It seems that Religious Rightists can get away with rhetoric a Religious Leftist would lose their pastorship or priesthood for. McCain should be asked this, indeed.

OK .. i know this is off-topic (or maybe not!) .. but it's just too rich not to share .. and open thread won't be here for hours ..

From MSNBC's FIRST READ: The First Place For Key Political News And Analysis :

CHELSEA STOPS TRAFFIC ON GAY BAR CRAWL

Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2008 12:47 PM by Domenico Montanaro
Filed Under: 2008, Clinton

From NBC/NJ’s Matthew Berger
PHILADELPHIA -- Chelsea Clinton stopped traffic Friday night as she wandered the streets of Philadelphia on a gay bar crawl, winning rave reviews for both her politics and her appearance.

Led around the neighborhood by Gov. Ed Rendell, Chelsea was mobbed by local gays and lesbians, as she walked from one club to the next. They ran up to hug her, posed for pictures and certainly invaded her personal space.

“I grabbed her ass,” one young woman exclaimed to her friends after snapping a picture with her arm around the former first daughter.
...

Funny how those who come to Stuffinenvelopes' defence say that ABC's debate had the highest ratings of all debates so far . So this is what democracy is all about, ratings and ad revenue.
Though I will not be watching George dry-hump McCain tomorrow, I'll guarantee he laughs off the debate debacle, if he mentions it at all .
ABC= Disney= Corporate fascism

Mcmuffburgercain and Mr. snuffleoffthebus- Why care America? Why,indeed?

iraqhusseinconcilable @ 6:

..
ABC= Disney= Corporate fascism

And most Americans believe that "the US stopped Fascism in World War Two" ..

Conveniently forgetting that it was the American Fascists - the very people in power here in the US today - who backed Hitler, sent him anti-semitic propaganda from the pen of our very own Henry Ford, managed Hitler's finances, owned shares in the iron-and-coal fields that Hitler siezed from Poland to start World War Two, and took home bundles of cash after the War because they - thanks to GW's great grandfather George Herbert Walker - had mastered the art of international money laundering.

And yet the PROPAGANDA we have been fed in our elementary schools, high schools, colleges, universities, churches, synagogues, the American News Media and BOTH major political parties omits all mention of this FACT.

The Fascists WON World War Two.

But you won't hear that in your American History Class.

iraqhusseinconcilable @ 6:

Funny how those who come to Stuffinenvelopes' defence say that ABC's debate had the highest ratings of all debates so far . So this is what democracy is all about, ratings and ad revenue.
Though I will not be watching George dry-hump McCain tomorrow, I'll guarantee he laughs off the debate debacle, if he mentions it at all .
ABC= Disney= Corporate fascism

Actually, McCain will laugh it off too, as well as this roasting from Olbermann. See, they're all in on the joke. Seriously.

This is the New Normal. Outrageously partisan debate 'moderators,' free passes for all republican candidates, torture, secret prisons, spying on Americans, trial by Star Chamber, endless war, tanking economy. It's all a kind of post-modern performance art to these people.

How's Senilator Mcmuffburgercain and Mr. Snuffleupsomepus ?

MountainMan23 @ 10:

iraqhusseinconcilable @ 6:

..
ABC= Disney= Corporate fascism

And most Americans believe that "the US stopped Fascism in World War Two" ..

Conveniently forgetting that it was the American Fascists - the very people in power here in the US today - who backed Hitler, sent him anti-semitic propaganda from the pen of our very own Henry Ford, managed Hitler's finances, owned shares in the iron-and-coal fields that Hitler siezed from Poland to start World War Two, and took home bundles of cash after the War because they - thanks to GW's great grandfather George Herbert Walker - had mastered the art of international money laundering.

And yet the PROPAGANDA we have been fed in our elementary schools, high schools, colleges, universities, churches, synagogues, the American News Media and BOTH major political parties omits all mention of this FACT.

The Fascists WON World War Two.

But you won't hear that in your American History Class.

You exaggerate, a little. Bush's family certainly has Hitlerian connections. But the Soviets trained the Wehrmacht for years, and then the Wehrmacht came in and slaughtered millions of Soviets. Nearly every country before 1939 in the West had some dealings with Hitler.

And Bush's regime bears a few structural resemblances to fascism, but the conservatives as a whole lack more than a few key traits of movement fascism, let alone the regime in power. Don't get me wrong, Bushism certainly has commonalities with fascism. But to state that Bush's regime is fascist is a smear on the Holocaust and Soviet victims of the Hitler regime.

Structural and some philosophical commonalities and similarities, yes. The full-blown thing, no.

( blue 4 ) Panama red , ah the good old days ( q 8 )

Keith kind of reminds me of a modern day Emmanuel Goldstein. Only he hasn't had to go on the run yet.

Which is surprising after the way he scorched Bush at the at Correspondent’s Dinner which was by far Keiths crowning achievement.

ronnie mitchell @ 19:

some more good questions might be on how it is that Barack &Michelle,who have just recently paid off their student loans thru' book sales, are 'elitists' when your wife's beer distributorship brings in $100 million a year and you own EIGHT houses? Housing crisis...whats that? ..and now Dr. Mcbomb analyzes the problems of America's housing crisis,economic crash ..etc. quit worrying! it will be solved by knocking off 18 cents off gas(do it quickly as its jumping that much as we speak..or soon) so we can afford to dump more pollution in the air and drive to places we cant afford to be..WORRY NOT! 'it is all "..psychological" that takes a load off...courtesy of ThinkProgress..... . CAVUTO: I think you know, Senator, we’ve been in and out another all time high for oil and gas prices today. Oil hovering around 113, 114 dollars a barrel. Many are sort of jumping on your proposal to nix the federal gas tax — a little north of 18 cents — throughout the summer. Are you afraid though, by the time we get to the summer, we’ll be up that much and more in gas prices?

MCCAIN: I’m very concerned about it, Neil. And obviously the way it’s been going up is just terrible. But I think psychologically — and a lot of our problems today, as you know, are psychological — the confidence, trust, the uncertainty about our economic future, ability to keep our own home. This might give them a little psychological boost.

Let’s have some straight talk, it’s not a huge amount of money. But it might be nice to be able to save a few bucks and maybe buy something else the next time that they have to fill up their gas tank and say, “You know I’m going to be able to afford that little expense now.” A little psychological boost. That’s what I think it would help. But we also, I think, we need to stop competing for a limited supply, as far as the Strategic Petroleum Reserve is concerned. Let’s just stop buying that as well. But it might be a nice thing to happen.

We need to get off oil, period. The best thing would be a synthetic substitute like the Nazis invented in the 1940s when the Soviets had made them use up most of their supply. Make this synthetic compound capable of doing the vital things petroleum can do, and industrial civilization lasts another few hundred years. Let the oil companies keep on doing their stuff, BAM! The shit hits the fan.

L.A. Confidential @ 20:

Keith kind of reminds me of a modern day Emmanuel Goldstein. Only he hasn't had to go on the run yet.

Which is surprising after the way he scorched Bush at the at Correspondent’s Dinner which was by far Keiths crowning achievement.

I thought that was Colbert. ???

"Hero" John McCain as Phony and Collaborator: What Really Happened When He Was a POW?

By ALEXANDER COCKBURN

http://www.counterpunch.org/cockburn04192008.html

CafeenMan @ 24:

I thought that was Colbert. ???

Oh your right. Thanks. Whatever happened to Colbert. He get fitted with cement shoes?

Crybaby Keith

Last night on Countdown with Keith Olbermann, the MSNBC host spent part of his broadcast condemning ABC’s George Stephanopoulos and Charles Gibson for their role in Wednesday’s Democratic debate. For Olbermann to sit in judgment of accomplished news journalists is comical.

For the unaware, Olbermann was a decent cohost (with Dan Patrick) of ESPN’s SportsCenter during the 1990s. This was followed by a stint on FOX Sports, before landing his position as host of his current MSNBC program. (Previously, he spent some time on MSNBC, but left out of disgust because he tired of covering the Clinton-Lewinsky scandal.

Olbermann does excel at some things; he knows quite a lot about baseball, for instance. Unfortunately, his wisdom does not extend to serious journalism, or to matters of policy. Instead of original insight or thoughtful commentary, Olbermann offers a nightly digest of left-wing blogosphere clichés.

From time to time, Olbermann enriches his anemic program with a “Special Comment,” segment during which, furrow-browed, he lashes out — usually at the Bush administration — for as long as ten minutes at a time. It is riveting in its own way: haughty and self-righteous, melodramatic, overwritten, sputtering with rage, banalities, and quotations from Bartlett’s. It turns out that the mad utterings of a cable-news host can command an audience (though not a particularly large audience).

Like the band player who longs to be the high-school sports star, Olbermann covets the life of the serious journalist, and aspires to be the next Edward R. Murrow. But he is neither. He is not even Bob Ley.

Lately, Olbermann has become one of cable television’s most vociferous Obama cheerleaders. He eagerly waves palm branches for Obama, and criticizes anyone who dares to question the Man of Hope — hence his criticisms of Stephanopoulos and Gibson for merely asking the candidate about his relationship with Reverend Jeremiah Wright and William Ayers. These days Olbermann will often interview MSNBC contributors whose dispositions toward Obama range from love to reverence to worship. On his program, this qualifies as balance.

NBC News has a great history and it includes some of the best journalists working today, including Tim Russert and Brian Williams. But NBC News also has Keith Olbermann, and so long as it does, its reputation as a serious news organization will suffer. The esteemed among NBC’s journalists deserve better, as does the American news-consuming public.

---Peter Wehner

dennis @ 29:

Crybaby Keith

Last night on Countdown with Keith Olbermann, the MSNBC host spent part of his broadcast condemning ABC’s George Stephanopoulos and Charles Gibson for their role in Wednesday’s Democratic debate. For Olbermann to sit in judgment of accomplished news journalists is comical.

For the unaware, Olbermann was a decent cohost (with Dan Patrick) of ESPN’s SportsCenter during the 1990s. This was followed by a stint on FOX Sports, before landing his position as host of his current MSNBC program. (Previously, he spent some time on MSNBC, but left out of disgust because he tired of covering the Clinton-Lewinsky scandal.

Olbermann does excel at some things; he knows quite a lot about baseball, for instance. Unfortunately, his wisdom does not extend to serious journalism, or to matters of policy. Instead of original insight or thoughtful commentary, Olbermann offers a nightly digest of left-wing blogosphere clichés.

From time to time, Olbermann enriches his anemic program with a “Special Comment,” segment during which, furrow-browed, he lashes out — usually at the Bush administration — for as long as ten minutes at a time. It is riveting in its own way: haughty and self-righteous, melodramatic, overwritten, sputtering with rage, banalities, and quotations from Bartlett’s. It turns out that the mad utterings of a cable-news host can command an audience (though not a particularly large audience).

Like the band player who longs to be the high-school sports star, Olbermann covets the life of the serious journalist, and aspires to be the next Edward R. Murrow. But he is neither. He is not even Bob Ley.

Lately, Olbermann has become one of cable television’s most vociferous Obama cheerleaders. He eagerly waves palm branches for Obama, and criticizes anyone who dares to question the Man of Hope — hence his criticisms of Stephanopoulos and Gibson for merely asking the candidate about his relationship with Reverend Jeremiah Wright and William Ayers. These days Olbermann will often interview MSNBC contributors whose dispositions toward Obama range from love to reverence to worship. On his program, this qualifies as balance.

NBC News has a great history and it includes some of the best journalists working today, including Tim Russert and Brian Williams. But NBC News also has Keith Olbermann, and so long as it does, its reputation as a serious news organization will suffer. The esteemed among NBC’s journalists deserve better, as does the American news-consuming public.

---Peter Wehner

Good old dennis. Can't stand Keith. And snow falls in Buffulo. Yawn

ysbaddaden @ 30:

Stephanopoulis hardly qualifies as a serious journalist. He merely stepped from a political career to talking head.

Charlie Gibson is essentially a teleprompter reader, no Peter Jennings.

A sports reporter is still a reporter whether it was circumstances or choices to lead him to that field first.

Afterall, rash limpballs is nothing but a failed radio dj

And boosh a failed businessman.

He hosts "This Week', ysby. How did he get that gig if he was a right-wing water-carrier? And why haven't you or the left-wing blogs spoken up much about him before for his bias or unprofessionalism? Why just now?

Why does dennis get to troll here?

[Because he's not abusive to other commenters and/or the bloggers, and he mostly stays on topic. Simple dissent is not a reason that we use to ban commenters. But yours was a question worth asking. Thank you. Site Monitor]

General_Rennenkampf @ 2:

It seems that Religious Rightists can get away with rhetoric a Religious Leftist would lose their pastorship or priesthood for. McCain should be asked this, indeed.

Exactly so! The media jumps all over the Rev. Wright and Sen. Obama, yet gives McCain and Rev. Hagee (though why anyone would Revere a bigot like Hagee, I'll never know) a free pass. Come on, MSM, do your job FOR A CHANGE.

Do not pay attention to TV.

Look inward. eom

L.A. Confidential @ 13:

Thats pinkish makeup must be standard these days. Or Keith is suffering from High Blood pressure now. Which I can fully understand.

Must be your video driver is going out. Looks fine to me.

Snowball @ 42:

Must be your video driver is going out. Looks fine to me.

I'm to lazy to tinker with hardware and drivers anymore.

George won't go anywhere near a tough question with McCain. Senator, was your American flag lapel pin made in China?

My free advice to Obama/Clinton:

Every time Iraq is mentioned, bring it back to Bush. Every time McCain is mentioned, bring it back to Bush. Every time the economy is mentioned, bring it back to Bush.

Can America afford any more of the Bush brand of failure and bad judgement?

dennis @ 30:

Crybaby Keith

Last night on Countdown with Keith Olbermann, the MSNBC host spent part of his broadcast condemning ABC’s George Stephanopoulos and Charles Gibson for their role in Wednesday’s Democratic debate. For Olbermann to sit in judgment of accomplished news journalists is comical.

For the unaware, Olbermann was a decent cohost (with Dan Patrick) of ESPN’s SportsCenter during the 1990s. This was followed by a stint on FOX Sports, before landing his position as host of his current MSNBC program. (Previously, he spent some time on MSNBC, but left out of disgust because he tired of covering the Clinton-Lewinsky scandal.

Olbermann does excel at some things; he knows quite a lot about baseball, for instance. Unfortunately, his wisdom does not extend to serious journalism, or to matters of policy. Instead of original insight or thoughtful commentary, Olbermann offers a nightly digest of left-wing blogosphere clichés.

From time to time, Olbermann enriches his anemic program with a “Special Comment,” segment during which, furrow-browed, he lashes out — usually at the Bush administration — for as long as ten minutes at a time. It is riveting in its own way: haughty and self-righteous, melodramatic, overwritten, sputtering with rage, banalities, and quotations from Bartlett’s. It turns out that the mad utterings of a cable-news host can command an audience (though not a particularly large audience).

Like the band player who longs to be the high-school sports star, Olbermann covets the life of the serious journalist, and aspires to be the next Edward R. Murrow. But he is neither. He is not even Bob Ley.

Lately, Olbermann has become one of cable television’s most vociferous Obama cheerleaders. He eagerly waves palm branches for Obama, and criticizes anyone who dares to question the Man of Hope — hence his criticisms of Stephanopoulos and Gibson for merely asking the candidate about his relationship with Reverend Jeremiah Wright and William Ayers. These days Olbermann will often interview MSNBC contributors whose dispositions toward Obama range from love to reverence to worship. On his program, this qualifies as balance.

NBC News has a great history and it includes some of the best journalists working today, including Tim Russert and Brian Williams. But NBC News also has Keith Olbermann, and so long as it does, its reputation as a serious news organization will suffer. The esteemed among NBC’s journalists deserve better, as does the American news-consuming public.

---Peter Wehner

I thought C&L didn't allow overly long cut and pastes. As the trolls say at Media Matters: Why Is This Here or, more simply WITH?

You should be very appreciative of the latitude C&L grants you here dennis, your side won't allow us to post at their sites. You are the beneficiary of Liberal ideology and tolerance, not that you'd admit it.

George Senmacsc*ckonlips, er, Stephenopoulos has a chance at redemption tomorrow.
You probably already figured out whether I believe he will or not.

Stephanopoulus looks even more like the hack that he is. What a whore. One more reason why I will never trust HRC, Stephanopoulus is Hillary's lap puppy.

17. What do you say to the DNC, the FEC and others who've accused of violating FEC campaign rules, which you helped write?

18. If you're elected president, who will advise you on foreign policy? Will it be the same Neocons who advised Bush, such as William Kristol, Robert Kagan, Randy Scheunemann and others from PNAC?

19. Can you explain why, in 2007, you voted against the Webb amendment allowing US troops in Iraq adequate rest between deployments?

20. On October 26, 1967, a Vietnamese peasant, Mai Van On, reportedly swam out during a bombing raid and rescued you from drowning. Yet you've refused to publicly recognize Mai Van On for saving your life?

Leslie [Bitter Elitist Hussein] @ 49:

9. Do you think your infamous temper qualifies you to have your finger on the button?

10. Can Americans trust you on foreign policy when you repeatedly confuse Sunni with Shia, as well as Iraq, Iran and al Qaeda?

11. You've said that you have no economic policy experience. The economy is in bad shape. Why should Americans, who are concerned about the economy, vote for you?

12. Given that Obama is being asked to explain his past associations, can you explain yours with: Rick Renzi (indicted), Terry Nelson (racist ads against Harold Ford in 2006), Trent Lott (pining for a Strom presidency), The Wyly Brothers (corrupt), Bob Perry (Chief Swift Boater), Richard Quinn (white supremacist), Rev. Richard Land (homosexual hate), Ken Blackwell (Ohio election suppression), Charlie Black (lobbyist and according to John Gorenfeld's new book, Bad Moon Rising, Reverend Moon lover)?

You forgot The Keating Five! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keating_Five

General_Rennenkampf @ 16:

MountainMan23 @ 10:

iraqhusseinconcilable @ 6:

..
ABC= Disney= Corporate fascism

And most Americans believe that "the US stopped Fascism in World War Two" ..

Conveniently forgetting that it was the American Fascists - the very people in power here in the US today - who backed Hitler, sent him anti-semitic propaganda from the pen of our very own Henry Ford, managed Hitler's finances, owned shares in the iron-and-coal fields that Hitler siezed from Poland to start World War Two, and took home bundles of cash after the War because they - thanks to GW's great grandfather George Herbert Walker - had mastered the art of international money laundering.

And yet the PROPAGANDA we have been fed in our elementary schools, high schools, colleges, universities, churches, synagogues, the American News Media and BOTH major political parties omits all mention of this FACT.

The Fascists WON World War Two.

But you won't hear that in your American History Class.

You exaggerate, a little. Bush's family certainly has Hitlerian connections. But the Soviets trained the Wehrmacht for years, and then the Wehrmacht came in and slaughtered millions of Soviets. Nearly every country before 1939 in the West had some dealings with Hitler.

And Bush's regime bears a few structural resemblances to fascism, but the conservatives as a whole lack more than a few key traits of movement fascism, let alone the regime in power. Don't get me wrong, Bushism certainly has commonalities with fascism. But to state that Bush's regime is fascist is a smear on the Holocaust and Soviet victims of the Hitler regime.

Structural and some philosophical commonalities and similarities, yes. The full-blown thing, no.

It was Bush Family profits from the Holocaust - his share in the Silesian-American Coal Company - that financed Prescott Bush's political career. Located in Auschwitz, the Silesian-American Coal Company used slave labor from Auschwitz to provide the Nazi War Machine with most of its coal, iron, and numerous other metals. Too sick to work the slave labor was sent to the ovens at the Death Camp. Prescott's share in the company was siezed under the Trading With The Enemy Act and returned to him after the war as a check for $1.5 million - that's 1.5 million 1951 dollars.

And that is only one of many connections between the Bush Family and Hitler. It's no smear of the Holocaust to point out the blood of millions on the Bush Family's hands.

9. You are infamous for your inability to control your temper. Do antipsychotics to help partially tame that inner beast, and will either your uncontrolled temper or those drugs adversely effect your judgement while you hold your finger over the nuclear button?

10. Does Joseph Lieberquisling give a good bl [Edited. Over the top-Sitemonitor]

11. Does your wife know you're having [Edited. Over the top-Sitemonitor]
12. Have you visited a neurologist yet to address the clear indications of what we all recognize as the early onset of Alzheimer's?

13. You are a very practiced liar, very accomplished. I'm sure you must be quite proud of this gift. Do you have any favorite techniques you find particularly effective that you'd like to share with the viewing audience?

14. Finally,Mr. McCain, right here , right now, answer this question: When Hillary Clinton loses her bid for the nomination, are you going to choose her as your running mate, or will you choose Jeoseph Lierquisling - who, unlike Hillary who is still in the closet, has already come out as a the GOPer neocon that we all know him as today? Which one will you pick? We have a right to know.

MountainMan23 @ 58:

General_Rennenkampf @ 16:

MountainMan23 @ 10:

iraqhusseinconcilable @ 6:

And most Americans believe that "the US stopped Fascism in World War Two" ..

Conveniently forgetting that it was the American Fascists - the very people in power here in the US today - who backed Hitler, sent him anti-semitic propaganda from the pen of our very own Henry Ford, managed Hitler's finances, owned shares in the iron-and-coal fields that Hitler siezed from Poland to start World War Two, and took home bundles of cash after the War because they - thanks to GW's great grandfather George Herbert Walker - had mastered the art of international money laundering.

And yet the PROPAGANDA we have been fed in our elementary schools, high schools, colleges, universities, churches, synagogues, the American News Media and BOTH major political parties omits all mention of this FACT.

The Fascists WON World War Two.

But you won't hear that in your American History Class.

You exaggerate, a little. Bush's family certainly has Hitlerian connections. But the Soviets trained the Wehrmacht for years, and then the Wehrmacht came in and slaughtered millions of Soviets. Nearly every country before 1939 in the West had some dealings with Hitler.

And Bush's regime bears a few structural resemblances to fascism, but the conservatives as a whole lack more than a few key traits of movement fascism, let alone the regime in power. Don't get me wrong, Bushism certainly has commonalities with fascism. But to state that Bush's regime is fascist is a smear on the Holocaust and Soviet victims of the Hitler regime.

Structural and some philosophical commonalities and similarities, yes. The full-blown thing, no.

It was Bush Family profits from the Holocaust - his share in the Silesian-American Coal Company - that financed Prescott Bush's political career. Located in Auschwitz, the Silesian-American Coal Company used slave labor from Auschwitz to provide the Nazi War Machine with most of its coal, iron, and numerous other metals. Too sick to work the slave labor was sent to the ovens at the Death Camp. Prescott's share in the company was siezed under the Trading With The Enemy Act and returned to him after the war as a check for $1.5 million - that's 1.5 million 1951 dollars.

And that is only one of many connections between the Bush Family and Hitler. It's no smear of the Holocaust to point out the blood of millions on the Bush Family's hands.

Fair enough. I had no idea Prescott Bush was in that deep. Why wasn't the motherfucker hanged for treason?

But his grandson's administration does have many commonalities with fascism, but it has a few blatant and a couple of subtle differences that disqualify it from the label (the biggest blatant difference being the lack of an organized headbusting group, though those Russians on the West Coast do make me wonder.)

While the best thing Georgie could do Sunday morning would be to play this video very slowly, allowing McBush ample time to answer(Ha Ha) these questions, I think a far simpler time saving quesdtion would be:

Sen. Mc Bush, you are running as the Republican candidate for President. Did you vote in the last two presidential elections and if so, who did you vote for?

Why, George I did vote as any red blooded American would do, and I, of course, voted twice, for the leader of our party and our country, George, the Decider, W. Bush!!!!!

Well, Sen. McBush, given your acknowledged vote, twice, for a complete idiot, why should America want someone of your dubious moral and intellectual capacity answering the phone at 3:00AM or any other time of the day?

this was funny:

10. Does Joseph Lieberquisling give a good bl [Edited. Over the top-Sitemonitor]

11. Does your wife know you’re having [Edited. Over the top-Sitemonitor]

duh... what could it be???

Who do I have to pay to get someone to ask him if he ever visited HOOKERS?

AWESOME!!!

It should be obvious at this point that the MSM does not want any discussion of issues or proposed policies or seriously considered fixes to problems to take place. It should be clear from their handling of earlier debates that there are entire areas of potential national dialog and debate that they have deemed prohibited topics: restoring the Constitution, halting the advance of the emerging totalitarian police state, stopping the war, universal healthcare as opposed to furthering corporate welfare via some kind of universal health insurance scam... ad nauseaum.

The MSM is an instrument and propaganda organ of the unholy alliance between corporation America, the neocons and the Republican party, whose candidates can not win on issues, only on a cult of personality. Hence their treatment of McCain and Clinton, versus their treatment of first Kucinich, Gravel, Dodd, Edwards and now Obama. It should be clear, that as the spokes-organ of the unholy alliance, the MSM is attempting, and has largely succeeded in, dictating who will be a successful candidate and who will not. This latest travesty is just a home-stretch move in their orchestration of the entire election process. Their success at manipulation is almost total. They do not want Americans thinking about anything, how much less about issues or about how they have been getting screwed or about how their government is being stolen from them. The MSM's endlessly vapid and insipid treatment of this alleged debate just serves as another example of how they are massively manipulating or attempting to manipulate all Americans.

Each success emboldens them and assures them that the American People are too dim-witted and apathetic to either notice or care. So they just keep becoming more blatantly and brazenly open about what they are doing. I think they overshot it by a good measure during this "debate"this time, and are probably shocked that as many people are pissed off as there are. It seems to be back-firing...that or they are so confident of their control and ultimate success that they feel they no longer have to waste energy or time pretending to be journalists who serve the public's interest. I expect it's the later.

An email I sent to about ten ABC News executives today, for what it's worth...

DEBATE TRAVESTY: I'M DONE WITH ABC NEWS
And to think that when thousands recently e-mailed you, requesting that you ask Clinton and Obama about George W. Bush's signing off on his "Torture Cabinet's" interrogation authorizations, you folks just blew that off, opting for "Where's your made-in-China flag lapel pin?" instead.
Peter Jennings is weeping somewhere right now.

Keith does a great job of pointing out the hypocrisy of the McCains of the world. If only this was the way most of the media handled these issues, we wouldn't be in the mess we're in now.

It's Me @ 69:

Olbermann's man-crush on Obama is embarrassing.

Projection?

Politico.com reporters John F. Harris and Jim VandeHei have pointed out that "the balance of political questions (15) to policy questions (13) in the ABC debate was MORE SUBSTANTIVE than other debates this year that prompted no deluge of protests. The difference is that this time there were more hard questions for Obama than for Clinton."

Questions about FUCKING FLAG PINS? Are you trying to make yourself more of a laughingstock than you already were?

http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=63C6F505-3048-5C12-0030F1E8C...
[[Last fall, when NBC’s Tim Russert hazed Clinton with a bunch of similar questions — a mix of fair and impertinent — he got lots of gripes from Clinton supporters. But there was nothing like the piling on from journalists rushing to validate the Obama criticisms and denouncing ABC’s performance as journalistically unsound.

There's a substantial statement. I'm sure you can document it.

...This is not to say that ABC’s performance was flawless.

ABC's performance was abysmal, embarassing, worthy of tabloid journalism or the kinds of insults that elementary schoolers throw at each other during recess.

There were some weird questions (“Do you think Rev. Wright loves America as much as you do?”).

Do you honestly think this was weird as opposed to just incredibly bad and insulting journalism?

There were some questionable production decisions (the camera cutaways to Chelsea Clinton, the stacking of so many process questions in the first 45 minutes).

But there was nothing to justify Tom Shales’s hyperbolic review (“shoddy, despicable performances” by Gibson and Stephanopoulos) in The Washington Post or Greg Mitchell’s in Editor & Publisher (“perhaps the most embarrassing performance by the media in a major presidential debate in years”). Others, like Time’s Michael Grunwald, likewise weighed in against ABC. In fact, the balance of political questions (15) to policy questions (13) was more substantive than other debates this year that prompted no deluge of protests.

So you are just breezing ignorantly past the substance of the flag-pin-type questions because it is inconvenient to your argument. Plus the fact that it took them almost an hour to get to any questions of substance, by which time anyone with serious questions about our nation's problems had probably tuned out.

The difference is that this time there were more hard questions for Obama than for Clinton.

The difference is, those questions were ALL pointed at Obama, as you would mention if you had a shred of honesty or integirty. Since I assume you're being paid to astroturf this garbage, I can further assume you've neither.

Moreover, those questions about Jeremiah Wright

Which were beaten to death in ugly attack ads for weeks before the debate and served no purpose to but to demonize

, about Obama’s association with 1960s radical William Ayers

Dude, if someone has to tell you again it's going to get ugly -- he was FUCKING EIGHT YEARS OLD

, about apparent contradictions between his past and present views on proven wedge issues like gun control, were entirely in-bounds.

I guess your rule is, if I say so, it's so. You haven't got any other real basis for the truth of your assertion.

If anything, they were overdue for a front-runner and likely nominee.

If only to hobble that nominee in the general election by bringing up dirt from the bottom of the barrel which is what scrummy fake journalists do when their real job is propaganda. WHO IS asking these questions of John McCain, may I ask? Has he been asked about his adultery? His associations with G. Gordon Liddy? His wildly shifting positions (which are well-documented) on almost every subject. His fake maverick status? I guess we'll find out when Georgie Staphylococcus interviews him today.

If Obama was covered like Clinton is, one feels certain the media focus would not have been on the questions, but on a candidate performance that at times seemed tinny, impatient and uncertain.

Of course, if Obama was spun to be a candidate grasping at straws and desperate for some kind of advantage like Clinton is, you could say that. I guess the fact that Obama rallies draw crowds of 30,000 while Clinton's rallies rarely break 1,000 means nothing to you.

The difference seems clear: Many journalists are not merely observers but participants in the Obama phenomenon. ]]

I'm really searching for a sign of pro-Obama bias in the news. As soon as the Jeremiah Wright and flag pin stories stop circulating, you can come back and try for that one again. Dumbass.

Like all the Obamaniacs in the media and elsewhere, Olbermann is over-reacting like a 14 year old girl in love for the first time.

I think the biggest thing about Obama that scares the establishment so much, so much that they've carpet-bombed our media with anti-Obama propaganda and lies, and have recoiled in terror to realize it isn't sticking -- the biggest thing that scares them is the sincerity of our support for him. For the first time in over a generation a political leader has arrived whose supporters aren't merely checking off the lesser of two evils, who are genuinely engaged in the process. The elite who have cynically manipulated this country for decades with corruption and dishonesty are watching the Obama candidacy as if it's the end of the goddamn world. And frankly, I hope it is for them. You can scream about it all you want that this movement is somehow dishonest or cheap or whatever -- we really don't care what you think. Obama is just the head of this movement. The connections that are being made during this process will last a generation, or more. We the People are through with this charade of corporate-bought candidates. We'll have no more of it. Obama has shown us the way, but he's just the first major candidate. There will be others.

slippy hussein toad@76

"There’s a substantial statement. I’m sure you can document it."

Not one piece of documentation to substantiate any assertions in your entire post.
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ABC’s performance was abysmal, embarassing, worthy of tabloid journalism or the kinds of insults that elementary schoolers throw at each other during recess.

To borrow your one-word question, Projection?

Maybe you could show us how you take the high road.

Was it this? "Dude, if someone has to tell you again it’s going to get ugly..."

Or this? "Dumbass." Or this? "I guess we’ll find out when Georgie Staphylococcus interviews him today."
--------------------

"You can scream about it all you want that this movement is somehow dishonest or cheap or whatever — we really don’t care what you think."

You really don't care at all, do you slippy toad? Just kickin' back and chillin'. Not the slightest worry in the world. You seem to be very vocal for someone who doesn't care what the opposition thinks. Someone strikingly upset at what you perceive as an obvious injustice to your candidate; while at the same time wondering if the opposing candidate might soon get the same treatment.

Either you denounce it and scream for it to end, or you hope for your pound of flesh as revenge. You seem to have chosen the latter.

From http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=2505

On August 26, 1994, Liddy told his radio listeners: "Now if the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms comes to disarm you and they are bearing arms, resist them with arms. Go for a head shot; they're going to be wearing bulletproof vests." Liddy's advice that day was explicit: "They've got a big target on there, ATF. Don't shoot at that, because they've got a vest on underneath that. Head shots, head shots.... Kill the sons of bitches."

I wonder if Staphthepopulus knows about this?

I tried to post this a couple of times yesterday, but I was on my dial-up.

We're familiar with Charlie Gibson, he's from Texas, and had to put up with him for years. I did not call him a right-wing water-carrier; those are you're words, not mine. However he did so on this debate. What I was saying is Gibson is insubstantial. He came from morning TV news which is more traffic and weather than anything else. He then moved to Good Morning America, a vacuuous "news" show similar to where Katie Couric came from. Gibson was known for his folksy commentary, like ABC's version of Dan Rather without the foreign correspondent credentials.

The very fact that right-wing trolls are coming on to the site to defend the debate belies their attempts to paint the MSM as liberal.

Mr Olbermann-- You are my last hope. I cannot believe the way the new media keeps trying to tear down Barack Obama and Michelle Obama. The final straw was the ABC Debate with George and Charlie and NOW MSNBC trying to say Obama was flipping Hillary off--Really, is the news world lacking material. I would think our country would be better served trying to get the real problems of this country solved. If the media must tear down the candidate then I think all should be treated the same. I just heard McCain trying to make something our of terrorist George tried to connect Obama to-- well why does the media ask McCain how he could live with a thief and drug user. His wife STOLE, yes let me say again, STOLE drugs from an organization that was suppose to be helping people in need of drugs. Why not dig up Bill Clinton's behavior in the White House. If Hillary is such a good leader, how could she close her eyes so many times. She tried to blame everyone should could for the news reports that tied Bill to Monica only to have him finally admit his guilt. You know Keith "It depends on your definition of it" Keith you are my last hope for fairness--- Please, please do a commentary on what is important in this election. The American Dream is dying. The average American citizen is losing all hope. Barack Obama is trying to get us back on the right track. However, for some reason, the media wants the same old politics-- the same old Washington. If the media wants to stay as Gossip reports and wants to be members of the National Gossip Column - fine-- but if so report the trash on Hillary and Bill and Cindi and John. I think the Bible teaches us that one sin is no worse that another. A sin is a sin. So let the first one Hillary or John throw the first stone and let the news media be sure to keep reporting, reporting, reporting-- until we get another eight years of George Bush!!!!!