Phony wingnut poll promoter gets testy when called out
By David Neiwert Wednesday Nov 19, 2008 6:45am
[Image courtesy Tom Tomorrow.]
Nate Silver interviewed John Ziegler, the wingnut who commissioned that falsehood-based poll purporting to demonstrate that Obama voters were stooopid.
Silver's questions, as you can see, are perfectly normal and reasonable, but Ziegler completely loses it. By the end, he's doing a Cheney.
It starts to go downhill when Silver, who know a wee bit about polling, asks a perfectly reasonable question:
NS: Why would you commission a survey question with no correct response?
JZ: The purpose of the question, you pinhead, was we wanted to determine the Tina Fey Effect.
In short order, Ziegler starts attacking Silver over the phone:
NS: Where the interviews conducted by telephone or online?
JZ: How can you ask a question like that and pretend that you have any clue what you're writing about! That's unbelievable that someone could write what you did! That is unbelievable that you wouldn't know that it's a telephone or an online poll and that you went on my summaries of the questions before the questions were even released!NS: We’ve heard reports from our readers that very similar questions had been asked in an online format. There was no online component at all?
JZ: That is correct, which you would have known if you had looked at the information. Before you called this a push poll -- you don't seem to know the definition of a push poll. How do you have this website?NS: What did Zogby charge you -- what did you pay for this survey?
JZ: I'm not going to tell you that, I'm not a fucking idiot.
By the end, Ziegler is simply hostile -- not to mention thoroughly convinced that his bullshit don't stink:
NS: Who paid for it?
JZ: You think I'm going to tell you that? When you've already shown yourself to be the enemy?NS: Was it paid for by the RNC?
JZ: [Laughs]. In your world, the question that I would ask you is what question [in the survey] is there any ambiguity as to what the answer is?NS: Well, that Obama 'launched his career' at the home of two former members of the Weather Underground --
JZ: That happens to be one of the questions that Obama supporters did the best on! They did better on that question than on any other Obama-related answers! And here you’re telling me that it’s not true?NS: What do you mean by "launched his career"?
JZ: The first campaign as told by the person whose position he took in the State Senate, as told by her admission, his first campaign event was in the home of Bill Ayers and his wife. [Laughs] Unless you live in the Obama kool-aid world! That is astonishing to me that you would not accept that! And by the way, when you're given four responses to that question, what else was the response going to be? Sarah Palin?NS: Well, her husband was a member of a secessionist party.
JZ: You are such a hack! That's a very good analogy.... NS: Would you consider yourself well-informed?
JZ: I’d consider myself extremely well-informed.NS: Who are the two senators from South Dakota?
JZ: Thune and, uh, Johnson.NS: Very good. South Carolina?
JZ: Go fuck yourself. I'm done with this interview if you're going to ask me stupid questions like that. Obviously I know who Lindsay Graham is.NS: Well, since you’re running a website calling people misinformed, I’d like to see if -- there are certain things you’ve said that I would consider misinformed.
JZ: Misinformed? You're a piece of work! You are never going to have the guts to post a representative transcript on your website! I thought you actually ran a legitimate website!NS: Thank you, have a good day.
JZ: Go fuck yourself.
Can anyone tell me why anyone should take John Ziegler seriously?
Login or Register to post comments.
does he kiss his f'ing mother with that mouth?
I'm sure he recites his prayers and the pledge of allegiance with it.
Ziegler is typical of the "above it all" attitude that has pervaded the GOP and our politics in general.
The ends justify the means and vice versa in their nether world.
It's called living in their own ideology. If you do not subscribe to it, you are probably a normal everyday dumbass who doesn't really know anything much, but what is real and how things affect you.
If you do subscribe to it, you would have hinted at it during the beginning of the conversation.
Dem's have their own issues and a bit of ideology, free market capitalism crock, corporations are important crock... However, to compare it to the Orwellian double-thinking mind of a Neo-Con, they are incomparable.
The Conservative party is terminally ill, consumed by a strong, nasty hate. Openly hostile towards all non-whites, gays, progressives, etc...good luck finding a majority without those groups.
That cancer will get you every time.
They never will be a majority again unless conservatism can transcend race.
Sounds like the interviewer was prepared but saw some gaps in the disclosures, and was asking for fill-in information.
Of course ziegler acted like the trolls we get here, whether we make a statement or ask a question, we don't know what we're talking about, and they maintain their faux sense of sensibility.
And ziegler thinks we never heard of a good offense being the best defense, and he's pretty offensive alright.
Or should that be fugly offensive?
awwww, poor widdle baby can't handle the twuth...
methinks the wingnuts are getting a bit hot under the collar. What a joke -- I guess he's really pissed off that the electorate no longer buys the bullshit the GOP is shoveling and their precious power is gone!
Ziegler insisted on the full transcript being posted and doubted it would happen -- as if it would make him look good!
the same guy who got his ass handed to him because he couldnt get along with the afternoon drive guys
after he was fired from kfi, he decided to burn all his bridges in the talk industry with this diatribe
http://www.therealkfi.com/
the man is certifiable
http://www.therealkfi.com/
Shade of, "I'm Not a Crook?"
zig is the guy who first twisted kerry's joke about bush into being a slight on the troops
he can dish it out, but he cant take it
I thought wingers were supposed to be our moral superiors. Aren't these guys the ones freaking out over Janet Jackson's boob? Now you got this guy f-bombing.
Run out of Louisville radio in shame. His erratic behavior in Louisville had him removed as a Big Brother. Kept an "enemies list" on his website for years. Dumped by his girlfriend then attacked her on the radio.
http://www.wlky.com/news/4530227/detail.html
Fired in LA. Now, he's working for a REAL idiot - himself.
Writes his own news releases about himself. Edits his Wikipedia page to cover his sociopathic behavior.
I'm surprised that even the wingnuttiest would embrace this disturbed attention seeker.
Dear God, he's putrid. That defies belief.
His side sure are good at "getting out the vote" for online surveys, though! Too bad "1,856" (or whatever it is who "supports the jury's decision" in the survey) doesn't elect presidents. Anymore.
:)
The repubs have been shot down,now to stamp out the snipers,water carriers,paid liers and hate radio included. CNN is included,still pushing the repub. line.
They are scared because Obama will bring back the Fairness Doctrine. Limpbaugh is already crapping in his pants. I don't care about the rightwing talk radio. But there should be equal time for the left to express they opinion. Where I live in rural TN all we get is the rightwing talk radio of hate. No wonder TN is a red state. Alot of these rednecks listen to that crap.
There was yet another letter to the Dallas Morning Nudes from a reader claiming Fairness Doctrine meant censoring conservatard stations.
How can they claim with one breath that liberals can't succeed with radio, and be in control of the media at the same time. Isn't radio part of the media?
Conservative Radio is Propaganda. Period. There is no news or value, just a bunch of people trying to make you think differently.
Turn it off.
Kind of like Corporate News.
THESE REPUBLICANS KNOW FAIRNESS ONLY WHEN IT IS REPUBLICAN. THEY KNOW IF IT FINALLY COMES THROUGH THEIR WAY OF LIFE WILL FALL DOWN.
THESE PEOPLE SURE CAN MAKE YOUR HEAD SPIN.
but he might revisit the telecommunications act...which has limited ownership of radio and tv stations
more ownership means more diversity
"CNN is included,still pushing the repub. line."
Damn right, wisedup. Boycott, boycott, boycott.
Carly,
Ex-repug
Being a raging assh*le and being a right wing Republican seem to go hand in hand...
This asshat was clearly a Billo the clown fan..
It's interesting, I noticed when the position of the people on the right are challenged, and when their ignorance is exposed- they cannot debate- rather they resort to profanity, and at times threats of physical violence.
From Wikipedia: In 2002, wanting to return to radio, Ziegler was hired by Louisville, Kentucky radio station WHAS. Once again, his tenure did not last long, as during a Ask John Anything segment, he discussed the physical attributes, intimate attire, and genital grooming of Darcie Divita, a former Los Angeles Lakers cheerleader and WDRB morning television host with whom Ziegler had a relationship until Divita broke up with him. WHAS fired him on August 27, 2003, and Divita sued for $2,700,000, claiming libel and defamation of character. However, on May 24, 2005, Ziegler was found not liable for damages as Divita was deemed a public figure by virtue of being a television personality.
Someone should inform Zigler that the election is over, and the time for polling is past.
Here is probably what happened. Republicans who go to his website online answered questions and he said they were democrats. Or he got his friends to answer and he said they were democrats. We know that the Palin republicans are the party of the uneducated hating racists. That is the party of Palin. The grand old party that use to be around has been taken over by the wingnuts like Joe the plummer, Palin the dummie who takes pride in being stupid. The good peole that fall for these kind of idiots. The final group who is the most dangerous group are the religious zealots who want to impose their religion on everyone else.
Hi Ziggy (Trust me, he's here - he can't RESIST reading about himself! And he DOES troll all over the web.)
Let's refresh everyone's memory about the day you choked up on the stand in Louisville and tried to get sympathy with fake tears. You are a piece of work.
http://www.wave3.com/Global/story.asp?s=3368765
Sadly, our Democratic Congressman, John Yarmuth, calls Ziggy a "friend." Of course, Yarmuth is one of the only dems around who opposes some sort of return to fairness on the radio. So, maybe he has a blind eye in broadcast matters.
Hey Ziggy -
Wed, 11/19/2008 - 07:30 — KYGuy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqJoIwuayiM
the fairness doctrine...as long as the web stays "free"
but ya, ziegler is a piece of work
he will never work in radio ever again, as he has proven to be incapable of getting along with anyone
I love how he was convinced that Silver wasn't going to post the full transcript, because he knew that a full transcript would show Silver as the buffoon.
I wish Silver didn't edit out the "ad hominem exchanges", though. He really should've posted the full thing.
Did he pass?
If your going to call someone 'such a hack!' You might want to make sure you are not one too.
What's that old saying" Oh yeah When you point a finger there are 3 fingers pointing back at you.
... Ziegler doth protest too much.
Is there an audio of the transcript?
I do not like the idea of the fairness doctrine because there is a difference between opinion and facts. Right wing radio lies. They lie about everything. They can not claim their philosophy works with out lying. They do not win arguments they muddy the water. I can not argue with the right wing nuts because every time it ends in a dispute of the facts that are the foundation of their beliefs. This story is about someone believing in his world view so much that he is more than willing to lie, cheat and steal because the end justifies the means.
and talk about her boobs and pubic hair on live radio
zig has such good family values
so good, he thinks its appropriate to talk about the koby bryant rape case with a 10 year old boy
then trash big brothers on the air when they wont let him stay in their org
sick, sick, sick
This is so hilarious, but at the same time so sad. Ah, hell, I'm going with hilarious, screw the sad part.
The only thing is the only ones really affected by the Fairness Doctrine would be mainstream magazines, newspapers and broadcast television. Cable, blogs and the internet would remain untouched.
I'm not sure about satellite, but since they're subsciption based, I doubt it.
they are private entities, not regulated by the fcc
the fairness doctrine never really did work anyway
tv stations got around it by having an editorial by the station head, which was rebutted by a viewer
radio stations got around it with early sunday morning programs that no one listened to
we dont need it...progressives control the internets...check out the traffic to progressive blogs
the wingnuts still havent gotten a handle on how to use the nets... and they never will
You're right about magazines and newspapers not being bound by the FCC. I'm a little tired today, I have to get up every morning at 4:45 for a 3 hour round-trip to work and back. But good journalism gets all sides of the story, but I'm not sure if they call it any kind of doctrine.
The community-based programs that air on television and radio are not part of the Fairness Doctrine, but a requirement to serve the community as part of one's license.
Please don't delude yourself into thinking that 'progressives control the internet' - that can change if we lose the battle for net neutrality.
whoooooooa! Dude definitely knows his poll is BS, given his over the top defensiveness.
John Ziegler dodged a real discussion about how his poll was conducted using a fake anger to dodge and distort the questions being put to him. Because of Ziegler's fake altitude and act of being insulted Nate Silver could never establish the truth behind how Ziegler really conducts his polling.
'Morans' for 'Mavrick' : The 'Returnage'
A little walk down memory lane...
I prefer mammary lane:
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b274/DUNNZ/...
...but we need SOMETHING to open the airwaves, owned by the public, to something other than 24/7 right wing speech. The wingnuts say "Go start your own station." I'd love to...but who hands out those public licenses? The FCC. Who's controlling that? The wingnuts. Who owns most of the stations? The wingnuts. Who constantly tells us that no one will listen to liberal radio? The wingnuts. Who gives a litmus test to hopeful radio talkers to make sure they'll carry the right-wing water? The wingnuts.
Test question for being hired by Salem Radio - - "If we hire you, you'd never say anything negative about our President, George Bush, would you? Because I won't have that on any of my stations."
Cable, satellite, internet, anything you PAY for would not be affected by fairness legislation. It's the free and public airwaves (read Communication Act of 1934) that have been stolen and are now unfairly dominated by the right. They think they own them. Witness that they fear they're going to be "taken away!" They don't own them. They are granted the right to USE them under a license issued by the government.
the issue is not the fairness doctrine, but the fact that a single entity can now basically own as many am/fm, tv stations and newspapers in a single area as they want
yes, because of this, those on radio are making more money...but the public is not being served...and that is the purpose of the public airwaves
change how the fcc does business...
btw, you can thank clinton for signing the telecommunications law that allowed this to occur
Bubba was expecting the industry to expand not constrict, that was the republican congress.
... if the Fairness Doctrine still existed, those stations would have to grant equal time to opposing views/candidates on a station by station basis.
and seriously...think the fcc is going to spend time figuring out how much time an opposing viewpoint has to be given?
so maybe the hosts start taking more calls from those with opposing views, and like hannity, just berate them on the air
its about the telecommunications act
and maybe clinton thought this would expand ownership...but i remember the arguments against the act at the time....and many were predicting exactly what would happen to the industry...and they were right
And I predict I'll get laid.
would you predict that for me, too? :-)
I would LOVE to be able to initiate a lawsuit to say I do not want hate on MY airwaves. Are the radio waves not public? I can understand Fox News - being on cable - as not under that purvue, but honestly. What happened to the public airwaves?
is always interesting and intrstructive to examine. Zieglers 9 minute video on the topic of the selective level of information that Obama supporters are able to verbalize is a wonderful case study in propaganda. Ziegler identifies a real issue, then carefully manipulates and crafts his presentation to present a narrative that supports the message he is trying to get a across. This is a classic, time honored propaganda tool. In a way, it's too bad that the truth gets hacked up so badly by Ziegler's zeal to manipulate reality It's clear to me that the sad state of awareness shown by the people he interviews really does show how misinformed people are, and what a poor job the media does of providing them with useful, issue oriented information. But that important issue is bound to be overshadowed by the noise that Ziegler has instigated and his own strident, screaming reply.
It's nice that Obama seeks reconciliation and a common purpose. Unfortunately, it only takes one side to start a fight. Both sides have to agree to reconcile. It doesn't look there's much hope for reconciliation.
ziegler attacks silver for questioning his methods before the raw data and the questions were released
however, ziegler posted both the vid and his website prior to the raw data and questions being released
what a dick
This is BS. I read that interview as soon as it was posted on 538.com. Nate was grossly underprepared for it and some of his questions were downright stupid.
Ofcourse Ziegler is gonna get mad. Nate first characterizes his poll as a push-poll. And only then does he make any research on the data in the poll, which can be seen by some of the questions, which were dumb, repetitive and juvenile.
The herd mentality here being that any right winger is a bad guy, I know I'll get attacked for this.
I don't agree with Ziegler, I don't agree with what his poll is trying to show. But insulting him by calling it a push-poll without doing actual research, compunding the fact by asking silly questions the answers to which you already got, it is understandable that Ziegler got mad. How would you feel if a right-wing asshole (all of them being assholes, no?) questioned your hard work without research and with much prejudice?
Anyway, this is my original reply on 538.com on the subject.
"I must say I found the interview very interesting, although Nate, you didn't contribute to it much.
To people from the left, the questions/answers in the polls were obviously linking Obama to what is seen as lies or gross misrepresentation. That's not (or shouldn't have been) what the interview was about. I must say, from where I'm sitting, Mr. Ziegler's stance seems valid. I don't agree with it, after all it's a Right perspective, but it's valid in the sense it can be discussed in a sensible way, not dismissed as outright hackery.
Mr. Ziegler, if you agree with him, made sense. And if you don't, you have to admit consistency. If he was mad, and used swearwords, that has nothing to do with the poll itself or his views. I found some of the questions in the interview very stupid, to be honest, but I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt, Nate, if you had them all written down and just wanted to go through them all. If not, you were grossly underprepared.
As it stands, knowing nothing about Mr. Ziegler except the fact he commissioned the poll, and this interview, my view is he is one of the more reasonable conservatives out there."
...is the old site coming back?
This is what it is.
... using the f-word repeatedly.
Do you think you'd be calling Joe Biden reasonable if he'd dismissed the one reporter who was asking him talking-points questions with, "You f---ing whore! Who the f--- writes your f---ing questions? What the f--- is going on here?"
If a poll is based on lies and factual misrepresentation, then it is flawed, period. Critical to any discussion is what the exact questions were as well as the sample size; this is not evident from Ziegler's interview.
sample size was 512...from all parts of the country...age and race did not seem to be taken into account
A push poll is a political campaign technique in which an individual or organization attempts to influence or alter the view of respondents under the guise of conducting a poll.
The only thing upon which this poll failed to meet the criteria of "push" was the fact that the campaigns have already been concluded, therefore their outcome cannot be affected.
The purpose of the poll, however, is clear. It is to push canards.
zig donated to liberal john yarmuth's campaign in 2006. significant because yarmie opposed (and beat!) bush rubberstamp 91% of the time neo-con anne north(r)up for office. i would not be surprised if he did that again this year.
i like john. i liked him while he was here. i thought he was funny and very anti establishment (on the radio side) but dude, come on now. i can manipulate a poll taking uninformed mccain voters off the street and derive the results that i want. i thought the whole concept of that poll was flawed especially since the questions were not factually accurate.
talk radio is about entertainment...he thought it was real
as a result, he would frequently attack coworkers for being phonies....duh
he would use the airwaves to settle personal beefs...he has some serious personality probs
he now cant get a gig anywhere in the states, and fancies himself a documentary film maker
thing is...he said he was working on a doc about the clintons that would blow everyones socks off....never happened
now he says he is working on a doc proving media bias in the 08 presidential election
i have a feeling the youtube video he posted is all we ever see of that doc
he has not really worked for almost an entire year....who is paying his bills?
Boy! He sounds as defensive as that character Martin Short did on SNL. Nathan Thurm. He was a company spokesman who was sent out to defend the undefendable. He sweated and smoked and was incredulous at the questions. "I know that! I find it highly ridiculous you would think that I wouldn't know that!!!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOLBQxk72NY
That was sooo great! How do they do that?
HAHA! Thanks, that's great.
Ziegler is a complete hack and a real wanker. Silver did a good job keeping his cool, especially exposing Ziegler's ideas about Obama's religion. I'm not surprised Ziegler was popular over at Fox.
You pinhead?! These low-level wingnuts are sheeple in an even more literal sense than I realized. They don't know enough to cloak their "follower" status by not using the trademark terminology of the FAMOUS wingnuts in their head-spinning-around, wingnut tirades, lest they be considered brainless unpaid servants of Groupthink, even by followers of their own.
OK, I read that transcript up there, and I don't believe it. The Mister Zegler parts are way too cartoonish to be the actual un-retouched words of a live human being in the real world. Even a wingnut isn't that much of a funny comic book villain, lol, come on.
There's a reason he won't tell what he paid Zogby, or who authored the questions w/o real answers.
I heard that he launched this BS poll in the front room of terrorists.
I wonder how john ziegler reacted as a kid when his teacher called him out?
Used to be that meant the teacher wanted to ask you a question; now it's that they want to have your baby.
Why didn't we have such teachers when I was in junior high school?
john ziegler being asked how his day went:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mX69T2Xm7Ag
I was on the Daily Beast and saw a clip of this crap. As soon as I saw it I thought I was watching Jay Leno show Jay Walking. You could ask anyone those questions wheter they were dem or rep. I can't believe anyone would fall for that. I did a little test today where I used to work were there are alot of young adults that come to workout. I asked the same questions and got the same responses. I didn't even ask if they were rep or dems. I will say that I live in TN which went for McCain. I mixed up questions about both republicans and democrats. Still got the same kind of responses. Anyone can do it on your own. I bet you will find the same thing.
(by myself)
97% of right wing ass holes could not identify a fact (even though it was beating them over the head with a baseball bat).
98% of right wing ass holes could not tell the truth even with a gun pointed at their heads (use it or lose it!)
98% of right wing ass holes could not identify any amendment in the US Constitution besides the second one. (This despite the previous result in the poll).
Phony wingnut poll promoter gets testy when called out
Thassa what happens when your testes shrivel.
Wingnut says Obama supporters are stoopid by proving the wingnut himself is an idiot who knows nothing. These people just top themselves everyday.
Login or Register to post comments.