This makes me miss the Bay Area. It seems to be one of the last places in the U.S. where it is still free enough to protest for your beliefs.

Rock-On San Francisco.

It does show that the US is capable of protesting SOMETHING!!

A friend(?) sent me this link. Turns out Tibetan society may not have been the Shangri-La that Mr. Gere and others would like us to believe. Even worse for me personally: Buddhism, not so different then the world's other whackjob religions in terms of societal control, corruption, etc. I hate it when one of my last few comforts is exposed as a myth.

Friendly Fuedalism: The Tibet Myth

http://www.michaelparenti.org/Tibet.html

As laudible as this protest is there should be as much energy and effort into our remaining in Iraq. And in response to the post above me from "Chicken Hussein Little: I too saw that video and it gave me pause as well. Worth watching for another perspective.

Nobody is claiming that Tibet was some sort of nirvana. Maybe some do, but they are not well informed. It had problems and corruption, but they were THEIR problems and THEIR corruption, and that was taken away from them in 1959. In the mean time, as in Xinjiang, there has been a concerted effort to place Han Chinese into positions of economic dominance and to dilute out as much as possible the indigenous elements. There is a deeply racist element to it, and Chinese people have been brainwashed beyond all possible comprehension of whatever happenedat that time.

Having said that, Tibet is not really our problem, and Iraq is, and I wish we had the same level of protests about the oppressed people in Iraq -- oppressed by us.

Humanity has a long slow slog ahead till people finally realize,

Why are we all fighting?

I cannot help but feel that the war atrocities of Iraq and Afghanistan committed by our military/industrial/congressional complex truly undermines the efforts of our people to effectively protest the atrocities of China in Tibet.

last_redoubt @ 13:

I cannot help but feel that the war atrocities of Iraq and Afghanistan committed by our military/industrial/congressional complex truly undermines the efforts of our people to effectively protest the atrocities of China in Tibet.

EXACTLY. We, because of what has been done in our name and without us doing much to stop it, are in no position to lecture others on how violent their governments are. I’m sorry but can the US claim we’re any better after what we’ve done to endless countries, in ways no better if not worse than China? We as individual citizens can, but how much weight will it have elsewhere knowing that we’ve allowed our government to run roughshod over the entire world for decades now? I don’t want to hear ONE right wing war supporter say a damn thing. If Tibet had coveted resources that the right wing here wanted to steal by force they’d only be jealous that they didn’t move in before Beijing.

If we had a president Gore or a president Kerry we might would have had credibility in lecturing China on human rights abuses. Just another of the many ways BushCo has undermined America's moral authority in the world.

Ruthless People @ 17:

If we had a president Gore or a president Kerry we might would have had credibility in lecturing China on human rights abuses. Just another of the many ways BushCo has undermined America's moral authority in the world.

No, we still have a murderous and immoral foreign policy that goes back decades and they would have taken over after Iraq was invaded , and the CPA's economic policies were put in place there. We could at least lecture them on correcting past wrongs, but if you look at our foreign policy, Reagan and his worship by so many here alone would make that difficult, we've never been in that position, we only pretend that the rest of the world doesn't know better.

Chicken "Hussein" Little - Not!! @ 5:

A friend(?) sent me this link. Turns out Tibetan society may not have been the Shangri-La that Mr. Gere and others would like us to believe. Even worse for me personally: Buddhism, not so different then the world's other whackjob religions in terms of societal control, corruption, etc. I hate it when one of my last few comforts is exposed as a myth.

Friendly Fuedalism: The Tibet Myth

http://www.michaelparenti.org/Tibet.html

Please research the dude before using his ramblings as proof of anything. This Michael Parenti has gone off on people like Mother Teresa for crying out loud!

So the Dalay Lama is now a bad dude, Buddishm a religion of hate, and the Chinese oppressors saint liberators now?

Wow, talk about blaming the victim. The amazing things some people will shill of in order to earn a buck.

Chicken "Hussein" Little - Not!! @ 5:

A friend(?) sent me this link. Turns out Tibetan society may not have been the Shangri-La that Mr. Gere and others would like us to believe. Even worse for me personally: Buddhism, not so different then the world's other whackjob religions in terms of societal control, corruption, etc. I hate it when one of my last few comforts is exposed as a myth.

Friendly Fuedalism: The Tibet Myth

http://www.michaelparenti.org/Tibet.html

Nothing on that website has anything to do with the issue of China's crackdown. Honestly, it seems more like the typical right-wing style hitpiece meant to muddy the cognitive waters of the dimly-lit reactionary mind.

The torch was disappeared! Just like many of us will be if we try to defy our major creditor. That is the message from Bush, who I predict will be at the opening ceremonies beaming in his lame duck suit. They've told him to show up and no demonstrations in the U.S. will be allowed. Screw the whole thing--it is now so tainted that even the athletes should be asking for a boycott.

Tyler Durden @ 21:

Chicken "Hussein" Little - Not!! @ 5:

A friend(?) sent me this link. Turns out Tibetan society may not have been the Shangri-La that Mr. Gere and others would like us to believe. Even worse for me personally: Buddhism, not so different then the world's other whackjob religions in terms of societal control, corruption, etc. I hate it when one of my last few comforts is exposed as a myth.

Friendly Fuedalism: The Tibet Myth

http://www.michaelparenti.org/Tibet.html

Please research the dude before using his ramblings as proof of anything. This Michael Parenti has gone off on people like Mother Teresa for crying out loud!

So the Dalay Lama is now a bad dude, Buddishm a religion of hate, and the Chinese oppressors saint liberators now?

Wow, talk about blaming the victim. The amazing things some people will shill of in order to earn a buck.

Hmmmm.....I didn't much care for what I read but he cited some pretty impeccable references to support what he wrote. If you had bothered to read it you would have noted a fairly even handed treatment that showed the Chinese as something far less than "saint liberators."

I've got a pretty good nose for propaganda from either side of the aisle, this seemed remarkably like a piece of well researched journalism. Perhaps you'd be kind enough to read the article and check the references before you comment on it. The history of Tibet and organized Buddhism has far more gray than I had been aware of or was happy to learn about. I've always told my daughter that the fact you don't like the information you get about people or events doesn't make it any less valuable.

To samdog:

AMEN to that!!!! Someone *finally* telling it like it is. God forbid anyone ever mention that innocent Chinese people were killed in the rioting...

The "Modern Olympics" are one monumental scam and should be ended.

China no more "liberated Tibet" than the US has "liberated Iraq" - both are illegal occupations of sovereign nations.

enough @ 32:

Maki Papadopoulos @ 26:

We had such a great coverage planned for the Torch Relay… it's really a shame what's happening! And what a huge disappointment for those who were part of the relay and their route was cancelled.

Nonetheless, we still plan on re-launching the site as a tribute to all past Olympic Torch Relays and the people who were part of it.

Web sites: http://www.torchrelay.org and http://www.torchrelay.net

I have nothing against the Olympic movement or the athletes. Way back in the old days of 1984, I watched and cheered the torch being passed near my home on its way to LA. But all countries are not created equal. The IOC should never have awarded the games to China, and they have shown a lack of judgment on many issues in the last few years. But the manipulation of the ONLY North American torch appearance is too telling. Somebody is pulling strings. The U.S. government is complicit in the effort. Please recognize that we have a police state every bit as dangerous as that of China's.

To enough: What manipulation are you referring to?

last_redoubt @ 13:

I cannot help but feel that the war atrocities of Iraq and Afghanistan committed by our military/industrial/congressional complex truly undermines the efforts of our people to effectively protest the atrocities of China in Tibet.

Its not the "atrocities" Its the simple act of invading Iraq itself. Even if we had done it "right"...it would still mirror the Chinese in Tibet. We don't have a leg to stand on.

♣Bangkok Bob♠ @ 1:

This makes me miss the Bay Area. It seems to be one of the last places in the U.S. where it is still free enough to protest for your beliefs.

Rock-On San Francisco.

You can protest anything you want as long as it's not against the US government, it's interests (big oil) and its institutions. If this were an anti-Iraq war protest you would have seen some tear gas, and beatings.

I'm getting really sick of all the fuss over Tibet, what the Chinese are doing in Tibet is a joke compared with what the Israeli's have been doing in the occupied territories for years?

I'm sick of it!!

glennser

False Dmitriy @ 38:

While Tibet is the current focus of these stories -- and as a Buddhist, a deeply important issue to me -- it is important to remember that China is also in the middle of the even greater human rights debacle of the moment, Darfur. China has protected Sudan in the security council against any real action, as Sudan supplies China with oil. China is a serial abuser of human rights, and should be held accountable beyond Tibet.

The Darfur relief group that Mia Farrow has been working with were on a campaign labelling these the "Genocide Games." Perhaps they should be spotlighted along with those acting in support of Tibet, giving broader bite to the complaints over China.

And the IOC Executive Board should be sacked en masse.

Just out of curiosity, don't you feel like you're on somewhat shaky ground coming down so hard on China assuming you're a citizen of the good old US of A? Considering our actions around the world since WW II and most certainly the last 7 years we really aren't in any position to criticize any other country. I wish it wasn't so but there it is.

Each of them probably walked to the protest in their Chinese-made sneakers, or otherwise travelled using Chinese-manufactured vehicles - hell, the Sharpe markers used to draw the signs are probably produced in China.
If these people were serious about hurting China, they would not buy products that are manufactured there.
Perhaps they should protest by setting a good example for others, as opposed to adding contraversy to an even that, historically, was formulated to avoid international skirmishes for a few days. Leave it up to the trust-funded, limousine Liberals...

X @ 43:

Each of them probably walked to the protest in their Chinese-made sneakers, or otherwise travelled using Chinese-manufactured vehicles - hell, the Sharpe markers used to draw the signs are probably produced in China.
If these people were serious about hurting China, they would not buy products that are manufactured there.
Perhaps they should protest by setting a good example for others, as opposed to adding contraversy to an even that, historically, was formulated to avoid international skirmishes for a few days. Leave it up to the trust-funded, limousine Liberals...

Naah.

Leave it up to the brilliant Wing Nuts and their superstitious belief in Tax Cuts and their use of Terror against the people of America and their lust for 19th Century Technology in a 21st Century world.

Fascist Republican pieces of camel dung committed Genocide upon the Iraqis when America was hurting from Al Qaida attacks.

IOW, we got attacked, then Republicans made us into Hitlerites.

We were mourning, and then we turned into Genocidal Monsters.

Better to ride in a Limo than to shoot a girl's parents, rape her, shoot her, and then burn the whole mess to cover it up, isn't it?

Do you have to call him President Bush? Can't we just call him Bush, or better Chimpy at this point?

samdog @ 28:

I was IN China during the week when all the Tibetan riots and the crackdown took place. It was very interesting to watch CNN contrasted with state tv (CCTV) and see their two versions of events. While CNN painted the riots as people reacting against China's control of their land and the rioters as some sort of freedom fighters, CCTV showed them as troublemaking criminals and swore that the Red Army was there to protect the innocent, and never fired a shot. Well, cutting through the B.S. on both sides, I have to say, the rioters get no sympathy from me. Cut out all the rhetoric about freedom and slave labor and what have you, these guys were common thugs out specifically targeting and destroying ethnic Chinese property. I saw with my own eyes how they pulled a man off his scooter and beat him to a pulp with his own helmet while hacking up his bike with hatchets. (Anybody remember Reginald Denny?) I saw as they tore down security doors on shops, looted the shops, then burned what they couldn't carry off. I saw as they burned shops and homes...one man lost four female employees and his own 18 year old daughter as they were burned alive inside his looted shop. Screw the demonstrators here, supporting that type of activity is unconscionable. I live in Los Angeles, and I have to say, had our government sent the troops into the streets of L.A. in '94 and put an end to that rioting like the Red Army did in Lhasa, there would have been a lot of cheering from the locals. How easy it is to forget when you were in the same situation how differently you felt.

On with the Olympics, and, shut up, George W. Bush.

Rednecks uber alles - you are at the wrong blog, mr wingnut. Strong fist does not fly here. Nothing to see here for you, move on.

False Dmitriy @ 38:

While Tibet is the current focus of these stories -- and as a Buddhist, a deeply important issue to me -- it is important to remember that China is also in the middle of the even greater human rights debacle of the moment, Darfur. China has protected Sudan in the security council against any real action, as Sudan supplies China with oil. China is a serial abuser of human rights, and should be held accountable beyond Tibet.

The Darfur relief group that Mia Farrow has been working with were on a campaign labelling these the "Genocide Games." Perhaps they should be spotlighted along with those acting in support of Tibet, giving broader bite to the complaints over China.

And the IOC Executive Board should be sacked en masse.

Yet another case of american hypocrisy.

Compare China's "support" for darfur crimes to america's active support (in the form of air cover/supply of intell and ammo) of crimes committed by Ethiopian government in its ogaden region and also its invasion of Somalia. According to human rights organizations, the post-invasion humanitarian situation in Somalia is the worst in africa. Yes, even worst than Darfur. But where are all the 'save somalia' campaigns? Doesn't it make more sense for americans to spend at least as much time on campaigning for Somalia (a situation created by their government) as they do for darfur?

eroded47095 @ 30:

We killed a million in Iraq.

Did China kill a million in Tibet?

If not, shut up until the killing of the innocent in Iraq is ended.

Thank you !!! These hypocratic morons need to protest their own stupid-hypocracy.

fact: America plays an active role in the crimes committed in Somalia by funding the Ethiopian army and providing air cover.

fact: The second largest largest American army base outside the US in Djibouti, neighboring both Somalia and Ethiopia.

fact: The humanitarian situation in Somalia created by the Ethiopian invasion/occupation is the worst in Africa (According to 40 humanitarian organizations: http://voanews.com/english/2008-03-26-voa29.cfm)

fact: Virtually no US media coverage of the situation in somalia

fact: American "liberals" and celebrities are fixated on tibet and darfur while ignoring Somalia and to some degree Iraq. (while both of these disasters have been created by their government).

Ignoring Somalia and Iraq? The subject here happens to be China. There are dozens of on-going human rights atrocities worldwide. We are hypocrites if we denounce the perpetrator of one without noting them all? Do you believe for a second I support the US sanction of these actions? Yet I am supposed to stay silent because I have a government I did not vote for?

Wow, you guys really are sold on that 51% mandate, eh? The rest of us lost so we must stay silent? I too wish more would protest these and other atrocities. But because the same numbers as protested the Vietnam War are not doing so now, I am supposed to remain silent? What dazzling bullshit. And what a fine prescription for silencing what few voices remain.

pathetic liberal imperialists...

Your right wing mongrels got Iraq, you play the same game versus China.

Same savage mindset of aggression.

Slavery, Beggary, Feudalism and Punitive Taxation plus end, routine torture, mutlation, eye gouging, tongue ripping, nose cutting, hand breaking etc for those serfs who could not pay the tax or who tried to run away

Looks like everybody buys into the Hollywood/Disney BS version of History/reality fn Tibet and the Dali Lama just as easily as they bought into Saddams WMD.
Sad really especially as I provided an easy path to find a good, impartial, authoratative and very detailed account of the relevant histories by a European Academic in English.

Tibet has never been an Independent country from China in the ways you people think of the word.

Bhuddism came to Tibet from China as part of a wedding arrangement between a Tibetan High Lord and a Chinese Princess.

The 1st (later 3rd) Dali Lama was a creation of a Chinese Mougul Emperor to help in his strategy of bringing the warring Tibetan clans to heel under on supreme leader and as one country.

Tibet 1951 was officially part of the ROC and was liberated as another ROC held province at the end of the Civil War.

The Dali Lama and other Abbots and Nobles fled in revolt in 1959 in reaction to significant Land and law reforms ending feudalisem in all its forms.

The CIA funded insurgency of the 60's was only participated in by monks and the exiled elite families. It failed because the ordinary peasents, former serfs and slaves were glad to see the back of them and under no circumstances wanted to see them back!

The much touted figre of 1.2 million deaths in Tibet during the 60's is a joke as their were barely that number of Tibeteans to begin with.

Still here is the guide again "Friendly Fuedalism - The Tibet Myth" and find out exactly what and who "Dubya's" new best friend really is, that you are all getting so misty eyed about.

don't these suckers know that the CIA is behind it all? the attempted destabilization of China. Ever read confessions of an economic hitman? destabilizing countries is what the CIA does best.

So the people are in the streets everywhere. London - stiff upper lip protests and Brown decided not to touch the torch. France - pull off a riot and put out that flame like only the French could. San Francisco - hanging off the bridge to stop the hanging. Maybe we should create a special Oh-Limp-Pics for those not-so-free societies to be paraded every four years. It will give us all a chance to show how we feel about injustice around the world. It is obvious that the media will only report on it if there is a sound-bite and a photo opportunity. Maybe something for tyrant to carry the torch of torture every four years. Mm, I think I have an idea… http://angryafrican.net/2008/04/09/oh-limp-pic-games-celebrating-tyrants...

What a bunch of hooie over nothing... Look folks, I used to watch the olympics every four years preferring the winter games personally. And I always admired the athletes but this thing has been tainted politically since at least 36 when Hitler turned it into a nazi propagandafest... I don't like it but thems the facts... I agree with enough@32.. China should never have been awared these games given their track record, so the IOC is culpable on that level. That the Bush administration signed on to this 'appearance' shit just reinforces the obvious about Chimpy Mcassholes agenda...

And as far as favorable p.r. for China??? Someone will have to explain to me how other than thru censorship and lies about the facts, those old farts in the PRC will be able to spin anything positive out of this 'only' American appearance for this p.r, crap where the the torch people have to sneak it thru town on a unannounced route with enough police and firepower presence to run it down the Baghdad airport road and then sign off after a heavy police quicky escort to the airport.. The only thing missing to this pathetic shit was bringing it in 'under cover of night'.... In short, sneak it thru town under a heavy police and security shield, and wisk it away as fast and quietly as possible. Yes, that certainly is headline grabbing and inclined to make one think of the very peaceful nature of the olympics or how nice China is.

Like I said, Hitler screwed the pooch on this way back.. We just won't face up to it yet... As for Newsome.. I think he did OK in making these choices which regardless of anything else, did minimize the possibility for injury and death... But the truth on that is.. While I commend Newsome in this post on his decisions here, I don't really like or trust him on most things... Fuckers got is own agenda he's workin and being mayor of SF is just a transitory thing for him on his way to something else... Probably something much bigger if things work out the way he wants them to....JD

Oh yeah the Olympic symbol of interlaced circles is as Nazi as the Swastika (although Hindus did originate the latter sign as a solar symbol.)

free america! return the US to the indians! nobody got massacred worst then them, not the even palistinian plus jews combined. And while you're at it, ask Gere for some gerbils. morons.