Just in case you haven't heard, the feds raided the Gibson Guitar Factory recently. NPR has the story:
Last week federal marshals raided the Gibson Guitar Corporation in Tennessee. It wasn't the first time. The government appears to be preparing to charge the famous builder of instruments with trafficking in illegally obtained wood. It's a rare collision of music and environmental regulation.
[...]
The raids at two Nashville facilities and one in Memphis recalled a similar raid in Nashville in November 2009, when agents seized a shipment of ebony from Madagascar. They were enforcing the Lacey Act, a century-old endangered species law that was amended in 2008 to include plants as well as animals. But Juszkiewicz says the government won't tell him exactly how — or if — his company has violated that law.
This immediately became a rallying cry for the TeaPublicans to cry about excessive government interference and job-killing federal regulations. Gibson has been raided by the feds before this last one, but no charges have been filed. Yet.
By the time Juszkiewicz (pronounced Juss-ka-witz) reached his office, agents were forensically imaging his computer and carting out boxes of paperwork and company hard drives. At the factories, agents were loading trucks with pallets of rosewood and ebony, guitars, guitar necks, computers and shipping documents.
It was the second time in the past two years Gibson had been raided by federal agents in search of illegal imported woods. A 2009 case hasn’t led to any charges against the 117-year-old guitar maker, although it is continuing.
In both instances, federal authorities spelled out in search warrants that they suspect the company was illegally importing protected hardwoods from rapidly dwindling rain forests to make prized Gibson guitars.
Juszkiewicz is milking his outrage for everything it's worth, accusing the government of harassing him and, of course, destroying jobs with their federal regulations.
Enter John Boehner, Speaker of the House, and the guy not enough in control of his own caucus to get them to show even a modicum of respect and make an appearance at tonight's joint session of Congress. Despite notable absences by members of the House and Senate, Boehner has invited 13 guests to the speech who, in his view, have been harmed by the federal government's "job-killing regulations." One of those guests is Henry Juszkiewicz.
Via The Hill, the others are:
Lisa Ingram, COO of White Castle, a restaurant chain threatened by the health care law.
Jim Plante, CEO of Pathway Genomics, which has been "attacked" by FDA after proposing a merger.
Ignacio Urrabazo, president of Commerce Bank of Laredo, Texas, which has been blocked from some lending activity by the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation.
Jack Earle, managing partner of Earle Enterprises, who has claimed harm from healthcare and financial regulations.
Glenn Rieger, general partner at NewSpring Capital, which has cited problems with regulations from Sarbanes-Oxley.
Safi Bahcall, CEO of Synta, which Boehner says is being hampered by an "uncompetitive American business environment."
Kalell Isaza Tuzman, CEO of KIT Digital, which has cited problems with Sarbanes-Oxley.
Chris George, CEO of CMG Finance, a mortgage company facing higher costs under the healthcare law.
Henry Juszkiewicz, CEO of Gibson Guitar Company, which was raided by federal agents who, Boehner's release said, have not explained reasons for the raid.
Gordon Logan, CEO of SportClips, one of the country's fastest growing hair salon franchises that is also "struggling with the new health care law's burdensome costs and mandates."
I will grant Boehner this. His choice of invitees does highlight the priorities Republicans have over Democrats. In Republicans' minds, there can be no pathway to jobs that doesn't include destruction of the environment, endangering people's health, and closing those same doors for people to get health care coverage. It is all-or-nothing for them.
In the case of Gibson Guitars, the allegations seem to center around Madagascar deforestation and rain forest preservation. From a 2009 New York Times story:
“Madagascar has 47 species of rosewood and over 100 ebony species that occur nowhere else, and their exploitation is pushing some to the brink of extinction,” said representatives of the environmental groups WWF, Conservation International, and the Wildlife Conservation Society, in a joint statement issued last week.
The decree “legalizes the sale of illegally cut and collected wood onto the market and constitutes a legal incentive for further corruption in the forestry sector,” the statement said.
The harvest and export of precious wood from Madagascar, an island nation off Africa’s southeatern coast, is a regular source of controversy. Recent reports from the Madagascar news agency Les Nouvelles, for example, suggested that 176 containers of illegally harvested hardwood that were seized in July were ultimately allowed to leave the country pending a payment of $37,000 in taxes.
The containers were valued at $650,000.
The United Nations Educational, Scientific, and Cultural Organization has also reported armed gangs felling and removing rosewood and other endangered trees in Madagascar this year.
Gibson guitars are beautiful. We have a very old one in our collection. They're unique and have great tone. But if I were asked whether it was worth it to destroy rain forests to have one, my answer would be a clear "no". So let Boehner trot out these CEOs and whine about "job-killing regulations" all he wants. In the end, it's all for show anyway, since even an announcement of a total suspension of all regulations would still be repudiated by these lunatics as "job-killing".
At this point, it's all comedy wrapped in tragic outcomes.
from other locales. There's no reason for Gibson to have to import from Madagascar - except maybe they are saving a bundle purchasing it from "roving gangs."
Brazilian rosewood has long been restricted.
statusquObama, change you can only pretend in
So Gibson breaks the law, gets caught...and the teabaggers defend them. And they claim to love the Constitution.
Incredible.
There's always free cheddar in the mousetrap, baby. - Tom Waits
Martin Guitars get their wood from the same place,funny Holder didn't go after them....oh yea,Martin CEO is a supporter of Obama and Gibson supports the Republicans,funny how that worked huh ?
Mike Foltz
Really? You signed up just to leave that small but steaming pile here?
.
so no. they don't and haven't since 2009.
And either has Gibson, unless a dealer misled them. And if that could happen to Gibson, it could happen to Martin. We better send in a large gestapo crew with automatic weapons to check on that immediately, so Karoli at C&L can sneer at how lame it is for people to complain about overreach, because complaining about the government makes you a teabagger bad-person.
"Either?"
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."
~albabe (The Writer/Artist Formally Known As Al Gordon)
http://www.comicon.com/gordon/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al_Gordon
...because more than one company does an illegal thing, NO company doing that thing should be the first one busted for it?
That's logic.
There's always free cheddar in the mousetrap, baby. - Tom Waits
Sorry Elephant4ever. you're wrong. Say you made a mistake, you're sorry, and change you're 'world view' to better reflect reality. OK?
"Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob"
-= Franklin Delano Roosevelt =-
I've got a low tolerance for off topic trolling this evening.
Well, to be fair, in this case, I'm pretty sure none of the regulations involved here are directly in the Constitution, unless you can point me to the endangered species protection Amendment. Besides, baggers don't even think all the Amendments should be there.
Yanno that business about treaties and stuff like that there?
That would be the place.
Gets caught? they haven't even been charged. whats wrong with you? I guess you read between the lines of this sick propaganda piece.
When Aristocrats govern the country... it is Tyranny
They are independent of the people and contribute nothing towards freedom said by:
Alexander Hamilton
John Adams
James Madison
John Jay
Thomas Paine
Theodore Roosevelt
and Presidents: Lincoln, FDR and Truman.
Smuggling it. Fake manifests and everything.
Funny how Obama didn't raid the guitar maker Martin cause they use the same wood from the exact same place.Only differance is Martin Guitars CEO is a big Obama donater and Gibson is a Republican Donator.Gee,whats wrong with this picture fools ? I guess Obama is gonna strong arm his competition...I guess so.What a POS !!!
Mike Foltz
Obama ordered the raid personally. He micromanages every single last thing everyone in the government ever does, up to and including multi-year investigations that predate his presidency. He truly is the puppet master.
...Martin attempted to perpetrate a fraud against the government of India?
Don't try to confuse the issue with half-truths and gorilla dust.
The only dust is gonna be Obama's Azz on the Oval office chair....LOL
Mike Foltz
We knew you could do it!
But go on.
Gibson had ALL the correct paperwork and the Madagascan Govt. approval. ya just can't handle the truth punk !!! Obama is a punk who can't handle that he's gonna loose in 2012....LOL !!!
Mike Foltz
it depends what our import regulations are. Or is that too much to comprehend?
The feds haven't charged gibson with anything.
.
There apparently was enough evidence to support the allegations that a judge signed off on the warrant.
In the real world, you don't file charges until you've investigated. Serving a warrant is part of an investigation. Once the evidence seized is evaluated, then charges can be filed if the evidence continues to support the complaint; if not, Gibson gets back their wood and goes on about their business.
I love Gibsons, but I sure as hell would want to know if they were importing their materials illegally.
What we know, is that apparently the wood has good papers and is signed off on as legal. Don't be surprised if there are no charges after the "investigation".
You actually put your own name in the signature line, didn't you, Mike Foltz?
BWAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!.
Uhm, sorry. No, really.
BWAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
Don't try to confuse the issue with half-truths and gorilla dust.
You're one of those coprocephalic Nugent-heads, aren't you?
Thank goodness for the ignore button. *clicks*
There's always free cheddar in the mousetrap, baby. - Tom Waits
But I can see you've got a huge interest in spreading false information, which is the usual modus operandi.
Try reading the linked articles sometime
Are you saying there should be no trade with countries with governments we might disagree with?
And if one has that opinion, why should that be enforced by a country of over 300 million people? Can we not make our own decisions in your world?
.
Why not? Should we suspend all trade with china for their human rights abuses? Of course Obama would never do that, it would actually hurt our pocket books at large. But we can just pick on Gibson a little, thats easy and the folks at c&l won't mind. So, should we suspend all trade with china big guy?
Gibson bought the wood from india.
Your blind allegiance to ignorance is honorable.
"Oh, blow it out your ass, Howard!"
Karoli already posted an answer above to your false equivalency.
There's always free cheddar in the mousetrap, baby. - Tom Waits
Sorry Elephant4ever. you're wrong. Say you made a mistake, you're sorry, and change you're 'world view' to better reflect reality. OK?
Repeating a lie over and over does not make it true. Learn something from your mistakes.
"Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob"
-= Franklin Delano Roosevelt =-
If you knew anything about Henry Juszkiewicz you'd know how he is held in very low esteem by many people in the guitar world, many of them fans of Gibson guitars. The idea that a greedy CEO like Henry would break a law that would bring the feds down on him for a second time in a year is not all that hard to grasp.
Let's see how far to the right they go before they fall off of the edge of this flat world.
Yup. Newer Gibsons are a disgrace.
...the same tool who is posting this same Gibson/Martin comparison BS on Gibson's Learn and Master Guitar student forum?
WWFSMD?
What's wrong with good old American wood? Is Gibson so elitist that only that IMPORTED stuff is good for them? Like French cheese!
Bo(eh)ner only likes foreign wood...
And this has been snark, btw.
I love American wood.
It's such a softball, though!
Don't try to confuse the issue with half-truths and gorilla dust.
.
Yeah, the Eurowood just lays there, no emotion at all. Looks pretty, but that's about it.
Election 2012: Be Educated! Be Active! Vote!
www.PhoenixJustice.com
I'm glad I didn't buy that Les Paul Studio made from Curupay back in '03. Who knows where the hell it came from? JHC on a tremolo, can't people just play by the rules?
In GOP land, if you get caught breaking the rules, it's the rules' fault.
Mike Foltz
Thank you.
Mike Foltz
Patently absurd on its face.
MyMy
to a 100 year old law. But your point is accurate.
"3 protesters barely on our property chained to a...drum...not causing any problems so I told the guys to just monitor them and let them freeze."
Shocking document revealing Fed attack on Occupy Portland 11/6/11
...they prevented 'em from making strings from siberian tigergut, now this? Communism, I tell ya!
Don't try to confuse the issue with half-truths and gorilla dust.
America could learn a lot from this tiny nation
http://www.sovereignman.com/expat/malta-economy
WTF? Is the guy also a good singer with a loud voice, so he can take Joe Wilson's place yelling at the President? The Rethuglican Congress these days specializes in diminishing and attacking the office of the Presidency,because of who occupies that position just now.It's absolutely disgusting,the depths to which they have sunk.
but we knew that all along!
This is the story we need out ...
THIS IS THE UNDER THE WIRE STORY THAT NEEDS TO BE OUT;
LITTLE J. WALSH WANTS HIS WIFE, WHO HE HAS NOT PAID FOR CHILD SUPPORT OF $117.000, TO BE SANCTIONED;
http://www.illinoisdivorce.com...
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/201...
OUTRAGEOUS ...AND YES I AM YELLING ABOUT THIS DEADBEAT!
are not regulations but a statutory prohibition contained in a law passed by Congress? That is not a regulation, Boehner.
Bush vetoed the bill. Boehner voted no but the House overrode. Obama was absent. McConnell voted to override. So did the Senate overwhelmingly. Did Boehner move to take out the job killing language? Can't find any record of it.
"3 protesters barely on our property chained to a...drum...not causing any problems so I told the guys to just monitor them and let them freeze."
Shocking document revealing Fed attack on Occupy Portland 11/6/11
I thought elephants are supposed to have good memories. Funny how quick he forgot the mess Bush left.
Master of the house
Isn't worth my spit!
Comforter, philosopher, and lifelong shit!
Cunning little brain, regular Voltaire.
Thinks he's quite a lover - but there's not much there...
What a cruel trick of nature, landing me with such a louse.
God knows how I've lasted, living with this bastard in the house!
Oh, and Elephant4Ever -- your dung seems appropriate to your postings....
I mean come on you can't even buy a Gibson now without worrying about a swat team raiding your residence sheesh people.
...without a case
But I can't get that even tanned look on my face...
Don't try to confuse the issue with half-truths and gorilla dust.
Luv this song.
...seriously? Where are these supposed SWAT teams. That's the problem with having a disagreement with wingnuts. You have to argue against fantasy scenarios.
WWFSMD?
I'm glad i didn't but my SG yet. When i do, I'll make sure it is not made from these endangered species.
"Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob"
-= Franklin Delano Roosevelt =-
Guitarist (long dead) in my p-rock band back in the '80s got a '67 SG from a pawnshop for a song. Another friend of ours has it now, and swears it's better than any modern version by a mile.
Don't try to confuse the issue with half-truths and gorilla dust.
Sadly, these days genuine vintage electrics, especially those from the Big Two, are way out of the affordable range for your average musician. You might get lucky and find an out of the way pawn shop who don't know what they have, but in today's ultra-connected world that's getting less and less likely.
for Gibson. I wonder how many of their customers are disinclined to purchase guitars made from endangered species. If they had any sense they'd be co-operating like hell to prove they didn't. Unless, of course, they did.
Hasa Diga Eebowai
The tangled intersection of international laws is enforced through a thicket of paperwork. Recent revisions to 1900's Lacey Act require that anyone crossing the U.S. border declare every bit of flora or fauna being brought into the country. One is under "strict liability" to fill out the paperwork—and without any mistakes.
It's not enough to know that the body of your old guitar is made of spruce and maple: What's the bridge made of? If it's ebony, do you have the paperwork to show when and where that wood was harvested and when and where it was made into a bridge? Is the nut holding the strings at the guitar's headstock bone, or could it be ivory? "Even if you have no knowledge—despite Herculean efforts to obtain it—that some piece of your guitar, no matter how small, was obtained illegally, you lose your guitar forever," Prof. Thomas has written. "Oh, and you'll be fined $250 for that false (or missing) information in your Lacey Act Import Declaration."
Strawman. Nobody is coming after guitar owners or their guitars. Not gonna happen.
Coming after? Maybe not. Just don't try taking your vintage Brazilian Rosewood guitar across international borders. They will confiscate it and you'll never see it again.
Let's see how far to the right they go before they fall off of the edge of this flat world.
Anyone coming from Canada that's a musician isn't getting into the US without paying well over $1000 for a "P2 Visa". Most of the musicians going into the US would be from Canada, it's virtually impossible for Canadian musicians to play in the US without paying more than they make for the gig, so you probably don't have to worry about the wood crossing the border...
"I could give a flying crap about the political process.... We're an entertainment company."
- Glenn Beck - Forbes interview; April 26, 2010
If it means keeping Celine Dion on that side of the border.....
"Civilized men are more discourteous than savages because they know they can be impolite without having their skulls split, as a general thing." -- Robert E. Howard
No worries if you fly United.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YGc4zOqozo
(someone had to do it)
far left loon >.<
I bought a guitar from a Canadian luthier, made with vintage woods derived from antique furniture (you would be surprised what kinds of woods you can find in antique shops and flee markets: Rosewoods, Mahoganies, Teak, Red and Black Walnuts, etc. One old table or cabinet can be turned into many instruments). I didn't think the importation process was all that onerous, to tell you the truth. Paper work wasn't that bad, and the guitar made it through customs just fine.
(I'm not sure what the time line is) it can be re-used. Our furniture at home is from a protected Chinese hardwood that's been protected for the past 50 years - but it was made out of the beams of some 300-500 year old chinese buildings. So it's o.k.
The woods in this guitar are 150 to 300 years old.
Brian May's guitar had a pretty unique sound. Supposedly it was fashioned out of a half burned, hundred year old piece of firewood.
fuck em, they can all go to hell, including boner
warren mosler for president
enron, tyco, sub-prime...
which also brings to question how these guys can keep re-spinning the same old b.s. as gold even after all of the previous failed "experiments"
i blame society
job killing
it is an f-bomb that just f's everything when it hits the fan
again, i blame society
Well, I've been a Fender man for as long as I've been playing - guess that ain't changing any time soon!
I hope someone takes this douchebag to task by pointing out that by enabling this illegal trade in limited raw materials, he's basically putting the long-term future of his company in jeopardy - not just legally but practically. How're a hypothetical Gibson Guitar Co. of 2050 going to build guitars if there's no damn wood left?
Next Teapublican debate, someone should bring a cadaver to represent the innocent guy Rick Perry had executed.
Screw Gibsons, they're so far overpriced that no one can afford them anymore and they can't hold their tuning after the first power chord. I'm sticking with Fender.
I have a Strat and a Tele. LOVE 'em! Never liked the short scale of Gibsons, the strings feel loose.
I play my new left-handed Telecaster all the time, and man can it hold a tune.
I just love Fender guitars.
If I were a psychopath, I would join the republican party, and get in on the gravy train taking the Teabircher morons to the cleaners.
You could always step up a gauge. Just a thousandth of an inch will do it. I use 10s on my 24.75" scale guitars and 9s on the longer 25.5" scale. Keeps the tension feel close.
Let's see how far to the right they go before they fall off of the edge of this flat world.
There you go! The scale you choose should ideally be appropriate for the size of your hands. It does effect the timbre of the strings though, as does string gauge. Thicker gauge strings produce more higher harmonics - but that's not always good thing either...
"Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob"
-= Franklin Delano Roosevelt =-
"This will be paid for" remember, he means to rob Peter (poor, sick and middle class still working) To pay for this "jobs" program. He won't be allowed to raise taxes so where else will the money come from?
He will be 'allowed' to raise taxes on the rich - as per his address, this is a part of paying for the bill - but it won't be sudden and it should not effect businesses' incentive to hire.
Regulation will ensure that we have healthy, wealthy and safe population to drive the economy into the future, and regulations on rare wood will ensure that Gibson will have rare wood species to make guitars with into the future.
"Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob"
-= Franklin Delano Roosevelt =-
(of several tree families) of various regions of the world. (Tabebuia isn't Dalbergia!!) It would be very helpful to know specifically what species are involved, but likely if from Madagascar, it's a threatened species. Most valuable hardwoods there are threatened or endangered.
I'd give the benefit of the doubt to conservationists of the island.
"Parachutes are allowed in checked or carry-on baggage, but may not be worn in flight."
---Southwest Airlines
The rosewood they're generally concerned with is the Brazilian grown variety but there are endangered species from a lot of countries on the list.
Let's see how far to the right they go before they fall off of the edge of this flat world.
I have great respect for the artisans who make guitars at Gibson, and I own a Les Paul myself. BUT Gibson CORPORATE has an absolutely atrocious reputation in the industry for a whole host of reasons. Pity the poor instrument manufacturer that gets bought out by them, ripped apart and turned inside out. Many of these acquisitions have been absolute disasters both for Gibson and their customers (the Oberheim acquisition comes to mind).
As a result, it does not surprise me at all to hear that Gibson has been bending rules and cutting corners on supplies...
Yep, until Gibson makes some statement about their supplier policy, I'm going back to Fenders....
As a product developer myself, I've seen a trend with larger corporations buying out smaller competitors. First, they get rid of anyone who's suspected of not being on board the new program.
What I mean by that is, I often have seen less scrupulous types take the place of people who had integrity. For example, people who didn't believe in using overseas manufacturing (because they care about America) were replaced by those who did.
I don't believe in God. Teach a man to be a good citizen and you have solved the problem of life.
-Andrew Carnegie
1) Fire the top 2 levels of management and bring in your friends
2) Do a 20% across the board layoff of employees
3) Use 90% of the company's cash to buy companies that don't fit with yours
4) Pay off the financial analysts to pump up your stock for a quarter or two.
5) Get the board to pay you the 10% of cash that you saved as a bonus
See? Just like politics....
*cough* Carly Fiorina *cough*
6. Get out with your stock options and golden parachute before all your previous 5 steps catch up with you and put the company into chapter 11. Take the money and run; it's no some other sucker's problem.
The way of the predatory socioipath.
create a situation where your company has to go into chapter 11
which then allows the bonus of eliminating the union, the need to pay the pension plans, repay the creditors at a fraction of the orginal debt, restructure the company with layoffs, then get a juicy multi-million dollar bonus and new stock options for doing such a great job of saving the company he/she had just steam-piled directly into the ground.
or:
be the mythological steward of the company, even though it is leaching money and not fulfilling its obligations. but because he/she is the mythological steward, he/she is indispensable so the b.o.d. will create a mult-million dollar retention bonus to keep up his/her spirits as he/she continues to drive the company into the ground
or:
the ceo drives the company into the ground, but the creditors want to get as much of a return as possible, in turn, they take the company to court and pressure the b.o.d. to pressure the c.e.o. to sell the company. if the company hits a milestone target min bid, then the ceo gets a bonus, but if the company gets a few points above the target, then the ceo gets a super mega bonus for getting all of the creditors money returned. needless to say, in all situations, the workers are screwed and the public stockholder is screwed.
but i think you know what i had intended with my first draft quick typing.
another one is to create a debt of six billion dollars, but then buy a 2nd rate t.v. network that did not have a hit since happy days, cash out all of your options for half a billion dollars, then leave the company. very sweet. only in hollywood on that one though.
Yep, seen that exact scenario. My old CEO was a lying, greedy, waste of cells who did nothing but destroy a good, profitable company. I hope he has a slow, painful death. He ruined the careers of many, many good people.
Traitor.
I don't believe in God. Teach a man to be a good citizen and you have solved the problem of life.
-Andrew Carnegie
I have a couple of Oberheim products and my MIDI time piece is Opcode (also bought out by Gibson) and they haven't updated their drivers for ages... They seem to buy companies and then forget about them, it's strange...
"I could give a flying crap about the political process.... We're an entertainment company."
- Glenn Beck - Forbes interview; April 26, 2010
They haven't been formally charged, nor found guilty of anything.
So what? Who I decide to do business with has nothing to do with their exact legal status.
I do not like how they operate as a company: I object to the *pattern* of their well-known (at least to those of us who spend large sums of money in their market) behavior.
I would not be surprised if the investigation did indeed lead to charges and possible findings of guilt based on that knowledge of their behavior.
As a marketing professional, my opinion is that they are idiots not to recognize that the demographic they sell to leans more to Pearl Jam and Sheryl Crow than Ted Nugent, and they are professionally negligent in protecting their shareholders investment for not doing major proactive damage control over the situation.
That they have not been formally charged with anything is only the paramount issue in any of these opinions to those obsessed with the hobgoblins of inconsistency.
I believe they haven't been charged because they won't be. If it does't, I hope you re-evaluate your trust in this blogger, who I believe has basically produced a propaganda hit piece, all but accusing Gibson of deforestation, when the guilty party, if there is one at all, is almost certainly a dealer in india.
That dealer in India wouldn't be selling illegally obtained hardwoods if there wasn't a buyer for them.
Gibson hasn't been charged because it's an on-going investigation. Unlike TV, in the real world, you investigate before charging. Or at least, you're supposed to do it in that order. If Gibson had been charged before the warrant was served (among other investigatory details), people would be screaming bloody murder about a rush to judgement.
Why do you have such a hard time accepting the opinions of people who have knowledge of the industry? While there are certainly people that love Gibson's product (although the newer models aren't held in as high a regard), you'll find a lot of people that aren't impressed with their business practices.
"That dealer in India wouldn't be selling illegally obtained hardwoods if there wasn't a buyer for them."
Uh, what? Well, there is always buyers for illegal wood that is PASSED OFF AS LEGAL wood? So if I buy a car thats illegal, that appears to have all the correct paperwork and that the government has signed of on, I am a big meanie who is encouraging the stolen car industry, rather than a victim of fraud?
Corporate smugglers suffer dreadfully form all those regulations that the rest of us call crimes and laws when they are applied to the polloi.
So it's ok if I smuggle a rare bird in my suitcase home right? Who cares?
What an asshole.
I don't believe in God. Teach a man to be a good citizen and you have solved the problem of life.
-Andrew Carnegie
This jackass needs to go to jail.
I personally know a guy who's the CEO of a company that buys RECYCLED rainforest wood from Asia and turns it into high-end home flooring. He then donates big-time to rainforest preservation.
Basically taking what would be burned and using the proceeds to make a living and help stop deforestation.
Apparently, Mr. Juszkiewicz isn't aware you can do that.
I don't believe in God. Teach a man to be a good citizen and you have solved the problem of life.
-Andrew Carnegie
He just cares more about all the money he's raking in. Do you really think he spends all the money he saves on his employees? Or hires more people because he's making more?
This is the typical fake these assholes are using. They lead you to a conclusion that makes no sense.
I actually had a senior lady working at the grocery store tell me that the wealthy will go buy ore cars and stuff if they don't have to pay so much taxes! That is the most ridiculous assumption I have ever heard: a guy with millions is going without that Ford Focus because because he has too many taxes to pay? No they buy $5000 shower curtains and $2000 purses. How many people are employed in those industries?
How about small business owners that use their own money to hire people? They DON'T USE THEIR OWN MONEY! The first rule of small business is pay yourself first. I have been left unemployed by that rule many times. I get cut to 20 hours while the boss makes his Lexus payments, then makes the common brag "if you pay any taxes, fire your accountant."
Oh Jesus H. Christ in a pickup truck. Next thing you know they are going to raid Steinway Pianos for killing all those pesky elephants for their tusks. Just more job killing regulations.
If I can't get my dodo egg omelettes with a side of dodo bird every morning, I'm just a wreck...
"I could give a flying crap about the political process.... We're an entertainment company."
- Glenn Beck - Forbes interview; April 26, 2010
...who remembers a nationwide survey of employees from about a year ago that had Gibson rated at the absolute bottom of the list of worst places to work in America?
"Trust no one, Mr. Mulder." - Well-Manicured Man
CRIMMINALS have a problem with getting busted and they want YOUR SYMPATHY.
WTF?
If they are not convicted, I hope you will reevaluate your trust in this blogger.
We should be outraged by this abuse of governement power. They went into the Gibson center with an enormous, expensive cast and crew, with weapons drawn (?). How is this not overreach? I strongly encourage people to investigate this issue further. Only certain kinds of wood are used for certain parts of the guitar, and Gibson goes thorugh an already complicated process to obtain wood. Considering the ills of our society, how is this not serious federal overreach?
I've been reading this site practically since it started, when John wrote a lot more of the content and boy has it gone downhill. Has this site become so obsessed with attacking anything the tea-party might put their imprimatur on, that if they howl you have to defend the feds? Do you defend the feds in Iraq? Afghanistan? When the punish sick people for smoking marijuana? Can it ever be true that the federal government is too large, to controlling, or just wrong? I'm a freedom first progressive. Fk the feds when they are hurting people, and flexing their power like gorilla.
Are multiple automatic weapons really necessary in a US guitar factory?
And my main thing is, still, not ONE charge has been filed.
Now, this is from Gibson, mind you, but they say they have signed affidavits from the governments of both India and Madagascar that all wood purchases and exports have been legal. That the US is trying to enforce other countries' laws - these countries have no grievance with Gibson.
But, absolutely, if they violated laws they should be held accountable. But I just picture a guy at a wood lathe turning around the see another guy with a machine gun...just seems a bit much.
I've seen some stuff, man. And some thangs...
http://www.wood-database.com/lumber-identific...
http://www.acousticmusic.org/CITES-and-ESA-sp...
"Parachutes are allowed in checked or carry-on baggage, but may not be worn in flight."
---Southwest Airlines
Once word gets out, they won't even be able to give their guitars away. From what I've seen, musicians are a mostly environmentally aware group of people. Some will have no problems with the kind of behavior amd practices that Gibson is accused of, but most won't. I make certain of the pedigree of any guitars before I buy, and that seems to be the norm.
Sure, some will shun them, but it will no more hurt the Gibson name than the Exxon Valdez hurt their sales. Guitars are proprietary. Only Gibson can make models like the Les Paul, Hummingbird, ES-335, ect. All have unique features and sounds - bands like Led Zeppelin, AC/DC, KISS, ect made their careers on the tone of Gibson guitars. Guitars players aren't going to quit playing and buying Gibsons because of some trade violations involving trees.
And, another thought, two words: China, Walmart. If American consumers were that worried about American companies supporting abuses in foreign countries, and we're talking people there, not trees.
I've seen some stuff, man. And some thangs...
Yep, there are guitarists that absolutely are not going to give up their Gibsons. What they'll do, though, is what they're already doing anyway - they're buying vintage, not new.
Federal agents, companies that make automatic weapons...
Okay, absolutely, if Gibson violated the Lacy act, they should be held accountable. But two raids (machine guns, really?) and not one charge yet. The Feds took (okay, according to Gibson) thousands of dollars in wood, guitar parts, and actual guitars in 2009 and never filed one charge or returned anything. Is that right - do progressives support that kind of behavior from our government?
Look, yes, the "job-killing regulations" thing is hogwash, dangerous, and political speak to appeal to a low demographic. But I'm not okay with the Federal government raiding an American business, taking inventory, and keeping it for years while filing no charges. And then doing it again. And according to Gibson, the Madagascar government has said and signed affadavits that all the wood is totally on-the-table-legal. Madagascar has no problem - but the US is spending money and time to say there is?
And, I don't know, while we kill women and children with bombs from drones the Feds are this worried about rosewood trees in Madagascar?
And finally, the lost $$$ angle - no sympathy for Gibson, In 1981 I bought a brand new Les Paul Custom for $630.00. Check out the price now for a Les Paul Custom.
I've seen some stuff, man. And some thangs...
No surprise that all Reslug CEO's are corrupt and criminal.
Karoli, you made a comment at the end of your post that begs further scrutiny from you as a writer who tries to live up to high critical thinking standards. Please give some thought to my response to this comment of yours.
You wrote that, in your opinion, it is not worth destroying our rainforests in order to own a Gibson guitar. Of course I totally agree with you, if indeed this is the choice we are being given in this case. However, it is not.
These rare woods were harvested and collected decades ago, like 50+ years ago, prior to any deforestation laws, and prior to any laws requiring the documentation of the sourcing of these woods. The woods that meet this criteria that I am bringing to your attention were collected/purchased by enterprising souls who trekked long distances to procure them way before most of your readers were born. When it became clear that the harvesting of rainforest woods was problematic, laws were rightly enacted to prevent further deforestation.
Now, the federal government is going after legitimate businesses that own stockpiles of these woods and/or musical instruments made from these woods that were harvested prior to any legislation, and since there were no laws at the time of the harvesting requiring any documentation, it is confiscating legitimate inventory, including both instruments and raw materials. This confiscation is wrong. It is an overstepping by our federal government into the private lives of our citizens that demands to be stopped.
So yes, Karoli, the enforcement of these regulations is going to shut down an industry with many gainfully employed individuals, including a large number of self-employed guitarmakers whose lifetime business plans rely heavily on being able to continue to make and sell guitars from woods that they collected as far back as the 1960s.
There are many guitarmakers who are very progressive, not tea party "lunatics." Boehner is highlighting one CEO who happens to live in his state and who is a Tea Party member, but this issue is not, as you wrote, about a group of raving lunatics who will oppose any and all legislation, even when that legislation attempts to address serious environmental problems. This is a legitimate attempt on the part of legally-operating individuals and businesses to protect their ability to legitimately run their businesses and generate income through the end of their working lives, and who are in compliance with our laws but only lack documentation that is being forcefully grandfathered onto them by overstepping federal law enforcers. It is impossible to comply with this grandfathering. No one should lose legally-obtained and very valuable inventory and materials in this outrageous way.
No rainforests are being destroyed by making/purchasing guitars that include rare woods harvested decades prior to the legislation we are talking about here. Beware, if you ever decide to take your Gibson guitar across state lines or out of the country, or to sell it to another collector/player. As far as our federal government is concerned, it belongs to them, and they wrongly think they are saving rainforests by confiscating it and then benefitting from its value. Hogwash.
You can think of what is going on here with these guitars and materials and the businesses that make and sell them as being just as outrageously overzealous as our federal government's attempts to catch terrorists by rounding up and incarcerating indefinitely all persons suspected to have any ties whatsoever to terrorism, even if there is no proof of these ties, and even if this lack of proof continues for years. Lives are being destroyed in the process. Don't be an unwitting enabler of this unconstitutional dragnet.
119 comments and nothing about the fact that Boehner thinks Sarbanes-Oxley is job killing?
Isn't the claim that it is difficult a sign that there are people who will have jobs to deal with the regulations?
NEVERMIND that Boehner himself voted yes to pass the legislation in 2002:
Aye OH-8 Boehner, John [R]
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/vote.xpd?vote...
So now we're blaming Obama for the Accounting Frauds and regulations that were put in place because of it?
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