Wexler Confronts Mueller on CIA Torture and Lack Of Investigation By FBI
By Nicole Belle Tuesday Apr 22, 2008 6:15pm
From an email from Wexler's office:
This morning, during a hearing in the House Judiciary Committee, I questioned FBI Director Robert Mueller on his agency's response to claims - made by his own FBI agents - that the CIA was torturing prisoners. I wanted to find out why, if the FBI's own agents had alleged illegal actions were taking place, there was no investigation into the CIA's illegal and immoral practices.
Mueller's responses, which I would like you to read below, create new concerns and call for further investigation in the days ahead.
I believe Mr. Mueller owes more to Congress and the American people than the half-answers he gave in his testimony today.
I would urge you to contact the editors and news departments of your local media and ask them to look into the responses below. It is critical that this discussion takes place beyond emails and blogs – and is covered by the mainstream media.In two weeks the Judiciary Committee will be holding hearings to investigate the fact that the highest levels of the Bush Administration sanctioned and ordered the torture of prisoners in United States custody. This is intolerable and we must vigorously oppose this policy that demeans our nation and offends our conscience.
Full transcript below the fold:
Robert Wexler: Thank you Mr. Chairman. Mr. Director, in January of 2006, the New York Times reported that the NSA wireless wiretapping program had produced thousands of leads each month that the FBI had to track down, but that no Al-Qaeda networks were discovered. During a July 17, 2007 briefing, FBI deputy director John Pistole indicated that the FBI was not aware of any Al-Qaeda sleeper cells operating in the United States. In August of 2007 Congress passed the Protect America Act, giving the intelligence community greater access to electronic communications coming into and out of the United States. I have two questions in this regard.
RW: Has the FBI found any sleeper cells yet? One…
RW: Two. Has the NSA's wireless wiretapping programs either before the Protect America Act or after led to the prosecution and conviction of any terrorists in the United States?
Robert Mueller: Well, as to your first question as to whether we have found affiliates or, as you would call them, cells of Al-Qaeda in the United States, yes we have. Again, I cannot get into it in public session, but I would say yes we have. With regard to the relationship of a particular case or individual to the terrorist surveillance program, again that is something that would have to be covered in a closed session.
RW: Alright, Mr. Director. An LA Times article from October, 2007 quotes one senior federal enforcement official as saying quote "the CIA determined they were going to torture people, and we made the decision not to be involved" end quote. The article goes on to say that some FBI officials went to you and that you quote "pulled many of the agents back from playing even a supporting role in the investigations to avoid exposing them to legal jeopardy" end quote.
RW: My question Mr. Director, I congratulate you for pulling the FBI agents back, but why did you not take more substantial steps to stop the interrogation techniques that your own FBI agents were telling you were illegal? Why did you not initiate criminal investigations when your agents told you the CIA and the Department of Defense were engaging in illegal interrogation techniques, and rather than simply pulling your agents out, shouldn't you have directed them to prevent any illegal interrogations from taking place?
RM: I can go so far sir as to tell you that a protocol in the FBI is not to use coercion in any of our interrogations or our questioning and we have abided by our protocol.
RW: I appreciate that. What is the protocol say when the FBI knows that the CIA is engaging or the Department of Defense is engaging in an illegal technique? What does the protocol say in that circumstance?
RM: We would bring it up to appropriate authorities and determine whether the techniques were legal or illegal.
RW: Did you bring it up to appropriate authorities?
RM: All I can tell you is that we followed our own protocols.
RW: So you can't tell us whether you brought it; when your own FBI agents came to you and said the CIA is doing something illegal which caused you to say don't you get involved; you can't tell us whether you then went to whatever authority?
RM: I'll tell you we followed our own protocols.
RW: And what was the result?
RM: We followed our own protocols. We followed our protocols. We did not use coercion. We did not participate in any instance where coercion was used to my knowledge.
RW: Did the CIA use techniques that were illegal?
RM: I can't comment on what has been done by another agency and under what authorities the other agency may have taken actions.
RW: Why can't you comment on the actions of another agency?
RM: I leave that up to the other agency to answer questions with regard to the actions taken by that agency and the legal authorities that may apply to them.
RW: Are you the chief legal law enforcement agency in the United States?
RM: I am the Director of the FBI.
RW: And you do not have authority with respect to any other governmental agency in the United States? Is that what you're saying?
RM: My authority is given to me to investigate. Yes we do.
RW: Did somebody take away that authority with respect to the CIA?
RM: Nobody has taken away the authority. I can tell you what our protocol was, and how we followed that protocol.
RW: Did anybody take away the authority with respect to the Department of Defense?
RM: I'm not certain what you mean.
RW: Your authority to investigate an illegal torture technique.
RM: There has to be a legal basis for us to investigate, and generally that legal basis is given to us by the Department of Justice. Any interpretations of the laws given to us by the Department of Justice….
(talking over each other)
RW: But apparently your own agents made a determination that the actions by the CIA and the Department of Defense were illegal, so much so that you authorized, ordered, your agents not to participate. But that's it.
RM: I've told you what our protocol was, and I've indicated that we've adhered to our protocol throughout.
RW: My time is up. Thank you very much Mr. Director.
Login or Register to post comments.
Bravo. Bring it on!
Go get um Wex!!!!! Watching these people like Mueller squirm makes my day!!!
RM: "We don't torture", sir.
RW: Who?
RM: We.
RW: We who?
RM: I can only speak for we.
RW: Who gives you that authority?
RM: They.
RW: They?
RM: Yes.
RW: Are you hiding something or are you a fool, sir?
RM: We?
RW: No. You.
RM: No.
RW: No. You aren't hiding something or "no" you're not a fool?
RM: Yes.
"Sir, I was just following orders". I didn't want to stick my neck out and do my duty. The Nuremberg defense once more.
You know how you fix these full of shit bastards with a emasculated Congress? They suspend the budgets for these Cocksuckers until they come to Congress and tell the truth!
The FBI are pussies. The toughest terrorists they want to deal with are PETA, or ELF. But not anyone who would ever be a realistic threat to them. Just cowars, and afraid of the CIA and DOD. What the hell kind of "G-MEN" are they? "G" spot?
thepoetryman @ 3:
Who's on first?
Every major broadcast news organization should be pounded for NOT DOING THEIR JOB! I'm sick to death of this. BTW #3 is brilliantly funny.
*lie*, umm umm *lie* umm *lie*lie*lie*
My tax money is actually paying these people for our defense?! WTF!
´´sighting National Security´´ wasint used? wow, Iam shocked that ole time favorite wasint spit out for the 500th time when these time of commities meet.
I think the whole thing is bullshit and NOT one of those ppl involved with tourture will ever be brought to justice. I say hunt em down like the then USA did to the Nazis that fled once ww2 was over. There are NO stats of limitations for murder. If G W Bush is a 94 year old demented old drooling bastard when the truth comes out, toss his ass in jail with the many rest of the goons.
New blog post is up at my blog, view for funnies relax and take a load off.
Best Regards,,,
RM: We followed our own protocols. We followed our protocols. We did not use coercion. .
We followed our own protocols. We followed our protocols. We did not use coercion. .
We followed our own protocols. We followed our protocols. We did not use coercion. .
We followed our own protocols. We followed our protocols. We did not use coercion. .*bzzzt* *beeP*
We followed our own protocols. We followed our protocols. We did not use coercion.
We followed our own protocols. We followed our protocols. We did not use coercion. .
We followed our own protocols. We followed our protocols. We did not use coercion. .*bip*
We followed our own protocols. We followed our protocols. We did not use coercion. .
*beep boop*
The NSA wireless wiretapping program?
Huh? Isn´t it the NSA warrentless wiretapping program?
The dominoes are teetering even harder now. We need more Wexler and less Pelosi.
This just makes me sick. I'm writing to the editor tomorrow and will post the letter on my blog. Who's with me?
I´ve posted this earlier in the open thread but nobody seemed to be interested. I´ll try again:
Amnesty unveils shock ‘waterboarding’ film
By Nigel Morris, Home Affairs Correspondent
Tuesday, 22 April 2008
An American expert in torture techniques has denounced his government for allowing “waterboarding” to be practised against terror suspects, just as a graphic advertisement showing the brutal reality of the technique is unveiled to British cinema-goers.
Malcolm Nance, who trained hundreds of US servicemen and women to resist interrogation by putting them through “waterboarding” exercises, demanded an immediate end to the practice by all US personnel.
…
He said: “They seem to think it is worth throwing the honour of 220 years of American decency in war out of the window. Waterboarding is out-and-out torture, and I’m deeply ashamed President Bush has authorised its use and dragged the US’s reputation into the mud.”
Mr Bush faced criticism recently when he vetoed a Bill that would have outlawed such methods of “enhanced interrogation” – the White House refuses to describe it as torture.
…
Mr Nance, who is now an independent consultant, said the technique was also futile, as well as barbaric, as the prisoner would say anything to survive – regardless of its truth.
Amnesty International is leading the campaign to persuade the US to abandon the practice – a form of torture used as long ago as the Spanish Inquisition – and is stepping up its efforts with the release of a graphic and disturbing advertisement.
The broadcast begins with images of glistening clear liquid, suggesting it could be promoting a new brand of vodka or gin. But the camera pulls back to show water is being poured over the face of a desperate man strapped to a table.
Kate Allen, the UK director of Amnesty International, said: “Our film shows you what the CIA doesn’t want you to see – the disgusting reality of half-drowning a person.
“For a few seconds, our film-makers did it for real. Even for those few seconds, it’s horrifying to watch. The reality – in a secret prison with no one to stop it – is much, much worse.”
The advertisement can be seen at www.unsubscribe-me.org from today and at 50 cinemas from next month onwards.
read on:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/amnesty-unveils-shock-w...
You go, Wexler. Make me proud to have come from Florida.
Bush sits around eating pretzels, drinking non alcoholic beer, and watching baseball every evening while all this goes on around him.
And Wexler says "my time is up, thank you very much?" Thank you for what? Bitch-slapping him? Will this country and the world ever hold these bastards accountable? My guess is NO, because dems are pussies! YES, I'm voting a straight dem ticket for the forseeable future, but can we find some dems with spines? OK, OK, we have a razor thin "majority" and we don't want to blow it!!! But do you really think that holding these NAZIS accountable for their actions will be show of weakness? Holy crap. I am so embarrassed for my country.
Rep. Wexler ("The Balls from Boca") and Rep.Tim Mahoney (my former Rep) are two reasons that I still have (some) hope for Florida politics.
Both are from Palm Beach Co, and now Randi Rhodes is back here as well. Look out Rush, PB Co is going blue. Too bad I had to relocate down to South Dade last month...
robert mueller seems to me to be a good man. same with mike mcconnell and general hayden.
the thing with all of them is that they're each trying to burn a whole chandelier's worth of candles by both ends. and someone's probably got them all by the balls.
so, what do you do, citizen x? keep asking questions, go up the chain of command, all the way to the top. and for god's sake, pile on.
Is it odd that the first time I tried to watch this video, I got a "this video is no longer available" message?
Wexler is a shining star in a vacuous sea of darkness. I will have the unique pleasure of the opportunity of meeting him in person in two weeks. Needless to say, I am thrilled.
It is critical that the mainstream media covers it, it'll never happen, because it is critical. That's why we hear about Obama's bowling skills, Britney Spears latest stupidness, American Idol crap, and all the other purposeless crap the mainstream media shoves up our collective ass every day - now tell me, doesn't stuff like this, the deafening silence of the 'mainstream' media on everything important to anyone left of center make it completely and mind-numbingly retarded to even start to think that there is a "liberal bias" in the media?
Sometimes I swear to god i'd put a bullet in my head if I didn't think that's exactly what these douchebags want us to do - I don't know how Helen Thomas does it. If I had to deal with half of the crap she does they would find me swinging from the White House Press Room ceiling.
If the democrats had "opposition leaders" (Wexler, Dodd, etc...) like this in charge, impeachment (pro-constitution), anti free-trade deals (pro american worker), and advocates for universal health care (pro human being), their poll numbers would be a hell of a lot higher.
Joe @ 23. You are meeting Wexler? I envy you. Tell him that there are lots of Canadians supporting him - this particular chick being one of them.
ProJecKt2501 @ 22:
Happens to me occasionally too. Usually just try again in a few minutes.
Mr. Mueller is suspected of being a member of the American Nazi Party.
asssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss!
AT about 5:04 of the vidoe:
RM: "I can tell you what that protocol was and how we followed that protocal".
This in response after Wexler implies that Mueller has been emasculated as an independent law enforcement officer by political appointees in DOJ. You can tell Mueller was a little bit pissed.
That's what Wexler should have followed up on. We need to hear from Mueller exactly what happened once he learned that other agencies were engaging in illegal human torture. What was the response from DOJ and how exactly did the response from DOJ prevent the FBI from investigating the charges of illegal human torture.
Actually he's surprisingly clear in what he's saying in a couple of ways:
A) He has authority to investigate other government agencies but the army's a totally different story.
B) The Justice Dept. (the prosecutors) told the FBI they'd decided torture is not torture anymore. If they won't prosecute, the evidence is worthless. Same as any cop faces, it's out of their hands.
This is how far the rule of law has sunk. Imagine what surprises Bush's lifetime judicial appointments hold in store.
Mueller was telling Wexler to look at the protocols the F.B.I. uses. He was hinting all through the questioning. Wexler never asked "what is the protocol?"
What do you think?
I know I'm just as shocked as anyone to hear Mueller say the DoJ never gave them go ahead to investigate what they already decided was legal. Gimme a fucking break. I hope this issue catches on and these clowns are prosecuted.
Distant Replan @ 30:
We know the DoJs response. They were on board scheduled the toture train that everyone got on.
When we say justice is blind, we don't mean justice turns a blind eye.
how many times have we seen this now...a department head in the bush co administration that is too stupid to get out of the way of their own answers. painting themselves into a corner time and time again.
how many times have we seen it go no farther than that. they hold the positions in the administration, no one get fired or prosecuted and the beat goes on.
at what point will this change?
Teddy Phuf @ 14:
I[Deleted. ALL CAPS-Sitemonitor]
Why was this shit head allowed to walk out with his job intact. We need to be able to torture these assholes to get the truth.
Let's waterboard that SOB and make him answer.
Put these bastards in the hague. "I was only following orders" "It pays the mortgage" "I was frightened of being made fun of"
You are toturing, murdering and pilliaging. There is no sympathy for what you have done.
This is really a non-story. Lets look at one of the final comments by Director Mueller:
"There has to be a legal basis for us to investigate, and generally that legal basis is given to us by the Department of Justice. Any interpretations of the laws given to us by the Department of Justice..."
This is consistent with what we already know about torture as we've learned from Mukasey. The DoJ has issued an opinion that waterboaring and all other techniques WERE LEGAL. Therefore, since the FBI goes to the DoJ to find out whether there are grounds to investigate, the FBI found out that the DoJ had already determined for the CIA that torture is legal.
This is the same reason why the DoJ won't investigate torture.
Advanced. Pardon. Look it up.
I wish that Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi had balls like Wexler and Helen Thomas.
Pelosi seem more concerned about looking good and doing commercials than ending the war.
Reid...is just an all around bum.
4@Lumusays
“Sir, I was just following orders”. I didn’t want to stick my neck out and do my duty. The Nuremberg defense once more.
Actually, it's the Sergeant Schultz defense. "I know nutzing. Nutzing!"
I am proud to report that Rob Wexler is my Representative here in the 19th. district and he has been keeping me updated on his work for many years now.
He is a good man and always responds to me when I e-mail him on the issues that are important to me. Unlike my Senator (Nelson) who sends only form letters if he responds at all, Wexler writes often and in detail.
I know it sounds corny, but if we all get involved, we can establish relationships with the people we elect and if they don't respond we can elect better people. Now that we've got voices thanks to this website, let's all get busy.
I want to congratulate Mr.Mueller on doing a fantastic job of investigating the biggest crime of the century, the 9/11 attacks. Shouldn't someone give him a lollipop?
Address: Maanweg 174, 2516 AB, The Hague, Netherlands.
Postal Address: Po Box 19519, 2500 CM, Den Haag, Netherlands.
Write them! Help them prepare the war crimes tribunal by putting in your testimony. There will be a another Nuremberg .. we must get a special prosecutor, war crimes have already been admitted.
http://www.opednews.com/articles/2/genera_ladybroa_080215_special_prosecutor_i.htm
There is also the matter of holding them all to account for BLACKWATER.
For Canucks and everyone else I created a noncitizen petition for a impeachment an
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/global-people-for-the-impeachment-of-richard-cheney
impeach.to.end.war.crimes@gmail.com
Just about says it ALL, but I need help spreading this around, obviously.
Login or Register to post comments.