Turn out the lights, the party's over (or perhaps not)
There’s probably a general impression among voters that the House of Representatives is a silly, dysfunctional institution, made up of a few too many people who love to hear themselves talk, but aren’t especially fond of governing.
Today is perhaps the single best example in recent history of lawmakers going out of their way to prove that caricature right. John Bresnahan has the story:
Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) and the Democrats adjourned the House and turned off the lights and killed the microphones, but Republicans are still on the floor talking gas prices.
Minority Leader John Boehner (R-Ohio) and other GOP leaders opposed the motion to adjourn the House, arguing that Pelosi’s refusal to schedule a vote allowing offshore drilling is hurting the American economy. They have refused to leave the floor after the adjournment motion passed at 11:23 a.m. and are busy bashing Pelosi and her fellow Democrats for leaving town for the August recess.
At one point, the lights went off in the House and the microphones were turned off in the chamber, meaning Republicans were talking in the dark. But as Rep. John Shadegg (R-Ariz.) was speaking, the lights went back on, and the microphones have been turned on as well.
Before you rush to C-SPAN to watch the circus unfold, don’t bother — C-SPAN isn’t broadcasting this. In fact, no one is actually watching this unusually stupid display except the Republican House members, their staffers, some tourists in the gallery, and some reporters who happen to be around.
But the GOP seems quite excited to play this little game, whether anyone can see it or not.
House Minority Whip Roy Blunt (R-Mo.) issued a statement reading, “Although, this Democrat [sic] Majority just Adjourned for the Democrat [sic] 5-Week Vacation, House Republicans are continuing to fight on the House Floor. Although the lights, mics and C-SPAN camera’s have been turned off, House Republicans are on the Floor speaking to the tax payers [sic] in the gallery who, not surprisingly, agree with Republican Energy proposals.”
The point of the spectacle is ... well, it’s not quite clear what the point is. Republicans apparently want some tourists to know that they support drilling the coasts for oil. It wouldn’t lower the price of gas, and wouldn’t help consumers in any way, but darn it all, they really want to talk about drilling anyway.
When the lights went out in the chamber a second time, Republicans “cheered,” apparently perceiving a debate in the dark (literally and figuratively) works to their advantage. Or something.
Apparently, the latest update indicates that GOP leaders are looking for a “bullhorn.”
Rep. John Shadegg (R-Ariz.) told reporters, “I love this. Congress can be so boring.... This is a kick.”
It’s hard to overstate how truly ridiculous these unhinged fools really are. One wonders how long it will take for the Republican Party to rediscover the value of acting like grown-ups.
I was talking to a source at the DNC about this, who said, “Republicans must think Big Oil is paying them by the hour.”
That about sums it up.
Label it as the "stupid obstructionist" event...
make a caqtalog of the republicans obstruction votes and post it.
Umm, the idiots really like this one.
I think they just overplayed their hand. The House was adjourned and the Rethuglicans refused to accept that "Democratic" vote for adjournment. (In favor of more oil profits.) This is a trial balloon for losing the presidential election and refusing to admit it later this year or early in 2009.
If they violated any rules or laws, I say prosecute heavily right now.
playing footsie in washington while the empire burns? AWESOME.
Not sure why they turned the lights and mics back on. In fact, they should have locked the doors from the outside and gone home for a month. When they returned, after the dessicated corpses were removed, the house could get back to doing the people's work, instead of the lobbyist's work.
Ok, far from my mind the idea of standing on the Republican's side, but...
Is that really any more of a childish circus than, say, a filibuster? (although a filibuster does generate results)
Can we honestly say that if it were Democrats playing this game over, say, FISA, we would not be praising their courage and dedication?
I'm just saying...and I'm probably wrong.
Can we have the room sprayed for cockroaches too?
Wow. What a bunch of sore losers.
But I already knew how much of sore winners they were.
Seriously, I am a Democrat all the way... but if the roles were reversed on this and the dems were pushing a dem issue... this place would be up in arms about this.
They're like children.
HITLER (adj): someone who doesn't let a teenager or republican do whatever they want to do.
After 8 years of the repubs kissing ass, now that's it's election time
BAM! they're all over the job. The job of fattening their friends at taxpayer expense.
"Democrat [sic] 5-Week Vacation"? You mean to tell me, Rep. Blunt, that this vacation is some new practice that just got instituted this year? Care to take a look back at how many days Congress took off when the Republicans were running the show? I still haven't figured out why "Democrat" is used as a slur in place of "Democratic". It just looks like they don't know the name of the opposition party or that their grammar is terrible. This whole display is a circus: a circus with no lights, little audience, and a lot of elephants not so much doing tricks as they are making a mess and trumpeting enthusiastically about it. What really gets me is the feeling in my gut that the Democrats will cave and end up giving the oil companies everything they want.
Rep. John Shadegg (R-8th Grade) gets a kick out of ignoring the rules. Does that make him a maverick in waiting?
ObiterDicta @ 5:
The big difference is everyone else is required to stay during a filibuster because something relevant is being discussed. When everyone else makes the motion to leave and shut off the lights, it means those guys are discussing something totally irrelevant.
ObiterDicta @ 5:
I think it's different to some extent, although I know what you're saying and I probably would be singing a different tune if the shoe were on the other foot and the metaphors were getting even more mixed. A filibuster at least has formal rules and can be affected through various Congressional procedures, while clearly allowing plenty of room for theatrics. What the Republicans are doing now just seems like throwing a temper tantrum and trying to act tough.
They are not there because they care a damn about all of us being squeezed by the oil companies- they are there because they made promises to the oily enitities and lobbyists....they are there yelling in the dark..yet they have been governing in the dark for 8 very long years....it really is time for them to go home..."Drilling" is not going to solve a single problem that working class americans are dealing with right now......
"The so-called Left-Right political spectrum is our own creation. In fact, it accurately reflects our careful, artificial polarization of the population on phony issues that prevents the issue of our power from arising in their minds."
-The Occult Technocracy of Power
Was turning out the lights the Democrats nuclear option?
This shows when left to their own devices, Republicans reveal their true colors.. a bunch of fratboy idiots who dont give a shit about anyone but themselves.
They block everything to make sure the oil companies get even more profit, then have a temper tantrum when they dont get their way.
When Pelosi comes back they should simply not allow any Republican to enter the House, then the real reform can start.
I have no idea what tags were on this, or even if it's still in the old posts, but..
Didn't this happen somewhat in reverse not terribly long ago? The pre-2006 Dems wanted to discuss something or other, and the speaker decided that he didn't wanna, and shut everything down.
The big difference was that the Repugs left, I think, during the middle of a regular business day?
Anybody remember the details?
(And, yes, people on this site were really furious because in that case, the regular business was interrupted.)
not nice, thats more akin to tactics of the 109th Republican Congress.
We expect better from the 110th.
Thrillhouse @ 14:
I agree with you completely.
My main thought after reading the article, basically, was that I don't believe for a second that the Democratic House Reps are above pulling this kind of tantrum. Representative democracy is all about this kind of posturing, phony outrage and theatrics. I live in a Parliamentary democracy, and it's the same game.
Drill Now!! Drill their heads and lobotomize these dinosaurs!!! SHEESH, WHAT A BUNCH OF DUMMIES.
If the oil companies wanted offshore oil drilling it would of happened a long time ago.
The US Government is just a rubber stamp mechanism for Corporate America.
Offshore oil is expensive to extract; it is much cheaper to suck it out of the ground in the Middle East.
Even if Congress opens up these areas; the oil companies are not going to drill there.
The problem that we have is with the Futures Market.
People have intentionally driven up the price of oil through speculation.
It's Shark Week.
'nuff said.
OH PLEASE! Stop bashing the republicans for a sec and would you look at ALL the congressmen/women??? They're going on a fucking 5 week vacation while I'm stuck at this same shitty job earning barely more than minimum wage and NO vacation and these assholes think they can just blow off for five weeks so they can go back to their homestates and suck the dicks of the special interests!? Fuck you Nancy Pelosi, Fuck you John Kerry, Fuck you everyone who takes my tax dollars and goes on vacation. Is there ANYONE running for office who doesn't just do it to line their own pockets????
All Democrats are Crooks and Liars.
All Republicans are Crooks and Liars.
Why doesn't the site load in IE?
(I don't use IE, but I've seen other ppl bitching about it.)
One thing, with the economic meltdown happening, and the ever present threat of POTUS recess appointments that happen during adjournments,
should Congress go off for their five week paid vacation 'business as usual' and let the country go to hell.
Then again who cares, its summer time lets get drunk and watch it all burn.
The House of Representatives is an incumbency racket. All of them, of both parties, work together to stay in office. They know they can muddle along and stay in office for 12+ years.
displeased...Did you see my comment at 16?
Paris Hilton's Tax Cut http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RBI8CGDnCQ
Yes, congress is going on vacation while our nation implodes.
Charles @ 29:
Nope, I didn't see it when I posted, but I totally agree.
displeased @ 25:
very few, prob barely a handful that really care about the people.
The American people are not entirely innocent. We have been so lulled to sleep by the financier-owned media that we have allowed these disasters to take place and are now reaping the consequences.
"The Technetronic era involves the gradual appearance of a more controlled society. Such a society would be dominated by an elite, unrestrained by traditional values."
- Zbigniew Brzezinski
Congress is a joke. A bunch of ass clowns to divert us from the real power. Just a bad play with bad actors.
L.A. Confidential @ 34:
You used to be a staunch Dem. What was the catalyst for you?
I wonder what the SETI people would find if they focused their radio-telescopes on the House of Representatives?
"The real rulers in Washington are invisible, and exercise power from behind the scenes."
- Felix Frankfurter (Supreme Court Justice, 1952)
mongoose @ 19:
Wasn't it regarding the Patriot Act? Sensenbrenner gaveled committee hearings in the middle of witnesses testifying about human and civil rights abuses. I think the Dems used a rarely used rule to get the testimony when Sensenbrenner cut the mics.
Peter G @ 38:
No signs of life.
Ruthless People @ 17:
It was the only thing that was left on the table.
L.A. Confidential @ 34:
and 'rage fatigue' , seven years sleaze of the Bush administration, the stomach turning criminality of the Iraq War.
"That which we say to the crowd is 'we worship God'...The religion should be, by all us initiates of the high degrees, maintained in the purity of the Lucifer doctrine...Yes! Lucifer is God."
- Albert Pike (in a letter he wrote to the heads of his Palladian Councils July 14, 1889)
Even the corporate MSM isn't picking it up.
IE is an inherently broken web-browser.
Use Opera (all platforms), Firefox (all platforms), Konqueror (Linux), or Safari (Mac/Windows). If your response is "I don't wanna", well, don't blame the website because you can't be bothered to use a working browser. All the above options are free as in beer; all but one and a half (Opera and parts of Safari) are free as in beer and free as in freedom.
sherifffriuitfly @ 26:
I just changed to Firefox. I couldn't load it in IE -- operation aborted! Good grief!
Firefox works fine!
Because Microsoft sucks?
L.A. Confidential @ 34:
If it is the intent of the corporate media, it is hard for me to accept blame. They sold a bill of goods that was easy to buy. The only thing that the populace lacked was common sense, but they were programmed to think that they didn't need it. They thought that someone in the MSM would use common sense. Don't blame the victim.
Sigh..... Our government, on both sides of the aisle, is largely composed of petulant children. No wonder we are in such a mess.
"The CFR, dedicated to one-world government, financed by a number of the largest tax-exempt foundations, and wielding such power and influence over our lives in the areas of finance, business, labor, military, education, and mass communication-media, should be familiar to every American concerned with good government, and with preserving and defending the U.S. Constitution and our free-enterprise system. Yet, the nation's right-to-know machinery, the news media, usually so aggressive in exposures to inform our people, remain conspicuously silent when it comes to the CFR, its members and their activities."
- Congressman John R. Rarick
Laura Ingraham was filling in for O'Reilly tonight and mentioned this and then continued to try and paint the Democrats as a joke by saying "What has the Democratic House actually done for us?" The fact that this notion plays on the premise of the willfully ignorant that tend to watch O'Reilly and listen to her radio show will probably believe the ensuing stupidity she spouts out because they probably didn't care to remember high school civics.
Look, I expect that kind of crap from FOX "News", but the rest of the media should be pointing out, everytime they bring up the "failure" of the Democratic Congress (and believe me, I've been infuriated by some of the crap they've pulled in the last couple of years myself), they should point out that when the House passes something that the Democrats want to do, the Congressional Republicans will block it. This is where the Democrats fail the media game. They should take every opportunity to just get on TV and say "hey, we came up with this idea we wanted to get started on with this bill, but the Republicans didn't want an up or down vote." They should continue to call for an "up or down" vote. If someone tries to call them out on it from the other side, they should then point to them and say "hey, we figured if the Republicans can get their way crying about it to the media, we'd give it a shot in the exact same way."
The Democrats ARE a joke. But alas, so are the Refucklicons.
DHavok @ 52:
filibuster,veto,signing statements and executive privilege....just a few details in the way of a paper thin majority....oh and forgot....administration secrecy
In Parliamentary procedure, the house is in recess. There is no business in order and there is no propriety to them being there. It is just a stunt, such as during the consideration of contempt citations for Bolton and Miers when the Republicans walked out, en masse.
My feeling at the time was that they should have kept walking, perhaps to Bermuda.
How easily the general public is duped by the rhetoric of this two party system.
Ex-Canuck @ 50:
Petulant Child is a pretty good description for the average American, and our elected officials are frighteningly average.
Two points: First, for all of those who criticize this "excessive" vacationing should remember that Congress has to go home and touch base with their constituents and oh, by the way, ATTEND THE NATIONAL CONVENTION TO CHOOSE OUR NEXT PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE!!! Secondly, would you like to compare Congress's attendance record with Bush's?
We have been discussing "energy independence" since President Carter was mocked for suggesting we turn down the thermostat & wear sweaters. Since then, we've had nearly 20 years of Republican rule (2 Reagans, Bush I, and nearly 2 Bush II) and the majority of that time a Republican Congress. So puh-----lease quit trying to act like it's an emergency and that it's the Dem's fault!
ALThomas @ 8:
Bullcrap! The republicans voted NO just last week to make the oil companies drill on the millions of acres that they already have leases on. I'm not sure what this whole "offshore" thing is about, but it is NOT for cheaper gas prices. They seem awful desperate to get those leases, which is a sure bet that something is fishy.
ObiterDicta @ 5:
The big diff being, this happening because of FISA would be in the people's best interest. This is not.
Sadly it might get them publicity points in the lamestream media.
They should threaten those guys to hold them in contempt of congress! That'll get 'em!
Janet @ 59:
What it is about is the failed policies of the GOP that have driven the American economy into a ditch and they have to some how try to shift the blame for what they have and haven't done for the last 8 years.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25287795/page/2/
The Rethuglicans are pulling a cheap theatrical stunt to try and cover up the results of their disastrous policies.
Janet @ 59:
Once they get those leases, the oil under that land becomes an asset and the company increases it's net worth by hundreds of millions of dollars; pushing the stock price even higher. The fact that the oil industry can't and has no desire to actually drill and pump that oil anytime soon makes no difference.
It's all about getting the numbers up for the next quarterly report in order to collect those big bonus checks.
What did you expect? They're republicans.
Off topic(kinda)
All I have to say is that I'm very disappointed in Senator Obama over this drilling issue. Ifhe keeps this up, and he'll lose.
What does California have with regards to electoral votes? 55? 53? I forget.
Still, Calif should swing his way, but he certainly didn't do himself any favors .
The guy is trying to win an election. I understand that. But saying drilling offshore is not the way to do it.
Cowardly Democrats are again running from an easy fight to win. Keep debate open and start talking about the oil industry's influence on law making, or the fact that the increase in gas prices is almost entirely accounted for by the increase in oil company profit. Nope.
Because for every anti-corruption, anti-corporatist argument the Democrats can and should be making, all the Republicans have to do is hold up a mirror to the corrupt and corporatist Democrats - beginning with the Speaker.
Anyway, I hope the Congress enjoys its month off.
well, hannity got all excited by it...
i actually heard him have an orgasm on the air
however, with the country going to shit...does it make alot of sense for congress to use their entire 5 week vacation?
why not cut it to 3
and i say this
if the polls continue to show americans wanting to give the oil companies the keys to the house...i say go right ahead
and when prices continue to go up, the democratic congress should all get on the tv and en masse say....WE TOLD YOU STUPID FUCKS SO!!!
oh, and every repug congressman used the term democrat party...fuck em all...shouldnt they all be indicted by now?
Heres the Electoral College if anyone wants it.
I think Obama will pull, NM,AZ,NV, Mi ,Wi,Wa,NY, Me, RI,Ma,Ore, Ca, Ga,Al,SC, Ill,La.
I'm missing a few.
mudshark @ 67:
Minn,NJ,MD,FLA. I think he's going to need Ind.
Well, Good nite folks.
Be well.
It worked for Gingrich, but then he actually got his rants on C-SPAN.
In comparison , check out the EC for Bill Clintons 92 campaign.
http://www.270towin.com/
Thom Hartman had it exactly right today.
Paraphrasing here: "The Republicans are great at political theater and the Pelosi/Reid Democrats suck at it."
Professor Peabody @ 58:
Well, if you watched last week's Bill Moyers, you would know that most spend their "vacation time" raising money for their next election and not actually meeting with their constituents. Besides, this is not 1781, we have modern means of communicating, they don't need to go home as often to talk to their constituents.
There's a ton of work for the f'ers to do like investigate shrubbie and his henchmen, get the immunity crap out of FISA as it's clearly unconstitutional, how about fixing the military commissions act, mortgage crisis, banks failing, etc.
I can remember the Republicans pulling vote buying shit -- the price of gas - not oil - dropped 30% in 2 days right before an election -- in my life I'd not seen that happen, but it was transparent that it had been engineered. The idea here is to take some action - it doesn't at all matter what or that it has any cause and effect connection, and then when need be, claim that the Republican party took an action that reduced the price of gas. This is easy to arrange when you have all the help of the oil companies -- and no evidence trail. My advice -- no compromise that will give these criminals a basis to "demonstrate" their "concern" for the average joe.
Steve Benen writes:
Let me guess, Steve doesn't know anyone who going to vote for Sen. McCain.
It took forty "ridiculous" House Republicans five hours to make Democratic Senator Barack Obama, the Democratic Party presumptive nominee for president, fold on this issue.
"Republicans were talking in the dark"....
i don't get it... so where's the news here...?.... isn't that normal for people with their heads stuck up their asses...?...
Charles @ 16:
ya... you guys NEED a third national party... your "category" of "independents" is completely laughable... sorry to say...
ObiterDicta @ 5:
Allow me to correct you if nobody else has yet:
When Democrats do something like this, Republicans run to anybody in the mainstream media who will listen (that is, everybody) and vehemently condemn the act as "political theatre" - when Republicans do something like this they run to anybody in the mainstream media who will listen (again, everybody) and loudly declare how they're the only ones dedicated to making this government function properly.
That much is simple, indisputable truth; what is not certain, however, is the percentage of Republicans who actually believe that their absurd spin is simple, indisputable truth as well.
Why'd they turn the lights back on?
They pukes made Dims meet in fuuking broom closets when they controlled the switches and the keys.
Dims are dumb0-fux
ALThomas @ 8:
Actually, when the Republicans were in charge, things like this did happen, but nobody seriously covered it. Throughout the many years of Republican control, the majority refused to hold hearings on any topic that might make the Bush administration accountable for something. The Democrats were forced to hold numerous "unofficial" hearings with no transcript, and with no Republicans present.
This begs the question: if a pandering shill jabbers in an empty room can anyone hear it?
If the republican's are this devoted to something, it means a MAJOR screwing for the American people - on behalf of corporate America. They NEVER do right by the people or the country! God I hate those lying, sociopathic bastards.
Since the republicans represent the DARK side, its only fitting they speak in the dark!
"Why doesn’t the site load in IE?
(I don’t use IE, but I’ve seen other ppl bitching about it.)"
Same thing happens when I visit newshounds. If I don't let the page on either site completely load and click stop, I can view them just fine. Smells like a rat to me.
WTF? After 6 years of a GOP WH, Senate and House. They finally decide they need a vote on energy?
This is just a childish publicity stunt. They'll be trouble in Calif if they try to start drilling offshore. All those years when the GOP had control of Congress when BC was Prez, Nuthin!
Now they decide they want a vote now. Because the people are semi behind it because of gas prices.
I was watching Larry King and he had on a CEO from Chevron. This caller asked him a question as to why gas prices were so much higher in Calif compared to the rest of the country. The CEO( O'Rielly if I remember correctly, No Kidding) Stated that Calif is self sufficient on gasoline and oil. That was one of the reasons why ,others were,Road Maintenance EPA and a host of others. The Ironic thing was, He had just got done saying gas would be cheaper if we were self sufficient. And Larry King just let this sail right over his head. They ( Big Oil) say they spend a tremendous amount on exploration. In What Country? Here In the US, I haven't seen any new fangled ways to get oil out of the ground. Same old wells doing the same old thing. Up and Down. So, Let me get this right, Other countries pay these guys to find and drill for oil. Then these countries sell the oil to these (big oil) guys who refine it and sell it to us. I don't see any new on land technology. Some one is lying through their teeth. And we're getting gashed in the meantime. The Gop want this OS drilling thing now. Because if gas prices drop, they lose the opportunity. And I think they'll drop. This all goes back to Cheney's secret meeting on " Energy".
The last great fuck you from Dead Eye. Offshore drilling.
Oh and they can't say they spent anything on new ways to refine it. Those refineries are so old, they've been payed for in full years ago. Probably decades ago.
It's time to send these arrogant, misbehaving Repub children to the political time out chair.
Am I wrong in thinking this? The Republicans, right up to the example their commander and chief sets, appear to be ANTI-AMERICAN in almost everything they do... invading nations illegally, wiretapping its own citizens, and even IGNORING CONGRESS when subpoenaed! Now this... it seems to me this nation of ours may be on the verge of some civil war of sorts.
NoGWBpolicyleftinplace @ 81:
So very true and it is pretty frightening ... the Repubs time is running out and they are moving in desperation to accomplish as much money grabbing as they can for "Big Oil" .
"Kucinich seeks to bar US oil firms from Iraq"
http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Kucinich_seeks_to_bar_US_oil_0801.html
Why hasn't "Crooks and Liars" even mentioned this?
Good for them! Let the morons stay there all through the summer recess and blow their steam and rant like a bunch of lunatics. The congressmen and women will come back after the vacation, and they can laugh at the jack asses who refused to give up on this ridiculous idea of exploiting the pristine shores of the USA for oil company profits.
Repuke idiots...the whole lot of them.
As if gas prices were such a new revelation. If I remember right, gas prices started going up 4 years ago.
Whoever turned out the lights is the dumbest person of all, because it gave the G.O.P. lawmakers an excuse to say somebody was trying to silence them.
By the way, why does Congress need the entire month of August off?
I have to wonder: How much electricity did they waste doing this political theater?
I'm sick of these repugs. I want Congress to do something, but why have the repugs blocked efforts for renewable energy? Why don't the repugs explain that drilling won't give us relief for maybe 10 years? Why don't the repugs tell us that if they really want to drill and be safe to the environment, it will cost a ton of money, and by the time we actually get more oil, the price of oil will be far more than it is, now, and we'll still be relying on oil because we haven't invested heavily in alternative sources. Why have certain repugs lied about offshore drilling and hurricanes (notably saying that Katrina didn't cause oil spills)?
If the repugs think they are so great, then why didn't all 202 of them show up for their hissy fit? I'm not sure how many actually did, but it sounds like 20 or 40 did, so that means the other 160 who didn't are as bad as what they make the Democrats out to be.
I am sick and tired of repugs like Blunt keep using the limpball tactics of referring to the "Democrat" majority. Oh, I am so depressed that I moved back to this state of Missouri, after living in Chicago.
What has the Democratic Congress done about ANYTHING ? I've stopped giving $ to the Democratic Congressional Committee. Harry Reid is a joke.
Republicans playing silly little games is nothing new. Republicans kicking Democrats asses with their little games isn't new either. The GOP already has the MSM carrying this story practically as if they'd written it themselves ("That didn't deter Republicans, who one after another rose to demand that Congress stay in session until it does something about high gas prices") and they can spend the next 5 weeks hammering on the Dems for leaving on vacation without addressing the price of gas. Obama has already folded so you can guess the rest of the Dems will follow. Another easy GOP win. Calling Republicans "repukes" or "rethuglicans" or whatever else does nothing to change the outcome here.
Vote the bums out!!!!! Those who will not bring aid to those who support those in that Democrat Congress need to live on the same level as the taxpayers they, the democrat congress is not be given a second chance. Just who do they think they are??? Marx and Lenin would agree with this democrat congress. It's sad. Darrell :)
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