.....
It can't imagine why anybody in there right minds would ever want to come to this country. It's looking more and more to me like a place that the sane would want to flee from, at any cost or risk to themselves.
High moral standards. That's rich.
Annoyed Canuck @ 54:
I guess having stamps in my passport from travelling to cuba might be looked at more closely then.
good thing I don't have any peircings
Is moral turpitude when rival submarines fire preachers into each other's hull?
to the subspecies made famous seven score and seven years ago by Abraham Lincoln. “They asked my girlfriend, ‘Why is he wearing that hat?’ And she told them, ‘Because it wouldn’t fit in his suitcase.’
Buddha...boom...ping
Why don't Obama and Clinton start focusing their debate on McCain. That way we the voters can start to see (and judge) how effective they are in beating the REPUBLICAN candidate instead of how effective they are in demonstrating that DEMOCRATS are self-destructive??????
I was once detained in Toronto for saying I was there to work. After sitting there for 2 hours to meet with an immigration officer she asked me who I was there to work for. I told her I was working on the RCMP radio systems and i'd be happy to supply a number to call.
She didn't ask for it and I was offered help loading my baggage and getting my rental car.
After that I learned to tell customs I was there for a sales meeting. They're the lord of their realm and you can't do a thing until later so you might as well play the game.
Only one hat truly signifies moral turpitude:
JFOE, The Jaunty Fez of Evil! (Watch for Turhan Bey sporting it in one of Universal's classic "Mummy" movies.
(JFOE is copyright LLGBT Enterprises, LLC.)
He doesn't look as much like Abe Lincoln as he does this guy.
http://www.afn.org/~afn15301/pics/catnhat2.gif
If he had blown up a Cuban airliner, fired a bazzoka off a dock in Miami and admitted to planting bombs in tourist Hotels in Cuba he would have been admitted regardless of his clothing.
'We' just didn't like his kind - What is the big deal here again?
Of all the fucked up shit we SHOULD be worried about...None of it is this.
As more sheep begin to run into the perimeter fence, they'll begin to realise that they aren't "free". They just never hit the fence which pens them in before.
Of course, the vast majority will continue to bleat in the middle of their pen, that they are free; never venturing more than a few inches away from the same small spot.
As someone who travels in and out of the USA several times a year, one thing I have learned is, DO NOT MESS WITH US CUSTOMS. They have always been a professional group, but they have a job to do, and they have no sense of humor about it. They also have more power than any other government agency, including the IRS. They can do whatever they want, and you have absolutely no recourse. They are highly trained in ways to trip people up with the most subtle of questions. Any answer that raises the smallest flag will trigger further questioning, searches, and further searches every time you enter or leave the country. Entering the customs area with a stovepipe hat and answering, "My head" to the question of what was in the hat is just asking for it.
Paul @ 57:
Well said. Regarding Horsley, one would think that once that crack TSA team examined his hat, and found nothing dangerous there, they would have then sent him on his merry way. But as Paul indicates, there seems to be very little in America today to feel merry about. Was it Ben Franklin who said that if one gives up a little security for freedom, one then ends up with little security and little freedom? Those words certainly have much resonance in the U.S. today while bin Laden [if he is still alive] is probably telling his followers that al Qaeda has won while the U.S. is on its way [if not already] on a steep decline from being the world's largest superpower. The U.S. still leads the world in terms of firepower but is taking up the rear in terms of liberty and quality of life.
You gotta admit, a stovepipe hat would be a perfect way to conceal a bomb. Also, if it were two midgets, one could stand on the other one's shoulders and they could wear a really long trenchcoat and pretend to be one really tall guy.
It'd be interesting to see what happens next Macy's parade
when the Queen's University Band arrives at the border.
All those men with kilts in their suitcases! What a terrible thing! Worse than the stovepipe hat, for sure.
What's worse is the tartan of the kilt matches the fabric of the bagpipes! Why that's like matching skirt and handbag!
Oy, veh!
They asked my girlfriend, ‘Why is he wearing that hat?’ And she told them, ‘Because it wouldn’t fit in his suitcase.’
Why didn't they just ask him why he was wearing the hat?? Jesus Christ, if past drug use disqualified you from visiting this country, the Rolling Stones would never be able to tour the States.
One of the first questions they asked me was, ‘What have you got inside that hat?’
Another example '(R)' security ... through 'stovepiped' intelligence ...
Snerd
Space Coyote @ 69:
Gotta watch out for those midgets; they hate us for our height.
geneHUSSEIN214 @ 71:
Because the hat never mattered. The person who asked the girlfriend probably wanted a bit of personal- rather than official- gratification.
"... The person who asked the girlfriend probably wanted a bit of personal- rather than official- gratification."
SG: NOT at all ... They were worried about the effects of an honest man upon Ame(R)ican culture ...
Snerd
The Dude @ 26:
That's a good question. I think that ignorance in our society has everything to do with it. We are all so quick to generalize about and judge others. Someone has got to show those illiterate underpaid hicks that they can't just go around judging people. Sigh. As you say, WTF.