Wingnuts Go Crazy Claiming Hypocrisy On Calling The President A Liar
By Jamie Tuesday Sep 15, 2009 1:00pmAs the House prepares to take up a resolution of disapproval over Rep. Joe Wilson’s outburst during last week’s appearance by President Obama to a joint session of Congress, the wingnuts have found what they claim to be “hypocrisy” on the Democrats part.
This video is from 2007 when Rep. Pete Stark was saying how Bush lied:
Now let’s go back to the current event. The Democrats asked Joe Wilson to apologize on the House floor for his outburst and he flat out refused. It was that refusal that led to this motion.
What happened with Pete Stark? Well something the wingnuts aren’t willing to admit, yet I found out on HotAir – a rightwing blog:
Boehner introduced a censure resolution this morning knowing that the Democrats would have to kill it and symbolically line up on Stark’s side, which they did. That was enough for Pelosi, evidently: after he initially refused to apologize, after the fight-fight-fightin’ nutroots very predictably made it a point of pride that he not apologize, the good congressman has duly considered the Speaker’s rebuke from Friday and … apologized.
So the minority party introduced a resolution of censure, which was killed. But that didn’t put an end to it, Stark ended up doing the right thing and apologizing to the House and President. Wilson is refusing to apologize to the House.
Of course even Hot Air is now jumping on the “hypocrisy” bandwagon. (Note to Captain Ed – check out your own archives first!)
If there is any hypocrisy here, it is on the part of Republicans. They wanted to censure Pete Stark, but couldn’t do it since they were in the minority (remember – elections have consequences). But when it comes to Joe Wilson, they are circling the wagons. They haven’t pushed him to apologize on the House floor, but the Democrats did and he refused.
Also let’s remember what the motions are. The Republicans wanted to censure Pete Stark. That’s the second highest level of punishment in the House, with expulsion topping it. For Joe Wilson, the Democrats are wanting a resolution of “disapproval”, which is the most minor disciplinary action in the House – essentially a slap on the wrist.
So thanks wingnuts for proving that the House’s reaction to Wilson is proper. Hell they are actually letting him off easy. It’s Wilson who is refusing to play by the rules.
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Well, I never . . . .
It is what they do best~!
Apologized to the person he offended.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/2009...
whose rules he broke. Decorum and etiquette in the Congress are required by house rules, and he flagrantly violated them. Time to man-up and tell his fellow Congress-critters that he is sorry for speaking out of turn.
The house is voting right now on whether to spank Wilson or not. You can see it on C-span.
The house is voting right now on whether to spank Wilson or not.
Which of the Republicans is jumping up and down yelling..."Me next! Me next!"
.
Wilson through earlier. It reminded me of that poor old man that apologized for Cheney's shooting the old man in the face. Wilson in this case would of course be Cheney, sort of.
This pants wetter cries without getting spanked.
What a momma's boy. I bet she still changes him after he comes home.
*
After all, IOKIYAR.
The Republican code of conduct and honor...
Do as I say, not as I do.
Funny how many people are calling in to c-span saying this vote is a waste of time. I wonder if they said the same thing when MoveOn was getting their spanking?
There was some asshole Republican on Hardball trying to claim the same thing. His excuse was "the Democrats did this and the Democrats did that". When Tweety called him on it he couldn't cite ONE incident of it happening but he was sure it had happened. This entire Party is finished for many years to come. They may win some local elections but I doubt they can win on the national level. There's not a single idea that the Republicans propose that will hold up. In fact, there's not a single idea that the have period. With that being said, what will they do now?
It's a sign of weakness.
Bush was a liar and a crook.
There is a difference between citing lies as Pete Stark did and calling a person, the President in this case, a liar as Joe Wilson has done.
While I am on the wire let me take the time to call Obama a LIAR on the short list of items he stated to drastically change or end altogether...
Patriot Act & Spying on Americans
Gitmo, Torture & Rendition
Iraq War
Afghanistan War
Tax Bailouts 4 Billionaires Program
They are all LIARS. It's their job!
It's a reqiurement for higher office.
You sincerely think an apology is a sign of weakness? It takes more courage and strength to face a mistake and say I'm sorry than it does to go through life in denial that one could ever make a mistake. Only a coward will hide from reality.
My wife has that same attitude patrica. Never apologize for anything. I call it the Jethro Gibbs syndrome.
Wifey WAS a Republican, now a Democrat with bad habits LOL. And the Gibbs comment is a reference to the NCIS series.
An apology goes a long way IMO.
Yes, apologizing is a sign of weakness. Don't make the mistake/ transgression in the first place and you don't need to apologize.
Since the right thinking brain cannot get their heads around this concept they lockstep in unison to beat back any repudiation of their ill actions, words or deeds.
This is why they kick the shit out of Democrats who are more worried about the mundane.... courage, strength or any other nebulous term used to describe a chivalrous person... than to fight and push back.
Why is it that a crackpot protester can come fully armed within yards of the President at an Obama speech but, no one could ever get within five miles with a poster board of Bush? Because, although they are in the vast minority Rightists are physically and mentally tougher than Leftists. Hooligans versus hula-hoops.
Strength only succumbs to greater strength. Toughen the fuck up and never apologize.
This clown is so bad, I immediately switch any show that he's on. I really like the McGlaughlin Group, but I just can't stomach him anymore.
is always the same. Conservatives are always right, especially the racist ones.
the Prez. Cuts him down any chance she gets and does't take constructive criticism well, and or is racist against perceived browns, and assumes a higher education since she is white.
Savannah
Wed, 09/09/2009 - 20:03 — chicano2nd
You have shown a proclivity to being reasonable but you have been off base in this issue.
You need to start with the premise. What is the goal of a national health care initiative? Why must there be a national health care initiative? Should it be recognized, by legislative action since the right to health care has not been decided constitutionally. The fight has been going on since the Medicare discussions. And still the next republican challenge will be by the tenthers.
Any, any public option is a victory and a start. Non republicans who cut down this president's plan are just as guilty as those they profess to oppose.
Who appointed you the ultimate arbiter of anything, you
Wed, 09/09/2009 - 20:54 — savannah43
presumptuous twit. You have been pissing me off all night, but I usually let others fight their own battles. Now you're going to start on me? Bring it! Firstly, do not judge my behavior by your 10th grade standards. Secondly, do not tell me what I should do, EVER, as I do not take direction from shallow simpletons. Thirdly, keep your dumb questions and your pious drivel to yourself. Finally, I wasn't talking to you, you self-important gas bag.
Okay, it passed but the sad thing was, there were more democrats voting against it than republicans voting for it. There were like seven republicans voting for it and about twelve democrats voting against it.
.
No, it was an electronic vote so you couldn't tell how they were voting, but I'm sure someone will have a list soon...or at least I hope so.
I don't think Stark *should* have apologized - because there's a fundamental difference between what he did, and what Wilson did.
1st - Bush provably lied. This isn't a "maybe" situation - it's factually provable with evidence. He baldface lied to us. He didn't JUST lie though - he lied us into a war that killed 4000+ of our countrymen and women, not to mention hundreds of thousands of Iraqis and Afghanis.
Oh and utterly failed to get Osama - who the whole thing it was ostensibly about.
In other words - Yes, Bush lied, calling someone a liar *when they are lying* is not an insult; it's a statement of fact. It's like saying "The sky is blue" or "The Earth revolves around the Sun".
2nd - Wilson's claim that Obama lied, was actually itself a lie. The House bill contains language that explicitly forbids allowing illegal immigrants any benefits from the bill. This is right there, in the bill. I - a regular schlub - know this.
There is no way it could be anything else - Wilson lied about what Obama was saying. Wilson being either a liar (for knowing damn well what was in the bill) or an idiot (for not, despite being a congressman; even though I - again, some random guy - know this).
---
So it's a false equivalency to begin with; and it's *PRECISELY* what wingnuts thrive on. This is how they can make us out to be the enemy of the middle and working classes, despite all the things our side has done for those exact groups.
What exactly have the right done for anyone not making hundreds of thousands of dollars a year?
Bottom line is there is a time and place for everything and Wilson failed on both. That was neither the time nor the place for him to state his opinion.
I believe members of congress are specifically forbidden to question the president's honesty in the chamber.
Out in the world, you can hold a press conference and go to town.
The issue of the apology is not (and cannot be) on the question of fact. We don't suspend the rules of decorum on the basis of whether or not you have a good point.
The apology is about decorum, not about the facts. After all, no one should ask you to apologize just for expressing your opinion, nutbag though it may be.
Joe Wilson broke the rules. Conservatives fetishize the rule of law when the president's penis is at question, they can suck it up here.
The rule of law, that is.
No one can call another a liar on the floor of the house or senate. I just heard that little tidbit on tv.
This I did not know. My apologies for being ignorant of that.
Just get so damned pissed off at the wingnuts. They lie, and when you call them on it; they try to make you out as the badguy. You tell the truth, they call you a liar.
GAH.
Distinctions matter. Bush did lie. Obama was telling the truth.
We have documentary proof that Obama was telling the truth, and that Bush lied. To call someone a liar is a serious accusation, but in Bush's case it is merited.
They always whine and cry and tell a big whopper.
I turely hope we are seeing the death throws of the republican party.
I mean really can you see how such a bunch of idiots could do anything?
the whole republican party is nothing but a pack of cowards and idiots.
I think there is only one conclusion that can be drawn form the things they do.
republicanism is a mental illness!
Who the hell doesn't know that Dumbya was a Neo-Con who loves war and doesn't give a shit about the death of our troops, along with the rest of the blood loving, lying Reslugs.
FactS?? We don't need no stinkin' facts, we's Republicans!
Tell the right wing assholes to stick their "morality" up their fat asses too!
Yes, if it is a partisant stunt today, then it was an equal partisan and political stunt last week when Wilson yelled out "you lie" at President Obama.
Yes, what Wilson did was in fact a political stunt. Yes, the Democrats did payback Wilson the favor of his own behavior. Too bad. Yes, this is about politics and government! Hello-this is what they do in the nation's capitol. Too bad. Wilson is a little man who keeps boasting and remains defiant. Wilson is "not sorry" and neither are the Republicans. The Republicans support this despicable behavior. Too freakin bad about Wilson.
You can have whatever so-called Republican/right-wing "morality" the right wing claim to have. These people are sickening beyond belief!
Republicans talk in riddles and act like spoiled children.
I do not care whether Mr. Wilson served an X amount of years in the military nor do I give a rat's ass that his kids are in Iraq right now.
I opposed the war in Iraq then and now and also oppose the hyper-militarism of America which Mr. Wilson participates in as he boasts of that so-called "proud service" to America.
Mr. Wilson can also shove his so called "proud military service" to America up his ass too!
In short, the Republicans and Wilson are Full of Crap!!!!!!
I am also very tired of the Republicans excusing their bad behavior by injecting oh, "Mr. Wilson served and protected America for 24 years" in the military as if we are supposed to all lay down and say "wonderful" to him.
Again, I must reiterate that the Republican Party thinks they can exploit military service when its convenient for them to do so. Wilson is not a unique fellow when it comes to military service.
I am very tired of the GOP's obscene and manipulative use of the military in their quest to score political points. There are many families across America whose family members have served in the armed forces who do not seek special treatment as the GOP try to do on a daily basis.
Again, the GOP in arguing for Wilson today exploited military service. I am sure Wilson would not have said such things to his superiors in the military.
Then again, Wilson disrespected the commander-in-chief, Barack Hussein Obama last week. So too bad if he cannot take the consequences of running his big mouth like a man.
Wilson again, showed himself to be a coward today!
In short, I am so tired of the Republicans always injecting how much "military service" they have into their lame ass speeches.
and it hasn't excused me from from so much as a parking ticket, so fuck you, Joe, take your damned medicine.
If you buy/read books, the one to get right away:
"The Healing Of America", by T. R. Reid
Extremely relevant today, and - unfortunately - probably for some time to come.
It's on the NYT Best Seller list now, let's help drive it up higher. A great read.
Oh, give me a break. There are no "death camps". There is no "mandatory health insurance programs". There is no "Obama Army Brain Washing Camps" (although HR1388 sounds great to fix the minds of the stupid). The (r)epublicans, the zany, right wing radio show propagandists and the drunk leftovers of Boner, Knewt, and the rest of those hop-head bastards:LIED....BLOODY LIED....about the Obamessiah. What else can these little girls do but cry "rape" after they self-inflicted their own damage....
Just a bunch of "little girls"....Their women aren't even women and their men couldn't hold a candle against me....Cause I can tell the truth and stand for the truth....not the girly-girl lie......
Atom Mother(From the Triple Thought-Speed Equation)......
this resolution is dumb! and a waste of time.. there is significantly more important shit to take care of..
besides, if you take what Wilson said and apply it to what Obama said, he is a liar. As Alex Cockburn pointed out this past weekend.
"...that his(Obama's) plan wouldn’t offer services to illegal immigrants. By so saying, of course, Obama was acknowledging that he had just lied when he declared at the start of his speech that adequate medical care is a basic human right. Are undocumented workers , who sustain America’s agriculture and much of its building industry, not humans, or humans without rights like the captives Obama still wishes to classify as beyond the protections of the Geneva Protocols?"
on your attempt to conflate "healthcare services" with "healthcare insurance". What the President said, and what HR3200 says, is that illegals will not be able to enroll in insurance plans; they will STILL receive medical services if they go to the ER at any hospital.
Adequate medical versus medical insurance - next time, try to get your facts straight before ranting, sunshine.
Part of providing medical care is establishing a system to pay for it, denying certain elements of the population of a fairly important part of the system(payment method and by extension, medical options) IS denying services. YOu cant separate the two..
I was in France last week, my wife was sick, it cost 22 euro for a diagnosis from an excellent doctor and medication. The doctor asked if we wanted some paper work to bring back to the state to file with our health care provider for reimbursement. We laughed at him.
You are still talking about "services" (treatment). No hospital can turn away the sick just because they don't have insurance, or can't pay; this is what allows most illegals to obtain care. Is is draining on the system? Yes, because the cost to provide those services has to come from somewhere. But nothing in the various proposed reform bills will allow illegals to obtain "health insurance", either thru plan purchase or the public option. all of which require some sort of proof-of-ID to enroll.
So Wilson was wrong when he called the President a liar.
you point directly to what is wrong with an insurance based system. "human rights" are rights, they are border-less, or a rational person would assume so. Is a Canadian anymore Human that a Mexican?
You are right that Wilson was wrong when he called the president a liar, only because he was calling him a liar for the wrong reason.
Obama was still bullshitting us even if he didn't realize it, his speech contradicts itself, or his administration doesn't understand what a FULL medical package requires; universal services for all AND a method to pay for them. "Services" is not restricted to just treatment, people must be paid, its a capitalist system.
watching yet another president, a minority for that matter, vilify Aliens, "illegal" or not, is depressing. That nonsense didn't belong in that speech.
is that there is a Federal law that is already in place and that has been in place for decades that says no hospital can turn away no one needing medical care. Let me repeat IT'S AGAINST THE LAW TO TURN AWAY ANYONE FROM GETTING MEDICAL CARE AT HOSPITALS (I.E ERs) IN THE UNITED STATES.
That is what President Obama is talking about. Why not give everyone and I mean everyone medical coverage though health care reform? Taxpayers will still be paying no matter what. People without insurance will go to ER for care and cost taxpayers more money if these same people had insurance (being paid by taxpayers)while being able to get preventive care that would lead to less cost.
There was a House resolution that would allow illegal immigrants to pay into getting health insurance....let me repeat would allow them to PAY into getting health insurance, but it didn't pass. Now what is wrong with that? They wouldn't be getting a hand out in health coverage being paid by taxpayers they would be paying their own medical insurance just like you and me. They would just have a opportunity to PAY into it also.
the ERs are a nightmare.
You can sit and sit and sit and sit and sit and sit until you keel over.
Or I.C.E. hurries in and throws you in a detention center.
Ya,, ER's are real safe for aliens.
Did you all hear Joe Wilson's reason as to why he is not a racist? This is priceless.
http://progressnotcongress.org/?p=2903
First Pete Stark in the video was speaking about a resolution he wanted to pass on Health care for kids when he was is talking about Bush, why Republicans and then President Bush couldn't come up with funding for more health care for kids, but can for the war. These things were not said in front of the president.
Second Pete Stark did do a outburst in front of the then President Bush while the president was giving a speech.
Now this is two completely different situations and can not be compare.
Also I notice at the end of the video a speaker (not sure what call that person) reminded the congressman not to "Refer to the President in any personal way".
So Joe Wilson did way worse than what Pete Stark did. No comparison.
Yes indeed, mistform...I remember that well. It has been proven that Bush DID L I E to get this country into Iraq...the whole damn Bush Administration lied to go into Iraq...
I was so ticked off when Stark apologized....I see where now, if you are not a constituent, you cannot email these people....except for a few Senators.
You are saying that Stark "did the right thing" by apologizing for calling Bush a liar?
I only wish more of our terrified worms in the Congress had had the guts to call him a liar.
How many lives might have been spared.
the one who had the balls to finally point out that Bush lied, and they hang him out to dry.
That's true..........but in every case, there was a valid reason for such anger from the left. The Iraq War, the War on Terror, torture, Guantanamo, tax cuts for the wealthy, you name it. He spent 8 years turning this country inside out; selling it to the highest bidder; and further widening the gap between the haves and the have nots.
The only thing Obama is guilty of is having to clean up behind the elephants that were in power for 8 long years!
Conservatives simply cannot accept the fact that they got trounced in the last election.
if they do, it means acknowledging that they are losers, and worst of all since there guy got fewer votes a...a.....-MINORITY-
but not to worry, the dems will piss it up and lose everything, or at least act like it when there hemming hawing and compromising alienates the left. It's what they do. for more on this see the so-called 1994 republican revolution.
Stark's comments about Bush were made while Stark had the floor and was allowed to speak. Wilson's comment was an outburst that interrupted Obama's speech to Congress. Congress' rebuke is for Wilson's behavior, not for his opinion. No comparison at all.
Wilson spoke a factually-verifiable lie. Lots different.
The list of atrocities is to numerous to list here but the Goose Stepping, Racist Nazi Party on the right feel offended DUH! did I miss something. Why doesn't the Dem's go a little crazy lets start MASSIVE investigations into the Right Wing NAZI Party. These Goose steppers are scared and if Holder would start a series of REAL investigation these Nazi Klan's people on the right will wither and die, Can't say I will not be laughing at these Gutless, Spineless Cowards. Sig Heil
You are a lying knuckle-dragging Neanderthal racist RethugliKKKlan sack of devolved monkey shite!
Oh, I am so sorry if you took offense at my empirical observations. How's THAT for an apology, dick-weed?
And so far as hypocrisy is concerned, if one were to look in the dictionary for its definition, one would find a picture of the RethugliKKKlan mascot the elephant, as well as its etymological roots in the RethugliKKKlan creed.
If the RethugliKKKlan clan is not a dying breed, they should be. They represent the most egregious examples of misanthropic hypocritical sociopaths -- a malignant cancer on the body politic.
Oh, RethugliKKKlans, I am so sorry if you took offense at my empirical observations ... NOT!
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